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On February 05 2012 13:54 GodOfWar wrote:
This result shouldnt get overrated.
Calm down pls, everyone can have a bad day, even the current GSL champion.
Right now the hottest Terrans should be MMA (for his awesomeness), aLive (for his patiience) and MKP (because he seems to get his nerves together now)
Jjakjii is still up there with the best, and HerO has yet to prove he can win in major leagues.
Get it right, yo.
Hottest Terran is NaDa.
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Great games by HerO! He really showed what IMO is the dominant power of late-game toss in this matchup. It seemed like he always had an extra storm or two to drop after the EMPs had landed and the engagement committed to. I look forward to seeing him again next week!
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On February 05 2012 13:58 babylon wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2012 13:54 GodOfWar wrote:
This result shouldnt get overrated.
Calm down pls, everyone can have a bad day, even the current GSL champion.
Right now the hottest Terrans should be MMA (for his awesomeness), aLive (for his patiience) and MKP (because he seems to get his nerves together now)
Jjakjii is still up there with the best, and HerO has yet to prove he can win in major leagues. Get it right, yo. Hottest Terran is NaDa.
sure but SC2 isnt a body building contest, lmao
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Australia18228 Posts
On February 05 2012 13:49 wklbishop wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2012 13:21 Bagration wrote:On February 05 2012 13:03 dragonborn wrote:On February 05 2012 13:00 Phobbers wrote:On February 05 2012 12:54 dragonborn wrote:On February 05 2012 12:43 Wroshe wrote:On February 05 2012 12:26 dragonborn wrote:On February 05 2012 12:23 Wroshe wrote:
Even though the series was sort of scrappy it was still entertaining. The excuses people make are sort of hilarious though. If anything this proves even more the current volatility of the scene.
Personally I feel that Jjakji is a bit overhyped even though he has a GSL Code S title. I agree, the finals were very good but his way to the final was not very convincing. In the group stages he lost to Killer and then rebounded with wins over SuperNova and Virus. His secound group stage involved getting stomped by MVP and then getting the walk-over over CoCa into a TvT win over the mediocre Gumiho(TvT Speaking). After that he beat Puzzle, Oz and Leenock to grab the title, those three are of high calibre. Still he had quite an easy path to the finals. Are you serious? Beating Puzzle and Oz to quite easy path to the finals??????? Puzzle and Oz probably #1 #2 Toss players in this scene both have fantastic PvT,and leenock best ZvT along with DongRaeGu. Jjakji's path to finals was quite tought. Yes, I am absolutely serious. He had a very weak first group set (in which he even lost to Killer) and in the second he relied on a walk over to get a second chance against a (definatly at the time) very weak TvTer. Sure Puzzle and Oz are both great players but compare that path against some other paths in that same GSL. Groupstage 1 Group 2 RO8 RO4 Finals
Leenock: Ganzi/Polt/Ensnare | MMA/HuK/Nestea | aLive -> Mvp -> Jjakji
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Oz: CoCa/TaeJa/NaDa | aLive/Killer/Happy | MMA -> Jjakji -> Leenock
Mvp: aLive/Marineking/Curious | Jjakji/GuMiho/CoCa | sC -> Leenock -> Jjakji
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MMA: MC/Ryung/YuGiOh | Leenock/HuK/NesTea | Oz -> Jjakji -> Leenock
Puzzle: HuK/July/Clide | sC/MC/GanZi | Jjakji -> Oz -> Leenock
aLive: Mvp/Marineking/Curious | Oz/Killer/Happy | Leenock -> Mvp -> Jjakji
sC: NesTea/LosirA/asd | Puzzle/MC/GanZi | Mvp -> Leenock -> Jjakji Out of those paths (some are imaginary) definatly Leenock's, MMA's and sC's are harder. Depending on how you look you can also make cases for some of the others. very weak TvTer is GuMiHo? Didnt he crush IMMvp in Code S,how can he have weak TvT? o_O.Losing SangHo doesnt mean anything since you won the whole tournament. whatever,just look at NesTea's GSL July path to finals;Ro32 July,Ro16 Ensnare, Ro8 CoCa,Ro4 HongUn,Final LosirA. still im saying jjakji's path to final is one of the toughest. Also jjakji won in new format,which is 10x harder than older formats. GuMiHo is known for having VERY weak TvT. No one pegged him to beat MVP at all. At the end,he beat MVP.This still means something. Also jjakji is known for his weak TvT. It does. But I think it is still more due to MVP playing poorly than Gumiho playing extraordinarily well. Hell, one game MVP pushed out and realized that he forgot siege mode. Siege mode man! Most people don't realize that Gumiho's style is one of multitasking that forces your opponent to work as much as you are and it just forces mistakes because you end up worn out by everything. However, it makes Gumiho look sloppy because he's doing so much and when you do so much, it's impossible to do everything well. It's actually a lot like MMA who you'll notice fucks up here and there and gets massively behind but at the same time can make someone like Nestea look bad.
But MMA controls everything much better; his drops are controlled well, his battle micro (tanks target-fire, marine split etc.) is impeccable and his reaction time is also much better. GuMiho is a good player and looks like what MMA was when he first came out, but he still needs to refine everything to be considered a top Terran.
MMA's game-sense is also so much better in TvT and controls the game much better, by knowing when to attack, when to drop and when to transition into tanks. It just seems like GuMiho is doing multiple things for the sake of it, rather than planning it to control the game.
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On February 05 2012 13:48 Whatson wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2012 13:30 Techno wrote:
Straight up HerO is the best Protoss in the world. I have no TL bias. Fact is he's beaten many awesome Terrans and Zergs in high pressure situations, and he simply BLEEDS APM and actually USES Protoss with SKILL without relying on a deathball. The only other Protoss with the skill in micro and multitasking is HuK and Hero seems to have better macro/better decision making. This much hype for a Code A player who has only won 1 tournament, and has had no significant headway in Code S? Please... This is why HerO has so many haters, it's not because of his play, which is well deserved of praise, but because fans like you overhype SO MUCH. He's a great Protoss player, yes, but not deserving of the title "best Protoss in the world." Need I remind you of his 0-5 dismantling by Polt? Or how about getting shut-out in GSL Blizzard Cup? Or how about losing to Violet in the first round of HSC IV, his best matchup? Or how about getting defeated by foreigners in IEM Kiev? The list goes on... Until HerO can win GSL, I will call MC the Protoss President. Everybody else is pretty much second rate.
I agree with that you say here. Plz, some ppl. Hero is awesome and super good. Do not let us 'hate' him.
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On February 05 2012 13:58 Sanchonator wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2012 13:43 Lewan72 wrote:On February 05 2012 13:00 Phobbers wrote:On February 05 2012 12:54 dragonborn wrote:On February 05 2012 12:43 Wroshe wrote:On February 05 2012 12:26 dragonborn wrote:On February 05 2012 12:23 Wroshe wrote:
Even though the series was sort of scrappy it was still entertaining. The excuses people make are sort of hilarious though. If anything this proves even more the current volatility of the scene.
Personally I feel that Jjakji is a bit overhyped even though he has a GSL Code S title. I agree, the finals were very good but his way to the final was not very convincing. In the group stages he lost to Killer and then rebounded with wins over SuperNova and Virus. His secound group stage involved getting stomped by MVP and then getting the walk-over over CoCa into a TvT win over the mediocre Gumiho(TvT Speaking). After that he beat Puzzle, Oz and Leenock to grab the title, those three are of high calibre. Still he had quite an easy path to the finals. Are you serious? Beating Puzzle and Oz to quite easy path to the finals??????? Puzzle and Oz probably #1 #2 Toss players in this scene both have fantastic PvT,and leenock best ZvT along with DongRaeGu. Jjakji's path to finals was quite tought. Yes, I am absolutely serious. He had a very weak first group set (in which he even lost to Killer) and in the second he relied on a walk over to get a second chance against a (definatly at the time) very weak TvTer. Sure Puzzle and Oz are both great players but compare that path against some other paths in that same GSL. Groupstage 1 Group 2 RO8 RO4 Finals
Leenock: Ganzi/Polt/Ensnare | MMA/HuK/Nestea | aLive -> Mvp -> Jjakji
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Oz: CoCa/TaeJa/NaDa | aLive/Killer/Happy | MMA -> Jjakji -> Leenock
Mvp: aLive/Marineking/Curious | Jjakji/GuMiho/CoCa | sC -> Leenock -> Jjakji
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MMA: MC/Ryung/YuGiOh | Leenock/HuK/NesTea | Oz -> Jjakji -> Leenock
Puzzle: HuK/July/Clide | sC/MC/GanZi | Jjakji -> Oz -> Leenock
aLive: Mvp/Marineking/Curious | Oz/Killer/Happy | Leenock -> Mvp -> Jjakji
sC: NesTea/LosirA/asd | Puzzle/MC/GanZi | Mvp -> Leenock -> Jjakji Out of those paths (some are imaginary) definatly Leenock's, MMA's and sC's are harder. Depending on how you look you can also make cases for some of the others. very weak TvTer is GuMiHo? Didnt he crush IMMvp in Code S,how can he have weak TvT? o_O.Losing SangHo doesnt mean anything since you won the whole tournament. whatever,just look at NesTea's GSL July path to finals;Ro32 July,Ro16 Ensnare, Ro8 CoCa,Ro4 HongUn,Final LosirA. still im saying jjakji's path to final is one of the toughest. Also jjakji won in new format,which is 10x harder than older formats. GuMiHo is known for having VERY weak TvT. No one pegged him to beat MVP at all. Puzzle and oz 1# and 2# toss? GTFO what about MC, Genius, ect at that time oz was probably the best toss, the best in that season at the very least.. puzzle not so much
He was the best in that season just like the result says. But even himself said Mc is still the best toss out there.
Anyways, I like Oz and hope he and MVP make it back to codeS again soon.
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Imo people in general are too fast to judge who is "best". All a player has to do is win/lose a series to "make it" or have thier time be over. MVP loses a series and suddenly he's just not the best terran anymore. Polt beats MMA in a SINGLE series and suddenly Polt is a better TvTer than MMA. It's just ridiculous.
I'm not actually trying to relate that at all to this current match, but more the discussion and topic of "who's best right now" in general.
People are too short-sighted about everything.
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On February 05 2012 13:42 Sabu113 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2012 13:35 Olinimm wrote:On February 05 2012 13:30 Techno wrote:
Straight up HerO is the best Protoss in the world. I have no TL bias. Fact is he's beaten many awesome Terrans and Zergs in high pressure situations, and he simply BLEEDS APM and actually USES Protoss with SKILL without relying on a deathball. The only other Protoss with the skill in micro and multitasking is HuK and Hero seems to have better macro/better decision making. This is why Hero has "haters". Never mind that Hero was eliminated in the group stages of HSC4 and IEM kiev, being owned by mostly foreigners, and is constantly out performed by MC. He's the best protoss because he uses the deathball with "skill". Not to say all Hero fans are delusional, mind you, or anything against Hero. Just need to offset the insanity you know? To his defense though it's pretty hard to find an alternate to MC. Nani, Sage, Huk(ish), Hero, and kinda genius have all laid claims to the #2 spot for a month. Ofc there's the time when no toss was winning when people tried to dethrone MC but... honestly MC's still a level above all of the others.
Your list is really generous towards foreigners...
MC, Oz, Genius, Puzzle, Parting. They are actually all serious contenders in the code S.
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D: oh jjakji T.T
and Shoot I missed the games T__T
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I takes a Korean to beat a Korean. Well played Hero. Now do it in the GSL.
User was warned for this post
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On February 05 2012 14:50 devPLEASE wrote:
I takes a Korean to beat a Korean. Well played Hero. Now do it in the GSL.
Sheth over Ryung? Mana over Ganzi?
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On February 05 2012 13:43 Lewan72 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2012 13:00 Phobbers wrote:On February 05 2012 12:54 dragonborn wrote:On February 05 2012 12:43 Wroshe wrote:On February 05 2012 12:26 dragonborn wrote:On February 05 2012 12:23 Wroshe wrote:
Even though the series was sort of scrappy it was still entertaining. The excuses people make are sort of hilarious though. If anything this proves even more the current volatility of the scene.
Personally I feel that Jjakji is a bit overhyped even though he has a GSL Code S title. I agree, the finals were very good but his way to the final was not very convincing. In the group stages he lost to Killer and then rebounded with wins over SuperNova and Virus. His secound group stage involved getting stomped by MVP and then getting the walk-over over CoCa into a TvT win over the mediocre Gumiho(TvT Speaking). After that he beat Puzzle, Oz and Leenock to grab the title, those three are of high calibre. Still he had quite an easy path to the finals. Are you serious? Beating Puzzle and Oz to quite easy path to the finals??????? Puzzle and Oz probably #1 #2 Toss players in this scene both have fantastic PvT,and leenock best ZvT along with DongRaeGu. Jjakji's path to finals was quite tought. Yes, I am absolutely serious. He had a very weak first group set (in which he even lost to Killer) and in the second he relied on a walk over to get a second chance against a (definatly at the time) very weak TvTer. Sure Puzzle and Oz are both great players but compare that path against some other paths in that same GSL. Groupstage 1 Group 2 RO8 RO4 Finals
Leenock: Ganzi/Polt/Ensnare | MMA/HuK/Nestea | aLive -> Mvp -> Jjakji
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Oz: CoCa/TaeJa/NaDa | aLive/Killer/Happy | MMA -> Jjakji -> Leenock
Mvp: aLive/Marineking/Curious | Jjakji/GuMiho/CoCa | sC -> Leenock -> Jjakji
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MMA: MC/Ryung/YuGiOh | Leenock/HuK/NesTea | Oz -> Jjakji -> Leenock
Puzzle: HuK/July/Clide | sC/MC/GanZi | Jjakji -> Oz -> Leenock
aLive: Mvp/Marineking/Curious | Oz/Killer/Happy | Leenock -> Mvp -> Jjakji
sC: NesTea/LosirA/asd | Puzzle/MC/GanZi | Mvp -> Leenock -> Jjakji Out of those paths (some are imaginary) definatly Leenock's, MMA's and sC's are harder. Depending on how you look you can also make cases for some of the others. very weak TvTer is GuMiHo? Didnt he crush IMMvp in Code S,how can he have weak TvT? o_O.Losing SangHo doesnt mean anything since you won the whole tournament. whatever,just look at NesTea's GSL July path to finals;Ro32 July,Ro16 Ensnare, Ro8 CoCa,Ro4 HongUn,Final LosirA. still im saying jjakji's path to final is one of the toughest. Also jjakji won in new format,which is 10x harder than older formats. GuMiHo is known for having VERY weak TvT. No one pegged him to beat MVP at all. Puzzle and oz 1# and 2# toss? GTFO what about MC, Genius, ect
Really? Calling Puzzle and Oz 1 and 2? Tell me who the only Code S Protoss GSL champion is. Yeah, it's MC. Puzzle and Oz would be good contenders for 2 and 3 while HerO, who id over-hyped, would be like the 15th best Protoss IMO.
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Are their VODs? I love Hero, but didn't catch this live!
'Darkness Falls' - this name is just way too melodramatic, and the WC3 reference doesn't help it at all.
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Australia18228 Posts
On February 05 2012 14:17 Angel_ wrote:
Imo people in general are too fast to judge who is "best". All a player has to do is win/lose a series to "make it" or have thier time be over. MVP loses a series and suddenly he's just not the best terran anymore. Polt beats MMA in a SINGLE series and suddenly Polt is a better TvTer than MMA. It's just ridiculous.
I'm not actually trying to relate that at all to this current match, but more the discussion and topic of "who's best right now" in general.
People are too short-sighted about everything.
Mvp not being the "best" anymore is largely due to the fact that other players had already showed they were better than him when they're playing their best (MMA, Jjakji) but Mvp was much more consistent so that's why he retained his position.
With him recently falling apart like that, it's hard to say that players - who are also becoming just as consistent while showing better results - are not overtaking him.
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United States15275 Posts
On February 05 2012 15:04 Inflicted_ wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2012 14:17 Angel_ wrote:
Imo people in general are too fast to judge who is "best". All a player has to do is win/lose a series to "make it" or have thier time be over. MVP loses a series and suddenly he's just not the best terran anymore. Polt beats MMA in a SINGLE series and suddenly Polt is a better TvTer than MMA. It's just ridiculous.
I'm not actually trying to relate that at all to this current match, but more the discussion and topic of "who's best right now" in general.
People are too short-sighted about everything. Mvp not being the "best" anymore is largely due to the fact that other players had already showed they were better than him when they're playing their best (MMA, Jjakji) but Mvp was much more consistent so that's why he retained his position. With him recently falling apart like that, it's hard to say that players - who are also becoming just as consistent while showing better results - are not overtaking him.
How has Jjakji shown better consistency? He got destroyed by Ganzi and nearly lost to Boxer.
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On February 05 2012 15:02 0neder wrote:
Are their VODs? I love Hero, but didn't catch this live!
'Darkness Falls' - this name is just way too melodramatic, and the WC3 reference doesn't help it at all.
i think you can watch them under "videos" of the IPL twitchtv channel
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On February 05 2012 14:56 Bagration wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2012 14:50 devPLEASE wrote:
I takes a Korean to beat a Korean. Well played Hero. Now do it in the GSL. Sheth over Ryung? Mana over Ganzi?
Sheth and Mana are Korean.
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EPT
