No one else has posted this, so figured I would go ahead and do it.
The IPL has interviewed Marcus "djWHEAT" Graham about his experiences in the last 11 years of eSports, and where he thinks the future is heading. Topics include the Championship Gaming Series, not being in "a bubble", and how the different competitive gaming communities including Starcraft, League of Legends, Halo and Street Fighter should be less segregated, and respect each other more to fight for the same goals. "Hey guys, It's not just about your game. This is all bigger."
This is only Part 1, with Part 2 coming soon, I would think.
This is fucking awesome. It especially makes me feel all good and bubbly inside since I knew Wheat from when he casted Quake 3 . Thanks for posting! It reminds me of his reply to Milkis' rant on reddit. Very encompassing of esports as a whole and saying how it isn't just about SC or some other single game. It's about all of them.
Wow, some really nice points here by Wheat. I mean, it's nothing new, but it's always good to see the big names go out and try to work against the incessent flood of "x game is worse than y game".
And what Rekrul said, damn Wheat, you good at interviews, really giving e-sports a good face to the "outside", well on you
Who is the interviewer for this I wonder? Seems like a few good questions in there.
I like how everyone always runs to Marcus for these answers, like he is the Gandalf Grey of eSports or something.
Would be nice to do an eSports History series with a few people along with Marcus though, maybe get Carmac, Slasher, SirScoots, Jason Lake, Torbull, Hwanni, etc, in the mix. Would be an interesting panel to interview and have discuss the past 10 to 15 years of eSports.
There are so many interesting stories from other games and scenes. I mean, when was the last time you heard someone discuss the name ICECLIMBERS or Immortal (the person, not the unit)? I know I can't remember.
Anyway, can't wait for part 2, seems a little short though?
Instant nerd chills in the first 5 seconds, sick interview, can't wait for part 2. DJWheat is such an amazing figure within esports, he has been here every since the start and he'll stick around all the way down the road.
DjWheat is the father of esports honestly. I remember back when he was with Team Sportscast Network with games like return to castle wolfenstein For many that was the first glimpse of true esports, it had tons of followers. No video streaming then, just casting audio.
On February 06 2012 19:49 Avean wrote: DjWheat is the father of esports honestly. I remember back when he was with Team Sportscast Network with games like return to castle wolfenstein For many that was the first glimpse of true esports, it had tons of followers. No video streaming then, just casting audio.
Oh man I remember the times of Enemy Territory at its hight, you'd tune into ETTV then load up a shoutcast stream with winamp and use some plugins to match the audio with the video, they'd give like countdowns so people could get synced, then watch some badass teamplay (idle, parodia, gunslingers, dsky etc) and insane aim (mystic, mAus, ferus..). That was pretty epic. Kinda sad streaming wasn't where it is now back then, maybe that community would have grown more. Filling a 1000 slot ETTV server was like whoah, and some biggest finals could maybe get 2.5k or something. Now with streaming there stuff like LoL finals getting 220k viewers and just eu tournament finals near 100k. Insane.
I like wheat but I can't help but feel a little hypocrisy from the way he talks about playing nice with other games. This isn't an issue with him in particular, but pretty much all of the big name personalities. How can you tell people to respect League of Legends and Halo while at the same time completely ignoring Starcraft BW or treating it like some nostalgic fossil? It's like "Yeah support these other games, except for the one in direct competition with the one I work with."
On February 06 2012 18:09 boaecho wrote: I hated him when they tried to get him to cast Street Fighter...he knew absolutely nothing. Ruined the whole SF tournament for me :/
How hard can it be to say "salt," "blown up," "free," "downloaded," and "good read" as frequently as possible?
djWHEAT is awesome but I will never agree with the "let's all come together" stance he has about gaming. Different games are as different as different sports and people will like one and dislike the other and argue which one is the best.
On February 06 2012 20:40 pezit wrote: djWHEAT is awesome but I will never agree with the "let's all come together" stance he has about gaming. Different games are as different as different sports and people will like one and dislike the other and argue which one is the best.
I agree, that's why I never got this "eSports" thing, I just wanna watch SC2.
wheat is a strong promoter for eSports, but credit also goes to ign. they did a great job with the editing of the video, underlaying wheats words with great footage. well done!
On February 06 2012 20:40 pezit wrote: djWHEAT is awesome but I will never agree with the "let's all come together" stance he has about gaming. Different games are as different as different sports and people will like one and dislike the other and argue which one is the best.
I agree, that's why I never got this "eSports" thing, I just wanna watch SC2.
That's the point. You don't have to watch LoL or SF4 or Bejeweled or whatever. But don't shit on it; respect it. Because if that game grows, SC2 grows indirectly.
StarCraft 2 alone can't fill a stadium by itself, at least not for a long time. Now imagine if there's LoL and fighting game and Counter Strike fans in the same stadium, and we watch MVP vs NesTea after Fnatic plays SK.
On February 06 2012 20:15 BrosephBrostar wrote: I like wheat but I can't help but feel a little hypocrisy from the way he talks about playing nice with other games. This isn't an issue with him in particular, but pretty much all of the big name personalities. How can you tell people to respect League of Legends and Halo while at the same time completely ignoring Starcraft BW or treating it like some nostalgic fossil? It's like "Yeah support these other games, except for the one in direct competition with the one I work with."
On February 06 2012 18:09 boaecho wrote: I hated him when they tried to get him to cast Street Fighter...he knew absolutely nothing. Ruined the whole SF tournament for me :/
How hard can it be to say "salt," "blown up," "free," "downloaded," and "good read" as frequently as possible?
Another SC2 vs BW comment - djWheat has never trashed BW - he only calls out BW elitists
On February 06 2012 20:40 pezit wrote: djWHEAT is awesome but I will never agree with the "let's all come together" stance he has about gaming. Different games are as different as different sports and people will like one and dislike the other and argue which one is the best.
He never said to go and watch the games you don't want to see - merely, don't go about dis-respecting other games. For instance, don't go about making posts comparing games (e.g. like some BW-elitists are prone to doing). As an example of what SC2 fans are doing, I've seen many posts mocking LoL as a competitive game.
On February 06 2012 20:15 BrosephBrostar wrote: I like wheat but I can't help but feel a little hypocrisy from the way he talks about playing nice with other games. This isn't an issue with him in particular, but pretty much all of the big name personalities. How can you tell people to respect League of Legends and Halo while at the same time completely ignoring Starcraft BW or treating it like some nostalgic fossil? It's like "Yeah support these other games, except for the one in direct competition with the one I work with."
On February 06 2012 18:09 boaecho wrote: I hated him when they tried to get him to cast Street Fighter...he knew absolutely nothing. Ruined the whole SF tournament for me :/
How hard can it be to say "salt," "blown up," "free," "downloaded," and "good read" as frequently as possible?
Another SC2 vs BW comment - djWheat has never trashed BW - he only calls out BW elitists
I'm not saying he trashed it, I'm saying that he basically doesn't acknowledge its existence.
But don't shit on it; respect it. Because if that game grows, SC2 grows indirectly.
But is that really true? Counterstrike and quake and broodwar don't seem to be growing with sc2 they seem to be dieing.
In the past we've had no problem getting sponsors and partners excited about the featured games we ran on the circuit. This year however people are taking a longer look at last years title performance on a case by case basis. Meaning everyone wants to be associated with the title they see the most potential around. Unfortunately that has left us scrambling to find the resources to run a full line up.
We're working around the clock to try and find support for the games we think need to be on the circuit but time isn't on our side.
Sounds like halo is having trouble getting sponsors because sc2 and LoL are taking all of them. Shouldn't it be growing with sc2 if what you said is true? What if in the future all the sponsors decide LoL gives more ROI than sc2 because of the viewer numbers are you sure sc2 will grow with a bigger game instead of being crushed by it?
On February 06 2012 20:40 pezit wrote: djWHEAT is awesome but I will never agree with the "let's all come together" stance he has about gaming. Different games are as different as different sports and people will like one and dislike the other and argue which one is the best.
He never said to go and watch the games you don't want to see - merely, don't go about dis-respecting other games. For instance, don't go about making posts comparing games (e.g. like some BW-elitists are prone to doing). As an example of what SC2 fans are doing, I've seen many posts mocking LoL as a competitive game.
As coolcor pointed out I don't believe SC2 grows with LoL at all, the industry as a whole might grow but not SC2. And while someone like djWHEAT or an organization profits regardless of which game is popular I don't because I think some games are just garbage, just like I think some sports are garbage.
i respect wheat, i respect what he has done for esports,and i also respect that hes trying to get viewers to watch other games. However i can see why wheat would want such a thing, because his career would benefit on any esport game. However for me i only like to watch Starcraft 2 and Street Fighter, everything else just does not hold my interest at all. So with that said i not sure why wheat is trying to get ppl to cross watch games. People will only watch what they interested in seeing.
Really awesome and well-worded interview, can't wait for part 2. I wholeheartedly agree that different gaming communities should at least respect each other (how can we expect society not to frown upon us gamers if we ourselves don't respect each other), and if they can, they should try to work together to make eSports become bigger and more wide-spread.
On February 06 2012 20:15 BrosephBrostar wrote: I like wheat but I can't help but feel a little hypocrisy from the way he talks about playing nice with other games. This isn't an issue with him in particular, but pretty much all of the big name personalities. How can you tell people to respect League of Legends and Halo while at the same time completely ignoring Starcraft BW or treating it like some nostalgic fossil? It's like "Yeah support these other games, except for the one in direct competition with the one I work with."
On February 06 2012 18:09 boaecho wrote: I hated him when they tried to get him to cast Street Fighter...he knew absolutely nothing. Ruined the whole SF tournament for me :/
How hard can it be to say "salt," "blown up," "free," "downloaded," and "good read" as frequently as possible?
Another SC2 vs BW comment - djWheat has never trashed BW - he only calls out BW elitists
I'm not saying he trashed it, I'm saying that he basically doesn't acknowledge its existence.
it doesnt exist outside korea and it was never a game he focused on, in what context would you want him to discuss it?
no one bashes bw, it just isnt relevant anymore in foreign esports.
I see this thread derailling towards the topic of appreciating other games that the one you like, and i just want to clarify something for the people that are not understanding how LoL/SF4 growing helps SC2 growing. Well it's very simple, it's all about the team.
Maybe a LoL only tournament having a lot of viewers might not seem to help the SC2 community, but thing is, it helps the teams. And guess what, the teams that have LoL rosters are the same one with the SC2, CS, DotA2 or whatever the hottest game in esports are nowadays. Each game growing is more exposure for the proffessional teams, and without the teams there is no pro-gaming. So yes, we're all in the same boat whatever game you are playing. I personally don't like LoL, i do find it's not a great game but whatever it's super successfull and rise the awareness of esports around all gamers across the globe. So whatever, it could be minesweeper i wouldn't care much, it's just good that there are games with competitive players, training hard to be on top, watched by a ton of people.
On February 06 2012 20:15 BrosephBrostar wrote: I like wheat but I can't help but feel a little hypocrisy from the way he talks about playing nice with other games. This isn't an issue with him in particular, but pretty much all of the big name personalities. How can you tell people to respect League of Legends and Halo while at the same time completely ignoring Starcraft BW or treating it like some nostalgic fossil? It's like "Yeah support these other games, except for the one in direct competition with the one I work with."
This. This interview was, while professional, pretty obvious. Sorry wheat, I'm not going to respect bejeweled, and really, I shouldn't be asked to.
EDIT:
Who cares about helping teams. Hey guys, support my company, it isn't related to starcraft but I'ma fan of starcraft and if I get more money I might have more free time to watch starcraft!
On February 06 2012 23:23 Marou wrote: I see this thread derailling towards the topic of appreciating other games that the one you like, and i just want to clarify something for the people that are not understanding how LoL/SF4 growing helps SC2 growing. Well it's very simple, it's all about the team.
Maybe a LoL only tournament having a lot of viewers might not seem to help the SC2 community, but thing is, it helps the teams. And guess what, the teams that have LoL rosters are the same one with the SC2, CS, DotA2 or whatever the hottest game in esports are nowadays. Each game growing is more exposure for the proffessional teams, and without the teams there is no pro-gaming. So yes, we're all in the same boat whatever game you are playing. I personally don't like LoL, i do find it's not a great game but whatever it's super successfull and rise the awareness of esports around all gamers across the globe. So whatever, it could be minesweeper i wouldn't care much, it's just good that there are games with competitive players, training hard to be on top, watched by a ton of people.
edit : on topic, djWheat is just amasing
It helps the teams yes and then they realize that all their interest comes from LoL and removes the SC2 team. Maybe you only care about esports as a whole but most people care about one or a few games and the people who "loves all games equally" are usually those who profit from it.
On February 06 2012 20:40 pezit wrote: djWHEAT is awesome but I will never agree with the "let's all come together" stance he has about gaming. Different games are as different as different sports and people will like one and dislike the other and argue which one is the best.
He never said to go and watch the games you don't want to see - merely, don't go about dis-respecting other games. For instance, don't go about making posts comparing games (e.g. like some BW-elitists are prone to doing). As an example of what SC2 fans are doing, I've seen many posts mocking LoL as a competitive game.
As coolcor pointed out I don't believe SC2 grows with LoL at all, the industry as a whole might grow but not SC2. And while someone like djWHEAT or an organization profits regardless of which game is popular I don't because I think some games are just garbage, just like I think some sports are garbage.
It's about industry health. With more titles proving to be sustainable it creates trust. The very same trust general business and society builds upon. If it weren't for CS, Quake, SC:BW and WC3, there wouldn't be SC2.
There wouldn't have been existing organizations knowing how to run tournaments and leagues, regardless of the game. There wouldn't have been MLG, DH, IEM and GOM. Their experience is derived from developing different scenes, making different errors and learning from them. No matter how much you love your own game, if there is no general positive environment, chances are slim for resource-rich and knowledgeable.third parties to enter the field. One can choose to refuse outside expertise and build everything from scratch over and over again, or create an atmosphere of exchange and mutual benefit. When looking at the event coverage of Dota 2's The International, there are certainly things to learn from. Bracket display, accessibility, and live statistics.
Nobody would have created Twitch.tv for SC2 only. That's all there is to it. If Twitch really believed that SC2 will be the only game to be using their technology, the investment would not have paid off. One can choose to take the risk on himself, but fact of the matter is there are rarely individuals in possession of the funds, technology and passion to gamble on that. With a larger base of business, these risks are being alleviated, making it easier for potential investment.
On February 06 2012 19:49 Avean wrote: DjWheat is the father of esports honestly. I remember back when he was with Team Sportscast Network with games like return to castle wolfenstein For many that was the first glimpse of true esports, it had tons of followers. No video streaming then, just casting audio.
Oh man I remember the times of Enemy Territory at its hight, you'd tune into ETTV then load up a shoutcast stream with winamp and use some plugins to match the audio with the video, they'd give like countdowns so people could get synced, then watch some badass teamplay (idle, parodia, gunslingers, dsky etc) and insane aim (mystic, mAus, ferus..). That was pretty epic. Kinda sad streaming wasn't where it is now back then, maybe that community would have grown more. Filling a 1000 slot ETTV server was like whoah, and some biggest finals could maybe get 2.5k or something. Now with streaming there stuff like LoL finals getting 220k viewers and just eu tournament finals near 100k. Insane.
Yep, that was a helluva lot of fun times! Tosspot and DJWheat were great casters there!
On February 06 2012 20:15 BrosephBrostar wrote: I like wheat but I can't help but feel a little hypocrisy from the way he talks about playing nice with other games. This isn't an issue with him in particular, but pretty much all of the big name personalities. How can you tell people to respect League of Legends and Halo while at the same time completely ignoring Starcraft BW or treating it like some nostalgic fossil? It's like "Yeah support these other games, except for the one in direct competition with the one I work with."
On February 06 2012 18:09 boaecho wrote: I hated him when they tried to get him to cast Street Fighter...he knew absolutely nothing. Ruined the whole SF tournament for me :/
How hard can it be to say "salt," "blown up," "free," "downloaded," and "good read" as frequently as possible?
Another SC2 vs BW comment - djWheat has never trashed BW - he only calls out BW elitists
I'm not saying he trashed it, I'm saying that he basically doesn't acknowledge its existence.
it doesnt exist outside korea and it was never a game he focused on, in what context would you want him to discuss it?
no one bashes bw, it just isnt relevant anymore in foreign esports.
That's a pretty pessimistic way of looking at it. It's not relevant anymore because everyone stopped talking about it, even though you would think that a fan of SC2 would have more common interest in Proleague than some fps game tournament.
Also it might not have been a game he focused on but that's him in this video right?
That's a pretty pessimistic way of looking at it. It's not relevant anymore because everyone stopped talking about it, even though you would think that a fan of SC2 would have more common interest in Proleague than some fps game tournament.
Also it might not have been a game he focused on but that's him in this video right?
It's not that no foreigners watch BW anymore, or talk about it; it's that there is no foreign BW infrastructure, virtually no foreign BW tournaments, and virtually no foreign BW progamers still in existence. Compared to games like LoL, SC2, etc, it's not just small or minor, it's completely nonexistent.
Sure, you've got a nice population of people who play BW in their spare time and a smaller population of people who watch Proleague and Korean BW events (such as, for instance, myself; go Samsung KHAN!); but all of that does not a foreign BW scene make. In terms of foreign ESPORTS, BW is not on the map.
That's a pretty pessimistic way of looking at it. It's not relevant anymore because everyone stopped talking about it, even though you would think that a fan of SC2 would have more common interest in Proleague than some fps game tournament.
Also it might not have been a game he focused on but that's him in this video right?
It's not that no foreigners watch BW anymore, or talk about it; it's that there is no foreign BW infrastructure, virtually no foreign BW tournaments, and virtually no foreign BW progamers still in existence. Compared to games like LoL, SC2, etc, it's not just small or minor, it's completely nonexistent.
Sure, you've got a nice population of people who play BW in their spare time and a smaller population of people who watch Proleague and Korean BW events (such as, for instance, myself; go Samsung KHAN!); but all of that does not a foreign BW scene make. In terms of foreign ESPORTS, BW is not on the map.
Why does it matter if there's "foreign" infrastructure or not? There's basically no American presence in F1, but that doesn't mean everyone in the country should just watch NASCAR instead. To get back to the original subject, ok maybe wheat doesn't care about BW and he never mentions it along with "other games" because he thinks no one else cares, but do I really believe that? I can't help but have a suspicion that there's some kind of "don't talk about BW" prohibition among all the big name community figures because they see it as direct competition to their own business.
I have no interest in other game titles, and their growing often directly conflicts with sc2 interests. Sc2 and LoL have both taken sponsorship money from other titles, why would I want the same to happen to sc2? Good games that provide entertainment will get viewers, bad games will die out. Trying to string along the bad with the good is only going to hurt the industry. Some games have to be marginalized, go look at bowling and comPare it to a mainstream sport, they earn a pittance, and "growing" bowling doesn't help other sports, it isn't exciting and doesn't attract a huge fan base. IMO, good riddance.
On February 06 2012 20:15 BrosephBrostar wrote: I like wheat but I can't help but feel a little hypocrisy from the way he talks about playing nice with other games. This isn't an issue with him in particular, but pretty much all of the big name personalities. How can you tell people to respect League of Legends and Halo while at the same time completely ignoring Starcraft BW or treating it like some nostalgic fossil? It's like "Yeah support these other games, except for the one in direct competition with the one I work with."
This. This interview was, while professional, pretty obvious. Sorry wheat, I'm not going to respect bejeweled, and really, I shouldn't be asked to.
EDIT:
Who cares about helping teams. Hey guys, support my company, it isn't related to starcraft but I'ma fan of starcraft and if I get more money I might have more free time to watch starcraft!
The more I read these responses the more I realize that those who are willing to "accept" other games are typically from the "old school" group of eSports fans. And that's fine.
I'm not asking you to necessarily embrace and enjoy every game out there, I simply ask that people don't shit on and disrespect other games.
I don't particularly like cubing (Rubik's) but god damn do I respect the amount of skill it takes to do something like that. See how easy that is?
That's a pretty pessimistic way of looking at it. It's not relevant anymore because everyone stopped talking about it, even though you would think that a fan of SC2 would have more common interest in Proleague than some fps game tournament.
Also it might not have been a game he focused on but that's him in this video right?
yes that's me in that video. Believe it or not I've supported BW since 2003. Which is why it also boggling that you make it seem like I ignore the game. I don't push Quake 3 like I used to, but I put thousands of broadcast hours into that game over 8 years as well.
Besides, why suddenly am I the guy who has to take the reigns of BW coverage? Seems to me that there are still enough interested folks out there that someone should be doing a show or whatever. Is Day9 also to blame? His show started with BW, but moved to SC2. I don't think that means Sean is "ignoring" BW.
On February 09 2012 03:28 ThomasHobbes wrote: I have no interest in other game titles, and their growing often directly conflicts with sc2 interests. Sc2 and LoL have both taken sponsorship money from other titles, why would I want the same to happen to sc2? Good games that provide entertainment will get viewers, bad games will die out. Trying to string along the bad with the good is only going to hurt the industry. Some games have to be marginalized, go look at bowling and comPare it to a mainstream sport, they earn a pittance, and "growing" bowling doesn't help other sports, it isn't exciting and doesn't attract a huge fan base. IMO, good riddance.
You won't use a sports comparison when it helps a point, but you are quick to use it when it goes against the sport.
PRO GAMING != SPORTS
Obviously Bowling getting bigger doesn't help Gymnastics. But fucking a guys, look at our activity... we see it as a conglomerate of different games, but companies see it as just "competitive game playing". There is much more parallel growth than many of you are making it seem.
On February 06 2012 20:02 iky43210 wrote: I just don't understand this "less segregated" issue, or "esport" in general.
I shouldn't have to give a damn about baseball just because I like football.
DJWheat already explained it. Each game is a slice of a pie and as the pie gets bigger each slice gets bigger. Understand? That's why its called e-sports and not just e-sport.
Wheat is the best around. Definitely, to me at least, seems like the most genuine dude in the world.
The whole supporting (or not taking a shit on at least) other games even if you don't like them sort of comes down to trying to get esports to become more legit outside of this niche community. I play DotA2, I don't play LoL, it's just not my thing. If LoL is taking off a bit and I do nothing but shit on it I'm basically trying to sink the ship before it has a chance. Well if everyone is actively trying to destroy every other game out there none of those little boats are going to ever float and we all drown. That's really quite a stupid move. But if the S.S. League of Legends starts to make it maybe my game could be the next boat to launch.
We're just a bunch of nerds who like to play games. It's not like we have the world in our back pocket so shitting on other games is for all intents and purposes sabotage to the scene.
On February 06 2012 20:02 iky43210 wrote: I just don't understand this "less segregated" issue, or "esport" in general.
I shouldn't have to give a damn about baseball just because I like football.
Well it's a bit different, football and baseball are already established things, they don't need growth at this point just sustainability whereas esports needs to grow more to become more marketable and so they are just saying it would be nice to grow the scene as a whole.
I mean i totally understand your sentiment, the few times I've watched LoL i wanted to rip my eyeballs out of my head but if LoL grows SC can grow and get more exposure with sponsors who don't understand esports unless we keep flinging poo at each other for no reason and stunting the growth for both sides.
Esports has a ring to us that most of us enjoy. The thought of games anywhere can be enjoyed by spectators and played by gamers is amazing to us and thats why most of us are here. Lets just get a long and pretty soon the word Esports will become a household thing and if we grow enough then people might stop turning their nose up at the thought of gaming breeding serious competition.
Djwheat is very entertaining and a pretty damn genuine guy, glad to have you in e-sports
I feel that people who bash other games are trying to assert themselves as the more "pro"gamer in that their particular game requires more skill.
Ive played Fps/Rts/Mobas, every game takes its own unique skill set and should only be comparable to other players playing the same game. I have much <3 for any gamer and to each his own, I wont bash LoL since i play Hon, its just a different style of the same game that suits my particular interests more
EPT
. Thanks for posting! It reminds me of his reply to Milkis' rant on reddit. Very encompassing of esports as a whole and saying how it isn't just about SC or some other single game. It's about all of them.
For many that was the first glimpse of true esports, it had tons of followers. No video streaming then, just casting audio. 
