• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 09:17
CET 15:17
KST 23:17
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10
Community News
RSL Season 3: RO16 results & RO8 bracket13Weekly Cups (Nov 10-16): Reynor, Solar lead Zerg surge2[TLMC] Fall/Winter 2025 Ladder Map Rotation14Weekly Cups (Nov 3-9): Clem Conquers in Canada4SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA17
StarCraft 2
General
SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA Weekly Cups (Nov 10-16): Reynor, Solar lead Zerg surge RSL Season 3: RO16 results & RO8 bracket RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview Mech is the composition that needs teleportation t
Tourneys
RSL Revival: Season 3 $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly) Constellation Cup - Main Event - Stellar Fest 2025 RSL Offline Finals Dates + Ticket Sales!
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 501 Price of Progress Mutation # 500 Fright night Mutation # 499 Chilling Adaptation Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death
Brood War
General
Data analysis on 70 million replays What happened to TvZ on Retro? soO on: FanTaSy's Potential Return to StarCraft 2v2 maps which are SC2 style with teams together? BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] RO16 Tie Breaker - Group B - Sun 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO16 Tie Breaker - Group A - Sat 21:00 CET Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
Current Meta Game Theory for Starcraft How to stay on top of macro? PvZ map balance
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Should offensive tower rushing be viable in RTS games? Clair Obscur - Expedition 33 Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Games Industry And ATVI Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine About SC2SEA.COM
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NBA General Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
The Health Impact of Joining…
TrAiDoS
Dyadica Evangelium — Chapt…
Hildegard
Saturation point
Uldridge
DnB/metal remix FFO Mick Go…
ImbaTosS
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2073 users

Math Puzzle [num 19]

Blogs > evanthebouncy!
Post a Reply
evanthebouncy!
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States12796 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-12 09:49:33
April 12 2011 09:43 GMT
#1
Friends it's been a while!! Here goes!

==THE PROBLEM==
There is a room with n lightbulbs, n is a power of 2, i.e. n = 2^k. These n lightbulbs are arranged in a straight line.

You and your friend Bob are allowed to discuss a strategy, after the discussion, you and bob will be seperated.

You will receive a piece of paper, and on that piece of paper, there will be a number, which is selected from {1,2,...,n}.

You will then enter a room of the lightbulbs. The initial configurations of the lightbulbs are arbitrary, i.e. some might be on, some might be off. you must flip one and only one light switch and then exit the room.

Bob will then enter the room, and depending on what he sees, he will be able to answer correctly what was the number you were given on that piece of paper.

Describe the strategy.



Again, put answers in spoilers, put discussion NOT in spoilers, have fun. Generate some discussions, etc

Oh yeah it's not a trick question where bob will feel the temperature or anything like that...


mini-sub-problems:
Can you do it for n = 2?
Can you do it for n = 4?
Solving specialized instances of this problem is quite rewarding as well

QnA(hopefully not too many T_T)
On April 12 2011 18:46 MisterD wrote:
does arbitrary configuration mean, they are arranged randomly on the wall, or that they are randomly switched on and off before you enter?

The latter, they are in a straight line and the on/off is arbitrary.

*****
Life is run, it is dance, it is fast, passionate and BAM!, you dance and sing and booze while you can for now is the time and time is mine. Smile and laugh when still can for now is the time and soon you die!
MisterD
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Germany1338 Posts
April 12 2011 09:46 GMT
#2
does arbitrary configuration mean, they are arranged randomly on the wall, or that they are randomly switched on and off before you enter?
Gold isn't everything in life... you need wood, too!
Slithe
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
United States985 Posts
April 12 2011 09:53 GMT
#3
I believe this problem is very similar to one that I posted a couple years back in my blog. I will refrain from participating in this one, as it will be interesting to see how people approach this problem.
iGrok
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States5142 Posts
April 12 2011 10:30 GMT
#4
Solution for n=2

+ Show Spoiler +

o = on
x = off
Bold is flip
j = number on paper

Tell Bob:
xx = j=1
ox = j=2
xo = j=1
oo = j=2

Starting possibilities:
j=1
xx
ox
xo
oo

j=2
xx
ox
xo
oo

I know that this is terribly done, but it 5:30 in the morning and I've been up all night lol.

My first suggestion was to break bulb #j, but apparently thats cheating :Þ
MOTM | Stim.tv | TL Mafia | Fantasy Fighting! | SNSD
incnone
Profile Joined July 2009
17 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-12 11:17:19
April 12 2011 11:00 GMT
#5
Good to see you back -- you always post good puzzles.
iGrok
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States5142 Posts
April 12 2011 11:02 GMT
#6
Solution for n=4
+ Show Spoiler +

j is number you are told

If single light on or off, n=j
If all same: x=1
If 2 same: position of second of type in col.1

Proof:
Start__ j=1 _ j=2 __ j=3 _ j=4
xxxx | oxxx xoxx xxox xxxo
oxxx | xxxx ooxx oxox oxxo
xoxx | xxxx ooxx xoxo xoox
xxox | xxxx xxoo oxox xoox
xxxo | xxxx xxoo xoxo oxxo
ooxx | oxxx xoxx ooxo ooox
xoox | xooo xoxx xxox ooox
xxoo | xooo oxoo xxox xxxo
ooox | oooo ooxx oxox xoox
xooo | oooo xxoo xoxo xoox
oooo | xooo oxoo ooxo ooox
oxoo | oooo xxoo oxox oxxo
ooxo | oooo ooxx xoxo oxxo
ooox | oooo ooxx oxox xoox
oxxo | oxxx oxoo ooxo xxxo
ooxx | oxxx xoxx ooxo ooox
oxxx | xxxx ooxx oxox oxxo



again, i'm kind of tired so I can't think of the full proof for n=n lol. Perhaps tomorrow I will
MOTM | Stim.tv | TL Mafia | Fantasy Fighting! | SNSD
MasterOfChaos
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
Germany2896 Posts
April 12 2011 11:14 GMT
#7
+ Show Spoiler +
Call the number of the piece of paper x
I give each lightbulb a unique name from 0 to n-1.
Then I calculate m=binary xor of the names of all light bulbs which are on.
now I calculate s=m xor (x-1) and switch the bulb with that name.

Bob calculates m'=binary xor of the names of all light bulbs which are on and then adds 1 to obtain x.

Originally I tried a similar scheme with addition modulo n, but that didn't work out because I needed switching on->off and off->on have the same effect on m. The xor scheme only works on powers of two, but the question kindly restricted it to that.
LiquipediaOne eye to kill. Two eyes to live.
Seth_
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Belgium184 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-12 15:10:52
April 12 2011 14:09 GMT
#8
n=2 solution (probably the same as iGrok but it's explained better)
+ Show Spoiler +
I'm counting from 0..n-1 since I'm a computer science student with off=0, on=1.

If the number is 0, you turn the first light off (if it's already off, just flip the second light)
If the number is 1, you turn the first light on (if it's already on, just flip the second light)
iGrok
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States5142 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-12 14:36:01
April 12 2011 14:34 GMT
#9
On April 12 2011 23:09 Seth_ wrote:
btw There's no solution for n=1 although it's a power of 2. You probably mean 2^k for k>0

n=2 solution (probably the same as iGrok but it's explained better)
+ Show Spoiler +
I'm counting from 0..n-1 since I'm a computer science student with off=0, on=1.

If the number is 0, you turn the first light off (if it's already off, just flip the second light)
If the number is 1, you turn the first light on (if it's already on, just flip the second light)

EDIT: I suppose this works. I dislike it though :p
MOTM | Stim.tv | TL Mafia | Fantasy Fighting! | SNSD
MasterOfChaos
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
Germany2896 Posts
April 12 2011 14:37 GMT
#10
On April 12 2011 23:09 Seth_ wrote:
btw There's no solution for n=1 although it's a power of 2. You probably mean 2^k for k>0

The solution is trivial for n=1. The number on the piece of paper is always "1", so bob just needs to say "1" and he is done.
LiquipediaOne eye to kill. Two eyes to live.
iGrok
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States5142 Posts
April 12 2011 16:12 GMT
#11
theres also no solution for non-integer k :p
MOTM | Stim.tv | TL Mafia | Fantasy Fighting! | SNSD
EsX_Raptor
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States2802 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-12 19:08:15
April 12 2011 17:54 GMT
#12
+ Show Spoiler +
Hamming Code

Suppose n = 8 and the following is our random on/off (red/black) sequence:

[image loading]

By applying Hamming Code, we can represent every number in the range of 1 to 8 by making use of the first, second and fourth lightbulbs as parity checkers:

[image loading]

Not long ago, a TL user posted a question that could be resolved using Hamming Code as well. Is this a new trend or something?
evanthebouncy!
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States12796 Posts
April 12 2011 20:28 GMT
#13
On April 13 2011 02:54 EsX_Raptor wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
Hamming Code

Suppose n = 8 and the following is our random on/off (red/black) sequence:

[image loading]

By applying Hamming Code, we can represent every number in the range of 1 to 8 by making use of the first, second and fourth lightbulbs as parity checkers:

[image loading]

Not long ago, a TL user posted a question that could be resolved using Hamming Code as well. Is this a new trend or something?


I actually don't know... can you link me? :p
Life is run, it is dance, it is fast, passionate and BAM!, you dance and sing and booze while you can for now is the time and time is mine. Smile and laugh when still can for now is the time and soon you die!
EsX_Raptor
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States2802 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-12 20:51:39
April 12 2011 20:50 GMT
#14
Here's one thread:

http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=206477

I also made a pretty drawing in there explaining in more detail how the...

+ Show Spoiler +
... Hamming Code...

... works.

^^
evanthebouncy!
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States12796 Posts
April 12 2011 20:56 GMT
#15
On April 13 2011 05:50 EsX_Raptor wrote:
Here's one thread:

http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=206477

I also made a pretty drawing in there explaining in more detail how the...

+ Show Spoiler +
... Hamming Code...

... works.

^^


Ah but that one is exactly the same as 1000 jars of millk 1 poisoned or what not and you have 10 slaves etc. I don't think you need hamming code to do that one since I did it w/o any knowledge of it. However I was having lots of trouble doing this one w/o hamming code. Maybe the two are really similar, it's just the process is reversed: One is you have something wrong, how to detect it, one is if you detect, what is wrong.
Life is run, it is dance, it is fast, passionate and BAM!, you dance and sing and booze while you can for now is the time and time is mine. Smile and laugh when still can for now is the time and soon you die!
EsX_Raptor
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States2802 Posts
April 12 2011 21:03 GMT
#16
On April 13 2011 05:56 evanthebouncy! wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 13 2011 05:50 EsX_Raptor wrote:
Here's one thread:

http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=206477

I also made a pretty drawing in there explaining in more detail how the...

+ Show Spoiler +
... Hamming Code...

... works.

^^


Ah but that one is exactly the same as 1000 jars of millk 1 poisoned or what not and you have 10 slaves etc. I don't think you need hamming code to do that one since I did it w/o any knowledge of it. However I was having lots of trouble doing this one w/o hamming code. Maybe the two are really similar, it's just the process is reversed: One is you have something wrong, how to detect it, one is if you detect, what is wrong.

I agree.

Also, you know there are many ways to kill the tiger. What I like the most is seeing how users with different professions/backgrounds/interests tackle the same problem in their own way. ^^
evanthebouncy!
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States12796 Posts
April 13 2011 02:10 GMT
#17
On April 13 2011 06:03 EsX_Raptor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 13 2011 05:56 evanthebouncy! wrote:
On April 13 2011 05:50 EsX_Raptor wrote:
Here's one thread:

http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=206477

I also made a pretty drawing in there explaining in more detail how the...

+ Show Spoiler +
... Hamming Code...

... works.

^^


Ah but that one is exactly the same as 1000 jars of millk 1 poisoned or what not and you have 10 slaves etc. I don't think you need hamming code to do that one since I did it w/o any knowledge of it. However I was having lots of trouble doing this one w/o hamming code. Maybe the two are really similar, it's just the process is reversed: One is you have something wrong, how to detect it, one is if you detect, what is wrong.

I agree.

Also, you know there are many ways to kill the tiger. What I like the most is seeing how users with different professions/backgrounds/interests tackle the same problem in their own way. ^^


mind if I ask what is your background?
Life is run, it is dance, it is fast, passionate and BAM!, you dance and sing and booze while you can for now is the time and time is mine. Smile and laugh when still can for now is the time and soon you die!
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Wardi Open
12:00
#62
WardiTV1067
TKL 270
Harstem229
Rex151
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Lowko348
TKL 270
Harstem 229
Rex 151
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 39296
Horang2 1829
Soulkey 1694
actioN 1440
Larva 894
Hyuk 850
Soma 757
Stork 527
Light 494
Killer 386
[ Show more ]
firebathero 257
BeSt 253
ZerO 247
Rush 125
Snow 93
Hyun 89
Pusan 78
Free 36
Mind 33
Terrorterran 28
ToSsGirL 28
Backho 27
sas.Sziky 25
Aegong 24
scan(afreeca) 16
zelot 11
Hm[arnc] 8
SilentControl 7
Dota 2
singsing3140
Dendi602
XcaliburYe180
BananaSlamJamma171
Counter-Strike
fl0m3767
olofmeister1162
zeus791
byalli228
oskar66
markeloff2
Other Games
B2W.Neo1916
hiko355
Fuzer 321
Hui .209
Mew2King120
ArmadaUGS53
ZerO(Twitch)12
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream383
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 7
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 5
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Adnapsc2 12
• intothetv
• Kozan
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• IndyKCrew
StarCraft: Brood War
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 1180
• WagamamaTV451
League of Legends
• Nemesis2097
• Jankos1573
• TFBlade317
• HappyZerGling109
Upcoming Events
Monday Night Weeklies
2h 43m
OSC
8h 43m
Wardi Open
21h 43m
PiGosaur Cup
1d 10h
Replay Cast
1d 18h
Wardi Open
1d 21h
OSC
1d 22h
Tenacious Turtle Tussle
2 days
The PondCast
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
[ Show More ]
OSC
4 days
LAN Event
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Wardi Open
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

SOOP Univ League 2025
RSL Revival: Season 3
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
CSCL: Masked Kings S3
SLON Tour Season 2
META Madness #9
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2

Upcoming

BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.