• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 06:32
CET 12:32
KST 20:32
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT20Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book16Clem wins HomeStory Cup 289HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview13Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info8
Community News
Weekly Cups (Feb 9-15): herO doubles up2ACS replaced by "ASL Season Open" - Starts 21/0224LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals (Feb 10-16)46Weekly Cups (Feb 2-8): Classic, Solar, MaxPax win2Nexon's StarCraft game could be FPS, led by UMS maker16
StarCraft 2
General
Terran Scanner Sweep ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT Nexon's StarCraft game could be FPS, led by UMS maker How do you think the 5.0.15 balance patch (Oct 2025) for StarCraft II has affected the game? Weekly Cups (Feb 9-15): herO doubles up
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament PIG STY FESTIVAL 7.0! (19 Feb - 1 Mar) LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals (Feb 10-16) Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) WardiTV Team League Season 10
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ? [A] Starcraft Sound Mod
External Content
Mutation # 513 Attrition Warfare The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 512 Overclocked Mutation # 511 Temple of Rebirth
Brood War
General
Gypsy to Korea TvZ is the most complete match up BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Ladder maps - how we can make blizz update them? Brood War inspired Terran vs Zerg cinematic – feed
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 1 Small VOD Thread 2.0 KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates Zealot bombing is no longer popular? Current Meta
Other Games
General Games
ZeroSpace Megathread Path of Exile Diablo 2 thread Nintendo Switch Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Ask and answer stupid questions here! Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TL MMA Pick'em Pool 2013
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Inside the Communication of …
TrAiDoS
My 2025 Magic: The Gathering…
DARKING
Life Update and thoughts.
FuDDx
How do archons sleep?
8882
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2434 users

A WCS seed for best GM played on ladder

Blogs > ViktorSC
Post a Reply
ViktorSC
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
United States75 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-03 16:12:18
April 03 2013 14:23 GMT
#1
I am very excited about the news, I think this is a step in the right direction. From now on, eSports will only continue to grow and prosper. One thing I was wondering about, was how to also make laddering and the StarCraft home experience equally as important. As we all know, this starts at home. Anyone can buy the game, start playing right away, and if they are good enough can rise to the ranks of GM or even play online tournaments from the comfort of their own bedroom. It is possible for even a young kid in a wheelchair to become a professional StarCraft player but how to make that more of a possibility? I am not entirely sure how the seeding works for WCS- What if the best person in each of the three sectors that has the highest ranking in GM and not already qualified for WCS was to get an opportunity to play in the championship? If I am playing day and night beating pros left and right with a really high ranking in GM, the highest of all the players not in WCS, and get a message from Blizzard to pack my bags and make my way to WCS at once... I think that would really be magical.

Of course, there has to be that one day where its the last day to qualify for WCS and everyone and their mothers are laddering. To the minute, the cutoff date would be exact. This is the way I perceive it: I am a youngling at a toy store. I am a huge nerd, my parents just bought me my first computer and I want a game for it. I go to the computer games section and see a gold foil sticker on a game called StarCraft. The sticker reads "Qualify for the World Championship Series." I flip out and buy the game, I almost don't care what the game play is and will dive right in. As soon as I take the game home all the info is there in the SC UI including names of all the pros and such. A kid would simply feel like Charlie almost, trying to make his way to the chocolate factory.

Important points:
1. The cutoff date would be exact.
2. Pro players could also qualify though GM.
3. Qualifying accounts will have to be verified and confirmed by Blizzard.

*
Buildings are units, units are buildings.
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States45282 Posts
April 03 2013 14:38 GMT
#2
My concerns with giving a seed based on ladder alone:

1. Doesn't the ladder change much too rapidly? Who's #1 on the ladder may become #5 within two hours. Even if you choose a specific day and time to pick the #1 spot, there's no reason to think they're actually better than the other top players in the region. Tournaments allow you to prove yourself in a much more rigorous and difficult scenario.

2. Laddering is very different than playing in tournaments. Many pros don't even bother laddering to obtain the highest rank, because they're practicing privately in custom games with practice partners.

3. Hackers will be more likely to obsess over the top spot, because they're more concerned with getting #1 on the ladder than actually becoming the best player they can possibly be.
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
ViktorSC
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
United States75 Posts
April 03 2013 14:51 GMT
#3
On April 03 2013 23:38 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
My concerns with giving a seed based on ladder alone:

1. Doesn't the ladder change much too rapidly? Who's #1 on the ladder may become #5 within two hours. Even if you choose a specific day and time to pick the #1 spot, there's no reason to think they're actually better than the other top players in the region. Tournaments allow you to prove yourself in a much more rigorous and difficult scenario.

2. Laddering is very different than playing in tournaments. Many pros don't even bother laddering to obtain the highest rank, because they're practicing privately in custom games with practice partners.

3. Hackers will be more likely to obsess over the top spot, because they're more concerned with getting #1 on the ladder than actually becoming the best player they can possibly be.


1. The cutoff date would be exact.
2. Pros already have a means for qualifying.
3. All accounts will have to be verified by Blizzard.
Buildings are units, units are buildings.
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States45282 Posts
April 03 2013 15:03 GMT
#4
On April 03 2013 23:51 ViktorSC wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 03 2013 23:38 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
My concerns with giving a seed based on ladder alone:

1. Doesn't the ladder change much too rapidly? Who's #1 on the ladder may become #5 within two hours. Even if you choose a specific day and time to pick the #1 spot, there's no reason to think they're actually better than the other top players in the region. Tournaments allow you to prove yourself in a much more rigorous and difficult scenario.

2. Laddering is very different than playing in tournaments. Many pros don't even bother laddering to obtain the highest rank, because they're practicing privately in custom games with practice partners.

3. Hackers will be more likely to obsess over the top spot, because they're more concerned with getting #1 on the ladder than actually becoming the best player they can possibly be.


1. The cutoff date would be exact.
2. Pros already have a means for qualifying.
3. All accounts will have to be verified by Blizzard.


1. What makes you think your spot in ladder is as worthy of a WCS seed as winning a tournament?

2. Everyone already has a means for qualifying. Even if you're not a pro, you can still play in tournaments. Laddering isn't the only way (and it's not the best way) to prove you're better than top tier gamers.

3. Not all accounts can be verified by Blizzard, because people smurf all the time.
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
StarVe
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany13591 Posts
April 03 2013 15:36 GMT
#5
Let the wintrading commence.
MstrJinbo
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1251 Posts
April 03 2013 15:52 GMT
#6
I'm glad to see IIlllIIIl get a chance

No in all seriousness, there are a lot of GM players out there who I'm thrilled are being given a shot.
Advantageous
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
China1350 Posts
April 03 2013 16:06 GMT
#7
Honestly, I don't disagree with your proposal, but ladder is not entirely trustworthy... the fact that forms of wintrades exist scares me. However, Hacks and Wintrades are detectable, but only if it is obvious. I don't think ladder should be a seeding process but a qualifying process. Have the top 2 seats in each regions ladder playoff (assuming they're not smurfs and/or illegitament accounts and or already seeded or had a chance to qualify via prof. tournaments) then seed the #1 contender into the WCS, or have the top regional non-prof GMs play in a ro8 and the winner is seeded into the ro32 in the WCS prelims.
"Because I am BossToss" -MC ヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ノ raise your dongers ヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ノ I'm sure that all of my fellow class mates viewed me as the Adonis of the Class of 2015 already. -Xenocider, EG, ieF 2013 Champion.
ViktorSC
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
United States75 Posts
April 03 2013 16:20 GMT
#8
On April 04 2013 01:06 Advantageous wrote:
Honestly, I don't disagree with your proposal, but ladder is not entirely trustworthy... the fact that forms of wintrades exist scares me. However, Hacks and Wintrades are detectable, but only if it is obvious. I don't think ladder should be a seeding process but a qualifying process. Have the top 2 seats in each regions ladder playoff (assuming they're not smurfs and/or illegitament accounts and or already seeded or had a chance to qualify via prof. tournaments) then seed the #1 contender into the WCS, or have the top regional non-prof GMs play in a ro8 and the winner is seeded into the ro32 in the WCS prelims.

I agree with you and updated my post. I think cheating in GM is a lot harder than you think. Many of the players in GM are pro players and Blizzard Knights of the eSports round table. They might even be the first to know if someone is cheating and you can bet they will not stand for it.

To qualify, obviously seeding someone into the final match would be unfair. However, to qualify them for their regions final tournament, I think, would be something people can get excited about. In a way, you could say this would be how Team Blizzard could be formed.
Buildings are units, units are buildings.
Holdenintherye
Profile Joined December 2012
Canada1441 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-04-03 16:21:58
April 03 2013 16:21 GMT
#9
I think its nice of blizzard to try and give nonprofessional players a chance, kinda replacing an open bracket with the ladder.
But still skeptical about maphackers...
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States45282 Posts
April 03 2013 16:30 GMT
#10
On April 04 2013 01:20 ViktorSC wrote:
I think cheating in GM is a lot harder than you think. Many of the players in GM are pro players and Blizzard Knights of the eSports round table. They might even be the first to know if someone is cheating and you can bet they will not stand for it.


The #1 GM spot has already been held by several hackers and cheaters in the past, and some of these players still aren't completely removed from the game.

And we can't wait for Blizzard to inspect every high-level ladder spot as this date approaches, because it takes them forever for them to act on hackers (Blizzard tends to ban in rounds, not individually).
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
KCM Race Survival
10:00
Regular season
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 1173
LiquipediaDiscussion
The PondCast
10:00
Episode 82
CranKy Ducklings31
LiquipediaDiscussion
PiG Sty Festival
09:00
Group A
Maru vs Bunny
Classic vs SHIN
PiGStarcraft889
IndyStarCraft 224
TKL 202
Rex127
IntoTheiNu 14
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft889
IndyStarCraft 224
TKL 202
Rex 127
ProTech127
Lowko117
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 27857
Horang2 7650
GuemChi 3182
Hyuk 2715
Sea 1381
Bisu 1242
Jaedong 631
Flash 464
ZerO 271
BeSt 262
[ Show more ]
Mini 261
Snow 210
Stork 198
Hyun 183
Last 172
EffOrt 128
Pusan 115
ggaemo 104
Light 99
hero 98
Mong 95
Larva 77
Rush 67
Soulkey 55
Barracks 39
sorry 38
JYJ 36
ToSsGirL 35
Hm[arnc] 34
JulyZerg 33
Free 33
sSak 28
NaDa 25
Yoon 25
Mind 24
scan(afreeca) 19
Icarus 19
910 16
Terrorterran 16
Bale 15
ZergMaN 15
GoRush 13
Movie 12
Dota 2
Gorgc1553
XaKoH 552
canceldota44
XcaliburYe35
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1988
zeus1227
m0e_tv360
allub248
x6flipin168
edward102
kRYSTAL_62
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor138
Other Games
singsing2528
Liquid`RaSZi985
B2W.Neo335
crisheroes209
Fuzer 105
Mew2King92
Trikslyr28
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick569
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 77
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos1409
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Winter Champion…
28m
OSC
28m
Replay Cast
12h 28m
PiG Sty Festival
21h 28m
Clem vs Percival
Zoun vs Solar
Escore
22h 28m
Epic.LAN
1d
Replay Cast
1d 12h
PiG Sty Festival
1d 21h
herO vs NightMare
Reynor vs Cure
CranKy Ducklings
1d 22h
Epic.LAN
2 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
2 days
PiG Sty Festival
2 days
Serral vs YoungYakov
ByuN vs ShoWTimE
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Wardi Open
4 days
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
WardiTV Winter Champion…
5 days
WardiTV Winter Champion…
6 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-02-18
LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
WardiTV Winter 2026
PiG Sty Festival 7.0
Nations Cup 2026
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S1: King of Kings
[S:21] ASL SEASON OPEN 1st Round
[S:21] ASL SEASON OPEN 1st Round Qualifier
Acropolis #4 - TS5
Jeongseon Sooper Cup
Spring Cup 2026: China & Korea Invitational
[S:21] ASL SEASON OPEN 2nd Round
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
RSL Revival: Season 4
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
FISSURE Playground #3
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.