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2v2 double cheese

Blogs > Kironide
Post a Reply
richard_keats
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States54 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-01 02:09:55
May 01 2010 02:04 GMT
#1
Well, someone from my school wanted to play a 2v2 against my friend and me. I had to deal with two proxy gateways and an extremely fast reaper at the same time, and ended up losing (my partner promptly quit afterwards). How am I really supposed to defend against that? I scouted an early refinery, so I went for a core right after my gateway with the intention of getting stalkers. As my single zealot was about to finish, a reaper arrived, which I held off fairly well--until more zealots and reapers showed up.

After the game, one of them complained that I had wasted five minutes of their time and that I could have easily scouted and defended both the zealots and the reapers if I had scouted better. Am I just a really bad player? I don't see how to defend against both, especially on a map like Arid Wastes where are are so many locations for proxies and your base is extremely accessible to reapers. I made a very compact sim city to try to minimize possible reaper damage, but I just couldn't hold out against everything that I was put against.

I guess I'm just ranting--I'm fairly annoyed that they complained about wasting their time after both going for cheesy tactics . . .

I mean admittedly there's always the possibility that I'm just really, really bad at Starcraft II

Deleted User 55994
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
949 Posts
May 01 2010 02:12 GMT
#2
No, it's impossible to defend against double cheese, especially double cheese with completely different counters, without any help from your ally, and it sounds like you got none. The end.
JFKWT
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Singapore1442 Posts
May 01 2010 02:15 GMT
#3
On May 01 2010 11:04 Kironide wrote:
Well, someone from my school wanted to play a 2v2 against my friend and me. I had to deal with two proxy gateways and an extremely fast reaper at the same time, and ended up losing (my partner promptly quit afterwards). How am I really supposed to defend against that? I scouted an early refinery, so I went for a core right after my gateway with the intention of getting stalkers. As my single zealot was about to finish, a reaper arrived, which I held off fairly well--until more zealots and reapers showed up.

After the game, one of them complained that I had wasted five minutes of their time and that I could have easily scouted and defended both the zealots and the reapers if I had scouted better. Am I just a really bad player? I don't see how to defend against both, especially on a map like Arid Wastes where are are so many locations for proxies and your base is extremely accessible to reapers. I made a very compact sim city to try to minimize possible reaper damage, but I just couldn't hold out against everything that I was put against.

I guess I'm just ranting--I'm fairly annoyed that they complained about wasting their time after both going for cheesy tactics . . .

I mean admittedly there's always the possibility that I'm just really, really bad at Starcraft II

Obviously if they ask you for a game then say its a waste of their time they're definitely the ones wasting both your time with the game and then with ranting with all their pissy nonsense.

Re: the actual constructive SC2 part, i'm not too knowledgeable on SC2 but (from SC1) if you scouted well your ally and you could have met up forces during appropriate times and engaged as 2 armies instead of letting the opponents 2v1 you piecemeal.
The calm before the storm / "loli is not a crime, but meganekko is the way to go!"
EmeraldSparks
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States1451 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-01 02:21:46
May 01 2010 02:20 GMT
#4
Your friends are retarded. It can't be defended without help from a friend or unless you do something retarded like 8 forge. Honestly? They proxy gate and 8 rax reaper and then tell you that you wasted their time?
But why?
richard_keats
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States54 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-10 08:55:36
May 01 2010 02:24 GMT
#5
edit: nvm
Hot_Bid
Profile Blog Joined October 2003
Braavos36402 Posts
May 01 2010 02:30 GMT
#6
its very difficult, if not impossible, to defend a properly executed 2gate+fast reaper as protoss without ally help. ditto for defending lingrush+fast reaper. your ally MUST help, you can't defend 1v2 unless the other team screws up completely.

@Hot_Bid on Twitter - ESPORTS life since 2010 - http://i.imgur.com/U2psw.png
PREWTAHS
Profile Joined March 2010
Armenia24 Posts
May 01 2010 02:35 GMT
#7
I'd be interested in seeing a team hold off a properly executed dual 7 rax reaper proxy. The size of the maps combined with the mobility of reapers makes even the tightest anti-cheese builds shaky at best. Zergling + Reaper is also pretty dominant. I've also encountered your aforementioned reaper + 2gate zealot.
Sadistx
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Zimbabwe5568 Posts
May 01 2010 03:12 GMT
#8
On May 01 2010 11:35 PREWTAHS wrote:
I'd be interested in seeing a team hold off a properly executed dual 7 rax reaper proxy. The size of the maps combined with the mobility of reapers makes even the tightest anti-cheese builds shaky at best. Zergling + Reaper is also pretty dominant. I've also encountered your aforementioned reaper + 2gate zealot.


Double 7 rax proxy reaper is undefendable. We've tested it multiple times and the rush kills one of the players outright with just the first 2 reapers.

The only way to counter it is go something like 8 rax and immediately bunker up and hope to god they are terrible at microing reapers so they wont kill all your scvs before the bunker finishes.
But since most players won't do that, it's an autowin.
Deleted User 55994
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
949 Posts
May 01 2010 08:11 GMT
#9
do you have a rep of that sadist? i don't doubt it'll do alot of dmg but killing them? can't see that unless their partner doesnt help at all
Sadistx
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Zimbabwe5568 Posts
May 01 2010 08:32 GMT
#10
The problem is by the time their ally comes to help them (usually with marines or zealots), reapers will kill most of the scvs, and then they just abuse the ledge and immediately go to the other person.

The way current 2v2 maps are set up, if you go help your ally, you will lose most of your svcs in the same manner.

The only pair that stands a chance vs this is maybe 2 zergs that both do 9 pool or something.

I'll post a few reps tomorrow when my competent 2v2 partner signs on
JFKWT
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Singapore1442 Posts
May 01 2010 12:32 GMT
#11
On May 01 2010 17:32 Sadistx wrote:
The problem is by the time their ally comes to help them (usually with marines or zealots), reapers will kill most of the scvs, and then they just abuse the ledge and immediately go to the other person.

The way current 2v2 maps are set up, if you go help your ally, you will lose most of your svcs in the same manner.

The only pair that stands a chance vs this is maybe 2 zergs that both do 9 pool or something.

I'll post a few reps tomorrow when my competent 2v2 partner signs on

Looking forward to that sadistx, and if anyone is kind enough to record it on vid-youtube it'll be much appreciated =)
The calm before the storm / "loli is not a crime, but meganekko is the way to go!"
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