EPTStephanos Ladderrun - Page 25
| Forum Index > SC2 General |
|
arQ
1033 Posts
| ||
|
Blasphemi
United Kingdom980 Posts
| ||
|
Kevan
Sweden2303 Posts
On September 26 2011 18:59 arQ wrote: No one says that Stephano isn't a fantastic player. It is just as simple as the fact that recently he has not destroyed people in a big "LAN" tournament. Therefore it's not really easy to say how truly great he is. Now if he would go and win say IPL 3, there would be no question that he is the best foreign player atm. Pretty much this. IPL 3 is a chance for him to prove himself against the best on LAN which is what matters the most. | ||
|
Velr
Switzerland10924 Posts
I mean.. You put 6+ high quality Koreans into a tournament like MLG (and some of them are really TOP Koreans). Now look at MLG: Incontrol/Machine are still seeded in group play, both of them seem to win like nothing... But they are still some of the best players in MLG. Tyler/Slush/Drewbie "winning" the open brackets, where else have they done good? Basically only these open brackets... Because at an MLG there are some of the best players... At any other "big events" they seem to drop out as early as possible... Now what does this tell you about the Player pool at an average MLG? Seriously, there are just not that many absolute top Foreigners there because there are nearly no NA based top foreigners. No wonder the Koreans take Top 1-X... At most MLG's there are only like 3-4 players that really can bring it to them because there are only very few absolute top foreigners attending MLG's atm (I hope that changes  )...Comparison? IEM/Assembly/Valencia... Killer dropped out in the group stages. Nada/Huk also went out pretty early. Puma dropped a series to Mana (and a game to Stephano...), Thorzain won against Hero and fell 2/3 to DRG... Yes, Koreans still won most of these events, but they never made like a ridiculous 1-X or more finish because the competition is just better. | ||
|
Blasphemi
United Kingdom980 Posts
On September 26 2011 19:05 Velr wrote: Koreans are not "allways" just winning (Assembly/IEM). I mean.. You put 6+ high quality Koreans into a tournament like MLG (and some of them are really TOP Koreans). Now look at MLG: Incontrol/Machine are still seeded in group play, both of them seem to win like nothing... But they are still some of the best players in MLG. Tyler/Slush/Drewbie "winning" the open brackets, where else have they done good? Basically only these open brackets... Because at an MLG there are some of the best players... At any other "big events" they seem to drop out as early as possible... Now what does this tell you about the Player pool at an average MLG? Seriously, there are just not that many absolute top Foreigners there because there are nearly no NA based top foreigners. No wonder the Koreans take Top 1-X... At most MLG's there are only like 3-4 players that really can bring it to them because there are only very few absolute top foreigners attending MLG's atm (I hope that changes )...Comparison? IEM/Assembly/Valencia... Killer dropped out in the group stages. Nada/Huk also went out pretty early. Puma dropped a series to Mana (and a game to Stephano...), Thorzain won against Hero and fell 2/3 to DRG... Yes, Koreans still won most of these events, but they never made like a ridiculous 1-X or more finish because the competition is just better. Dreamhack Summer - 3 Koreans in the top 4. Other guy trains in Korea long term. Dreamhack Invitational - MC wins as the only Korean. Dreamhack Valencia - DRG wins. Three Koreans in attendence. two make the top four. Assembly Summer - One Korean, he does crap. Copenhagen Games - MC wins, two Koreans in attendence. IEM 2010 - Korean top three. Three Koreans in attendence. IEM 2011 - Korean top two. Threee Koreans in attendence. Koreans have still dominated EU Lans. | ||
|
Phenrock
United Kingdom132 Posts
Koreans have been dominating the ipl qualifiers regardless of the time difference. I bet it scared a lot of foreigners away, I was applauding any foreigner who registered. Only a few could compete against them, Stephano was one of them. Other players should also deserve a lot of praise, but this is about Stephano's run on ladder and it's still very impressive record against the top ladder players in EU. Not that many people are suggesting he's the best player in the world, just an up and coming top foreigner, able to compete with the best. | ||
|
Velr
Switzerland10924 Posts
BUT they drop games and series to some players.. Watching these tournaments it did not look like utter domination to me. Why you bring up the really old stuff like DH Invitational (were MC barely won 2-3) is also questionable  . | ||
|
Blasphemi
United Kingdom980 Posts
On September 26 2011 19:16 Velr wrote: I'm not arguing against Koreans winning more/doing better in general. BUT they drop games and series to some players.. Watching these tournaments it did not look like utter domination to me. Why you bring up the really old stuff like DH Invitational (were MC barely won 2-3) is also questionable .Well the domination is actually getting worse. Lets no forget as well that Koreans are generally represented by four good players at these LAN's (usually one tip top player, two solid players and a BW/WC3 legend) while the foreigners often have all their best players in attendence. If Koreans were to have Nestea, MVP, MMA, DRG, Bomber, Losira and Ryung at every international LAN there isn't a chance in hell of a foreigner ever placing top four in the foreseeable future. | ||
|
justinpal
United States3810 Posts
On September 26 2011 19:00 Blasphemi wrote: If Stephano wins IPL 3 he will absolutely be the top foreign player. No doubt about that. If Gordon Hayward wins IPL 3 he will absolutely be the top foreign player. | ||
|
Slyce
United Kingdom173 Posts
He needs to get himself to Korea asap. | ||
|
RiT4LiN
Netherlands131 Posts
| ||
|
gammAwolfa
Finland213 Posts
On September 26 2011 19:58 RiT4LiN wrote: I demand replay pack This. I also want to know how to play this 50supply agressive zerg style | ||
|
AxionSteel
United States7754 Posts
A mighty effort, looking forward to seeing how he competes at IPL 3!! | ||
|
HonorZ
France858 Posts
I suppose we can wait for the next lan to properly"evaluate" his level. I wouldn't put too much hype on him nor blame him if he doesn't do as well in LAN events. | ||
|
Dawg_Snow
France425 Posts
On September 26 2011 18:40 Blasphemi wrote: No one says this because Koreans basically always win on LAN. Do you not think it's maybe a little coincidently that a foreigner is far more likely to beat Korean online than at a LAN? You do realize that the KOR vs EU matchs were on the NA server witch makes them lag both as much ? | ||
|
Mandalor
Germany2362 Posts
On September 26 2011 19:22 Blasphemi wrote: Well the domination is actually getting worse. Lets no forget as well that Koreans are generally represented by four good players at these LAN's (usually one tip top player, two solid players and a BW/WC3 legend) while the foreigners often have all their best players in attendence. If Koreans were to have Nestea, MVP, MMA, DRG, Bomber, Losira and Ryung at every international LAN there isn't a chance in hell of a foreigner ever placing top four in the foreseeable future. why you put ryung in that sentence is beyond me. I don't think it'll get worse. Lots and lots of foreigners went to korea or are about to. HuK has been doing considerably better than people like Bomber or DRG in GSL. You might blame that on luck or sth. but we have quite a strong player base in korea right now. Add people like Dimaga, TZain, Stephano and probably Nerchio to that and we have like 8 people that can win series against the top notch koreans. | ||
|
bucckevin
858 Posts
| ||
|
Redox
Germany24794 Posts
On September 26 2011 18:59 arQ wrote: No one says that Stephano isn't a fantastic player. It is just as simple as the fact that recently he has not destroyed people in a big "LAN" tournament. Therefore it's not really easy to say how truly great he is. Now if he would go and win say IPL 3, there would be no question that he is the best foreign player atm. You just have to look at his play to know that he is a great player. People generally put way too much importance into single games / tournaments when judging a player. If Stephano lost a bo3 in IPL3 and crashed out first round he would not suddenly be a worse player. Sc2 is way to volatile for judgements like this, everybody loses from time to time against other good players. The best players have a win rate of about 70 % in a competetive environment. Which means they can lose any time, also in the first round of a tourney. As we have seen with MVP, Nestea, MC for example. | ||
|
saksy2
Norway520 Posts
On September 26 2011 21:12 bucckevin wrote: He still has a long way to go. He lost 1-3 to Ryung and did not look impressive at all. Those games were played several MONTHS ago, and should really not determine his current skill level. | ||
|
Fus
Sweden1112 Posts
| ||
| ||
