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Recently my sister and her live-in boyfriend got a new dog, Daisy, that is now living at home with them, my parents, my parents' dog Scarface, and me when I am not at school. Before I continue I will post pics of both dogs, because why not.
Daisy:
+ Show Spoiler +
Scarface:
+ Show Spoiler +
Anyways, as the title suggests, things have not been going great. The new dog Daisy is overly aggressive towards Scarface (not in that she wants to fight, but she wants to play with/be around Scarface as often as she can), however Scarface wants absolutely nothing to do with Daisy. In fact Scarface seems scared of Daisy and will leave when Daisy comes near even if Scarface was somewhere she wanted to be.
When all of this happens, my sister makes things 10 times worse by yelling at Daisy for scaring scarface, but of course Daisy doesn't realize what she is doing is wrong (in fact, it isn't wrong, scarface is just being a wuss, but scarface is more important than a new dog imo, since we have had her for ten years) and so Daisy doesn't know why she is being scolded and therefore has no idea how to react.
Also, both dogs were heavily abused/neglected by previous owners, so they both have odd behaviors/phobias that you just have to get used to when you adopt abused dogs, but those are manageable, I just want them to get along with each other.
Another piece of information that I find pertinent is that my sister did the same thing a few years ago, but that dog was violently aggressive with Scarface and so had to be given back to the humane society. (she has since found a happy home with people a few blocks away from us) Not sure if that matters, but just so you know that scarface has unsuccessfully been introduced to a new dog in the past.
Basically I am asking anybody that has dealt with a similar problem or is an expert on dog behavior what I can do to make this work. I really don't want to have my sister send Daisy back because she has enough health problems that nobody will want to make the investment to get her healthy again, so if she goes back to the humane society she will most likely be put down. 
Any websites I should visit, or just advice would be greatly appreciated.
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came in here thinking this was the topic of the thread. DOG PROBLEMS > problems relating to dogs.
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Hmmm ... I don't think he wants to learn about the emo band The Format.
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You must seek Cesar Millan, he will show you the light.
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Before scrolling through the pictures, I was expecting each had the other's name.
I dunno if this can be applied to your dogs but I have outdoor dogs and we just chain the new dog nearby. They get bored enough and soon were communicating with each other like "food's coming". I have only 1 indoor dog so I'm not that sure on what to do with handling multiple dogs indoors.
I do recall however my mum bringing the indoor one to the hairdresser one time and it always tried to play with hairdresser's indoor dog. And the hairdresser's dog would always backed off meekly everytime. The funny thing is, the hairdresser's dog usual behaviour was to bark fiercely at every customer who wasn't a regular that came into the shop. But nowadays, it doesn't back away and instead just lies there on the floor looking bored.
So, maybe it needs to get used to the other dog?
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I have a dog and when we first got him we took him to puppy training class. The dog trainer also offered sessions for dogs with problems socializing with other dogs and such issues. It sounds like Scarface has socializing problems. I would suggest looking in your area for a trainer who you might go to for advice. My personal advice would be to try and separate them while you can't be there to supervise and then let them interact under supervision. Patience is the key here, though. Scarface has been the family dog for so long that he doesn't expect another dog in the house. He's probably wondering when Daisy is leaving. Also, he's older and she seems to still be a puppy with the playfulness. So he'll probably tolerate her until he feels that Daisy is invading his personal space. Once he realizes she's not going away, things will hopefully get better.
Anyway, I applaud your attempt at finding a place for Daisy. Just keep at it! =) Let them interact only under supervision at first and good luck!
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Is Daisy a dwarf Snauzzer or however you spell that? I have a dog like that, anyway and she's rather aggressive voice-wise but pretty shy regarding physical contact.. She's also getting bullied by a friend of mine's dog which is also dwarf snauzzer, and frankly I have no clue how to fix it..
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we encountered a similar problem few months back, except that our dogs are not abused. anyway, we got a new dog (a pomeranian) and she's very playful to our old dogs. our old dog (a micro-mini pincher) just stayed away from her, e.g. jumping in the sofa so she can't be reached by the baby pomeranian. after some time, may be 3 weeks or 1 month, they get along well. and now, the pincher is acting as if she's an older sister to the pomeranian.
how long have you had daisy? i guess, dogs have their own adjustment period. may be after some time, they'll get along well, too.
good luck on your problem. pls. don't send back daisy to the cruel world!
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Sounds like you're going to have to get the dog trained if it's had problems before similar to this. Or just only keep Scarface and don't allow a second dog. Scarface is probably just used to being the only dog in the house and isn't enjoying the competition for attention now. Our dog's an attention whore too haha. It just stems from spoiling the dog when it's young I think.
On March 07 2010 08:27 lac29 wrote:
Hmmm ... I don't think he wants to learn about the emo band The Format.
emo? rofl.
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Awww, is the beige dog a cockapoo? It looks exactly like mine.
Anyway, I'd say just give it a few months and let the dogs get used to each other. If the older one is still annoying the new one, you're just going to have to do your best to keep them apart. It's really hard to change a dog's demeanor. I think it's just got to do with how they were as a puppy. My dog was really shy as a puppy, he was hiding in the corner of the puppy box when we got him, and he's always been intimidated by dogs that are really aggressive or bigger than him.
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We have had Daisy for 2 weeks now, which is why Scarface's continuing discomfort with her is starting to bother me, but maybe I am just being impatient. Idk I just fear that scarface feels betrayed that she isn't the center of attention anymore, and she is old enough that I'm also afraid she won't put up a fight and will just become second dog. (She won't obviously, but as far as she knows she will, which is what I am afraid of.)
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As far as breeds, Daisy is a 4 year old Snauzzer, and Scarface is a 12(ish) year old cockapoo.
I didn't pick either name, and I know they both suck. 
Scarface's name was a place holder as we came up with an actual name, because part of her previous owner's abuse was to put a pony-tail holder around her muzzle to keep her from barking, but then the sick bastard left it there for 2 weeks, which was long enough for her skin to begin growing around it. So she had a scar around her mouth for the first few years we had her. Unfortunately the name scarface became her new name as far as she was concerned, so it ended up sticking.
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I'm VERY good with dogs and recognizing behavioral problems. I've had about 6 dogs, 2 of which have have come from previously abusive owners and they've turned out to be wonderful, playful, non-aggressive dogs.
First of all, what you are describing of Daisy is NOT an aggressive attitude. You'd know if it were pure aggression (Scarface would be dead/injured by now). The way it sounds to me is that Daisy gets OVEREXCITED and rough houses a bit too much for Scarface. In some sense this is natural considering one is a puppy and the other is considerably older.
There are two problems that have to be addressed: (1) Daisy's over-the-top excitement and (2) Scarface's shyness. These have to be addressed in this order because you can't fix (2) without first fixing (1).
This may seem like a strange bit of advice, but you & your family first NEED to watch The Dog Whisperer (Cesar Milan) on the National Geographic, Animal Planet, Travel Channel, etc. He's absolutely incredible with dogs and has the best understanding of animal psychology I've ever seen. If you watch what he teaches, quite often you will find that the owner is mishandling/exacerbating the problem rather than helping it (your sister yelling is a good example of this). Cesar commonly refers to the need for people to be in a "CALM, ASSERTIVE STATE" when handling dogs. He also has a website with tips and advice Cesar's Way. Sit down with your family and watch a bunch of episodes, it'll help your problems go away.
As for my advice, here's how I would approach it:
(1) Daisy needs to be in a calmed state. If she constantly has people around her shouting, being nervous, feeling unsure of themselves and what will happen with Scarface - Daisy is going to pick up on these and take advantage. They are excellent body language readers and are completely situational/in the moment animals. Therefore, Daisy needs to have her energy, and the energy of her immediate environment lowered. Be calm but firm, and let her know only ONCE, that what she's doing is unacceptable by a combo of noise+touch. Repetitive shouting (i.e. "stop it Daisy! stop it Daisy!") and pulling her away from Scarface from behind is only going to make it worse. Have whoever is most confident/least nervous step in between the dogs (facing Daisy) and give her a tap on the muzzle or chest while firmly saying NO. Don't say anything else, but stand your ground in between them like you mean it. She may try to get around you to Scarface but simply look at the wall behind her like you aren't even paying attention and step to the side to block her off. Daisy will likely soon reach a state where she gets inquisitive/calmed and starts to look at both you and Scarface and may even sit down. Don't leave at this point and just stay put, paying no attention to either dog. Eventually Daisy will leave and then you can move from your position. You have established yourself as the dominant animal and let her know what needs to happen. It's your way or the highway. At this point, quietly sit nearby and watch from a distance and interact as needed.
The second part to helping Daisy is by draining her energy. Take her on long walks/runs. These need to be LONG walks so that she isn't so hyper. These benefit both the human and dog and will be of immense importance. Again, start with whoever is most comfortable/confident around dogs. Many women have problems in dog handling because they're overly emotional and regard the dog as a baby/close friend rather than what it actually is: a dog, and you as its master.
(2) Dogs that have been mistreated generally react in two ways. A - They will be extremely aggressive and B - They will act shy and seek refuge from only certain individuals. Scarface falls into the latter of those two. I would bet that Scarface's problem lies in the fact that she was already a shy/antisocial dog, but was then babied by your parents or whoever else took care of her. Combined with age, this can lead to great problems. In a way, this is even harder to treat than (1). Cesar has a great section on his website that deals with nervous/shy dogs. Take a look at it. I would suggest taking them together on walks. This lets them know that YOU think it's okay for them to be together. This will take time, but by having them interact during activities, you will see them engaging positively during their free-time. I think that by addressing (1), you will in some ways address (2).
Again, keep assertive with Daisy and let her know you mean it. Not by repetitive shouting and grabbing, but by what I said above. Simply stand your ground, and don't let her roughhouse.
Let me know what happens and if you have any more questions!
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Ty guys very much for the help and suggestions so far, I will definitely be following up on these.
Honestly, I think the biggest problem is going to be getting my sister to see that she is being overprotective of scarface when she yells at daisy and make her take a less active role in their acclimating to eachother.
For the next week that I am home I will try the things you suggested solar, and hopefully I can train either my mother or my sister to continue them when I leave.
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watch dog whisperer. such a good show.
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Excellent. It's good that you recognize that your mom and sister are being overprotective/uncomfortable around them - that's always step #1. Provide the most calm, positive environment you can and just remember that you are in control and it needs to remain that way.
In a way, dog training is almost like picking up women (I'm sorry if I offend anybody with that statement.) You need to be assertive and act like it's no big deal. That and have your mother and sister watch The Dog Whisperer.
ps - I have another method that will work for Daisy if the one above doesn't help. I think it will though.
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A small problem with the daisy thing is that it is hard to tire her out in any other way than walking because she was neglected by her previous owners to the point that she simply doesn't understand how to play with people. You try to play by getting on all fours and acting excited or by throwing a toy and she just stares at you or sniffs your face. (We are going to keep at it of course, but as of right now we can't tire her out because she doesn't know how to play.) We have been walking them both together, which is nice because as you said it lets them know it is ok to be together, but scarface just doesn't have the energy that daisy has, so I think I will start suggesting an extra walk for daisy after the group walk.
Edit: or will that make scarface jealous?
Edit 2: Also any specific episodes of dog whisperer I should look for that deal with this/similar problems? I'm just gonna set it to record the series and tell my mom and sister to watch them, but I'd like to watch at least one or two with them while I am here.
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On March 07 2010 09:43 Lemonwalrus wrote:
A small problem with the daisy thing is that it is hard to tire her out in any other way than walking because she was neglected by her previous owners to the point that she simply doesn't understand how to play with people. You try to play by getting on all fours and acting excited or by throwing a toy and she just stares at you or sniffs your face. (We are going to keep at it of course, but as of right now we can't tire her out because she doesn't know how to play.) We have been walking them both together, which is nice because as you said it lets them know it is ok to be together, but scarface just doesn't have the energy that daisy has, so I think I will start suggesting an extra walk for daisy after the group walk.
Edit: or will that make scarface jealous?
Edit 2: Also any specific episodes of dog whisperer I should look for that deal with this/similar problems? I'm just gonna set it to record the series and tell my mom and sister to watch them, but I'd like to watch at least one or two with them while I am here.
Will Daisy not even chase a tennis ball or something if you take her to a park? Also, if you have a fenced backyard, just find a toy that she really likes, and just keep acting like you are trying to take it from her and just chase her.
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Daisy has yet to respond to any toy. Chasing her just seems to scare her. The only way we have been successful is that either me or my sister's boyfriend have been able to semi-wrestle with her on occasion which she enjoys for a minute or two. Unfortunately she was spayed only 2 weeks ago so we can't really roughhouse as much as you normally would.
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http://www.youtube.com/show?p=ygVF8eWNrAk
dunno if there's any episode in particular but they are all pretty interesting to watch to see how he approaches each situation. i don't even have a dog but i like watching his methodology. it's fucking awesome.
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If Daisy has too much energy for Scarface on walks then take Daisy on an extra walk BEFOREHAND. You want them on a level playing field. Take Daisy on a daily run and THEN take them on a 15 minute walk together. I know this requires a lot of time but dogs are a responsibility. If your sister wasn't willing to spend at least 45 minutes a day walking/running the dog, then perhaps she shouldn't have an animal at all.
Additionally, you need to be walking them the CORRECT way. During the walk, make sure they are beside you rather than in front of you. Those extendable leashes that go 20 feet are the worst thing to ever happen for dog/human interaction. They need to be by your side, following your orders. Not the other way around.
As far as Daisy not knowing how to play, it sounds like you're addressing play time in the wrong manner. The purpose of playtime is not to wear them out. This happens only indirectly. The purpose of playtime is for them to interact with each other in a playful way (chasing balls, sniffing butts, etc etc.) If you are getting on all fours with the intention of riling her up, then this could very well be exacerbating the problem. As Cesar says - always show discipline before affection.
And for specific episodes - I can't remember exactly which ones, but he has rehabilitated hundreds of dogs with both of the problems you mentioned. YOU need to watch them too, not just your mother and sister.
ps - DO NOT CHASE HER. It will make things worse.
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I know, but I also need to get myself a degree. Neither of these dogs are mine, I am doing all that I can to help, but in the end I am only here 3 months out of the year and so it can't be left up to me.
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I understand, the only reason I say that you need to do it is that your sister sounds like she has no idea what she's doing is detrimental to the dog. Somebody needs to step up to the plate and I think you are the most obvious person to do that. If you act in a certain way while you're here, it'll hopefully rub off on them.
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ur sister and her bf should get a room...living with ur parents?...not fun...
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That is a problem for another blog....
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Germany2762 Posts
afraid of
?!
you cannot be serious.
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Her skin is pink, but her fur is cream-colored.
Why that is I have no idea.
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On March 07 2010 10:40 jhNz wrote:afraid of ?! you cannot be serious.
I know right?
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You forgot to add "Say hello to my little friend!".
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Why is Scarface so pink o_0 did u mix her in with some red thongs?
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EPT![[image loading]](http://blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com/valleyfever/scarface-photo-scarface-6229381.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_wDidwDvONhs/SiYmrDOuJsI/AAAAAAAABA0/bQJdpJu1TUs/s400/Daisy_Duck.jpg)
