There is just so much frustration that I decided to write a blog about it. FYI, I am teacher teaching on a northern reserve in Canada. In case you didn't know what a reserve was, it is where all the natives/aboriginals/inidians live. It is very isolated, everything is flown in. This is actually my second year teaching here, I am just fed up with all the fucken bullshit that has happened and has been happening here.
The school consists of grades JK to grade 9, so it is mixed up to get more funding form the government. Their way of getting money for the upcoming school year is based on the previous year's attendance records in Sept and Oct. This is just retarded, how can you use previous year's attendance record to predict the upcoming year's enrollment numbers? Because of this, we are forced to keep kids in school regardless of their behaviours. Basically we put up with their attitudes, disrespects everyday for 2 months so the school can get money for the next year. The office does not punish kids or deal with them, if I send them the office, they send them back because they are "ready" to participate in classroom activities again....
You have to keep in mind that, all the native kids here are extremely low in terms of academics, even though they are grade 9, they function at a grade 4-6 level. They have been spoon fed from JK all the way to grade 8. I have always questioned the integrity of their grades from the years before because there is no way they can get to grade 9 if they function at a grade 4-6 level. There has been a lot of pushing kids through and passing kids for free here. There are 3 classes here for kids who are working below grade level, some kids who are like 13-14, can't read and can't perform simple math operations like adding. They don't even know the letter sounds, and times table.
Couple days ago, we just had our grade 9 midterms. The grade 9s have no respect, no work ethic, no motivation, and don't give a fuck attitude. This is true for 80%+ natives here. So the kids normally don't study and don't do any work in class, they don't do any homework because the homework never make it back to the home. The day before the midterm, I literally took the midterm and wrote on the board all the questions that were on the midterm. Basically telling them exactly what to study for, some people copied them down and then just sat there and chatted the remainder of the period. They didn't care at all. Then the exam day, I had 2 girls walk out on the midterm 20 minutes in because they didn't know how to do it and decided to go for a smoke break. So I called the office and the office called the parents. One of the parents came in and was in the principal's office with the students for half an hour. The next day, I was called into the office by the principal and the principal wanted me to give the student a make up midterm next week and find the notes from other students, make photocopies of them and give to that particular student to study for the make up midterm... The principal explained that the parent wants her kid to go to the city in January for grade 10, so we will have to try to "help" her out.
That student chose not to do any work in class everyday, she chose not to study for the midterm when given all the questions on the midterm, she chose to walk out on the midterm, and now all of a sudden she is given a second chance and I have to make photocopies of notes for her to study? Are you fucking kidding me? She was blaming me during the parent principal meeting for talking too fast, writing illegibly, etc... The principal does not want to confront the parents and just sugarcoats everything and changes her story all the time to please the parents, it is fucking ridiculous. Also, she does not go anywhere in town because she is afraid the kids might stone her to death. She wouldn't go to the grocery store unless she has a car for this very reason.
Couple weeks back, the principal went into my classroom and stole all my paper like 8 reams of blank paper for photocopying. I confronted her in her office and her excuse was " I don't see a name on it". Every single one had my name on it written on the side, they were handed out every month for teacher making photocopies. She says I don't need that much and asked where did I get them. I just told her I saved them up from last year and what I received this year. Apparently, you can't save up things here because they will be taken away...
The kids here are just totally fucking hopeless, natives and education don't mix at all. The parents do drugs at home and the kids do whatever they want outside. You often see them walking around 3-4am in the morning even those little kids. They throw rocks at teachers' houses and bust windows all the time. The teachers houses are mostly covered with plywood because of broken windows. Just yesterday, they torched a police cruiser and the chief came into school for a talk with the students. They busted all the school windows and you can't see the outside from the inside of the school because all the windows are boarded up. We just had a few arsons here, several houses got burned down.
Just today, a teacher was accused of looking at a female student in her class "inappropriately" by her parents. The teacher was new here, only been here for a month. He has a class of fully degenerate kids. That female student(14 years old) was always giving him a hard time and was throwing tables and having a temper tantrum everyday. So basically she just made up some bullshit and told her parents and that teacher got in shit for that. Even though it was not true, the principal did not investigate this issue just told him to stay 5 feet away from other students. Now he is uncomfortable stay in the class because he is afraid that other kids might accuse him of something else. This kind of garbage is just absolutely mind boggling.
The female students here do no get along with male teachers because they "hate" guys. The reason being that they didn't have proper father figures in life and their dads were all deadbeats just went around and made babies so that they can get welfare once the kids go to school. This brings me to another point that I am just seeing the parents here using kids to make money(welfare), as long as kids stay in school they couldn't care less. If the kids get kicked out, they would be pissed because of no welfare! There is a huge lack of parenting, I call home all the time about students' behaviours and attendance, the parents always tell me "I'll talk to him/her". This kind of response just tells me that they don't care.
A lot of the teachers are from the city, and they are afraid to speak up and stand up for themselves because they are afraid that they might get fired... LOL.... We get worked to death everyday for shit pay, and we have to do all the extra school work like organizing a festival and baazars, cooking turkey/ham for Thanks Giving feast and Christmas dinner etc... while the local staff members barely do any shit, they just go home as soon as school is over. They just take advantage of us here because we are educated and nice people.
For the record, I am not gonna make any fucken photocopies of notes, she can go get it from her friends. I should just fucking give her a 0 on the midterm and call up the education ministry and report this unprofessional practice. If they are doing this all the time, imagine what kind of other corrupt shit they are doing... trying to send kids to the city to make themselves look good, to prove to other people natives can succeed.... I am not trying to generalize that all natives are retards and they can't succeed. I am sure that there are couple smart natives out there, but for the most part, fucken hopeless at best.
Oh, I forgot to add that natives do not pay tax, they get free money from the government and the government pays for ALL of their health coverage like free surgery etc.. they also get lighter sentence if they commit a crime unless it is a serious crime like murder.
There's alot of groups that do the same thing in my area. Church groups mostly and the native kids who went to my schools were the same. Why work? Why try? Once their of age to be hired the church can just get them a job. Same way with natives, my friend works at wallmart and since its on a native reserve natives get hired 100% of the time. They even have a set number of native workers they have to hire before turning any natives away.
You could try getting a job with kids who actually care. I dont see that school being very fulfilling for a teacher. Yeah natives get alot of benifits, its pretty ridiculous. Lifes not fair, whatever.
I've heard many stories like yours, its shitty I have a lot of friends that went into education. They got lucky and got jobs in the city. I recently heard of a program that the gov will either pay for/or pay a part of your education if you are willing to teach on a reserve. Crazy stuff.
I'm pretty sure teaching is tough and children can be little monsters universally. I've heard worse teaching stories.
It sounds like the kids don't take the lessons seriously. Maybe you could try to find new ways to engage your students -- let them know what's in it for them. Where's your work ethic?
I never hated school, but I certainly didn't appreciate then why I needed to learn things that weren't interesting to me. My best experience in the lower grades was a 6th grade teacher that raised the bar: he had us reading NYT, Carl Sagan, National Geographic, and doing frequent writing assignments. Most cracked under the stress, but it was so far ahead of the other teachers in the grade that we were way ahead of our peers going into middle school.
Maybe because there are such low expectations for these students you can ask for some freedom/flexibility in teaching methods?
On November 11 2011 12:43 mmp wrote: I'm pretty sure teaching is tough and children can be little monsters universally. I've heard worse teaching stories.
It sounds like the kids don't take the lessons seriously. Maybe you could try to find new ways to engage your students -- let them know what's in it for them. Where's your work ethic?
I never hated school, but I certainly didn't appreciate then why I needed to learn things that weren't interesting to me. My best experience in the lower grades was a 6th grade teacher that raised the bar: he had us reading NYT, Carl Sagan, National Geographic, and doing frequent writing assignments. Most cracked under the stress, but it was so far ahead of the other teachers in the grade that we were way ahead of our peers going into middle school.
Maybe because there are such low expectations for these students you can ask for some freedom/flexibility in teaching methods?
The thing is, its not that you need a different approach to teaching them, its that most of them could care less. I have lived around many many natives, and yes there are some really nice ones, but from my OWN personal experience I have mostly run into complete assholes. Over 80% of my cities homeless are natives who just dont want to work. You can give one of them a job, and in the end drugs and alcohol wins over, and they end up right back where they started. I really dont want to come across as racist, as I have friends who are native and they are great, but speaking from what I have witnessed the last 25 years, they have some serious problems in life.
I don't think enough people realise the historical and I mean recent as well, issues aboriginal peoples in Canada have faced. Reserve schools completely fucked over a lot of the education system for aboriginals. Many adults don't trust it and there is a lot of substance abuse thanks to cultural transmission partly due to the side effects of serious physical sexual and mental abuse that happened in reserve schools as well.
Also, some reserves and their educational systems are poor at the lower levels in part due to lack of funding and also due to the fact most of the funding they get is from incentive programs which some people forge results to achieve
But really no need to be so ignorant of the social and historical issues facing aboriginal people in Canada. They are a disadvantaged group and the situations you face are part and parcel of educating disadvantaged groups. Im sure its similar in inner city schools with high african american population in the states in major cities.
And here I was thinking that it was only Australia that had such a severe level of problems with it's Aboriginals. They literally have a mentality that if they want something new they just burn their old one down and the government will get them a new one. Don't like your house? Burn it down and the government will build a new one. Don't like the playground? Burn it down and the government will build a new one. It is the most heartwrenching thing to go out to the communities one year and get to know the kids and then come back the next and find them all changed because over half of the girls (who hadn't previously had it happen) have been raped by a family member and everyone has gotten into alcohol and drugs.
The problem is that this cycle will keep going as long as the government keeps rewarding them for doing nothing and If the government stops giving them so much for nothing then everyone (both aboriginal and non-aboriginal) will be up in arms about it.
People have to realise that adversity isn't an excuse to give up. Just because you're born into a situation doesn't mean you have to stay in that situation your entire life and bring your kids into it.
On November 11 2011 12:43 mmp wrote: I'm pretty sure teaching is tough and children can be little monsters universally. I've heard worse teaching stories.
It sounds like the kids don't take the lessons seriously. Maybe you could try to find new ways to engage your students -- let them know what's in it for them. Where's your work ethic?
I never hated school, but I certainly didn't appreciate then why I needed to learn things that weren't interesting to me. My best experience in the lower grades was a 6th grade teacher that raised the bar: he had us reading NYT, Carl Sagan, National Geographic, and doing frequent writing assignments. Most cracked under the stress, but it was so far ahead of the other teachers in the grade that we were way ahead of our peers going into middle school.
Maybe because there are such low expectations for these students you can ask for some freedom/flexibility in teaching methods?
The thing is, its not that you need a different approach to teaching them, its that most of them could care less. I have lived around many many natives, and yes there are some really nice ones, but from my OWN personal experience I have mostly run into complete assholes. Over 80% of my cities homeless are natives who just dont want to work. You can give one of them a job, and in the end drugs and alcohol wins over, and they end up right back where they started. I really dont want to come across as racist, as I have friends who are native and they are great, but speaking from what I have witnessed the last 25 years, they have some serious problems in life.
There are probably social elements here that I am not familiar with. We have a lot of problems over here too though, especially in poor public schools and cities where drugs & violence are problems.
Reading the OP, this sounded very similar to the stories teachers tell me about their work in the US, but without the cultural dimension. Poverty is poverty anywhere.
Yeah, the very roots of the people on aboriginal reserves in Canada are effed up because our predecessors went and tried to forcibly assimilate them into European/white culture.. children were taken away from their families at a young age, and awful things happened at reserve schools for generations. At least that's how I remember it from Social Studies in high school.
On November 11 2011 14:55 Vestrel wrote: Yeah, the very roots of the people on aboriginal reserves in Canada are effed up because our predecessors went and tried to forcibly assimilate them into European/white culture.. children were taken away from their families at a young age, and awful things happened at reserve schools for generations. At least that's how I remember it from Social Studies in high school.
I think the more severe problem is the opposite of assimilation; isolating them on reserves and paying their way. They have no integration into society at large and no incentive to work or better themselves. Substance abuse is a huuuuge issue. The government of Canada has basically created ghettos with the reserve system. The feelings of bitterness and entitlement with the culture due to past abuses are a problem too.
My mom worked on a reservation in western Alberta a couple years ago and she had stories very similar to OP's. She taught a grade 2 class. The kids were completely wild and developmentally stunted. She got the day off work one day because a few natives had stolen a truck with some guns in it and were riding around shooting at people's houses. They had a shootout with police near the school. I'm sure her job was actually easier than the OP, being a younger class, but she still quit after a year of it.
So I read everything and I'm really curious, WTF are you doing working as a teacher on a RESERVE?!
Now that I have that out of my chest, I want to say that it's very unfortunate the way natives are here. Is there ever going to be hope for them or will it be a vicious cycle of shitty parents forever?
Natives have been a problem for a long, long time and ofc it's not even their fault the bad things that happened to them. The damage is so great though that they're still fucked up for the most part. Is there any solutions?!
AFAIK Native Americans lived for tens of thousands of years at one with nature, no alcohol, no smallpox, no technology. Then we (you? Europeans in general) invaded the Garden of Eden and fucked it all up. Now, although they have their own reservations and aren't "assimilated" per se, Western civilization at large is still trying to fit the western ideas of progress and societal responsibilities onto these people by instilling ideas of education, advancement, and jobs.
These kids were basically brought up in an environment that's intrinsically hostile to the idea of western society, so these programs of schooling don't really work. Maybe if the schools were completely re-adapted to be more culturally based than based on science/math/literature things could be better. Abandon trying to teach science/math/literature, and simply concentrate on teaching the kids their own culture, history, religion, and language. Gradually pull these government-educated teachers out and have the Natives teach their own kids, fund the schools but don't expect the same standardized education that comes out of cities and towns outside the reservation. Let them figure out for themselves whether or not they want/need to learn about math, science, and literature.
On November 11 2011 16:28 Newbistic wrote: Maybe some people were just born to be wild, eh?
AFAIK Native Americans lived for tens of thousands of years at one with nature, no alcohol, no smallpox, no technology. Then we (you? Europeans in general) invaded the Garden of Eden and fucked it all up. Now, although they have their own reservations and aren't "assimilated" per se, Western civilization at large is still trying to fit the western ideas of progress and societal responsibilities onto these people by instilling ideas of education, advancement, and jobs.
These kids were basically brought up in an environment that's intrinsically hostile to the idea of western society, so these programs of schooling don't really work. Maybe if the schools were completely re-adapted to be more culturally based than based on science/math/literature things could be better. Abandon trying to teach science/math/literature, and simply concentrate on teaching the kids their own culture, history, religion, and language. Gradually pull these government-educated teachers out and have the Natives teach their own kids, fund the schools but don't expect the same standardized education that comes out of cities and towns outside the reservation. Let them figure out for themselves whether or not they want/need to learn about math, science, and literature.
Your sig greatly compliments the points you gave, I lol'd.
I agree, somethings got to change so need to try new things because clearly the reserves currently aren't cutting it.
It's not going to work Newbistic. They try to do the same here in Australia and the kids do the exact same thing as they always did. As shit as it sounds the only way to fix it is to take all oftheir kids away from their parents and put them in another home but this time minus the abuses that happened previously. I'm not saying destroy their culture, you can put them in other "natives" homes as long as the home you put them in isn't a violent, alcohol fueled mess.
Anyone who comes at this saying that Mifan has done the wrong thing or he isn't trying hard enough is completely wrong. There is no trying with kids like this. They don't want anything you have to give them whether it's "their own culture" or not.
So MMP tell me a worse story then the kids throwing rocks through their teachers windows, setting fire to the cars, throwing tables over at school and then NOT BEING ABLE TO PUNISH THEM. They get away with anything they do because if you punish them you're either being racist or losing the school money which would make the next year even worse. Hell, if you punish them your life will probably be in danger.
You can blame it on what happened to them as a race in the past but that does not excuse them for what they are doing now.
On November 11 2011 17:16 JoFritzMD wrote: It's not going to work Newbistic. They try to do the same here in Australia and the kids do the exact same thing as they always did. As shit as it sounds the only way to fix it is to take all oftheir kids away from their parents and put them in another home but this time minus the abuses that happened previously. I'm not saying destroy their culture, you can put them in other "natives" homes as long as the home you put them in isn't a violent, alcohol fueled mess.
Anyone who comes at this saying that Mifan has done the wrong thing or he isn't trying hard enough is completely wrong. There is no trying with kids like this. They don't want anything you have to give them whether it's "their own culture" or not.
So MMP tell me a worse story then the kids throwing rocks through their teachers windows, setting fire to the cars, throwing tables over at school and then NOT BEING ABLE TO PUNISH THEM. They get away with anything they do because if you punish them you're either being racist or losing the school money which would make the next year even worse. Hell, if you punish them your life will probably be in danger.
You can blame it on what happened to them as a race in the past but that does not excuse them for what they are doing now.
The way you put it, what western governments are trying to do in these reservations is a lot like what the United States was trying to do in Iraq, minus hundreds of thousands of troops and billions of dollars. You are right though, there probably will never be a fully satisfactory solution to this mess. Someone somewhere will find a way to be pissed or offended at any given solution.
It's strange how the government is now stuck between a guilt trip and an international human rights clusterfuck. At the moment these governments are basically trickling money and manpower into the reservations to keep the status quo, and everything is fine (except for these beleaguered teachers). The moment anyone actually tries something radical to help you'll probably instantly see thousands of politicians, human rights activists, and out of touch academicians go up in arms about how it'll "destroy the culture" amongst other things.
On November 11 2011 17:16 JoFritzMD wrote: It's not going to work Newbistic. They try to do the same here in Australia and the kids do the exact same thing as they always did. As shit as it sounds the only way to fix it is to take all oftheir kids away from their parents and put them in another home but this time minus the abuses that happened previously. I'm not saying destroy their culture, you can put them in other "natives" homes as long as the home you put them in isn't a violent, alcohol fueled mess.
Anyone who comes at this saying that Mifan has done the wrong thing or he isn't trying hard enough is completely wrong. There is no trying with kids like this. They don't want anything you have to give them whether it's "their own culture" or not.
So MMP tell me a worse story then the kids throwing rocks through their teachers windows, setting fire to the cars, throwing tables over at school and then NOT BEING ABLE TO PUNISH THEM. They get away with anything they do because if you punish them you're either being racist or losing the school money which would make the next year even worse. Hell, if you punish them your life will probably be in danger.
You can blame it on what happened to them as a race in the past but that does not excuse them for what they are doing now.
The way you put it, what western governments are trying to do in these reservations is a lot like what the United States was trying to do in Iraq, minus hundreds of thousands of troops and billions of dollars. You are right though, there probably will never be a fully satisfactory solution to this mess. Someone somewhere will find a way to be pissed or offended at any given solution.
It's strange how the government is now stuck between a guilt trip and an international human rights clusterfuck. At the moment these governments are basically trickling money and manpower into the reservations to keep the status quo, and everything is fine (except for these beleaguered teachers). The moment anyone actually tries something radical to help you'll probably instantly see thousands of politicians, human rights activists, and out of touch academicians go up in arms about how it'll "destroy the culture" amongst other things.
You've pretty much hit the nail right on the head except for one thing, everything isn't fine.
I personally think that in a lot of these situations people need to look for the lesser of two evils. Sure losing culture is a bad thing but is allowing kids to live in a situation where they are beaten and raped by their family better? I know which one I'd prefer to get rid of.
i literally skipped every post in this thread that wasnt canadian. unless you are from canada, it's impossible to understand the aboriginal problem here. new zealand/australia has the same problem. i feel so bad for you, man. i have friends who work on reserves in my province (sask) exact same thing here. its really disgusting. its only perpetuating the problem. im quite radical on the subject so i'll save my opinions for another time. just wanted to chime in. god speed, mifan.
Why do people work in the hellish reserves as teachers in the first place? Can someone explain please I'm really confused. Just go be a teacher in a normal school.
On November 12 2011 04:03 Kamais_Ookin wrote: Why do people work in the hellish reserves as teachers in the first place? Can someone explain please I'm really confused. Just go be a teacher in a normal school.
There's an overabundance of teachers, and not nearly enough teaching jobs for them all, so they might just be taking whatever they can get.
iirc you also get a pay bump from the government for working on reserves, I don't know if it's the same in the provinces but I've read that government workers in Inuit communities get a pretty sizable raise. Could just be because they are desperate for people to work in fucking frigid cold 365 days a year :/
On November 12 2011 04:03 Kamais_Ookin wrote: Why do people work in the hellish reserves as teachers in the first place? Can someone explain please I'm really confused. Just go be a teacher in a normal school.
There's an overabundance of teachers, and not nearly enough teaching jobs for them all, so they might just be taking whatever they can get.
iirc you also get a pay bump from the government for working on reserves, I don't know if it's the same in the provinces but I've read that government workers in Inuit communities get a pretty sizable raise. Could just be because they are desperate for people to work in fucking frigid cold 365 days a year :/
Hello Mifan, I've been living in northern Alberta for most of my life (I'm 21 now), and you bring up a very sad truth. I remember in grade 9 I moved from a very lovely little town in Alberta to one with a much higher population of native people, that's not to say it wasn't a lovely town as a direct factor, just generally this town was in a much worse state. The school I attended was K all the way to 12 I will never forget my first day there. The teachers all had an air of hopeless resignation. When the teacher would leave the room to photocopy, or anything like that half the class would just pack up and leave it was insane. Not to mention people playing cards in the corner all day, people sitting on top of the desks, and paper airplanes constantly flying through the air.
My 2nd day there we had a substitute teacher for gym and he thought it would be a good idea to play dodge ball. Now the school had no money and there were no dodge balls so it was played with volleyballs. We had a certain individual in my class who obviously should be in grade 12 by now but was held back 3 times, anyway this guy was huge and he hit the sub in the face (the teacher wasn't even playing) broke his glasses and gave him a bloody nose. You guessed it no punishment.
Now I have a part-time job (in addition to being a baker) working at a Sports Stadium which happens to hire a lot of native people considering it doesn't require so much as a high school diploma. Some of them continue to dysfunction even in the workplace, but a lot are finally growing up supporting themselves and going back to school or going to college. It is sad that they often do not have the support and family stability when they are young, and even more so does my heart go out to the teachers who have to deal with the struggle emanating from the home. But I believe many do realize the value of hard work and education at a later point in their lives.
This of course is all drawn from experiences outside of reserves. I am in a degree ignorant as to what happens inside, but it is certain that it is almost a whole 'nother world. At this point there is almost a self fulfilling prophecy affect in that they are treated (this is a little harsh but I lacked any other analogy) like children, being pampered and given what they ask for when they throw a tantrum. So they never grow up or are delayed in growing up. Things have to change there are better ways to pay tribute to their culture, than establishing reserves and giving them completely nonsensical things like discounted cigarettes. In our current times though nobody wants to focus on an issue like this. It is nearly political suicide to open up this can of worms. So it stagnates and becomes worse and worse.
I didn't mean to go of on a rant like this, but your post really caught my attention and I felt like I had something to add. In summary outside of reserves a lot of native people mature (I am in no way saying Native people are less mature than anyone else, everybody has to mature sometime regardless of race) go back to school, and then raise beautiful families. Yet inside the reserves that is the only life they know it is the norm and not many make it out into what one might call "the real world." It is sad but true, and ultimately there is not much if anything at all in the way of changing the situation. My heart goes out to you my friend, I hope you can find a way out of there and lead a more positive life.
lol, I'm a teacher too and there's no way in hell I would work on a reserve or in a northern community. You can make pretty serious money up there very quickly, but the conditions are unreal. Go to UK/NZ/AUS if you want to teach and can't get a job in Canada. I got three calls this morning and I only began expressing interest on Tuesday. They're pretty desparate.
On November 12 2011 05:39 ChiffonAngel wrote: ITT: White Imperialists frustrated that the people they oppress don't want to live their life the "white way".
It's not even so much about that as that they've been segregated for years. There are plenty of native people who have been quite successful in this country, but living on a reserve is literally poisonous to having any chance at life. The closest comparison I can draw is to being in a poor (really poor) neighbourhood in the US, where there is next to no chance of getting out of poverty due to the way the school and social support system is set up.
On November 12 2011 05:39 ChiffonAngel wrote: ITT: White Imperialists frustrated that the people they oppress don't want to live their life the "white way".
On November 12 2011 05:39 ChiffonAngel wrote: ITT: White Imperialists frustrated that the people they oppress don't want to live their life the "white way".
Wait a second here chiffon. I know you probably have good intentions butseriously??? You think that it is a problem with white imperialists being frustrated about a different lifestyle choice? Given the OP and the other posters who have witnessed similar circumstances you really want to tellme that rape, violence, drugs, and complete dependence on handouts is a traditional and cultural way of life?? That is absolute garbage. I even agree with you to a point in that I think that the current system is very lacking, but in today's world we need to worry first about children whose lives are destroyed before they have a chance to grow up. My mom taught in an inner city high school in the usa when I was a kid and tells similar stories about the state of families and kids. Please think about the kids first, because any kid put in a good situation can succeed regardless of race or culture, but they can't if they never have the support.
Please don't feed the troll. It's a zero content inflammatory post consisting of a single sweeping generalization. I don't think he's looking for a series of essays telling him how wrong he is.
On November 12 2011 08:31 TimmyMac wrote: It's not even so much about that as that they've been segregated for years. There are plenty of native people who have been quite successful in this country, but living on a reserve is literally poisonous to having any chance at life. The closest comparison I can draw is to being in a poor (really poor) neighbourhood in the US, where there is next to no chance of getting out of poverty due to the way the school and social support system is set up.
On November 12 2011 08:42 warhawk224 wrote: Wait a second here chiffon. I know you probably have good intentions butseriously??? You think that it is a problem with white imperialists being frustrated about a different lifestyle choice? Given the OP and the other posters who have witnessed similar circumstances you really want to tellme that rape, violence, drugs, and complete dependence on handouts is a traditional and cultural way of life?? That is absolute garbage. I even agree with you to a point in that I think that the current system is very lacking, but in today's world we need to worry first about children whose lives are destroyed before they have a chance to grow up. My mom taught in an inner city high school in the usa when I was a kid and tells similar stories about the state of families and kids. Please think about the kids first, because any kid put in a good situation can succeed regardless of race or culture, but they can't if they never have the support.
Yes, there is a problem with white imperialists being frustrated about a different lifestyle choice to the point that they not only try to replace the pre-existing culture, but also appropriate that culture for profit. Those things listed are not a traditional and cultural way of life, they are a result of their culture and way of life being forcibly denied them. *MY* tribe's culture was about raping and pillaging. I descend from the Comanche tribes of Texas. I am close to the depression and suicidal tendencies prevalent in native americans. No, my family predecessors have not faired well being torn between trying to hold onto their culture and deciding for themselves how they wish (or don't wish) to adapt to "modern society." As far as I know, there are less than 5 people left in the entire world who speak my tribe's language and that pisses me off. Yes, I have gained from living in American society. I have medicine and I have access to the internet, but I have lost contact and connection with my ancestry and that has affected me in many ways such as doing poorly in school (like any other non-white minority). I am part of a generation that can only watch helplessly as the last remnants of my cultural heritage fade away. My last living "close" relative won't tell me about the culture of the tribe I came from due to her imposed conversion of catholicism. So yeah, I'm bitter about that.
I say all this to give some insight into the other side of the coin. Is education bad? I don't think so personally, but education enforced by the representation of the people who is systemically destroying your ancestory is a completely different matter. These people are powerless and hopeless to maintain their culture in the face of an overwhelming force bent on eradication through assimilation. Such is history and life. On the other hand, something to consider and keep in mind while you (royal "you" as in not a single person being addressed, but a collective) are judging them.
They should live life the same way everyone else in the country does. I don't think they should not have to pay taxes, etc. Start moving people off reserves and getting them into main stream society. If they want to continue to learn about their ancestry, then go for it, the same way everyone else does it. Sink or swim, like the rest of society. It's time to take the baby rattle away.
I thought about everything that has happened. In the beginning I always thought it was the kids but in reality it is the administration at the school who is failing. There is absolutely zero consequences to the kids actions and they keep giving them second chances like there is no tomorrow. If a kid threatens to kill a teacher(joke or not) the the kid should be suspended or expelled immediately. Yet what do they do here? The principal doesn't even give a shit, at most it would just be something like "you shouldn't be saying things like that". However, when a kid threatens to kill him/herself(joke or not), we have to notify the cops and child services...
I agree with VersusVersus that
they are treated (this is a little harsh but I lacked any other analogy) like children, being pampered and given what they ask for when they throw a tantrum. So they never grow up or are delayed in growing up
Whenever a kid is wrong regardless of age, the school does not punish, the administration does not want to deal with parents because they are afraid of parents' complaints. When parents' complain about something, the administration sugarcoats everything and changes their story. We just had a staff meeting today and one of the outcome was to deny students going for washroom breaks during class. Unless the kids have some kind of medical issue then they shouldn't be going to washroom at all. They have a break and that's what it's for. However, once this reaches the parents, they will complain and then the principal will change her mind again. Whenever we make rules here, they are just for show only, they never follow any rules here that's why degenerate kids get away with everything.
The only way to fix things here is to have an iron fist approach to everything, can't let anybody get away with anything and if something happens, make an example out of that person, period. The natives need to be taught a lesson, they are taking everything for granted, enjoying so much benefits from the government. Yet, what do they do everyday? Sniffing gas, doing oxy, weed, drink alcohol based hand sanitizer, go around make babies to collect welfare and child tax benefits. There is absolutely nothing positive here. They should be fucking ashamed of themselves, and to balance the budget of the country, cut all the fucken welfare to natives. If I was the prime ministry, I would pass a new law requiring at least a secondary school diploma and a drug test if you want to collect welfare. Unless, of course you have legitimate mental retardation and can't study.
I agree that some natives realize later in life what they did wrong and try to change it but the majority just don't give a fuck. Free money from the government, great! What's more disturbing is that there is one family here that has 3 FASD kids, 3 brothers all have fetal alcohol spectrum disorder. If you made the mistake the first time, how can you do it again and again and fuck up all your kids like that?
People have asked me in the thread that why I chose to come here, I had to choice because there is just way too many fucken teachers in Canada. There is a huge decline in enrollment in the cities and the only job opportunities are in the northern reserves because nobody wants to come up here to teach. I have heard some funny stories today that years ago the teachers here were required to do a lot of things for the locals like digging graves because the natives would be too "emotionally hurt" after a death to do anything... you gotta be fucken joking me... They are just lazy to the fucken bone and want to do nothing everyday. Might as well ask us to wipe your asses and brush your teeth for you. There is a lack of responsibility and accountability on any reserve, they want to take the easy way out and they want to take advantage of nice people who wish to teach up there.
May I suggest giving up teaching for a bit and doing tutoring instead? The pay's pretty nice (afaik in calgary standard rate is $40~$50 an hour). It won't take long to get students, even if you don't really have that much experience.
Actually in alberta all the natives are pretty good (the ones I've met ofc). Some of them are just like you described but in the schools they're never as bad as you paint them to be where you are
On November 12 2011 11:49 LonelyIslands wrote: They should live life the same way everyone else in the country does. I don't think they should not have to pay taxes, etc. Start moving people off reserves and getting them into main stream society. If they want to continue to learn about their ancestry, then go for it, the same way everyone else does it. Sink or swim, like the rest of society. It's time to take the baby rattle away.
Good idea but you are missing the point here. They CANNOT be integrated into society because the way they are. They have no manners, no discipline and have bad attitudes. The natives kids who go to school in the cities always get kicked out and sent back to reserves because they can't function in a proper society. If you read what I said before, you will know that they get no consequences on reserves and act in anyway they wish. When they move to the city, the teachers run on iron fist there and won't put up with their degenerate shit and they expelled them right away. Kids here often tell me their drug stories in the city because that's what they do there once they get to the city. There is even more room for their delinquent behaviours. I watched the 5th estate on CBC the other weekend, they talked about natives kids going to school in the city. People commit suicides and drink/do drugs everyday. They are not using the opportunity to pursue their dreams to make a difference in their lives. Again, everything is taken for granted.
ok so now that i've been polite and have been safely deemed as "civilized" by capitalists and "civilization's peek peers" that judge these things .. can i be real for a moment?
ok so lets sum up.. "someone" who"s ancestors destroyed a whole culture / virtually wiped it off the map / someone has now a frustration towards the smidgen left of that culture that has not "been wiped out" ?
you make nice points obviously "wow progress" "wow they treat themselves as animals we should do something about it?".. but.. but you end up saying "but why wont they integrate?" "we must act strongly and make them understand that they have to be "civilized!"
On November 12 2011 12:13 mifan wrote: The only way to fix things here is to have an iron fist approach to everything, can't let anybody get away with anything and if something happens, make an example out of that person, period. The natives need to be taught a lesson.../
??? you cannot even see your own "indoctrination" .. this is very very sad indeed.
ok lets put it back in the right order:
capitalism is bad.. civilization is bad and progress is at most subjective .. never REQUIRED!
you invoke how they are NOW.. but never mention that WE made it so!
you call them children? (i mean when they are 20 30 whatever) just like the slavers called their slaves and you do this probably without noticing it i guess?
i"m a 45 frog, when i was 8 i was in the united states of murica.. in their public system.. there i read about all the people the americans wiped out to call their piece of land "america" (in books that were not in the school library i might add, not in the classes i got) ... now we are 30+ years later and i am sitting down reading this thread.
i am appalled by this reading, hence me typing this message 'in reeeesponse".
you want a solution to what? to imperialism"s way of thinking? because you for sure are not going to do it this way?
you seem affected by the idea that people would be in this state after a century of being WILLFULLY pushed into that situation? you are weird! even if i sense your "goodness" i can't help but think you need an adjustment :/
YOU are the problem, not them! (as it was said earlier, YOU is the royal YOU not you individually but the YOU that houses 90% of people on earth)
capitalism is happy it destroyed all other "options' than itself, now it is destroying our planet .; the ship we are ALL on..
and NO the "good" by-products of imperialism / capitalism are not worth it.. they never were!
sorry if i seem a little rattled but i am rattled so that's that.
so .. ranting is frowned upon in "civilizedland" so i'll refrain from more, i'll just add this:
.. get your government (if indeed you still cling to the idea that you have any power at all as a citizen of your "nation" to make anything constructive happen going forward.. from "your" government) .. try to get YOUR government to give them back what they owe these "aborigines" ..? instead of continuing their legacy of stepping on anything different and particularly people they have tried to get killed for centuries! (and failed to do so up until now but damn close call if you ask me)..
first they wont do it, second they will put you in jail for saying/asking it and third you will discover just how much YOU are the same as them, YOU ARE THEM! (i am them too dude it is fine <3 trust me)
i was going to pick out certain of your turn of phrases to make you look in the mirror more but i can't bring myself to do that.. because you seem to genuinely care,
also i'd have to insult/bait/flame other posters in this thread who seem unashamedly to want the grand C's work to be done by now and for those remnants of the real human beings to be wiped out and i don't want to do that because i will become the issue and this "conversation" warrants more respect than that!
tldr: nothing wrong with "aborigines" that were not killed please don't finish them off when you vote!
Edit follow up: "the pitbull age" (about latinoes in murica ; this is obviously not stricto senso the same "topic" but please allow the curiosity you are obviously capable of to make you watch it (the whole thing should still be on netflix or some pirate platform you are used to), it could resonate and become relevant to this "conversation" / thread if you do) interview of leguizamo