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On August 02 2010 10:05 SubtleArt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2010 08:53 Nick_54 wrote:On August 02 2010 08:46 SubtleArt wrote:On August 02 2010 07:59 Lebesgue wrote:On August 02 2010 07:49 SubtleArt wrote:On August 02 2010 07:43 Lebesgue wrote:On August 02 2010 07:34 SubtleArt wrote:That jaedong vs sea game on fortress shows just how awesome his Zvt is. The one on dreamliner? Well....DON'T BE SO DAM STUBBORN SOMETIMES JAEDONG  Btw don't be too defensive about putting Flash second instead of first  . I would have put him fantasy and effort to be honest. He's just not getting results, especially in TvT, and with like 7 ace matches in a row blown, i don't see how this decision is the least bit controversial. Its a monthly power rank, and jaedong had the better month plain and simple You're completely right. He is just in quarterfinals in MSL is 1:0 in his group in OSL and he is in the playoff finals with KT. He definitely doesn't deliver anymore... 0-7 in his last 7 ace matches...no he is NOT playing up to his expectations and delivering the way the best player in the game should be. The last 2 months flash's record has barely been above 50%. For that he doesn't deserve to be #1. Is he still playing very well? Duh. Is he still amazing? Yea. Is he winning as much as you would expect the #1 player to? No. That's what counts in a monthly power ranking. Also, this round KT won their only sets without him so I don't see how him being in the finals is particularly relevant right now. It's relevant since he's been delivering when he needed to so far. I'm OK with Jaedong being no1 but Flash shouldn't be any lower than no2. Though I have to admit that personally I would have switched the ordering of Flash and Jaedong. Anyway, the next month will show who of those two is really better. He's 0-7 in his last 7 ace matches, yet hes delivering when it counts? If it wasn't for STX's slump KT would have lost their #1 spot. Jaedong had the better record, plain and simple, and aside from that shitty night vs SKT where he lost to bisu and s2, he's been delivering consistently for his team in proleague. No question he deserves #1 more than flash, I don't see how anybody could argue that (with it being a monthly power rank and all. Oh right, I see that KT symbol Those ace matches were last month so why the hell are you bringing them up? Seeing as its a monthly power rank and all. Last month and extended into early this month if we're getting picky. Either way, when theres some sort of a dispute between two players, or when one goes relatively inactive (like Flash this month), people usually call on on trends from last month too.
No, I'm pretty sure all the ace match losses were last month, the game against Light wasn't an ace. I'm just saying in my opinion, after the OSL and MSL games Flash looks like the stronger player. Your statement saying Jaedong is no question, undisputed #1 is a very foolish claim.
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On August 02 2010 08:31 Plexa wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2010 00:44 Holgerius wrote:Heh, as soon as the BoX's started again Flash went on his longest winning streak since the 3-0 vs JD (and the following PL game). I think he just had a little mini-slump since there were no Starleagues to own in. Given that JD could've had the #1 last month but didn't get it, which by the way meant that Flash broke the #1 streak record  , I'm quite ok with him getting it this month instead (although I disagree with it). Flash will retake it soon enough. Dual finals once more! I genuinely hope that this happens. I much prefer having Flash at the top and jaedong fans raging. It's more fun that way Show nested quote +On August 02 2010 07:27 TwoToneTerran wrote:
You know, I think I get it, Plexa has sort of a two month ranking style. He takes the current month and last month and weighs them pretty equally together. It makes sense, the wording is there in his descriptions, so that's fine I guess. It made for Flash being guaranteed #1 last month (If you count both months last month then yeah, 3-0), and it makes a close race this month with Jaedong being better last month and Flash being better or atleast similar this month. Only when it's too hard to tell the difference between players. If it's really close between 9/10 over one month, I'll look to the month before as well to try get a clean separation. It's been close between JD/Flash for the past two ranks.
That's fine. I'm still kind of lost on some of your stuff about Jaedong's losses being good -- I don't think there is a good excuse for his loss against Sea aside from just being dumb. Same with his loss to Kal in that series -- just a plain dumb loss. He won that series overall, but even the two games he won were sketchy.
That said, Flash's loss to Light was dumb and unexcusable. Maybe he was trying to be clever with that proxy fact but he had secured an advantage and wanted to go for a quick win and got busted. Other than that, Effort just played well in that game he won.
THAT SAID, I don't think you've seen Effort play vs Mech before when you made that comparison to him and Zero. Zero is probably the second best zerg player to play against mech around, following Jaedong who is #1 at everything zerg does (besides be creative, zero's got the market cornered!). I think if you would've used Jaedong there the rank would've been overall improved, it would've backed up your #1 and #2 choice. Saying Effort had Flash figured out begs the question why Effort isn't over Flash then, as his ZvZ and ZvP have been mostly immaculate. If Flash has been figured out, why is he #2 and still winning most of his games?
-- Man that's a lot of words for which was mostly just waxing poetic. I don't necessarily disagree with the ranking itself I just like to be privy with arguments. =)
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Fenrax
United States5018 Posts
I think it is time to clarify what "Power Rank" actually stands for:
My definition for #1 would be
"The player who is judged by his results, performances and overall current play strength at the moment most favorited to win a game and/or series against a random opponent."
Is that right?
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Stork constantly underrated as usual. No surprise.
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On August 02 2010 10:40 Nick_54 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2010 10:05 SubtleArt wrote:On August 02 2010 08:53 Nick_54 wrote:On August 02 2010 08:46 SubtleArt wrote:On August 02 2010 07:59 Lebesgue wrote:On August 02 2010 07:49 SubtleArt wrote:On August 02 2010 07:43 Lebesgue wrote:On August 02 2010 07:34 SubtleArt wrote:That jaedong vs sea game on fortress shows just how awesome his Zvt is. The one on dreamliner? Well....DON'T BE SO DAM STUBBORN SOMETIMES JAEDONG Btw don't be too defensive about putting Flash second instead of first . I would have put him fantasy and effort to be honest. He's just not getting results, especially in TvT, and with like 7 ace matches in a row blown, i don't see how this decision is the least bit controversial. Its a monthly power rank, and jaedong had the better month plain and simple You're completely right. He is just in quarterfinals in MSL is 1:0 in his group in OSL and he is in the playoff finals with KT. He definitely doesn't deliver anymore... 0-7 in his last 7 ace matches...no he is NOT playing up to his expectations and delivering the way the best player in the game should be. The last 2 months flash's record has barely been above 50%. For that he doesn't deserve to be #1. Is he still playing very well? Duh. Is he still amazing? Yea. Is he winning as much as you would expect the #1 player to? No. That's what counts in a monthly power ranking. Also, this round KT won their only sets without him so I don't see how him being in the finals is particularly relevant right now. It's relevant since he's been delivering when he needed to so far. I'm OK with Jaedong being no1 but Flash shouldn't be any lower than no2. Though I have to admit that personally I would have switched the ordering of Flash and Jaedong. Anyway, the next month will show who of those two is really better. He's 0-7 in his last 7 ace matches, yet hes delivering when it counts? If it wasn't for STX's slump KT would have lost their #1 spot. Jaedong had the better record, plain and simple, and aside from that shitty night vs SKT where he lost to bisu and s2, he's been delivering consistently for his team in proleague. No question he deserves #1 more than flash, I don't see how anybody could argue that (with it being a monthly power rank and all. Oh right, I see that KT symbol Those ace matches were last month so why the hell are you bringing them up? Seeing as its a monthly power rank and all. Last month and extended into early this month if we're getting picky. Either way, when theres some sort of a dispute between two players, or when one goes relatively inactive (like Flash this month), people usually call on on trends from last month too. No, I'm pretty sure all the ace match losses were last month, the game against Light wasn't an ace. I'm just saying in my opinion, after the OSL and MSL games Flash looks like the stronger player. Your statement saying Jaedong is no question, undisputed #1 is a very foolish claim.
Thank you. That's pretty much sums up what I think.
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hmm... bisu at #6?
i think he should be higher. if not two, maybe one slot. are we forgetting that PvZ is terribly difficult nowadays, and bisu has not lost a PvZ ever since his slump ended?
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To be honest, I wouldn't have minded if Flash was #1 this time compared to last month. His slump from june seemed to continue at the beginning of this month, but after those initial losses, he's looked completely solid since then. Glad to see Stork back.
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Although I agree with your rankings I have to say that..blatantly... you were wrong last month. I wouldnt normally hold last month's rankings against anybody, but you mentioned it as part of your self-justification, so be prepared to take the flak for it.
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ahh i can be happy with the number one woot
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"So why is Bisu placed so highly despite just being eliminated from the MSL? Well, because he's doing amazingly well in Proleague at the moment and he is the best PvZ player in the world hands down. His games are really impressive and his PvP is still amazingly solid. I can overlook a weakness to Terrans temporarily, assuming Bisu keeps delivering when it matters."
Solid PvP? His 1st game vs pure was pretty lame imo, allowing pure to walk all over his probes. Then he went 50% versus kal which is pretty ridiculous because, although kal used to be a good player, hes been playing pretty poorly lately.
Also, " assuming Bisu keeps delivering when it matters"? Seriously? You said it yourself he was dropped out of the MSL. How is that delivering where it matters?
Lost faith in plexas ability to make these power ranks. Do you even watch the games?
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DOOOOOOHHHH JAAAAEEE WOOOOKK!!!!!~~~
totally deserved a spot here. without him skt would be something more like mbc.
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On August 02 2010 14:07 ibreakurface wrote:
"So why is Bisu placed so highly despite just being eliminated from the MSL? Well, because he's doing amazingly well in Proleague at the moment and he is the best PvZ player in the world hands down. His games are really impressive and his PvP is still amazingly solid. I can overlook a weakness to Terrans temporarily, assuming Bisu keeps delivering when it matters."
Solid PvP? His 1st game vs pure was pretty lame imo, allowing pure to walk all over his probes. Then he went 50% versus kal which is pretty ridiculous because, although kal used to be a good player, hes been playing pretty poorly lately.
Also, " assuming Bisu keeps delivering when it matters"? Seriously? You said it yourself he was dropped out of the MSL. How is that delivering where it matters?
Lost faith in plexas ability to make these power ranks. Do you even watch the games?
What the balls?
If you're in Proleague Grand Finals, that's where it matters. It is a huge fucking deal as it's the culmination of five seasons of proleague.
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Sweet JD back to #1. Hopefully he decides to stop showing off like he did against Sea and play seriously so he can stay there.
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On August 02 2010 10:44 TwoToneTerran wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2010 08:31 Plexa wrote:On August 02 2010 00:44 Holgerius wrote:Heh, as soon as the BoX's started again Flash went on his longest winning streak since the 3-0 vs JD (and the following PL game). I think he just had a little mini-slump since there were no Starleagues to own in. Given that JD could've had the #1 last month but didn't get it, which by the way meant that Flash broke the #1 streak record , I'm quite ok with him getting it this month instead (although I disagree with it). Flash will retake it soon enough. Dual finals once more! I genuinely hope that this happens. I much prefer having Flash at the top and jaedong fans raging. It's more fun that way On August 02 2010 07:27 TwoToneTerran wrote:
You know, I think I get it, Plexa has sort of a two month ranking style. He takes the current month and last month and weighs them pretty equally together. It makes sense, the wording is there in his descriptions, so that's fine I guess. It made for Flash being guaranteed #1 last month (If you count both months last month then yeah, 3-0), and it makes a close race this month with Jaedong being better last month and Flash being better or atleast similar this month. Only when it's too hard to tell the difference between players. If it's really close between 9/10 over one month, I'll look to the month before as well to try get a clean separation. It's been close between JD/Flash for the past two ranks. That's fine. I'm still kind of lost on some of your stuff about Jaedong's losses being good -- I don't think there is a good excuse for his loss against Sea aside from just being dumb. Same with his loss to Kal in that series -- just a plain dumb loss. He won that series overall, but even the two games he won were sketchy. That said, Flash's loss to Light was dumb and unexcusable. Maybe he was trying to be clever with that proxy fact but he had secured an advantage and wanted to go for a quick win and got busted. Other than that, Effort just played well in that game he won. THAT SAID, I don't think you've seen Effort play vs Mech before when you made that comparison to him and Zero. Zero is probably the second best zerg player to play against mech around, following Jaedong who is #1 at everything zerg does (besides be creative, zero's got the market cornered!). I think if you would've used Jaedong there the rank would've been overall improved, it would've backed up your #1 and #2 choice. Saying Effort had Flash figured out begs the question why Effort isn't over Flash then, as his ZvZ and ZvP have been mostly immaculate. If Flash has been figured out, why is he #2 and still winning most of his games? -- Man that's a lot of words for which was mostly just waxing poetic. I don't necessarily disagree with the ranking itself I just like to be privy with arguments. =)
I like and endorse all parts of this post. Well said TTT
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On August 02 2010 07:49 SubtleArt wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2010 07:43 Lebesgue wrote:On August 02 2010 07:34 SubtleArt wrote:That jaedong vs sea game on fortress shows just how awesome his Zvt is. The one on dreamliner? Well....DON'T BE SO DAM STUBBORN SOMETIMES JAEDONG Btw don't be too defensive about putting Flash second instead of first . I would have put him fantasy and effort to be honest. He's just not getting results, especially in TvT, and with like 7 ace matches in a row blown, i don't see how this decision is the least bit controversial. Its a monthly power rank, and jaedong had the better month plain and simple You're completely right. He is just in quarterfinals in MSL is 1:0 in his group in OSL and he is in the playoff finals with KT. He definitely doesn't deliver anymore... 0-7 in his last 7 ace matches...no he is NOT playing up to his expectations and delivering the way the best player in the game should be. The last 2 months flash's record has barely been above 50%. For that he doesn't deserve to be #1. Is he still playing very well? Duh. Is he still amazing? Yea. Is he winning as much as you would expect the #1 player to? No. That's what counts in a monthly power ranking. Also, this round KT won their only sets without him so I don't see how him being in the finals is particularly relevant right now.
thats LAST Month
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Yay jaedong!
I mostly agree ^^
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wHOO GO SKT !!!
(and yea FlaSh get owned by Jaedong!)
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On August 02 2010 14:42 Severedevil wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2010 14:07 ibreakurface wrote:
"So why is Bisu placed so highly despite just being eliminated from the MSL? Well, because he's doing amazingly well in Proleague at the moment and he is the best PvZ player in the world hands down. His games are really impressive and his PvP is still amazingly solid. I can overlook a weakness to Terrans temporarily, assuming Bisu keeps delivering when it matters."
Solid PvP? His 1st game vs pure was pretty lame imo, allowing pure to walk all over his probes. Then he went 50% versus kal which is pretty ridiculous because, although kal used to be a good player, hes been playing pretty poorly lately.
Also, " assuming Bisu keeps delivering when it matters"? Seriously? You said it yourself he was dropped out of the MSL. How is that delivering where it matters?
Lost faith in plexas ability to make these power ranks. Do you even watch the games? What the balls? If you're in Proleague Grand Finals, that's where it matters. It is a huge fucking deal as it's the culmination of five seasons of proleague.
Not a bad idea lets make a power rank for teams. However this is for the individual player.
Sure he has been delivering in the proleague but he is failing in individual leagues. He has been playing mediocrely, not deserving to be bumped up 4 places.
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Everyone being a bit harsh to Kal, holding it against both Jaedong and Bisu to drop a game to him. He is considered a good player you know not just some scrub that's expected to be an autowin...
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EPT
