• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 14:53
CEST 20:53
KST 03:53
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!9[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
Evil Geniuses - shutting down9ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier4Weekly Cups (October 12-18): 5.0.17 era begins1[$1250] International ShieldBattery League52Weekly Cups (October 5-11): Farewell to 5.0.164
StarCraft 2
General
REPORT: StarCraft 2: Remastered In Development Evil Geniuses - shutting down How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR? No more SC2 streamers on team liquid? Weekly Cups (October 12-18): 5.0.17 era begins
Tourneys
ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament ScienceCraft (October 24-25) - Live Event WORTEX Challenger Series — Open SC2 LAN in Budapes
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[G] How to playtest arcade maps [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Sweltering Sands [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 548 Shining Bright The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 547 Temple Of Terror Mutation # 546 Catch the Train
Brood War
General
Do we even care about balance? Young Players Tournament Announced by SOOP BW General Discussion SCHNAIL now supports Remastered Rollback Netcode in Brood War
Tourneys
[$1250] International ShieldBattery League [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL23] RO24 Group Stage [ASL22] Grand Finals
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Simple Questions, Simple Answers Replay Review Process - What do you do?
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Armies of Exigo - YesYes? Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread The Chess Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
How Much Genes Contribute to…
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7984 users

The Politics of posting/Defending the Undefendable

Blogs > BioNova
Post a Reply
BioNova
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States598 Posts
June 03 2013 22:03 GMT
#1
Teamliquid is a funny place sometimes.

I often ask myself what I 'get out of it' for posting here. It's not trolling in the least though I'm sure some would suspect it. I LOVE this game. Always have. I remember lobbying a friend of mine back in 1998 about Starcraft. I told him he would definately not regret splurging a bit for this masterpiece. He loved it. I loved that he convinced the big whigs at his engineering/construction firm to let him install it on several computers(they were already doom/quake freaks) which led to my first ever lan party where we had the run of the place in Kokomo, Indiana rocking out Starcraft on 21+ inch monitor's. Island Maps with no alliances. Our own lil diplomacy mode in which teams were never locked and something shady was always brewing. I remeber my buddies girlfriend Sara screaming down the hallway "I can hearz you typing" and my best friend standing up and turning around and screaming "I'm never playing with you Fk'rs again" after his mostly scout army fell to a couple of clicks of the diplomacy box and a wall of hydra 'allies' he parked a lil to close to in his posturing. Ah to be noobs and in love. Reminds me of Day[9] and his early zerg builds from life of starcraft. Got the job done right.!

I don't hit much into posting in the actual Starcraft forums because what does a fan really have to say in that realm besides applauding excellent posts or commending efforts by the community. The General forums are much more my forte. I still read the good stuff. I follow what I can when I can but current events pop culture and the inroads between them really butter my daily bread. I'm regular guy in the 'crisis' threads, the politics threads not only because I keep up, but because I wonder what other people think. Farva's wonderfull brainchild politics thread, which at the time probably the best thing that coulda have happened to the Teamliquid General forum, though at the time I probably would have had some chide remarks about 'narratives'. Imagine trying to sort thru a billion OMG Terrorist/Justice Dept outrage threads. We've seen the deluge of shocking relevations and baseless accusations continue unabated since then. Poor moderators. Much simpler to patrol this way. Efficiency is important.

It does require a lot of patience and a willingness to hear other peoples views for what they are and address them thoughtfully without resorting to personal attacks or dramatic overgeneralization. Some of the best posting I have seen recently has been Jibba in the Turkey thread.
On June 03 2013 10:40 Jibba wrote:
Our moderation doesn't exist to provide you opinions you like. Even if they're wrong, it's not our place to punish people for being wrong, it's your place to explain to them why they're wrong and have a meaningful discussion.

Especially for a 20 page thread on an explosive topic, there have been very few reports made. That indicates to me that, despite there being posts I don't like or disagree with, people have been making posts that live up to our standards of civility and content. If you don't like that, there's plenty of echo chambers for you to visit.


To the point, realistic, and fact filled. I myself picked up tips from watching Stealth post in my early days. How easy it would be to just ban anyone outside of mainstream because who has the time to fack check these pricks anyway?
[image loading]
You do, especially if you do it properly. Finding yourself at odds with other posters can be a bit disconcerting but it doesn't have to end with 'Red' on your face so to speak. You shouldn't shit on your local mod because he didn't correct someone for you and then lit you up when you went all reddit on the guy. . You should write him a letter and thank him for your warning you got for overeacting because the task is mind numbing. Who cares if you get a response. Let them know you appreciate what they do for you. Not to mention I cannot help but feel it's directed not only to the shit posters we've all came to love and loathe, but to those devil's advocates in the crowd. Not everyone agrees, and not everyone can express themselves properly without resorting to meme form.

I 've been called just about everything from racist, to naive, idealistic, a terroist sympathizer and a little bit in between for some of my posts and the people I quote. It comes with the territory. This is the unpopular side effect of fact checking both sides and yourself at times. I never hesistate to apologize when I'm wrong and I am ready to listen as opposed to talk.

I've greatly enjoyed and suffered equally trying to advance viewpoints that are less than popular. A Ron Paul fan in the Republican Primary thread. Check. Read more liberal sites as a conservative. Check Check. Understanding the opposition and their viewpoints is invaluable in debate and discussion and focused insults are rarely going to get you anywhere. If I could give back all the wonderful things about this site Team Liquid has given to me over 500 posts in one sentence or less. It would probably be.... Thanks for the link. The second sentance would have to be thanking all the wonderful posters who have taken the time to express themselves and their viewpoints in a respectful manner. I've learned a lot, not only from the Pro's in the strat section, but from from awesome/informative posters in the current/event political threads. Thanks for everything TL.

Kirk slaps spock on the shoulder. "See, we are getting to know each other" Wink.




**
I used to like trumpets, now I prefer pause. "Don't move a muscle JP!"
Cele
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Germany4016 Posts
June 03 2013 22:42 GMT
#2
your over thinking this i feel. Basically it's stil good old fashioned netiquette that wil get you through your day whith politics threads at hand.
Broodwar for life!
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18869 Posts
June 04 2013 00:26 GMT
#3
5/5 for the kudos, you libertarian terrorist sympathizer!
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
radscorpion9
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Canada2252 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-04 02:03:07
June 04 2013 02:02 GMT
#4
I have had a similar experience with Team Liquid. Its strange that I came here because I was interested in Starcraft 2, and I thought it would be the next best thing. I quickly got bored of it after several months, and now I just occasionally check for the results in major tournaments with the hope that certain people won or lost. Some of the games are pretty good though, but its just way too draining to watch more than a few key games.

Now I almost entirely come here to read up on current events and follow the politics thread in the general section. Its filled with such a wide variety of opinions, and people seem to be really well informed. Just today I managed to watch that video for high school students you posted, and I learned some good stuff. Although I would still want clarity on a lot of the fundamentals of how economics works, but I assume that is a very complicated thing so I will postpone it.

The debate between Wegandi and Quark is particularly fun to watch. I know we used to have a debates thread, I think farva started it. But for whatever reason I don't see it anymore. I wish we could have a new debate thread, but this time it could just be two specific people, who post on that one thread, and its locked for others except for a moderator (maybe we get to comment on another thread).

They could then go back and forth on one issue, directly countering each other's points, post by post. It has all the advantages of a typical debate, and more - because in this case people can take the time to think, and they don't have those silly time limitations that almost always end up cutting off a debate before they have time to really explore the evidence. Also no one can interrupt or shout over each other. I guess the main advantage is, is that you can actually *finish* a conversation rather than try to squeeze in your main points in an hour, quote some evidence, and everyone goes home none the wiser.

Eventually we could come to a nice conclusion on one issue (hopefully). Its too often that in other threads you just get a lot of "noise" and derails by other important events, or people misinterpret each other and the whole debate is lost; or just because someone's interest fades away. If there was some moderation, a key question, and your "credibility" at stake in front of all of TL...I would love to keep tabs on that. It makes me wish I was actually an intellectual...but the amount of reading you have to do is tremendous. And I am too lazy to read through all of that...is interesting as it seems at first.
BioNova
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States598 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-04 15:18:36
June 04 2013 15:17 GMT
#5
On June 04 2013 11:02 radscorpion9 wrote:
I have had a similar experience with Team Liquid. Its strange that I came here because I was interested in Starcraft 2, and I thought it would be the next best thing. I quickly got bored of it after several months, and now I just occasionally check for the results in major tournaments with the hope that certain people won or lost. Some of the games are pretty good though, but its just way too draining to watch more than a few key games.

Now I almost entirely come here to read up on current events and follow the politics thread in the general section. Its filled with such a wide variety of opinions, and people seem to be really well informed. Just today I managed to watch that video for high school students you posted, and I learned some good stuff. Although I would still want clarity on a lot of the fundamentals of how economics works, but I assume that is a very complicated thing so I will postpone it.

The debate between Wegandi and Quark is particularly fun to watch. I know we used to have a debates thread, I think farva started it. But for whatever reason I don't see it anymore. I wish we could have a new debate thread, but this time it could just be two specific people, who post on that one thread, and its locked for others except for a moderator (maybe we get to comment on another thread).

They could then go back and forth on one issue, directly countering each other's points, post by post. It has all the advantages of a typical debate, and more - because in this case people can take the time to think, and they don't have those silly time limitations that almost always end up cutting off a debate before they have time to really explore the evidence. Also no one can interrupt or shout over each other. I guess the main advantage is, is that you can actually *finish* a conversation rather than try to squeeze in your main points in an hour, quote some evidence, and everyone goes home none the wiser.

Eventually we could come to a nice conclusion on one issue (hopefully). Its too often that in other threads you just get a lot of "noise" and derails by other important events, or people misinterpret each other and the whole debate is lost; or just because someone's interest fades away. If there was some moderation, a key question, and your "credibility" at stake in front of all of TL...I would love to keep tabs on that. It makes me wish I was actually an intellectual...but the amount of reading you have to do is tremendous. And I am too lazy to read through all of that...is interesting as it seems at first.


Having a 3 year old girl by your side eats game time. I'd play more if I could. The back and forth on topics is what keeps me coming back as well. I've also passed up drinking nights out and alas even more game time following debates and a debate thread would be a interseting go, even if only for a laugh.

Farva, you deserve your kudos. So do a lot of of posters in Gen who take the high road even on flashpoint topics. The bad side of that forum gets seen regularly. I just wanted to thanks to the efforts of those who don't shit it up. Does that make sense?

Even though I don't always agree with them. I regularly appreciate posts by Kwark, JohnyB, Parellel, Stealth, Wegandi, and so many others. I especially appreciate people who bother to take the time to search or link in an attempt to explain themselves rather than shoot low and fast. Tang's guides in strat and on reddit for example seem to get dogged a lot. At least he put the effort in. He always does. The same sentiment applies to other posters. Hell I was was at 499 so I went with it.
I used to like trumpets, now I prefer pause. "Don't move a muscle JP!"
Endymion
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States3701 Posts
June 05 2013 01:28 GMT
#6
as much as tl moderation and i have butted heads, they're very good about maintaining free speech.. they might not like what you have to say but they'll rarely if ever target you for it. the community on the other hand, well that's up to your ability to argue and convince
Have you considered the MMO-Champion forum? You are just as irrational and delusional with the right portion of nostalgic populism. By the way: The old Brood War was absolutely unplayable
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 16h 7m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Serral 2409
mouzHeroMarine 447
BRAT_OK 49
JuggernautJason41
UpATreeSC 25
MindelVK 16
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 21695
Calm 2106
Shuttle 450
BeSt 251
actioN 166
ProTech142
Soulkey 115
Dewaltoss 100
Mind 85
Mini 79
[ Show more ]
Shine 24
ToSsGirL 23
Free 16
Sacsri 13
League of Legends
KnowMe78
Counter-Strike
fl0m1399
Heroes of the Storm
Grubby3648
Liquid`Hasu345
Other Games
Gorgc3154
FrodaN1097
Beastyqt751
B2W.Neo601
ToD256
RotterdaM200
ViBE73
Trikslyr61
QueenE39
C9.Mang00
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 29
• Adnapsc2 7
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• HerbMon 29
• 80smullet 16
• Michael_bg 3
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 2235
League of Legends
• TFBlade961
Other Games
• imaqtpie957
• Shiphtur854
Upcoming Events
IntoTheTV X SOOP
16h 7m
Reynor vs Zoun
Neeb vs Rogue
OSC
1d 4h
FEL
2 days
Patches Events
2 days
AI Arena Tournament
2 days
FEL
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
WardiTV Weekly
4 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
5 days
ByuN vs Lambo
MaxPax vs Bunny
[ Show More ]
PiGosaur Cup
6 days
The PondCast
6 days
Kung Fu Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-10-20
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
IPSL Winter 2026-27
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
Acropolis #5 - GSC
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026

Upcoming

BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.