"I just arrived here in Kiev and must say this netcafe, cyberarena is freaking cool ;D, prolly best netcafe i've visited and I went to many in my life :D, gonna meet a few players soon and tomorrow it kicks off, gonna be a great event dispite 10 terrans, im sure of that!" - Rotterdam
Wow, almost exlusively Terran. How were the slots filled? Based on EPS results, qualification, invite or a combination? I can remember the past IEMs slots were given away differently.
On January 17 2011 23:14 kazansky wrote: Wow, almost exlusively Terran. How were the slots filled? Based on EPS results, qualification, invite or a combination? I can remember the past IEMs slots were given away differently.
All qualification afaik.
Also, I sure as hell won't be watching this bore of a tournament. They better be showing lots of QuakeLive or I'm gonna be pissed.
On January 17 2011 23:14 kazansky wrote: Wow, almost exlusively Terran. How were the slots filled?
Multiple national cups, 2 more qualification rounds, and finally a groupstage out of which the top2 of each group advanced to the final. All 4 remaining Zerg (Dimaga, DeathAngel, Skruf, Morrow) did not get out of the group stage See Liquipedia for more detailed coverage
Like someone else said I hope they show lots of QL (and they really better because its one of the best tourney lineups for QL I've seen in a long time) or I think I'll just fall asleep, 20% toss 80% terran just thinking of all the TvT is making me snore.
Is there a timetable anywhere? I looked on the official page earlier this morning for a good ten minutes, but I couldn't find anything. Depending on when it starts on friday, I wanna take a day of vacation then
I really love tvt, so that's a plus, but damn, this will probably even too much for me. Goody's group especially, each series with Goody in it will probably take around 1h30.
on one hand i'm extremely happy i can be part of this but on the other hand im really sad that it's almost all terrans, because it's not really what viewers want and playing all matchups would be way more fun than playing 4x TvT which is very, very tiring (especially with goody in your group). i believe rotti and TLO will make the cast fun! looking forward to meeting everyone
Socke and Goody both have good chances to advance out of their group. Goody is becoming very good lately, especially in TvT and I think that Goody has the safest TvT style.
Socke won all three matches in his group leaving the other players with a 1-2 score and PredY advanced since he won against MorroW. Ret also tried to qualify, but he lost to servant in the dutch qualifier.
On January 17 2011 23:14 kazansky wrote: Wow, almost exlusively Terran. How were the slots filled?
Multiple national cups, 2 more qualification rounds, and finally a groupstage out of which the top2 of each group advanced to the final. All 4 remaining Zerg (Dimaga, DeathAngel, Skruf, Morrow) did not get out of the group stage See Liquipedia for more detailed coverage
Thanks, didnt expect a Liquipedia article on it, me pity
Are there any plans in making the qualification system more oriented towards national championships? I remember the IEMs once were filled by final standings of national EPS. Are there even enough EPS for this?
On January 17 2011 23:45 PredY wrote: on one hand i'm extremely happy i can be part of this but on the other hand im really sad that it's almost all terrans, because it's not really what viewers want and playing all matchups would be way more fun than playing 4x TvT which is very, very tiring (especially with goody in your group). i believe rotti and TLO will make the cast fun! looking forward to meeting everyone
I loled - the T-player who has to play goody last will surely hate his life
Also bad that the qualifiers were played at a time where Mana hadn't reached the full potential of his amazing PvT playstyle and Morrow hadn't mastered zerg yet. On the other hand, I'm struggling PvT myself right now and Socke is my favourite PvT player in Europe...so I'm really looking forward to this.
This is going to be a stamina contest ! I hope for them they do not play to many games like Jinro vs Ensnare :p , they might have to call the ambulance on the 23rd !
I agree that it's unfortunate that no zergs and so few protoss players are part of this. But people must understand that they were trying to qualify and got knocked out. Whether its because of racial imbalance at the time or that they didnt play very good might be discussed, but rest assured that the qualification for this tournament was very very long, there are no invites.
Oh, and TLO will not cast it. From his facebook page: "TheLittleOne sadly I have to to announce that I won't be able to attend the IEM in Kiev as a co-caster after all. I got very sick and I don't feel able to cast the event in the my current.
I think TvT is one of the most fun matchups, both to play and to watch, but even I think this is a a bit too many Terrans. That is, I know that it's not due to invites or anything like that, that rather it's because these terrans actaully qualified.
Still, with so many top players there's bound to be many good games.
Huge mistake to allow this many Terrans. They've literally destroyed the entire spectacle. There comes a point where you must decide whether you want a 100% fair qualification process or a tournament that people will actually watch. In this case those two things became mutually exclusive. Shame
I have to give the edge to White-Ra. With his current form and the fact that it's on his home turf, i would not be surprised one bit if he came out triumphant. Then again the same reasoning can be applied to Kas.
On January 18 2011 01:49 Klive5ive wrote: Huge mistake to allow this many Terrans. They've literally destroyed the entire spectacle. There comes a point where you must decide whether you want a 100% fair qualification process or a tournament that people will actually watch. In this case those two things became mutually exclusive. Shame
You realise this is not an invite tournament, right?
On January 18 2011 01:49 Klive5ive wrote: Huge mistake to allow this many Terrans. They've literally destroyed the entire spectacle. There comes a point where you must decide whether you want a 100% fair qualification process or a tournament that people will actually watch. In this case those two things became mutually exclusive. Shame
You are kidding right? So they're just going to take away hard earned spots that people fought really hard for just because the racial distribution got messed up?
Ugh, they should offer Red Bull to sponsor the tournament and have free drinks for all the terran players (and the watchers brave enough to watch all the games) I am sure that TvT can be a great matchup, but too much is too much This is why I rather have tournaments with half invite half qualifiers. Gives some balance for viewers and the run of the tournament sake, and still allows underdgos to qualify. Btw, having watched many tournaments lately, and playing ome.... I root for Kas, Im sorry White-Ra, you are OP and dont need rooting
There are good players in there, But TvT is so boring . And why no zerg
Because unlike the black dragon league (in which the only zergs were invited i believe because they didnt win any qualifiers), this one was just qualifiers, is my guess.
Wow no zerg, i guess european terrans rly are the boss! Shame that there iusnt many accomplished european zergs, i mean darkforce is pretty good but not on the same level as these guys quite yet, and ret is in korea, tho i wud have expected dimaga there or morrow
On January 18 2011 06:41 Zacsafus wrote: Wow no zerg, i guess european terrans rly are the boss! Shame that there iusnt many accomplished european zergs, i mean darkforce is pretty good but not on the same level as these guys quite yet, and ret is in korea, tho i wud have expected dimaga there or morrow
the funny thing is that Europe have alot of good Zergs, like Dimaga, TLO, MorroW, DarkForcE, Lalush, DabOo, Zpux ect ect
I love to see many of them playing, but the race stats looks soooo boring, so many T. Not even one Zerg? TvT starts annoying after the 3rd game of tanks and vikings slowly inching forward. Go Ra and Demu !
the funny thing is that Europe have alot of good Zergs, like Dimaga, TLO, MorroW, DarkForcE, Lalush, DabOo, Zpux ect ec
Exactly, they just... never win any tournaments (or the qualifiers apparently, could anyone correct me if im wrong about the black dragon league zergs being 100 percent invited?)
On January 18 2011 06:41 Zacsafus wrote: Wow no zerg, i guess european terrans rly are the boss! Shame that there iusnt many accomplished european zergs, i mean darkforce is pretty good but not on the same level as these guys quite yet, and ret is in korea, tho i wud have expected dimaga there or morrow
the funny thing is that Europe have alot of good Zergs, like Dimaga, TLO, MorroW, DarkForcE, Lalush, DabOo, Zpux ect ect
I don't think Europe has that many top Tier. Only really Dimaga and maybe TLO/Morrow/Darkforce. The rest are really good but aren't top tier like the T/P guys. There's a difference between top tier and being really good.
the funny thing is that Europe have alot of good Zergs, like Dimaga, TLO, MorroW, DarkForcE, Lalush, DabOo, Zpux ect ec
Exactly, they just... never win any tournaments (or the qualifiers apparently, could anyone correct me if im wrong about the black dragon league zergs being 100 percent invited?)
3 of each race were invited, and then 2 protoss and 4 terran qualified I believe?
To anyone that's unfamiliar with the Intel Extreme Masters:
The European Championship has started a few months ago with 24 players competing in it in an online group stage (before that we had national and international qualification).
There were several Zerg and Protoss players in here, many others have failed to qualify this far:
This is what a "natural selection" of players throughout the tournament has brought us: 10 Ts and 2 Ps. While we would prefer a more balanced race distribution, those are the best players in the tournament so far. Each of those 12 players has played 5 or more matches to get to the live final.
Like it or not, this reflects the state of the game in Europe over the months that have gone by. We would rather wait for the balance of the game to change than to discriminate against players who have earned their place among the 12 best in the continent fair and square.
On January 18 2011 07:03 wxwx wrote: wow what a horrible race distribution.. I hope this is a rare occurence, because if it gets any worse, we'll be seeing an all-terran tournament.
Since this qualification there has already been a big shift. Protoss is doing much better now in the euro tournaments, winning bascially as much, maybe even more then the terrans. Only zerg is still rarely seen in the final of tournaments.
it should be noted that qualification for this began shortly after release when zerg was having a very difficult time against terran thus most zergs weren't able to win their national cups and those that did were eliminated in the qualifying rounds.
On January 18 2011 06:41 Zacsafus wrote: Wow no zerg, i guess european terrans rly are the boss! Shame that there iusnt many accomplished european zergs, i mean darkforce is pretty good but not on the same level as these guys quite yet, and ret is in korea, tho i wud have expected dimaga there or morrow
the funny thing is that Europe have alot of good Zergs, like Dimaga, TLO, MorroW, DarkForcE, Lalush, DabOo, Zpux ect ect
I don't think Europe has that many top Tier. Only really Dimaga and maybe TLO/Morrow/Darkforce. The rest are really good but aren't top tier like the T/P guys. There's a difference between top tier and being really good.
this is a non-argument. Like saying that there are not that many asian bballers in NBA because there are not that many top tier asian bballers. While true the real issues are the causes underlining that.
This might be the first time Socke won't be hindered by a PvP to win a big tournament lol
Also, if Goody is in good shape this event will take like double the planned time, since he never attacks in TvT and all his TvT's are like 30+ minutes :D
On January 17 2011 23:18 arctics86 wrote: I think there were several qualification rounds in October/November last year
Seeing so many terrans was a let down at first, but TvT is actually very nice to watch and there won't be any balance discussions afterwards^^
Yeah, TvT is great fun that value micro and skill. From a purely spectator point of view the lack of Protoss players are good news but some Zergs would make up for good esports. Sadly I doubt people will watch these games due to all the mirrors, but they should be really entertaining. TvT is IMO the second most entertaining MU spectator-wise after TvZ.
On January 17 2011 23:18 arctics86 wrote: I think there were several qualification rounds in October/November last year
Seeing so many terrans was a let down at first, but TvT is actually very nice to watch and there won't be any balance discussions afterwards^^
Yeah, TvT is great fun that value micro and skill. From a purely spectator point of view the lack of Protoss players are good news but some Zergs would make up for good esports. Sadly I doubt people will watch these games due to all the mirrors, but they should be really entertaining. TvT is IMO the second most entertaining MU spectator-wise after TvZ.
How so? PvT and PvZ both are excellent match ups for the spectators imo. Especially in the foreigner scene where we see a fair amount of macro games.
On January 18 2011 07:17 naamis wrote: I think scheduling this tournament might be a pain in the ass because tvts can last soooo loong
Honest to God, I think Goody will get cheesed more than half of his matches - I expect a lot of proxy rax marine/SCV all-ins. And blue flame hellion drops.
On January 17 2011 23:18 arctics86 wrote: I think there were several qualification rounds in October/November last year
Seeing so many terrans was a let down at first, but TvT is actually very nice to watch and there won't be any balance discussions afterwards^^
Yeah, TvT is great fun that value micro and skill. From a purely spectator point of view the lack of Protoss players are good news but some Zergs would make up for good esports. Sadly I doubt people will watch these games due to all the mirrors, but they should be really entertaining. TvT is IMO the second most entertaining MU spectator-wise after TvZ.
TvT requires very little micro compared to other match-ups. You are probably confusing micro with positional play. For me as a protoss player I usually prefer PvP to TvT....simply because TvT can take so long with everyone just macro-ing up and no action whatsoever. Although PvPs are a pain to play, watching the hilarity of PvP can be quite funny, at least it is to me.
Yeah will be fun to see if socke and white-ra brings it. Also since Im swedish I really want to see merz and sjow do well, though there are a lot of good terrans there.
Im guessing top 3 will look something like this (and Im probably gonna be totally wrong) :
On January 17 2011 23:39 MaRkieMarK wrote: Is there a reason why Dimaga is not in this?
Yes he lost in his group during the online season against Merz and Demuslim.
Do you know who you will have as co caster yet?
"Unfortunately TheLittleOne won't be able to attend the European Championship Finals in Kiev as a co-caster after all. He is very sick and doesn't feel able to cast the event. So RotterdaM will pick some of the attending 12 players to give you the best viewers experience possible."
I dont think that its complete yet, because i couldnt find a link on the esl page, but had to type it in manually. SC2 coverage should be quite good, as theres an "ESL TV SC2" stream.
On January 18 2011 20:44 drooL wrote: i would love to see whitera winning this and i wouldn't be surprised to see him do so. his PvT is insanely good and his PvP is as well.
And his PvZ is also out of this world. The guy is pretty complete.
On January 17 2011 23:39 MaRkieMarK wrote: Is there a reason why Dimaga is not in this?
Yes he lost in his group during the online season against Merz and Demuslim.
Do you know who you will have as co caster yet?
"Unfortunately TheLittleOne won't be able to attend the European Championship Finals in Kiev as a co-caster after all. He is very sick and doesn't feel able to cast the event. So RotterdaM will pick some of the attending 12 players to give you the best viewers experience possible."
I dont think that its complete yet, because i couldnt find a link on the esl page, but had to type it in manually. SC2 coverage should be quite good, as theres an "ESL TV SC2" stream.
I guess the Homestory Cup was a good example for having a pro as a co caster. Hope there will be more events like this: A real caster who can lead through the game speakingwise and a pro who can give his opinions and predictions.
The more money is on the line the better white-ra gets...this guys is insane in big(ger) tournaments, he did just win three tournaments with >1k price money each.
Though Europe has a lot of great zerg players, the reason they may not win as many tournaments may be because it's difficult to win a lot of games as zerg in a row, as you need in a tournament, the biggest problem is the choice between units and drones, and you can often accidently make too many drones, or not scout something you should have, and therefore lose a game.
This dosen't mean zerg is any worse than the other races, just that it's hard to play "safe".
On-topic: Great to see White-ra being the favourite, hoping he does well to keep the number of mirror's low.
I love the fact that the 2 protoss players have most votes of who the people of TL has voted for. White-ra/Duckload-ra has been playing just super lately so I'll out my money on him.
And also, the protoss players may have an advantage since they pretty much only have to prepare for one matchup since 10/12 is Terran. Hopefully we'll see some epic TvT, and not "I'll put my tanks here and you put your over there so they can watch each other, but not shoot!"
Sad to see so many Terrans and no Zergs, but cant fault the organisers to much since it was all done using qualifications over a long time. Fair but unfortunate result.
I hope you learn from this in the future and start using non-blizzard maps in your events, GSL has realised this is the only way to go and you should really do the same.
I don't see why this shouldn't be entertaining lol...
TvT is by far the most interesting mirror, because they have a lot of strategies at hand, which imho is the difference between PvP or ZvZ, ofc this is just me.
Nobody wants to see tank chess as a spectator, but you are guaranted to see the better player advance in those situations, because then its all about your strategic abilities.
On January 18 2011 21:57 dtz wrote: Only Rotterdam and DeMuslim combo will make me watch these many TvTs.
Rotterdam + ToD + DeMuslim would make it interresting. At the moment, I've not a big interest in this tournament. But its the risk with tournaments without any invites.
Yeah, with this distribution of races i really dont care about the tournament. I think TvT can be the most entertaining mirror match, but that really doesn't happen very often. Let Whiteload-Ra win the thing in the finals against deMuslim and everything is fine.
The reason TvT can be entertaining is the same reason why it is so hard to play against T at the moment.
Even as a Zerg play I enjoy how many different styles of Terran exist. You got your cheesers, your macro players, your timing pushers, your micro marine/MM players, players that drop harass, players that are great w/ tanks and mech, players that are creative with ravens and nukes etc. And a lot of players are good at a variety of the above.
It is fun to watch creative players with solid micro and macro(either one or the other, or a combination) really test the creativity terran offers. I only hope that the future expansions will help add some depth to the other races to offer the same variety.
I'll watch just because with that many TvT games potentially, you are bound to see a lot of creative play by the time the players get a few games in. I'll also be rooting for the Toss players!
On January 18 2011 07:01 Carmac wrote: To anyone that's unfamiliar with the Intel Extreme Masters:
The European Championship has started a few months ago with 24 players competing in it in an online group stage (before that we had national and international qualification).
There were several Zerg and Protoss players in here, many others have failed to qualify this far:
This is what a "natural selection" of players throughout the tournament has brought us: 10 Ts and 2 Ps. While we would prefer a more balanced race distribution, those are the best players in the tournament so far. Each of those 12 players has played 5 or more matches to get to the live final.
Like it or not, this reflects the state of the game in Europe over the months that have gone by. We would rather wait for the balance of the game to change than to discriminate against players who have earned their place among the 12 best in the continent fair and square.
The way the race distribution ended up being is pretty sad but I 100% agree with this. This was a good way to do it, it's just that europe has been entirely dominated by terrans, only recently protoss has been doing well too. I'm sure next year with the exact same system the race distribution will be much better.
Man, I hope you guys like TvT. This Terran-heavy player pool could seriously hamper the popularity of the eventual stream as many people will get tired of the matchup. But as Carmac said, there's nothing they can (or should) do, these are the players that have qualified for the tournament fair and square.
Also, is it true that the Gom people are looking at IEM results to determine some of the GSL Code A invitees? Because that'd would up the ante considerably, even with the big prize pool as-is.
In any case, good luck to all the players! I'll definitely be watching. :D
On January 19 2011 04:16 Socke wrote: having kulas and desert instead of jungle shak in the mappool also helped in lowering the z and p numbers for sure
Well isnt desert a much better map for zerg than jungle? I think what played a bigger role was that the first qualification rounds were played before the zerg buff (4 range roach and stuff). But even if played now there probably wouldnt be much more zergs. I could only see Dimaga and Morrow having a chance, others would need a lot of luck.
On January 19 2011 05:25 On_Slaught wrote: Most of the good Eu players are going to be playing here. Really excited to see this one (tho Whitera is the heavy fav prob).
Well at least most of the good EU terrans for sure. No Zerg makes me sad though.
On January 18 2011 07:01 Carmac wrote: To anyone that's unfamiliar with the Intel Extreme Masters:
The European Championship has started a few months ago with 24 players competing in it in an online group stage (before that we had national and international qualification).
There were several Zerg and Protoss players in here, many others have failed to qualify this far:
This is what a "natural selection" of players throughout the tournament has brought us: 10 Ts and 2 Ps. While we would prefer a more balanced race distribution, those are the best players in the tournament so far. Each of those 12 players has played 5 or more matches to get to the live final.
Like it or not, this reflects the state of the game in Europe over the months that have gone by. We would rather wait for the balance of the game to change than to discriminate against players who have earned their place among the 12 best in the continent fair and square.
Quoting so that whiners might see it. :|
I mean it's kinda shitty how it turned out, but it's 100% fair... shit happens.
If I'd have to chose a mirror than I'd say TvT is the most exciting one, but I don't think it's the "balance" that matters here but more the maps that people in SC2.
We need to get custom maps into the big leagues to be able to see more of the other races.
On January 18 2011 20:19 eltese wrote: Yeah will be fun to see if socke and white-ra brings it. Also since Im swedish I really want to see merz and sjow do well, though there are a lot of good terrans there.
Im guessing top 3 will look something like this (and Im probably gonna be totally wrong) :
guys. you have to understand, that in europe the distribution of good players go like this:
TTTTTTT>PPP>ZZ
for every "rly good" p/z player, i could name 3 terrans, for every "top tier" p/z player i could name 2-3 terrans.
look at all the smaller tournaments and u will see. sure mana/white-ra/socke/dimaga/morrow etc wins alot too, but they are also TOP TOP tier, but theyre still 2-3x as many terrans, although not as many on their lvl. normally 6-7 out of 10 are terrans in euope top10.
i dont know why this is. perhaps the fact that terran was OP for some time, and the fact that most terrans were earlier pros, so they werent just abusers but were good, and then kept playing, idk.
edit: oh yeah and GoOdy will be interesting xD his games always go 25min+ and he never attacks xD when he wins some big battle his standard reponse is always more CC's and factories which i guess is very good and safe tvt, as its easy to lose ur patience and suicide into a well made siege line
On January 19 2011 22:06 CryMeAReaper wrote: guys. you have to understand, that in europe the distribution of good players go like this:
TTTTTTT>PPP>ZZ
for every "rly good" p/z player, i could name 3 terrans, for every "top tier" p/z player i could name 2-3 terrans.
look at all the smaller tournaments and u will see. sure mana/white-ra/socke/dimaga/morrow etc wins alot too, but they are also TOP TOP tier, but theyre still 2-3x as many terrans, although not as many on their lvl. normally 6-7 out of 10 are terrans in euope top10.
i dont know why this is. perhaps the fact that terran was OP for some time, and the fact that most terrans were earlier pros, so they werent just abusers but were good, and then kept playing, idk.
edit: oh yeah and GoOdy will be interesting xD his games always go 25min+ and he never attacks xD when he wins some big battle his standard reponse is always more CC's and factories which i guess is very good and safe tvt, as its easy to lose ur patience and suicide into a well made siege line
So basically what you are saying is that the terran players are simply better than the zerg players. Well I am not saying that is no true, but it might also be total bullshit. You just know more top tier terran players because they are more succesful in tournaments, which again could be related to imbalance. There is simple no way to verify that either way. Therefore one should be cautious with such judgements.
On January 19 2011 22:06 CryMeAReaper wrote: guys. you have to understand, that in europe the distribution of good players go like this:
TTTTTTT>PPP>ZZ
for every "rly good" p/z player, i could name 3 terrans, for every "top tier" p/z player i could name 2-3 terrans.
look at all the smaller tournaments and u will see. sure mana/white-ra/socke/dimaga/morrow etc wins alot too, but they are also TOP TOP tier, but theyre still 2-3x as many terrans, although not as many on their lvl. normally 6-7 out of 10 are terrans in euope top10.
i dont know why this is. perhaps the fact that terran was OP for some time, and the fact that most terrans were earlier pros, so they werent just abusers but were good, and then kept playing, idk.
edit: oh yeah and GoOdy will be interesting xD his games always go 25min+ and he never attacks xD when he wins some big battle his standard reponse is always more CC's and factories which i guess is very good and safe tvt, as its easy to lose ur patience and suicide into a well made siege line
So basically what you are saying is that the terran players are simply better than the zerg players. Well I am not saying that is no true, but it might also be total bullshit. You just know more top tier terran players because they are more succesful in tournaments, which again could be related to imbalance. There is simple no way to verify that either way. Therefore one should be cautious with such judgements.
Hes saying theres not as many good Zergs as there are good Protoss and Terrans in Europe, which is true.
What top Zergs are there in Europe? Now think of all the top Terrans and Protoss and you get the point.
If I understand the schedule right, there will be sc2 games going on that will not be casted because of counter strike or other stuff being shown at the same time. Can they not organize a second caster or something to cover these games? That really annoys me I must say, I dont want my watching of sc2 to be interrupted by games I dont care about.
edit: According to the schedule, first sc2 games will be casted at 17.00 while the games actually begin at 12:00. That cant be right. I really hope there is some other cast that is just not mentioned in the schedule.
On January 19 2011 22:06 CryMeAReaper wrote: guys. you have to understand, that in europe the distribution of good players go like this:
TTTTTTT>PPP>ZZ
for every "rly good" p/z player, i could name 3 terrans, for every "top tier" p/z player i could name 2-3 terrans.
look at all the smaller tournaments and u will see. sure mana/white-ra/socke/dimaga/morrow etc wins alot too, but they are also TOP TOP tier, but theyre still 2-3x as many terrans, although not as many on their lvl. normally 6-7 out of 10 are terrans in euope top10.
i dont know why this is. perhaps the fact that terran was OP for some time, and the fact that most terrans were earlier pros, so they werent just abusers but were good, and then kept playing, idk.
edit: oh yeah and GoOdy will be interesting xD his games always go 25min+ and he never attacks xD when he wins some big battle his standard reponse is always more CC's and factories which i guess is very good and safe tvt, as its easy to lose ur patience and suicide into a well made siege line
So basically what you are saying is that the terran players are simply better than the zerg players. Well I am not saying that is no true, but it might also be total bullshit. You just know more top tier terran players because they are more succesful in tournaments, which again could be related to imbalance. There is simple no way to verify that either way. Therefore one should be cautious with such judgements.
Hes saying theres not as many good Zergs as there are good Protoss and Terrans in Europe, which is true.
What top Zergs are there in Europe? Now think of all the top Terrans and Protoss and you get the point.
You didnt get my point. So I will try to explain it. How do you define who is a top player? I am pretty sure you are going by success in tournaments. So here is a hypothetical (or real? ) sceneario with imbalance: The top zergs win basically no tournaments, or just very rarely. Which means that the zerg player number 10 skillwise never even reaches finals. So you will never take zerg player number 10 serious as a top player. In contrast to that the top terran players win many tournaments. So terran player number 10 doesnt win a lot, but a few, maybe as much as the top zergs. This leads to you regarding him as a top player. So as a result of this your impression is, that there are 10 top terran players, but only 2 or 3 top zerg players. While this is actually the result of imbalance.
Now this scenario might not actually be the truth and zerg players are indeed worse, or there are less good zergs. But there is no way you could know that. And the fact that even the top zerg players do not win much is at least a good indication that zerg indeed do have it more difficult.
On January 19 2011 23:01 Redox wrote: If I understand the schedule right, there will be sc2 games going on that will not be casted because of counter strike or other stuff being shown at the same time. Can they not organize a second caster or something to cover these games? That really annoys me I must say, I dont want my watching of sc2 to be interrupted by games I dont care about.
edit: According to the schedule, first sc2 games will be casted at 17.00 while the games actually begin at 12:00. That cant be right. I really hope there is some other cast that is just not mentioned in the schedule.
According to the ESL page there will a Stream from Studio2 wich will stream Starcraft matches all day.
We offer a second stream, which shows the StarCraft 2 matches that will not be played on stage - our commentators Dennis "HasuObs" Schneider and Phil "FiLLy" Klockow will be casting them from Studio 2. Click to see exactly what matches are being broadcasted by the second stream!
Yes that is correct, same goes for Fenix and QXC, I just arrived here in Kiev and must say this netcafe, cyberarena is freaking cool ;D, prolly best netcafe i've visitted and I went to many in my life :D, gonna meet a few players soon and tomorrow it kicks off, gonna be a great event dispite 10 terrans, im sure of that! :p
On January 19 2011 22:06 CryMeAReaper wrote: guys. you have to understand, that in europe the distribution of good players go like this:
TTTTTTT>PPP>ZZ
for every "rly good" p/z player, i could name 3 terrans, for every "top tier" p/z player i could name 2-3 terrans.
look at all the smaller tournaments and u will see. sure mana/white-ra/socke/dimaga/morrow etc wins alot too, but they are also TOP TOP tier, but theyre still 2-3x as many terrans, although not as many on their lvl. normally 6-7 out of 10 are terrans in euope top10.
i dont know why this is. perhaps the fact that terran was OP for some time, and the fact that most terrans were earlier pros, so they werent just abusers but were good, and then kept playing, idk.
edit: oh yeah and GoOdy will be interesting xD his games always go 25min+ and he never attacks xD when he wins some big battle his standard reponse is always more CC's and factories which i guess is very good and safe tvt, as its easy to lose ur patience and suicide into a well made siege line
That's funny, let me present you something you say there are more players and you draw a 7-3-2 ratio. So let's double that number, because it woudl be too small, so 4-6-14 (let's exclude those in korea)
Zergs: let's see who's top 4 out of the top of my head wihtout giving it too much thinking, Dimaga, Morrow, Nerchio and Darkforce Protoss: White-ra, Socke, Hasu, Naniwa, Mana and ohm, maybe Nightend and Terrans: Demuslim, Kas, Tarson, Sjow, Strelok, Naama, Goody, Cloud, Bratok ohmmm Sarens, merz,and predy?
Do you think all these players (you can change some of the names to personal preference) are in one leauge, say S, and the others in a code A or below? let's try to make a code A. Z: Madfrog, Stephano, Naugrim, Lalush P: pf, im in a problem now, Bischu, ommm, Elfi? guys sorry i cant even name 6 code A Protosses from europe T: well, Thorzain i guess, Satiini, Jimpo, inuh maybe, pff, who else, Fury maybe? sorry guys im out once again.
So please, put this question to yourself? Are players like merz and predy on the same level as Dimaga and Morrow? Are they above the skill level of Madfrog or Lalush? And speaking of them, are they in the same leauge as those couple enumarated, and the others who shoud be there, but i just cant name them, becuase they re simply too insignificant (could have missed 1 or 2 big names, sorry for that)? I for one could name a number of other Zergs who are really skilled such as Mondragon, Deathangel, Bly, Syz, Ciara, Osho, who unfortunately would have to get something like code B.
So think this trhough and answer me, is the reason for lack of Zerg players the lack of talented gamers playing that race? I certainly dont want to start a flame-war or a race-fight, things like this could happen in a 100% balanced situation (though it would be a statisctical anomaly) just food for thought, and let me know if you really think this is the sitation
On January 20 2011 00:30 RotterdaM wrote: Yes that is correct, same goes for Fenix and QXC, I just arrived here in Kiev and must say this netcafe, cyberarena is freaking cool ;D, prolly best netcafe i've visitted and I went to many in my life :D, gonna meet a few players soon and tomorrow it kicks off, gonna be a great event dispite 10 terrans, im sure of that! :p
I want the power of MULES mentioned in every game >
If you repeat it enough, it might get changed!
Also, White-ra will absorb the ukranian hometown vibe to power to victory, the guy is in scary scary shape atm.
On January 20 2011 00:53 Geo.Rion wrote: So please, put this question to yourself? Are players like merz and predy on the same level as Dimaga and Morrow? Are they above the skill level of Madfrog or Lalush? And speaking of them, are they in the same leauge as those couple enumarated, and the others who shoud be there, but i just cant name them, becuase they re simply too insignificant (could have missed 1 or 2 big names, sorry for that)?
merz qualifying results: vs Demuslim 2-0 vs Dimaga 2-1 vs KroLu 2-0
On January 20 2011 00:53 Geo.Rion wrote: Are players like merz and predy on the same level as Dimaga and Morrow? Are they above the skill level of Madfrog or Lalush? And speaking of them, are they in the same leauge as those couple enumarated, and the others who shoud be there, but i just cant name them, becuase they re simply too insignificant (could have missed 1 or 2 big names, sorry for that)? I for one could name a number of other Zergs who are really skilled such as Mondragon, Deathangel, Bly, Syz, Ciara, Osho, who unfortunately would have to get something like code B.
Ths is exactly why Carmac posted what he did.
If you say 'player X is bad, player Y is soooo much better - he should be there instead' you have to explain to us all why they didnt win the qualifying tournaments?
As far as I know, everyone of them had the chance to enter - yet the either didnt, or lost.
So who is better really?
Many players are carried by their profile, there is never any doubt that the best way to audition for an important offline LAN is not to go through the fanmail, but to get the guys to play some damn sc2 matches to determine who has the 'right' to go.
Otherwise, we would never have any new players breaking through into the pro scene, if every tournament was invite only and only the same people got invited.
Not to be rude, but i really have no interest in watching any BW or SC2 tournament where its TvT, PvP or ZvZ.
I understand that no Z players qualified and only 2 Toss got in, and i have respect for all these players as being some of the best Europe has to offer.
Ill do what most others will do, check if WhiteRa or Socke are doing well and tune in if any good PvT matches happen.
Good luck to everyone and i hope you have a great tournament!
On January 20 2011 00:53 Geo.Rion wrote: So please, put this question to yourself? Are players like merz and predy on the same level as Dimaga and Morrow? Are they above the skill level of Madfrog or Lalush? And speaking of them, are they in the same leauge as those couple enumarated, and the others who shoud be there, but i just cant name them, becuase they re simply too insignificant (could have missed 1 or 2 big names, sorry for that)?
merz qualifying results: vs Demuslim 2-0 vs Dimaga 2-1 vs KroLu 2-0
Just saying.
you totally missed my point. I have not said Merz is a bad player or anything like that.
On January 20 2011 00:53 Geo.Rion wrote: Are players like merz and predy on the same level as Dimaga and Morrow? Are they above the skill level of Madfrog or Lalush? And speaking of them, are they in the same leauge as those couple enumarated, and the others who shoud be there, but i just cant name them, becuase they re simply too insignificant (could have missed 1 or 2 big names, sorry for that)? I for one could name a number of other Zergs who are really skilled such as Mondragon, Deathangel, Bly, Syz, Ciara, Osho, who unfortunately would have to get something like code B.
Ths is exactly why Carmac posted what he did.
If you say 'player X is bad, player Y is soooo much better - he should be there instead' you have to explain to us all why they didnt win the qualifying tournaments?
As far as I know, everyone of them had the chance to enter - yet the either didnt, or lost.
So who is better really?
Many players are carried by their profile, there is never any doubt that the best way to audition for an important offline LAN is not to go through the fanmail, but to get the guys to play some damn sc2 matches to determine who has the 'right' to go.
Otherwise, we would never have any new players breaking through into the pro scene, if every tournament was invite only and only the same people got invited.
you too, but even worse. The guy is saying there is a lack of zerg player at the highest level regardless of balance, european talented gamers pick terran or maybe P but not T. I tried my best to stay pollitcally correct and explain, that there would be a player pool of zerg gamers with skills, yet they fail to qualify for some reason.
You 2 guys's counterarguments, yes, Merz beat dimaga, Yes, all the Zergs lost hence they are worse.
Do you guys really not see a flaw in that logic? I'm not trying to say there are people who don't deserve to be in there
You have to realize that some of the qualifier-matches were played at unfortunate times. For example it's easy to explain why Morrow didn't qualify: he switched to zerg and was still in the process of learning his race (not saying he has mastered them yet, he is still getting better constantly....unless he is screwing around with protoss too much lol). I'd say zergs in Europe have always struggled the most out of all realms, since zerg was really weak in the release-version few people managed to persist on the highest level and really "develop" the race.
just recently naama said in an interview that he thinks white-ra or socke will win the tourney. We will see but i think hes right. why are you guys discussing about merz? he wont win anything in kiev either way.Winning some Bo3s doesnt make him better. gl white-ra! Im also curious why the ESL travels from the Germany to the Ukraine? Is the location cheaper?
I am curious to see what new developments this tournament will bring to TvT. European TvT is really good and I am sure the players have prepared some new strats.
On January 19 2011 22:06 CryMeAReaper wrote: guys. you have to understand, that in europe the distribution of good players go like this:
TTTTTTT>PPP>ZZ
for every "rly good" p/z player, i could name 3 terrans, for every "top tier" p/z player i could name 2-3 terrans.
look at all the smaller tournaments and u will see. sure mana/white-ra/socke/dimaga/morrow etc wins alot too, but they are also TOP TOP tier, but theyre still 2-3x as many terrans, although not as many on their lvl. normally 6-7 out of 10 are terrans in euope top10.
i dont know why this is. perhaps the fact that terran was OP for some time, and the fact that most terrans were earlier pros, so they werent just abusers but were good, and then kept playing, idk.
edit: oh yeah and GoOdy will be interesting xD his games always go 25min+ and he never attacks xD when he wins some big battle his standard reponse is always more CC's and factories which i guess is very good and safe tvt, as its easy to lose ur patience and suicide into a well made siege line
That's funny, let me present you something you say there are more players and you draw a 7-3-2 ratio. So let's double that number, because it woudl be too small, so 4-6-14 (let's exclude those in korea)
Zergs: let's see who's top 4 out of the top of my head wihtout giving it too much thinking, Dimaga, Morrow, Nerchio and Darkforce Protoss: White-ra, Socke, Hasu, Naniwa, Mana and ohm, maybe Nightend and Terrans: Demuslim, Kas, Tarson, Sjow, Strelok, Naama, Goody, Cloud, Bratok ohmmm Sarens, merz,and predy?
Do you think all these players (you can change some of the names to personal preference) are in one leauge, say S, and the others in a code A or below? let's try to make a code A. Z: Madfrog, Stephano, Naugrim, Lalush P: pf, im in a problem now, Bischu, ommm, Elfi? guys sorry i cant even name 6 code A Protosses from europe T: well, Thorzain i guess, Satiini, Jimpo, inuh maybe, pff, who else, Fury maybe? sorry guys im out once again.
So please, put this question to yourself? Are players like merz and predy on the same level as Dimaga and Morrow? Are they above the skill level of Madfrog or Lalush? And speaking of them, are they in the same leauge as those couple enumarated, and the others who shoud be there, but i just cant name them, becuase they re simply too insignificant (could have missed 1 or 2 big names, sorry for that)? I for one could name a number of other Zergs who are really skilled such as Mondragon, Deathangel, Bly, Syz, Ciara, Osho, who unfortunately would have to get something like code B.
So think this trhough and answer me, is the reason for lack of Zerg players the lack of talented gamers playing that race? I certainly dont want to start a flame-war or a race-fight, things like this could happen in a 100% balanced situation (though it would be a statisctical anomaly) just food for thought, and let me know if you really think this is the sitation
It most certainly has something to do with alot of the qualifications being played pre the zerg buff. But also, there are just alot of terrans in EU, and theres not as many of the other races, even tho its getting much better with P recently. Now i dont know why terrans are doing so well in EU. Maybe terrans has something to do with the understanding being better for Terran in EU, or imbalance, or simply just due to the fact that theres more terran players, and its more likely theres gonna be more terrans than P/Z.
On January 20 2011 19:22 drew-chan wrote: Anyone watching the main stream? I love the commentary of Joe Miller, and its gonna stream a nice mix of quake, 1.6, and SC2.
On January 20 2011 19:22 drew-chan wrote: Anyone watching the main stream? I love the commentary of Joe Miller, and its gonna stream a nice mix of quake, 1.6, and SC2.
On January 20 2011 19:22 drew-chan wrote: Anyone watching the main stream? I love the commentary of Joe Miller, and its gonna stream a nice mix of quake, 1.6, and SC2.
On January 20 2011 19:22 drew-chan wrote: Anyone watching the main stream? I love the commentary of Joe Miller, and its gonna stream a nice mix of quake, 1.6, and SC2.
I lost the sc2 stream. At first I could switch between streams, now only the main stream is on.
No, all streams are ON but we removed the switch buttons on the start page because they were causing problems. Click here please: http://tv.esl.eu/de/esltv_stream/
They even say in stream 2 that stream 1 isn't working. So yeah :>
Edit: And yeah, no idea what Socke could have done. He had concussive shells, so zealots are useless. Marauders kill Stalker easily with stim...*shrug*
On January 20 2011 20:09 Eggcake wrote: They even say in stream 2 that stream 1 isn't working. So yeah :>
Edit: And yeah, no idea what Socke could have done. He had concussive shells, so zealots are useless. Marauders kill Stalker easily with stim...*shrug*
Korean tosses held that kinda pushes with early sentries ( to fill their energy), then zealot stalkers. It's not easy though
CS 1.6: Group A - Frag Executors (Poland), SK Gaming (Sweden), mTw (Denmark), Mousesports (Germany), Meet Your Makers (Russia), esahara (France) - Group B: Na'Vi (Ukraine), fnatic (Sweden), Lions (Norway), Alternate (Germany), ForZe (Russia), Cph. Wolves (Denmark)
Thursday, January 20th:
5:00 AM EST: Group A - Frag Executors vs MYM @ HLTV 5:00 AM EST: Group B - GoOdy vs Socke, PredY vs ClouD @ ESL TV Studio 2 5:00 AM EST: Group B - Cooller vs tox1c @ ESL TV, noctis vs GoHLinK @ LevelUP TV 5:45 AM EST: Group B - Cypher vs Fazz @ ESL TV 6:00 AM EST: Group A - SK Gaming vs esahara @ HLTV 6:15 AM EST: Group B - SjoW vs SarenS, PredY vs Socke @ ESL TV Studio 2 6:30 AM EST: Group B - Cypher vs Cooller @ ESL TV 7:00 AM EST: Group A - Frag eXecutors vs esahara @ HLTV, mTw vs MYM @ ESL TV 7:15 AM EST: Group B - noctis vs Fazz @ LevelUP TV 7:30 AM EST: Group B - GoOdy vs SarenS, SjoW vs ClouD @ ESL TV Studio 2 8:00 AM EST: Group A - Na'Vi vs fnatic @ ESL TV 8:00 AM EST: Group B - tox1c vs GoHLinK @ LevelUp TV 8:45 AM EST: Group A - White-Ra vs Naama, merz vs Tarson @ ESL TV Studio 2 8:45 AM EST: Group A - madix vs k1llsen, av3k vs zsx @ LevelUp TV 9:00 AM EST: Group B - SK Gaming vs Mousesports @ ESL TV, ForZe vs TCM Gaming 9:30 AM EST: Group A - strenx vs Spart1e @ LevelUp TV 10:00 AM EST: Group B - Alternate vs Lions @ HLTV 10:00 AM EST: Group A - Kas vs DemusliM @ ESL TV, Naama vs Tarson @ ESL TV Studio 2 10:15 AM EST: Group A - zsx vs madix @ LevelUp TV 11:00 AM EST: Group B - fnatic vs Lions, Alternate vs TCM Gaming, ForZe vs Na'vi @ HLTV 11:00 AM EST: Group B - av3k vs Spart1e @ LevelUp TV 11:15 AM EST: Group A - Kas vs White-Ra @ ESL TV, DemusliM vs merz @ ESL TV Studio 2 11:45 AM EST: Group A - k1llsen vs strenx @ LevelUp TV 12:00 PM EST: Group B - Na'Vi vs Altnertae @ HLTV 12:30 PM EST: Group A - Naama vs DemusliM @ ESL TV, Kas vs merz @ ESL TV Studio 2 12:30 PM EST: Group A - madix vs av3k @ LevelUp TV 1:00 PM EST: Group B - Lions vs TCM Gaming @ HLTV 1:15 PM EST: Group A - strens vs zsx @ LevelUp TV 1:45 PM EST: Group A - White-Ra vs Tarson @ ESL TV 2:00 PM EST: Group B - Fnatic vs ForZe @ HLTV 2:00 PM EST: Group B - k1llsen vs Spart1e @ LevelUp TV
Friday, January 21st:
5:00 AM EST: Group A - mTw vs Mousesports @ HLTV 5:00 AM EST: Group B - SarenS vs ClouD @ ESL TV , GoOdy vs PredY @ ESL TV Studio 2 5:45 AM EST: Group B - noctis vs tox1c, Cypher vs GoHLinK @ LevelUp TV 6:00 AM EST: Group A - esahara vs Mousesports, SK Gaming vs MYM @ HLTV 6:15 AM EST: Group B - SjoW vs Socke @ ESL TV, GoOdy vs ClouD @ ESL TV Studio 2 6:30 AM EST: Group B - Fazz vs Cooller @ LevelUp TV 7:00 AM EST: Group A - Frag Executors vs mTw @ HLTV 7:15 AM EST: Group B - Fazz vs GoHLinK @ LevelUp TV 7:30 AM EST: Group B - SarenS vs Socke @ ESL TV 8:00 AM EST: Group A - MYM vs esahara @ HLTV 8:00 AM EST: Group B - Cypher vs tox1c @ LevelUp TV 8:45 AM EST: Group B - SjoW vs PredY @ ESL TV Studio 2 8:45 AM EST: Group B - Cooller vs noctis @ LevelUp TV 9:00 AM EST: Group B - Frag Executors vs Mousesports @ ESL TV 9:30 AM EST: Group A - strenx vs madix @ Level UP TV 10:00 AM EST: Group A - SK Gaming vs mTw @ ESL TV 10:00 AM EST: Group A - Kas vs Tarson, Naama vs Merz @ ESL TV Studio 2 10:15 AM EST: Group A - Spart1e vs zsx @ LevelUp TV 11:00 AM EST: Group B - fnatic vs TCM Gaming @ HLTV 11:00 AM EST: Group A - av3k vs k1llsen @ ESL TV 11:15 AM EST: Group A - White-Ra vs DemusliM @ ESL TV Studio 2 11:45 AM EST: Group A/B - strenx vs av3k, noctis vs Cypher @ ESL TV; k1llsen vs zsx, madix vs Spart1e @ LevelUp TV 12:00 PM EST: Group B - Alternate vs ForZe @ HLTV 12:30 PM EST: Group A/B - DemusliM vs Tarson, Socke vs ClouD @ ESL TV, 1:00 PM EST: Group B - Na'Vi vs Lions @ HLTV 2:00 PM EST: Group A/B - SK Gaming vs Fx @ ESL TV, Mousesports vs MYM, fnatic vs Alternate @ HLTV
Saturday, January 22nd:
5:00 AM EST: CS 1.6 Quarterfinal - 2nd Group A vs. 3rd Group B @ ESL TV 6:25 AM EST: Quake Live Quarterfinal - 2nd Group A vs. 3rd Group B @ LevelUp TV 6:30 AM EST: Starcraft 2 Quarterfinal - 2nd Group A vs. 3rd Group B @ ESL TV Studio 2 7:20 AM EST: Quake Live Quarterfinal - 2nd Group B vs. 3rd Group A @ ESL TV 7:20 AM EST: CS 1.6 Quarterfinal - 2nd Group B vs. 3rd Group A @ HLTV 8:15 AM EST: Starcraft 2 Quarterfinals - 2nd Group B vs. 3rd Group A @ ESL TV 10:00 AM EST: CS 1.6 Semifinals 1 @ ESL TV 12:20 PM EST: CS 1.6 Semifinals 2 @ ESL TV
Sunday, January 23rd:
5:00 AM EST: CS 1.6 Third Place Game @ HLTV 5:00 AM EST: Quake Live Semifinal 1 @ ESL TV 5:55 AM EST: Quake Live Semifinal 2 @ ESL TV 6:50 AM EST: Starcraft 2 Semifinal 1 @ ESL TV 8:35 AM EST: Starcraft 2 Semifinal 2 @ ESL TV 10:20 AM EST: CS 1.6 Grand Finals @ ESL TV 11:35 AM EST: Starcraft 2 Third Place Game @ ESL TV Studio 2 11:45 AM EST: Quake Live Third Place Game @ LevelUp TV 12:40 PM EST: Quake Live Grand Finals @ ESL TV 1:35 PM EST: Starcraft 2 Grand Finals @ ESL TV
They obviously are, and I find it pretty annoying. I already muted the stream and am listening to music right now ... kinda sad I can't hear game sounds either.
The casting doesn't feel as slick and exciting as the GSL, that's really too bad. I think they can really make it an awesome tournament if they get the casting and presentation up to par. You know, get an overlay when nothing is happening, maybe a nice introduction cutscene, some interviews or background information. Though the music is infinitely better than the horrible korean poprock they play at the GSL.
The casters might be braindead from the hour long mind numbing TvT with GoOdy and SerranS though.
On January 21 2011 00:11 Devanthar wrote: do someone know if the quake live matches are streamed somewhere? Slasher said that he would commentate some i think.
On January 21 2011 00:11 Devanthar wrote: do someone know if the quake live matches are streamed somewhere? Slasher said that he would commentate some i think.
On January 20 2011 23:59 Thenno wrote: The casting doesn't feel as slick and exciting as the GSL, that's really too bad. I think they can really make it an awesome tournament if they get the casting and presentation up to par. You know, get an overlay when nothing is happening, maybe a nice introduction cutscene, some interviews or background information. Though the music is infinitely better than the horrible korean poprock they play at the GSL.
The casters might be braindead from the hour long mind numbing TvT with GoOdy and SerranS though.
First of all, the problem is probably also that they are actually germans. So casting in english could be a little difficult. The second thing: they are casting since 11:00 in the morning...that's pretty long
On January 20 2011 23:59 Thenno wrote: The casting doesn't feel as slick and exciting as the GSL, that's really too bad. I think they can really make it an awesome tournament if they get the casting and presentation up to par. You know, get an overlay when nothing is happening, maybe a nice introduction cutscene, some interviews or background information. Though the music is infinitely better than the horrible korean poprock they play at the GSL.
The casters might be braindead from the hour long mind numbing TvT with GoOdy and SerranS though.
First of all, the problem is probably also that they are actually germans. So casting in english could be a little difficult. The second thing: they are casting since 11:00 in the morning...that's pretty long
And it is Filly (ESL TV SC2 Expert) and HasuObs (one of the best players in Europe!) casting! Olé!!
The schedule announces Kas vs Demuslim at 16h00 CET
It's 17h30 CET and the stream is announcing Kas vs Demuslim shortly.....
Am I wrong thinking all the hours are CET (that's what the site says though) or are they late ? Or is the schedule just wrong ?
If you got any info, I'll take it....I want to see White-Ra matches and a couple of other matches but don't want to get to check it every 10 minutes nor to watch the whole show....
Oh man you had to be there in the german ESL chat when the CS gamers found out that the next game was going to be SC2 and not SK vs mouz ... Some comments actually gave me chills. Also reminds me why SC2 is the best community in the world.
A quote from the ESL main/eventstream : heuka wrote: tolles game SC2... kz insassen beim ressourcen abbauen zuzugucken.. weltklasse translation : fantastic game SC2 .. watching KZ (concentration camp) residents mine ressources.. world class
I have no idea what has to go on in your mind to write that.
Been watching the stream for 2 hours now, went away 15 minutes, missed the only game. Rest of the time was spent watching guys falling asleep in front of the cameras or discussing players forever. Am I the only one watching http://tv.esl.eu/de/55-flv-fs1/ and wanting to shout : START THE GAME ALREADY. And yeah, I like to complain.
On January 21 2011 02:25 Eurekastreet wrote: Been watching the stream for 2 hours now, went away 15 minutes, missed the only game. Rest of the time was spent watching guys falling asleep in front of the cameras or discussing players forever. Am I the only one watching http://tv.esl.eu/de/55-flv-fs1/ and wanting to shout : START THE GAME ALREADY. And yeah, I like to complain.
I've never been very impressed by these ESL events.
Glad I ain't the only one. 15 minutes later, 2 casters have been talking on and on, still no match. Guess it ain't their fault, but when I'm gonna watch a football match, I don't need 1 hour of discussion before the match starts (put that on podcasts for that if needed) or at least let me know when the game is gonna start so I can do sthg else in the meantime if I ain't interested. This is just silly.
* they got connection issues, guess my last comment is not fully relevant then. Back to the old "give us LAN" (or "why this doesn't happen in GSL") complaint then...
On January 21 2011 02:43 Eurekastreet wrote: Glad I ain't the only one. 15 minutes later, 2 casters have been talking on and on, still no match. Guess it ain't their fault, but when I'm gonna watch a football match, I don't need 1 hour of discussion before the match starts (put that on podcasts for that if needed) or at least let me know when the game is gonna start so I can do sthg else in the meantime if I ain't interested. This is just silly.
You can't compare watching a single live sporting event to a tournament being cast online with multiple gaming platforms sharing the mainstage. When the second stream was casting games it was extremely smooth and were actually swapping between games as they were happening when something important was happening or a lull in action in a different one.
Not many reactions here, few people watching the event ?
Also, I don't know the name of the 2 present casters but...could the guy in the brown shirt stops talking for 10 seconds and let the other guy talk ? I'm not even listening to him anymore, seems he's just working on his lips APM but most of it is spam.
On January 21 2011 02:43 Eurekastreet wrote: Glad I ain't the only one. 15 minutes later, 2 casters have been talking on and on, still no match. Guess it ain't their fault, but when I'm gonna watch a football match, I don't need 1 hour of discussion before the match starts (put that on podcasts for that if needed) or at least let me know when the game is gonna start so I can do sthg else in the meantime if I ain't interested. This is just silly.
You can't compare watching a single live sporting event to a tournament being cast online with multiple gaming platforms sharing the mainstage. When the second stream was casting games it was extremely smooth and were actually swapping between games as they were happening when something important was happening or a lull in action in a different one.
Agreed, but I missed that part of the event, so far only got the negative bits, a bit upsetting....my fault I guess (plus I maybe you get too demanding watching GSL)
On January 21 2011 02:50 Eurekastreet wrote: Not many reactions here, few people watching the event ?
Also, I don't know the name of the 2 present casters but...could the guy in the brown shirt stops talking for 10 seconds and let the other guy talk ? I'm not even listening to him anymore, seems he's just working on his lips APM but most of it is spam.
Its Carnac and Rotti are casting, rotti the one with the brown shirt.
On January 21 2011 02:57 Anomalus wrote: Wheres the stream?
On January 21 2011 02:50 Eurekastreet wrote: Not many reactions here, few people watching the event ?
Also, I don't know the name of the 2 present casters but...could the guy in the brown shirt stops talking for 10 seconds and let the other guy talk ? I'm not even listening to him anymore, seems he's just working on his lips APM but most of it is spam.
Think of it like this in terms of game knowledge brown shirt guy (rotterdam) is Artosis and Green shirt guy (Carnac i think) is Tasteless but with less knowledge of SC2 but some of Esports in general.
Carmac isn't even really a caster, he's pretty much the organizer of the whole of tournament/IEM, he's just filling in. I think you would be happier with Rotterdam talking more, since I doubt he knows a whole lot about SC2 strategy, etc.
Sadly Rotterdam uses the same "wrong technical term" as the german casters by calling a "Maynard transfer" a "slide". At least I never hear anone else use that term for transferring workers ...
On January 21 2011 03:18 Eurekastreet wrote: Didn't know. Filling in for ? Can we expect a second/third "pro" caster for the week-end ?
It was originally supposed to be TLO, I'm not sure why he's not casting but I'm sure they will get someone else. Probably someone who doesn't make it out of the group stages.
On January 21 2011 03:18 Eurekastreet wrote: Didn't know. Filling in for ? Can we expect a second/third "pro" caster for the week-end ?
It was originally supposed to be TLO, I'm not sure why he's not casting but I'm sure they will get someone else. Probably someone who doesn't make it out of the group stages.
On January 21 2011 03:18 Eurekastreet wrote: Didn't know. Filling in for ? Can we expect a second/third "pro" caster for the week-end ?
It was originally supposed to be TLO, I'm not sure why he's not casting but I'm sure they will get someone else. Probably someone who doesn't make it out of the group stages.
TLO is feeling sick and Rotterdam didn't want to ask anybody who has to play games to cast in the meantime. Probably if people are done for the day or if anybody gets eliminated in the future he'd probably ask them.
Yes I will get pro players to cast with me but right now their obviously very focussed on their own tournament and can understand they don;t wanna cast right now, carmac is filling in cause TLO is sick but we will get players to cast with me from tomorrow for sure, just making the best of an unfortunate situation.
Hi Kevin, when Ben's photo appears before his matches, it say's' MTW' under his name!!!! Obviously, he's now EG!!!! Can this be altered as this is REALLY BAD!
It seems to me Demuslim has taken a look at Goodys playstyle since he has lost to him so badly in BDL. He probably was like "why is that guy so succesful while his mechanics are so bad?". And so he started to use thors and blue flame helions.
On January 21 2011 04:39 Redox wrote: It seems to me Demuslim has taken a look at Goodys playstyle since he has lost to him so badly in BDL. He probably was like "why is that guy so succesful while his mechanics are so bad?". And so he started to use thors and blue flame helions.
Rotterdam said sometime today on the stream that Demuslim was always a very aggressive player which lost him quite some games.
Must be some technical difficulties. Stream should have been up 29 mins ago. Like opis and human_ko I get nothing but a black screen on the Studio 2 SC2 stream
Big apologies for those who have problems watching the streams. Unfortunately the problem is not within ESL.TV, but lays at our CDN, edgecast. Everybody who is routed via Amsterdam, might have those connection issues right now.
They are working on it, and hopefully it should be fixed within the next 30min.
Sorry again for the inconvenience, we are as displeased as you are...
Demuslim seems really clueless at what to do after that second match. Lets hope for a good next match. But Goody's style is quite impressive, I wonder how that would look if he also had insane APM.
The semis didn't start when they were supposed to, still showing Quake instead, then I had to leave and came home just in time for "That's it for SC for now, next up is the CS final, etc. etc." The schedule says "16:20" for the CS final but apparently it's just starting? Is it 16:20 anywhere in the world?
On January 24 2011 04:48 mindspike wrote: I fixed the stream by rebooting my router. I think its a DNS issue. Trying flushing your DNS or changing to OpenDNS if rebooting doesn't work.
Yup, I use OpenDNS and it works perfectly for me. You should be using Opendns anyways though.
It was working perfectly for me when I saw games for 3rd and 4th place, and I can see any other Own3D stream without a problem, so I don't think it's a DNS issue :S
im pretty sure its not going on the sc2 stream... its gonna be on the main stage thats what they said on the sc2 stream... so watch the quake live event and itll come on after
They lost the internet connection in the whole venue during game 2 on delta quadrant. White-Ra had a tiny advantage prior to that, but it'll restart on DQ any moment now. Sjow up 1-0.
EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/pHzKb.png)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/Picon.png)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/flags/ua.png)
White-Ra![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/Ticon.png)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/flags/uk.png)
DeMusliM![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/flags/fi.png)
Naama![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/flags/pl.png)
Tarson![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/flags/se.png)
meRz![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/flags/de.png)
Socke![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/flags/fr.png)
SarenS![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/flags/cz.png)
PredY![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/flags/it.png)
ClouD
