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I've been part of this community for a long time now, I originally started looking and reading these boards around early 2008 when i watched a TL attack video on youtube with iNcontroL as the guest of all people. I found it very interesting and had a lot of fun watching it; having always played BW since its inception but never competitively (I played CS 1.6 quite competitively for many many years until i finally went to college and then university) it reinvoked that first feeling i got when i played Starcraft with my dad when i was very young. So i went on this website... Then discovered the Proleague, ICCUP, the small foreigner scene and well... The rest is history.
I love starcraft, BW and SC2. I have done for a long time, and think the community at times is fucking awesome and awe-inspiring. But sometimes, jesus christ it just melts my brain.
I've been watching esports and going to lans since the days of NiP and when they were unbeatable, I still remember watching players like HeatoN and ksharp (Really fucking good CS 1.6 players back in the day) when i was just alittle kid and being starstruck while contemplating how i could be as good at a game as them one day. I remember when there used to be crowds of about 10-50 people and people would get giddy about it. Most of those were either family or competitors too. The prize pools were pitiful. People didn't even go for the money, they went for the competition, prestige and fun. So they could say, I won something. On this day, at this event, I was the best. You were elated if you broke even half the time. It's amazing what esports has become. But please, can we as a community respect the other esports that have laid the foundations for what we have today?
Starcraft 2 alone is not esports. Is it one of the biggest? Yes. Has it set precedents and furthered it? Certainly. But there's others that came before it that got us where we are today and are still going strong. Without games like Quake, Counter-Strike, Brood War, Warcraft 3, Dota, the fighting games; what we have right now, wouldn't even exist. And a lot of the people in those communities like ours, gave their heart and soul to try and make it happen. We are incredibly lucky that ours is one of the biggest, but please don't become ignorant because of it and respect the other games.
Dreamhack has been one of the main drivers of esports long before Starcraft 2 existed and has always had multiple titles. It is NOT a starcraft 2 event, but an esports event. Tbh, i feel like it's the way it should be. We are all still niche communities and we could be so much more if we worked together instead of all trying to shit on eachother. If you don't like the other game, that's completely fine, but that doesn't mean you have to boo, or flame or write how terrible it is and how it takes no skill or is for noobies. The LR's deteriorate at such a rapid rate when another game comes on and quite frankly, half the people that start writing trash in them don't even give the game a chance. They've already drawn their conclusions and prejudices before the game has begun.
Nobody expects you to watch something you don't want to, but please just show some respect because that was once us, we were the little guys, we needed a help in hand. Dreamhack for Quake is one of the only times they ever get to even see their game and go to events now. Just how we were with WCG in the BW days. It might even be their last. The events for CS are dwindling. For some of these guys, these events are their big moment. The moment they spend months preparing for hoping for a title, for a legacy. Who are we to shit all over that? That's such arrogance and quite simply disgusting. How would you feel if someone just took a dump all over something you have worked years at and put your life into? I know because our community has grown, the trolls have grown with it. It's just the way life and internet in general work but can we please strive to be a little better than that? Let's lead by example and try and do this fucking right. Give other games a chance. Because i know we can.
Be the better people. Because he who respects not is not respected.
"Respect is honouring the worth or dignity in a person or process. When we respect others, we take their preferences and ideas seriously. We thoughtfully weigh our own insights and experiences against theirs.
Respect is merited particularly by those who are our elders, because knowledge, insight and wisdom often are hard won through a lifetime of discipline and learning.
Cultivating respect as a virtue does not mean insisting that all ideas, beliefs, or actions are respect-worthy. It does mean that we recognize the basic human dignity of others, even when their ideas or values are different than our own. A general attitude of respect also assumes that each person has something to teach us if we are willing to learn."
 
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Full cosign. Helps that your name inludes "Hova"
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Agreed.
Sad thing is that the people who this aims to probably won't read it at all... the same kind that says "BW is too old, no one plays it", "BW is dead" "Wheres my SC2? Who cares about CS!?!!?", "<insert some shit here> IS KILLING ESPORTS!" and so on.
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It's a lot like homecoming in high school for those of us who know what that is. People would rather rally behind their own class than with the others.
It'd be a beautiful sight to see hordes of sc2 players move out to support and watch fps/fighter games during the down time for sc2, but I don't really see it happening. Maybe I'm cynical, but I never bought into the hype/idea that the sc2 community is one of the best around. It's just like the others. There will be people who read a thread like this and say "yea duh", while others will say "fuck that sf4 is stupid to watch". I left my stream open/muted when other games were going on to support DH, but I honestly don't expect others to.
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On November 27 2011 12:04 phiinix wrote:
It's a lot like homecoming in high school for those of us who know what that is. People would rather rally behind their own class than with the others.
It'd be a beautiful sight to see hordes of sc2 players move out to support and watch fps/fighter games during the down time for sc2, but I don't really see it happening. Maybe I'm cynical, but I never bought into the hype/idea that the sc2 community is one of the best around. It's just like the others. There will be people who read a thread like this and say "yea duh", while others will say "fuck that sf4 is stupid to watch". I left my stream open/muted when other games were going on to support DH, but I honestly don't expect others to.
It used to be a very respectful community. Back in the Beta days before IdrA REALLY started talking shit. And even now people who watch Husky are probably ... okay they might very well be fanatics at this point. I'm gonna do some research.
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This highlights the difference between people who want to see the growth of eSports, and people who only want to see the growth of SC2. I dislike people who say they want to support eSports as a whole, and then are aggressive and condescending towards any game but that of their choice. They're lying to themselves, and should at least be honest about it if they only care about one game, in my opinion, instead of throwing around the term "eSports".
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There's a lot of people from this community that are completely unaware of everything behind eSports and the history that we've come from. They've almost had tunnel vision from BW and TL, into SC2 and all the newcomers that have since arrived.
They know not of the days of Quake, Counter-Strike, and all the leagues and tournaments that existed back many, many years ago. When people used to play for the love of the game and the competition; not the money. The community as a whole (not just TL/BW/SC2), has slowly degenerated into more expectations. There has to be more money, more streams, more tournaments and better casters.
Certainly, there are aspects of most communities where people are grateful for how far we have come, and those that know that they can't have their cake and eat it too when it comes to our hobby; but Generation Y has always been on the cusp of huge advancements and their resulting attitude is that of a spoiled child. It will take a lot to change this mindset and there are lots of format changes across the spectrum that can help legitimize a lot of the issues that we face today.
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I really liked quake and SSF4 at dreamhack. LoL still has no respect from me :3
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I think some people just don't realize that one day their game will be the one that is dying out and they'll be the ones wanting to get some new blood watching (kind of like how BW fans reacted to events earlier this year). Comparisons to 'real' sports are well and good, but Starcraft does not yet have the stability of a 'real' sport, in Korea or worldwide. There's no reason we shouldn't work together, lest we all fall.
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A lot of people have the ability to ignore the appearance of a game when they really get into it. When you play all the Brood War custom games and see what map editors can really do with the units, they really start to mean more to you than some random pixels on a computer screen. At least if one of your best childhood memories involves your favorite cousin building morphing a bunch of Atom-looking Archons on a laptop screen distorted by the angle from which you're looking at it.
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As I just posted in that thread about the dreamhack thing.. I'm a fan of Esports. I came from Halo/ CS.. I watch a bit of QL, will happily sit and watch SSF4/ any good fighter really. ( was just watching a Halo ffa and a few daigo matches from evo earlier) I wish more people would take an interest in other things. But this is a Starcraft site.. people are bias, a lot of the younger guys here won't have been around for Q3 1.6 etc.
I still revere the SK name above almost anything else in Esports.
I know when SC2 is on break at MLG I'm usually sitting watching Halo. I've been a member over at MLG since it's first Halo 2 season, and watched the WCG way back when the Original Halo was a 1v1 game there.
You'd think people would be happy to see something other than a blank screen/ crowd shot inbetween games but apparently not.
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thanks for respecting and appreciating esports, esports brother ; o ;...
something i posted on another thread earlier-
+ Show Spoiler +i haven't read many replies yet to this thread, but relating from your OP, i just wanted to say that i like the word, 'appreciation' and its entirety.
as i've said during the LR though, it does seem a bit hasty to have an entire 'program' with the casters if you will, that would help give others a sense of what's going on in a game they've barely ever seen. as more interest and care were shown, it would happen naturally anyway.
i don't know how it was like before starcraft for me and its been many years, but i am still a huge fan of the fighting games, FPS, online games and anything that has to do with a competitive scene over a game that i have some sort of respect for.
it's extremely---and i can't stress it enough---irritating for me when people talk carelessly and bash the game and its community when they know absolutely nothing about it. this is from my own competitive nature to learn. it's comparable to balance whining or player bashing as someone with little or no experience actually playing or watching games being played.
----and it's not even just 'this is my opinion' stuff, some people just feel the need to insult the game and the community itself, and it's unnecessary.
if you are a fan of games in general, i feel like you owe some bit of respect to all the other games out there that fill in the gaps of people who love playing something other than starcraft
+ a bit of respect for games that give people a chance to express themselves.
if you are just a fan of starcraft, you could hope to learn to appreciate that something in front of you (even if it is just some game) gives joy to many, many people around the world. some would have been ecstatic to have been there in person at dreamhack to watch just the finals of ssf4.
sigh
i'm really glad you decided to blog on this, and you get just as much support as e-sports does ^_^
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How can we expect SC fans to respect other eSports when they barely even respect a ton of figures in SC2? There's such a large amount of hate spewed all over the place to people that I think the focus should first be on establishing respect for our own eSport before telling people to respect other eSports.
In a perfect world, both would happen, but I just don't see it happening soon.
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On November 27 2011 13:13 Sc1pio wrote:
How can we expect SC fans to respect other eSports when they barely even respect a ton of figures in SC2? There's such a large amount of hate spewed all over the place to people that I think the focus should first be on establishing respect for our own eSport before telling people to respect other eSports.
In a perfect world, both would happen, but I just don't see it happening soon.
I think this is the biggest problem. I mean I have players I don't like due to play styles but I still respect them for where they stand in the game. I've actually found myself watching more LoL and Halo at MLG's lately... I'm finding it rather exciting to watch something I never see  gogo Esports!
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So...I realize there's a discussion going on in here. But what I'm really seeing is that I don't really know how to give people a little bit of pain mixed with respect right now. I don't really know how to avoid that because of everything going on in my head recently. And this has nothing to do with an Internet forum. So if anyone can give me some positive feedback about these posts people are calling crazy, it would be much appreciated.
The only reason I'm saying this is because it adds depth to the conversation. By all means, never read anything I've written. That's not what this is about.
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United States677 Posts
is this my hova from wew? because I AM EOHS
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Not just in ESports.
Do this in regular life,
We would fix the world.
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On November 27 2011 13:03 Gingerninja wrote:
As I just posted in that thread about the dreamhack thing.. I'm a fan of Esports. I came from Halo/ CS.. I watch a bit of QL, will happily sit and watch SSF4/ any good fighter really. ( was just watching a Halo ffa and a few daigo matches from evo earlier) I wish more people would take an interest in other things. But this is a Starcraft site.. people are bias, a lot of the younger guys here won't have been around for Q3 1.6 etc.
I still revere the SK name above almost anything else in Esports.
I know when SC2 is on break at MLG I'm usually sitting watching Halo. I've been a member over at MLG since it's first Halo 2 season, and watched the WCG way back when the Original Halo was a 1v1 game there.
You'd think people would be happy to see something other than a blank screen/ crowd shot inbetween games but apparently not.
I understand here will always be a bias, and that's great. It's fantastic that people feel so strongly about 'their' game. But we don't have to be so negative towards others to show that. Everyone is allowed to not like a game and want to watch it. I think everybody agrees with that. But you can still respect something even if it don't agree with its connotations. We're doing ourselves no favours or getting anything constructive out of vile hate.
I don't expect everyone to agree, and my view i guess is very utopian, but if just one person reads this who usually responds negatively has a think before doing it next time. Heck, that's good enough for me.
On November 27 2011 14:05 SeizeTheDay wrote:
is this my hova from wew? because I AM EOHS
I'm afraid not sorry. :p
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As a long time quake player, i couldn't agree more. It was totally disgusting to see all these people hating on quake when it really kind of paved the way for alot of esports. I mean, i don't even enjoy sc2 but i sure as hell wasn't on stream/IRC hating on it.
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EPT
