EPTOn May 23 2012 06:05 Whitewing wrote:
Hey man, don't shit on my Bioware games >_>.
Hey man, don't shit on my Bioware games >_>.
The way they've been doing things lately, it's not uncalled for.
A Polemical Diablo 3 Review - Page 8
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Telcontar
United Kingdom16710 Posts
The way they've been doing things lately, it's not uncalled for. | ||
Whitewing
United States7483 Posts
On May 23 2012 06:08 Telcontar wrote: The way they've been doing things lately, it's not uncalled for. Maybe, but he shat on the very concept of what they aim for, not the quality of the ME3 ending or Dragon Age 2, but the entire idea of having a story driven game with dialogue. | ||
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Gheed
United States972 Posts
The major point of contention seems to be the story, but let's be honest. Were the people I was power trading with interested in the story? Did the crafters I traded sets of 40 perfect rubies or amethysts for Pul runes care about the story? Did high school me care about the story when I stocked up on Mountain Dew and leveled new characters with my friends? Did the people glitch rushing for hell forges worry about the story? Did the people who PK'd in Baal runs worry about how their actions would affect the demise of the Lord of Destruction? No. The people who cared the most about Diablo 2 were the ones that cared least about its story. The ones that care about the story are transient. They play a few times and then they drift to another game with another story. The grinders, the farmers, the power traders, those are the ones that give the game its longevity, and they are the ones the game is designed to cater to. | ||
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awu25
United States2003 Posts
On May 23 2012 06:16 Gheed wrote: One would think that after a person reads the heading "Forum Index > Blogs" that said person would surmise that this was, in fact, a blog. As a blog, one would assume that anyone reading it would acknowledge that the opinions and thoughts contained therein were those solely of the creator of the blog. Further, when such a blog was entitled "polemical," and, in the very first paragraph, professed itself to contain a "series of straw man arguments" about how a group of people were "stupid," one would imagine that those people purported to be stupid would simply not read the blog. Instead, they choose to read the entire thing, become angered, and then feel obligated to post their dissent, rather than simply ignoring it in the first place, perhaps affirming the blog author's initial stance on their stupidity. The major point of contention seems to be the story, but let's be honest. Were the people I was power trading with interested in the story? Did the crafters I traded sets of 40 perfect rubies or amethysts for Pul runes care about the story? Did high school me care about the story when I stocked up on Mountain Dew and leveled new characters with my friends? Did the people glitch rushing for hell forges worry about the story? Did the people who PK'd in Baal runs worry about how their actions would affect the demise of the Lord of Destruction? No. The people who cared the most about Diablo 2 were the ones that cared least about its story. The ones that care about the story are transient. They play a few times and then they drift to another game with another story. The grinders, the farmers, the power traders, those are the ones that give the game its longevity, and they are the ones the game is designed to cater to. I for one didn't even know what the Diablo 2 story was. Just played the game for what it was and had a blast. Could it be that people complaining about the story only liked it because 10 years ago they were probably a teenager? I sometimes see cartoons on TV that I used to love as a child and I think they're complete shit now | ||
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solidbebe
Netherlands4921 Posts
On May 23 2012 06:23 awu25 wrote: I for one didn't even know what the Diablo 2 story was. Just played the game for what it was and had a blast. Could it be that people complaining about the story only liked it because 10 years ago they were probably a teenager? I sometimes see cartoons on TV that I used to love as a child and I think they're complete shit now Yep the nostalgia factor. It's really hard to properly compare 2 things if one is from your past, people tend to remember things better or worse than they actually were. | ||
Falling
Canada11349 Posts
On May 23 2012 06:23 awu25 wrote: I for one didn't even know what the Diablo 2 story was. Just played the game for what it was and had a blast. Could it be that people complaining about the story only liked it because 10 years ago they were probably a teenager? I sometimes see cartoons on TV that I used to love as a child and I think they're complete shit now I don't think so. I just played through both in the last year or so for the first time. I haven't played D3 so I can't comment on D3's story. However, I actually really enjoyed the story/ atmosphere. Sure it wasn't super detailed or complex. It was minimal story telling, but it felt epic and dark. I am not a grinder and I do play games for stories. And somehow D1 and D2 efficiently told a story that left me wanting to know more. Much more, but it was well told. D1's writings of the Archbishop's slow descent into corruption were sooo chilling. "My lord said to me..." I don't know, I like to think I have a good imagination and there was something about D1 and D2 that had my brain firing on all cylinders. Now mind you D1 was very hacky/slashy in some parts and I admit to listening to some podcasts and/or SotG while playing. But whenever the story stuff would come up, I'd shut that all off and turn up the sound and music. Unfortunately even D2's expansion already had some pretty generic fantasy soundtracks compared to D1 and D2's cool combination of steel guitars, electric guitars and classical music. Matt Uelmen was awesome. I have no idea what D3 is like except the little Beta I played, but I don't think D1 and D2 story is just a matter of nostalgia. Minimal story, sure. Stupid story? No. And really there's not too much popular dark fantasy out there. Closest I can find is maybe Solomon Kane or Constantine? | ||
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Rotodyne
United States2263 Posts
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Duka08
3391 Posts
Though I will say, I agree and disagree with you about the Doctor. Witch Doctor right now is my most progressed character (not entirely by choice but by the group of friends I began leveling with) and while I have fallen in love with the character himself and the utility of the class, there are a few things about it that just bother me. Things that, done properly, could have made him so much more fun. I hate pulling the necromancer comparison (after all, what have we learned if not "they're different games!") but there are subtle things that felt right about that class that could have enhanced the gameplay of the WD without changing it dramatically. The fact that, depending on the class(es) or how many players, I often find myself having more fun alone than in a group, is kind of disappointing. But really though. Hilarious and accurate, 5/5 I love Gheed blogs | ||
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ManicMarine
Australia409 Posts
If story doesn't matter to you, that's fine. But people like me who complain about the shit story because it could've been a good story, but it wasn't. All your other points I agree with because they're what make it a good Diablo game. Having a shit story doesn't make it a better Diablo game, and for a lot of us it makes it a worse one. | ||
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Emnjay808
United States10655 Posts
On May 22 2012 18:37 StorkHwaiting wrote: There's not really any hunting with the auction house though. You just farm gold and then go buy whatever you want off the auction house... Fair enough. Mostly everything I would think that is "godly" prolly wont be in a couple weeks or so. But when we get to the point where the game has matured abit, and people start to get those near perfectly rolled items. Then thats when it gets interesting. Perfect items would prolly go for a fortune on AH, assuming they were to sell it and not use it for themselves. | ||
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TheAntZ
Israel6248 Posts
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EatThePath
United States3943 Posts
On May 22 2012 08:31 DoubleReed wrote: Wha? How is that different from D2 or whatever? It just seems like the story has way more personality, immersion, and coherence than any of the previous games. I'm sorry, but I really don't understand complaints against the story. If anything the story may just be harder to ignore, which is pretty odd complaint. The only other complaint that seems valid to me is the personality of my character. I mean my character just seems a little too badass, like we've gone beyond Chuck Norris levels here. I think you may have read my post in the light of something you thought I was saying that I wasn't. Not sure. But. I agree that D2 had good story elements too, but it was much simpler and amounted to NPC one-liners, and act cutscenes. Everything else was just world flavour. In fact, I enjoy the D2 story more, and the D1 story the most. This is because it grabs you and slowly unfolds. In D3 you are beaten over the head with details that don't matter, instead of given opportunities to learn more about the world. However the D1 story is simplistic and structurally boring. It's just told with a certain amount of grace and skill. The D3 story comes at you in an unending stream so you end up overfed on things you weren't really hungry for. The best part is the way the environments convey information (and mood). It has problems with pacing, mystery, and introducing new characters. This is probably because the main story is Tyrael, and everything else is just an excuse to fill up 4 acts and give you quests to do. Leah was supposed to be the main character but the game never commits to giving her a real condition; she is presented as a plot device from the very beginning. Hero (to him/herself): Here I am at Tristram, gotta find me that fallen star! walks down the road to the first skirmish Rumford: You're looking for the fallen star? Talk to Leah. And so on for the rest of the game. It's a shame, because Leah's story could be really compelling, but it's never the focus of the storytelling as much as the focus of the questing. This might be confusing because Leah features prominently throughout the game (as much as anyone else), but ask yourself how often you really care what Leah is going through compared to what it means for your anticipation of oncoming setbacks to your progress. And the way it all ends is like, well that was that! Which is odd because they go to the trouble of making game assets for an iconic returning titular final boss (no pun intended) that reflect the fate of the would-be main character, such as it is. But that "fateful" conclusion has no more carry than the shitty blue Diablo dropped that you salvage immediately if you even bothered to pick it up, when you could have been left dazed by the tragedy ringing in your ears, which you yourself put the capstone on. This might be the biggest letdown of the story, because it ties the 3 games together intimately in facts, but fails to do so with any convincing emotion. This is why I say it has the best story technically, but the worst story in terms of player experience. I really like it for what it could have been. Whoever that is railing on the writer should consider this. edit: Aylear  | ||
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Salv
Canada3083 Posts
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Jetaap
France4814 Posts
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StatixEx
United Kingdom779 Posts
I think the game is really boring, i am over 30 years old and bought the other two when i was just a lad. This type of game doesnt hold up well with me anymore i got quick fixes, and i do mean quick with the xboxlive titles like torchwood and that other one that came out shortly after . . .bah, what a waste of points cant even remember the name. I agree with everything you actually said but there is one thing you didnt address. The game IS boring. LoL seems to have taken the d3/wc3 idea and made it into 30 minute short bursts. This is what i think D3 should have done, overwhelming mobs, not just a trickle of a few which if ur playing range like me, splash is all you need. i dont feel like im employing any tactics just watching health, moving back, holding shift and left clicking and grinding up my money and then spamming pots. Ive never fallen asleep playing a game before but D3 had me doing that . . .there was no one more game feel here. the comparing it with wow idea tho ive got to say ive never come across and i did get sucked in with the hype, diablo is a great game, or at least i remembered it to be! Anyone who says this is like wow needs their head testing, i dont get that . . i suppose COD is like Gears in that respect . . .i hate them both . . halo is the only fps you need to play. anyway yeah, game is boring, i keep playing it cos im in a love affair with blizz, great games, good times and the fact that it was a shaky start should be totally overlooked. If the game wasnt so damn popular we wouldnt be talking about it now and it may only create a poisonous feel in the devs minds as they clearly worked hard on this Its a good game in all just really boring! | ||
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thepuppyassassin
900 Posts
I say it literally.. and it's sort of fitting that I use a cliche expression to do so... 13 year olds could (and have) written better dialogue. No pvp, auction house, game breaking errors at launch.. This whole thing seems rushed in the final stages of development... Blizzard drifts further and further away from their old selves IMO. It's more about the cash grab and that means you cut corners where you can... not hiring a decent writer in a game that presents itself as an rpg? tsk tsk... BTW can someone PM me a guest pass? I would be extremely grateful | ||
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babylon
8765 Posts
On May 23 2012 15:35 thepuppyassassin wrote: I appreciate your review. Except your bit about the story. For a game that has been developed this long, and also since Blizzard has established a history putting a lot of thought into their writing in the past, there is no excuse for the game to be lacking in this department... in any department really. I say it literally.. and it's sort of fitting that I use a cliche expression to do so... 13 year olds could (and have) written better dialogue. No pvp, auction house, game breaking errors at launch.. This whole thing seems rushed in the final stages of development... Blizzard drifts further and further away from their old selves IMO. It's more about the cash grab and that means you cut corners where you can... not hiring a decent writer in a game that presents itself as an rpg? tsk tsk... BTW can someone PM me a guest pass? I would be extremely grateful Actually, Blizzard has always had really shitty storylines in all their universes. Warcraft, Starcraft, Diablo plots are basically the distillation of every single bad fantasy/sci-fi novel out there. Don't get me wrong, they tried to do cool things with the characters and they did have some potentially good storylines going on, but their plots have never been all that special, and they dropped the ball every time they actually caught it. Warcraft was actually surprisingly good/engaging (for being cliche) until they released WoW and shit over everything, SC was surprisingly good/engaging (for being cliche) until they decided to make Raynor pine after Kerrigan (lolol), so I'm not surprised with what they did here. | ||
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Tobberoth
Sweden6375 Posts
On May 22 2012 23:06 Osmoses wrote: I'm not saying the game is terrible because the story sucked. I'm saying the story sucked. I'm also saying that "who cares" is in no way a counterargument to that statement. Personally I didn't care for the gameplay either, but I know alot of people enjoy it so I supposed that's totally subjective. But the story is objectively shit. It didn't break the game, but it didn't exactly help either. Here's an anology: you're watching a movie. A hobo in the row behind you suddenly soils himself and starts yelling about Jesus. You might say that the hobo wasn't really part of the movie itself, but that doesn't change the fact that your evening is ruined. Your analogy works for that situation, but we're talking people who loved D2 and dislike the story in D3 and whine about it. Which is like going to a movie expecting it to be interactable, but still loving it when it turns out it isn't, because that's not what movies do. Then going to see the sequel, and getting pissed off that it isn't interactable. The story in D3 is fine. It's not a good story, it doesn't compare to the story of storydriven games such as mass effect, but it works. It doesn't ruin the game, and it's not a detriment to the game, it's just something which could definitely be improved. This is identical to D2, only that there's at least more story in D3. Yet people love on D2 and hate on D3, which literally makes no sense at all. | ||
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Jragon
Australia1471 Posts
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Kuzmorgo
Hungary1058 Posts
wowcrendor, panadaria rage | ||
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