• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 12:14
CEST 18:14
KST 01:14
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview25Code S RO12 Preview: GuMiho, Bunny, SHIN, ByuN3The Memories We Share - Facing the Final(?) GSL46Code S RO12 Preview: Cure, Zoun, Solar, Creator4[ASL19] Finals Preview: Daunting Task30
Community News
[BSL20] ProLeague: Bracket Stage & Dates6GSL Ro4 and Finals moved to Sunday June 15th12Weekly Cups (May 27-June 1): ByuN goes back-to-back0EWC 2025 Regional Qualifier Results26Code S RO12 Results + RO8 Groups (2025 Season 2)3
StarCraft 2
General
Magnus Carlsen and Fabi review Clem's chess game. The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview Jim claims he and Firefly were involved in match-fixing GSL Ro4 and Finals moved to Sunday June 15th
Tourneys
Bellum Gens Elite: Stara Zagora 2025 SOOPer7s Showmatches 2025 Cheeseadelphia 2025 - Open Bracket LAN! $25,000+ WardiTV 2025 Series Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
[G] Darkgrid Layout Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 476 Charnel House Mutation # 475 Hard Target Mutation # 474 Futile Resistance Mutation # 473 Cold is the Void
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion Will foreigners ever be able to challenge Koreans? BGH auto balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ [BSL20] ProLeague: Bracket Stage & Dates I made an ASL quiz
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL20] ProLeague Bracket Stage - Day 2 [BSL20] ProLeague Bracket Stage - Day 1 [BSL 2v2] ProLeague Season 3 - Friday 21:00 CET
Strategy
I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Mechabellum Monster Hunter Wilds
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
LiquidLegends to reintegrate into TL.net
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0 Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Vape Nation Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
Maru Fan Club Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Korean Music Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Cleaning My Mechanical Keyboard
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Cognitive styles x game perf…
TrAiDoS
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
I was completely wrong ab…
jameswatts
Need Your Help/Advice
Glider
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Poker
Nebuchad
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 18461 users

Twilight of the Dong

Blogs > Askalaphos
Post a Reply
Askalaphos
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Germany772 Posts
February 16 2011 13:04 GMT
#1
At first: English ist not my first language and so I think, I will made many silly mistakes in that entry, please go easy on myAt first: English is not my first language and so I think, I will made many silly mistakes in that entry, please go easy on my, I hope you understand me anyway.


Here are some thoughts I have in mind, after viewing the last month of Pro-BW:
To make this absolutely clear: I'm a great Jaedong fan. Well, I think you can call me an huge Jaedong-Fanboy!
If the Dong wins the Day starts good (for Europe the Games are normally early in the morning) and if he looses... well the day starts anyway.

But, I can't deny, I have the feeling, that we witnesses the end of his dominance.
- All his last finals he loses too Flash,
- He drops out of the OSL after loosing againt HiyA and Hogil...,
- This MSL was his to take, because there were only Zergs left, but he lost against Hydra in a best-of-five!
- In the Proleague-season he lost some important Ace-Matches and never accomplished an AK so far.

Of course he played some very good Games in that time, too.
The last game in the round-of-eight in the MSL against Snow or his last game against BaBy in the PL, but I have the feeling, he wins those game by his great will to win and not because he played way stronger than his opponent.

Altogether - and that makes my fan-heart bleeding - we witnesses something, that I call in these blog "Twilight of the Dong". (After the opera "Twilight of the Gods", because JD was the last years really the God of all Zergs.)

It's hard but, I think all Jaedong fans have to accept, that maybe (I really hope MAYBE) the era of the Dong comes to an end.
And well, of cause that happens to all Pro-BW-players, but because JD is my favorite player it is very hard for me to accept...

Am I the only one who have these thoughts?
What do you think?, I hope you understand me anyway.


Here are some thougts I have in mind, after viewing the last month of Pro-BW:
To make this absolutly clear: I'm a great Jaedong fan. Well, I think you can call me an huge Jaedong-Fanboy!
But, I can't denie, I have the feeling, that we witnesses the end of his domiance.

*
FavZerg: EffOrt, Jaedong; FavProtoss: Movie, Kal; FavTerran: BaBy, Leta
nath
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1788 Posts
February 16 2011 13:32 GMT
#2
i mean you cant really say for sure. you never know. jaedong is the kind of guy who can just start absolutely tearing shit up again even after a 'slump' (hate that word btw)
Founder of Flow Enterprises, LLC http://flow-enterprises.com/
Quasimoto3000
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States471 Posts
February 16 2011 13:51 GMT
#3
I was really really worried about Jaedong after his loss to Hydra, but I think the poster above me is correct. Jaedong is just really really talented as an rts player, he is still ridiculously scary atm, and I think we'll see a resurgence.
Every sunday a nun lays from my gunplay
Shaman.us
Profile Joined May 2010
United States319 Posts
February 16 2011 13:52 GMT
#4
I feel that the biggest issue is not that jaedong is losing his grip on the game, but that the average zerg player has improved to the point that the Dong is no longer the dominant Tyrant he once was. Even if this is the beginning of his end, I'm sure we'll still see strokes of brilliance poking through the shroud of mediocrity.
Shaman.233
Invictus
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
Singapore2697 Posts
February 16 2011 14:07 GMT
#5
Give him time, after all, hes been performing the most consistent out of the TBLS(where there were really obvious slumping times(or you could say time periods where some of them really played bad.)) He still kills the scrubs as easily as he does. He just seems to have lost the edge over his opponents. All he needs is a real break( not a break where his practice is piling up like half of his schedule) then he would be fresh and ready to go.

Against Flash, I really have nothing to say but its more of jaedong trying to win Flash out of pure mechanics instead of preparing builds. I don't really mean to say that is stupid but it seems as though his mechanics have dulled over the years, last time his muta micro was what made him so godly. He wouldn't miss a shot at all during muta harass and really had what it took to propel himself upwards.

I would like to see a revival from him after all, its too early for hydra to take the scene cause his SL golds got denied by that stupid Flash for the umpteenth time
Lee Jaedong Fighting!
onlinerobbe
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany547 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-16 14:21:43
February 16 2011 14:09 GMT
#6
yeah I really expected him to take this MSL too :/ (ZvZs COME ON Oo?!)
but I hope he'll figure out why he started losing this season and will
be strong again in the next one
ohayo- on afk-op teamliquid | tuturuuuu! mayushi desu - 유인나, 이지은 사랑 (멍 지효 <3 )
Tazza
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Korea (South)1678 Posts
February 16 2011 15:42 GMT
#7
Imo, Jaedong's never been on a slump yet. He has never lost like more than 4 or 5 games in row. But yeah, huge Jaedong fan here too, and it just seems like his reign is slowly coming to an end. I remember he was just the boss before Flash started his dominance. Nowadays, protoss players have been beating left and right, losing zvz to hydra, etc. Sigh...

What really gets me though is that Hydra had better muta micro than Jaedong. I remember when he did 2 group muta harass and stuff like that.
Raii
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Philippines194 Posts
February 16 2011 15:51 GMT
#8
I miss the days when he used to be called "The Next Bonjwa" (along with Bisu)
As a matter of fact, I'm extremely frustrated and sad that TBLS has disappointed all my expectations this year
Interesting comeback. How long did it take you make one?
tyCe
Profile Joined March 2010
Australia2542 Posts
February 16 2011 15:56 GMT
#9
On February 17 2011 00:51 Raii wrote:
I miss the days when he used to be called "The Next Bonjwa" (along with Bisu)
As a matter of fact, I'm extremely frustrated and sad that TBLS has disappointed all my expectations this year


Why?

Flash is still dominating everyone good but losing to scrubs with good builds.
Bisu is still dominating scrubs but losing to anyone good.
Stork is still showing amazing play until the finals.
Jaedong is the only one who's been disappointing so far imo.
Betrayed by EG.BuK
Raii
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Philippines194 Posts
February 16 2011 16:29 GMT
#10
Exactly.
The whole "Flash is god" thing has sunken into me, so it's extremely unusual for me to see Flash lose to scrubs.
Bisu is owning JUST scrubs[except Jaedong and a few others]. That isn't exactly saying anything. Well, he does have most wins so far, so Bisu is a so-so.
Stork is showing pretty solid results, but I'm disappointed that he couldn't nab the OSL gold.
Jaedong, as you have said, is probably doing the worst out of TBLS right now.
Interesting comeback. How long did it take you make one?
Kairo
Profile Joined November 2008
Sweden184 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-16 16:48:22
February 16 2011 16:47 GMT
#11
It would be sad if Jaedong lost his edge, but it follows the turns that happen to the best progamers in their natural habitat where a new style arises and the old gods fall.

If the speculated hive ZvZ era actually starts, whether Jaedong manages to adopt it or not, I will suddenly gain a new matchup to follow and we will be able to rejoice in the fact that BW strategy is still not stagnant.
Only the insane have strength enough to prosper. Only those who prosper may truly judge what is sane. Off she rode with a trumpety trump; trump trump trump.<- Sig since before the Don.
insanet
Profile Joined January 2010
Peru439 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-16 18:13:49
February 16 2011 17:29 GMT
#12
Guys, cmon, Flash could NEVER imagine what its like to play a matchup so hard like ZvZ, where if you just lose 2 mutas then you are done.

Lets pretend TvT was like ZvZ, where like if T lose 2 tanks he is done.
how many times we watched flash been behind?, if TvT was like ZvZ, Flash winrate will be barely 70%.

Hydra is very good at ZvZ, Jaedong is very good too, ZvZ is just insanely hard. and TvT is the most forgiven matchup EVER. so BEEN JD is HARDER than been Flash.
puppykiller
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States3126 Posts
February 16 2011 17:43 GMT
#13
On February 17 2011 02:29 insanet wrote:
Guys, cmon, Flash could NEVER imagine what its like to play a matchup so hard like ZvZ, where if you just 2 mutas then you are done.

Lets pretend TvT was like ZvZ, where like if T lose 2 tanks he is done.
how many times we watched flash been behind?, if TvT was like ZvZ, Flash winrate will be barely 70%.

Hydra is very good at ZvZ, Jaedong is very good too, ZvZ is just insanely hard. and TvT is the most forgiven matchup EVER. so BEEN JD is HARDER than been Flash.

Wrong.

Jaedong is just as good as hes always been, just currently flash is better and hydra understands zvz. We shouldn't pretend we understand what the pros are thinking when they make discisions that turn into a disidvantage.
Why would I play sctoo when I can play BW?
mierin
Profile Joined August 2010
United States4943 Posts
February 16 2011 17:49 GMT
#14
As an extreme JD fanboy I view his current situation as a slump too

I remember when I first declared fanboyism...he was the best progamer without a doubt IMO.

Then he became #2 to only Flash..which was okay, I could deal with that even though I didn't like it.

Now... /sigh I can't wait for him to get back on his feet, it just seems like he's not the same player he was before I remember my heart swelling with pride whenever I mentioned JD to anyone; now I feel the reflex to start making excuses for him.
JD, Stork, Calm, Hyuk Fighting!
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Bellum Gens Elite
10:00
Stara Zagora 2025 Day 3
ShoWTimE vs RyungLIVE!
SKillous vs Lambo
Bellum Gens Elite4594
ComeBackTV 1786
IndyStarCraft 396
3DClanTV 272
Rex241
CosmosSc2 205
TaKeTV 27
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Bellum Gens Elite4594
IndyStarCraft 396
Hui .335
Rex 241
CosmosSc2 205
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 33595
Shuttle 3446
EffOrt 1566
Mini 819
Hyuk 818
Jaedong 630
BeSt 605
ZerO 526
Stork 396
firebathero 240
[ Show more ]
Snow 129
TY 93
JYJ81
Sea.KH 61
sSak 53
Yoon 43
Barracks 42
sorry 33
soO 27
Terrorterran 20
zelot 17
GoRush 14
ajuk12(nOOB) 8
Noble 8
Dota 2
XcaliburYe600
syndereN560
Counter-Strike
fl0m6050
olofmeister2697
pashabiceps402
Foxcn208
flusha193
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King98
Other Games
singsing2501
FrodaN1868
Beastyqt637
crisheroes454
Lowko269
ArmadaUGS166
Liquid`VortiX112
Trikslyr67
QueenE55
KnowMe22
ZerO(Twitch)17
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream8839
PGL Dota 2 - Secondary Stream452
Other Games
BasetradeTV52
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• poizon28 20
• Kozan
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• HerbMon 54
• Michael_bg 7
• FirePhoenix2
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis4302
• Jankos2368
• TFBlade1223
Upcoming Events
BSL 2v2 ProLeague
2h 46m
Replay Cast
7h 46m
CranKy Ducklings
17h 46m
SC Evo League
19h 46m
Bellum Gens Elite
20h 16m
Fire Grow Cup
22h 46m
CSO Contender
1d
BSL: ProLeague
1d 1h
StRyKeR vs MadiNho
Cross vs UltrA
TT1 vs JDConan
Bonyth vs Sziky
Replay Cast
1d 7h
SOOP Global
1d 10h
Creator vs Rogue
Cure vs Classic
[ Show More ]
SOOP
1d 16h
Classic vs GuMiho
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 17h
AllThingsProtoss
1d 18h
Fire Grow Cup
1d 22h
BSL: ProLeague
2 days
HBO vs Doodle
spx vs Tech
DragOn vs Hawk
Dewalt vs TerrOr
Replay Cast
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
GSL Code S
4 days
Rogue vs GuMiho
Maru vs Solar
Replay Cast
5 days
GSL Code S
5 days
herO vs TBD
Classic vs TBD
The PondCast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
GSL Code S
6 days
WardiTV Invitational
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Season 17: Qualifier 1
DreamHack Dallas 2025
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
NPSL S3
Rose Open S1
CSL Season 17: Qualifier 2
2025 GSL S2
BGE Stara Zagora 2025
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
ECL Season 49: Europe
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025
BLAST Open Spring 2025

Upcoming

CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
SEL Season 2 Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
Murky Cup #2
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.