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Why Sequels are Terrible - Page 2

Blogs > Blisse
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haduken
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
Australia8267 Posts
July 08 2011 12:48 GMT
#21
Personally I didn't like the first two Lord of the rings. The third one was epic though.
Rillanon.au
Horiz0n
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
Sweden364 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-08 13:09:38
July 08 2011 13:09 GMT
#22
Terminator > Terminator 2

But both are "good movies"

cant think of a movie where the sequal where better then the first one, probably because the originality that made the first one intressting isnt there anymore along with much more.

And I think the 3rd lotr's movie where the worst.
Louuster
Profile Joined November 2010
Canada2869 Posts
July 08 2011 13:10 GMT
#23
Lord of the ring doesnt count because its not really a sequel, its just a huge movie shot at only 1 time and then split in 3. Also its 100% based on a story thats already written so its not like they couldve adapted the story based on the reaction to the previous movies.
Kim Taek Yong fighting~
Zorkmid
Profile Joined November 2008
4410 Posts
July 08 2011 13:58 GMT
#24
Fun Fact:

The Lord of the Rings is ONE book.

Tolkien's publisher just released it against his wishes in three installments cause it was so long.
Servius_Fulvius
Profile Joined August 2009
United States947 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-08 15:14:32
July 08 2011 15:04 GMT
#25
On July 08 2011 15:12 Blisse wrote:
Why do most sequels suck?

Is it because the big corporations sees the success of their first movie and decide they don't give a crap anymore and just release movie after movie to milk the most out of the series?

Well sometimes.

But for people like Steven Spielberg, they have enough money that they don't really care about money that much. There really comes a point in your career where the money doesn't even matter anymore. You just want to make good movies.


Oh, here we go with corporation talk :/. I'd argue that a lot of sequels are suckling from the teat of their cash cow. Take the fourth Pirates movie. The plot of the first three were done. There didn't need to be a fourth. But people are still willing to pay to go see it. In the world of art this may be a mute point, but in the world of business you make as much money as you can. Perhaps, in an ideological paradise, money doesn't matter anymore, but this is the real world...


With all of that in mind, let's move on to Jurassic Park. Good, yes? And the second and third were complete bombs. Why? Because after the first movie, you think immediately that the next movie is going to be great as well. But you're already used to the idea of dinosaurs in a park and in the city. Now, you tell me, what else can they do?

Jurassic Park 2. Dinosaurs in a jungle, people get stuck and have to escape. Jurassic Park 3. Dinosaurs in a jungle, people get stuck and have to escape. It's exactly the same as Jurassic Park because there is nothing else you can possibly add to the movie. Sure, maybe the collective minds of several million fans have come up with an okay fan fiction, but there's really nothing you can add to make it even more amazing.


I'm ok with the Lord of the Rings arguments, your opinion is your opinion, but have you ever READ Jurassic Park? The first movie is, primarily, a short explanation on how the dinosaurs came to exist again and then a lot of surviving when you're in the wild with them. The book focused a lot more on how the dinosaurs came to be again in an interesting "what if?" scenario you see in a lot of science fiction. The first movie didn't cover all the material in the book, primarily a survival sequence in the pterodactyl habitat. This was a big part of Jurassic Park 3, so it's a far cry from fan fiction, it's actually a legitimate part of the story.

Sure, the plot of Lost World had a number of differences from the book, but the overall story was decidedly different from the first. The first movie was "hey, we made this theme park with rez'd dinosaurs, isn't it awesome? Oh crap, the power is out and they're loose!" while the second was "there's another island with dinosaurs, but this time a rival is trying to steal the dino's and the main characters are trying to rescue someone." Yes, they both have the survival aspect in common, but what do you expect? The plots, on the other hand, are different.

Overall you seem to judge movies based more on action than the story they tell. The action sequences of sequels ARE going to be similar because if they weren't then you'd have an entirely different movie! The key differences are in the plot. A film is another way of telling a story, and if you don't have the stomach for the plot then don't expect to enjoy ANY sequel!
Servius_Fulvius
Profile Joined August 2009
United States947 Posts
July 08 2011 15:11 GMT
#26
On July 08 2011 22:09 Horiz0n wrote:
cant think of a movie where the sequal where better then the first one, probably because the originality that made the first one intressting isnt there anymore along with much more.


It's mostly a matter of opinion. However, it's generally accepted that The Empire Strikes Back and The Godfather II were better than their predecessors.

Personally, I like Evil Dead 2 AND Army of Darkness better than the first (with Army of Darkness being my favorite - that was #3 in the series). I also like Aliens a lot more than Alien. Let's not forget Dark Knight versus Batman Begins, either! In the end, everything is debatable!
QuanticHawk
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States32051 Posts
July 08 2011 15:23 GMT
#27
You're comparing something like LoTR, which was designed to be a trilogy, vs Terminator, which was not.

Not to mention T1 is nothing liek T2, and T3 is nothing like any of the others beyond the whole robots fight humans schtick. Complete different as far as style, ambiance and a whole bunch of other things
PROFESSIONAL GAMER - SEND ME OFFERS TO JOIN YOUR TEAM - USA USA USA
VeNoM HaZ Skill
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States1528 Posts
July 08 2011 15:39 GMT
#28
On July 08 2011 22:58 Zorkmid wrote:
Fun Fact:

The Lord of the Rings is ONE book.

Tolkien's publisher just released it against his wishes in three installments cause it was so long.

Which is why it is so hard splitting it into three movies also. I never really considered the movies as individuals too much, I thought of them as a single 20 hour long adventure. It just makes more since that way.

For terrible sequels see Karate Kid Part 2. Seriously? WTF!!! First you take time to learn karate from the coolest goddamn person to ever walk the earth. Then you go on a fucking rampage kicking the shit out of everybody you see, collecting some broken bones and shit on the way. And because you get so injured, Asian Jesus has to perform his body fixing awesomeness. Finally you fight Johnny, all while that annoying kid is yelling "Put him in a body bag Johnny!", and finally you crane kick him in the face to win the tournament.
All of this for a girl who then dumps your ass in the sequel!!?!?!?!?!!! NO! JUST NO!
#1 MMA fan! I like you too Taeja. Still patiently waiting for the Crown Prince to become the King.
xXFireandIceXx
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Canada4296 Posts
July 08 2011 16:47 GMT
#29
A lot of sequels are "boring" simply because of the expectation of the first movie or because the plot is carried on. What I mean is that there's nothing radically different in the second movie when compared to the first. But in your examples, the sequels are not that bad. LOTR was well done and epic throughout, probably one of the most re-watchable movies of all time. Pirates of the Caribbean 1 and 2, in my humble opinion, were both not that bad. I loved them both and had a great time. Terminator is just Terminator lol. Even Batman: the Dark Knight wasn't terrible. So I honestly think that you can't label sequels are bad simply because they are sequels.
Blisse
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Canada3710 Posts
July 08 2011 20:06 GMT
#30
Actually I never intended for the Lord of the Rings to do anything but act as an introduction to my idea that sequels are terrible because the first movie is so good that there are no more ideas. I said if you flipped the order of them around, the Lord of the Rings seemed to fit this description, but because it was presented in the way it was, the Lord of the Rings seemed to get better and better, and that's probably why the Return of the King is considered the best movie by some.

And I totally forgot that it was one movie split into three. It doesn't really invalidate my argument since I never used the Lord of the Rings as an example... at least I'm pretty sure I didn't. Left to sleep after my post. :D

And the reason I didn't put "Why Most Sequels are Terrible" is because that makes for a terrible title and argument. My argument is, "Why Most Sequels are Terrible," as shown if you read the op carefully. And I don't have the experience or memory to call on every example ever of every movie series. And even if I did, it's still my opinion.

It's just an idea that I had, instead of people always saying, the corporations get greedy and release subpar content to milk the most out of the brilliance of the first movie, maybe we're just used to the idea, and disappointed when we watch somewhat of the same movie twice.

I liked reading the arguments against me though, really interesting stuff that I never knew before.

Also, which Terminator is the one with the cop and which Terminator is the one with the woman?
There is no one like you in the universe.
lolsixtynine
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States600 Posts
July 08 2011 21:02 GMT
#31
I don't know what you're talking about with low expectations for LOTR 3... I loved all three of them! The 3rd only blew me away because it's one of the best movies of all time, and the scores of all three are simply incredible.
wherebugsgo
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Japan10647 Posts
July 08 2011 21:10 GMT
#32
USUALLY sequels suck.

Exceptions:

Terminator 2

The Godfather: Part 2

That's all I can think of.
Servius_Fulvius
Profile Joined August 2009
United States947 Posts
July 08 2011 21:15 GMT
#33
On July 09 2011 05:06 Blisse wrote:
Also, which Terminator is the one with the cop and which Terminator is the one with the woman?


Terminator is the one with the soldier sent back in time (so he's like a cop), Terminator 2 has the machine that wears a cop uniform, and Terminator 3 has the female machine.
Jonoman92
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
United States9103 Posts
July 08 2011 21:57 GMT
#34
Your post is confusing... Sequels sucks, yet LotR got gradually better... but only because the first one was so horrible I guess? Anyway, what about the Jason Bourne movies! Those are all amazingggg!!!!
Tal
Profile Blog Joined May 2004
United Kingdom1015 Posts
July 08 2011 22:13 GMT
#35
I feel like the first LOTR film was by far the best, and while I liked the other two, there was enough holywood moments (shield surfing legolas), or just plain misjudgments (gullible instead of wise ents and the boring army of the dead), that they weren't as perfect.

The first just had it all right...from Gandalfs fireworks to Rivendelll, it just felt expertly crafted and right.

Generally on topic, isn't the Empire Strikes Back considered the best Star Wars film?
It is what you read when you don't have to that determines what you will be when you can't help it.
OmniEulogy
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Canada6592 Posts
July 09 2011 00:57 GMT
#36
On July 08 2011 21:40 BadBinky wrote:
I don't think sequels are terrible. Sure most of the time they are but I can think of many movies where a sequel is better than the original. Godfather 2, The Dark Knight, Terminator 2 and The Empire strikes back just to name a few. Maybe the ones with better sequels have an idea that doesn't get boring or sometimes the original is so terrible the sequel looks good.


wasn't planning on commenting cause everybody has mostly hit all my points... just felt I had to mention The Dark Knight isn't really a sequel... it's like the 8th movie in a series of films. Kinda like calling Quantum of Solace a sequel.
LiquidDota Staff
Kenpachi
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States9908 Posts
July 09 2011 01:04 GMT
#37
On July 08 2011 22:58 Zorkmid wrote:
Fun Fact:

The Lord of the Rings is ONE book.

Tolkien's publisher just released it against his wishes in three installments cause it was so long.

i wonder if it would have been published as a textbook if it werent for the publisher lol
Nada's body is South Korea's greatest weapon.
Chairman Ray
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States11903 Posts
July 09 2011 01:18 GMT
#38
A huge part of what makes sequels worse than the first is that character, plot, and setting development are key elements in the quality of a movie. Take The Matrix for an example. The whole setting in The Matrix is very deep and intriguing, but most of it is spewed out in the first movie. In the second and third, you don't get the thrill of seeing a new setting and characters unfold, you only see how they interact.
Probulous
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Australia3894 Posts
July 12 2011 05:52 GMT
#39
On July 09 2011 10:18 Chairman Ray wrote:
A huge part of what makes sequels worse than the first is that character, plot, and setting development are key elements in the quality of a movie. Take The Matrix for an example. The whole setting in The Matrix is very deep and intriguing, but most of it is spewed out in the first movie. In the second and third, you don't get the thrill of seeing a new setting and characters unfold, you only see how they interact.


This is somewhat true, but with proper writing the plot and characters can grow and develop beyond their original incarnation. I guess the most recent example of this would be the Harry Potter series. The crafted storyline of the books allowed the script writers to create a longterm story arc which flows through the movies.

The movies themselves grow with the characters both in tone and content. Some would say that this is just an example of corporations taking advantage of good writing but my counter to that is quite simply, are the movies good? I would suggest that by earning well over $1 Billion dollars the franchise has at least been financially successful.

I stand by point raised in my first post, that without a proper storyline, without well constructed writing, sequels fail. This is not because sequels themselves are inherently bad, the writing is.
"Dude has some really interesting midgame switches that I wouldn't have expected. "I violated your house" into "HIHO THE DAIRY OH!" really threw me. You don't usually expect children's poetry harass as a follow up " - AmericanUmlaut
Cuddle
Profile Joined May 2010
Sweden1345 Posts
July 12 2011 06:05 GMT
#40
As has been said before, this comparison falls flat when you start comparing movies that have longer stories than 1 movie can hold, to movies where the story is captured in one movie.

In LoTR, the story doesn't end until the third movie.
In Matrix, the original story ends in movie one but there were more ideas floating around that was later adapted to movies two and three. Movie 2 and 3 is one story and thus, of the same "quality", albeit not as good as the original.
The same goes for Pirates, a great first movie, but the others does not add anything we haven't already seen, it's just milking the concept and characters.
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