EPTOn January 22 2013 01:30 Grettin wrote:
Slasher on twitter, few days ago:
I haven't seen any statement yet.
Slasher on twitter, few days ago:
I haven't seen any statement yet.
Can't wait for the interview
Destiny: Own3d paying streamers late, not fulfilling contr…
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llIH
Norway2147 Posts
Can't wait for the interview | ||
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Targe
United Kingdom14103 Posts
On January 22 2013 01:30 Grettin wrote: Slasher on twitter, few days ago: I haven't seen any statement yet. Neither :/ anyone heard anything? | ||
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Grettin
42411 Posts
Nothing yet. | ||
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megid
Brazil142 Posts
On January 18 2013 11:10 Fionn wrote: I never used Own3d. I have a rule that I don't trust companies that use leet speak. It's a rule that most of the world should follow. Valve owns Dota 2 and they use "pwn" all the time in game :x | ||
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Titio
France237 Posts
On January 21 2013 03:20 Innovation wrote: I am Sr. Manager of analytics for one of the worlds largest advertising agencies. It's my job to know how this all works. Despite your uninformed opinion streaming is in fact a lucrative job for those that have a decent audience. A streamer with the average viewership of Destiny with a decent rev-share agreement can make about 50K (gross) a year streaming about 4 hours per day every day. Even at 7 days a week that's a decent living for just a 28 hour work week. (Numbers based upon average of 2K viewership & 4 ad breaks per hour with 3 ads per break and a 2$ cpm rev-share agreement which amounts to approximately 6.7% of what the site is likely making from him) If Destiny is not being paid for several months of work or more that means he's easily lost thousands of dollars which is a big deal. Even though I'm not a big fan of his antics, I wouldn't wish this upon anyone trying to make a living the best way they know how. As I have significant influence in where billions of ad dollars are spent every year I can assure you that if this turns out to be true Own3d will lose significant revenue via the loss of my accounts. Interesting but fairly incomplete point of view - being in this business, surely you must know it's more complicated than that. You're assuming a constant fill rate all over the year, no capping on the campaigns and not taking into account the GEOs viewers come from. And let's not forget advertising being a highly periodic business. September to December, ad money sure is there. January to May? Not that much. My (educated) guess is that own3d.tv is no evil, it's just a start-up company struggling to keep alive : bandwidth/servers (but mostly bandwidth) costs probably have jumped skyrocket, and they don't have enough sales power to bring in enough cash to sustain the business - their margin being cut deep by revshare deals they had to strike with streamers so as not to fall too far behind twitch. Well, they probably can't pay their employees AND bandwidth at all at the moment - I wouldn't expect rev share money to be paid anytime soon  | ||
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Grettin
42411 Posts
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Caihead
Canada8550 Posts
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garbodor
269 Posts
On January 24 2013 10:26 Caihead wrote: Just as a side note, I find it annoying and / or disgusting that you have to preface factual evidence with a popular or controversial person's name to attract attention in this community. .. Destiny is the person that brought most of this to the public's eye? | ||
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Williammm
Australia908 Posts
On January 23 2013 00:25 megid wrote: Valve owns Dota 2 and they use "pwn" all the time in game :x and look at how Dota 2 is doing in terms of popularity  | ||
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GenoPewPew
United States347 Posts
On January 24 2013 10:44 Williammm wrote: and look at how Dota 2 is doing in terms of popularity Doing great lol | ||
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Caihead
Canada8550 Posts
On January 24 2013 10:42 garbodor wrote: .. Destiny is the person that brought most of this to the public's eye? And other organizations have already said similar things? Some even before this? Some of which is linked directly in this thread? | ||
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gamerdude12345
Korea (South)378 Posts
On January 23 2013 00:25 megid wrote: Valve owns Dota 2 and they use "pwn" all the time in game :x Have you ever played DotA? It's been saying "x has pwn x head" for quite a few years now, 2004 or 2005 I think. DOTA2 is a 1:1 port so it's to be expected to have it in there. | ||
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Badinoff
15 Posts
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Grettin
42411 Posts
On January 25 2013 03:11 Badinoff wrote: Naniwa just tweeted that Own3d is shutting down in 2 weeks, and that he's still owed $500 from 2011. No source on the shutdown yet. https://twitter.com/NaNiwaSC2/status/294503454347497472 I think this was because of Slasher was talking about it in Lo3 last night. He did say something about couple of weeks and how Machinima was close to make a deal with Own3d/buying Own3d or something. You can listen the bit, VoD's out in the OneMoreGameTV's chnnel. | ||
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TriZen
England219 Posts
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Grettin
42411 Posts
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Canucklehead
Canada5074 Posts
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cabosetv
United States14 Posts
There is probably, if the corporation is smart, jurisdictional clauses within the contract which make it a pain in the ass. These clauses stipulated any claims arising out of the contract will be subject to X state/city laws and will heard only in X city. So for instance, you live in Europe or Florida or wherever you call home, but the contract with Own3d has a jurisdictional clause stating any claims have to be filled in San Francisco county court, then you would have to file your claim in SF. Thus it may not be worth it. You can also have an attorney write up a demand letter, usually $100-$300 depending. A demand letter involves an attorney applying legal analysis to the situation and demanding the company either pay or do whatever in accordance to the agreement. The threat of litigation can sometimes be enough. There are different avenues you can take. Arbitration is another remedy and is usually inexpensive. There are also forums of binding Arbitration. (Like those court shows you see on TV, nothing more then fancy binding arbitration). Instead of doing nothing, you can research the legal remedies available and do something, rather then complaining about how expensive an attorney is. Almost ALL states have a Bar association where you can get a reference and free consultation with an attorney. He may not view your contract but you can go over the situation with him and see what they have to say. I am going back to reading Property law now but I hope I helped out someone who reads this. | ||
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Innovation
United States284 Posts
Interesting but fairly incomplete point of view - being in this business, surely you must know it's more complicated than that. You're assuming a constant fill rate all over the year, no capping on the campaigns and not taking into account the GEOs viewers come from. And let's not forget advertising being a highly periodic business. September to December, ad money sure is there. January to May? Not that much. My (educated) guess is that own3d.tv is no evil, it's just a start-up company struggling to keep alive : bandwidth/servers (but mostly bandwidth) costs probably have jumped skyrocket, and they don't have enough sales power to bring in enough cash to sustain the business - their margin being cut deep by revshare deals they had to strike with streamers so as not to fall too far behind twitch. Well, they probably can't pay their employees AND bandwidth at all at the moment - I wouldn't expect rev share money to be paid anytime soon While you are correct there are many other factors the post was clearly not meant to provide an in-depth analysis but simply to give people an approximation of the potential. Also, own3d does not rely on only direct sales to fill it's inventory but also uses a multitude of network, exchange, DSP/DMP which almost guarantees 100% fill rate. Also you'd be surprised how many campaigns still do not cap, it's pretty sad. Either way the debate is not about minor reconciliation variances about what a streamer thinks he/she should be getting and what they are receiving; it's about own3d not honoring its contracts and not paying at all. Its becoming clear that they are having issues and I'm not surprised that revshare agreements are the first to lose out but it still doesn't make it right for the streamers who unfortunately are relying on that money to put food on the table. If own3d is essentially going out of business than it doesn't much matter if agencies pressure them to fulfill their contracts but if own3d is getting purchased than the new organization will have to honor the contracts and the streamers will get paid but unfortunately very late. The best scenario for the streamers in this case if for own3d to be purchased by another healthy organization. | ||
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Grettin
42411 Posts
Earlier today rumours had been circulating that Own3d TV, the gaming focused streaming resource that had been embroiled in a long standing battle with Twitch TV, would be closing within two weeks. After speaking to our sources we can confirm this to be the case. Our anonymous sources close to the situation told us that it was "absolutely true" that Own3d TV would be closing in the next week or so and that they cannot pay the debts they owe and if they liquidate and if advertisers don't pay their streamer contracts that clears them of obligation to pay streamer revenue. They told us following: "After a buy-out fell through one week ago it looks like time is up for own3D who will be announcing the end of their operation in the coming days. Due diligence began in early November for Machinima to buy own3D for a price of five million dollars including debts, however due to a slipping position since that time this deal fell through on Wednesday 16th, last week. Having already failed to raise a venture capital round last summer, Own3D now plan to announce the end of all operations within one week." http://www.cadred.org/News/Article/191800/ Slasher on Twitter: Sources confirm to me the same details as Cadred is reporting. Curse to switch to Twitch, other organizations looking at options now. Good riddance, Own3d. | ||
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