• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 23:58
CET 05:58
KST 13:58
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump1Weekly Cups (Nov 24-30): MaxPax, Clem, herO win2BGE Stara Zagora 2026 announced15[BSL21] Ro.16 Group Stage (C->B->A->D)4Weekly Cups (Nov 17-23): Solar, MaxPax, Clem win3
StarCraft 2
General
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou Maestros of the Game: Live Finals Preview (RO4) BGE Stara Zagora 2026 announced
Tourneys
RSL Offline Finals Info - Dec 13 and 14! Tenacious Turtle Tussle 2025 RSL Offline Finals Dates + Ticket Sales! Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament StarCraft2.fi 15th Anniversary Cup
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 504 Retribution Mutation # 503 Fowl Play Mutation # 502 Negative Reinforcement Mutation # 501 Price of Progress
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ How Rain Became ProGamer in Just 3 Months [BSL21] RO8 Bracket & Prediction Contest BW General Discussion FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle
Tourneys
[ASL20] Grand Finals [BSL21] RO8 - Day 2 - Sunday 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO8 - Day 1 - Saturday 21:00 CET Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Game Theory for Starcraft Fighting Spirit mining rates Current Meta
Other Games
General Games
Dawn of War IV The 2048 Game Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Awesome Games Done Quick 2026!
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Survivor II: The Amazon Sengoku Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread YouTube Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TL+ Announced Where to ask questions and add stream?
Blogs
How Sleep Deprivation Affect…
TrAiDoS
I decided to write a webnov…
DjKniteX
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Thanks for the RSL
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1660 users

SOTG Topics - TL Changes and relevance of opinion - Page 2

Blogs > babolatt
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 All
ShadowWolf
Profile Joined March 2010
United States197 Posts
December 16 2010 16:47 GMT
#21
On December 16 2010 22:03 shannn wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 16 2010 19:51 zatic wrote:
On December 16 2010 09:32 babolatt wrote:
First, there's this ongoing myth in any type of competitive environment, including Starcraft 2, that only the top pros have anything relevant to say about the game, and anyone who has a differing opinion is literally automatically wrong based purely on the fact that they aren't as good at the game. This is, at best, elitist and at worst a flat out incorrect assumption. This is the case across all competitive environments but it is even more valid in Starcraft 2 based on what it takes to be a top level player. There are many people who watch endless tournaments, analyze endless replays and spend more time spectating the sport than playing it. One could almost argue that people with that type of diverse information gathering actually have a more objective view of the Starcraft 2 landscape than a player who simply plays their race 12 hours a day and watches the odd tournament. This is obviously an oversimplification, but I believe the core argument to be sound.

Categorically disagree with this. The important part is that it doesn't even matter what is holding you back from playing at the top level. As long as you don't play there you can't have the same level of understanding about the game. Unfortunately, you also don't have the ability to realize that you don't have that understanding, because from your perspective everything about the game makes sense.

As long as you don't play at the pro level, you can't recognize the disparity from your grasp of the game vs someone's who does play at that level.

This. No matter how many games you watch. Unless you are a pro gamer or a pro in any sport or an ex-pro you cannot discuss specific details about a strategy or anything relevant without being a pro yourself in one time.

Because of details which can not be seen from a spectator view but by a players point of view.
In other words, why don't you see an unknown gamer casting/commentating at a professional tournament?


By and large, every level of pro-sports coaching is close to 70% filled with former players that at least played at a reasonably high level ( though often times a good portion of that 70% were players that had shortened careers or weren't very good ). That said, At a certain level, there are definitely people who can perform and understand the game far beyond their own skill level. Though rare, they can coach pretty well despite their own inability to execute at a level equal to their understanding. There are also a lot of very high level people who have no idea what they're doing. The things they do and why they do them are just instinctual and they are, more often than not, wrong when they discuss things outside of their specific wheelhouse. I'd rather not give examples of each type of person in our community because I think that's just inviting a flame war.

In short, there are, undeniably, individuals that can discuss and teach things at a level higher than their own execution. However, the real problem is that the there are a number of individuals who believe they are one of those types of people when they are not. I think as long as you approach your specific situation, until otherwise proven, with a "Here's what works at my level" and are open to criticism from people who probably know more than you then I don't see a real issue.

As proof of my above point:
+ Show Spoiler +

Bill Belichick is pretty universally considered one of the best coaches in the NFL right now in terms of what he has managed to accomplish with the talent he's been given. The highest level of football he ever played was Division III in College. John Gruden won a super bowl with Tampa Bay and never played football above Division II. Mike Shanahan won two super bowls with Denver and didn't really even play much College ball at all ( due to an extremely serious injury that nearly killed him ). Jeff Van Gundy and Stan Van Gundy both got to the NBA Finals as coaches, but neither competed at any reasonable level of basketball, though both played. There are some examples in the NHL, too, but I'm kinda tired of looking this up.
Euronyme
Profile Joined August 2010
Sweden3804 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-09 04:37:55
February 09 2011 04:34 GMT
#22
Thing is if you make private forums for the pros, none's gonna contribute.
I think Tyler took that up actually. What are they gonna talk about?
They are all competing against eachother, so they are gonna be completely unwilling to contribute with new stuff.
There are gonna be some imbalance threads obviously, but that's about it I presume.

Edit:
On December 16 2010 10:22 hifriend wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 16 2010 09:40 Plexa wrote:
Rest assured TL has been working on things for a long time I know a lot of you are new to TL but we work at an incredibly slow pace since when we want to change something or improve the site in some way, we absolutely want to do it right.

Kind of like ents, in an entmoot.

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


wow this was the funniest I've seen for like seriously a month! still laughing :D
I bet i can maı̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̸̨̨̨̨̨̨ke you wipe your screen.
Prev 1 2 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 4h 2m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
WinterStarcraft733
RuFF_SC2 197
StarCraft: Brood War
Shuttle 574
Bale 50
Noble 47
ZergMaN 23
Icarus 13
Dota 2
monkeys_forever466
League of Legends
JimRising 691
Counter-Strike
Coldzera 1513
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor132
Other Games
summit1g9367
hungrybox264
Maynarde143
Mew2King94
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1213
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• practicex 30
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• Diggity2
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Rush1425
• Lourlo739
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
4h 2m
Wardi Open
7h 2m
Monday Night Weeklies
12h 2m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 5h
OSC
2 days
YoungYakov vs Mixu
ForJumy vs TBD
Percival vs TBD
Shameless vs TBD
Replay Cast
2 days
The PondCast
3 days
OSC
4 days
CranKy Ducklings
5 days
SC Evo League
5 days
[ Show More ]
BSL 21
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
BSL 21
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4 - TS3
RSL Offline Finals
Kuram Kup

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
Slon Tour Season 2
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22

Upcoming

CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Big Gabe Cup #3
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.