|
ESV Borealis
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/CrAce.jpg)
Made by: neobowman aka Einhart
Currently Published On: North America
Remake of Aztec II by Testbug, which is itself, a remake of Aztec 1 by Djin)Xuul(. Just because I didn't get enough controversy about naming witoh Blitzkrieg. I did the deco myself. It's lacking in doodads. A lot. I just didn't have time to do that. I think I textured pretty well (blatently copied Koagel's texturing) and it looks pretty cool in game.
Map details
- Number of Players: 4
- Map size: 136x136
- Main ramp to Main ramp distance: 41 in game seconds
- Nat choke to nat choke distance: 29 in game seconds
- Main ramp to Main ramp Cross position distance: 52 in game seconds
- Nat choke to Nat choke Cross position distance: 38 in game seconds
- Large units (Siege Tanks, Archons, Colossi, Ultralisks and Thors) cannot pass through the gas entrance into the middle base. May be changed pending balance.
Didn't stream making this map but meh. I'll try to remember to do so next time. Check out my stream.
A big shoutout to Diamond and his twitter for helping me come up with the name. Also big thanks to Diamond for promoting us so well. The team would never be able to get as far as we are without him =).
http://www.twitch.tv/neobowman
|
OMGWTF WHICH IS THE REAL FRIGID PASS?!!?!?
|
Not this one. Misnamed the title.
|
So do the vespene gases completely wall the center 4 mini-bases? So that they are like pseudo-islands? Or can workers still walk to it? If so, I'm really curious how they would affect gameplay in the different matchups.
Anyways, it's difinitly a cool-looking map. I love this texturing palette, has a really cool atmosphere to in and not something that I typically see. Good job, man!
|
They don't completely wall. Units can still get in. Thanks for the feedback.
|
Both of the possible third bases look REALLY REALLY far away. Like, nigh impossible to defend far away >.< Also after doing a drop at the third (let's say 6 o'clock base) you can just pick up and head to the natural (assuming the natural is 7 o'clock) and keep going back and fourth because the distance is so much less as an attacker than a defender.
The map itself looks beautiful. Also I think it was G4MR that pointed out the middle bases look like the cookie monster from sesame street :3.
|
The third bases are far but they are really easy to defend with only 1 choke and you can always expand away from the opponent. Also, there's no airspace on the map so drops suddenly become quite a bit harder.
|
your Country52798 Posts
People seem to be experimenting with long chokes after the success that calm before the storm had.
I'd advise against it unless you are going for a macro forcing map with easy to defend nats/thirds (which you sort of aren't).
|
those are some isolated mains... the middle expos wont see the light of day unless you get a big contain, cause the other expos are just soo much better.
|
I had never seen calm before the storm before lol. I was just remaking Aztec.
The middle expos could be a better alternative, for example, for a Protoss against a Zerg. It's tighter than the other third base and brings you closer to him rather than further.
|
On February 11 2012 10:48 neobowman wrote:
The third bases are far but they are really easy to defend with only 1 choke and you can always expand away from the opponent. Also, there's no airspace on the map so drops suddenly become quite a bit harder.
Yeah, I think the main-nat-far third is unimpeachable in terms of balance, at least for starters. But honestly it seems kind of bland with one area outside your natural that is suitable to defend home and the main route to the third, with such a far flanking route that leaves you so vulnerable to counterattack.
That said, the point of the map is the middle bases obviously, so a boring main-nat-third isn't all bad. I really think you need to redesign those though, because it seems impossible to assault a PF and really hard to break a wall of static D inside the geysers. Imo those should be 6m1g (high yield gas) and the entry choke should be 2 gridquares wider. I know this removes the somewhat interesting adjacent geyser gimmick, but otherwise these are essentially sitting around for P or T to take any time they see fit and zerg will have to struggle if P or T wants them to.
Completely right call to forgo the tower, it makes the semi-stable middle more plausible, and I envision really cool positioning / re-positioning around those obstacles.
Also very nice job with the airspace next to the main and above the nat minerals, perfectly sized and positioned.
About the OP itself, I think it could be more... substantive? Clearly you are using some atypical features and I think it'd be worthwhile to at least mention the thoughts of you and your team, at least in passing. It would dispel this sense I get of empty showboating. Like, why even make a thread if you don't care other than to post a picture and plug diamond? (Diamond is awesome. ^^) Mean this constructively, nothing personal.
|
Well I never really figured out what to say. I mean, here's my map, have fun. There's no real special features to go over that you can't see for yourself and my thought process was basically remake the BW map to Starcraft 2 well. Though you have a point. I should try filling it up with more stuff.
The middle base doesn't need to be directly assaulted. First, the gas is obviously completely vulnurable to any attack, even from melee units. It's hard to move units in and out of the expo so a planetary is less effective. Same goes for the minerals. Can be harassed by infestors from the top or stalkers. In fact, it might be so dangerous, that I'll make it high yield since the upcoming patch will fix the mule issue.
Main-nat-third was actually what I was focusing on for this map, believe it or not. It's bland, but it's unique. If you take the three bases in that order, then there's only two areas you have to defend, but the distances are really long between the two. The best option would probably to wall off one side but still, it's hard to bounce back and forth. I took a lot of care making sure that it was positionally balanced from both sides.
|
On February 11 2012 11:52 neobowman wrote:
The middle base doesn't need to be directly assaulted. First, the gas is obviously completely vulnurable to any attack, even from melee units. It's hard to move units in and out of the expo so a planetary is less effective. Same goes for the minerals. Can be harassed by infestors from the top or stalkers. In fact, it might be so dangerous, that I'll make it high yield since the upcoming patch will fix the mule issue.
Part I highlighted -- that's why it's even harder for especially zerg to kill PF there. What units are they going to use to deny mineral mining from above? I grant it's cool that you can kill gas mining but TvZ terran mid-late economy revolves around muling outlying expansions that get a PF if they are positionally important.. for the minerals. And tanks would easily deter any half assed gas denial attempts. I'd love to be wrong though and see it work. If they change how gold works it'd be perfect for it, provided the above issues are resolved.
On February 11 2012 11:52 neobowman wrote:
Main-nat-third was actually what I was focusing on for this map, believe it or not. It's bland, but it's unique. If you take the three bases in that order, then there's only two areas you have to defend, but the distances are really long between the two. The best option would probably to wall off one side but still, it's hard to bounce back and forth. I took a lot of care making sure that it was positionally balanced from both sides.
Definitely, it's something new at least, and it shows that you calibrated as well as possible. I wish there was a way to include the small expos, but it'd put something else out of kilter. In my head I think I would add them back in and make every base 6m1g except the main/nats. But that'd be a completely different map, lol. Either way thanks for commenting more, it's nice to get a view into someone else's thought process.
|
Hmm... Is Steam hiring you guys?
First I see the Portal reference on i-Grok's map, the Borealis, coincidence? 
No analyzer that I see, but thats a lot of open space in the center, and the edges are kinda choky, perhaps taking some of the center space to widen the side paths?
Very nice map i like i like.
|
On February 11 2012 13:45 Gl!tch wrote:Hmm... Is Steam hiring you guys? First I see the Portal reference on i-Grok's map, the Borealis, coincidence? No analyzer that I see, but thats a lot of open space in the center, and the edges are kinda choky, perhaps taking some of the center space to widen the side paths? Very nice map i like i like.
Indeed lol.
Very cool map, I love the layout for the thirds, far away for both attacker and defender, regardless of the spawn positions. It does look apparently different to ordinary maps, which I also like a lot.
Also, I love the change to the MULE that's coming. Now I don't have to feel like I'm breaking a rule when I make a gold expansion anymore. Just a side note.
|
Borealis? Man this map seems to be cooking up a lot of untrue references..
Ok, first off, large units cannot enter the middle bases, just like in Blitzkrieg. This was an unintentional side effect of the gas geysers and I should have (and I will) put this in the OP. Even if tanks could get in there by ground, if you have a bunch of tanks there, suddenly your natural is wide open since there is quite literally nothing connecting the two bases. Splits the army up. Same thing with Toss. If you defend base with forcefields, suddenly, you can't get out to defend your nat.
|
|
|
Dropping in to say this is one of my, if not my, favorite map in SC2 right now. I love the main and nat, the center expansions, the efficient use of space, and the long pathways. The only thing I fear is that the third is too far-- if it is though, it'll be easy to change it to more like Aztec from BW with an extra base for each player.
|
On February 12 2012 01:44 SigmaFiE wrote:Seeing the thread about how geysers work in the references section -- I just knew someone was going to take that and go to the extreme (in a good way) with it. You rock! For the sake of making sure people see what I was talking about: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=185532
Oh man, I actually had no idea about that. Forgot completely. It's unintended and I believe it could be too complicated. I may have to change that.
|
Just at first glance, the mains look really disconnected from the rest of the base. Can't you connect it at that little bit where it's almost touching, and add a way in for reapers?
The map feels so much larger than 136x136, good job using the space.
It seems a little easier to expand cw than ccw, but it could be pretty good, hard to say without testing. (Looking at it again, I was looking at the left side of the map and misread some of the shadows. I thought that area was much tighter than it actually is. It's not as bad as I thought.)
I like the open center and the central expansions, very interesting. I like how it encourages movement through the center with any army that doesn't like tight spaces, although I'm a little afraid about deathballs through the tighter paths in close positions. I guess it's a bit hard to take a 3rd as protoss though, so it would be hard to get a deathball.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/JBE6C.jpg)
