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On February 01 2011 05:13 Bosu wrote:
The biggest problem I have with 4gate is not stopping it. I know how to stop it.
The problem I have is identifying that they are 4gating. Would love to hear some insight into things that can hint that the protoss is 4gating.
1 gas, saving chrono, chrono on core, zealot + stalker as first units, 4 gates, probe moving out to build pylon. ur rly not gonna get more than that, even from a pro
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3gate sentry expand or tech builds normally get second gas at 21 (you need the gas badly). It's not a 100% indicator, he could do some weird one gas expand build or get the gas to trick you and 4gate anyways but you should be getting conerced.
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The vod with catz was very informational to me. I recommend watching this to learn how to play as a reaction based zerg.
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On February 01 2011 05:25 Almin wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 05:13 Bosu wrote:
The biggest problem I have with 4gate is not stopping it. I know how to stop it.
The problem I have is identifying that they are 4gating. Would love to hear some insight into things that can hint that the protoss is 4gating. Sac an overlord, sneak in a drone with mineral glitch. attack their gateway when your speed is out, and move past the zealot if he goes out the gap to attack the zerglings.
I am not completely oblivious to how to scout. Obviously a zerg can sac an overlord and potentially figure it out. However on many maps bases are large enough that an overlord may not see the gateways. Or if a protoss isn't terrible they will hide gateways so you are unsure.
Thanks to ribbo for some actual decent advice though.
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Just started watching these VODS, pretty freaking awesome. iNControL seems to have been the most helpful for me, probably because ZvP is my current most difficult matchup, but I've liked CatZ and Ret too.
iNControL stressing to get speed ovies and spew creep at Protoss 3rd, as well as everywhere else has been going through my head as I've been playing lately, and its helping me a lot. His emphasis on creep spread and burrowing the ling at the 3rd has won me games too.
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I have to echo all the praise and thanks for this series Mr. Bitter. My play has dramatically improved from keeping up with the VODS. I am also very much looking forward to the iNControL session on stopping 4-gate- even after such a long period of popularity/having played against it many times I still lose to it plenty. Especially the 1-gas pure zealot/stalker variation is really hard to hold- I remember artosis suggesting to cut drones at 20 and produce purely zerglings to stop it (LeenockfOu held on blistering sands with this method)...will be interested to hear iNControL's thoughts on how to best defend it.
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love the shows, watching it all, and all the time
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India45 Posts
love it! thanks so much Mr.bitter
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what time exactly is the next 4gate show?
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Mr Bitter, thanks for this, Really liked all the advice... I think RET was the one I was most impressed with standard play. Cat's was absolutely no bs awesome.
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is inc gonna come on and 4gate you all night?
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Hoping for some ZvZ!
Great stuff since you started streaming. Keep the good work up!
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I would like to give a suggestion for a future show, and this might be better to do with replays to get a lot out of it:
"Killing moves as zerg"
I know every zerg struggles with being able to make a killing move when they get what SHOULD BE a decisive advantage. I'm a mid-masters league zerg so I can't be the only one.
Edit: added "what should be"
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Watching the Catz vod has made me an even bigger fan than I already was. That guy has a great understanding of the game.
Thank you MrBitter (and all the guests) for making this available to us all.
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So eager for the 4gate lessons, I §#&$*%# hate 4gates.
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Please, please please please please go specifically over a 2gas 4gate with Sentries on Blistering Sands. I see even progamers lose to this every single time against an opponent of around equal skill, and have no idea how to defeat this. It'd be great if you could dedicate some time on this specifically, since if you can stop it on Blistering, other maps won't give you trouble.
Why are people talking about the 1gas 4gate? I think that's a pretty bad build, just mass speedling with a few crawlers while teching to Roaches beats it easily, Sentries are what give you trouble. And the gas timing in a 2gas 4gate is the same as in 3gate expand, it also makes a Sentry first.
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On February 02 2011 01:47 Shikyo wrote:
Please, please please please please go specifically over a 2gas 4gate with Sentries on Blistering Sands. I see even progamers lose to this every single time against an opponent of around equal skill, and have no idea how to defeat this. It'd be great if you could dedicate some time on this specifically, since if you can stop it on Blistering, other maps won't give you trouble.
Why are people talking about the 1gas 4gate? I think that's a pretty bad build, just mass speedling with a few crawlers while teching to Roaches beats it easily, Sentries are what give you trouble. And the gas timing in a 2gas 4gate is the same as in 3gate expand, it also makes a Sentry first.
We'll hit on all the high points, I promise.
<3
2 hours til iNcontroL!
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On February 02 2011 05:55 MrBitter wrote:
2 hours til iNcontroL!
Gonna be sweet!
Thanks for everything you do MrBitter, it's really awesome.I hope Catz returns, his video was reeeeally quite educational, as well as entertaining.
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Would you mind asking him what he thinks about getting an early +1 melee attack out? Then get another +1 ranged and when the lair is finished decide on getting +2 melee for banelingbombs or +2 for ranged attack.
Getting speedlings with +1 melee while I build up a sufficient amount of roaches has helped me win a lot of 4 gates. You just gotta watch out for the forcefields and never engage when you aren't sure you will win the battle certainly.
So looking forward to this  .
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EPT
