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ManaBlue
Canada10458 Posts
On February 06 2007 17:40 The Storyteller wrote: Actually, ever since Savior lost to Gorush, his ZvZ has improved tremendously. I think you could say he's got more than a 50/50 chance to win ZvZ. Zergman, Savior, and Chojja at his best all have comparable ZvZ. Anytime that any of them play each other, it's always 50/50. | ||
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pOOwarrior-
United States518 Posts
On February 06 2007 17:02 Hot_Bid wrote: can we really say that these maps are T>Z anymore though? recently... Longinus OSL ro16 July > Casy MBC Survivor Nal_keke > Iris MSL Savior > Bifrost HitchHiker OSL ro16 Savior > Midas OSL ro16 Yarnc > oov OSL ro16 Zergman > Hwasin I think all of those games, the T players were significantly outplayed and that's more why they lost than the map. Also, probably the only games where the T's were known for (currently) having strong TvZ were savior vs. midas and july vs. casy (maybe hwasin, but eh, I dunno). | ||
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Purind
Canada3562 Posts
On February 06 2007 17:40 The Storyteller wrote: Actually, ever since Savior lost to Gorush, his ZvZ has improved tremendously. I think you could say he's got more than a 50/50 chance to win ZvZ. Yeah, I've seen Savior's ZvZ's over the past year, and it has been very very impressive. That's why I give him such a high chance at beating Zergman | ||
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oddeye
Canada716 Posts
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Ilikestarcraft
Korea (South)17743 Posts
Yellow[arnc] > nada I don't know hard too last time they vsed yellow[arnc] raped nada. Savior > Much Zergman > Iris. Sortof hard both dont have the best zvt or tvz yet Zergman seems to better. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
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SiZ.FaNtAsY
Korea (South)1497 Posts
FBH > Casy Just because I hate Casy now that he beat my fatzerg. Nada > Fake Yellow I hate fake yellow, simple as that. Much > Savior Much is the only protoss, he is the savior of aiur. Zergman > Iris He beat Hwasin who is gosu in TvZ, craterface will be a walk in the park. P.S - Thanks for making the post early, I nearly forgot games were today until you made it haha. | ||
Plexa
Aotearoa39261 Posts
On February 06 2007 17:02 Hot_Bid wrote: July > Casy is legitcan we really say that these maps are T>Z anymore though? recently... Longinus OSL ro16 July > Casy MBC Survivor Nal_keke > Iris MSL Savior > Bifrost HitchHiker OSL ro16 Savior > Midas OSL ro16 Yarnc > oov OSL ro16 Zergman > Hwasin Keke > iris was a product of iris being super bad at tvz Savior > Bifrost - its savior ffs not sure about the others though... anyway, voted; Casy > FBH Nada > Yarnc Sasvior > Much Zergman > iris | ||
Last Romantic
United States20667 Posts
On February 06 2007 19:52 ManaBlue wrote: Zergman, Savior, and Chojja at his best all have comparable ZvZ. Anytime that any of them play each other, it's always 50/50. Most Zs that have ever been top level have very solid ZvZ. Even those who are slumping now - YellOw, GoRush, July come to mind. GGPlay also has top ZvZ. | ||
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Ilikestarcraft
Korea (South)17743 Posts
On February 06 2007 22:02 Plexa wrote: July > Casy is legit Keke > iris was a product of iris being super bad at tvz Savior > Bifrost - its savior ffs not sure about the others though... anyway, voted; Casy > FBH Nada > Yarnc Sasvior > Much Zergman > iris Savior>midas its savior!!! And because midas choked with his double stimming and his horrible counter vs. the fast guards. Yarnc > Oov Yarnc has good Oov's card. Yarnc has good zvt while oov is slumping and played sloppy. Zergman > Hwasin iirc those early speedlings punished hwasin for being too greedy, | ||
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Malongo
Chile3479 Posts
On February 06 2007 21:29 Ace wrote: Iris is gonna beat Zergman no iris cant win tvz my prediction: casy> fbh (whats his name?) nada> yellow much> savior zergman> iris (WTF yeah go much its just a prediction!) | ||
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sOnagi[3.33]
Korea (South)886 Posts
Much<Savior Nada>Yarnc Iris<Zergman | ||
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Storchen
Sweden4385 Posts
I hope I'm wrong about the NaDa though. ZvZ always feels kinda like 50/50. I don't think Savior will have the easiest of times in a series against Zergman, which have impressive ZvZ. | ||
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ChApFoU
France2986 Posts
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Malongo
Chile3479 Posts
On February 07 2007 00:02 ChApFoU wrote: If NaDa looses to Yarnc on Arkanoid I'll sell my balls on ebay for 3 bucks ........................................................................ | ||
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ChApFoU
France2986 Posts
On February 07 2007 00:06 malongo wrote: ........................................................................ What's up ? You're interested ? Stay tuned buddy :p | ||
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tfeign
United States2980 Posts
Or Iris losing a couple tvz's and now considered horrible tvz. It's just silly. 2 games mean nothing. Any pro can win or lose 2 games to any other pro any day. Nobody should ever judged based on 2 games. The fact is, over the span of their last 30 games, Iris is exactly 50% tvz - doesn't fit the definition of horrible tvz by any means. And you don't consistently hold top 10 Kespa for a year by having horrible tvz especially in a periods where every league is swarmed with zergs. Zergman is 36% zvt in his last 30. Who's the clear favorite, it's quite simple. | ||
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Fuu
198 Posts
I dont say that especially for today, but its becoming really annoying. Every tread is the same story, and most of the time nobody agrees on this cause nobody knows the true answer. And difference of level usually can overcome the small imba of the map, if there is one. Of course some are hugely imba, but that's another story. So please... | ||
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araav
Armenia1590 Posts
On February 07 2007 00:02 ChApFoU wrote: If NaDa looses to Yarnc on Arkanoid I'll sell my balls on ebay for 3 bucks you either have huge balls to say that or you don't have at all  | ||
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SiZ.FaNtAsY
Korea (South)1497 Posts
On February 07 2007 00:24 tfeign wrote: It's funny how zergman wins a couple of zvt's and is now considered a big favorite over Iris Or Iris losing a couple tvz's and now considered horrible tvz. It's just silly. 2 games mean nothing. Any pro can win or lose 2 games to any other pro any day. Nobody should ever judged based on 2 games. The fact is, over the span of their last 30 games, Iris is exactly 50% tvz - doesn't fit the definition of horrible tvz by any means. And you don't hold top 10 Kespa for a year by having a horrible tvz especially in a periods where every league is swarmed with zergs. Zergman is 36% zvt. Who's the clear favorite, it's quite simple. I agree you on this, however..... Sometimes just 2 games do count, even one game counts to bring a player back from the dead, and let them ride the momentum to win more games. It may look like 2 loss is nothing, but that may affect the player's morale and momentum, so even though overall result is important, I think two or even one game is important too. Again this may be a bad example since he didn't make it to round of 8 of this thread, Julyzerg after a win vs Xellos in an imporant match up in the proleagus finals helped him get a momentum and dominate Oov, the MSL survivor, the wildcards for OSL, and he showed really good performance agaisnt Casy too, almost coming for a comeback in game 1(although all these opponents besides Casy I think are slumping or sucky). Julyzerg has comeback to life in my opinion ^^. So Iris who lost to Gorush, who has terrible builds lately, and Zergman who beat Hwasin TvZ gosu, I think this will give Zergman confidence and the momentum to beat Iris. So although what you are saying is totally right about the larger picture, you should see the smaller ones too, like the 2 silly games, because soon they will become the larger picture ^^. Sorry for making this so fucking long. | ||
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