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Definition of a good player

Blogs > Nolos
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Nolos
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
Germany10 Posts
August 07 2012 14:00 GMT
#1
Recently I started to feel annoyed by all the people in the video game scene who are running around and telling other people, that they are bad players and at some point I began to spread my opinion on what I understand as a "good player" and a "gamer", as I don't believe that someone is a douche by nature. It's all in the environment.

First of all a few things about myself as a video game fan so that you might understand my
background. The first game I finished was Command and Conquer Tiberian Dawn at the age of 6 from then on I started playing mainly (J-)RPGs on consoles and strategy games on my computer.
Though as I was living on the countryside with poor internet connection I was playing single player most of the time so I've never gotten in touch with competitive play until I started playing DotA and as this wasn't ladder based and not organized at all back then I'd rather not count it.
In university I started playing SC2 a lot more thanks to a good internet connection and some friends
who played as well and made it into Platinum league. At this point many might already start mumbling "what a scrub" somewhere, but to change that performance based view on people (at least in the gaming scene) is what I shall try with the following text.

The first step towards understanding my judgement on people is to understand that people are not equal.
People are different and they have different interests and different abilities. Sure everyone can climb a tree, but some are faster than others. That doesn't mean that the slower ones are worse as humans, right? Same goes for games. Only because some players are worse in playing Starcraft that doesn't mean they are worse gamers. They just might be better in playing Battlefield.
Read that paragraph as often as you need to to understand it. It's meant to prepare your way of thinking for changing your way of judging.

On a sidenote: I have to admit that I was inspired to changing my view on this by hearing some interesting stuff from Sir Ken Robinson. Check him out if you're interested in educational matters.

So let's start with the main part:
I think the main problem of the ESports/Gaming branch to find acceptance in society is not the mindset of the previous generations, but the intolerance of many players to accept others in their circle. What many have forgotten is that we all started as newbies and some of us are still, let's say, less skilled. But that is not a bad thing as long as you find joy in what you do and we should rather help them to gain a foothold, instead of saying things like "Fuck you! you better deinstall the game!" (LoL [ingame]), "Damn feeder ruined the game l2p noob" (DotA [ingame]), "lol bronze crub l2p before posting" (Sc2 [Bnet forums]), and any mixture of the above in CounterStrike. These comments demotivate people to try again in the game and they start turning their back on one game and then on another game and so on and so forth until they dont want to participate in ESports or gaming in general.
To support this statement: Imagine you go to a football club and you're new and everybody tells you to pass but you can't hit the ball the right way and everybody blames you for weeks continuously without giving any good advice. At some point you're just frustrated and quit the club. But you try to give sports another chance and try a 1on1 sport this time: Tennis. But again your opponent is only making fun of you. At some point you will quit again, because this is your freetime and you dont have to go through that negative environment, freetime should be used for fun and stress relief obviously.

So here's the most important statement of the whole text:
A "good gamer/player" is not defined by how well he actually plays but by a positive attitude.
By that I mean people who can laugh and have fun even when they lose and can accept that someone is better, people who want to improve and/or help others to improve and people who are in general fun to play with. That means as well that even a Grandmaster-ranked player can be a "bad player" if he's always looking down on people and is ruining the fun for others.

If people could understand that their hobby could find a lot more positive feedback by society if they only let them take part ESports would grow more than it is right now.

Now this text will become a little more practical to complete my little definition.
What I noticed is, that Brood War players look down upon Starcraft 2 players and call sc2 easy and that it's not as elitist as bw. Then again sc2 players frown at LoL for being such an "ezpz" game. There are many more examples for such behaviour in other games (WoW Classic vs Cataclysm anyone?) but let's stick to those sc related ones.
I myself think that LoL is a lot easier (on the non professional level) to get into then Starcraft is and that is imho the reason for so many players joining rather LoL instead of SC2. But what some "bad players" in Starcraft do not realize is that many new players get convinced by their LoL friends to start playing when they havent tried any other video game before. So they get introduced to ESports by playing an easy game with nice tutorials and such. Wonderful. Now some might think of trying another video game. Maybe Starcraft? And that moment they hit a wall of elitism and intolerance. Who would try to be part of such a community? No one. To fill a logic gap I opened by saying that this elitism behaviour happens in LoL as well. (It does happen in every game)
LoL or DotA are team games. You can play with your friends and that softens the wind of negativity that is unleashed by playing under the standards of others. You can just laugh about a "your mom" line from your enemy with your team mate/s. In a 1on1 environment like it exists in Starcraft you don't have that advantage.

So to help Esports and your favourite game (whatever it is) you should talk more with them and give
them positive and constructive feedback. If you play Starcraft and you lose you say gg and tell your
opponent what was a good move and what you think he can improve. If you win you tell him that this and that move was well executed etc. This motivates new players and maybe they tell their friends that this game has a nice community and that the game is actually easy and quick to learn because people help you and support you. So show some positive attitude and be a good player no matter the performance

My next point is what it means to be a gamer/player.

To me, everyone who plays any kind of video game is a gamer. We are a small community compared to society and we do not have the luxury to say "She's an attention whore, not a real gamer!", "He only plays FIFA! He's not a real gamer!". It shouldn't matter what, how or how long someone plays. If you have taken an interest in gaming and you want to share that on facebook or in real life with a shirt or any other way, you should feel free to do so and other gamers shouldn't look down on that but be happy that there are others with similar interests. It spreads the word, it shows others that maybe even normal/non-nerdy/popular people play video games and that it doesn't have to be a niche. Maybe more people will then think of giving it a try and so on and so forth. Of course some people define themselves through video games and feel less special if it's not their trademark anymore. I'm thinking of teenagers for example, who try to differ from the mainstream and then suddenly face that their "scene" became mainstream and now they are mainstream...Awwwww :/ .

Tl,dr: Show some tolerance to new players, other players and help Video games to grow by showing a positive attitude.

I hope you understood what I tried to explain, even though my English isn't the best, and that you help me sharing this thought with others. By now I'm almost explaining this in every DotA2 game I'm attending and I feel like people are getting my point. On that note: If you are playing team based
games, try to talk friendly with weaker players and explain stuff to them, because in a nice atmosphere the performance of the team as a whole is greatly improved. (Didn't do any scientific research there but it's my experience from several years of playing in team-oriented environments.)

So yeah that's it for now. If you find any logic mistakes feel free to tell me. I am a rather confused person and sometimes I lose myself in my sentences . Any constructive criticism is welcome and if there's a discussion I'll be even more so happy about it.

PS: If you're interested in that educational stuff by Robinson try this: Changing education paradigms

**
nttea
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Sweden4353 Posts
August 07 2012 14:36 GMT
#2
i disagree, people who only play fifa are not gamers, just someone who happened to play a game (ie pretty much everyone) also you are a bad player is a bad player, regardless of attitude. It's still OK to be bad though and sure attitude matters but not as to whether you are currently a bad player or not, i don't really see what's wrong with current definitions.
Flip9
Profile Joined June 2012
Germany151 Posts
August 07 2012 14:36 GMT
#3
Didn't read it all but to me a good player is one who can prove his skills with a good winrate. A good attitude helps becoming a good player.
Someone that is new to a game and loses because of that is not a good player yet in my eyes, but he may become one.
Antylamon
Profile Joined March 2011
United States1981 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-07 14:40:12
August 07 2012 14:37 GMT
#4
You mean "good" in a completely different way than most people. You are talking about being morally good instead of being good at a skill.

For example, we can all agree that Idra is a good player in terms of skill, but he is not morally good. (when he rages or BMs)

After all, there are many definitions of the word "good." You chose one and stuck with it. I respect that opinion and I agree with it to an extent. After all, who said there was just one measurement of a good player? Why not more?
Spacemoose
Profile Joined August 2012
Germany2 Posts
August 07 2012 14:43 GMT
#5
i agree. Good players are defined through attitude.

BUT gaming is also about competition. Some people play games like LoL, SC2 or DotA2 for the thrill of PvP gaming. Therefore the environement in such games can be harsh. Less competitive players could also go play Farming Simulator...

Still, being nice IS important in order to attract players from other parts of society. being nerdy is okay, but being nerdy doesn't include cussing and swearing as mentioned by Nolos. More players => More fun!

Nice Blog !
Kukaracha
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
France1954 Posts
August 07 2012 14:59 GMT
#6
You pay too much attention to BM.

But yes, people should be nicer in-game... however, it is sometimes difficult to type nice things in the heat of battle.
Le long pour l'un pour l'autre est court (le mot-à-mot du mot "amour").
Nolos
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
Germany10 Posts
August 07 2012 15:06 GMT
#7
Well I differ between a skilled/unskilled attribute and a good/bad attribute. That is a correct observation of you. As already mentioned a good player is a lot more likely to become a skilled player same as a bad player is less likely to improve. The logic there being that a bad player with a negative attitude will rather see the mistakes in others but not in himself. Because if I am the player with a newbie in my team it is MY fault for not helping him. Same as "Hey that's cheese!" in Sc2 leads to not thinking its your fault, because you blame it on balance, and yet it is YOUR fault for not being able to defend it.

I think that we lost sight of the roots of gaming. As far as I remember games were designed to be fun and nowadays we face the problem that people only judge based on skill. Exactly that's where I disagree. Of course Idra has a certain level of skill and I respect that, but I am not quite sure if his attitude supports esports or gaming (by the definition of fun).

@nttea Fifa is a video game. Just by definition a Fifa player is a gamer. There is no advantage for your/our position to exclude them. And that's what is wrong with the current definition: It leads to a an elitist point of view, which leads to communities alienating themselves from the rest of society. How can you expect society to accept a hobby, if the people executing the hobby do not accept society?

Errrh I hope you get my point somehow It feels like I'm not capable of describing precisely what I'm thinking. xD
Treehead
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
999 Posts
August 07 2012 16:20 GMT
#8
My biggest problem with this blog is that I'm not sure who the audience is supposed to be.

On one hand, you have people like you and me: adults who play games for fun, don't judge others by their APM (lol), and generally are nice in (All) and like seeing other people who do the same. These people will get the blog about halfway through, but won't learn anything new from it.

On the other hand, you have people who derive much of their enjoyment in gaming from being rude to other people, and seeing people blow up at them (the trolls of the internet). These people will skim down, see the bolded part, laugh, and ignore everything you've said. Your argument is not enticing to them.

I agree that we really shouldn't say "man, that guy's FFs were awful, therefore he's a terrible player" - but I'm not sure how this blog does anything towards that end. Seems like the only people who will like this blog are also people who do not need to read it.
Nolos
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
Germany10 Posts
August 07 2012 16:45 GMT
#9
My audience are both. I hope that players who are rude read this and think twice about doing so and realize that it's harming them in the end if they scare away others. And I hope that players like you not only pick up my mindset but carry it to others. As I mentioned above I'm preaching this not only here but in-game as well. If you see someone picking on a newbie you intervene and say what defines a good player and that its - ahem - idiotic to behave that way.
And this should actually attract trolls^^ I know that people unlike us will react to this and try to disprove me and I think they can be reasoned with.
docvoc
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States5491 Posts
August 07 2012 16:53 GMT
#10
In general a good moraled player tends to make it farther than a not-highly moraled player, this is just because of sheer love for the game. If you are a guy like me and you take breaks every once in a while, but you always come back to SC2 because you love it, you will always make it quite far for the average person up the ladder. If you are a rage quitting asshole and you just don't enjoy starcraft then you will quit, simple as that. That however does not define a player as good or bad. Good and bad are based on results and how they improve. Improvement is definitely based on the perception above I completely agree, but still, its mainly results. Good is also relative, everyone here would say that Jinro is a good player, but not many people would put 1000$ on him in a game against IMMVP or MKP.Prime.we, not because he is bad, but because he is not AS good against people of that caliber of play.

On another note, Starcraft is very elitist, people playing BW for 12 years have seen all their friends quit and just a few stay in it. For me, I have seen almost all of my friends quit SC2 because its, "too hard." That accounts for probably like 7 friends or more that I noticed. Whenever I just want to chill I'll play SC2 during the year, but I'll also play LoL a lot because it is so casual a lot of my friends got into it. So i play 2 games, for a couple reasons: 1) variety, plain and simple, I used to binge on SC2 when it had just come out after Beta, I would get angry and rage and then I changed my outlook that I was just getting better and sine I "sucked" I needed to calm the fuck down after a loss and just say, "oh well, time to get better," this entailed playing other games when I just wasn't on the mark for Starcraft. 2) friends, most of my IRL friends play LoL and I enjoy it. Yeah its much easier until you hit pro level, but I want to see how close to being Dyrus I can be haha, that and most of my not IRL people that I play with get on SC2 much less frequently than they used to.
User was warned for too many mimes.
FlaShFTW
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States10127 Posts
August 07 2012 17:41 GMT
#11
id consider your definition as a positive player, a team player. someone who likes to boost other people's moral, if not only his or her own moral. however, what you say is, generally in most people's minds, is not a "good" player. a good player is someone who is proficient at what he does. someone who may or may not have a good attitude. TLO is a "good" player to you because of his awesome attitude to the game. however, someone like idra, an amazing player, or even Jinro (TT.TT i love you) would not be a good player in your eyes because their attitude isn't good.
Writer#1 KT and FlaSh Fanboy || Woo Jung Ho Never Forget || Teamliquid Political Decision Desk
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QuanticHawk
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States32048 Posts
August 07 2012 19:53 GMT
#12
good or bad means skill, not anything to do with attitude and a wall of text doesn't change that broheim
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