On May 07 2021 05:57 Xain0n wrote: Rogue has the average quality of his successes and the pristine record in offline bo7 over Serral, literally nothing else; he didn't even earn more than Serral in LoTV. Only a fanboy could think Rogue would be the uncontested best Zerg or compare him to Brood War's Jaedong.
By the way, I'm out of this thread; enjoy this obscene series and this redundant success, Rogue shouldn't have won this Code S but for sure deserved to win the finals.
You and your pathetic vitriol are so predictable, dissing Rogue whenever he wins something just because he's better than Serral and you know it. You only say he ''deserved'' to win the finals because again its against another player who's miles better than Serral. In fact you have been extremely bitter ever since the finals matchup was announced, god knows what sort of nonsense you would be spilling here if Maru had won.
Listing any of those folks as being ‘miles’ better than Serral is hyperbolic in the extreme.
Not that I condone silly bashing of Rogue for his fantastic achievements
Saying that Rogue's achievements aren't better than Serral's and that, in any of case, it would be foolish to claim that he is the uncontested best Zerg is "silly bashing"?
This is the first time I express my distaste for Rogue's way of winning his titles, I said literally nothing when he won his last Code S and Katowice; on the contrary, I am pretty sure I said that a player of Rogue's caliber couldn't end his career without a Code S final after he won his first. It's undeniable that Rogue is one of the greats, calling him GOAT and way better than Serral is instead excessive; be sure I am deeply convinced of what I am writing here.
I expected much more from a Code S final between Maru vs Rogue and I was genuinely horrified by Rogue's abusiveness and Maru's subpar performance. If I were a player I would personally be much closer to Rogue's approach to the game but as a fan I absolutely hate it and I also feel that he has won more than he would have deserved in the last year and half judging by his level of play; in any of case, those are just my thoughts, and I have to admit his clutchness and surgical dissection of his opponents in those awful finals are to be admired.
On May 07 2021 02:48 SmoKim wrote: haven't seen this much passion on TL.net in a long time Bless bad GSL finals Still can´t believe they had the finals on a thursday, Maybe they knew what was comming GG Rogue, Maru will win soon enough
We had a long stretch of pretty bad / one-sided GSL finals in 2011
2010 Open Season 3 (MC 4-1 Rain) 2011 Jan (Mvp 4-1 MKP) 2011 Mar (MC 4-1 July) 2011 GSL vs. World (Mvp 4-2 MKP) 2011 May (Nestea 4-0 Inca) - this one was especially bad, as Inca tried like 4 different failed DT rushes. To this day, his name is still synonymous with DTs 2011 Super Tournament (Polt 4-0 MMA) 2011 Jul (Nestea 4-0 Losira) - just a ZvZ clinic by Nestea over his Zerg teammate 2011 Aug (Mvp 4-1 TOP) 2011 Oct (MMA 4-1 Mvp) -> this was considered a "fun" GSL finals 2011 Nov (Jjakji 4-2 Leenock) -> very nice back-and-forth series 2011 Blizzard Cup (MMA 4-3 DRG) -> now this was an epic finals, still probably one of the best Bo7 series in SC2 history
I remember finding that Super Tournament with Polt and MMA pretty interesting, despite the score. It was the first time we saw infantry winning against sieged tank lines through good micro, IIRC.
It's so funny to read...When Maru wins vs Zerg with mostly proxy rax every game- WHAT A FANTASTIC PLAYER, WHAT A SKILL AND MICRO, TACTICAL GENIUS. When Rogue does the same with roach allin but to Terran- WHAT AN ABUSER, DISGUSTING, BORING...etc etc. Freaking hilarious. They do what they do to win. Rogue knows Maru to the bone, and he was prepared. Maru was not. Whole story.
On May 07 2021 08:07 hiroshOne wrote: It's so funny to read...When Maru wins vs Zerg with mostly proxy rax every game- WHAT A FANTASTIC PLAYER, WHAT A SKILL AND MICRO, TACTICAL GENIUS.
No one says this, you're making up a fake persona to try and counter people's justified frustration. People praise Maru for his skill and micro all the time, but not whenever he gets a quick win with proxies, in fact they usually criticise it.
If Maru went up 3-0 doing a proxy rax allin every game people would be calling shit and it would be boring to watch. Sadly that's never happened.
On May 07 2021 07:00 Obamarauder wrote: Someone just said Rogue is better than Serral? I don’t even like Serral but that statement is hilarious LOL
Look at their records. Serral winning a bunch of tournaments where Koreans weren't allowed to compete is the only reason there is even a discussion.
Serral is a better player. Rogue is better at winning tournaments. It's been this way for the last 4 years.
If you made all players play a hundreds of games against each other and saw who came out on top, Serral probably does. But if you put each player into a single series against someone they know and said you win it or go home, Rogue wins that over anyone else.
On May 07 2021 09:17 sudete wrote: Calling roach all-ins abusive certainly feels like a throwback. It's not Rogue's fault that Maru chose to make dumb decisions especially on Oxide
Dumb decision? Rogue was the one that took a huge gamble
On May 07 2021 07:00 Obamarauder wrote: Someone just said Rogue is better than Serral? I don’t even like Serral but that statement is hilarious LOL
Look at their records. Serral winning a bunch of tournaments where Koreans weren't allowed to compete is the only reason there is even a discussion.
Serral is a better player. Rogue is better at winning tournaments. It's been this way for the last 4 years.
If you made all players play a hundreds of games against each other and saw who came out on top, Serral probably does. But if you put each player into a single series against someone they know and said you win it or go home, Rogue wins that over anyone else.
So when it comes to the games that matter, Rogue is the better player?
Rogue did what he set out to do, but Maru just looks like he was totally off, it doesn't even reflect Rogue's skill. The games were so boring to watch for that matter. Maru looked like a retired 30+ year old man who has not been playing for long at least in the last game, the reaction to slow banelings moving in was just , uh ..... that just made the games not worth watching at all.
Just for my personal taste, I mean this is personal anyway. just chipping in my 5 cents.
On May 07 2021 07:00 Obamarauder wrote: Someone just said Rogue is better than Serral? I don’t even like Serral but that statement is hilarious LOL
Look at their records. Serral winning a bunch of tournaments where Koreans weren't allowed to compete is the only reason there is even a discussion.
Serral is a better player. Rogue is better at winning tournaments. It's been this way for the last 4 years.
If you made all players play a hundreds of games against each other and saw who came out on top, Serral probably does. But if you put each player into a single series against someone they know and said you win it or go home, Rogue wins that over anyone else.
So Rogue is better at the only thing that pays any money in Starcraft? The very thing that makes Starcraft a competitive profession? The thing every SC2 pro devotes his entire time to win? Serral can keep his 9k mmr, no one gives a fuck and no one will pay him a zimbabwe dollar cent over it. You all sound just like Artosis/Idra claiming that he's better than the Protoss who just beat him, because if the game was a NR20 he would win.
On May 07 2021 07:00 Obamarauder wrote: Someone just said Rogue is better than Serral? I don’t even like Serral but that statement is hilarious LOL
Look at their records. Serral winning a bunch of tournaments where Koreans weren't allowed to compete is the only reason there is even a discussion.
Serral is a better player. Rogue is better at winning tournaments. It's been this way for the last 4 years.
If you made all players play a hundreds of games against each other and saw who came out on top, Serral probably does. But if you put each player into a single series against someone they know and said you win it or go home, Rogue wins that over anyone else.
So Rogue is better at the only thing that pays any money in Starcraft? The very thing that makes Starcraft a competitive profession? The thing every SC2 pro devotes his entire time to win? Serral can keep his 9k mmr, no one gives a fuck and no one will pay him a zimbabwe dollar cent over it. You all sound just like Artosis/Idra claiming that he's better than the Protoss who just beat him, because if the game was a NR20 he would win.
I mean they both won 900K, it's not like it worked out that much better for Rogue, one won multiple big tournament, the other hasn't had a bad finish in 3 years in any tournament. And I'd say being probably the best Starcraft player ever is pretty sweet on its own when you spend your whole life playing the game.
On May 07 2021 05:57 Xain0n wrote: Rogue has the average quality of his successes and the pristine record in offline bo7 over Serral, literally nothing else; he didn't even earn more than Serral in LoTV. Only a fanboy could think Rogue would be the uncontested best Zerg or compare him to Brood War's Jaedong.
By the way, I'm out of this thread; enjoy this obscene series and this redundant success, Rogue shouldn't have won this Code S but for sure deserved to win the finals.
You and your pathetic vitriol are so predictable, dissing Rogue whenever he wins something just because he's better than Serral and you know it. You only say he ''deserved'' to win the finals because again its against another player who's miles better than Serral. In fact you have been extremely bitter ever since the finals matchup was announced, god knows what sort of nonsense you would be spilling here if Maru had won.
Listing any of those folks as being ‘miles’ better than Serral is hyperbolic in the extreme.
Not that I condone silly bashing of Rogue for his fantastic achievements
Saying that Rogue's achievements aren't better than Serral's and that, in any of case, it would be foolish to claim that he is the uncontested best Zerg is "silly bashing"?
This is the first time I express my distaste for Rogue's way of winning his titles, I said literally nothing when he won his last Code S and Katowice; on the contrary, I am pretty sure I said that a player of Rogue's caliber couldn't end his career without a Code S final after he won his first. It's undeniable that Rogue is one of the greats, calling him GOAT and way better than Serral is instead excessive; be sure I am deeply convinced of what I am writing here.
I expected much more from a Code S final between Maru vs Rogue and I was genuinely horrified by Rogue's abusiveness and Maru's subpar performance. If I were a player I would personally be much closer to Rogue's approach to the game but as a fan I absolutely hate it and I also feel that he has won more than he would have deserved in the last year and half judging by his level of play; in any of case, those are just my thoughts, and I have to admit his clutchness and surgical dissection of his opponents in those awful finals are to be admired.
come on dude, didn't you say you were out of this thread?
On May 07 2021 05:57 Xain0n wrote: By the way, I'm out of this thread; enjoy this obscene series and this redundant success, Rogue shouldn't have won this Code S but for sure deserved to win the finals.
it's super entertaining watching people arguing, I haven't seen such a heated debate in a long time tbh personally, as great as Serral is until he wins a GSL-type tournament I can't call him the GOAT. I just value GSL titles too much
On May 07 2021 05:57 Xain0n wrote: Rogue has the average quality of his successes and the pristine record in offline bo7 over Serral, literally nothing else; he didn't even earn more than Serral in LoTV. Only a fanboy could think Rogue would be the uncontested best Zerg or compare him to Brood War's Jaedong.
By the way, I'm out of this thread; enjoy this obscene series and this redundant success, Rogue shouldn't have won this Code S but for sure deserved to win the finals.
You and your pathetic vitriol are so predictable, dissing Rogue whenever he wins something just because he's better than Serral and you know it. You only say he ''deserved'' to win the finals because again its against another player who's miles better than Serral. In fact you have been extremely bitter ever since the finals matchup was announced, god knows what sort of nonsense you would be spilling here if Maru had won.
Listing any of those folks as being ‘miles’ better than Serral is hyperbolic in the extreme.
Not that I condone silly bashing of Rogue for his fantastic achievements
Saying that Rogue's achievements aren't better than Serral's and that, in any of case, it would be foolish to claim that he is the uncontested best Zerg is "silly bashing"?
This is the first time I express my distaste for Rogue's way of winning his titles, I said literally nothing when he won his last Code S and Katowice; on the contrary, I am pretty sure I said that a player of Rogue's caliber couldn't end his career without a Code S final after he won his first. It's undeniable that Rogue is one of the greats, calling him GOAT and way better than Serral is instead excessive; be sure I am deeply convinced of what I am writing here.
I expected much more from a Code S final between Maru vs Rogue and I was genuinely horrified by Rogue's abusiveness and Maru's subpar performance. If I were a player I would personally be much closer to Rogue's approach to the game but as a fan I absolutely hate it and I also feel that he has won more than he would have deserved in the last year and half judging by his level of play; in any of case, those are just my thoughts, and I have to admit his clutchness and surgical dissection of his opponents in those awful finals are to be admired.
come on dude, didn't you say you were out of this thread?
On May 07 2021 05:57 Xain0n wrote: By the way, I'm out of this thread; enjoy this obscene series and this redundant success, Rogue shouldn't have won this Code S but for sure deserved to win the finals.
it's super entertaining watching people arguing, I haven't seen such a heated debate in a long time tbh personally, as great as Serral is until he wins a GSL-type tournament I can't call him the GOAT. I just value GSL titles too much
Involving Serral, or any foreigner in a GOAT discussion is laughable. They will never come close to even be a top 5. Its pointless. As for Rogue, he is so much better than Serral as is Manchester City compared Leyton Orient. There is no comparison. Rogue could get eliminated in the first round of all the next tournaments and he would still be far superior. Its a joke, lets just stop this nonsense.
The way I look at Rogue vs Serral is that I favor Serral in a head to head match (although Rogue has scored a few victories, so Serral isn't as invincible as he was before) but Rogue's body of work is too extensive for me to consider Serral's achievements as equal. If we look at world championships alone, they both have a Blizzcon, but Rogue has 2(!) IEM Katowice wins while Serral has still yet to score any.
Outside of those two championships, the next most prestigious tournament is GSL, and Serral is again just out of the discussion since he doesn't want to come live in Korea to play in the GSL. Sure, Serral's won a bunch of the WCS events, but I don't think anyone will equate those to a GSL victory. And now Rogue has racked up 3 GSL Code S wins, tied for the most of any zerg, and second only to Maru in terms of total wins. Rogue has a legitimate chance to get the G5L, if he can stay motivated the year or two he has left before he has to go to the military.
Idk, I like both of these players, and instead of categorizing players into a hard ranking list, I think it's more accurate to sort them into tiers, where both Rogue and Serral are SSS tier monsters you have to be able defeat in order to make a name for yourself.
On May 07 2021 05:57 Xain0n wrote: Rogue has the average quality of his successes and the pristine record in offline bo7 over Serral, literally nothing else; he didn't even earn more than Serral in LoTV. Only a fanboy could think Rogue would be the uncontested best Zerg or compare him to Brood War's Jaedong.
By the way, I'm out of this thread; enjoy this obscene series and this redundant success, Rogue shouldn't have won this Code S but for sure deserved to win the finals.
You and your pathetic vitriol are so predictable, dissing Rogue whenever he wins something just because he's better than Serral and you know it. You only say he ''deserved'' to win the finals because again its against another player who's miles better than Serral. In fact you have been extremely bitter ever since the finals matchup was announced, god knows what sort of nonsense you would be spilling here if Maru had won.
Listing any of those folks as being ‘miles’ better than Serral is hyperbolic in the extreme.
Not that I condone silly bashing of Rogue for his fantastic achievements
Saying that Rogue's achievements aren't better than Serral's and that, in any of case, it would be foolish to claim that he is the uncontested best Zerg is "silly bashing"?
This is the first time I express my distaste for Rogue's way of winning his titles, I said literally nothing when he won his last Code S and Katowice; on the contrary, I am pretty sure I said that a player of Rogue's caliber couldn't end his career without a Code S final after he won his first. It's undeniable that Rogue is one of the greats, calling him GOAT and way better than Serral is instead excessive; be sure I am deeply convinced of what I am writing here.
I expected much more from a Code S final between Maru vs Rogue and I was genuinely horrified by Rogue's abusiveness and Maru's subpar performance. If I were a player I would personally be much closer to Rogue's approach to the game but as a fan I absolutely hate it and I also feel that he has won more than he would have deserved in the last year and half judging by his level of play; in any of case, those are just my thoughts, and I have to admit his clutchness and surgical dissection of his opponents in those awful finals are to be admired.
come on dude, didn't you say you were out of this thread?
On May 07 2021 05:57 Xain0n wrote: By the way, I'm out of this thread; enjoy this obscene series and this redundant success, Rogue shouldn't have won this Code S but for sure deserved to win the finals.
it's super entertaining watching people arguing, I haven't seen such a heated debate in a long time tbh personally, as great as Serral is until he wins a GSL-type tournament I can't call him the GOAT. I just value GSL titles too much
Involving Serral, or any foreigner in a GOAT discussion is laughable. They will never come close to even be a top 5. Its pointless. As for Rogue, he is so much better than Serral as is Manchester City compared Leyron Orient. There is no comparison. Rogue could get eliminated in the first round of all the next tournaments and he would still be far superior. Its a joke, lets just stop this nonsense.
Saying that Rogue is the GOAT is a complete joke. He is the 3rd or 4th best Zerg and hold a 12 place on Aligulac.
Does that sound like a GOAT to you? Winning in Korea when they 3 best players reside outside of Korea does not make you a GOAT contender. Even among the Koreans I would not rank him as a top 5 player.