EPT
And they always play good in CL so I am also confident that they will get out of the group at least.
2014 - 2015 Football Thread - Page 239
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TerransHill
Germany572 Posts
And they always play good in CL so I am also confident that they will get out of the group at least. | ||
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Maenander
Germany4926 Posts
On September 25 2014 05:09 TerransHill wrote: Stop crying guys, it's only the 5th matchday. I am pretty sure that Dortmund is going to be 2nd again at the end of the league which is where they belong. And they always play good in CL so I am also confident that they will get out of the group at least. Also it's pretty tough playing 2 games a week with all those injuries, so people should cut them some slack ... | ||
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warding
Portugal2394 Posts
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Oh well win is win and Nathan Akex played 90minutes and went off to standing ovation :D Netherlands have a sick holding mid on there hands  | ||
Twisted
Netherlands13554 Posts
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smr
Germany4808 Posts
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On September 25 2014 05:31 warding wrote: The betting odds of Bayern Munich winning the Bundesliga are at 1/10. Isn't that the definition of boring? For the sake of comparison: PSG 2/17, Juventus 5/6, Barcelona 8/11, Chelsea 7/10 (Man City at 3 doesn't seem like a bad bet), Porto 4/5. It is, and people aren't happy about it. The Bundesliga is pretty much all-around the most exciting league; fastest pace, most goals scored, most competition and variability year-to-year, but over the past three years or so Bayern kicked it into overdrive and has gone to the next level to build what looks to be a dynasty that is going to win the double for 3-5 straight years, and the fact that their income/spending is multiple times that of each other Bundesliga club, combined with the image of buying the best players from their direct competitors, makes people pretty salty about the "Bayern vs. the rest" situation in the Bundesliga. Basically everything that is good about the Bundesliga is still there, but then you just have the cemented fact that Bayern will win the league and most likely the DFB Pokal every year in the near future. As for BVB, injuries are just doing too much. Reus, Mhki, Hummels, Kuba, Sahin, Gundogan. A huge list that includes pretty much every play-maker for BVB. It's compounded by the fact that a couple key replacements/substitutes (Aubameyang, Mhki, Sokratis) are turning out to either be less-than-expected or total duds. Like I said before, the problem is lack of creativity in the front and no depth in the back. We need Hummels back to full health and some quality depth in the back 4, because anyone beyond Schmelzer-Hummels-Subotic-Pizscek is just unreliable and makes huge mistakes. We also need Kagawa to get back into form, hopefully Immobile and Ramos to acclimate and blossom, and to pick up more depth (hopefully depth that can create chances and move the ball well) in the midfield. | ||
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Copymizer
Denmark2107 Posts
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Capital Cup Round 4 Draw Tottenham v Brighton Stoke v Southampton Bournemouth v West Brom Shrewsbury v Chelsea Liverpool v Swansea MK Dons v Sheffield United Manchester City v Newcastle Fulham v Derby | ||
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Skynx
Turkey7150 Posts
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TerransHill
Germany572 Posts
On September 25 2014 06:15 Stratos_speAr wrote: It is, and people aren't happy about it. The Bundesliga is pretty much all-around the most exciting league; fastest pace, most goals scored, most competition and variability year-to-year, but over the past three years or so Bayern kicked it into overdrive and has gone to the next level to build what looks to be a dynasty that is going to win the double for 3-5 straight years, and the fact that their income/spending is multiple times that of each other Bundesliga club, combined with the image of buying the best players from their direct competitors, makes people pretty salty about the "Bayern vs. the rest" situation in the Bundesliga. Basically everything that is good about the Bundesliga is still there, but then you just have the cemented fact that Bayern will win the league and most likely the DFB Pokal every year in the near future. It is not really Bayerns fault. They can and need to invest money in order to stay competitive internationally. Just look what Clubs like Real Madrid, Barca, PSG, ManU/City etc. spent in the past. Bayern is actually far away from that level. It also makes sense to buy players from Bundesliga since you know that they already adapted to the country and league. Sure it also weakens the competition but Dortmund is doing just the same, they also buy players from weaker teams like Gladbach, Bremen, Hertha etc. So every Dortmund fan who hates Bayern for buying their players is just a hypocrite. I'd rather have a more thrilling season from time to time aswell. But its the other teams who need to make their players stay and its not Bayerns fault that they can't afford to do so. | ||
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On September 25 2014 08:24 TerransHill wrote: It is not really Bayerns fault. They can and need to invest money in order to stay competitive internationally. Just look what Clubs like Real Madrid, Barca, PSG, ManU/City etc. spent in the past. Bayern is actually far away from that level. It also makes sense to buy players from Bundesliga since you know that they already adapted to the country and league. Sure it also weakens the competition but Dortmund is doing just the same, they also buy players from weaker teams like Gladbach, Bremen, Hertha etc. So every Dortmund fan who hates Bayern for buying their players is just a hypocrite. I'd rather have a more thrilling season from time to time aswell. But its the other teams who need to make their players stay and its not Bayerns fault that they can't afford to do so. Well, actually, it is. Of course Bayern does very well financially and they deserve credit for that. It's not like they stole their money or became the financial juggernaut of Germany through corrupted means or anything. However, it's a zero sum game; other leagues in Germany can't prosper when Bayern just wins everything, because when Bayern dominates so much they just soak up all the money. They win everything, getting themselves more money and building their reputation. They use that money to buy better players. This lets them keep winning, and it lets them win outside of Germany. This continues to make them more money and also more reputation. Good players flock to where they can get the most money and the best chance of winning. It's pretty naive to say that "It's not Bayern's fault" when Bayern is the reason that the league is so lopsided. Hell, even Dortmund can't come close to Bayern's spending power, making nearly $200 million less in 2012/2013, which was Dortmund's best financial year ever (and one they probably won't replicate often, seeing as they dropped off by a good $40+ million the following year). There are only three other teams that made over $100 million in 2012/2013, and SC Paderborn's entire roster's budget could only pay for half of Thomas Muller's contract. | ||
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zev318
Canada4306 Posts
On September 25 2014 05:31 warding wrote: The betting odds of Bayern Munich winning the Bundesliga are at 1/10. Isn't that the definition of boring? For the sake of comparison: PSG 2/17, Juventus 5/6, Barcelona 8/11, Chelsea 7/10 (Man City at 3 doesn't seem like a bad bet), Porto 4/5. thats what happens when they're the only A tier team in the league. | ||
Liquid`Drone
Norway28743 Posts
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On September 25 2014 11:13 Liquid`Drone wrote: stratos, I read "it's not bayern's fault" as "you can't blame them for the situation". Sure it's their fault, but only through them being so successful, so smartly managed for such a long period of time. It's not something you can hold against them. Yea, and I agree with that. However, it still doesn't make it right. It means that the system is flawed, even if Bayern is playing by the system's rules. Of course, change won't ever happen, since money rules European soccer. | ||
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Rebs
Pakistan10726 Posts
On September 25 2014 11:32 Stratos_speAr wrote: Yea, and I agree with that. However, it still doesn't make it right. It means that the system is flawed, even if Bayern is playing by the system's rules. Of course, change won't ever happen, since money rules European soccer. No system in any sport is made to foster competition, it is fundamentally incorrect to assume that dynasties and big teams make sports boring. There really arent any major sports where big market teams havent dominated them historically. And its those same big market teams that garner interest towards the sport and make it bigger and that can only be better for all teams. Bayern being bigger makes the Bundesliga bigger whether other teams can compete with them or not. The pie gets bigger Its not really as zero sum and doom and gloom as you say. Maybe in terms of success on the pitch but not in terms of the popularity of the league overall. It also forces the grass roots levels of teams to go higher. Like how teams like Dortmund or recent cases such as Southampton and even dutch teams get their rosters raped every year but evolve to maintain their levels year after year. Its a a complete falsity (even though it may seem intuitive) that leagues that arent competitive are considered boring by the average fan. Thats not true. The only way to introduce different winners is to use a single or 2 game elimination system that encourages randomness. Where the better team may not win. In league play where everyone plays everyone else. The best team will win nearly 99 percent of the time. The MLS is super competitive. No one gives a shit. If the LA Galaxy went on a tear and started playing a level above everyone else. I guarantee you interest in MLS will grow. + Show Spoiler + (this is also statistically proven by multiple papers and books btw) There is frankly nothing wrong with Bayern Munich being bigger than everyone else. It just sucks for teams rooting against them in the same league. And that small sample set of fans are the only ones who care. And as far as the piece of the pie goes they are a nibble. Dont get me wrong, I am not saying competition is bad. But just that increased competition is not necessarily all hunky dory like you might be suggesting. At the end of the day no matter how "competitive" we talk about the PL is its always a 2 or 3 horse race at the end. The actors alter slightly at best. And its pretty unconvincing to call a league competitive when it boasts just 3 different winners in the last 8 years. | ||
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Maenander
Germany4926 Posts
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warding
Portugal2394 Posts
On September 25 2014 15:09 Rebs wrote: No system in any sport is made to foster competition, it is fundamentally incorrect to assume that dynasties and big teams make sports boring. There really arent any major sports where big market teams havent dominated them historically. And its those same big market teams that garner interest towards the sport and make it bigger and that can only be better for all teams. Rivalries make sports exciting. Two-three juggernauts on a league make a league exciting. One sole dominating dynasty is actually relatively rare and is non-existent in the major leagues like Serie A, La Liga and the Premier League, and I'd wager that people only tuned in to the Bundesliga recently because of the rise of Dortmund as a challenger to Bayern Munich's supremacy. As for your statement that no system is made to foster competition, then what are the salary caps in american sports for? EDIT: I also think that this dynasty is different from ones in decades past: while previously dynasties were built on perfect-storms of talent coming together at the same time in the same place, today's dynasties are built on having yearly revenues that are hundreds of millions of Euros above your competitors. That's actually much more difficult to overcome. Again, I see your point that people actually like dynasties and big teams, but even MJ's Bulls had to sweat to beat the Sonics, the Jazz, the Suns. I just don't see how Bayern Munich's total dominance Do you know of studies on this that conclude that single dynasties are good for a league's popularity? In my opinion: Celtics vs Lakers = good. Real Madrid vs Barcelona = good. M. City vs M. Utd vs Chelsea vs Liverpool vs Arsenal = awesome. Porto vs Benfica vs Sporting = great. Bayern Munich = zzz. | ||
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Liquid`Drone
Norway28743 Posts
then when the league became genuinely competitive in 2005 2006 2007, it had the biggest viewer numbers ever. and then ever since, because Rosenborg stopped participating in the champions league and stopped being this kind of locomotive that inspired all the other teams to be as good as they could be, quality has dropped and since 2007, so have viewer counts. | ||
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zeo
Serbia6336 Posts
On September 25 2014 07:19 Skynx wrote: MK Dons vs. Chsea finals Hyped as fuck. My soft spot for Wimbledon gives me an extreme dislike for Milton Keynes. | ||
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