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So I hear Bios pretty good.
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Really, really well played by theStC. Sick.
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Norway25712 Posts
On May 17 2012 21:45 KristofferAG wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2012 21:40 KristofferAG wrote:On May 17 2012 21:37 KristofferAG wrote: ByunPrime v TheStC
1 - 0Maps:Dual Sight - ByunPrimeDaybreakCloud Kingdom05.00ByunPrime is spawning as the red Terran in the 1 o'clock position. TheStC is spawning as the blue Terran in the 7 o'clock position. Gas first for StC. Rax on 12 for Byun. StC following up with a Rax on his ramp. Factory follow-up next to the rax. CC down for Byun. Byun taking both gas in his main. Tech lab on the barracks for StC. Adding on a Starport on the tech lab. Factory started for Byun. Bunker up on the natural of Byun.
10.00
First Banshee on the way.
Starport on the way for Byun.
StC getting a CC on his natural. Starting Stim.
Byun getting a siege tank off his factory, Viking in the Starport.
Two rax added on for StC.
The Banshee starts doing damage, kills of multiple SCVs. Very nice micro kills of multiple Marines as well.
Hellions run into the natural. Total of 16 SCVs killed!
Stim finishing up for StC.
Byun going for a third CC.
Starport added on to a Reactor for StC, Factory on tech lab.
Banshee from Stc moving towards natural again.
Drop from Stc going into the main of Byun!
The drop is spotted and taken out, but the Banshee still kills multiple SCVs. Repair micro from Byun saves him from losing more. Banshee falls.
15.00
Combat shields and +1 attack coming in gfrom StC. Adding on a CC and Armory as well as a second Engineering Bay.
Another Factory added on for Byun.
StC taking the fourth Refinery on his natural, adding on another Factory and starting +1 armor.
+1 attack and +1 mech attack started by StC. Marines try to pressure but siege tank is in position. Siege tech started for StC.
2 Armories added on for Byun.
2 more Barracks for StC.
Blue Flame started for Byun.
StC has taken his third and getting a single gas on it.
+1 mech attack and armor started for Byun.
+2 armor for infantry started by StC.
StC moving in on the natural of Byun. Decides to siege up at the bottom fo the ramp.
Fourth CC on the way for StC, getting second gas on third. Getting Concussive shells and +2 infantry attack.
Two more Factories and an Engineering bay for Byun.
A fifth CC added on for StC.
Double drop from StC goes into the main but Vikings and Marines are waiting. Hellions run in to clean up but multiple fall.
StC sieges up the third of Byun, drops Marines on the tanks and kills multiple. Byung forced to repair.
18.00
Reinforcements from StC come in, the remaining Siege tanks and Hellions fall, forcing Byun to lift off his CC and pull it back.
StC taking the top left and middle bases, getting +3 infantry attack.
Reinforcements from StC comes in, run up thge ramp to the natural while the main brunt of his army goes in from the third. The remaining siege tanks fall for Byun, gg is called.
TheStC ties it up 1-1!
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nice drops. Marines are so cheap compared to the mech army that he can keep dropping for the rest of his life.
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4713 Posts
On May 17 2012 21:46 Yello wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2012 21:42 Zorgaz wrote:On May 17 2012 21:35 Destructicon wrote:On May 17 2012 21:31 Tehs Tehklz wrote:On May 17 2012 21:23 FakeDeath wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. Did you even watch Game 2 and Game 3? Yeah, man. Did you? Artosis even kept talking about how important fungals were. He mentioned it probably 10 times, haha. On May 17 2012 21:24 LittLeD wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. However one feels about the balance of late game ZvT (I personally think its near-perfectly balanced), you should be able to appriciate the extreme precision of the multi-tasking, stress management, micro, macro, positioning...everything, that went on in that last game. Just suberb from both parts really. I think it is pretty balanced, too, I just think the manner in which that balance is achieved is very lame. Terran gains an incredible amount of cost effectiveness from controlling their units well. Instead of giving Zerg the same opportunities to showcase good control, Blizzard gives them a spell that takes that opportunity away from the Terran player. That is about as backwards an idea as I can imagine. Brood War TvZ with defilers & lurkers against science vessels & bio is a good example of control vs control as opposed to SC2's control vs control-prevention. You know what I mean? Very well said. Not talking about balance, but strictly design, all races should have micro and control opportunities to the level of where it indeed becomes control vs control. Instead Z and P seem very focused on control prevention with FF and FG. It indeed feels lame and unsatisfying. Anyway, really great game. I didn't expect TheStC to make that small comeback and threaten Byun, I also didn't expect Byun to be able to break him from there, cool game overall. Agree with you guys 100%. Atleast you can dodge storm. I'm okay with some control prevention in the game but it's too much. And FF and FG are too deeply rooted into the races. It just makes for very unsatisfying fights. So now, after we have all agreed on what the problem is, how do we fix it? Blizz can't just take out FF or FG in HotS. Personally I would hope for a change to fungal to slow down units instead of completely locking them down. Another possibility for Blizz is to give both Zerg and Toss other units which are more micro rewarding and more attractive to use then Infestors for example. Any other ideas? And please don't say stuff like "remove Infestors" or "remove sentries" because that's never gonna happen.
I'm not really sure about zerg, I have some ideas for them, but I do have a lot of suggestions regarding how to fix Toss design. Of course it would require an expansion to make it work, since there are some big changes needed.
Edit: Nice game from TheStC, harass from the beginning, edging a lead to go into the mid game then caught Byun out of position, not very spectacular, but overall clean game plan.
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Still no mech TvT victories.
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Norway25712 Posts
All righty, last game gogo. StC can do this. Give me 4/12.
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7 wrong bets in a row ....
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On May 17 2012 21:46 Yello wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2012 21:42 Zorgaz wrote:On May 17 2012 21:35 Destructicon wrote:On May 17 2012 21:31 Tehs Tehklz wrote:On May 17 2012 21:23 FakeDeath wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. Did you even watch Game 2 and Game 3? Yeah, man. Did you? Artosis even kept talking about how important fungals were. He mentioned it probably 10 times, haha. On May 17 2012 21:24 LittLeD wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. However one feels about the balance of late game ZvT (I personally think its near-perfectly balanced), you should be able to appriciate the extreme precision of the multi-tasking, stress management, micro, macro, positioning...everything, that went on in that last game. Just suberb from both parts really. I think it is pretty balanced, too, I just think the manner in which that balance is achieved is very lame. Terran gains an incredible amount of cost effectiveness from controlling their units well. Instead of giving Zerg the same opportunities to showcase good control, Blizzard gives them a spell that takes that opportunity away from the Terran player. That is about as backwards an idea as I can imagine. Brood War TvZ with defilers & lurkers against science vessels & bio is a good example of control vs control as opposed to SC2's control vs control-prevention. You know what I mean? Very well said. Not talking about balance, but strictly design, all races should have micro and control opportunities to the level of where it indeed becomes control vs control. Instead Z and P seem very focused on control prevention with FF and FG. It indeed feels lame and unsatisfying. Anyway, really great game. I didn't expect TheStC to make that small comeback and threaten Byun, I also didn't expect Byun to be able to break him from there, cool game overall. Agree with you guys 100%. Atleast you can dodge storm. I'm okay with some control prevention in the game but it's too much. And FF and FG are too deeply rooted into the races. It just makes for very unsatisfying fights. So now, after we have all agreed on what the problem is, how do we fix it? Blizz can't just take out FF or FG in HotS. Personally I would hope for a change to fungal to slow down units instead of completely locking them down. Another possibility for Blizz is to give both Zerg and Toss other units which are more micro rewarding and more attractive to use then Infestors for example. Any other ideas? And please don't say stuff like "remove Infestors" or "remove sentries" because that's never gonna happen.
I always wanted fungal to slow units to a point where they get stunned at the end of the duration for a few seconds. I.e you can try to split to minimize the damage instead of being clumped up.
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Norway25712 Posts
"The Super Terran Commander".
Much better.
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4713 Posts
On May 17 2012 21:49 YyapSsap wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2012 21:46 Yello wrote:On May 17 2012 21:42 Zorgaz wrote:On May 17 2012 21:35 Destructicon wrote:On May 17 2012 21:31 Tehs Tehklz wrote:On May 17 2012 21:23 FakeDeath wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. Did you even watch Game 2 and Game 3? Yeah, man. Did you? Artosis even kept talking about how important fungals were. He mentioned it probably 10 times, haha. On May 17 2012 21:24 LittLeD wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. However one feels about the balance of late game ZvT (I personally think its near-perfectly balanced), you should be able to appriciate the extreme precision of the multi-tasking, stress management, micro, macro, positioning...everything, that went on in that last game. Just suberb from both parts really. I think it is pretty balanced, too, I just think the manner in which that balance is achieved is very lame. Terran gains an incredible amount of cost effectiveness from controlling their units well. Instead of giving Zerg the same opportunities to showcase good control, Blizzard gives them a spell that takes that opportunity away from the Terran player. That is about as backwards an idea as I can imagine. Brood War TvZ with defilers & lurkers against science vessels & bio is a good example of control vs control as opposed to SC2's control vs control-prevention. You know what I mean? Very well said. Not talking about balance, but strictly design, all races should have micro and control opportunities to the level of where it indeed becomes control vs control. Instead Z and P seem very focused on control prevention with FF and FG. It indeed feels lame and unsatisfying. Anyway, really great game. I didn't expect TheStC to make that small comeback and threaten Byun, I also didn't expect Byun to be able to break him from there, cool game overall. Agree with you guys 100%. Atleast you can dodge storm. I'm okay with some control prevention in the game but it's too much. And FF and FG are too deeply rooted into the races. It just makes for very unsatisfying fights. So now, after we have all agreed on what the problem is, how do we fix it? Blizz can't just take out FF or FG in HotS. Personally I would hope for a change to fungal to slow down units instead of completely locking them down. Another possibility for Blizz is to give both Zerg and Toss other units which are more micro rewarding and more attractive to use then Infestors for example. Any other ideas? And please don't say stuff like "remove Infestors" or "remove sentries" because that's never gonna happen. I always wanted fungal to slow units to a point where they get stunned at the end of the duration for a few seconds. I.e you can try to split to minimize the damage instead of being clumped up.
Or, fungal slows for the duration but, if you move your units, the slow dissipates over time, if you don't move your units the slow becomes progressively worst until it becomes a root for the last 1 second.
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On May 17 2012 21:49 YyapSsap wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2012 21:46 Yello wrote:On May 17 2012 21:42 Zorgaz wrote:On May 17 2012 21:35 Destructicon wrote:On May 17 2012 21:31 Tehs Tehklz wrote:On May 17 2012 21:23 FakeDeath wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. Did you even watch Game 2 and Game 3? Yeah, man. Did you? Artosis even kept talking about how important fungals were. He mentioned it probably 10 times, haha. On May 17 2012 21:24 LittLeD wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. However one feels about the balance of late game ZvT (I personally think its near-perfectly balanced), you should be able to appriciate the extreme precision of the multi-tasking, stress management, micro, macro, positioning...everything, that went on in that last game. Just suberb from both parts really. I think it is pretty balanced, too, I just think the manner in which that balance is achieved is very lame. Terran gains an incredible amount of cost effectiveness from controlling their units well. Instead of giving Zerg the same opportunities to showcase good control, Blizzard gives them a spell that takes that opportunity away from the Terran player. That is about as backwards an idea as I can imagine. Brood War TvZ with defilers & lurkers against science vessels & bio is a good example of control vs control as opposed to SC2's control vs control-prevention. You know what I mean? Very well said. Not talking about balance, but strictly design, all races should have micro and control opportunities to the level of where it indeed becomes control vs control. Instead Z and P seem very focused on control prevention with FF and FG. It indeed feels lame and unsatisfying. Anyway, really great game. I didn't expect TheStC to make that small comeback and threaten Byun, I also didn't expect Byun to be able to break him from there, cool game overall. Agree with you guys 100%. Atleast you can dodge storm. I'm okay with some control prevention in the game but it's too much. And FF and FG are too deeply rooted into the races. It just makes for very unsatisfying fights. So now, after we have all agreed on what the problem is, how do we fix it? Blizz can't just take out FF or FG in HotS. Personally I would hope for a change to fungal to slow down units instead of completely locking them down. Another possibility for Blizz is to give both Zerg and Toss other units which are more micro rewarding and more attractive to use then Infestors for example. Any other ideas? And please don't say stuff like "remove Infestors" or "remove sentries" because that's never gonna happen. I always wanted fungal to slow units to a point where they get stunned at the end of the duration for a few seconds. I.e you can try to split to minimize the damage instead of being clumped up.
The problem with this change is that Terran gets even more rewarded for better micro while Zerg can still only throw down fungals and a-move. How do we give Zerg micro capabilities?
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On May 17 2012 21:35 AxionSteel wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2012 21:31 Tehs Tehklz wrote:On May 17 2012 21:23 FakeDeath wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. Did you even watch Game 2 and Game 3? Yeah, man. Did you? Artosis even kept talking about how important fungals were. He mentioned it probably 10 times, haha. On May 17 2012 21:24 LittLeD wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. However one feels about the balance of late game ZvT (I personally think its near-perfectly balanced), you should be able to appriciate the extreme precision of the multi-tasking, stress management, micro, macro, positioning...everything, that went on in that last game. Just suberb from both parts really. I think it is pretty balanced, too, I just think the manner in which that balance is achieved is very lame. Terran gains an incredible amount of cost effectiveness from controlling their units well. Instead of giving Zerg the same opportunities to showcase good control, Blizzard gives them a spell that takes that opportunity away from the Terran player. That is about as backwards an idea as I can imagine. Brood War TvZ with defilers & lurkers against science vessels & bio is a good example of control vs control as opposed to SC2's control vs control-prevention. You know what I mean? They're also introducing that viper thing in Hots which greatly reduces the range of the terran units, or something. So it will be even worse over there.
I actually kind of like that because there is no root. Since the units can still be moved, they can be controlled around the spell. That spell will just eliminate the bonus of clumping - units in the back will be unable to contribute. So, splitting and good control will be the counter to that spell. Of course, combined with fungals...
On May 17 2012 21:46 Yello wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2012 21:42 Zorgaz wrote:On May 17 2012 21:35 Destructicon wrote:On May 17 2012 21:31 Tehs Tehklz wrote:On May 17 2012 21:23 FakeDeath wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. Did you even watch Game 2 and Game 3? Yeah, man. Did you? Artosis even kept talking about how important fungals were. He mentioned it probably 10 times, haha. On May 17 2012 21:24 LittLeD wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. However one feels about the balance of late game ZvT (I personally think its near-perfectly balanced), you should be able to appriciate the extreme precision of the multi-tasking, stress management, micro, macro, positioning...everything, that went on in that last game. Just suberb from both parts really. I think it is pretty balanced, too, I just think the manner in which that balance is achieved is very lame. Terran gains an incredible amount of cost effectiveness from controlling their units well. Instead of giving Zerg the same opportunities to showcase good control, Blizzard gives them a spell that takes that opportunity away from the Terran player. That is about as backwards an idea as I can imagine. Brood War TvZ with defilers & lurkers against science vessels & bio is a good example of control vs control as opposed to SC2's control vs control-prevention. You know what I mean? Very well said. Not talking about balance, but strictly design, all races should have micro and control opportunities to the level of where it indeed becomes control vs control. Instead Z and P seem very focused on control prevention with FF and FG. It indeed feels lame and unsatisfying. Anyway, really great game. I didn't expect TheStC to make that small comeback and threaten Byun, I also didn't expect Byun to be able to break him from there, cool game overall. Agree with you guys 100%. Atleast you can dodge storm. I'm okay with some control prevention in the game but it's too much. And FF and FG are too deeply rooted into the races. It just makes for very unsatisfying fights. So now, after we have all agreed on what the problem is, how do we fix it? Blizz can't just take out FF or FG in HotS. Personally I would hope for a change to fungal to slow down units instead of completely locking them down. Another possibility for Blizz is to give both Zerg and Toss other units which are more micro rewarding and more attractive to use then Infestors for example. Any other ideas? And please don't say stuff like "remove Infestors" or "remove sentries" because that's never gonna happen.
I think fungals should not root, but maybe disable spells instead. So, marines can still be microed but you have to do it without stim and tanks could move only if they are unseiged. I feel like that would still be a powerful spell.
Force fields could function like dark swarm from Brood War or the bubble shield from Halo. A force field would be cast on zealots or in front of tanks to force units to fight zealots in melee range. Zealots with force fields would still be effective area control, as nothing should be more cost effective in melee range than zealots, but then the spell would not prevent micro or control, either.
Graviton beam could be an AoE spell that simply lets phoenix attack anything in the field, but things can move out of the field.
Concussive shells can just go away. Honestly, I think marauders need to be changed a bit. Less range in order to force them to be microed to the front and damage reduction to make them more about meat shield and less about kill everything. I say give the role of vs. armored DPS to the reaper - make D-8 charge their only attack and drop the damage in line with what marauders are now. This would add another level of control and variety to bio.
Eh, I don't know, I have a lot of silly little ideas like this that I think would make the game better.
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der linker blinker ist kaputt? :p
User was warned for this post
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On May 17 2012 21:51 Yello wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2012 21:49 YyapSsap wrote:On May 17 2012 21:46 Yello wrote:On May 17 2012 21:42 Zorgaz wrote:On May 17 2012 21:35 Destructicon wrote:On May 17 2012 21:31 Tehs Tehklz wrote:On May 17 2012 21:23 FakeDeath wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. Did you even watch Game 2 and Game 3? Yeah, man. Did you? Artosis even kept talking about how important fungals were. He mentioned it probably 10 times, haha. On May 17 2012 21:24 LittLeD wrote:On May 17 2012 21:20 Tehs Tehklz wrote:
People keep saying how awesome those last two matches were, but they were both basically just Yugioh chain fungal-ing everything and fungal growth is just so lame. I mean, it is a spell specifically designed to remove micro and lower the cost effectiveness that Terran gains from good control because Blizzard did not give Zerg the same potential. The problem is that without it, Zerg would be weak to the point of being broken...again. It is the same issue with Warpgate necessitating weak Gateway units. Sure, you end up with a fairly balanced game, but it is done in the stupidest way possible. However one feels about the balance of late game ZvT (I personally think its near-perfectly balanced), you should be able to appriciate the extreme precision of the multi-tasking, stress management, micro, macro, positioning...everything, that went on in that last game. Just suberb from both parts really. I think it is pretty balanced, too, I just think the manner in which that balance is achieved is very lame. Terran gains an incredible amount of cost effectiveness from controlling their units well. Instead of giving Zerg the same opportunities to showcase good control, Blizzard gives them a spell that takes that opportunity away from the Terran player. That is about as backwards an idea as I can imagine. Brood War TvZ with defilers & lurkers against science vessels & bio is a good example of control vs control as opposed to SC2's control vs control-prevention. You know what I mean? Very well said. Not talking about balance, but strictly design, all races should have micro and control opportunities to the level of where it indeed becomes control vs control. Instead Z and P seem very focused on control prevention with FF and FG. It indeed feels lame and unsatisfying. Anyway, really great game. I didn't expect TheStC to make that small comeback and threaten Byun, I also didn't expect Byun to be able to break him from there, cool game overall. Agree with you guys 100%. Atleast you can dodge storm. I'm okay with some control prevention in the game but it's too much. And FF and FG are too deeply rooted into the races. It just makes for very unsatisfying fights. So now, after we have all agreed on what the problem is, how do we fix it? Blizz can't just take out FF or FG in HotS. Personally I would hope for a change to fungal to slow down units instead of completely locking them down. Another possibility for Blizz is to give both Zerg and Toss other units which are more micro rewarding and more attractive to use then Infestors for example. Any other ideas? And please don't say stuff like "remove Infestors" or "remove sentries" because that's never gonna happen. I always wanted fungal to slow units to a point where they get stunned at the end of the duration for a few seconds. I.e you can try to split to minimize the damage instead of being clumped up. The problem with this change is that Terran gets even more rewarded for better micro while Zerg can still only throw down fungals and a-move. How do we give Zerg micro capabilities?
OR, you could make ghosts to throw 3-4 emps to completely nullify infestors?
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Norway25712 Posts
ByunPrime v TheStC
1 - 1Maps:Dual Sight - ByunPrimeDaybreak - TheStCCloud Kingdom05.00ByunPrime is spawning as the red Terran in the 1 o'clock position. TheStC is spawning as the blue Terran in the 7 o'clock position. Both players walling off with a 12-rax. 1 rax expand for both players, Byun a bit ahead, skipping the supply depot. Double gas for Byun. Really quick third CC for StC! Factory on the way for Byun. Three marines from StC tries to pressure, but is pushed back. Double rax added on for Stc.
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United Kingdom38257 Posts
I love that TheStC is putting on light marine pressure while doing this greedy build. Going to keep Byun pinned back a bit.
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On May 17 2012 21:51 Fragile51 wrote:
der linker blinker ist kaputt? :p
Der linke Blinker ist kaputt.
Mein linker Blinker ist kaputt.
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Double expo, crush later or get destroyed now.
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wow khaldor losing his identity, driving on the left side lol
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EPT
