• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 17:29
CEST 23:29
KST 06:29
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash10[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy18ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT30Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book20
Community News
Weekly Cups (March 23-29): herO takes triple6Aligulac acquired by REPLAYMAN.com/Stego Research8Weekly Cups (March 16-22): herO doubles, Cure surprises3Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool51Weekly Cups (March 9-15): herO, Clem, ByuN win4
StarCraft 2
General
Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool What mix of new & old maps do you want in the next ladder pool? (SC2) Aligulac acquired by REPLAYMAN.com/Stego Research
Tourneys
RSL Season 4 announced for March-April Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly) WardiTV Mondays World University TeamLeague (500$+) | Signups Open
Strategy
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Frigid Storage Publishing has been re-enabled! [Feb 24th 2026]
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 520 Moving Fees Mutation # 519 Inner Power Mutation # 518 Radiation Zone
Brood War
General
ASL21 General Discussion so ive been playing broodwar for a week straight. Gypsy to Korea Pros React To: JaeDong vs Queen BSL 22 Map Contest — Submissions OPEN to March 10
Tourneys
[ASL21] Ro24 Group F Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Ro24 Group E
Strategy
What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Darkest Dungeon
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread The Chess Thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread NASA and the Private Sector Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT] Tokyo Olympics 2021 Thread General nutrition recommendations
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
[G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
China Uses Video Games to Sh…
TrAiDoS
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
FS++
Kraekkling
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Electronics
mantequilla
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1338 users

First blog - discussing SC2

Blogs > Ero-Sennin
Post a Reply
Ero-Sennin
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States756 Posts
October 27 2011 00:26 GMT
#1
After watching State of the Game last night, I was struck with an idea on how to fix the ghost. The biggest problem (as a Protoss player) I feel is EMP. I do not think it has to do with the radius, but with how easily you can get a ghost out.

With BW, Terran would have a handful of science vessels, but they were more easily targetable and the EMP was dodgeable.

Here's my thoughts. In HoTS they should remove EMP from the ghost and give it to the Raven (not sure if it should be dodgeable or not), and then remove auto turret from the Raven. Ghosts will still be useful (cloak, nuke, snipe), but EMP won't be as readily available. This forces the Terran to control another unit (Raven, which one could argue it needing fusion core, but I'm not married to that idea) which would be a little more easily targetable by the Protoss and add some more diversity (do I want to get a Raven out right away before I start medivac production? Or wait?) and skill into the game.

This could lead to Protoss coming up with some new interesting timings which the Terran wouldn't have EMP readily available like they would with the ghost. Terran would have to rely even more on positioning, micro, and possibly implementing those new battle hellions to help against zealots.

The only "drawback" I could see is newbs whining about it being too difficult. Cool, I could care less about you. Sorry, it's blunt, but it's true. If they implemented this I believe it'd make HoTS more difficult than WoL, which leads to the higher skilled player winning even more. If newbs want to play an easier game, they could play WoL. BW is harder than vanilla SC, and this will allow HoTS to be harder than WoL.

Thoughts? Think I'm on to something? Or crazy?

What can you see that would be better?

Thanks

**
Luck makes talent look like genius.
Probe1
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States17920 Posts
October 27 2011 00:43 GMT
#2
A month ago I would have said "Look, when theorycrafting just try to remember that they aren't talking about redesigning the entire game, just altering units. Little tweaks, a couple new units."

Then Blizzcon came and I was proven to be flat out wrong.

God knows man. It'd certainly encourage more sci.. raven usage and make ghosts much less useful but I kind of think on first impression that your suggestion goes way too far. It doesn't upset the applecart- it burns it to the ground. TvP would be completely foreign and mech would all of a sudden become a hugely viable choice all of the time.

Anyway, I don't really theorycraft all that often and am not the best person to respond. Really I just came here to say congratulations on your first blog ^_^
우정호 KT_VIOLET 1988 - 2012 While we are postponing, life speeds by
Whole
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States6046 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-27 01:46:10
October 27 2011 01:45 GMT
#3
Just a 2 radius EMP to the Raven actually sounds like a really good idea. I don't know TvP well, but it seems like it can fix a lot because Ravens are pretty slow and easier to target. It is a pretty simple change too, which I like. Sometimes it feels that some changes and theorycrafts are trying to make the game mechanics too complex. It is good for balance, but not good for spectating.
LuckyFool
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States9015 Posts
October 27 2011 01:58 GMT
#4
sounds like a change that would make sc2 feel more like bw....feel more logical...those kinds of changes never seem to happen T_T;
Ero-Sennin
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States756 Posts
October 27 2011 02:44 GMT
#5
Lol, I know right? T_T

At least this game isn't as bad as it was even 6 months ago, so, I mean there are some glimmers of hope.
Luck makes talent look like genius.
neobowman
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada3324 Posts
October 27 2011 03:10 GMT
#6
That's exactly what I told Azn on skype a while ago 0_o. You'd have to buff the Ghost damage or something to compensate but it'd be better.
Ero-Sennin
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States756 Posts
October 27 2011 04:23 GMT
#7
Ahh, <3 sc2gg newblets ^^

Heh, I'm not entirely convinced you'd have to buff the ghost, as right now it's not used for anything more than snipe/emp. At what point does a Terran look and say, "If only I had ghosts that were doing regular attack dmg." No, they may say "If only I had more ghost for another EMP (or snipe, whatever)."

So I think you could leave it how it is and just see how that plays out
Luck makes talent look like genius.
pandaBee
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States251 Posts
October 27 2011 05:01 GMT
#8
this actually does not seem to be a bad idea. more science vesselly.
neobowman
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada3324 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-27 05:34:36
October 27 2011 05:06 GMT
#9
Yeah but Ghost'd need something to make them useful in TvP. I don't play TvP so I wouldn't know but making ghosts just to snipe high templar seems redundant.

But I agree 100%.
Ero-Sennin
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States756 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-27 06:06:13
October 27 2011 06:03 GMT
#10
Cloak and snipe could be effective against a Protoss who may skip collosus and focus more on a HT/chargelot/archon composition, for example. Then the raven with EMP + good micro and battle hellion (like a vulture, I'm thinking, dealing a good amount of damage to the light armored units) to eat up the zealots.

Although one could also raise the question, does every unit have to play a role in every match up? Two examples I can think of is:

TvP BW, how many times have you seen a medic? Once in a blue moon as a part of a weird timing. But they can play a vital role in TvZ

PvT BW, how many times do you see a corsair? Rarely, but that doesn't mean it needs a buff, you know what I mean?

I mean, let's say the change I presented in the OP happens, and then Protoss (after 2 months) continues to dominate Terran at the highest level, then you could look at possibly buffing the ghost dmg, or what have you, depending on the data, but I don't that that would happen at all. I definitely think the lower skilled/mechanically deficient/slower players would struggle, but that's not necessarily a bad thing, and I think it'd open up the game more at the higher levels of play.
Luck makes talent look like genius.
Whole
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States6046 Posts
October 27 2011 11:28 GMT
#11
On October 27 2011 14:06 neobowman wrote:
Yeah but Ghost'd need something to make them useful in TvP. I don't play TvP so I wouldn't know but making ghosts just to snipe high templar seems redundant.

But I agree 100%.

Well Terran already have enough stuff, so I think Ghost being used in one MU and Raven being used in another wouldn't be that bad. But if they would want to put another spell on the ghost, it definitely shouldn't be something as game changing as EMP.
Ero-Sennin
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States756 Posts
October 27 2011 15:24 GMT
#12
Well, glad to see my first blog being received positively so far ;D
Luck makes talent look like genius.
neobowman
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada3324 Posts
October 27 2011 21:56 GMT
#13
You're probably right about the stuff. Like even the hydra was only really used in ZvP.
ReachTheSky
Profile Joined April 2010
United States3294 Posts
October 27 2011 22:05 GMT
#14
I'd be ok with this as long as the raven only cost 100 gas. make it 200/100. and while were at it, reduce the nrg cost of seeker missle cuz i think we all know 125 renders it completely useless. make emp 75 seeker missle 75 and pdd 75.
TL+ Member
Ero-Sennin
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States756 Posts
October 28 2011 04:24 GMT
#15
Yeah, that may be good. It'd be nice to find out
Luck makes talent look like genius.
OopsOopsBaby
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Singapore3425 Posts
October 28 2011 07:48 GMT
#16
Some ideas i have got without the need to introduce emp to the raven:
the main gripe with emp is less on the energy removal but the shield removal as mentioned in sotg. with the heavily clumped protoss ball, a couple of well placed emp can potential deal 1-2k instant damage to shields.

emp as a shield debuff. shield damage done over time so you cant stack mutiple emps to remove shields. the skill can be a aoe where protoss can avoid staying in and take shield loss or a debuff that stays on the unit for full duration but thats up to balance.

energy removal stays instant.
s3x2-2 xiao3x2+2 bone3+2+2
Ero-Sennin
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States756 Posts
November 02 2011 20:04 GMT
#17
Would you make EMP dodgeable or no?
Luck makes talent look like genius.
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 11h 31m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
NeuroSwarm 159
ProTech121
JuggernautJason95
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 2842
actioN 184
Mind 137
ggaemo 91
NaDa 12
Dota 2
canceldota268
Counter-Strike
apEX4769
tarik_tv1195
kRYSTAL_42
Super Smash Bros
C9.Mang0192
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu361
Khaldor167
Other Games
summit1g8109
Grubby4869
FrodaN1474
shahzam479
Mew2King79
ZombieGrub52
Liquid`Ken8
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 20 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 87
• Hinosc 31
• musti20045 25
• Adnapsc2 21
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• intothetv
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• Eskiya23 33
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21152
• lizZardDota294
Other Games
• imaqtpie1306
• Scarra268
• Shiphtur164
Upcoming Events
CranKy Ducklings
11h 31m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
12h 31m
PiGosaur Cup
1d 2h
Replay Cast
1d 11h
Kung Fu Cup
1d 14h
Replay Cast
2 days
The PondCast
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
WardiTV Team League
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
[ Show More ]
CranKy Ducklings
4 days
WardiTV Team League
4 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
4 days
BSL
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
WardiTV Team League
5 days
BSL
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Wardi Open
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W1
RSL Revival: Season 4
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
CSL Elite League 2026
ASL Season 21
CSL Season 20: Qualifier 2
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
Nations Cup 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W2
IPSL Spring 2026
Escore Tournament S2: W3
Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
uThermal 2v2 Last Chance Qualifiers 2026
RSL Revival: Season 5
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
IEM Rio 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.