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On April 11 2013 01:41 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2013 01:37 vrok wrote:
Extremely disappointed that Jaedong is going for NA instead of KR. It's a disgrace. He is on an NA team with NA sponsors, I wonder why he decided to go to NA? I wonder why?
That doesn't make it any less of a disgrace.
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I wonder whether Diablo 3 or this is a bigger lesson for Blizzard. They somehow managed to make the most pointless (ironically) system conceivable. I sure hope there are some serious revisions for 2014's.
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On April 11 2013 01:51 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2013 01:48 govie wrote:On April 11 2013 01:43 Swords wrote:On April 11 2013 01:32 MstrJinbo wrote:On April 11 2013 01:27 Plansix wrote:On April 11 2013 01:21 geokilla wrote:On April 11 2013 01:15 Plansix wrote:On April 11 2013 01:12 TOdesKaMpF wrote:
yay!!!!!!!!!!! no one from NA will even be able to play in WCS NA :DDD
good job blizzard, good fucking job.
After your 16 invited NA pro's get slaughtered MLG will be hosting WCS Korea 2.0
Well this isn't the open bracket at MLG and the players are going to know their match ups well in advance, unlike MLG. There are NA players that can take down the players on this list in a best of 5. There is a little hope. But only a little. Who in NA can take down a KR player? Only person I can think of is NA with a KR background. Scarlett is staying in Korea I believe so that's one top NA gone. Demulism has beat Nestea and given a number of Koreans a run for their money at MLGs. Idra has beaten MC in the past and does very well in the GSL format. Those are the only two of the top of my head, but other players may surprise us when they know who to prepare for. Lets not forget scarlet, goswser and Suppy. QXC all killed IM a while back in GSTL. Even Incontrol won best of threes agains koreans. NA players are certainly capable of taking series off Koreans. They certainly are, but think about how Scarlett/Suppy/Gowser got onto the scene in the first place. Gowser and Suppy came up through the open bracket at MLG and Scarlett qualified for IPL via a playhem and then beat a Korean B-Teamer and took a game off of Oz. With the new WCS in place it makes it much harder for players like these to get any recognition and support to continue their careers. Obviously everyone wants to watch the highest quality starcraft, but there's a reason for region locking and why you see it in every single sport. The reason is not having a region lock can severely inhibit growth. NA and EU players who are working hard to be the best in their region now essentially have to compete with the creme of the crop of another region. To get better one has to take baby steps - when you start playing basketball they don't throw you on the court with an NBA team and say "good luck", you work your way through a system where you play evenly matched opponents and then you get to move on if you're better than these opponents. Fuck, it's the same way leagues and MMR work on ladder. LOL all zergs.... Blizzard should just imba-op-patch zerg again because this is never gonna happen in the current hots! (except for scarlet, she got game). Suppy is bad ass and rocked before the era of Zerg. Gowser is pretty good, though I have not seen his play recently.
Yes, they are pretty good and have competed fairly well against the best, but that was in WOL. HOTS is different ballgame.
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On April 11 2013 01:48 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:Now that kespa, mlg and blizz work all together, there won't be much of problem I think. They'll reschedule.
If they reschedule for EG-TL, they might have to start recheduling for MVP, LG-IM and Axiom-Acer players ( possible GSTL conflict ). The whole WCS was designed to eliminate the need of such rescheduling - if some players choosed a region where they cant be due to commitment in other region - then its their fault.
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Sweet, WCS NA is now GSL. Blizzard has effectively killed the NA scene in my opinion by allowing this many Koreans to play in NA.
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On April 11 2013 01:45 Enchanted wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2013 01:27 BeyondCtrL wrote:On April 11 2013 01:07 Miss_Foxy wrote:On April 11 2013 00:46 vesicular wrote:
Does nobody else realize that almost half of that NA list is EG-TL players? And that EG-TL players doing well is NA is great for teams like EG as a whole and TL, the site you're f'n POSTING on?
The stupidity of this forum is impressive to say the least. Lol, just noticed that too. As long as people are thinking entirely on the present and near future about their biases and wallets, stupid outcries like this are always bound to happen. I'm pretty sure every NA pro had a raging boner that was immediately killed because they realized that they might actually have to compete for prize money. Once their perceived injury has been accepted through all the stages of grief they will realize that this is very good news for the long term. Blizzard didn't owe anyone anything of this scale, nor the money they injected into it. What makes NA/EU players more entitled to this money when they weren't really winning any of the big tournaments anyway? If this hadn't been done as it is Koreans would keep widening the gap until it became BW 2.0, and then no one would have any chance and SC2 would become a Seoul centered niche attraction. Just because they can't cash in asap obviously means that it has already failed and that their is no hope, /s. True, the short term does not alleviate the immediate concerns, but in the end the outcome will hopefully reveal a much more internationally competitive and sustainable endeavor. Immediate and strict region locks would actually kill that off and it might be decades, if ever, until the 2nd rate NA/EU scenes might even take a single game off a KR in Global Finals. Blizzard has stated, numerous times very clearly that they intend to transition into fully region locked offline only tournaments. I already shared my view on why this is significantly beneficial. If these pros are suggesting that they might as well retire because of the WCS system, then they should have done it a year ago. But looking at the prize distribution of these regional WCS it seems to me that these foreigners have a greater chance of winning more money more often than they have this entire past year. Subjective bias is always present and constant, and the level of idiotic statements reflect that. How the fuck are people that aren't pro in NA supposed to beat these players ? These players can afford to practice 10 hours a day in team houses where they don't need to worry about paying bills or even cooking food or cleaning because they have a maid that does it. If you try to play 10 hours a day in NA you can't because NA doesn't have the infrastructure that Korea has, you don't have a team backing you or a job for money you're gonna starve trying to keep up with the Koreans that are farming NA for money. I think your idea is great that the people who can't keep up in the scene should just retire and people that can't break through because they have zero opportunities to shine and have to play against players that can practice 10 hours a day without worrying about anything else. Instead of growing the NA scene we're just gonna slowly see it die out, sure there will be a few pros left that have the teams so they can practice but no one else is going to make it.
Ok, let's say WCS wasn't announced and Blizzard did nothing to change the status quo. What then? Oh right, and I'm going to quote you: "Instead of growing the NA scene we're just gonna slowly see it die out, sure there will be a few pros left that have the teams so they can practice but no one else is going to make it."
Long run
Long term
Ostensibly bad
Eventually good
"How the fuck are people that aren't pro in NA supposed to beat these players ? These players can afford to practice 10 hours a day in team houses where they don't need to worry about paying bills or even cooking food or cleaning because they have a maid that does it." - Blizzard wants to make this a reality. To expect that it will happen in 5 months? Please, have realistic expectations. I don't want to explain something I've already written in this thread so I kindly ask you, for my sake, to read my earlier post: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=407158¤tpage=56#1113
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Don't worry stephano will save NA from the Korean invasion
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On April 11 2013 01:27 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2013 01:21 geokilla wrote:On April 11 2013 01:15 Plansix wrote:On April 11 2013 01:12 TOdesKaMpF wrote:
yay!!!!!!!!!!! no one from NA will even be able to play in WCS NA :DDD
good job blizzard, good fucking job.
After your 16 invited NA pro's get slaughtered MLG will be hosting WCS Korea 2.0
Well this isn't the open bracket at MLG and the players are going to know their match ups well in advance, unlike MLG. There are NA players that can take down the players on this list in a best of 5. There is a little hope. But only a little. Who in NA can take down a KR player? Only person I can think of is NA with a KR background. Scarlett is staying in Korea I believe so that's one top NA gone. Demulism has beat Nestea and given a number of Koreans a run for their money at MLGs. Idra has beaten MC in the past and does very well in the GSL format. Those are the only two of the top of my head, but other players may surprise us when they know who to prepare for.
Isn't Demuslim British? Says so on Liquipedia... Not NA.
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If you people actually believe people like suppy, demuslim, idra, and any other "NA" pro has a chance to get through any of these koreans, let alone beating more than one of them you are very very very wrong about the state of things in sc2
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On April 11 2013 01:52 vrok wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2013 01:41 Plansix wrote:On April 11 2013 01:37 vrok wrote:
Extremely disappointed that Jaedong is going for NA instead of KR. It's a disgrace. He is on an NA team with NA sponsors, I wonder why he decided to go to NA? I wonder why? That doesn't make it any less of a disgrace.
What if his sponsors/teams asked him to do so? I'm not sure you want to be questioning the competitive spirit and drive of JaeDong.
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On April 11 2013 01:54 geokilla wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2013 01:27 Plansix wrote:On April 11 2013 01:21 geokilla wrote:On April 11 2013 01:15 Plansix wrote:On April 11 2013 01:12 TOdesKaMpF wrote:
yay!!!!!!!!!!! no one from NA will even be able to play in WCS NA :DDD
good job blizzard, good fucking job.
After your 16 invited NA pro's get slaughtered MLG will be hosting WCS Korea 2.0
Well this isn't the open bracket at MLG and the players are going to know their match ups well in advance, unlike MLG. There are NA players that can take down the players on this list in a best of 5. There is a little hope. But only a little. Who in NA can take down a KR player? Only person I can think of is NA with a KR background. Scarlett is staying in Korea I believe so that's one top NA gone. Demulism has beat Nestea and given a number of Koreans a run for their money at MLGs. Idra has beaten MC in the past and does very well in the GSL format. Those are the only two of the top of my head, but other players may surprise us when they know who to prepare for. Isn't Demuslim British? Says so on Liquipedia... Not NA.
He lives in the US and is on a US team, and according to yesterdays ItG, has spent a lot of time and money on getting a US work permit. His being British doesn't really have anything to do with it.
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On April 11 2013 01:54 geokilla wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2013 01:27 Plansix wrote:On April 11 2013 01:21 geokilla wrote:On April 11 2013 01:15 Plansix wrote:On April 11 2013 01:12 TOdesKaMpF wrote:
yay!!!!!!!!!!! no one from NA will even be able to play in WCS NA :DDD
good job blizzard, good fucking job.
After your 16 invited NA pro's get slaughtered MLG will be hosting WCS Korea 2.0
Well this isn't the open bracket at MLG and the players are going to know their match ups well in advance, unlike MLG. There are NA players that can take down the players on this list in a best of 5. There is a little hope. But only a little. Who in NA can take down a KR player? Only person I can think of is NA with a KR background. Scarlett is staying in Korea I believe so that's one top NA gone. Demulism has beat Nestea and given a number of Koreans a run for their money at MLGs. Idra has beaten MC in the past and does very well in the GSL format. Those are the only two of the top of my head, but other players may surprise us when they know who to prepare for. Isn't Demuslim British? Says so on Liquipedia... Not NA.
I think you need to take a geography class, bro. Where I'm from, I got to pick where I'm from. I think Demuslim picked the Euro region last year. See, this year, he's one of us. NA. Play your cards right and Demuslim might be reppin w/e region you're from next season.
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On April 11 2013 01:53 Dexington wrote:
Sweet, WCS NA is now GSL. Blizzard has effectively killed the NA scene in my opinion by allowing this many Koreans to play in NA.
well the coffin door was already shut. this was just the last nail.
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At the end of the day, what's important to me is that the best players have the opportunity to have the best results. Koreans are the best at starcraft anyway. They make sacrifices and they have dedication.
Anyway, as far as I can tell, nothing prevents the creation of tournaments and leagues on top of the Blizzard one. Maybe we'll see EU and NA locked tournaments
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After reading the statements of the team-owners i have to wonder what the fuck blizzard is doing. This first season looks like a major clusterfuck. It looks so rushed that i have to wonder who is responsible for such a shitty job.
And no this is not their first wcs season. Its their second one and it seems that they forgot anything about it, or fired the guy who was responsible for the planning of last years event, because i cant believe the same person would do such a shitty job after doing a very sucessfull season 1.
I wont even go into the tournament format itself, but not beeing able to present a finished tournament format with all the information on the day of the annoucement is amateurish and not giving the players and teams the information they require to make good decisions, that could influence their success for a long time period is retarded. Blizzard starts to make even KESPA look good in comparison, which is a joke.
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On April 11 2013 01:51 Adreme wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2013 01:47 Beakyboo wrote:On April 11 2013 01:40 Adreme wrote:On April 11 2013 01:28 Beakyboo wrote:
People are overreacting so hard to this. At least half the tournament is guaranteed to be north american players still. That's giving more than plenty of opportunity for foreigners to succeed in WCS. How much more can you really ask for? An all north american tournament would just suck. Winning it would carry so little weight without Koreans, and it'd be impossible to justify a large prize pool. This system seems like a great compromise. It's totally possible for a foreigner to win, and anyone with an invite has huge incentive to put a lot of effort into this. That's not even the part I care that much about. I care about the fact that all the players on that list now will not be competing in anymore GSL/OSL this year after this one and many including this one because of region lock. It just seems silly to weaken the premier SC2 event in order to create a new one with less players in it. It weakens the individual leagues in some sense by dispersing the players, but the best players from each league will all still come together in the season finals. I don't think it's so bad in that sense. GSL's already so strong that this doesn't really hurt it. We still have a single tournament with all the best players. That's what WCS is. GSL is a regular event that is on most nights. WCS season finals and the grand finals at Blizzcon are multi day events like MLG. I enjoy dedicating a weekend to watching MLG but I also enjoy sitting down for a few hours and watching the GSL knowing that I can count on my fingers the amount of top level players that aren't either in it or trying to get in it. Now I cant do that because a massive chunk of the talent has been cut out and the games will suffer as a result.
You exaggerate so much though. A massive chunk? GSL is still far and away the most stacked tournament. So far it's like all of 5 people leaving code A and 3 in code S that are confirmed to be moving over. Most of the Koreans changing regions aren't even in code A right now. I can't imagine this actually ruining GSL for you.
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oh and let me also add that these are just the koreans on big teams that are getting announced. When the NA registration for wcs opens on friday I bet we will be seeing even MORE koreans competing for our spots :D
b teamers, code A players, code a/s dropouts and more! woohoo!
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Honestly, who from NA could even compete? This isn't a great loss. Sorry if that seems blunt or harsh but it's the truth. This will put additional uber-talent into the final bracket which I am absolutely 100% fine with. I have no desire to see regional players just because I'm from the US. I want to see the finest players in the world.
Can't wait to watch. <3
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On April 11 2013 01:53 rename wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2013 01:48 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:Now that kespa, mlg and blizz work all together, there won't be much of problem I think. They'll reschedule. If they reschedule for EG-TL, they might have to start recheduling for MVP, LG-IM and Axiom-Acer players ( possible GSTL conflict ). The whole WCS was designed to eliminate the need of such rescheduling - if some players choosed a region where they cant be due to commitment in other region - then its their fault.
It's not your fault when your forced to choose a region without knowing any details about when it's played nor how the prize money will be distributed.
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HOOLY SHIT! this is wayyy more than I expected!!!
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EPT
