• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 09:52
CET 15:52
KST 23:52
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !8Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win4Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump1Weekly Cups (Nov 24-30): MaxPax, Clem, herO win2BGE Stara Zagora 2026 announced15
StarCraft 2
General
When will we find out if there are more tournament ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career ! Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump
Tourneys
$5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship RSL Offline Finals Info - Dec 13 and 14! Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Winter Warp Gate Amateur Showdown #1: Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 504 Retribution Mutation # 503 Fowl Play Mutation # 502 Negative Reinforcement Mutation # 501 Price of Progress
Brood War
General
FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle screp: Command line app to parse SC rep files How Rain Became ProGamer in Just 3 Months BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ [BSL21] RO8 Bracket & Prediction Contest
Tourneys
Small VOD Thread 2.0 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] WB SEMIFINALS - Saturday 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO8 - Day 2 - Sunday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Game Theory for Starcraft Current Meta Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Survivor II: The Amazon Sengoku Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine The Games Industry And ATVI YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TL+ Announced Where to ask questions and add stream?
Blogs
The (Hidden) Drug Problem in…
TrAiDoS
I decided to write a webnov…
DjKniteX
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Thanks for the RSL
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1836 users

[MSL Spoiler]

Forum Index > BW General
Post a Reply
1 2 3 4 5 9 10 11 Next All
joohyunee
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
Korea (South)1087 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-13 23:37:37
July 11 2009 16:28 GMT
#1
Why Calm Will Win The MSL

He might be only #7 in the PR right now, but from what I've seen from him recently, he's a strong Dark Horse to win this MSL. Not many people know this, but Calm is the zerg with the 2nd most wins behind Jaedong in the Proleague with ~40 wins. (he's just been shaded by Jaedong's domination) Since June, he is 10-3, taking down FlaSh (FlaSh has admitted that he's scared to play against Calm, according to the commentators), Mind, Sea, and Zero. It's not so much the record that leads me to believe he can take this OSL, though; it's his playstyle.

What characterizes Calm's play? I can think of Ballsy aggression and creative builds. But it's more a combination of the two, working together to create his greatest weapon: unpredictability. I believe Calm's strongest trait is that he forces open openings in the opponent's play. I don't think he has FlaSh's style of "I know what the other guy's going to do just by feeling it out" and try to abuse a hole in the opponent's play; Calm is different.

He literally rips apart openings in his opponents through 1) Ballsy builds 2) clever mindgame tactics that abuse the opponents' scouting 3) aggression with balls of steel. he attacks where the opponent is most uncomfortable at an uncomfortable timing, thereby disrupting the opponent's timing/overall plan for the game.

Exhibit A: Ballsy Builds


2 Base Hive for the Win? What?

Exhibit B: Mindgame Tactics that abuse opponents' scouting

what you see is not what it seems...

Exhibit C: Aggression with balls of steel

(watch from 7:00)
Fuck your vultures FlaSh, I'm gonna rip you a new one.
Be scared.. be very scared to play me..



(Watch from 9:30)
All-in? I'll force an opening with mutas and make it happen

Most recently... (MSL spoiler) + Show Spoiler +


Calm never faces the metal ball head on but aggressively attacks forGG's base, trading units effectively as mech is weak in small numbers, as well as whittling down forGG's economy down to nothing in 2 waves of hydra attacks. The aggression forces forGG to head home TWICE before forGG could eventually take down Calm's natural. Oh by the way, he's got 2 more bases by that time, so it didn't matter at that point. Why go for hive tech when you can cripple the terran's economy by attacking?


Yes, most of these games are against terran. But he's also shown strong performance against Protoss. Some toss named yoon got his ass handed to him in this game:


Bottom line: Calm will win this MSL. I don't give a crap at who's still in the MSL. I BELIEVE!
SuperArc
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Austria7781 Posts
July 11 2009 16:32 GMT
#2
I agree, Calm doesn't have the crazy APM of by.hero or micro from JD, but he's so smart!

His play is beautiful to watch.
Snow - future of protoss! :) Nada = baller
TwoStep
Profile Joined January 2009
United States294 Posts
July 11 2009 16:34 GMT
#3
I wouldn't mind Calm winning the MSL. Who would he play in the Ro8 assuming the higher seeds win? Flash or Bisu, I think.
Arf
Scaramanga
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Australia8091 Posts
July 11 2009 16:35 GMT
#4
Uhh, all the qualities that you have listed, jd has x2
Loda talked about the fun counter, it's AdmiralBulldog on his natures prophet
Klive5ive
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United Kingdom6056 Posts
July 11 2009 16:37 GMT
#5
You should have named it something different.
Now you'll get flamed a lot.
By claiming "Calm will Win this MSL" you've joined the sad group of people who predict an unlikely event just so they can claim to be a genius if they get lucky.
(Before someone calls me out; I'm aware I'm in this group ;p)

I really like your analysis though. Calm IS a really smart player, respect to him.
Don't hate the player - Hate the game
Bob123
Profile Joined October 2006
Korea (North)259 Posts
July 11 2009 16:39 GMT
#6
I don't believe, but I hope : ). Nice play!
Fontong
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States6454 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-07-11 16:41:23
July 11 2009 16:40 GMT
#7
Haha no way. I'm not even a Jaedong fan, but even then I think that Calm would get flattened against JD. Not to mention Bisu, and likely fantasy as well.

He really doesn't have a good list of victories against players that are actually good. Sure he beat Flash, but Flash doesn't really deserve to be up there with Jaedong, Bisu, Effort, or even Fantasy(lol i that guy annoys me) at this point. Calm is going to just get smashed when he plays an actual S class player.

also calm vs darkelf on python nuff said

edit: plus all you did was make a list of gimmicky builds that he did
[SECRET FONT] "Dragoon bunker"
disciple
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
9070 Posts
July 11 2009 16:43 GMT
#8
I dont think we really need a new face right now as a champion, this will make the picture even more chaotic. I prefer Jaedong to win everything than Yarnc and Calm or smth like that, although canata for a double will be cool as fuck
Administrator"I'm a big deal." - ixmike88
mog87
Profile Joined October 2008
United States1586 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-07-11 16:46:23
July 11 2009 16:44 GMT
#9
On July 12 2009 01:40 Fontong wrote:
Haha no way. I'm not even a Jaedong fan, but even then I think that Calm would get flattened against JD. Not to mention Bisu, and likely fantasy as well.

He really doesn't have a good list of victories against players that are actually good. Sure he beat Flash, but Flash doesn't really deserve to be up there with Jaedong, Bisu, Effort, or even Fantasy(lol i that guy annoys me) at this point. Calm is going to just get smashed when he plays an actual S class player.

also calm vs darkelf on python nuff said

edit: plus all you did was make a list of gimmicky builds that he did


I agree with your point about Calm getting smashed when he faces a top player, personally I think Forgg will take the next 2 games, but then you went all crazy and starting saying flash is worse than Effort and Fantasy...so umm dont post while high.

But for me Calm is like luxury+yarnc+brains, but really I dont think hes strong enough to get through a bo5 vs strong competition.
SuperArc
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Austria7781 Posts
July 11 2009 16:45 GMT
#10
On July 12 2009 01:40 Fontong wrote:
Haha no way. I'm not even a Jaedong fan, but even then I think that Calm would get flattened against JD. Not to mention Bisu, and likely fantasy as well.

He really doesn't have a good list of victories against players that are actually good. Sure he beat Flash, but Flash doesn't really deserve to be up there with Jaedong, Bisu, Effort, or even Fantasy(lol i that guy annoys me) at this point. Calm is going to just get smashed when he plays an actual S class player.

also calm vs darkelf on python nuff said

edit: plus all you did was make a list of gimmicky builds that he did


Eh, I would do Calm > fantasy on any day.

but vs Bisu or Jaedong, he has no chance
Snow - future of protoss! :) Nada = baller
JWD
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States12607 Posts
July 11 2009 16:50 GMT
#11
If you're trying to advertise Calm's skills, I think you probably shouldn't even mention his game against Flash. He played like garbage...I mean, how can you scout a walled in Terran on Outsider and not build a sunken? The only reason he won that game is because Flash handed it to him on a silver platter.
✌
vhallee
Profile Blog Joined January 2005
899 Posts
July 11 2009 16:51 GMT
#12
On July 12 2009 01:35 Scaramanga wrote:
Uhh, all the qualities that you have listed, jd has x2

True. Very true. I do see Calm as a strong contender for the MSL and I like his play a lot but I'm still a bit sceptical.
Marijuana causes amnesia and other things I don't remember.
Frits
Profile Joined March 2003
11782 Posts
July 11 2009 16:55 GMT
#13
Meh, I think zero is way better than calm right now.
deconduo
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
Ireland4122 Posts
July 11 2009 16:55 GMT
#14
You have the outsider game up twice.
Fontong
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States6454 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-07-11 17:07:12
July 11 2009 17:00 GMT
#15
On July 12 2009 01:44 mog87 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 12 2009 01:40 Fontong wrote:
Haha no way. I'm not even a Jaedong fan, but even then I think that Calm would get flattened against JD. Not to mention Bisu, and likely fantasy as well.

He really doesn't have a good list of victories against players that are actually good. Sure he beat Flash, but Flash doesn't really deserve to be up there with Jaedong, Bisu, Effort, or even Fantasy(lol i that guy annoys me) at this point. Calm is going to just get smashed when he plays an actual S class player.

also calm vs darkelf on python nuff said

edit: plus all you did was make a list of gimmicky builds that he did


I agree with your point about Calm getting smashed when he faces a top player, personally I think Forgg will take the next 2 games, but then you went all crazy and starting saying flash is worse than Effort and Fantasy...so umm dont post while high.

But for me Calm is like luxury+yarnc+brains, but really I dont think hes strong enough to get through a bo5 vs strong competition.

Flash is fresh off of a 3 game losing streak to Kal, Calm, and Kwanro. He is only 5-5 in his last ten games. He lost to fucking BACKHO.

Fantasy on the other hand is fresh off a 10 game winning streak, including victories over Kal, Jangbi, Leta, guemchi(who is actually doing very well otherwise i wouldn't include him) and Backho(who flash couldnt beat lololo)

Effort is fucking crazy recently, nuff said.

Wake up and smell the roses. Flash isn't what he used to be. He is the next sea.

Edit: but I think he will actually beat forgg, its sad since I'm a huge fan of oov 2.0, but he just never lived up to his series against JD.
[SECRET FONT] "Dragoon bunker"
Foucault
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Sweden2826 Posts
July 11 2009 17:01 GMT
#16
Any zerg that rules in ZvT and is good at ZvZ will easily become a monster in ZvP because the MU is easier than the other two.
I know that deep inside of you there's a humongous set of testicles just waiting to pop out. Let 'em pop bro. //////////////////// AKA JensOfSweden // Lee Yoon Yeol forever.
Too_MuchZerg
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Finland2818 Posts
July 11 2009 17:01 GMT
#17
On July 12 2009 01:34 TwoStep wrote:
I wouldn't mind Calm winning the MSL. Who would he play in the Ro8 assuming the higher seeds win? Flash or Bisu, I think.


MSL Round of 8 brackets (predictions)

(Z)Jaedong vs (T)Canata

(Z)EffOrt vs (Z)Calm

(Z)ZerO vs (Z)Kwanro

(P)Bisu vs (T)Iris

IF IF IF those players advance who already did win first game.
PH
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
United States6173 Posts
July 11 2009 17:04 GMT
#18
Calm is a great player, but there are a lot of great players in this MSL as of now.

He has a shot at the finals if he doesn't face Jaedong before then (I don't know what the brackets look like)...but that's about it.

To whoever mentioned by.hero...that guy is NOT a great player. 500APM can kiss my ass, he needs to both learn to utilize that and relearn the game.
Hello
SuperArc
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
Austria7781 Posts
July 11 2009 17:04 GMT
#19
On July 12 2009 01:55 Frits wrote:
Meh, I think zero is way better than calm right now.


Calm is consistent, Zero isn't.
Calm > Zero
Snow - future of protoss! :) Nada = baller
AzureEye
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States1360 Posts
July 11 2009 17:09 GMT
#20
I actually think Calm is a really strong player, on par with Effort possibly. He just hasn't his streak like Effort yet but I think he will. But Fantasy or JD will stop Calm from this MSL for sure.
Terrans who whine: http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=107788
1 2 3 4 5 9 10 11 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
OSC
14:00
King of the Hill #234
SteadfastSC54
Liquipedia
WardiTV 2025
11:00
Playoffs
Clem vs CreatorLIVE!
Scarlett vs Spirit
ShoWTimE vs Cure
WardiTV1541
ComeBackTV 1301
TaKeTV 413
IndyStarCraft 220
Rex143
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Lowko666
IndyStarCraft 220
Harstem 183
Rex 143
ProTech57
SteadfastSC 54
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 31885
Calm 5177
GuemChi 2325
Rain 2315
Bisu 2030
Horang2 875
Stork 872
actioN 728
Shuttle 390
firebathero 284
[ Show more ]
Larva 252
Mind 175
Mini 175
ggaemo 173
Hyun 105
Killer 105
hero 95
Zeus 75
Barracks 75
Bale 71
Aegong 66
Snow 65
JYJ 65
Sea.KH 58
ToSsGirL 49
Shinee 40
soO 37
zelot 27
Mong 23
910 20
sorry 17
scan(afreeca) 16
ajuk12(nOOB) 14
GoRush 13
JulyZerg 13
Sacsri 13
Yoon 12
Terrorterran 12
SilentControl 5
Dota 2
Gorgc4698
singsing3675
qojqva1594
XcaliburYe122
LuMiX1
League of Legends
C9.Mang0384
Counter-Strike
allub257
oskar107
Other Games
B2W.Neo1694
hiko538
crisheroes403
Fuzer 348
XaKoH 127
djWHEAT56
Trikslyr30
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 9
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• HeavenSC 6
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis1902
Upcoming Events
Big Brain Bouts
2h 8m
YoungYakov vs Jumy
TriGGeR vs Spirit
The PiG Daily
6h 8m
SHIN vs ByuN
Reynor vs Classic
TBD vs herO
Maru vs SHIN
TBD vs Classic
CranKy Ducklings
19h 8m
WardiTV 2025
20h 8m
Reynor vs MaxPax
SHIN vs TBD
Solar vs herO
Classic vs TBD
SC Evo League
21h 38m
Ladder Legends
1d 4h
BSL 21
1d 5h
Sziky vs Dewalt
eOnzErG vs Cross
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 19h
Ladder Legends
2 days
BSL 21
2 days
StRyKeR vs TBD
Bonyth vs TBD
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
WardiTV Invitational
5 days
ByuN vs Solar
Clem vs Classic
Cure vs herO
Reynor vs MaxPax
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4 - TS3
RSL Offline Finals
Kuram Kup

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
Slon Tour Season 2
CSL Season 19: Qualifier 1
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22

Upcoming

CSL Season 19: Qualifier 2
CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Big Gabe Cup #3
OSC Championship Season 13
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.