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On March 14 2012 12:50 Esk23 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2012 12:46 FlamingTurd wrote:Nice to actually have a thread where we can talk about balance  I've always felt Protoss is the most imba. When it is played perfectly it seems no race can efficiently counter it. Watching some of the games in code A, S where the P player plays flawlessly just makes me scratch my noggin wondering how it could possibly be beaten, especially with the rather early double chrono boosted upgrades that have been so popular as of late. I think when played almost perfectly Terran is not close behind them however. Terran has to micro a lot more, and more perfecty when engaging Protoss or your whole army gets stormed a couple of times and you get absolutely destroyed. And even if you engage and micro well, Protoss just warps in a ton of units. Protoss is just dumb right now.
Right now? It's been like that for what, ever? And the high number of Protoss (gsl)champions clearly shows it's really good.
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Really? Maybe I'm biased by low masters/high diamond. Zerg is way stronger, its so much easier, less micro intensive. Sit on 4 base spam roaches, Protoss is dead unless they micro their ass off. Zerg is by far easiest...
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i think protoss is to strong in pvt because the terran have to micro a lot mostly in late game against chargelot and high templars. But as terran u can often do timing goes in mid and early game wich are sometimes hard to hold for protoss expecially when the terran player drop and do a attack same time.
and in pvz protoss is in my opinion really micrintensive so hard to hold in midgame with only 100 supply against zergs 150.
Other problem is against muta ling that if u didnt know exactly that zerg go for that style ur fucked as protoss.
tvz is hard for terran i think because its also very microintensive. if u go mac style it hink u have problems against muta because of ur immobility and if u go for bioarmy and tanks its hard to force against banelings
btw im protoss player. so maybe im completely wrong in tvz^^
conclusion:
z
p
t
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Whining about balance on ladder is the craziest thing I am completely unable to comprehend. If your race is "underpowered" qqqqqqq then just lose until your opponents are bad enough to be balancing it out.
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as a top 10 Masters Zerg player, >50% of my losses come from protoss. absolutely not exaggerating, also my win rate vs toss is below 50% but i have more wins than losses (overall).
Toss is the most frustrating race to play against for me because it nearly always comes down to one engagement, not that there aren't others, but its extremely difficult to slowly accumulate an advantage (as zerg needs to do) vs a race that can all in on the fly.
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The fact that one race have to micro more then the other doesn't make one or the other stronger, but easier.
The fact that high level Terrans are having more success is because multitasking benefits terran alot more than protoss. Same thing with Zerg but not as much.
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I guess my argument is just think a bit more before you make a blanket statement in which one race is over powered or not...look to multiple sources to construct your argument much like how you would in an academic situation...
People who claim you must be masters or higher to enter this discussion are right if the person uses only their games as support to their claims....
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On March 16 2012 06:14 HoBb3 wrote:
The fact that one race have to micro more then the other doesn't make one or the other stronger, but easier.
The fact that high level Terrans are having more success is because multitasking benefits terran alot more than protoss. Same thing with Zerg but not as much.
I 100% agree. Protoss may be a bit easier to play, I admit, at least in the lower leagues. But I still think it is pretty hard to master Protoss at the higher levels. Terran may be the hardest race to play, but when you master it, it can be pretty damn good, if not the best. Terran is so diverce than the other races, so if a person is really good, then it is hard to beat a Terran.
But does that mean that it is unbalanced? Not at all. You have to earn the skills to be best and find the race that benefits your playstyle the most. As it is now, I am actually pretty pleased with the balance in general. I lose some, I win some - against every race. I really don't bother that much with the balancing matters, I just play the game and adapt to that.
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This is the dumbest poll I've ever seen on TL. It's like they made it just so they could laugh at the responses.
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On March 16 2012 01:28 Metaphorical wrote:
At diamond level zerg is imba because they don't get punished as hard for poor macro. If a terran or protoss misses a round of units they will never be able to make them again. Whilst a zerg can sit on 5000mins/gas and just chuck it all into units when they remember they have a keyboard.
It works the opposite way for mules/chronoboost vs larva inject though, so I'd imagine that's intentional.
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I like how this poll almost inversely correlates to the race distribution of TL
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My Opinion
Zerg > Terran
Protoss > Zerg
Terran > Protoss
Therefore you have to split the power of each race in the early, mid and late game to decide which is the strongest race.
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29% of TL is trollin', Zerg hatin'.
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On March 16 2012 01:28 Metaphorical wrote:
At diamond level zerg is imba because they don't get punished as hard for poor macro. If a terran or protoss misses a round of units they will never be able to make them again. Whilst a zerg can sit on 5000mins/gas and just chuck it all into units when they remember they have a keyboard.
Well your hatchery doesn't naturally produce larva once its at 3 but I suppose thats not as big of a deal at diamond level.
On March 16 2012 07:17 CrashLight wrote:
My Opinion
Zerg > Terran
Protoss > Zerg
Terran > Protoss
Therefore you have to split the power of each race in the early, mid and late game to decide which is the strongest race.
Hah the funny part is that historically that is the exact opposite of what bw was like xD Maybe i'm just the only one that gets a kick out of that.
But honestly I didn't vote in this poll because there's no way to tell which race is the strongest. The best we can do is come up with which race feels the strongest based on the ignorance of the players. Until the game is figured out (which it wont be before HoTS) "which race is the best" can't be answered without scripting perfect AI and pitting each race against each other. Maybe i'm taking the question a little to seriously but I see much too many mistakes in the games that I watch and the things I see that are exclaimed to be imba, I see pro players handling those situations horribly (or at the very least sub-optimally). I anticipate this poll again a couple years after LoV when the pros have refined their skills and know what exactly they are doing. Hopefully it will be a 3 way tie ^^
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as zerg I have to autovote toss ;P
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On March 14 2012 20:20 Mentalizor wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2012 12:34 PandaMonk wrote:
Look at win rates in korea. Protoss>all. Quarter finals this GSL, 1/2 protoss. Protoss seems to be the strongest but that doesn't mean they are OP. Gogo zerg! That argument just doesn't work. One season we had 6/8 Terran players in the quarterfinals. So... terran was super dominant. Even more so than P today. How much did blizzard nerf them? They only changed the ghost and now protoss is too strong? That doesn't make sence. Watch Stephano or any clearthinking zerg against a protoss. It aint pretty... But yeah...
Woah woah stop right there.. 1st of all are u freaking kidding me? ur saying only thing they nerfed is ghost? LOL Every patch terran gets nerfed i want you to go find a patch that terran didnt get nerfed in. Plx try cuz u wont find 1
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On March 16 2012 07:14 goldenwitch wrote:
I like how this poll almost inversely correlates to the race distribution of TL
LMAO so true
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EPT
