Such a good interview. Anyone who gives a fuck about journalism and esports should watch this. Remove your biases against Thorin and Richard Lewis for whatever they might have said or done; these two talking about content creation in esports is a gold mine of information.
Specifically, they talk about Reddit and appealing to the lowest common denominator. As content creators, they MUST appeal to Reddit because of its popularity, but are also then a slave to the hivemind of opinion that the site enforces by design. Thus, to be a divisive figure (and then, to take positions that may run counter to others' ideas) is to put oneself in a position where they can only ever be so successful. The most successful people in esports or gaming content creation are masters of appealing to the masses and never creating the sort of malignant hate core that comes as a result of having an opinion or making a statement that MIGHT offend someone.
I can't speak on behalf of the other staff, but I'll drop some quick thoughts.
I am quite thankful that I'm staff on TL, and that I'm not working in the eSports industry with the proverbial Sword of Damocles in the form of the wider internet audience. While I'm not an active writer any more, I've never felt constrained in what I've wanted to write when I did. For example I wrote about strategy because I felt like it, and who cares if it's popular or not. (I'm not going to lie though, my ego did enjoy wanting the view numbers tick up!)
Thooorin and Richard are correct in that people who generate content for a living are beholden to their readers. It's like this in a lot of industries, but for free online content generation in particular the issue is much more acute. You're beholden to an amorphous mass of individuals who have no hard loyalty to you and who each on their own basically have no value to you either. * But you're also required to stay in line in anything you do because the nature of online work means a lot of what you do is public and easily scrutinised.
The idea of scrutiny in and of itself is not the issue, but rather linked to a broader issue around the outrage culture that has taken ahold in the internet and social media. I won't write lots on this issue, because there are many people far more educated in this matter than I who have already written extensively about thus. But suffice to say the permanent outrage culture we currently live in means that if your are dependent on what is essentially public charity (in the form of CPM and click-through) for your livelihood then you darn well are thinking about the threat of outrage. **
There have been various attempts at changing the economic and financial factors that affect content producers from subscription models, to Patreon ***, to direct sponsorship and merchandising. But these alternatives are still somewhat limited in their general scope and application. (For example, I cannot see how a subscription model would work in eSports content generation although it is quite successful in other niche areas.) There is also the ever constant threat that someone willing to do something in worse conditions and for less gain can just undercut you. While brand loyalty does play a part in viewer numbers (which a casual glance at Twitch seems to suggest) the barrier to entry is still very low **** so there's pressure from that aspect too.
Is this a good or a bad thing that these factors can affect someone's writing? I'm honestly not that sure since undoubtedly it's these factors that allow for people to take on careers in free content generation in the first place, even if they are limiting and have serious flaws. But it's also true to say that there's a lot of potential content that will never rationally get created as well. I bring back the issue of strategy articles because, quite frankly, there is no rational reason to write eSports Strategy.
Take the grand strategy articles on Starcraft that the team at TL constantly put out. It's really crazy when you think about it. I've never seen any other game that has so much in-depth content that breaks down so many concepts for people of all skill groups. And it's basically an irrational act of love for Starcraft that drives this *****.
Does my ramble have any conclusion? Haha no. This was a random steam of consciousness from your friendly lunar resident. But yamato it's quite nice for you to highlight this episode of Reflections. Nothing in here is really revolutionary, but there is quite a lot to think about when it comes to the ecosystem around eSports and I guess free content generation in general.
* IIRC Thooorin and Richard are both partially reliant on CPM from ad revenue, and the CPM rates for web ads are atrocious. ** Not that this has prevented various people from saying very silly things sometimes, but still. *** The increase in patronage feels like some Rennaisance revival where the wealthy (ie. those with disposable wealth) bestow the right to create art, but adapted for the modern world through crowdshare which makes me wonder about what the wider implications are for society if we are reviving these ancient practises but I digress. **** Although not zero! There are also other costs involved but let's not get into that for the sake of this post. ***** Or elitism. That works too.
Holy shit I'm totally picking up league again for this.
1)New champions blow. Not like, they're weak, but fuck all of them, like look at this Bard dude... 'he's a roamer, roam and pick up charms and meeps and stuff and help your teammates by roaming.... seriously though roam this guy, don't you dare do anything else with him.' 2)I have spent 0 dollars on the game, and if I'm going to 'exploit' a game's free-ness League is like, the worst to do it in. 3)Probably the only legit draw to reinstalling the game. 4)I can watch LCS without playing(like I watch certain sports despite not playing them, competition is entertaining) 5)ROFL.
Such a good interview. Anyone who gives a fuck about journalism and esports should watch this. Remove your biases against Thorin and Richard Lewis for whatever they might have said or done; these two talking about content creation in esports is a gold mine of information.
Specifically, they talk about Reddit and appealing to the lowest common denominator. As content creators, they MUST appeal to Reddit because of its popularity, but are also then a slave to the hivemind of opinion that the site enforces by design. Thus, to be a divisive figure (and then, to take positions that may run counter to others' ideas) is to put oneself in a position where they can only ever be so successful. The most successful people in esports or gaming content creation are masters of appealing to the masses and never creating the sort of malignant hate core that comes as a result of having an opinion or making a statement that MIGHT offend someone.
I can't speak on behalf of the other staff, but I'll drop some quick thoughts.
I am quite thankful that I'm staff on TL, and that I'm not working in the eSports industry with the proverbial Sword of Damocles in the form of the wider internet audience. While I'm not an active writer any more, I've never felt constrained in what I've wanted to write when I did. For example I wrote about strategy because I felt like it, and who cares if it's popular or not. (I'm not going to lie though, my ego did enjoy wanting the view numbers tick up!)
Thooorin and Richard are correct in that people who generate content for a living are beholden to their readers. It's like this in a lot of industries, but for free online content generation in particular the issue is much more acute. You're beholden to an amorphous mass of individuals who have no hard loyalty to you and who each on their own basically have no value to you either. * But you're also required to stay in line in anything you do because the nature of online work means a lot of what you do is public and easily scrutinised.
The idea of scrutiny in and of itself is not the issue, but rather linked to a broader issue around the outrage culture that has taken ahold in the internet and social media. I won't write lots on this issue, because there are many people far more educated in this matter than I who have already written extensively about thus. But suffice to say the permanent outrage culture we currently live in means that if your are dependent on what is essentially public charity (in the form of CPM and click-through) for your livelihood then you darn well are thinking about the threat of outrage. **
There have been various attempts at changing the economic and financial factors that affect content producers from subscription models, to Patreon ***, to direct sponsorship and merchandising. But these alternatives are still somewhat limited in their general scope and application. (For example, I cannot see how a subscription model would work in eSports content generation although it is quite successful in other niche areas.) There is also the ever constant threat that someone willing to do something in worse conditions and for less gain can just undercut you. While brand loyalty does play a part in viewer numbers (which a casual glance at Twitch seems to suggest) the barrier to entry is still very low **** so there's pressure from that aspect too.
Is this a good or a bad thing that these factors can affect someone's writing? I'm honestly not that sure since undoubtedly it's these factors that allow for people to take on careers in free content generation in the first place, even if they are limiting and have serious flaws. But it's also true to say that there's a lot of potential content that will never rationally get created as well. I bring back the issue of strategy articles because, quite frankly, there is no rational reason to write eSports Strategy.
Take the grand strategy articles on Starcraft that the team at TL constantly put out. It's really crazy when you think about it. I've never seen any other game that has so much in-depth content that breaks down so many concepts for people of all skill groups. And it's basically an irrational act of love for Starcraft that drives this *****.
Does my ramble have any conclusion? Haha no. This was a random steam of consciousness from your friendly lunar resident. But yamato it's quite nice for you to highlight this episode of Reflections. Nothing in here is really revolutionary, but there is quite a lot to think about when it comes to the ecosystem around eSports and I guess free content generation in general.
* IIRC Thooorin and Richard are both partially reliant on CPM from ad revenue, and the CPM rates for web ads are atrocious. ** Not that this has prevented various people from saying very silly things sometimes, but still. *** The increase in patronage feels like some Rennaisance revival where the wealthy (ie. those with disposable wealth) bestow the right to create art, but adapted for the modern world through crowdshare which makes me wonder about what the wider implications are for society if we are reviving these ancient practises but I digress. **** Although not zero! There are also other costs involved but let's not get into that for the sake of this post. ***** Or elitism. That works too.
@Moonbear: Actually subscription models are hella easy. For someone like Thorin - setup a sub button on twitch so that people can subchat and use funny maymay emotes with his and monte's face. Release reflection interviews a day earlier for his patreons. I like Richard Lewis, but let's not pretend like he's not a controversy creator who thrives in clickbait media. For someone like Travis, I dunno, a subchat as well so that people can ask questions (if he still does talkshows)? A patreon so that people can vote on questions he asks players? I dunno, aren't 99% of patreon deals "you receive my content day earlier" and people have no problem paying for that? Or just make tshirts and mugs, those always sell.
Such a good interview. Anyone who gives a fuck about journalism and esports should watch this. Remove your biases against Thorin and Richard Lewis for whatever they might have said or done; these two talking about content creation in esports is a gold mine of information.
Specifically, they talk about Reddit and appealing to the lowest common denominator. As content creators, they MUST appeal to Reddit because of its popularity, but are also then a slave to the hivemind of opinion that the site enforces by design. Thus, to be a divisive figure (and then, to take positions that may run counter to others' ideas) is to put oneself in a position where they can only ever be so successful. The most successful people in esports or gaming content creation are masters of appealing to the masses and never creating the sort of malignant hate core that comes as a result of having an opinion or making a statement that MIGHT offend someone.
I can't speak on behalf of the other staff, but I'll drop some quick thoughts.
I am quite thankful that I'm staff on TL, and that I'm not working in the eSports industry with the proverbial Sword of Damocles in the form of the wider internet audience. While I'm not an active writer any more, I've never felt constrained in what I've wanted to write when I did. For example I wrote about strategy because I felt like it, and who cares if it's popular or not. (I'm not going to lie though, my ego did enjoy wanting the view numbers tick up!)
Thooorin and Richard are correct in that people who generate content for a living are beholden to their readers. It's like this in a lot of industries, but for free online content generation in particular the issue is much more acute. You're beholden to an amorphous mass of individuals who have no hard loyalty to you and who each on their own basically have no value to you either. * But you're also required to stay in line in anything you do because the nature of online work means a lot of what you do is public and easily scrutinised.
The idea of scrutiny in and of itself is not the issue, but rather linked to a broader issue around the outrage culture that has taken ahold in the internet and social media. I won't write lots on this issue, because there are many people far more educated in this matter than I who have already written extensively about thus. But suffice to say the permanent outrage culture we currently live in means that if your are dependent on what is essentially public charity (in the form of CPM and click-through) for your livelihood then you darn well are thinking about the threat of outrage. **
There have been various attempts at changing the economic and financial factors that affect content producers from subscription models, to Patreon ***, to direct sponsorship and merchandising. But these alternatives are still somewhat limited in their general scope and application. (For example, I cannot see how a subscription model would work in eSports content generation although it is quite successful in other niche areas.) There is also the ever constant threat that someone willing to do something in worse conditions and for less gain can just undercut you. While brand loyalty does play a part in viewer numbers (which a casual glance at Twitch seems to suggest) the barrier to entry is still very low **** so there's pressure from that aspect too.
Is this a good or a bad thing that these factors can affect someone's writing? I'm honestly not that sure since undoubtedly it's these factors that allow for people to take on careers in free content generation in the first place, even if they are limiting and have serious flaws. But it's also true to say that there's a lot of potential content that will never rationally get created as well. I bring back the issue of strategy articles because, quite frankly, there is no rational reason to write eSports Strategy.
Take the grand strategy articles on Starcraft that the team at TL constantly put out. It's really crazy when you think about it. I've never seen any other game that has so much in-depth content that breaks down so many concepts for people of all skill groups. And it's basically an irrational act of love for Starcraft that drives this *****.
Does my ramble have any conclusion? Haha no. This was a random steam of consciousness from your friendly lunar resident. But yamato it's quite nice for you to highlight this episode of Reflections. Nothing in here is really revolutionary, but there is quite a lot to think about when it comes to the ecosystem around eSports and I guess free content generation in general.
* IIRC Thooorin and Richard are both partially reliant on CPM from ad revenue, and the CPM rates for web ads are atrocious. ** Not that this has prevented various people from saying very silly things sometimes, but still. *** The increase in patronage feels like some Rennaisance revival where the wealthy (ie. those with disposable wealth) bestow the right to create art, but adapted for the modern world through crowdshare which makes me wonder about what the wider implications are for society if we are reviving these ancient practises but I digress. **** Although not zero! There are also other costs involved but let's not get into that for the sake of this post. ***** Or elitism. That works too.
Well I got the offer. Not sure I can afford to take it though. Atleast it's a bargaining tool for a raise? I actually can't really find a whole lot of good in the situation
On February 25 2015 11:16 AlterKot wrote: @Moonbear: Actually subscription models are hella easy. For someone like Thorin - setup a sub button on twitch so that people can subchat and use funny maymay emotes with his and monte's face. Release reflection interviews a day earlier for his patreons. I like Richard Lewis, but let's not pretend like he's not a controversy creator who thrives in clickbait media. For someone like Travis, I dunno, a subchat as well so that people can ask questions (if he still does talkshows)? A patreon so that people can vote on questions he asks players? I dunno, aren't 99% of patreon deals "you receive my content day earlier" and people have no problem paying for that? Or just make tshirts and mugs, those always sell.
Sorry. To be clear when I say subscription I mean subscription models that, say, newspaper companies offer where your content is behind a paywall. My focus was mainly on video on demand and written content rather than live streamed content since the dynamics between them are quite large. (For example, live streamed content focuses very heavily on viewer interaction which is not necessarily present in written or pre-recorded material.) For many reasons, I can't see paywall/subscription models for nearly any in an eSports world succeeding.
Merchandising is interesting, but you need a brand to merchandise in the first place. This works better for some types of content creators than others but it's finicky. Mainly, it still leads back to the issue of needing to be a marketable person yourself and the need to rely and appeal to a mass of people who support your brand before you even get to the paying money for items part.
And again, as I stated these alternative methods will still be limited in how much they can achieve and do. Trying to drive for clicks and impressions is the standard model for many very good reasons. (Mostly because it works and people can actually afford to have careers doing this tbh) How many people would be willing to basically Patreon fund Thooorin if it gave him discretion to produce whatever content he wanted? I think the answer is probably not enough to allow him to quit what he's currently doing. And if you have a business model that's currently working for you right now, paying for your bills and food, it's very hard to leave it.
We sometimes talk about business and having to go through failures sometimes almost as if it's a rite of passage, and how people should aim to be daring. Follow your dreams and all that. But the human cost of failure is really, really, high.
I'm not sure if there is a "one-stop solution" with regards to the incentives free content producers have but it's something that I find interesting to think about. (And if you think it's a boring thing to think about, you're totally welcome to. It is indeed a fairly dry topic haha)
EPT
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/LC0J4vU.png)
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