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Perception of Skill and Balance in the Community

Blogs > T33K3SS3LCH3N
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teekesselchen
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Germany886 Posts
April 10 2010 01:01 GMT
#1
Actually, this topic does not really aim for the TeamLiquid forums but more for german forums I read in. Many people complained about balance and that they just can't compete with certain races, such as Zerg who now say that ZvT matchup was broken now.

I think that most players cannot actually rate the balance from their results because they cannot compare their skill to that of their opponents in most cases.

If all players' skill was rated in a rating between 0 to 100, their results should be explainable by comparing their skill and the matchup balance to their opponent's skill. The other way round, this means that players cannot rate the balance of a matchup when they don't know their or their opponents skill levels.

If a Zerg player wins 50% of his games against Skill-80-Terrans, does that mean that he is equally skilled? Not if the balance is unknown. Maybe he is way more or way less skilled but the matchup is not balanced.

Thus, you have to know a player's skill to get information about the balance by looking at his matches. Most players who flame and whine about balance can't know their or their opponents' skill, for example some Zerg might have been massively overrated and now think their race was broken because they loose against players they had a chance against before the patch.

The only players we can rate more or less accurately are top players. The beta might not be old yet but there already are players of each race who have exeptional results such as Lucifron, Dimaga, DeMuslim and several others. Those are the only players who's skill can be quantified as they must be more or less close to 100 (maybe not of what is possible overall but what is reached yet). So if you check their results, you can draw an approximate picture of balance.

Sure, this method can't always work and won't work for balance amongst all skill levels. If there, for example, is something you have to do in order to maintain a chance of winning in a specific matchup that just requires a certain base skill but does not really bother professional players, a matchup can be balanced for top players but not for the majority of the community.
(Let's say players have to stack Mutas to win against Terrans, very good players won't have a problem with that, a little worse players might be struggling with their multitasking and have a disadvantage over Terran, bad players won't be able to do it at all, but on their skill level it possibly won't be so important anyways :D).

All in all, I just think that there is way too much whining going on from players who don't even try to be objective about their games. They don't see "oh wow I got supply blocked right before the push so I lost", they just see "I lost again against this stupid race!" and complain about it in all forums they know.

*
When they were introduced, he made a witticism, hoping to be liked. She laughed extremely hard, hoping to be liked. Then each drove home alone, staring straight ahead, with the very same twist to their faces.
DeathSpank
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
United States1029 Posts
April 10 2010 01:16 GMT
#2
I always check to see what league/division my opponent is in after I play them. People who whine deserve to lose.
yes.
obesechicken13
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States10467 Posts
April 10 2010 02:47 GMT
#3
If the really really bad players feel a matchup is too unbalanced then they will either leave the game or switch to another race.

These guys will never advance in rank... because they don't play enough games to get the points to advance... but since one race may be easier: eg mass marauders as terrans... they will win more than 50% of their games against equally bad 1-5 skill level opponents. If a Terran and Zerg player have just finished the campaign... the terran shouldn't be given an automatic win and the game will be unbalanced at a lower skill level(given skill level is based on how much time one has played the game). It's probably impossible for balance to be achieved across all skill levels and therefore we should hope that it is as good as possible across the 1-89 levels, and damn near perfect at the 90-100 level.
I think in our modern age technology has evolved to become more addictive. The things that don't give us pleasure aren't used as much. Work was never meant to be fun, but doing it makes us happier in the long run.
unit
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States2621 Posts
April 10 2010 02:51 GMT
#4
On April 10 2010 10:16 DeathSpank wrote:
People who whine deserve to lose.

This is exactly the case
teekesselchen
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Germany886 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-04-10 03:26:36
April 10 2010 03:15 GMT
#5
On April 10 2010 11:47 obesechicken13 wrote:
If the really really bad players feel a matchup is too unbalanced then they will either leave the game or switch to another race.

These guys will never advance in rank... because they don't play enough games to get the points to advance... but since one race may be easier: eg mass marauders as terrans... they will win more than 50% of their games against equally bad 1-5 skill level opponents. If a Terran and Zerg player have just finished the campaign... the terran shouldn't be given an automatic win and the game will be unbalanced at a lower skill level(given skill level is based on how much time one has played the game). It's probably impossible for balance to be achieved across all skill levels and therefore we should hope that it is as good as possible across the 1-89 levels, and damn near perfect at the 90-100 level.


Sadly they do advance :D
Maybe it's a thing thats special for germany. The prejudice that germans complain all the time may proof true for multiplayer games.
Just to give you one example (respond to patch 8): "30% of Zerg will switch race now -.-" (posted by a Zerg ofc - Still he won't switch race, maybe deep in his heart he feels the righteosness of Patch 8 :D ). Also just got insulted by a weeping zerg after a match who has 1550 rating (platinum) and said that he can't possibly ever win on terran with hydras only having 80 hp and Terran beeing so lame race because they have "5 harrassing units". Actually all he played was Roaches/Hydras and expanding all over the place without giving any pressure or a real gameplan and allowing me to harass him as I pleased.

Forums are full of people who are not even total noobs but really don't EVER spend a thought on the fact that their previous results could be better than their skill because balance was bad by giving them an advantage.

Also a zerg who almost stepped into austrian national team (quite a good player though he admits to be some levels below players such as german national team Socke, HasuObs, XlorD and so on, think he is around 1650 rating Platinum right now) keeps on complaining, for instance that Thors actually do counter mutas and mutas would be extremely underpowered since thor's air AoE.

Gotta say that TL community is much more constructive about tactics. Lets take this thread title: "[Q] PVZ how to fight mass muta?" - I'm kinda sure that 85% of german posts about the same problem would be titled "macht Mutas endlich schwächer -.-" ("Nerf mutas already -.-")
When they were introduced, he made a witticism, hoping to be liked. She laughed extremely hard, hoping to be liked. Then each drove home alone, staring straight ahead, with the very same twist to their faces.
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