EPTWhats the *worst* that can happen?
Some Mafia Game
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
Whats the *worst* that can happen? | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
On September 03 2011 02:22 Hesmyrr wrote: /in I am? | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/iXdzg.jpg) Lets just say I'm here to punish sinners. Let none stand against me, lest they be cast into a lake of eternal fire. Amen. | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
iGrok Ah, random voting, the most useless way to possibly kick a game off. Arguing about lurkers is better than this. Seriously, does anyone feel threatened at all with 1/9 votes? Any risk of death? Now, iGrok, lets talk about him shall we On September 08 2011 02:59 iGrok wrote: I consider that a valid reason to vote. With no setup knowledge other than my own role, I'm a little on edge anyways. This jumps out at me, this is so... unnecessarily defensive, I don't think I've ever been "on edge" when rolling town. I mean as town I don't really care that much if I die or if a couple of idiots vote for me, its almost par for the course. I generally don't even acknowledge the first votes thrown at me, nor do most town, as we know we are innocent. We certainly have nothing to fear, why then is iGrok scared and on edge? What motivation is there for this "edginess", from a town perspective? None, at least none that I can see. Lets compare this "edginess" with what iGrok usually does as town. From XLIV, his first post upon replacing On August 25 2011 10:19 iGrok wrote: ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/4JR0G.png) Doesn't seem that on edge to me, no real nervousnessor attempts at justification, just "this is what I think, deal with it!" There is not "oh no, I better avoid people tunneling me, what are people going to think of me" namely there is not fear no emotional undercurrent that suggests iGrok might be hiding something, even though there is a bit of doubt its not the prominent part of the post, its not dominating it, unlike the majority of his posts here. This post right here gives a similar emotional vibe to the first quote I posted, namely fear and discomfort On September 08 2011 11:20 iGrok wrote: This is trying hard to justify it? Look, if you want to tunnel someone, that's fine. Just pick someone else to fight with. Can no one else smell the tinge of fear from this post? Note that this desire to avoid the spotlight, this deep fear isn't present in his play as town in mafia XLIV, where he was not at all afraid to be a nexus of attention. Notice he *really* doesn't want to be tunneled, he wants to be away from the spotlight Compare the above "oh don't tunnel me" to iGrok's response to being called scum by wherebugsgo in XLIV On August 27 2011 13:26 iGrok wrote: @WBG: You still think I'm mafia? After I started the vote for Mig, shot down attempts to split votes between Mig and BB, and... well I haven't told you why Kurumi is scum yet. I've got to think about when to release that, I'm not sure if it'd be better far in advance or right before daypost. Notice the absolute lack of fear in fact there is a bit of arrogance in the post, that is the attitude of a town player. Fear and anger are what I see in iGrok's posts so far this game, not a tinge of arrogance or that "deal with it" tone from mafia XLIV. Its interesting that iGrok apparently notices this change (probably informed by his team) and drops back to an arrogant tone with things like On September 08 2011 11:21 iGrok wrote: Oh, and I'll give my opinions on people when I'm damn well ready. Which is a magnificent change, but far too late, and still out of character. The major sticking point of this in my mind is that while iGrok was arrogant in XLIV, his arrogance was always *useful*, while he did post with some arrogance and willfulness it was never stuff like "we'll I don't feel like helping right now", generally he didn't shut down avenues of conversation like this, arrogance was also one of his major sticking points in mafia XL, where he was the mafia godfather, and he took an "everyone but me sucks" approach to the game, which got him lynched day 2, this looks like a lapse into similar behavior. What motivation does a townie have for refusing to give his reads? This evidence is pretty damning. iGrok's fear and doubt have become his undoing, iGrok is almost certainly scum. ##Vote: iGrok + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/iCJXN.gif) | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
Let his days be few; and let another take his office Amen | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
On September 08 2011 19:06 Palmar wrote: Actually, I still like chaos13 as scum. I don't think iGrok is scum, he wouldn't drag all this attention by opening up with a policy post on killing the smurf. I don't know about GGQ, the rest are just derp votes. Fun fact, that wasn't what iGrok did at all, he opened with a post where he was explicitly pressure voting for me. Which as I explained is hilarious, because with majority votes a single vote means nothing. I like how you are framing him in a better light though. Care to tell me what the last game you rolled scum is? I think I may need to go re-read it. (sorry for triple posting, but since I'm all alone in the thread I thought I might as well talk to myself) | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
On September 09 2011 04:18 TheAwesomeAll wrote: i disagree, ive never really seen a rvs on teamliquid and imo it basicly quick started the game. (i like the random talking about the game better) random vote, ergo scum, is a pretty bad base for an analysis. the rest of your analysis is pretty good but starting it of with that random vote makes me think you are mainly attacking him because he voted for you. None of my case is based on it being random voting, read the actual case. I'm simply saying I think its stupid, but towns do it all the time, its not really a tell either way. Way to take a single line and use it to try to discredit a whole case. I was just pointing out that I believe the RVS is utterly worthless, NOT that iGrok is scum for starting/participating in it. | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
I'd like to hear a justification from Curu however, I hate votes without reasoning, now that we are more than 24 hours into day 1. | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
On September 09 2011 06:18 TheAwesomeAll wrote: ##unvote ##vote bumatlarge of iGrok and GGQ, iGrok is the scummiest but the case against either is pretty bad. Explain. Now. Why is bum a better lynch target than those two? Make a case! You cannot just make blanket statements and hope to get away with it. Why bum over iGrok? What makes the cases against them "bad"? What is the last game you rolled scum? @Jackal RVS stands for Random Voting Phase, its those five people who voted for someone at game start. | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
On September 09 2011 07:03 iGrok wrote: Haha, wow. This game is going to be fun. I can't have Pressure voted and Random voted. Pick one to accuse me of. But, your first post revealed your true identity, so now I've got something to play off of. So now lets take a look at what else has been going on. GGQ and JeeJee got into a pissing contest. chaos13 and wbg gave their opinions of things. BA finally posts, ~36 hours after I vote for him. TheAwesomeAll got some attention. I'm going to vote for TheAwesomeAll, not merely for his incredibly short posts, but for his suspicion of GGQ. "You're defending yourself so you must be scum!" ##Vote TheAwesomeAll ok, its rare a post makes my head hurt so much, of course a random vote is a pressure vote, that is usually the objective of random votes: to put pressure on people. In a majority lynch setting they fail to do that because a single vote is hardly a risk. Pressure voting and random voting aren't mutually exclusive. Yes, I posted late in the day, I had no need to post silly random votes that don't mean anything, when I post I try to make it count. Nice attempt at making me contradict myself, too bad its just as transparent as TTA's attempt at discrediting my argument Nice summary, shame it fails to contribute anything. Are you going to defend yourself? Or should we just lynch you? As far as to my true identity, you can *guess* at what it is, but I think you'll be surprised later. Either way, its a moot point, you are scum, and you are not getting anywhere fast by posting a "summary", that as wonderful as posting "lurker lists", a great way for scum to blend in. Seriously people, can we kill him already? | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
I'm out for the next 5 or so hours. I will attempt to make it back before the deadline, no promises however. Calling all day1 posting "fluff" is hardly going to help us find scum. You are better than this, step it up. Either way, the town should know who to vote for. | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
If I die lynch iGrok. If I don't then lynch him anyway. | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/D0AmB.jpg) Its time. I have proven beyond any doubt that iGrok is scum, yet somehow his lynch was averted by one of the fastest forming and most suspicious wagons I have seen in a long time. Furthermore iGrok's "defense" has consisted of ignoring my accusations and accusing me of being scum , rather than addressing why he is jumpy and scared. Scum 101, if you can't defend yourself discredit your attacker, and ignore the arguments against you. I'm not going to allow it. It is time I put my money where my mouth is, or in this case my gun. I am a day vigi, and I am taking iGrok to the pits of hell, where he belongs. Since I am the man pulling the trigger I take full responsibility for his flip. I'll be back to analyze the interactions later, but for now please note how hard Curu and Palmar have defended him, and check to see how it was Curu who began the bandwagon against TAA that kept iGrok of the gallows, and Palmar who gave a 5% chance iGrok was scum. Keep this all in mind when we see the flip, when my holly bayonnets dig into iGrok's flesh. Let there be none to extend mercy unto him: neither let there be any to favor his fatherless children. Let his posterity be cut off; and in the generation following let their name be blotted out. Let the iniquity of his fathers be remembered with the LORD; and let not the sin of his mother be blotted out. Let them be before the LORD continually, that he may cut off the memory of them from the earth. Let this be the reward of mine adversaries from the LORD, and of them that speak evil against my soul. AMEN ##Kill: iGrok | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
Time to reread the thread. (After the TL Open is over) | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
On September 11 2011 01:19 Curu wrote: And mister smurf man, now that your tunnel has died who do you find scummy? Can I get back to you on that? I was making my net of suspects based on iGrok flipping red, I need to go back and reread the thread and try to figure out what I've overlooked. bleh. | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
On September 11 2011 03:23 wherebugsgo wrote: Wait what the fuck I just noticed something. Mafia KP is 2 but only one person died last night? Who got saved? How do you know mafia KP is 2? It doesn't say that anywhere in the OP... scumslip? I mean 2 is likely, but we don't know that its that for sure... | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
sandroba ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/wYeM3.jpg) So, I was bored, so I went meta/lurker hunting, and I found the man of the hour, the person everyone seems to be willing to call out for lurking, yet no one seems to want to vote for or make a formal accusation of. Its time I changed that. Lets fliter sandroba and see what agenda he is pushing, what wonderful pro-town plans he has come up with, what awesome discussion he has begun. Here is his filter What jumps out at you right away? The guy has all of 10 posts! This is "active man" sandroba the guy who's posted such pro town sentiments as On July 25 2011 09:36 sandroba wrote: Sup people, I'd like to propose a new policy this game. Instead of lynching lurkers and liars, which produce no info whatsoever, we leave them to be shot at night by our vigs, if they exist. We can adjust acordingly if they fail to do their job. The policy is to lynch all non-sense. People are getting away too easily by throwing random acusations that make no sense to pretend to be scum hunting. This is to pressure mafia into skilfully captalizing into people's mistakes if they want to suceed and survive. They can't lurk, because they will be getting shot, and can't pretend to be dumb, cuz they will get lynched. Of course pressuring people is okay, but if you are pushing hard a lynch for a lynch based on shoody evidence I'll tunnel you into oblivion. and On August 14 2011 00:04 sandroba wrote: + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://www.cracked.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/timepanties31.jpg) Okay people. First let's try to keep the posts regarding personality flavor to a bare minimum. This only helps mafia to hide, so don't go out of your way role playing. I know some people might have some posting restrictions, but know that posting any more fluf than you absolutely have to is anti-town behaviour and you WILL be held accountable for it. Now I want this question answered by everybody: Let's look at kurumi and his Bill Murray claim. Being BM, he could easily be VI trying to get lynched day1. He could also have a terrible posting restriction. Or he could be mafia trying to cause chaos. But we can't know for sure, so what I ask you is this: Do you think personalities point to aligment this game? Or do you think they only point towards role/posting style? My guess would be that some personalities would have a very high chance of being a certain aligment (i.e. ace is prob scum), but others not so much. Do we notice any policy post this game? Any suggestion that we vigi lurkers, or any point of discussion offered? Any attempt at generating controversy? No, we really don't. To anyone who has played with town sandroba in the past, this should be setting off every alarm bell in the system. We should be outright worried. this isn't how sandroba usually behaves. Lets be rational however, maybe its sandroba trying out a new style, trying a different method of playing, lets look at what he has actually contributed, maybe all our suspicion is unjustified, maybe he isn't posting plans because its a closed setup and he can't come up with anything, like talking about viging lurkers or avoiding tunnels or maintaining a pro-town atmosphere. Oh, wait, he says this, which is... fascinating. Its trying to *look* like one of his usual policy posts, but in reality its dodging discussion and not supporting his reasons. To me it looks like he is trying to emulate one of his usual policy/plan posts, but isn't willing to fully commit to it or the scrutiny it might put him under. So lets take a look at a couple of sandrobas wonderful contributions this game. On September 08 2011 08:04 sandroba wrote: Sup I don't think GGQ is scum. Suspcious people to me so far are iGrok and xfttfc whose behaviour day1 is 100% different than mafia xliv. xftc is being too absurdly confindent about his reads and even basing an entire scum team out of them when the game was only one page long (LOL). The whole notion is so ridiculous that to me it seems he is over compensating for his behaviour in the last game where he was townie and was found scummy by a lot of others. Makes no sense for a townie to throw acusations into 4 players this early with so little info, but it makes a lot of sense for scum to try to create this sort of confusion. I'd like you gather your thoughts and post in a more coherent manner until I decide if you are scum or not. You are right sandroba, throwing around suspicion *is* a mafia trait, great catch. I like how you mention iGrok in passing and don't actually say anything about him. Your description of xftc's behavior is pretty spot on, except your logic is all wrong. Scum *subtly* push lynches, they don't spearhead them, much less provide ridiculous scumlists, to me this looks like a shallow attempt to make an accusation out of almost no evidence. Notice how sandroba doesn't take a stance, notice how whishy washy the post is. He says X's (I'm never going to figure out how to spell his name) behavior "makes no sense for a townie", yet sandroba is willing to give him more time? He doesn't even vote for him, which is... odd... to say the least, considering how he just concluded town wouldn't be doing what X is doing. This post is worrying because its wishy-washy and non-committal Sandroba then proceeds to push suspicion onto iGrok by adding pressure to him, then out of the blue we have On September 09 2011 07:04 sandroba wrote: Alright TAA is the best lynch. No bullshit allowed here sir. ##Vote: TheAwesomeAll What the HELL? we went from this where sandroba was turning up the heat (yet oddly enough not voting, to this. Hint as a rule of thumb if you are on the same wagon as someone you consider suspicious you at least think twice about it. So, what does sandroba really do all of day 1? He pushes suspicion on two people, X and iGrok, defends GGQ and proceeds to vote for someone he hadn't even mentioned yet, with no reason given, can you say easy bandwagon? I could expand this post, looking at how he liked to push suspicion as scum, and how as town he is more active and questioning, but I don't honestly think its necessary, I'm pretty sure from what I've looked at alone we can tell he is scum. For those who dislike thinking, sandroba is scum because he 1.) Lurks like a madman, unlike his usual town play 2.) Shows wishy washyness 3.) Pushes suspicion around, something he had already said was anti-town 4.) Jumps on an easy bandwagon, with no justification 5.) People in the thread keep calling him out on being scum, and then proceed to do exactly nothing. Sandroba is scum ##Vote: Sandroba The LORD is righteous: he hath cut asunder the cords of the wicked. Let them all be confounded and turned back that hate Zion. Let them be as the grass upon the housetops, which withereth afore it groweth up: wherewith the mower filleth not his hand; nor he that bindeth sheaves his bosom. AMEN | ||
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BayonnetAnderson
United States60 Posts
On September 12 2011 01:12 Curu wrote: Based on right now I would lynch sinani, bum, Jackal, or Palmar. I don't know if sandroba is actually lack-of-interest Townie or doing syllogism style "lurk as scum even when pressured until people forget about you" but he has indicated he will post more. If he doesn't hold to this we can lynch him. Please, town sandroba doesn't do this, I don't care what he's promised, notice how he showed up less than 6 hours after my analysis to promise more contribution? The guy is scum, no bones about it. I'm also ok with the bum lynch, although I'm convinced WBG's "slip" isn't one, he's been way too fearless to be scum. I've been wrong in the past, but if WBG flipped red I would be exceedingly surprised. | ||
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