• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 17:40
CEST 23:40
KST 06:40
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection1Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview4[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview2herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026)7
Community News
StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th88Weekly Cups (May 18-25): MaxPax wins doubles0Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League4Weekly Cups (May 11-17): Classic wins double1Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO8 Results2
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th TL Poll: How do you feel about the 5.0.16 PTR balance changes? Changing from 12 to 8 is just asking for StarCraft Weekly Cups (May 11-17): Classic wins double TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection
Tourneys
GSL Code S Season 2 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule !
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
Welcome to the External Content forum Mutation # 527 Hell Train The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 526 Rubber and Glue
Brood War
General
FlaShFTW vs A.Alm Grudge Match Event VPN experiences Every Matchup's Top 5 Winrates (all ASLs & KSLs) BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Pros React To: ASL S21 Finals
Tourneys
[ASL21] Grand Finals [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [BSL22] WB Final & LB Semis - Saturday 21:00 CEST
Strategy
Any training maps people recommend? Muta micro map competition [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Megathread Path of Exile Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Trading/Investing Thread Dating: How's your luck?
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Customization Drives Loyalty…
TrAiDoS
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 4379 users

[M] (2) Forborne Fortune

Forum Index > SC2 Maps & Custom Games
Post a Reply
EatThePath
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
United States3943 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-04 07:41:56
February 04 2011 07:40 GMT
#1
Forborne Fortune 1.1

[image loading]

One has always the option not to, with the exception of fate.

Wow... my first map in the forum. I'm a little surprised it's been this long. I'm really only giving it a thread because it's only proper for a MotM submission, and I'm really only doing MotM because it happened to coincide with making this map. Skip to "Details" if you just want to look at the map and forgo my rambling.

+ Show Spoiler +
I have never created a map I consider a finished product--not by a long shot. Often, a simple idea, or a puzzle over how to execute a map feature, will consume me for a day or two. Once the editor is open, I try to lay it out as a draft, but inevitably I get bogged down in minute details. By a process of self-compromise, many hours later I will have created a full layout. If you give a mouse a cookie... he'll do some basic texturing and perfunctory doodad placement. But being a perfectionist and visionaryTM that also ends up being a project. Once ample swaths of time have been drained from my life, I have a creation worthy of playtesting. Or abandoning, once I see that it never did really come out right. But the process for me is most important; creative foment, churning analysis and imagination.

The inception for this map was the idea of having a natural with two entrances separated on the outside by DRocks. The fitting next step was to put a base on the outlying side. This ended up taking over as the focus, because Forborne Fortune hinges on the decision between a close, vulnerable third base or a medium distance third base more typically situated.

I've found that I naturally tend to create lots of cliffs and ramps, which unavoidably decreases the openness. In this map I knew I wanted multiple levels because it was integral to the design of the natural and the close third, so I was very deliberate about using wide pathways. Instead of zoning "open areas", I relied on wide routes and wide ramps to naturally create broad areas at their intersections. (This is exactly what happens outside the natural on XelNaga Caverns.) The result is that no one spot feels "open", but across much of the map you're just a corner away from breathing room.

Another proclivity of mine is that I see possibility in every inch of terrain, and it takes all my discipline not to design an infernal canyon network or an island made of destructible rocks whenever I concentrate on one spot for more than thirty seconds. Even placing a doodad can take me down a whole new path to enhance the tactical aspect of my terrain. This is what happened with the cliffs above the close third, where eventually I settled on using trees to make it a semi-island allowing small and medium units to walk in but requiring large (imba) guys to drop. This is used a couple other places less drastically. I am pleased with how the tactical features turned out. Overall the layout is somewhat unconventional but the main areas are standard enough. Around the map are plenty of places for tricks where they won't get in the way of standard procedure.


Details

Angled view and map analyzer + Show Spoiler +
[image loading]
[image loading]
[image loading]


The most likely point of contention here is the cliff above the close third. Yes, you can easily harass that base with drops, or even just ranged guys on the cliff. That's the point. You'll note that map control, particularly solid presence at the watchtower there, lets you proactively fight that. You can use the small ramp at your natural to keep yourself relatively secure on the home front while maintaining position above the close third. Alternatively, if you have the right composition you can break your own rocks and guard the center of mass, using colossus to repel cliffers (for example).

The aesthetics are a "sketch with embellishment". I could spend a year texturing and placing doodads, which is not even considering decoration of the map exterior. I am satisfied by the atmosphere created and the differentiation provided by the textures. Nevertheless, how would you rate the looks?
Comprehensive strategic intention: DNE
Samro225am
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany982 Posts
February 04 2011 10:29 GMT
#2
I have to say that it is amazing how you managed to put so many different situation into this map. still, I think the map would be better, if it was simplified just a little bit. I feel there are to many ideas put into it.
this all leads to a very complex map. the layout is not really clear, probably too cluttered and too wide spread.

e.g. the fourth:
go clockwise and you have to deal with DRs, drops on highground and you are at he bottom end of another ramp. now you might decide tp push out, and control the left hand flank, but then you are pretty much out of position (far out 'left') and have to fortify your natural's ramp and you have to be afraid of cliffwalks via right hand third.
OR
go counter-clockwise and you have an open backdoor at your nat, that can be secured quite easily, you will move your forces in front of your main on low ground and and still you have to deal with attacks against your third at two openings.

for me it looks like the only way to feel safe is to establish map control, take nat and third, break DRs, expand again to your right hand side and take the counterclockwise watchtower. prepare to shift your forces from one side to the other and place them somewhere next to the former DRs...

this is all nothing bad at all, it just feels so unclear of how to play the map. given that custom maps have less playing time, maybe we desiner have to make more clear design decisions, one element ater the other, sothat maps are more clear of how to be played.

how could your map be a bit easier to be understood?
I would suggest to rotate both thirds (that are named thirds in the analyzer picture) a bit towards the outside, sothat there open side faces towards the centre, sothat i can switch more easily from centre towards backdoor at third, etc.
also the number of chokes and entrances should be smaller and the centre should be more open (central place could be just flat).
you could tale out some extra pathes, like the one at the xel naga watchtower.

I think you cold have taken your ideas and make two maps out of it
EatThePath
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
United States3943 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-04 21:51:39
February 04 2011 20:58 GMT
#3
On February 04 2011 19:29 Samro225am wrote:
I have to say that it is amazing how you managed to put so many different situation into this map. still, I think the map would be better, if it was simplified just a little bit. ... given that custom maps have less playing time, maybe we desiner have to make more clear design decisions, one element ater the other, sothat maps are more clear of how to be played.

how could your map be a bit easier to be understood? ...

I think you cold have taken your ideas and make two maps out of it


Yes, I think you've covered it. I really agree that it's the job of the designer to provide a space which has options that communicate themselves. It's a very interesting question if we should err on the side of simplicity, at least for now, given that these maps will not have endless person-hours devoted to "solving" them. Perhaps from the perspective of design learning, we definitely should. There are so many things to test on this map, you would learn very little in 20 games. Whereas Neonights that funcmode just posted could tell you some useful things about terran and openness, and third proximity, and three-path maps.

I always think about the BW maps that were made the last 5 years or so, some of them with highly intricate designs. That level of depth was expected for the pro maps. I aspire to that, but I will also aspire to "grokability" even more. That's a term used a lot in discussing design of Magic: TG cards, borrowed from Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy. Grok: to get it, to understand; almost viscerally. The most impactful thing a designer can do is create a puzzling setup that resolves itself into an "I grok!" moment.

Anyway, thanks for sharing your view. It's very valuable to hear an outside perspective, to confirm your worst fears. =D


edit: lol I just realized about iGrok's name too. ; )~
Comprehensive strategic intention: DNE
PiLoKo
Profile Joined January 2011
Mexico144 Posts
February 04 2011 22:09 GMT
#4
I love this map, looks pretty solid, with 2 options for the 4th, yeah, it seems a little complicated when it comes to play the map, but still looks great and ill definetly going to give it a try, keep the good work :O
I like to troll in-game :)
lovablemikey
Profile Joined October 2010
264 Posts
February 05 2011 01:39 GMT
#5
This map is super sweet! Every path flows into another path which branches off and back around and so forth. How cool is that!? Plus, it's my favorite tileset.

As far as a ratings on looks, I would give it a 6 out of 10. Without more doodads, the map looks a little over half finished to me. A fun layout is all you need though, and it looks like that's what you have.
[wh]_ForAlways
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States235 Posts
February 05 2011 01:47 GMT
#6
This is a pretty good looking map, imo. The main thing I would critique about it is removing the cliff in the middle to allow players to have a nice open space to engage. Perhaps even replace the cliff with a xel'naga tower, instead.
s031720
Profile Joined December 2009
Sweden383 Posts
February 05 2011 02:04 GMT
#7
Looks really fun, and I agree with the above poster; the rocks in the middle should go.

I think it might be biased to siege-tanks, but that would remain to be seen.
Just another noob
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
BSL
19:00
S22 - WB Final & LB Semis
Bonyth vs eOnzErG
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft787
Railgan 100
ProTech79
elazer 63
Vindicta 38
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 13402
ZZZero.O 416
Dewaltoss 81
ajuk12(nOOB) 13
NaDa 12
Dota 2
capcasts66
League of Legends
Doublelift4577
JimRising 364
Other Games
Grubby5229
summit1g3405
KnowMe173
Chillindude47
ViBE28
kaitlyn27
ForJumy 13
minikerr7
fpsfer 3
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1113
BasetradeTV269
Counter-Strike
PGL186
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 83
• printf 39
• musti20045 9
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota261
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
2h 20m
RSL Revival
9h 20m
Lambo vs Rogue
Clem vs TBD
herO vs TBD
Maestros of the Game
15h 20m
SHIN vs Nicoract
Rogue vs Gerald
ByuN vs Shameless
Cure vs TriGGeR
OSC
15h 20m
IPSL
18h 20m
Dragon vs Artosis
dxtr13 vs Hawk
BSL
21h 20m
Wardi Open
1d 14h
Monday Night Weeklies
1d 18h
Replay Cast
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Spring Champion…
2 days
Maestros of the Game
2 days
The PondCast
3 days
Kung Fu Cup
3 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3 days
Maestros of the Game
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
WardiTV Spring Champion…
4 days
Maestros of the Game
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
5 days
Maestros of the Game
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Solar vs Classic
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: King of Kings
2026 GSL S1
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

2026 KK StarCraft Pro League
BSL Season 22
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
KK 2v2 League Season 1
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
SCTL 2026 Spring
WardiTV Spring 2026
Maestros of the Game 2
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
Murky Cup 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026

Upcoming

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Heroes Pulsing #3
Heroes Pulsing #2
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.