• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 08:28
CEST 14:28
KST 21:28
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S RO12 Preview: Maru, Trigger, Rogue, NightMare12Code S RO12 Preview: Cure, sOs, Reynor, Solar15[ASL19] Ro8 Preview: Unyielding3Official Ladder Map Pool Update (April 28, 2025)17[ASL19] Ro8 Preview: Rejuvenation8
Community News
Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A Results (2025)4$1,250 WardiTV May [May 6th-May 18th]4Clem wins PiG Sty Festival #66Weekly Cups (April 28-May 4): ByuN & Astrea break through1Nexon wins bid to develop StarCraft IP content, distribute Overwatch mobile game29
StarCraft 2
General
How does the number of casters affect your enjoyment of esports? Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A Results (2025) Code S RO12 Preview: Maru, Trigger, Rogue, NightMare Nexon wins bid to develop StarCraft IP content, distribute Overwatch mobile game Code S RO12 Preview: Cure, sOs, Reynor, Solar
Tourneys
SOOPer7s Showmatches 2025 Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) [GSL 2025] Code S:Season 1 - RO12 - Group A INu's Battles#12 < ByuN vs herO > [GSL 2025] Code S:Season 1 - RO12 - Group B
Strategy
[G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 472 Dead Heat Mutation # 471 Delivery Guaranteed Mutation # 470 Certain Demise Mutation # 469 Frostbite
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion BGH auto balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Recent recommended BW games Preserving Battlereports.com OGN to release AI-upscaled StarLeague from Feb 24
Tourneys
[BSL20] RO32 Group F - Saturday 20:00 CET [BSL20] RO32 Group E - Sunday 20:00 CET [ASL19] Ro8 Day 4 [CSLPRO] $1000 Spring is Here!
Strategy
[G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player Creating a full chart of Zerg builds [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread What do you want from future RTS games? Nintendo Switch Thread Grand Theft Auto VI Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
LiquidLegends to reintegrate into TL.net
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread TL Mafia Plays: Diplomacy TL Mafia: Generative Agents Showdown Survivor II: The Amazon
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Ask and answer stupid questions here! Elon Musk's lies, propaganda, etc.
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread [Books] Wool by Hugh Howey Surprisingly good films/Hidden Gems
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread NHL Playoffs 2024 NBA General Discussion Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Cleaning My Mechanical Keyboard How to clean a TTe Thermaltake keyboard?
TL Community
BLinD-RawR 50K Post Watch Party The Automated Ban List TL.net Ten Commandments
Blogs
Why 5v5 Games Keep Us Hooked…
TrAiDoS
Info SLEgma_12
SLEgma_12
SECOND COMMING
XenOsky
WombaT’s Old BW Terran Theme …
WombaT
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
BW PvZ Balance hypothetic…
Vasoline73
Test Entry for subject
xumakis
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 13065 users

Bandwagon Broodwar

Forum Index > News
203 CommentsPost a Reply
1 2 3 4 5 9 10 11 Next All

Bandwagon Broodwar

Text byHot_Bid
October 19th, 2009 15:02 GMT
[image loading]

Banner by Kennigit and Fanboys Everywhere


By now you've probably read the first few paragraphs of Backseat Broodwar. There seems to be a view that the masses don't "respect" old gamers and are just a giant bandwagon of front running fans. This seems like the same tired elitist argument that pervades every sport: "It used to be better back when..." No. It sucked back then. It sucked when the NBA had all white guys and people "played as a team." It sucked when football teams only ran the ball. It sucked when MLB players were all skinny and never hit home runs (yes, I went there). And it sucked when Brood War players could only control one group of units and had 2000/1000 in the bank after microing a group of marines for two minutes (hi BoxeR). It sucked when Brood War players had to specifically design a strategy around not making a lot of workers because they were just that bad at macro (hi YellOw).


[image loading]

I have no idea who this guy is but I know he's better than Boxer.
Image by NeverGG

Everyone is a bandwagon fan. Everyone. You like watching players play because they are good. Sure there are some oddballs here and there that you like for style or whatever, but the bottom line is, no matter how many ridiculous strategies a player attempts, he will get no fans and no recognition unless he wins with them. Are you really going to tell me that I can't like Flash because other people like him? I'm the biggest Ma Jae Yoon fan there is. I stick by him through thick and thin. Why am I a fan? Because he was ridiculously good. I remember him being good. Now, he's bad. I don't deny that. I still love Savior, but I also like Effort now. That doesn't mean I disrespect MJY -- it just means I'm a realist. I can applaud Savior for what he did for CJ, for himself, for the Zerg race -- but I can still point out that it is insane to send him out for an Ace Match when you have the Second Coming sitting on your bench. It seems like the elitists think that just because they liked a guy first or they know about some ancient history that they deserve to cheer for players more.

Is there really anything wrong with Joe Nooblet never watching Brood War before and instantly loving Jaedong? Does he really have to know that Jaedong lost to Rock 1-3 in his first Bo5 ZvP? Does having that knowledge or being a fan of JD two years back somehow entitle him to cheer more?Look at Michael Jordan. 100% of his fans are bandwagon fans. And those guys who cheered against him? Also bandwagon fans. Every single SK Telecom fan? Bandwagon fan. There's nothing wrong with that.


[image loading]

e-Stars Heritage League was like taking a time machine back to when players sucked.

Is it my fault I want to watch high level games? I went back the other day and watched Savior versus Nal_rA -- one of the most entertaining rivalries there was -- and it was sad. Really, it was. I'm all for appreciating what people can do at the peak of their abilities, but watching these old guys play against each other is like watching the WNBA or women's soccer. I understand that they're the best relative to their competition. I just don't care. I want to see the game played at its highest level, not some grandpa toss who can't figure out how to attack lurkers. Nal_rA, I get that you invented FE. That's great and all, but Bisu is the one that invented FE. I'm sure some fat white guy on a step ladder invented dunking, but Lebron James invented dunking.

Are we really flaming fanboys for actually liking the player they cheer for? Fanboys are spirited. Fanboys get angry. Fanboys are awesome. I'm CJ fanboy. I admit it. When it comes to all things CJ, I am irrationally and irrevocably pro-CJ. I think they are the best team ever. I go into every round of Proleague thinking "This is our year!!" I wouldn't trade Effort for anyone. No, I wouldn't trade him for Jaedong. I'm an Effort fanboy. What do you expect me to do? Find a player who sucks and cheer for him? Progaming is my hobby, I watch in my spare time. Since I'm not a masochist, I'll enjoy when my guys win, thank you very much. And I'm going to go into CJ threads and post "FFFFFFFF YEAH" every time Skyhigh cheeses Jaedong, or post "wow this dude sucks" every time Effort rolls over a crappy washed up Air Force player, no matter how many times he won a starleague in 2003. That's not disrespecting him. Because sucking now doesn't change his win back then, and winning then doesn't affect us recognizing he sucks today.

[image loading]

I'm a fanboy and I fully enjoyed this moment.


CJ is going to win proleague this year. There's still room -- hop on.
Facebook Twitter Reddit
@Hot_Bid on Twitter - ESPORTS life since 2010 - http://i.imgur.com/U2psw.png
Deleted User 31060
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
3788 Posts
October 19 2009 15:14 GMT
#2
BackHo is still the best player on the planet in my book.
Peaked at C- on ICCUP and proud of it! @Sunyveil
iSiN
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States1075 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-10-19 15:16:11
October 19 2009 15:15 GMT
#3
lol hotbid this was such a good read

it's like a staff flame war
Grouty @HoN/PCKJ <--<333 || Jaedong Fan Cafe GFX
kOre
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Canada3642 Posts
October 19 2009 15:16 GMT
#4
On October 20 2009 00:02 Hot_Bid wrote:
CJ is going to win proleague this year. There's still room -- hop on.

I hope so ... for the sake of my Fantasy team :D
http://www.starcraftmecca.net - Founder
nataziel
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Australia1455 Posts
October 19 2009 15:18 GMT
#5
Seems to me like this should be a blog and not front page news, but you're the admin...

Totally agree about the whole respect thing, sure the greats used to be good relative to the competition but now they suck, plain and simple. Sure, it's great when the win, but don't get your knickers in a knot when someone says they suck, cos that's just the truth.

BTW This is wemade's season fo sho
u gotta sk8
Pyrthas
Profile Joined March 2007
United States3196 Posts
October 19 2009 15:20 GMT
#6
On October 20 2009 00:02 Hot_Bid wrote:
I have no idea who this guy is but I know he's better than Boxer.

I loved this.
MountainDewJunkie
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States10340 Posts
October 19 2009 15:21 GMT
#7
Thank you for this, Hot_Bid.
[21:07] <Shock710> whats wrong with her face [20:50] <dAPhREAk> i beat it the day after it came out | <BLinD-RawR> esports is a giant vagina
wifebeater
Profile Joined January 2008
178 Posts
October 19 2009 15:23 GMT
#8
Great read Hot_Bid! I couldn't agree more..
Villain Terran~~~~~~~~~~
VictorW
Profile Joined May 2009
United States157 Posts
October 19 2009 15:25 GMT
#9
But if you didn't like a player before a certain date, it means you're not a real fan and can't enjoy or comprehend how good he is. You don't understand him!

There is no doubt that players today are better than the players from year ago and the mid and late game are much better, but I do prefer the old school style early games, where there was more action. Too many games these days feel like 5-7 minutes no rush, but large part of that is probably due to map design.
Process is more important than the result
StorrZerg
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
United States13918 Posts
October 19 2009 15:25 GMT
#10
wow great read lol
Hwaseung Oz fan for life. Swing out, always swing out.
koreasilver
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
9109 Posts
October 19 2009 15:25 GMT
#11
10/10
DrainX
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
Sweden3187 Posts
October 19 2009 15:26 GMT
#12
No other player will ever take the place that Savior has in my heart. I won't ever let any new player get that much of my love. The pain when the stars finally fall is just too great =(
Ry-Masta-T
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
United States478 Posts
October 19 2009 15:28 GMT
#13
hit the nail on the head, great stuff hb
Speak the word...
Endurethetoothache
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States51 Posts
October 19 2009 15:28 GMT
#14
There's also that fanboy-esque bandwagon attitude towards the bad players and it's not out of respect but rather because NO ONE LIKES him. Why would anyone want to be masochistic like that?
There was never yet philosopher That could endure the toothache patiently. (Shakespeare)
ThunderGod
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
New Zealand897 Posts
October 19 2009 15:29 GMT
#15
Ahaha, Joe Nooblet.
"Certain forms of popular music nowadays, namely rap and hip hop styles, are just irritating gangsters bragging about their illegal exploits and short-sighted lifestyles." - Shiverfish ~2009
Herro_Korea
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
310 Posts
October 19 2009 15:29 GMT
#16
CJ is going to win proleague this year.

nope, Wemade is going to win it ofc
anyway this was a good read
+ Show Spoiler +
BTW This is wemade's season fo sho

whats up ?
(-_(-_(-_-)_-)_-)
TwoToneTerran
Profile Joined March 2009
United States8841 Posts
October 19 2009 15:30 GMT
#17
I think you mean KT.
Remember Violet.
revy
Profile Joined September 2009
United States1524 Posts
October 19 2009 15:30 GMT
#18
A sensible and reasonable article, this is not allowed here!
No_eL
Profile Joined July 2007
Chile1438 Posts
October 19 2009 15:31 GMT
#19
flame war? half staff and old fans are getting redish now!

i like CJ and new players, but the heroes of the past deserve RESPECT =)
Beat after beat i will become stronger.
Hyperionnn
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
Turkey4968 Posts
October 19 2009 15:31 GMT
#20
11/10, had a great read and he is really about that stuff
1 2 3 4 5 9 10 11 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
SC Evo League
12:00
#11
MindelVK33
LiquipediaDiscussion
AllThingsProtoss
11:00
Team League - Playoff Seeding
Gemini_1936
Liquipedia
WardiTV Invitational
11:00
WardiTV May Group A
WardiTV998
ComeBackTV 799
IndyStarCraft 209
Rex185
LiquipediaDiscussion
CranKy Ducklings
10:00
Sea Duckling Open #134
CranKy Ducklings102
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Lowko386
IndyStarCraft 209
Rex 185
MindelVK 33
LamboSC2 31
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 10364
Rain 7029
firebathero 4542
Sea 3130
Flash 2076
Horang2 1646
Hyuk 1121
Pusan 980
Last 446
Mini 288
[ Show more ]
actioN 263
Stork 237
ZerO 185
GuemChi 173
ggaemo 91
Aegong 44
Killer 43
Sea.KH 38
TY 35
sSak 32
Barracks 32
Sharp 29
Shinee 22
Backho 19
Free 18
Movie 17
Icarus 17
sorry 15
SilentControl 15
IntoTheRainbow 12
Sacsri 9
yabsab 7
Dota 2
XcaliburYe1220
Counter-Strike
fl0m2383
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King148
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor304
Other Games
gofns39244
singsing3039
B2W.Neo1106
DeMusliM570
Happy530
crisheroes401
SortOf144
PartinGtheBigBoy71
KnowMe44
ArmadaUGS42
ZerO(Twitch)14
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL27526
Other Games
gamesdonequick1085
StarCraft 2
ESL.tv112
Other Games
BasetradeTV24
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 16
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 6
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos712
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Invitational
1h 32m
Chat StarLeague
3h 32m
PassionCraft
4h 32m
Circuito Brasileiro de…
5h 32m
Online Event
15h 32m
MaxPax vs herO
SHIN vs Cure
Clem vs MaxPax
ShoWTimE vs herO
ShoWTimE vs Clem
Sparkling Tuna Cup
21h 32m
WardiTV Invitational
22h 32m
AllThingsProtoss
22h 32m
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 1h
Chat StarLeague
1d 3h
[ Show More ]
Circuito Brasileiro de…
1d 5h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 21h
BeSt vs Light
Wardi Open
1d 22h
PiGosaur Monday
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Snow vs Soulkey
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
GSL Code S
3 days
ByuN vs Rogue
herO vs Cure
Replay Cast
4 days
GSL Code S
4 days
Classic vs Reynor
GuMiho vs Maru
The PondCast
4 days
RSL Revival
5 days
GSL Code S
5 days
Korean StarCraft League
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL Nation Wars Season 2
PiG Sty Festival 6.0
Calamity Stars S2

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
ASL Season 19
YSL S1
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
China & Korea Top Challenge
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
CSLPRO Spring 2025
2025 GSL S1
Heroes 10 EU
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
ECL Season 49: Europe
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025
BLAST Open Spring 2025
ESL Pro League S21

Upcoming

NPSL S3
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLAN 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2025
2025 GSL S2
DreamHack Dallas 2025
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.