• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 23:53
CEST 05:53
KST 12:53
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play2Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview8
Community News
MC vs IdrA, Boxer vs Nal_rA to be Legacy Matches @ BlizzCon85.0.16 Hotfix (June 30) - Balance + Bug Fixes17Weekly Cups (June 22-28): Zergs thrive in new patch2[TLMC] Summer 2026 Ladder Map Rotation05.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start)98
StarCraft 2
General
5.0.16 Hotfix (June 30) - Balance + Bug Fixes MC vs IdrA, Boxer vs Nal_rA to be Legacy Matches @ BlizzCon The Death of Cheese: From a Professional Cheeser 5.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start) ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play
Tourneys
RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28) Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! INu's Battles#17 <BO.9> Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 532 Nuclear Family Mutation # 531 Experimental Artillery Mutation # 530 One For All
Brood War
General
ASL 22 Proposed Map Pool ProGamer Paychecks Story BW General Discussion Best thing happen to StarCraft since Remastered? Data needed
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Grand Finals The Casual Games of the Week Thread [BSL22] GosuLeague Casts - Tue & Thu 22:00 CEST
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Relatively freeroll strategies Why doesn't anyone use restoration?
Other Games
General Games
ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
[94721]Better Good-Health Signs Than 3-15 Bans/Yea TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
The HerO Fan Club! The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion McBoner: A hockey love story Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Listen To The Coaches!
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 4760 users

[1]No games that you should have won.

Blogs > MarineKingPrimeFan
Post a Reply
MarineKingPrimeFan
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Hong Kong73 Posts
August 29 2012 08:16 GMT
#1
I just finished playing around 4 games of Fifa 12 Head to Head matches. I have lost 3 of them and won 1 of the four. I'm in division 2 and I play with AC Milan most of the time.

For those of you who don't know what FIFA 12 is, it's a virtual football game. In head to head matches, you pick any team you want and play online against other people who used teams with similiar ratings and who's in a similiar division. A division is like "leagues" in starcraft. Division 10, the worst is bronze / practice, while division 1, the best is GM.

So in the games I've lost, all of them, I had SO many chances. When I say so many, I mean around 6 chances that I should have scored on. Most people would score these chances, they are so easy to take and I score them 99% of the time.

however I've only scored 2 goals, out of the 6 each game. The opponent, who has literally no possesion, bad passing, bad defending in my opinion, has scored more than me somehow. I feel like they are lucky goals, i.e my defenders triped over each other, stupid cross ins headers which are just a gamble, lucky that I screwed up my defending which I nearly never do. I was dominating that game, but in the end I still lost. And my opponent celebrated like an absolute douche even though he knew, he fully realizes how lucky those goals are. Those goals are not worth celebrating at all. This is one way of BM in FIFA 12.

So I lost 3 of them, in a row.

I was mad.

real mad.

the last one which I won, it was 3-2. this one I had literally 10 chances, and he had 2.

again, 2 lucky goals for him, and for me 8 chances that I wiffed.

I felt like the game just didnt want me to win. I felt like it was the Game's fault, for somehow making the players screw up the shot.

Even though I won, I stopped playing, I couldn't handle it anymore. So I just calmed down and think of what went wrong.

To be honest, I still think and feel like I should have won that game really badly, but it was MY fault that I let him score on me, it was MY fault that I tripped up my defender, it was MY fault that I got angry, probably played worse as a result, and it was MY fault that I couldn't finish the chances I got (actually mostly it's due to the game )

So in the end it was MY fault that the match ended this way, and it was what I deserved.

Even games that you feel like you should have won, if you lost in the end, you deserved to lose.
An SC2 example :

I was playing a game, Terran v Terran on cloud kingdom. I was so ahead, probably I was at 175 supply, he was 110.
I went to atk him, he countered attack me, an all in. I was on 3 bases he was on 3 as well. He lifted all his stuff and flew it to my base. while my main army attacked whatever they could in his many.
At my base, I just sent my scvs to my natural while he attacked things at my third. I had my producing facilities producing units, and I thought I could easily hold it.

In the end I pulled all my scvs and engaged him, who has 6 sieged siege tanks at the choke of my natural. I lost in the end.

I was furious. But.... It was my stupid fault for engaging him at the choke of the natural. I should have just sat at my main, block the ramp and he wouldn't be able to make it up and I had a few sieged tanks too. But I decided to engage at my natural, lost all my units. And with some bad control in the end I lost the game.

That was a game which I think (I'm in masters league) if I let a silver player play it out, he would have won it. I made stupidly huge mistakes. but I, me, jason made it. so I, me, jason deserved to lose.

There isn't a game you lost, which you should have won.

Jason.


***
More Marines Please!
reikai
Profile Joined January 2011
United States359 Posts
August 29 2012 14:43 GMT
#2
FINALLY somebody else realizes this. This, honestly, should kill off all BM on the ladder from people raging about "stupid strats." If somebody played a "bad strategy" (deciding to follow the faulty logic), and beat you, YOU played even worse. No such thing as a loser "outplaying" the winner.

Well, you can outplay the winner and then make horrific mistakes :D
Et Ducit Mundum Per Luce. :T:
MarineKingPrimeFan
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Hong Kong73 Posts
August 30 2012 12:16 GMT
#3
On August 29 2012 23:43 reikai wrote:
FINALLY somebody else realizes this. This, honestly, should kill off all BM on the ladder from people raging about "stupid strats." If somebody played a "bad strategy" (deciding to follow the faulty logic), and beat you, YOU played even worse. No such thing as a loser "outplaying" the winner.

Well, you can outplay the winner and then make horrific mistakes :D


Yup, that is a nice summary of what I wanted to say. I learnt this from Grubby, I asked him on his stream about it and he told us about it.
More Marines Please!
NewbieOne
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Poland560 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-30 20:18:50
August 30 2012 20:18 GMT
#4
Well, I look at that stuff a bit from a programmer's perspective (I coded a lot when I was younger), variables, algorithms, some basic designs. It is indeed stupid that some things work, it is possible for the better player to lose, even if he's playing better. To claim the contary is a noble, gentlemanly sports-like reflex that I respect but ultimately disagree with because it ultimately relies on some kind of noble fiction, I think.

This said, a mistake does generally mean you "deserve" to lose but you shouldn't use the word "deserve" to punish yourself, like take the blame on yourself because that's easier, the way those people do who say that if you have a problem with something then you can and should only change yourself, blah blah. Which is not true, it's motivational talking that works despite not being true.

When people talk about about a game somebody should've won, they don't mean an entitlement, a violation of some right to win a game. They rather mean that the expected, normal, typical consequence didn't happen, or basically that someone made a stupid, game-altering mistake so that on some level (which is not a level of objective truth of the matter by any means! nor does it necessarily say the other player didn't deserve his win) it feels vaguely unfair that he'd lose (e.g. after being in the lead all the time), they pity on the overall better player for ultimately losing on one mistake. This is an understandable feeling. A lot of the hassle about this comes from different understandings of the "should" and "should have" modalities. And people love twisting those understandings to make different points because people like paradoxes, contrarian attitudes, reframing, differentiation etc. In reality it's probably important to understand the emotional sensation that's going on, while realising that mistakes have consequences, and not let it get to one's head too much (or heart). And leave hair-splitting and word-twisting to compulsive debaters.

And for the record, it really doesn't mean you played worse than the other guy. This is because the ultimate result isn't actually the sole probe of skill. You played better, you mad a huge mistake (that probably had more to do with emotions over reason than with strategic miscalculation), it cost you the game, you did lose. But you didn't play worse, you didn't "deserve to lose" or anything like that (though there are some fighting philosophies that espouse such thinking, I just disagree with them; you also need to be careful when you choose to involve questions of moral fault, e.g. for negligence, in the judgement of your performance in a game or sport or some art). In the future you'll probably not make the mistake but rather judge the situation more coolly, in wholesome way, without rash decisions. Which is what matters.

I also think there might be some twisted sense of pride in refusing to allow oneself the explanation of a simple human mistake or some situation exceeding one's level of training (or otherwise one's proverbial paygrade). So one could look up some negligence or some other fault to blame for the loss, while it's that nobody is a robot, we all make mistakes.

Eh, and I understand those feelings, man. I've had a lot of them with Warcraft 3 (where I was more of a baller but still not a real gosu) and then with Starcraft 2 (placed silver, got demoted to bronze, what insult! yadda yadda). And yes, at least in the case of SC2 the objective truth is probably close to that I didn't do my homework, didn't appreciate my opponents, overrated my skill, underappreciated my skill decay (after like 3-4 years of not playing an RTS) etc., neglected some things, glossed over some other, displayed some hubris and some cavallier attitude. Then there was some frustration, some tiredness, some distraction, whatever. (Results can drop if you overpractice.) I guess calm and some positive thinking is the way to go. Gotta learn to deal with all those negative feelings, get them out of one's system.

I'm not sure it's possible to become a master at something with a laidback attitude but I'd like to if it were, as my chosen way of having at it.

GL HF in all your games!
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
PiGosaur Cup
00:00
#88
PiGStarcraft714
CranKy Ducklings116
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft714
RuFF_SC2 149
Nina 91
ROOTCatZ 34
StarCraft: Brood War
GuemChi 3297
Rain 3170
Shuttle 605
sSak 90
Dewaltoss 38
Noble 25
Bale 23
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox537
Other Games
summit1g9318
C9.Mang0798
JimRising 540
Sick183
ViBE157
Maynarde86
minikerr7
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1018
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream225
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• mYiSmile117
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP5
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Lourlo972
• Rush748
• Stunt359
Upcoming Events
Kung Fu Cup
7h 7m
Replay Cast
20h 7m
CrankTV Team League
1d 7h
Bombastic Starleague
1d 16h
The PondCast
2 days
HomeStory Cup
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
HomeStory Cup
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
HomeStory Cup
4 days
[ Show More ]
OSC
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
WardiTV Weekly
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

YSL S3
Douyu Cup 2026
Murky Cup 2026

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
CSL Season 21: Qualifier 2
SCTL 2026 Spring
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026

Upcoming

CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
ASL Season 22:Wild Card Qualifier
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Heroes Pulsing #3
Eternal Conflict S2 E1
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.