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So, Rain defends the elephant grounds, while MVP defends the house that GOM built. No side has taken a championship from the other's league yet. Let the intrigue continue into next season!
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I stayed up all night to watch this, ended up falling alseep shortly into game 2 thinking it could be a boring cleansweep for drg with long broodlord games =/ guess i was wrong lol
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On October 28 2012 00:06 ZerglingTwins wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2012 23:48 nkr wrote:On October 27 2012 21:51 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:On October 27 2012 21:29 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:24 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:22 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:17 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:15 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:13 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:11 Patate wrote:
[quote]
It's their first SC2 tournament and the viewers didn't follow the BW--> SC2 transition at all, because they don't want to watch that game. Normally when there is a new thing, people are more interested... or at least they are curious. OGN lost so many fans when transitionning.
It's called building up a fanbase. There's nothing automatic about it. Are you kidding me? They already had a fanbase. This was supposed to be OGN's BW fanbase meet SC2 fanbase. If this game was interesting, it would have been bigger than the BW OSL of the last few years, but the audience was almost inexistant. Please, just realize how dead this game is compared to BW. They had a BW fanbase. And your pessimism is pathetic... Just because OGN does bad its first season, suddenly sc2 is dead. Spare me. When you think realism is pessimism, maybe you should stop being biased. I really wanted the KESPA players and OGN to revigorate SC2, but the only ones who can do it don't even have the competence to do so. They release a BALANCE patch every week for the beta HoTS, and think suddenly this game is going to be popular and growing. Your optimism is killing Starcraft.. it needs a reality check. The life is sc2 in korea doesn't hinge on the OSL, not at all. GSL is WAY bigger in korea, the OSL barely has any attention on the forums and such in korea (this a fact). You are blowing this out of proportion, and living in the past where the OSL was the shit and more important than anything. And please, don't go over into the whole saveHotS rant, it's so ridiculous. GSL finals fill out an auditorium which is not bad, but please go watch a BW finals from 2005 or so. I do understand that with streaming and all, people will have lower motivations to actually move out to an offline event, but these are the finals.. there should have been more people. and if you think i live in the past, go watch offline LoL events: people are still interested in E-sports.. just not Starcraft 2. you have to consider that in 2005 bw basically was esports but now we have more than just 1 game that people like to watch. bw wasnt an "esport" outside of korea. counter-strike probably had 100x the viewers of any bw event when it came to foreign views. If you count Chinese as foreigners, then your statement is certainly not true. Even in late stage of BW pro scene, there are still huge number of viewers for Proleague and OSL, usually larger than GSL viewers.
actually im pretty sure chinese people were a lot more into cs than bw in those days
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On October 28 2012 00:23 nkr wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2012 00:06 ZerglingTwins wrote:On October 27 2012 23:48 nkr wrote:On October 27 2012 21:51 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:On October 27 2012 21:29 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:24 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:22 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:17 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:15 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:13 monkybone wrote:
[quote]
It's called building up a fanbase. There's nothing automatic about it.
Are you kidding me? They already had a fanbase. This was supposed to be OGN's BW fanbase meet SC2 fanbase. If this game was interesting, it would have been bigger than the BW OSL of the last few years, but the audience was almost inexistant. Please, just realize how dead this game is compared to BW. They had a BW fanbase. And your pessimism is pathetic... Just because OGN does bad its first season, suddenly sc2 is dead. Spare me. When you think realism is pessimism, maybe you should stop being biased. I really wanted the KESPA players and OGN to revigorate SC2, but the only ones who can do it don't even have the competence to do so. They release a BALANCE patch every week for the beta HoTS, and think suddenly this game is going to be popular and growing. Your optimism is killing Starcraft.. it needs a reality check. The life is sc2 in korea doesn't hinge on the OSL, not at all. GSL is WAY bigger in korea, the OSL barely has any attention on the forums and such in korea (this a fact). You are blowing this out of proportion, and living in the past where the OSL was the shit and more important than anything. And please, don't go over into the whole saveHotS rant, it's so ridiculous. GSL finals fill out an auditorium which is not bad, but please go watch a BW finals from 2005 or so. I do understand that with streaming and all, people will have lower motivations to actually move out to an offline event, but these are the finals.. there should have been more people. and if you think i live in the past, go watch offline LoL events: people are still interested in E-sports.. just not Starcraft 2. you have to consider that in 2005 bw basically was esports but now we have more than just 1 game that people like to watch. bw wasnt an "esport" outside of korea. counter-strike probably had 100x the viewers of any bw event when it came to foreign views. If you count Chinese as foreigners, then your statement is certainly not true. Even in late stage of BW pro scene, there are still huge number of viewers for Proleague and OSL, usually larger than GSL viewers. actually im pretty sure chinese people were a lot more into cs than bw in those days
I'm Chinese, so I know. CS is hot for a while, but faded, BW fanbase is too hardcore to fade. Also better and more regular casting of proleague prolonged the BW pro scene in China. OSL final in shanghai is actually pretty hot tickets to get at that time. And a lot of other BW tournaments continued for a long time also.
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I'm chinese as well, so I know. There were plenty of huge tournaments for CS, and they all had a huge turnout.
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On October 28 2012 00:29 nkr wrote:
I'm chinese as well, so I know. There were plenty of huge tournaments for CS, and they all had a huge turnout.
I guess we are at different age groups.
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despite the chinese scene, the fact that more than 10 people watching day9 or artosis at a wcg was considered huge(not considering they never made a dime), while the cs stars of the time were making good salaries and signing autographs whereever they went is enough to realize bw had nothing on cs outside of korea
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On October 27 2012 22:07 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2012 22:01 lolmlg wrote:On October 27 2012 21:51 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:On October 27 2012 21:29 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:24 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:22 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:17 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:15 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:13 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:11 Patate wrote:
[quote]
It's their first SC2 tournament and the viewers didn't follow the BW--> SC2 transition at all, because they don't want to watch that game. Normally when there is a new thing, people are more interested... or at least they are curious. OGN lost so many fans when transitionning.
It's called building up a fanbase. There's nothing automatic about it. Are you kidding me? They already had a fanbase. This was supposed to be OGN's BW fanbase meet SC2 fanbase. If this game was interesting, it would have been bigger than the BW OSL of the last few years, but the audience was almost inexistant. Please, just realize how dead this game is compared to BW. They had a BW fanbase. And your pessimism is pathetic... Just because OGN does bad its first season, suddenly sc2 is dead. Spare me. When you think realism is pessimism, maybe you should stop being biased. I really wanted the KESPA players and OGN to revigorate SC2, but the only ones who can do it don't even have the competence to do so. They release a BALANCE patch every week for the beta HoTS, and think suddenly this game is going to be popular and growing. Your optimism is killing Starcraft.. it needs a reality check. The life is sc2 in korea doesn't hinge on the OSL, not at all. GSL is WAY bigger in korea, the OSL barely has any attention on the forums and such in korea (this a fact). You are blowing this out of proportion, and living in the past where the OSL was the shit and more important than anything. And please, don't go over into the whole saveHotS rant, it's so ridiculous. GSL finals fill out an auditorium which is not bad, but please go watch a BW finals from 2005 or so. I do understand that with streaming and all, people will have lower motivations to actually move out to an offline event, but these are the finals.. there should have been more people. and if you think i live in the past, go watch offline LoL events: people are still interested in E-sports.. just not Starcraft 2. you have to consider that in 2005 bw basically was esports but now we have more than just 1 game that people like to watch. People didn't watch BW because they didn't have any other video games to watch. They watched it because they liked it. There were lots of other proleagues on OGN and MBC Game. Most of them went away relatively quickly because the games weren't very good by comparison or as interesting to a spectator. Edit: Also, I don't think SC2 viewership would go up if LoL went away. yea and nowadays people like to watch other games as well. not sure what you are trying to tell me with that 
I'm not sure what you think your point was. You were trying to downplay Brood War audiences by saying it didn't have any competition. That's clearly false. And if someone didn't want to watch kids playing competitive video games, they would watch one of the other billion things on television. BW drew audiences on its own merit. I don't think anyone is confused by all the games they can watch now. They'll watch what they are most interested in, which is what has always happened with any kind of television broadcast. If SC2 isn't interesting, it won't last.
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Congrats Rain! Knew you could do it with no problem.
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United States7639 Posts
On October 28 2012 00:23 nkr wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2012 00:06 ZerglingTwins wrote:On October 27 2012 23:48 nkr wrote:On October 27 2012 21:51 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:On October 27 2012 21:29 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:24 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:22 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:17 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:15 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:13 monkybone wrote:
[quote]
It's called building up a fanbase. There's nothing automatic about it.
Are you kidding me? They already had a fanbase. This was supposed to be OGN's BW fanbase meet SC2 fanbase. If this game was interesting, it would have been bigger than the BW OSL of the last few years, but the audience was almost inexistant. Please, just realize how dead this game is compared to BW. They had a BW fanbase. And your pessimism is pathetic... Just because OGN does bad its first season, suddenly sc2 is dead. Spare me. When you think realism is pessimism, maybe you should stop being biased. I really wanted the KESPA players and OGN to revigorate SC2, but the only ones who can do it don't even have the competence to do so. They release a BALANCE patch every week for the beta HoTS, and think suddenly this game is going to be popular and growing. Your optimism is killing Starcraft.. it needs a reality check. The life is sc2 in korea doesn't hinge on the OSL, not at all. GSL is WAY bigger in korea, the OSL barely has any attention on the forums and such in korea (this a fact). You are blowing this out of proportion, and living in the past where the OSL was the shit and more important than anything. And please, don't go over into the whole saveHotS rant, it's so ridiculous. GSL finals fill out an auditorium which is not bad, but please go watch a BW finals from 2005 or so. I do understand that with streaming and all, people will have lower motivations to actually move out to an offline event, but these are the finals.. there should have been more people. and if you think i live in the past, go watch offline LoL events: people are still interested in E-sports.. just not Starcraft 2. you have to consider that in 2005 bw basically was esports but now we have more than just 1 game that people like to watch. bw wasnt an "esport" outside of korea. counter-strike probably had 100x the viewers of any bw event when it came to foreign views. If you count Chinese as foreigners, then your statement is certainly not true. Even in late stage of BW pro scene, there are still huge number of viewers for Proleague and OSL, usually larger than GSL viewers. actually im pretty sure chinese people were a lot more into cs than bw in those days
WCG 2009 in Chengdu, China during the SC:BW finals between Jaedong and Stork:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/khfNX.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/hVifh.jpg)
Yeah obviously China doesn't like BW.
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So I fell asleep... I take it from the general tone of the thread that one of two things happened
1)The crowd turn out was shit
or
2)It turned into a lategame ZvP Boring/wtfisthisshit fest every game?
Sigh... so much negativity and doomsday like proclamations recently..
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On October 28 2012 00:41 Kiett wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2012 00:23 nkr wrote:On October 28 2012 00:06 ZerglingTwins wrote:On October 27 2012 23:48 nkr wrote:On October 27 2012 21:51 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:On October 27 2012 21:29 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:24 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:22 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:17 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:15 Patate wrote:
[quote]
Are you kidding me? They already had a fanbase. This was supposed to be OGN's BW fanbase meet SC2 fanbase. If this game was interesting, it would have been bigger than the BW OSL of the last few years, but the audience was almost inexistant. Please, just realize how dead this game is compared to BW.
They had a BW fanbase. And your pessimism is pathetic... Just because OGN does bad its first season, suddenly sc2 is dead. Spare me. When you think realism is pessimism, maybe you should stop being biased. I really wanted the KESPA players and OGN to revigorate SC2, but the only ones who can do it don't even have the competence to do so. They release a BALANCE patch every week for the beta HoTS, and think suddenly this game is going to be popular and growing. Your optimism is killing Starcraft.. it needs a reality check. The life is sc2 in korea doesn't hinge on the OSL, not at all. GSL is WAY bigger in korea, the OSL barely has any attention on the forums and such in korea (this a fact). You are blowing this out of proportion, and living in the past where the OSL was the shit and more important than anything. And please, don't go over into the whole saveHotS rant, it's so ridiculous. GSL finals fill out an auditorium which is not bad, but please go watch a BW finals from 2005 or so. I do understand that with streaming and all, people will have lower motivations to actually move out to an offline event, but these are the finals.. there should have been more people. and if you think i live in the past, go watch offline LoL events: people are still interested in E-sports.. just not Starcraft 2. you have to consider that in 2005 bw basically was esports but now we have more than just 1 game that people like to watch. bw wasnt an "esport" outside of korea. counter-strike probably had 100x the viewers of any bw event when it came to foreign views. If you count Chinese as foreigners, then your statement is certainly not true. Even in late stage of BW pro scene, there are still huge number of viewers for Proleague and OSL, usually larger than GSL viewers. actually im pretty sure chinese people were a lot more into cs than bw in those days WCG 2009 in Chengdu, China during the SC:BW finals between Jaedong and Stork: Yeah obviously China doesn't like BW.
no one said china didn't like bw, are you even reading the posts you respond to?
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Rain is a legit best player in the world contender.
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Someone please post the Rain fangirl gif
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United States7639 Posts
On October 28 2012 00:54 nkr wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2012 00:41 Kiett wrote:On October 28 2012 00:23 nkr wrote:On October 28 2012 00:06 ZerglingTwins wrote:On October 27 2012 23:48 nkr wrote:On October 27 2012 21:51 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:On October 27 2012 21:29 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:24 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:22 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:17 monkybone wrote:
[quote]
They had a BW fanbase.
And your pessimism is pathetic...
Just because OGN does bad its first season, suddenly sc2 is dead. Spare me. When you think realism is pessimism, maybe you should stop being biased. I really wanted the KESPA players and OGN to revigorate SC2, but the only ones who can do it don't even have the competence to do so. They release a BALANCE patch every week for the beta HoTS, and think suddenly this game is going to be popular and growing. Your optimism is killing Starcraft.. it needs a reality check. The life is sc2 in korea doesn't hinge on the OSL, not at all. GSL is WAY bigger in korea, the OSL barely has any attention on the forums and such in korea (this a fact). You are blowing this out of proportion, and living in the past where the OSL was the shit and more important than anything. And please, don't go over into the whole saveHotS rant, it's so ridiculous. GSL finals fill out an auditorium which is not bad, but please go watch a BW finals from 2005 or so. I do understand that with streaming and all, people will have lower motivations to actually move out to an offline event, but these are the finals.. there should have been more people. and if you think i live in the past, go watch offline LoL events: people are still interested in E-sports.. just not Starcraft 2. you have to consider that in 2005 bw basically was esports but now we have more than just 1 game that people like to watch. bw wasnt an "esport" outside of korea. counter-strike probably had 100x the viewers of any bw event when it came to foreign views. If you count Chinese as foreigners, then your statement is certainly not true. Even in late stage of BW pro scene, there are still huge number of viewers for Proleague and OSL, usually larger than GSL viewers. actually im pretty sure chinese people were a lot more into cs than bw in those days WCG 2009 in Chengdu, China during the SC:BW finals between Jaedong and Stork: Yeah obviously China doesn't like BW. no one said china didn't like bw, are you even reading the posts you respond to?
This is also what you said:
bw wasnt an "esport" outside of korea. counter-strike probably had 100x the viewers of any bw event when it came to foreign views.
This event took place outside of Korea. The people watching are not Korean, and are therefore "foreign" viewers. There are many foreign people watching a competitive computer game. So why is it not an "esport" outside of Korea?
Let me know if there's ever been a counter-strike event with 100x that crowd.
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On October 27 2012 22:43 zerious wrote:And he's a big favourite going into the BWC, so might add another $100k in addition to his 80k salary 
Where did you get that 80k salary info from?
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Elephanter for life!
Good job, Rain!
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On October 28 2012 01:15 Titorelli wrote:Show nested quote +On October 27 2012 22:43 zerious wrote:And he's a big favourite going into the BWC, so might add another $100k in addition to his 80k salary Where did you get that 80k salary info from?
An interviewer asked if he was gonna get a 100million won from SKT, he just laughed it off and said that he already renewed his contract and from the same interview he said that money is not a concern for him at the moment. I'm assuming that, since he's the new SKT ace, he's getting paid big money.
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On October 28 2012 01:04 Kiett wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2012 00:54 nkr wrote:On October 28 2012 00:41 Kiett wrote:On October 28 2012 00:23 nkr wrote:On October 28 2012 00:06 ZerglingTwins wrote:On October 27 2012 23:48 nkr wrote:On October 27 2012 21:51 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:On October 27 2012 21:29 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:24 monkybone wrote:On October 27 2012 21:22 Patate wrote:
[quote]
When you think realism is pessimism, maybe you should stop being biased. I really wanted the KESPA players and OGN to revigorate SC2, but the only ones who can do it don't even have the competence to do so. They release a BALANCE patch every week for the beta HoTS, and think suddenly this game is going to be popular and growing. Your optimism is killing Starcraft.. it needs a reality check. The life is sc2 in korea doesn't hinge on the OSL, not at all. GSL is WAY bigger in korea, the OSL barely has any attention on the forums and such in korea (this a fact). You are blowing this out of proportion, and living in the past where the OSL was the shit and more important than anything. And please, don't go over into the whole saveHotS rant, it's so ridiculous. GSL finals fill out an auditorium which is not bad, but please go watch a BW finals from 2005 or so. I do understand that with streaming and all, people will have lower motivations to actually move out to an offline event, but these are the finals.. there should have been more people. and if you think i live in the past, go watch offline LoL events: people are still interested in E-sports.. just not Starcraft 2. you have to consider that in 2005 bw basically was esports but now we have more than just 1 game that people like to watch. bw wasnt an "esport" outside of korea. counter-strike probably had 100x the viewers of any bw event when it came to foreign views. If you count Chinese as foreigners, then your statement is certainly not true. Even in late stage of BW pro scene, there are still huge number of viewers for Proleague and OSL, usually larger than GSL viewers. actually im pretty sure chinese people were a lot more into cs than bw in those days WCG 2009 in Chengdu, China during the SC:BW finals between Jaedong and Stork: Yeah obviously China doesn't like BW. no one said china didn't like bw, are you even reading the posts you respond to? This is also what you said: Show nested quote +bw wasnt an "esport" outside of korea. counter-strike probably had 100x the viewers of any bw event when it came to foreign views. This event took place outside of Korea. The people watching are not Korean, and are therefore "foreign" viewers. There are many foreign people watching a competitive computer game. So why is it not an "esport" outside of Korea? Let me know if there's ever been a counter-strike event with 100x that crowd.
yah if you had also read all of the conversation you'd see that it was regarding the status of bw/cs in 2005. Not in recent years.
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United States7639 Posts
On October 28 2012 01:42 nkr wrote:Show nested quote +On October 28 2012 01:04 Kiett wrote:On October 28 2012 00:54 nkr wrote:On October 28 2012 00:41 Kiett wrote:On October 28 2012 00:23 nkr wrote:On October 28 2012 00:06 ZerglingTwins wrote:On October 27 2012 23:48 nkr wrote:On October 27 2012 21:51 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:On October 27 2012 21:29 Patate wrote:On October 27 2012 21:24 monkybone wrote:
[quote]
The life is sc2 in korea doesn't hinge on the OSL, not at all. GSL is WAY bigger in korea, the OSL barely has any attention on the forums and such in korea (this a fact). You are blowing this out of proportion, and living in the past where the OSL was the shit and more important than anything.
And please, don't go over into the whole saveHotS rant, it's so ridiculous. GSL finals fill out an auditorium which is not bad, but please go watch a BW finals from 2005 or so. I do understand that with streaming and all, people will have lower motivations to actually move out to an offline event, but these are the finals.. there should have been more people. and if you think i live in the past, go watch offline LoL events: people are still interested in E-sports.. just not Starcraft 2. you have to consider that in 2005 bw basically was esports but now we have more than just 1 game that people like to watch. bw wasnt an "esport" outside of korea. counter-strike probably had 100x the viewers of any bw event when it came to foreign views. If you count Chinese as foreigners, then your statement is certainly not true. Even in late stage of BW pro scene, there are still huge number of viewers for Proleague and OSL, usually larger than GSL viewers. actually im pretty sure chinese people were a lot more into cs than bw in those days WCG 2009 in Chengdu, China during the SC:BW finals between Jaedong and Stork: Yeah obviously China doesn't like BW. no one said china didn't like bw, are you even reading the posts you respond to? This is also what you said: bw wasnt an "esport" outside of korea. counter-strike probably had 100x the viewers of any bw event when it came to foreign views. This event took place outside of Korea. The people watching are not Korean, and are therefore "foreign" viewers. There are many foreign people watching a competitive computer game. So why is it not an "esport" outside of Korea? Let me know if there's ever been a counter-strike event with 100x that crowd. yah if you had also read all of the conversation you'd see that it was regarding the status of bw/cs in 2005. Not in recent years.
lol that's irrelevant. I mean, what are you trying to say? That foreign BW interest actually rose between 2005 and 2009? 2005 is the often cited comparison year because that was the peak of BW success in Korea, and things slowly started to decline from there. The 2005 crowds were larger than the 2009 ones. So if anything, all you did was just disprove your own point even more.
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EPT
