• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 04:32
CEST 10:32
KST 17:32
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End9Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2915Serral wins Maestros of the Game 244ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7
Community News
Weekly Cups (August 10-16): SHIN doubles2GSTL Returns in 2026!45Weekly Cups (Aug 3-9): Protoss get shut out7RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-2212Weekly Cups (July 27-Aug 2): SHIN's big week0
StarCraft 2
General
Geoff 'iNcontroL' Robinson has passed away SC4ALL II: SC2 Player Announcement 6/8 - Maru GSTL Returns in 2026! Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) Serral wins Maestros of the Game 2
Tourneys
PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August) WORTEX 2026 - Hungarian SC2 Finals Budapest Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament SC2 AI Tournament 2026 Fall 2026 GSTL Announcement
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 539 Thunder Dome Mutation # 538 Media Blackout Mutation # 537 Hostile Territory
Brood War
General
Replay Review Process - What do you do? Pros React To: First 'Fastest' Map in ASL History BW General Discussion [Personal Project Share] Terran Defense v0.60 ASL22 General Discussion
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro24 Group C Small VOD Thread 2.0 Toronto invitational lan 22 august [ASL22] Ro24 Group A
Strategy
Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation Fighting Spirit mining rates Any training maps people recommend? Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Anyone here play Quakeworld back in the day? Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread EVE Corporation
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Dating: How's your luck? Artificial Intelligence Thread
Fan Clubs
The Creator Fan Club MarineLorD Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Simple Questions Simple Answers FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
Young Players Exit Esports E…
TrAiDoS
LOCKPICKING NOOB
LUCKY_NOOB
Cathedral Of CS And NY pizza a…
FuDDx
Please support my new stand…
Peanutsc
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 4980 users

This is not just a game

Blogs > KristofferAG
Post a Reply
KristofferAG
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Norway25712 Posts
May 02 2012 10:52 GMT
#1
I tried watching today's Code S Ro8 matches between NaNiw and Mvp while doing an LR today, but at the end of the last game my stream decided to crash over and over to the point where I couldn't watch at all.

I did however keep reading the LR thread in hopes that someone would say something about what was going on. Usually this is a fairly simple deal. All the way up to Round of 8, there are few issues in the LR threads, little bitching and little throwing of shit. Of course people are sometimes sad that their favorites don't win, and they'll try to find something to blame.

As you reach Ro8 in any tournament, people are going to become even more passionate about their favorites. They're really really close to a good spot by then, It is, after all, the quarter finals. This obviously means that people will be really really angry at minor things happening.

During today's series between Mvp and NaNiwa, Mvp opted to go for some quite cheesy and all-innish strategies. In game 1 mvp went for a really strong 2-base agressive play with marines, marauders, siege tanks and vikings. The Colossi of NaNi fell rather quick, as did the third base. The following push on the natural of NaNi took it out rather easily as NaNi was forced to fight on the ramp, thus clumping up his units for the siege tanks to shell away. Behind all this Mvp kept making units and made no attempt at expanding. In game 2, Mvp hid a double barracks opening in his natural. NaNi went for a forge expand with up to two cannons at his ramp. As Mvp pulled SCVs, it wasn't enough to stop the Terran forces from stomping all over NaNi. The third game went in NaNi's favor as he managed to take Mvp off guard. This was after NaNi failed an attempt at doing some blink stalker trickery into the main of Mvp. Had the tanks gotten to siege up in time, the game would've ended entirely different. In the last game, Mvp finished it all off with a double 11rax on the third of NaNi. With a really late Gateway on 15, NaNi wasn't able to hold off the attack or stop the bunker from building, even with scouting the two barracks, and the series ended 3-1 to Mvp.

Now, like I mentioned, people will react agressively when their favorites lose. Naturally people react differently to what goes on or what happens to their favorites. Feeling sad and angry is absolutely natural, especially when your favorite loses to agressive and to some extent cheesy/all-innish strategies. In a case like this, it's wholly understandable. In the LR thread the vocal minority kept ripping on Mvp for executing the builds he did.

NaNi has never been exceptionally good at holding off these cheesy strategies. He is a macro player, quite frankly. I can imagine that Mvp in his current condition (CTS) does not want to go for long macro games against a very strong Protoss opponent. He also knows that he will have to face protoss later on, and one can assume that he doesn't want to reveal his strategies this early on. Especially when he knows he can win by being very agressive early-game.

All sports are competitive. If you go to the lower leagues of, say, soccer, you'll find people workign their asses of to win, at any cost. It's all about getting the ball in the net by any means. You don't have to do an amazing curved shot from outside the penalty box to get a goal, a simple header from a corner will suffice. It's not the most entertaining thing to watch, but it's what's needed to win.

SC2 is no different. As a spectator I too want to enjoy good games. I do prefer games that cross the 20-minute mark and has action back and forth with drops and minor as well as large engagements. I always loved BW because it was never completely clear who would win for large parts of the games. it was always back and forth with amazing play from both sides, sprinkled with some cheesy games here and there.

However I do understand that this is not just a game. When you're a professional SC2/BW player you're playing this to make money. You're doing it to win, to get that check and that trophy. I'd love to have nothing but entertaining and interesting play throughout the entire of GSL, but I understand that this is not at all possible. A player will do anything to win, no matter what that means. If it means long games to tire out your opponent, go for it. If it means short games because your opponent is bad at holding off cheese, then go for it.

You can't watch a tournament and expect the players to do it for entertainment value instead of playing to win. If you're really interested in entertaining games, you should instead check out showmatches, or even player streams, where there's not that much on the line. Chances are you'll see more fun builds and longer games this way.

I even saw someone talking about how this was not good for e-sports. To you I say, "WHAT!?"
How anyone can say that a couple of cheesy and quick games are figuratively killing e-sports is beyond me. Oh god yes, we wouldn't want people to play to win, they must make it entertaining and promote e-sports. E-sports first, the life of a pro-gamer second.

It's just my 2 cents.

****
@KristofferAG | http://vestkyststoy.bandcamp.com | last.fm/user/KristofferAG
Firereaver
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
India1701 Posts
May 02 2012 11:08 GMT
#2
well written and solid points...
"They drone drone drone , me win" - JangMinChul(Iron/oGsMC)
zZygote
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
Canada898 Posts
May 02 2012 11:29 GMT
#3
Everyone seems to be trying to be making a fuss about anything hurting esports. Great write-up, summed about most of the things on my mind as well.
KristofferAG
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Norway25712 Posts
May 02 2012 11:31 GMT
#4
Thanks to the both of you.

It's to expect that as the game grows, there will be more peoplein the community, and more people can easily mean more drama. It's something we should be able to avoid IMO.
@KristofferAG | http://vestkyststoy.bandcamp.com | last.fm/user/KristofferAG
ReketSomething
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States6012 Posts
May 02 2012 11:54 GMT
#5
Cheese is so fun to watch anyways. Most excitement.

MVP Fighting.
Jaedong :3
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 1h 29m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
BRAT_OK 39
MindelVK 10
StarCraft: Brood War
Shuttle 3409
Bisu 398
BeSt 310
Killer 103
Sharp 83
Mind 49
Bale 32
Noble 14
ZergMaN 10
Dota 2
The International171787
Gorgc9859
singsing2937
League of Legends
JimRising 560
Counter-Strike
shoxiejesuss588
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King72
Other Games
summit1g9031
Happy221
Sick145
amsayoshi37
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick452
[ Show 11 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV106
League of Legends
• Jankos1078
• Lourlo1063
Upcoming Events
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1h 29m
PiG Sty Festival
3h 29m
Solar vs Reynor
Serral vs Maru
OSC
7h 29m
Afreeca Starleague
1d 1h
hero vs ggaemo
Larva vs Mong
The Patches Monday
1d 7h
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Soulkey vs PianO
JyJ vs sSak
GSL
2 days
PiGosaur Cup
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
3 days
Mini vs Calm
Queen vs EffOrt
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
3 days
The PondCast
4 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
5 days
GSL
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S3: W8
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
K-JUNGMAN
ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL Season 22: Qualifier 1
RSL Revival: Season 6
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
META DYMY #4
Esports World Cup 2026
Esports World Cup 2026: LCQ
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026

Upcoming

CSL Season 22: Qualifier 2
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - TRS
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Acropolis #5 - GSA
Acropolis #5 - GSB
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Calamity Invitational
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.