A: Pause the stream for a couple of seconds, then click play. If that doesn't work. Close the stream entirely and re-open it. Q: GOM TV stream won't open for me. What do I do?
A: DL the latest version of GOM. Make sure you've enabled the Live stream feature GOM require you to. If nothing else. Click on the Link below the stream Link above the FAQs. Q: I'm watching the same stream as everybody else but it seems like I'm behind all the time. What'S up?
A: GOM streams tend to lag for some reason, therefore when the casters go on break and come back (cause u need to be able to hear to know if you're fast forwarding or not), hit "c" on your computer to fast forward. U should keep hitting "c" until you reach around 2.0x or 3.0x. When you hear the noises start to skip, then hit "z" to return back to 1.0x Speed. Do this every time because it never stops lagging Q: I bought the GSL ticket but I can't watch GSTL HQ?
A: GSTL is not included in the package. You have to buy the tickets separately
oGs should lose, supernova is not back, zenio is not back. They only have literally Vines, ForGG, slumping TOP and InCa to hold the fort. 5-1 to MVP if Genius/DRG is sent 2nd. Else would be slightly closer at a 5-3 score.
Everything hinges on whether DRG/Genius plays. That's not to say that MvP relies entirely on those two, nor am i implying that oGsTL cannot take down those two players, but MvP's chances are much much better if they can have those two compete, because of DRG's ZvT and Genius' PvZ and PvP.
On March 09 2012 15:47 Whatson wrote: Everything hinges on whether DRG/Genius plays. That's not to say that MvP relies entirely on those two, nor am i implying that oGsTL cannot take down those two players, but MvP's chances are much much better if they can have those two compete, because of DRG's ZvT and Genius' PvZ and PvP.
OGS has been weak against protoss all long even when MC was still around. We will probably see multiple kills from MVP protosses as thewind doesn't know how to utilize inca. Supernova who's good at timing attacks in tvp is also not around today. Not that it matters, OGS just doesn't have enough firepower compared to MVP. MVP not only can choose players based on their specialized match-up, most of their players are not vulnerable to any weak matchups either.
On March 09 2012 16:06 babysimba wrote: OGS has been weak against protoss all long even when MC was still around. We will probably see multiple kills from MVP protosses as thewind doesn't know how to utilize inca. Supernova who's good at timing attacks in tvp is also not around today. Not that it matters, OGS just doesn't have enough firepower compared to MVP. MVP not only can choose players based on their specialized match-up, most of their players are not vulnerable to any weak matchups either.
Isn't Inca like stupid good at PvP? There's at least one good vP they have. Still have to say MVP are my pick to win it, but should be very interesting to see the choices and lineups.
All I want is for Forgg to do well. Show his ever improving game knowledge and take a few sets. oGs doesn't even need to win, so long as Forgg does well. PLEASE!!
Anyone else having problems with the gomplayer? When i start the stream i only get sound and the first frame of the video, it doesn't play the video after that. halp :<
On March 09 2012 18:18 Hall0wed wrote: I wasn't paying attention but when I peaked at the MVP bench I saw no Genius? Did my eyes just miss him or is he not there or am I going insane?
Not that MVP should even need him today.
Yeah, Khaldor said so as well, Genius maybe trolling backstage waiting to come out when ogs least expect it wearing a cape while blowing bubbles or something :p
On March 09 2012 18:25 neoghaleon55 wrote: oooh man I totally forgot oGs is missing MC that's a huge blow to their roster...
MC was always cool to have in oGs, not even just for the games he won but for the ceremonies he did when he won :p who still remembers mc's boothstomping ceremony? :p
On March 09 2012 18:39 Jyvblamo wrote: The MVP team reminds me of the old MBCgame Heroes team from ~2007. A group of energetic guys who just love to have fun playing the game.
Finale's been looking pretty damn sick on the MVP stream as well as last week in GSTL, have high hopes for this dude. Not in the least because he kinda looks like Reach (Only a lot less buff)
On March 09 2012 18:56 Ribbon wrote: For a team with such good players, MVP sure has some really awful players. What the hell was that attack? He did nothing right.
He's choking. He normally has amazing army control.
On March 09 2012 18:56 Ribbon wrote: For a team with such good players, MVP sure has some really awful players. What the hell was that attack? He did nothing right.
I like how wolf and khaldor completely missed the entire drop in finale's base that the observer was flipping out about the entire time it was going on.
On March 09 2012 18:58 hugedong wrote: I like how wolf and khaldor completely missed the entire drop in finale's base that the observer was flipping out about the entire time it was going on.
On March 09 2012 19:03 the`postman wrote: Sniper is practically Code S and almost took a series from IM.MVP, don't get why he wouldn't play.
Sniper's ZvZ is just horrible. oGs could then procide sending TheWind or another mediocre Z and Sniper would be out. Monster is the better all-around player.
So, Inca's either gonna make dt's and their opponent will play crazy greedily again because they think inca being inca is way too predictable or inca's gonna play crazily greedy and his opponent will prepare for DT's to a fault because...it's inca z_z
On March 09 2012 19:42 Fragile51 wrote: So, Inca's either gonna make dt's and their opponent will play crazy greedily again because they think inca being inca is way too predictable or inca's gonna play crazily greedy and his opponent will prepare for DT's to a fault because...it's inca z_z
On March 09 2012 19:42 Fragile51 wrote: So, Inca's either gonna make dt's and their opponent will play crazy greedily again because they think inca being inca is way too predictable or inca's gonna play crazily greedy and his opponent will prepare for DT's to a fault because...it's inca z_z
of course it is Inca and obviously he wont play greedy and just go DT :D
On March 09 2012 19:42 Fragile51 wrote: So, Inca's either gonna make dt's and their opponent will play crazy greedily again because they think inca being inca is way too predictable or inca's gonna play crazily greedy and his opponent will prepare for DT's to a fault because...it's inca z_z
To think i see the day where stay on ultra tech actually pays off lol. Carriers do shit against ultras. Should just go mass upgraded void rays if toss want to deal with hive tech switch.
On March 09 2012 20:00 babysimba wrote: To think i see the day where stay on ultra tech actually pays off lol. Carriers do shit against ultras. Should just go mass upgraded void rays if toss want to deal with hive tech switch.
and immortals probably cause immortals love ultras.
Inca has no scouting, so he assumed his opponent would do the standard muta into ling/bling into infestor into bl. The carriers were a great blind choice versus broods, but his opponent unfortunately went for ultras.
On March 09 2012 20:09 silverstyle wrote: leading with your BL against mass carrier, sounds like a plan to me...
I don't know how you should engage tbh, if you lead with corruptors and lose them all instantly then your bl's are free anyway. if the higher hp broods tank the first bit of damage then your corruptors can come up to get some good shots off?
So mmm has someone won with carriers in a "normal" situation when he was not HUUUUUGELY ahead (and even when he was ahead) in a progame yet ? Maybe Genius once ? Don't remember...
On March 09 2012 20:18 Nouar wrote: So mmm has someone won with carriers in a "normal" situation when he was not HUUUUUGELY ahead (and even when he was ahead) in a progame yet ? Maybe Genius once ? Don't remember...
On March 09 2012 20:18 Nouar wrote: So mmm has someone won with carriers in a "normal" situation when he was not HUUUUUGELY ahead (and even when he was ahead) in a progame yet ? Maybe Genius once ? Don't remember...
I recall someone killing Keen with a two base carrier timing on daybreak. I believe it was Hongun (as he was the only one to actually use carriers in gsl :p)
On March 09 2012 20:18 HwangjaeTerran wrote: InCa's problem was the passivity, maybe he was aiming for an unstoppable 200/200 army, but he should've put some pressure on Monster too :/
He was trying to STARVE Monster. He was so so so so so much more efficient, that it almost worked. Even though it lost, this was the best usage of carriers I've ever seen
On March 09 2012 20:18 HwangjaeTerran wrote: InCa's problem was the passivity, maybe he was aiming for an unstoppable 200/200 army, but he should've put some pressure on Monster too :/
He was trying to STARVE Monster. He was so so so so so much more efficient, that it almost worked. Even though it lost, this was the best usage of carriers I've ever seen
I think it was that one mistake where he got cornered. If he stayed as he was, and slowly turtled even more, he may have won
On March 09 2012 20:18 Nouar wrote: So mmm has someone won with carriers in a "normal" situation when he was not HUUUUUGELY ahead (and even when he was ahead) in a progame yet ? Maybe Genius once ? Don't remember...
Well would you call this a normal game either? I mean the zerg took every expansion on the map without contest.
It reminds me of Hong-un Games abusive Vortex Toilet Storm and killing all Zerg army with 2 Storms its just ridiculous hard to kill a Protoss when the turtle and use Momma ship. Its friqin frustrating.
On March 09 2012 20:18 HwangjaeTerran wrote: InCa's problem was the passivity, maybe he was aiming for an unstoppable 200/200 army, but he should've put some pressure on Monster too :/
He was trying to STARVE Monster. He was so so so so so much more efficient, that it almost worked. Even though it lost, this was the best usage of carriers I've ever seen
I think it was that one mistake where he got cornered. If he stayed as he was, and slowly turtled even more, he may have won
carrier ((((((((((((((( as much as i love the unit, i think it either need some massive change or it just has no place in hots
anw, on the game, Inca looks quite good in his pvz recently, may be it is a trade off as his pvp is not that "imba" anymore, but good to see a more complete player than just a pvp master
On March 09 2012 20:18 HwangjaeTerran wrote: InCa's problem was the passivity, maybe he was aiming for an unstoppable 200/200 army, but he should've put some pressure on Monster too :/
He was trying to STARVE Monster. He was so so so so so much more efficient, that it almost worked. Even though it lost, this was the best usage of carriers I've ever seen
The only issue with that is the creep spread becomes ridiculous, to the point that there are suddenly a million spores outside your base when you want to move out. :/
On March 09 2012 20:19 XRaDiiX wrote: Takes 70% of map still can't kill Protoss oh god i'd rage so hard.
Monster could had won so much earlier, but he was not cost effective and just a-moved, remax a-moved. I'm curious why he didn't use more ling runby in his base, or perhaps nydus/drops. InCa had a very very slow deathball, and Monster had lots of statis defense, so he could just easily sacrifice those ling runbys or something and then remax.
On March 09 2012 20:18 Nouar wrote: So mmm has someone won with carriers in a "normal" situation when he was not HUUUUUGELY ahead (and even when he was ahead) in a progame yet ? Maybe Genius once ? Don't remember...
Well would you call this a normal game either? I mean the zerg took every expansion on the map without contest.
Inca down at least one base all game and put zero pressure on Monster.
This just shows late game zerg can amass an almost unlimited supply army only relying on resources gathered and creep spread, spines and spores can move to any location easily with creep.
I don't know if that game is worth a serious analysis considering how unrefined it was, but I'll just say that the real turning point was where Inca had enough energy for (2?) Vortex on his Mothership but didn't use it. Take out even 5-6 Corruptors in the crucial fight and he'd have stayed in that game with a good chance at getting to six bases with a good amount of 3-3-1 Carriers.
On March 09 2012 20:27 FuzzyJAM wrote: I don't know if that game is worth a serious analysis considering how unrefined it was, but I'll just say that the real turning point was where Inca had enough energy for (2?) Vortex on his Mothership but didn't use it. Take out even 5-6 Corruptors in the crucial fight and he'd have stayed in that game with a good chance at getting to six bases with a good amount of 3-3-1 Carriers.
I don't know if it'll ever work and be long-term viable, but I wouldn't be surprised to see some carriers next season. That Carrier/Archon/Storm/MShip ball was intensely powerful. You need a ton of corruptors to kill carriers, but storm and archons are REALLY good, and it's hard to flank well when attacking into a turtly protoss. It has sex appeal, as a build.
On March 09 2012 20:27 FuzzyJAM wrote: I don't know if that game is worth a serious analysis considering how unrefined it was, but I'll just say that the real turning point was where Inca had enough energy for (2?) Vortex on his Mothership but didn't use it. Take out even 5-6 Corruptors in the crucial fight and he'd have stayed in that game with a good chance at getting to six bases with a good amount of 3-3-1 Carriers.
I don't know if it'll ever work and be long-term viable, but I wouldn't be surprised to see some carriers next season. That Carrier/Archon/Storm/MShip ball was intensely powerful
I still say they suck. :D
They take so long to become relevant that your opponent can take the whole map. From there, you mass Spores/Spines and get Corruptors and can even do Zergling drops and stuff. I don't know. . .It's kind of like mech in that you're trying to get the unbeatable composition and sacrificing all map control in order to get it, but I think the Carrier just isn't good enough for that. Siege tanks work so well and scale amazingly - Carriers do not.
On March 09 2012 20:49 Fragile51 wrote: Wuh? I go for a sandwhich for 4 minutes and hero wins? :p
Monster went hydra nydus, revealed it possibly too early since he didn't have that many hydras. Then waited around while Hero built like 4 more cannons. Still had a bigger army but didn't really attack. Hero poked out, ran away because Monster had a lot of Hydras. Monster put a nydus down in the main next to a pylon in case Hero was somehow not looking at his minimap at all. Monster gg's without actually doing anything.
On March 09 2012 20:49 Fragile51 wrote: Wuh? I go for a sandwhich for 4 minutes and hero wins? :p
Monster went hydra nydus, revealed it possibly too early since he didn't have that many hydras. Then waited around while Hero built like 4 more cannons. Still had a bigger army but didn't really attack. Hero poked out, ran away because Monster had a lot of Hydras. Monster put a nydus down in the main next to a pylon in case Hero was somehow not looking at his minimap at all. Monster gg's without actually doing anything.
Hero must be like, "ok, I can do this, I can do this, I can do this, I can do this, I can do this, I can do this, I can do this, I can do this, I can do this, I can do this...... FUUUUUUUCCCKK THE STRESSS!!!"
hero managed to confuse drg by not going +1 with the 4 gate pressure, but zealots are so weak vs lings without it that it didn't do enough damage even with drg not building units at the perfect time
Whoever OGS picks, they'll have a hard time dealing with DRG. I think it's safe to say that if DRG (and likely will) win, they need a miracle to beat DRG. I am guessing they may send out Supernova or ForGG up next.
On March 09 2012 21:23 yoshi245 wrote: Whoever OGS picks, they'll have a hard time dealing with DRG. I think it's safe to say that if DRG (and likely will) win, they need a miracle to beat DRG. I am guessing they may send out Supernova or ForGG up next.
On March 09 2012 21:23 yoshi245 wrote: Whoever OGS picks, they'll have a hard time dealing with DRG. I think it's safe to say that if DRG (and likely will) win, they need a miracle to beat DRG. I am guessing they may send out Supernova or ForGG up next.
Supernova is at IEM sadly
Oh yea, derp moment for me
Shit, even if it was ForGG, he's not rdy.
Luvsic/J is up? I hope he really practiced hard on his ZvZ. I want oGs to win this.
On March 09 2012 21:25 Fragile51 wrote: Luvsic? What the actual flying fuck z_z You send Luvsic out against someone who took out nestea in a straight up ZvZ?!
OGS has no other zergs in their lineup, and zvz is really micro intensive. Luvsic might get lucky
Even if they think cheese is their only hope why not have forgg cheese? The forgg hellion into bashee into expand into mech build is really hard to deal with. Forgg has AMAZING execution just not enough game knowledge, he was the better choice =(
On March 09 2012 21:27 sitromit wrote: From what I have seen of Luvsic in the ESV weeklies, he has no chance against DRG. He'll do some kind of allin.
If i was DRG id be expecting something cheesey because id know i was better than Luvsic, weakens this choice quite a lot because i doubt DRG is going to get caught with his pants down.
On March 09 2012 21:25 VavPK wrote: DRG so overhyped -_-
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
On March 09 2012 21:25 VavPK wrote: DRG so overhyped -_-
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Yeah he's consistently made 2 consecutive finals of the toughest SC2 competition in the world (winning the most recent one) he's definately not the best.
If your argument is that MMA is the best, I can at least somewhat respect you... but youre still wrong ;D <3
On March 09 2012 21:28 Maghetti wrote: Even if they think cheese is their only hope why not have forgg cheese? The forgg hellion into bashee into expand into mech build is really hard to deal with. Forgg has AMAZING execution just not enough game knowledge, he was the better choice =(
I normally agree with you but this is nonsense, after more than a year of playing his game knowledge should be more than fine. His execution is good but it's really not more than your average GSL terran.
On March 09 2012 21:25 VavPK wrote: DRG so overhyped -_-
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
On March 09 2012 21:25 VavPK wrote: DRG so overhyped -_-
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
On March 09 2012 21:25 VavPK wrote: DRG so overhyped -_-
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
Meh, i'll respectfully disagree. Everyone's entitled to their opinion though :p
On March 09 2012 21:28 Maghetti wrote: Even if they think cheese is their only hope why not have forgg cheese? The forgg hellion into bashee into expand into mech build is really hard to deal with. Forgg has AMAZING execution just not enough game knowledge, he was the better choice =(
I normally agree with you but this is nonsense, after more than a year of playing his game knowledge should be more than fine. His execution is good but it's really not more than your average GSL terran.
I could be wrong, but that is the judgement I have made from watching his play. His mechanics from first person look brutally good, including macro and micro, all that I see left is decision making and general game knowledge.
On March 09 2012 21:25 VavPK wrote: DRG so overhyped -_-
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
On March 09 2012 21:38 babysimba wrote: It doesn't matter. Both MMA and DRG are in such a class of their own, that top 2 in the world is not considered overhyped.
hope they cant both meet in next GSL finals...would make for an epic rematch
On March 09 2012 21:25 VavPK wrote: DRG so overhyped -_-
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
On March 09 2012 21:25 VavPK wrote: DRG so overhyped -_-
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
On March 09 2012 21:25 VavPK wrote: DRG so overhyped -_-
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
Wasn't that the reason for why MMA was wearing that thing covering his mouth?
On March 09 2012 21:25 VavPK wrote: DRG so overhyped -_-
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
My question is, how can someone you yourself has said could be even the second best in the world, possibly be overrated?
On March 09 2012 21:25 VavPK wrote: DRG so overhyped -_-
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
Yeah but still. DRG strong in all three MU and MMA's TvP kind of shaky like some people said. But I guess it's up to you who you think is the best player, however I'm pretty sure more things are speaking for DRG atm.
On March 09 2012 21:25 VavPK wrote: DRG so overhyped -_-
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Well MMA also got one GSL title, and another somewhat major title (Bliz Cup) under his belt, while DRG only has the recent GSL, so again, really depends on how exactly you define "best". There is really no way to say who the best is really as everyone's "best" is defined a lil bit different. We should just settle that they're both top 2, hence why their games are ALWAYS so epic when they go head to head against each other
On March 09 2012 21:38 babysimba wrote: It doesn't matter. Both MMA and DRG are in such a class of their own, that top 2 in the world is not considered overhyped.
hope they cant both meet in next GSL finals...would make for an epic rematch
Yea with DRG winning this time :D, then meeting in subsequent finals with them taking turns to win. All WoL finals need to be TvZ for us spectators.
On March 09 2012 21:25 VavPK wrote: DRG so overhyped -_-
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
No matter what condition he was but the fact is he lost to Alive. It's like saying MVP doesn't dominate anymore because of his wrist.
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
My question is, how can someone you yourself has said could be even the second best in the world, possibly be overrated?
I'll break it down for you, the definition of overrated. People rate DRG as #1, when hes really #2. Hence hes overrated, how is that not self explanitory lol
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
My question is, how can someone you yourself has said could be even the second best in the world, possibly be overrated?
I'll break it down for you, the definition of overrated. People rate DRG as #1, when hes really #2. Hence hes overrated, how is that not self explanitory lol
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
My question is, how can someone you yourself has said could be even the second best in the world, possibly be overrated?
I'll break it down for you, the definition of overrated. People rate DRG as #1, when hes really #2. Hence hes overrated, how is that not self explanitory lol
That's 100% subjective. To me I could say MMA is overrated because I personally think DRG is the best in the world. But everyone will generally agree, DRG is one of the top two or three at the very least. Calling him overrated at all is just silly.
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
My question is, how can someone you yourself has said could be even the second best in the world, possibly be overrated?
I'll break it down for you, the definition of overrated. People rate DRG as #1, when hes really #2. Hence hes overrated, how is that not self explanitory lol
Who are you to decide who is number 1 and 2 exactly? You act like your opinion holds more value then someone else.
yahh man totally. Hey you DRG take your back to back finals and 80%+ win rate in team league and go back to the over hyped corner
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
No matter what condition he was but the fact is he lost to Alive. It's like saying MVP doesn't dominate anymore because of his wrist.
Except... that being sick is like a one day coincident thing, while the wrist injury is more of a long term thing, so you can't really compare it like that lol
Don't forget Blizzard Cup Runner-up and MLG Winter Arena Runner-up :D
Probably best player in the world atm!
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
No matter what condition he was but the fact is he lost to Alive. It's like saying MVP doesn't dominate anymore because of his wrist.
Except... that being sick is like a one day coincident thing, while the wrist injury is more of a long term thing, so you can't really compare it like that lol
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
No matter what condition he was but the fact is he lost to Alive. It's like saying MVP doesn't dominate anymore because of his wrist.
Except... that being sick is like a one day coincident thing, while the wrist injury is more of a long term thing, so you can't really compare it like that lol
My point is in the end it's just an excuse.
You must have a very weird definition of "excuse" then lol
Runner-up! Exactly. DRG may be second best player in the world, but definitely not the best.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
No matter what condition he was but the fact is he lost to Alive. It's like saying MVP doesn't dominate anymore because of his wrist.
Except... that being sick is like a one day coincident thing, while the wrist injury is more of a long term thing, so you can't really compare it like that lol
My point is in the end it's just an excuse.
It's an excuse for that game, but it means that its still logical to consider MMA N1 Terran.
Serious question: Who would you rate higher then him right now? Only one i can think of that comes close is MMA tbh, and he has one matchup that he is kinda meh in (TvP) whereas DRG is completely solid in all three.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
No matter what condition he was but the fact is he lost to Alive. It's like saying MVP doesn't dominate anymore because of his wrist.
Except... that being sick is like a one day coincident thing, while the wrist injury is more of a long term thing, so you can't really compare it like that lol
My point is in the end it's just an excuse.
You must have a very weird definition of "excuse" then lol
No, not wierd at all. In my book player who play better will win.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
No matter what condition he was but the fact is he lost to Alive. It's like saying MVP doesn't dominate anymore because of his wrist.
Except... that being sick is like a one day coincident thing, while the wrist injury is more of a long term thing, so you can't really compare it like that lol
My point is in the end it's just an excuse.
You must have a very weird definition of "excuse" then lol
No, not wierd at all. In my book player who play better will win.
Lolll so if someone gets his arm blew off but decides to play his game anyways and loses the other guy was clearly the better player, zero excuses. Great logic.
MMA is the best player in the world. DRG can stay at second, but for now MMA is up on him.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
No matter what condition he was but the fact is he lost to Alive. It's like saying MVP doesn't dominate anymore because of his wrist.
Except... that being sick is like a one day coincident thing, while the wrist injury is more of a long term thing, so you can't really compare it like that lol
My point is in the end it's just an excuse.
You must have a very weird definition of "excuse" then lol
No, not wierd at all. In my book player who play better will win.
Your logic is losing me there, I don't see how your 2nd sentence there relates at all to w/e we were talking about.
No he's not lol. It's incredibly hard to make a good argument for DRG not being the best player in the world right now.
Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
No matter what condition he was but the fact is he lost to Alive. It's like saying MVP doesn't dominate anymore because of his wrist.
Except... that being sick is like a one day coincident thing, while the wrist injury is more of a long term thing, so you can't really compare it like that lol
My point is in the end it's just an excuse.
You must have a very weird definition of "excuse" then lol
No, not wierd at all. In my book player who play better will win.
Lolll so if someone gets his arm blew off but decides to play his game anyways and loses the other guy was clearly the better player, zero excuses. Great logic.
How is it hard to understand that the guy with one arm is not as good as the guy with 2 arms?
On March 09 2012 21:40 Fubi wrote: [quote] Well he would probably be the favourite on head to head against DRG, but MMA is weak against P while DRG is strong against all matchups. So it really depends on how we define "best"
Also MMA went out in Ro8 or something? DRG made it to GSL finals and won also, so much speaks for DRG as best player right now.
Cella confirmed MMA was very very sick that day, I thought that was obvious?
No matter what condition he was but the fact is he lost to Alive. It's like saying MVP doesn't dominate anymore because of his wrist.
Except... that being sick is like a one day coincident thing, while the wrist injury is more of a long term thing, so you can't really compare it like that lol
My point is in the end it's just an excuse.
You must have a very weird definition of "excuse" then lol
No, not wierd at all. In my book player who play better will win.
Lolll so if someone gets his arm blew off but decides to play his game anyways and loses the other guy was clearly the better player, zero excuses. Great logic.
How is it hard to understand that the guy with one arm is not as good as the guy with 2 arms?
He was not as good as the other guy because he has one arm, not because he is the better player.
If i beat DRG with DRG giving me a handicap and setting his health ratio to 10%, then i won because he gave me a handicap, not because I'm a better player. I wouldn't go "lol the 10% handicap was an excuse for DRG, I'm better than him"
On March 09 2012 21:50 VavPK wrote: DRG didn't go to IEM for one reason, MMA. He doesn't want to fall off his hype wave yet.
I like your way of trolling the LR thread, now it all makes sense.
Hey, I am just honest.
Honest? What makes MMA the best player?
It's not about MMA being the best player. It's the idea that DRG would skip a major tournament just because he is 'scared' of one guy. It's ludicrous.
Shameful trolling.
Ye, I know he is trolling but I just wanna ask people who are saying MMA is the best player than what make him the best? one thing I know is that he is invincible in TvZ but other than that?
On March 09 2012 21:50 VavPK wrote: DRG didn't go to IEM for one reason, MMA. He doesn't want to fall off his hype wave yet.
I like your way of trolling the LR thread, now it all makes sense.
Hey, I am just honest.
Honest? What makes MMA the best player?
It's not about MMA being the best player. It's the idea that DRG would skip a major tournament just because he is 'scared' of one guy. It's ludicrous.
Shameful trolling.
Ye, I know he is trolling but I just wanna ask people who are saying MMA is the best player than what make him the best? one thing I know is that he is invincible in TvZ but other than that?
His TvT is pretty godly too, although just not on his level of TvZ. But I can't think of another terran that I would put my bet on over MMA if they were to go head to head in a TvT.
Yea his TvP is weak, but that is true for 95% of the terran out there rite now
On March 09 2012 21:50 VavPK wrote: DRG didn't go to IEM for one reason, MMA. He doesn't want to fall off his hype wave yet.
I like your way of trolling the LR thread, now it all makes sense.
Hey, I am just honest.
Honest? What makes MMA the best player?
It's not about MMA being the best player. It's the idea that DRG would skip a major tournament just because he is 'scared' of one guy. It's ludicrous.
Shameful trolling.
Ye, I know he is trolling but I just wanna ask people who are saying MMA is the best player than what make him the best? one thing I know is that he is invincible in TvZ but other than that?
His TvT is pretty godly too, although just not on his level of TvZ. But I can't think of another terran that I would put my bet on over MMA if they were to go head to head in a TvT.
Yea his TvP is weak, but that is true for 95% of the terran out there rite now
Godly TvT? No, not at all. He is clearly beatable in TvT. Whatever you will say but he lost to Alive and his record against Polt is pretty bad. MVP's TvT in 2011 is what I will call godly TvT. He lost to only MMA in TvT.
On March 09 2012 21:50 VavPK wrote: DRG didn't go to IEM for one reason, MMA. He doesn't want to fall off his hype wave yet.
I like your way of trolling the LR thread, now it all makes sense.
Hey, I am just honest.
Honest? What makes MMA the best player?
It's not about MMA being the best player. It's the idea that DRG would skip a major tournament just because he is 'scared' of one guy. It's ludicrous.
Shameful trolling.
Ye, I know he is trolling but I just wanna ask people who are saying MMA is the best player than what make him the best? one thing I know is that he is invincible in TvZ but other than that?
His TvT is pretty godly too, although just not on his level of TvZ. But I can't think of another terran that I would put my bet on over MMA if they were to go head to head in a TvT.
Yea his TvP is weak, but that is true for 95% of the terran out there rite now
On March 09 2012 21:50 VavPK wrote: DRG didn't go to IEM for one reason, MMA. He doesn't want to fall off his hype wave yet.
I like your way of trolling the LR thread, now it all makes sense.
Hey, I am just honest.
Honest? What makes MMA the best player?
It's not about MMA being the best player. It's the idea that DRG would skip a major tournament just because he is 'scared' of one guy. It's ludicrous.
Shameful trolling.
Ye, I know he is trolling but I just wanna ask people who are saying MMA is the best player than what make him the best? one thing I know is that he is invincible in TvZ but other than that?
His TvT is pretty godly too, although just not on his level of TvZ. But I can't think of another terran that I would put my bet on over MMA if they were to go head to head in a TvT.
Yea his TvP is weak, but that is true for 95% of the terran out there rite now
Godly TvT? No, not at all. He is clearly beatable in TvT. Whatever you will say but he lost to Alive and his record against Polt is pretty bad.
He lost to alive due to him being sick, not because his TvT is weak, we've already went over that. And he lost to Polt like ages ago, at the time when DRG couldn't even make it into code A. So it's like same as saying DRG is still bad rite now since he had trouble getting into Code A back then.
But I agree with you, his TvT is beatable, never said it isn't, it definitely isn't on the same level as his TvZ, but that is cuz his TvZ is so godly. But if I were to bet my life on a match of TvT, I still can't think of a Terran atm that i would bet over MMA.
So basically, he has like #1 TvZ, top 3 TvT, and as stupid as this sounds, probably top 5 TvP too (just due to how few terrans are actually good against P now).
Could people who watched today's GSTL please vote in the poll of recommended games?
I'd like to know which vods are worth watching when I'm home from work, but there is a total of 3 people voting in the polls, so it's tough to figure what's really a worthwhile game (and I don't have the time for watching all the matches).
Leenock is too overrated (in his list), imo. Fin is also way too high, and should be replaced by TheStC at the very least.
It's hard to know where to rate Leenock at the moment. After his MLG and GSL run it seems he should be high, but lately not so much. Totally agree on Fin/TheStC.
thanks ive been updating it frequently, however, only the top 11 is accurate in my oppinion, the rest is hard to know, as they all have their strengths and weaknesses. Also, im not 100% sure about MKP, the guy suprises me more and more, feel like putting him higher up, but need another month of games to edit my list
On March 09 2012 21:50 VavPK wrote: DRG didn't go to IEM for one reason, MMA. He doesn't want to fall off his hype wave yet.
I like your way of trolling the LR thread, now it all makes sense.
Hey, I am just honest.
Honest? What makes MMA the best player?
It's not about MMA being the best player. It's the idea that DRG would skip a major tournament just because he is 'scared' of one guy. It's ludicrous.
Shameful trolling.
Ye, I know he is trolling but I just wanna ask people who are saying MMA is the best player than what make him the best? one thing I know is that he is invincible in TvZ but other than that?
MMA has had DRG's number. Their games are always close, but i think MMA has the edge (correct me if I'm wrong). When it counted, MMA beat DRG. Blizzard Cup finals and GSTL Ace matches come to mind.
MMA and DRG are even on games both internationally and in korea. I wouldn't look too much into the first gstl ace match since they were not fighting on even grounds. MVP team back then was still weak, and DRG has to play multiple matches with map disadvantages. MMA indeed has a slight edge due to the blizzard cup finals, though it came down to only 1 game difference. Well finals is still finals i guess, people look at the champion and forget the runner-up.
Right now, MMA is more accomplished than DRG with more championship titles to his name. However, DRG did clinch back a bit of points with his current run. Blizzard cup runner-up, King of kongs, FXO invitational series, Winter-arena runner-up, came out ahead with toughest code s line-up ever seen, all these over a span of 3 mths. MMA also has a slightly weaker match-up compared to DRG.
It's too difficult to differentiate them who is the best. Let's just say they are top 2 in the world right now.
On March 09 2012 23:15 babysimba wrote: MMA and DRG are even on games both internationally and in korea. + Show Spoiler +
I wouldn't look too much into the first gstl ace match since they were not fighting on even grounds. MVP team back then was still weak, and DRG has to play multiple matches with map disadvantages. MMA indeed has a slight edge due to the blizzard cup finals, though it came down to only 1 game difference. Well finals is still finals i guess, people look at the champion and forget the runner-up.
Right now, MMA is more accomplished than DRG with more championship titles to his name. However, DRG did clinch back a bit of points with his current run. Blizzard cup runner-up, King of kongs, FXO invitational series, Winter-arena runner-up, came out ahead with toughest code s line-up ever seen, all these over a span of 3 mths. MMA also has a slightly weaker match-up compared to DRG.
It's too difficult to differentiate them who is the best. Let's just say they are top 2 in the world right now.
Eh, its a tough call between MMA and DRG, but I'm glad we can agree the IM era has ended. DRG is certainly on a hotter streak right now, but MMA has been producing results for a longer time. It's a tough call. Personally I favor MMA right now because he's been consistent for as long as he's been in code S, always making it to at least the RO8 whereas DRG up until recently was a major disappointment (in code S at least) or failing to qualify for code A.
Numerical rankings are kind of silly though, Tiers are more logical. If you look at Flexis' list, how far apart are Ganzi and Supernova really? The list puts them 4 ranks apart, which is a much larger sounding gap than the real gap between their skills. DRG and MMA are in their own tier right now. Players like Ganzi and Supernova are in the same tier too.
Just off the top of my head, I'm sure you could argue some people up and down this list. And it's only the 20 players Flexis listed:
I'm really impressed by oGs, I would though they have been doing worse. 4-5 is an honorable feat (btw I fear MvP will be team DRG when protoss will not be as good in the metagame :D). They would have need a MC to close the deal (a good old 2 base all-in that kills even the best zerg in the world), too bad they couldn't use him (because he's no longer in their team, and wasn't in korea anyway ).
And, seriously, Inca vs zerg what was TheWind thinking -_-
Hmm these results were unnecessarily close for MvP. No Genius, sC or TAiLS? I guess that shows how much faith they have in Dongraegu, who by the way is now a blistering 20-2 in the GSTL for his career.
The best player in the world does it again! It's a good thing drg skipped iem because MVP needs him for the vegas trip! Also, this frees up DRG to go to MLG columbus now as MVP advances to the ro4! Now hoping Prime wins tonight so MKP can also go to columbus cause if prime loses he'll most likely skip out on MLG to play in an elimination gstl match that weekend.
On March 09 2012 23:46 Greggle wrote: Eh, its a tough call between MMA and DRG, but I'm glad we can agree the IM era has ended. DRG is certainly on a hotter streak right now, but MMA has been producing results for a longer time. It's a tough call. Personally I favor MMA right now because he's been consistent for as long as he's been in code S, always making it to at least the RO8 whereas DRG up until recently was a major disappointment (in code S at least) or failing to qualify for code A.
Numerical rankings are kind of silly though, Tiers are more logical. If you look at Flexis' list, how far apart are Ganzi and Supernova really? The list puts them 4 ranks apart, which is a much larger sounding gap than the real gap between their skills. DRG and MMA are in their own tier right now. Players like Ganzi and Supernova are in the same tier too.
Just off the top of my head, I'm sure you could argue some people up and down this list. And it's only the 20 players Flexis listed:
On March 10 2012 06:43 neoghaleon55 wrote: MKP is top tier now? :O?
Yes he is.
I don't know...I can't see him handling long games very well against the likes of IMMVP, DRG, MMA or Genius. I guess I'm siding with Artosis in regards to "better macro games = less randomness = better indication of skill"
MKP arguably #2 player in the world, man. 80% TvT, 80% TvP is better than DRG's stats this year in those matchups. TvZ is questionable, but that's only because Losira and DongRaeGu have his number there (most of his TvZ losses are to DRG/Losira lol) MKP rolled aLive and Puma, who both beat MMA.
On March 10 2012 07:02 opterown wrote: MKP arguably #2 player in the world, man. 80% TvT, 80% TvP is better than DRG's stats this year in those matchups. TvZ is questionable, but that's only because Losira and DongRaeGu have his number there (most of his TvZ losses are to DRG/Losira lol) MKP rolled aLive and Puma, who both beat MMA.
calling stats on just this year alone (only 2 months and 10 days) is kind of silly. Should take account of at least 3 months time.
On March 10 2012 07:02 opterown wrote: MKP arguably #2 player in the world, man. 80% TvT, 80% TvP is better than DRG's stats this year in those matchups. TvZ is questionable, but that's only because Losira and DongRaeGu have his number there (most of his TvZ losses are to DRG/Losira lol) MKP rolled aLive and Puma, who both beat MMA.
calling stats on just this year alone (only 2 months and 10 days) is kind of silly. Should take account of at least 3 months time.
I reckon ~50 or so games in each matchup is a pretty good sample. The only game MKP played in the last few days of last year was a 2-1 of Boxer in Boxer's best matchup, and a 4-kill of StarTale, rolling through Ace, Sound, Parting, and July
On March 10 2012 07:02 opterown wrote: MKP arguably #2 player in the world, man. 80% TvT, 80% TvP is better than DRG's stats this year in those matchups. TvZ is questionable, but that's only because Losira and DongRaeGu have his number there (most of his TvZ losses are to DRG/Losira lol) MKP rolled aLive and Puma, who both beat MMA.
calling stats on just this year alone (only 2 months and 10 days) is kind of silly. Should take account of at least 3 months time.
I reckon 80 or so games in each matchup is a pretty good sample. The only game MKP played in the last few days of last year was a 2-1 of Boxer in Boxer's best matchup, and a 4-kill of StarTale, rolling through Ace, Sound, Parting, and July
MKP definitely top tier
Ignore him he is just salty that his boy DRG lost to MKP at MLG. He kept on calling two rax cheese and making excuses for DRG losing. Also MarineKing can play late game just fine. Although i do think DRG and MMA are better then him.
On March 10 2012 07:02 opterown wrote: MKP arguably #2 player in the world, man. 80% TvT, 80% TvP is better than DRG's stats this year in those matchups. TvZ is questionable, but that's only because Losira and DongRaeGu have his number there (most of his TvZ losses are to DRG/Losira lol) MKP rolled aLive and Puma, who both beat MMA.
calling stats on just this year alone (only 2 months and 10 days) is kind of silly. Should take account of at least 3 months time.
I reckon 80 or so games in each matchup is a pretty good sample. The only game MKP played in the last few days of last year was a 2-1 of Boxer in Boxer's best matchup, and a 4-kill of StarTale, rolling through Ace, Sound, Parting, and July
MKP definitely top tier
80 games? where did you get this number from? The quality of opponents also counts, too. Not just quantity.
MKP has the best TvP in the world right now. He has figured out something that the likes of Jjakji, aLive, Keen and MMA have not. He has learned to abuse the early-midgame of Terran and try to never get into the lategame without a sizeable advantage. There are too many greedy macro Terrans in TvP at the moment, who don't understand how P-favoured the matchup is in the lategame right now.
On March 10 2012 07:02 opterown wrote: MKP arguably #2 player in the world, man. 80% TvT, 80% TvP is better than DRG's stats this year in those matchups. TvZ is questionable, but that's only because Losira and DongRaeGu have his number there (most of his TvZ losses are to DRG/Losira lol) MKP rolled aLive and Puma, who both beat MMA.
calling stats on just this year alone (only 2 months and 10 days) is kind of silly. Should take account of at least 3 months time.
I reckon 80 or so games in each matchup is a pretty good sample. The only game MKP played in the last few days of last year was a 2-1 of Boxer in Boxer's best matchup, and a 4-kill of StarTale, rolling through Ace, Sound, Parting, and July
MKP definitely top tier
80 games? where did you get this number from? The quality of opponents also counts, too. Not just quantity.
Oops, rechecked that, average 50 games. MKP is 42-9 in TvP (82%), 25-8 in TvT (75%) and 45-30 in TvZ (and 20 of those zerg losses are to DRG and Losira, so he'd be 45-10, 82% otherwise)
Notable records of MKP this year against some of the best PvT: Oz 4-2 Genius 3-2 Parting, Puzzle 3-0 MC, Sage, Huk, Nani 2-0 Tod 4-0
Jjakji, Supernova 4-2 Polt 3-2 alive, happy, ganzi 2-0 ^ some very solid tvt there, but MKP is untested against MVP or MMA thus far. I think he'd hold up well.
Leenock 5-1 and a rather abysmal 5-11 against DRG and 6-8 against Losira
If those aren't impressive records against top players, i don't know what are :D
note that I'm actually not arguing that MKP is number 1 (i think DRG is 1), but MKP definitely 2nd or 3rd
On March 10 2012 07:02 opterown wrote: MKP arguably #2 player in the world, man. 80% TvT, 80% TvP is better than DRG's stats this year in those matchups. TvZ is questionable, but that's only because Losira and DongRaeGu have his number there (most of his TvZ losses are to DRG/Losira lol) MKP rolled aLive and Puma, who both beat MMA.
calling stats on just this year alone (only 2 months and 10 days) is kind of silly. Should take account of at least 3 months time.
I reckon 80 or so games in each matchup is a pretty good sample. The only game MKP played in the last few days of last year was a 2-1 of Boxer in Boxer's best matchup, and a 4-kill of StarTale, rolling through Ace, Sound, Parting, and July
MKP definitely top tier
80 games? where did you get this number from? The quality of opponents also counts, too. Not just quantity.
Oops, rechecked that, average 50 games. MKP is 42-9 in TvP, 25-8 in TvT and 45-30 in TvZ (and 20 of those zerg losses are to DRG and Losira, so he'd be 45-10 otherwise)
Notable records of MKP this year: Oz 4-2 Genius 3-2 Parting, Puzzle 3-0 MC, Sage, Huk, Nani 2-0 Tod 4-0
If those aren't impressive records against top players, i don't know what are :D
note that I'm actually not arguing that MKP is number 1 (i think DRG is 1), but MKP definitely 2 or 3rd
As an MC fanboy, I'd like to mention that he only faced MC at HSC4, when they had both already passed their group and decided to put on a show. For the record, one of those 2 games included a Carriers vs Battlecruisers fight.
I don't think the games against MC can be included.
On March 10 2012 07:02 opterown wrote: MKP arguably #2 player in the world, man. 80% TvT, 80% TvP is better than DRG's stats this year in those matchups. TvZ is questionable, but that's only because Losira and DongRaeGu have his number there (most of his TvZ losses are to DRG/Losira lol) MKP rolled aLive and Puma, who both beat MMA.
calling stats on just this year alone (only 2 months and 10 days) is kind of silly. Should take account of at least 3 months time.
I reckon 80 or so games in each matchup is a pretty good sample. The only game MKP played in the last few days of last year was a 2-1 of Boxer in Boxer's best matchup, and a 4-kill of StarTale, rolling through Ace, Sound, Parting, and July
MKP definitely top tier
80 games? where did you get this number from? The quality of opponents also counts, too. Not just quantity.
Oops, rechecked that, average 50 games. MKP is 42-9 in TvP, 25-8 in TvT and 45-30 in TvZ (and 20 of those zerg losses are to DRG and Losira, so he'd be 45-10 otherwise)
Notable records of MKP this year: Oz 4-2 Genius 3-2 Parting, Puzzle 3-0 MC, Sage, Huk, Nani 2-0 Tod 4-0
If those aren't impressive records against top players, i don't know what are :D
note that I'm actually not arguing that MKP is number 1 (i think DRG is 1), but MKP definitely 2 or 3rd
As an MC fanboy, I'd like to mention that he only faced MC at HSC4, when they had both already passed their group and decided to put on a show. For the record, one of those 2 games included a Carriers vs Battlecruisers fight.
I don't think the games against MC can be included.
Rightio, he's only about 80% tvp without MC's games then. Although I remember MC saying he was most afraid of facing MKP out of the people in the Group of Death.
On March 10 2012 07:02 opterown wrote: MKP arguably #2 player in the world, man. 80% TvT, 80% TvP is better than DRG's stats this year in those matchups. TvZ is questionable, but that's only because Losira and DongRaeGu have his number there (most of his TvZ losses are to DRG/Losira lol) MKP rolled aLive and Puma, who both beat MMA.
calling stats on just this year alone (only 2 months and 10 days) is kind of silly. Should take account of at least 3 months time.
I reckon 80 or so games in each matchup is a pretty good sample. The only game MKP played in the last few days of last year was a 2-1 of Boxer in Boxer's best matchup, and a 4-kill of StarTale, rolling through Ace, Sound, Parting, and July
MKP definitely top tier
80 games? where did you get this number from? The quality of opponents also counts, too. Not just quantity.
Oops, rechecked that, average 50 games. MKP is 42-9 in TvP, 25-8 in TvT and 45-30 in TvZ (and 20 of those zerg losses are to DRG and Losira, so he'd be 45-10 otherwise)
Notable records of MKP this year: Oz 4-2 Genius 3-2 Parting, Puzzle 3-0 MC, Sage, Huk, Nani 2-0 Tod 4-0
If those aren't impressive records against top players, i don't know what are :D
note that I'm actually not arguing that MKP is number 1 (i think DRG is 1), but MKP definitely 2 or 3rd
As an MC fanboy, I'd like to mention that he only faced MC at HSC4, when they had both already passed their group and decided to put on a show. For the record, one of those 2 games included a Carriers vs Battlecruisers fight.
I don't think the games against MC can be included.
Rightio, he's only about 80% tvp without MC's games then. Although I remember MC saying he was most afraid of facing MKP out of the people in the Group of Death.
Yeah. I don't think it can be denied that MKP is a top tier player at the moment.
The only thing holding back MKP from top tier before was his weak TvT. I used to cringe every TvT he played and had low hopes for him in that matchup. However, he's improved his TvT a lot the last few months and I think he's pretty good at it now. I used to say mkp had the worst banshee defense around, so seeing him lose to jjakji's banshees in IPL last night wasn't encouraging, but it was only one game.
His mech TvT still leaves a lot to be desired because every time I see him try that, he takes a lead then blows it away by thinking his mech is bio and trading inefficiently and getting impatient by moving out with too few units, like he did against bomber in IPL.
With MKP being solid in all matchups now, I think he's a top 5 terran.
Monster, he's such a dangerous player. On the level of BboongBboong and Vines. Individiually they aren't much, but the possibility that they multi-kill in team play is so high!
On March 10 2012 05:22 Canucklehead wrote: The best player in the world does it again! It's a good thing drg skipped iem because MVP needs him for the vegas trip! Also, this frees up DRG to go to MLG columbus now as MVP advances to the ro4! Now hoping Prime wins tonight so MKP can also go to columbus cause if prime loses he'll most likely skip out on MLG to play in an elimination gstl match that weekend.
I think it was on state of the game that LiquidNony/Tyler stated that good players can be judged by how they handle mirror matches. Lately MMA's mirrors haven't been so hot. Consider that TvT is probably the most stable of the 3 mirror matches, having MMA losing to both Puma (who doesn't even train in korea anymore) and aLive is a bit disheartening. MMA's still a beast though...with that 14:0 win streak at IEM...still I think if you have to compare DRG and MMA, DRG's better overall.
I find it hilarious when Khaldor read off the statistics yesterday to reveal that DRG's weakest matchup is ZvT... While MMA's BY FAR strongest matchup is TvZ...
Regardless, I can't wait for DRG to meet MMA again in the GSL...a score needs to be settled...
On March 10 2012 10:40 neoghaleon55 wrote: I think it was on state of the game that LiquidNony/Tyler stated that good players can be judged by how they handle mirror matches. Lately MMA's mirrors haven't been so hot. Consider that TvT is probably the most stable of the 3 mirror matches, having MMA losing to both Puma (who doesn't even train in korea anymore) and aLive is a bit disheartening. MMA's still a beast though...with that 14:0 win streak at IEM...still I think if you have to compare DRG and MMA, DRG's better overall.
I find it hilarious when Khaldor read off the statistics yesterday to reveal that DRG's weakest matchup is ZvT... While MMA's BY FAR strongest matchup is TvZ...
Regardless, I can't wait for DRG to meet MMA again in the GSL...a score needs to be settled...
Where do you get your information? Puma trains in the same house as MMA.
LAS VEGAS BABY!!!! HERE COMES THE MVP NERD BALLERS WINNING ALL YO BLACK JACKS, BETTER HIDE YO CHIPS, HIDE YO CARDS AND HIDE YO SECURITY CAMERAS TOO CUZ DRG'S RAPING ERRRYBODY OUT THUR
EPT
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