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THIS POST WILL SPOIL THE RESULTS OF THE GSL SUPER TOURNAMENT FINALS AS WELL AS SOME OF THE OLDER ONES. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED. DO NOT BITCH ABOUT SPOILERS.
So, with last nights GSL Super Tournament finals now over, I'm sure I'm not the only SC2 fan who's left with a bitter taste in their mouth after this. Months of leading up to finals to see Polt steam roll MMA in less than an hour in the most un-entertaining games imagineable. It's sad to say, but the Rainbow performance may have been more intriguing than the actual games, save maybe the ghost rush.
This type of showing for the GSL finals has become pretty common place. I cannot even remember the last time I watched a GSL finals and thought..."Hey, this is an awesome game..". Nestea rolled Inca in the last finals, before that MC unmercifully beat the snot out of July. Did MKP get 4-0'd by MVP in Season 2/3...however long ago that was? The point is, the GSL finals (save the team league most of the time) have just flat out sucked.
That being said, the production value of these finals has always been pretty high. Gom spares no expense with the Kpop groups, the badass intro with opening balls and smoke and fire and all that crazy shit. Needless to say, this must be expensive. With the quality of the finals being pretty piss poor, one has to wonder how long GOM will continue with this kind of super dressed up hyped out finals presentation.
I can imagine it's pretty frustrating for all of the people involved in setting up the venue and coordinating everything to see their awesome stage and setup get used for a 40 minute beatdown. So, fellow TL'ers, Can GOM continue to support such an extravagant setup with these sub-par finals showings? I'm interested in all opinions related to the subject!
EDIT: I don't think people are understanding the question. It is not "How can GOM improve the quality of the finals?". It is " Can GOM continue to invest what would seem to be a large sum of money into the finals if the games continue to be poor and disappointing? "
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The situation of having a history of so many bad games is unfortunate, but it's not GOM's duty or right, even, to even attempt to manipulate the actual games to be more entertaining. All I can feel they can do is adjust the situation to affect player stress, practice time, on-site nerves, etc. but nothing they do is guaranteed. For instance, having a longer time before finals to allow for more preparation, or lowering production value or 1st-2nd prize differences to lower stakes/nerves. Pretty bad approaches I think, but I don't know what GOM's other options are on the matter. GSL fans will just need to live with this history for a while and hope it gets broken sooner than later.
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Winning isn't everything;it's the only thing.
-Vince Lombardi-
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Netherlands45349 Posts
What are you going to do about it?
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i think anyone who expects every final to be epic ( or even occasionally epic) isnt considering the fact that it's an extremely rare occasion. In an elimination tournament (so loser has to go) the chance of the best 2 players in the finals is very low. In most of the cases, the 2nd best player will be taken out by the eventual best player much earlier in the tournament, simply because of the setup. its really sad but there really is nothing to do about it with this format. a good example is in gsl 3, where MC beat the shit out of rain in the finals, but when he met marine king prime in the ro8 or something it was a much more exciting and close match. I just really hope people realise this and i hope even more that gom will get a bit luckier with their finals because they do deserve it.
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On June 19 2011 00:50 Kipsate wrote:
What are you going to do about it?
The only thing I can, which is not watch.
The question wasn't proposed to figure out what the players can do to make the finals more interesting. It was to examine the financial ramifications or public image that GOM was creating for it's league when the finals turn out the way that they do.
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they tried something by having the showmatch but there really is nothing they can do
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Well we got to see a pretty awesome TvZ bo5 between SC and DRG before the "main event", so it's not like the crowd went home without seeing any good games.
I don't think anyone expected this to be a 4-0 (either way), but that's just the way it goes sometimes. By the law of averages, we have to get a good Code S final sooner or later.
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I would love if GSL could switch to double elimination style.
Generally, you would see more quality games between good players which means greater potential for epic games. plus the better players would likely make it to the finals as well
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On June 19 2011 01:06 eshlow wrote:
I would love if GSL could switch to double elimination style.
Generally, you would see more quality games between good players which means greater potential for epic games. plus the better players would likely make it to the finals as well
The MSL had that going for a while back in the day, but changed back to single elimination in knockout stages due to the players having to play too many games.
Might fit into SC2 schedule, though. I wouldn't know.
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On June 19 2011 00:56 turamn wrote:The only thing I can, which is not watch.
That's a terrible attitude to have. It's not the fault of GSL, if anything it's the players' fault, but it's not that GSL are 'doing something wrong'. Every final of any tournament can be good or bad, it just depends on the players on the given day, how well they're playing, how well their skill levels match up, etc.
If you're not going to watch finals because they might be bad, then you may as well not watch the finals of any tournament because the fact that it's the GSL makes no difference. I agree that the last few finals have been average at best, but it's just unlucky. Correlation != causation etc.
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single or double elimination. shit happens. if its 4-0, its 4-0. there is nothing anyone can do.
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On June 19 2011 01:13 stafu wrote:Show nested quote +On June 19 2011 00:56 turamn wrote:On June 19 2011 00:50 Kipsate wrote:
What are you going to do about it? The only thing I can, which is not watch. That's a terrible attitude to have. It's not the fault of GSL, if anything it's the players' fault, but it's not that GSL are 'doing something wrong'. Every final of any tournament can be good or bad, it just depends on the players on the given day, how well they're playing, how well their skill levels match up, etc. If you're not going to watch finals because they might be bad, then you may as well not watch the finals of any tournament because the fact that it's the GSL makes no difference. I agree that the last few finals have been average at best, but it's just unlucky. Correlation != causation etc.
There's an infinite number of SC2 to watch to this point, and I work 12 + hours a day. The free time I have, I don't care to watch a 40 minute ROFL stomp, with a 45 minute introduction. If the TL thread has it rated decently, yeah, I'll watch, but the current trend certainly points to there being more entertaining games to watch at basically any given time.
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Even in mainstream sports there were terrible finals.
Example:
Super Bowl V, also known as The Blunder Bowl.
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Maybe they could have a few show matches before the actual finals? Not necessarily the finalists themselves playing, but some other good players.
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they will spend, because they have to
you will watch, because you never know when you might see the most epic finals in history
finals will get better in time as they fine tune their format, the game gets patched, the practice regimens get harder with the increase of the competitiveness of the tournaments, the players get more experience on the grand stage of a finals game with the pressure that ensues, and the first and second tier of players stabilizes so less upsets happen and more evenly matched players meet in the final rounds.
all this ofcourse is a few bad finals off, but again, you never know, so they have to put up the show for us, and it'd be silly of us not to tune in.
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On June 19 2011 01:16 turamn wrote:Show nested quote +On June 19 2011 01:13 stafu wrote:On June 19 2011 00:56 turamn wrote:On June 19 2011 00:50 Kipsate wrote:
What are you going to do about it? The only thing I can, which is not watch. That's a terrible attitude to have. It's not the fault of GSL, if anything it's the players' fault, but it's not that GSL are 'doing something wrong'. Every final of any tournament can be good or bad, it just depends on the players on the given day, how well they're playing, how well their skill levels match up, etc. If you're not going to watch finals because they might be bad, then you may as well not watch the finals of any tournament because the fact that it's the GSL makes no difference. I agree that the last few finals have been average at best, but it's just unlucky. Correlation != causation etc. There's an infinite number of SC2 to watch to this point, and I work 12 + hours a day. The free time I have, I don't care to watch a 40 minute ROFL stomp, with a 45 minute introduction. If the TL thread has it rated decently, yeah, I'll watch, but the current trend certainly points to there being more entertaining games to watch at basically any given time.
Yeah that's fair enough — I actually thought you meant from a live-viewing point of view. I agree that it's not worth watching tournament finals if you know for sure that they were bad, but that's true for any tournament, not just the GSL.
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Everyone is saying that there are "a few" bad finals....I could be mistaken, but wouldn't the number of poor finals now outnumber the entertaining ones as far as GSL is concerned?
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On June 19 2011 01:16 turamn wrote:Show nested quote +On June 19 2011 01:13 stafu wrote:On June 19 2011 00:56 turamn wrote:On June 19 2011 00:50 Kipsate wrote:
What are you going to do about it? The only thing I can, which is not watch. That's a terrible attitude to have. It's not the fault of GSL, if anything it's the players' fault, but it's not that GSL are 'doing something wrong'. Every final of any tournament can be good or bad, it just depends on the players on the given day, how well they're playing, how well their skill levels match up, etc. If you're not going to watch finals because they might be bad, then you may as well not watch the finals of any tournament because the fact that it's the GSL makes no difference. I agree that the last few finals have been average at best, but it's just unlucky. Correlation != causation etc. There's an infinite number of SC2 to watch to this point, and I work 12 + hours a day. The free time I have, I don't care to watch a 40 minute ROFL stomp, with a 45 minute introduction. If the TL thread has it rated decently, yeah, I'll watch, but the current trend certainly points to there being more entertaining games to watch at basically any given time.
His point was you don't know that the next GSL finals will be bad, because the previous GSL finals being bad wasn't the fault of the GSL, it was just luck.
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Yes, Redmark, I understood his point.
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Single elim tournament + sometimes this stuff just happens. The last MSL finals weren't any better.
Once in a blue moon, we get Iris vs GGPlay, but you can't expect every finals to be that good. AAt least we're not seeing Boxer vs YellOw triple bunker rushes anymore.
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Finals would be better if GOM had a double elimination format rather than single.-
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EPT
