• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 22:04
CET 04:04
KST 12:04
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
[BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 101SC2 All-Star Invitational: Jan 17-1820Weekly Cups (Dec 22-28): Classic & MaxPax win, Percival surprises3Weekly Cups (Dec 15-21): Classic wins big, MaxPax & Clem take weeklies3ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !11
StarCraft 2
General
SC2 All-Star Invitational: Jan 17-18 Weekly Cups (Dec 22-28): Classic & MaxPax win, Percival surprises Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou Starcraft 2 Zerg Coach ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !
Tourneys
OSC Season 13 World Championship WardiTV Mondays $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship $100 Prize Pool - Winter Warp Gate Masters Showdow Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 506 Warp Zone Mutation # 505 Rise From Ashes Mutation # 504 Retribution Mutation # 503 Fowl Play
Brood War
General
Empty tournaments section on Liquipedia A cwal.gg Extension - Easily keep track of anyone I would like to say something about StarCraft StarCraft & BroodWar Campaign Speedrun Quest BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 10 SLON Grand Finals – Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] Grand Finals - Sunday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Current Meta [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Elden Ring Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Awesome Games Done Quick 2026! Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Survivor II: The Amazon Sengoku Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI 12 Days of Starcraft
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List TL+ Announced
Blogs
National Diversity: A Challe…
TrAiDoS
I decided to write a webnov…
DjKniteX
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 844 users

DramaCraft - Page 2

Blogs > ZenobiaTalon
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 All
rd
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States2586 Posts
March 09 2012 10:03 GMT
#21
On March 09 2012 17:11 RJGooner wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 09 2012 15:22 motbob wrote:
Mr. Garfield's post basically boiled down to "I personally find the word n----- unacceptable, and therefore I have fired Orb." I find it fascinating that no one has broken down the post to find the essence of its meaning yet. Go back and read the post. Here's the structure:

Alex explains why he, personally, finds the n-word so reprehensible.

He states: "In line with this, earlier today, Orb, who had been contracted by EG to anchor our Master's Cup broadcasts, was informed that he has been dismissed of his position and will not be invited back."

Alex then talks a bit about the nature of racism and how happy he is with the SC2 community for finding Orb's usage of the n-word as unacceptable as he did.

So there is your answer as to why this action feels "extreme." It's one man firing another for a personal belief -- it's a belief I 100% agree with leading to a firing that I 100% agree with, but that's not the point.

This is why I've felt that the comments that EG "caved in" to pressure from reddit/sponsors are detached from reality. You cannot read Mr. Garfield's post and come away with the impression that he acted at all against his wishes -- unless, of course, you assume that he is lying. And I don't see how anyone could assume that, either, unless they have a hopelessly cynical view of business and EG.


I understand what you're getting at but based off the post and his statements on twitter, he fired Orb for saying nigger on his stream at a time when Orb wasn't even affiliated with EG. He also says in his post that he wishes that people stigmatized the word faggot as much as nigger, implying that he holds very similar personal beliefs with regards to that word.

IdrA has used the word faggot or fag several times in different forums. So why was IdrA not let go from the team before? As far as I can see it is either:

A) Alex clearly doesn't hold as strong personal beliefs about the word faggot as he does about nigger.
or
B) Nobody conjured up a shitstorm and complained to sponsors when IdrA used those words. IdrA is also the signature player for EG.

Do I know which of these it is? Of course not. But I feel that this definitely raises questions about whether a double standard possibly exists here.


Would anyone really want Idra to be fired from EG for saying faggot? It would be way too harsh of a punishment. Especially if it was done for saying faggot before he even joined. Orb's punishment is way over the top.
sharky246
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
1197 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-09 12:05:53
March 09 2012 12:05 GMT
#22
On March 09 2012 15:22 motbob wrote:
Mr. Garfield's post basically boiled down to "I personally find the word n----- unacceptable, and therefore I have fired Orb." I find it fascinating that no one has broken down the post to find the essence of its meaning yet. Go back and read the post. Here's the structure:

Alex explains why he, personally, finds the n-word so reprehensible.

He states: "In line with this, earlier today, Orb, who had been contracted by EG to anchor our Master's Cup broadcasts, was informed that he has been dismissed of his position and will not be invited back."

Alex then talks a bit about the nature of racism and how happy he is with the SC2 community for finding Orb's usage of the n-word as unacceptable as he did.

So there is your answer as to why this action feels "extreme." It's one man firing another for a personal belief -- it's a belief I 100% agree with leading to a firing that I 100% agree with, but that's not the point.

This is why I've felt that the comments that EG "caved in" to pressure from reddit/sponsors are detached from reality. You cannot read Mr. Garfield's post and come away with the impression that he acted at all against his wishes -- unless, of course, you assume that he is lying. And I don't see how anyone could assume that, either, unless they have a hopelessly cynical view of business and EG.


His wishes are that of what the majority of the community wants (like any guys working in marketing), which is some sort of justice for orb's use of the n word. And that is also why no one - to put it in your words - has broken down the post to find the essence of the meaning. Completely irrelevant. Alex was always going to respond in a way that best serves his business. He wouldn't give a flying fuck about his personal beliefs if it meant hurting EG.
On January 03 2011 13:14 IdrA wrote: being high on the ladder doesnt get you any closer to your goal. Avoiding practice to protect your rating is absurd. If you want to be good go play 40 games a day and stop thinking about becoming a pro.
Iranon
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States983 Posts
March 09 2012 12:37 GMT
#23
On March 09 2012 18:17 AeroEffect wrote:
1. Its the internet, if your sad about something someone said... oh well.
2. If you look to start trouble and/or bait anger out of somebody, dont expect to NOT get a reaction.
3. Get over the "we're all adults so we have to be Good Mannered" shit, like I said in #1, its the internet.
4. People are entitled to say whatever the fuck they want to say because again, its the internet.

[...]

Grow some nuts. Let that testosterone flow, drink a beer, and enjoy watching a stream just like you would a basketball or football game and stop whining because thats a bitch trait


So you want to treat it like a regular sports game, but with an "its the internetz lolol" attitude? Genius. If someone involved in the NBA or NFL was calling his opponents "dumb niggers", I'm pretty sure there would be some repercussions. Serious ones. Nobody cares whether or not it's actually said out of racism (extremely unlikely anyway), the point is it's unacceptable public behavior for someone that represents a larger organization. The same is true here, EG is a corporation with an image to protect. It's not a big deal when random 15 year olds on ladder drop the N word left and right, because they're just random 15 year olds, not contracted professionals in the public eye.

On the other hand, the SC community (notice the lack of a "2" there) prides itself on being a little bit better than the sewage pit that is the rest of the internet and other "gaming communities". So no, it's not "the internet". If that's how you feel, kindly take your leave and crawl back to 4chan or wherever where this is the norm.

What you suggest we do is exactly what I already do. I take a few beers from the fridge, queue up an hour or two of tournament VODs, and enjoy myself, as though I were watching the World Cup or something. However, when I'm watching the World Cup, I don't have to worry about legions of trolls in stream chat, and I don't have to worry about the players and casters insulting each other on camera, because they're professionals. You say grow some nuts; I say have some fucking standards.
motbob
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States12546 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-09 14:05:49
March 09 2012 14:05 GMT
#24
On March 09 2012 21:05 sharky246 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 09 2012 15:22 motbob wrote:
Mr. Garfield's post basically boiled down to "I personally find the word n----- unacceptable, and therefore I have fired Orb." I find it fascinating that no one has broken down the post to find the essence of its meaning yet. Go back and read the post. Here's the structure:

Alex explains why he, personally, finds the n-word so reprehensible.

He states: "In line with this, earlier today, Orb, who had been contracted by EG to anchor our Master's Cup broadcasts, was informed that he has been dismissed of his position and will not be invited back."

Alex then talks a bit about the nature of racism and how happy he is with the SC2 community for finding Orb's usage of the n-word as unacceptable as he did.

So there is your answer as to why this action feels "extreme." It's one man firing another for a personal belief -- it's a belief I 100% agree with leading to a firing that I 100% agree with, but that's not the point.

This is why I've felt that the comments that EG "caved in" to pressure from reddit/sponsors are detached from reality. You cannot read Mr. Garfield's post and come away with the impression that he acted at all against his wishes -- unless, of course, you assume that he is lying. And I don't see how anyone could assume that, either, unless they have a hopelessly cynical view of business and EG.


His wishes are that of what the majority of the community wants (like any guys working in marketing), which is some sort of justice for orb's use of the n word. And that is also why no one - to put it in your words - has broken down the post to find the essence of the meaning. Completely irrelevant. Alex was always going to respond in a way that best serves his business. He wouldn't give a flying fuck about his personal beliefs if it meant hurting EG.

See, this is what I'm talking about. You are saying this kind of stuff with absolutely no justification. You are taking the most cynical view of Mr. Garfield possible when there is zero reason to do so.
ModeratorGood content always wins.
ZenobiaTalon
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
Canada35 Posts
March 09 2012 19:42 GMT
#25
On March 09 2012 18:17 AeroEffect wrote:
The sc2 community is soft and nosey. They're beginning to be like that old lady that lives next door with her cats. Always in your business trying to see what she can tell the neighborhood. Its quite frustrating. Then you have the grammar nazis and truth police that roam the forums looking for trouble. When I first joined teamliquid, I took it pretty seriously. Not seriously as in what I described above, but I began to take interest in e-sports through tl and thought it would be big like "real" sports.

never in a million years would I expect what has happened in the past 2 weeks to become such an issue. this is why:

1. Its the internet, if your sad about something someone said... oh well.
2. If you look to start trouble and/or bait anger out of somebody, dont expect to NOT get a reaction.
3. Get over the "we're all adults so we have to be Good Mannered" shit, like I said in #1, its the internet.
4. People are entitled to say whatever the fuck they want to say because again, its the internet.

Sure, you can whine about someone saying "Nigger", but im black and I can say that it doesnt bother me and Im sure that it really doesnt bother any other black person on this site. I find it funny because people usually only say it when they are referring to stupid shit, not to be racist.

So my message to the community is:

Grow some nuts. Let that testosterone flow, drink a beer, and enjoy watching a stream just like you would a basketball or football game and stop whining because thats a bitch trait


The only question I have for you is this: Just because it's the internet and it has an annonymous aspect to it; does that make it okay to use offensive language? Do we have the right to defy society's standards simply because it is the internet? Just curious about your thoughts on the topic.

Also, you say "let that testosterone flow" when this is a post by a girl... that's a bit illogical. Just throwing that out there, take it as you will.
Que Sera Sera
Prev 1 2 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Korean StarCraft League
03:00
Week 84
davetesta34
CranKy Ducklings30
SteadfastSC16
HKG_Chickenman12
Liquipedia
The PiG Daily
21:00
Best Games of SC
Reynor vs Clem
MaxPax vs TBD
SHIN vs TBD
Rogue vs TBD
PiGStarcraft767
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft767
NeuroSwarm 181
RuFF_SC2 178
ProTech150
SteadfastSC 16
StarCraft: Brood War
Shuttle 69
NaDa 45
Icarus 5
Dota 2
XaKoH 481
monkeys_forever164
League of Legends
JimRising 718
C9.Mang0409
Counter-Strike
summit1g10620
tarik_tv5861
minikerr34
Other Games
ViBE152
Chillindude54
Mew2King46
ZombieGrub37
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 19 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH93
• Hupsaiya 71
• HeavenSC 25
• Adnapsc2 2
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• RayReign 56
• HerbMon 48
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• Doublelift5774
Other Games
• imaqtpie1999
• Scarra1050
Upcoming Events
OSC
8h 56m
IPSL
13h 56m
Dewalt vs Bonyth
OSC
14h 56m
OSC
1d 8h
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 10h
Replay Cast
2 days
RotterdaM Event
2 days
Patches Events
2 days
OSC
3 days
OSC
4 days
[ Show More ]
OSC
5 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S1: W2
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9

Ongoing

IPSL Winter 2025-26
BSL Season 21
Slon Tour Season 2
CSL Season 19: Qualifier 2
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025

Upcoming

CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
Escore Tournament S1: W3
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Thunderfire SC2 All-star 2025
Big Gabe Cup #3
OSC Championship Season 13
Nations Cup 2026
Underdog Cup #3
NA Kuram Kup
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.