EPTTL Mafia 2 [GG]
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easy to control-f search it, and keeps everything in one place. However if a new thread makes administrating the game easier (never did this myself) then go for it. | ||
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On March 14 2008 14:38 qrs wrote: OK, so far fusion, caller, and Empyrean have all said that they will run for mayor no matter what. That means that if they end up mafioso, the Mafia practically has to put them up for election, otherwise it will be clear that they are Mafia (why else wouldn't they run). IOW, if the Mafia puts up, say, two candidates, and any of these three are in the Mafia, he will be one of the two candidates. Something to keep in mind. actually no he is right, this is nonsense. As an innocent townie, above all else your best bet is to elect a Mayor and Pardoner that are above all else highly competent. Having a dumb innocent townie is just as bad as having a Mafia Mayor. If you elect a really smart Mayor who just so happens to be Mafia a few things can happen so that the town comes out ahead: 1.) The first day one of the detectives investigates the Mayor, another one or another day Pardoner. If they turn up innocent they either truly are, or happen to be Godfathers. If they turn up guilty well thats a quick Mafia death. 2.) The detectives never do it, but if the Mayor that was elected was supposed to be highly competent the smart townies can trap him if they think he is doing a bad job. As a competent Mayor, certain actions would be expected and if they aren't doing them even when it HAS to be best for the town well then they are Mafia or useless. 3.) You elect both a really smart Mayor and really smart Pardoner, and as long as both aren't Mafia the power struggle that will ensue would be hurtful if even one of them is Mafia. What those 3 are saying is that they think they are SMART enough to lead the town, and in the Mafia games I've played and admined thats the kind of strategy I would go for as an innocent townie. A Mafia Mayor or Mafia Pardoner can be cornered if you know they have to be thinking logically. | ||
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No. You keep saying that, but it's groundless. You're assuming that the Mafia will put up a higher percentage of its people for mayor than the town will, but there is no reason to think that that is the case. 1) Last game, when Chuiu closed the vote, 7/57 townies were candidates. 0/14 mafia were candidates. ([url=http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=66251¤tpage=39#763]link[/url]). That worked out fine for them, by the way. 2) It doesn't make sense for the Mafia to put up more than a couple of candidates: a) The more people they put up, the harder it is to influence the vote for any one of them. b) The more people they put up for election, the more people fingers can be pointed at down the line. [quote] The ONLY reason that happened is because the Townies were so fucking BAD. In a game full of good players, the Mafia might have been toasted. With no Mafia Mayor, and no Mafia Pardoner, and the Mafia not electing to try and get at least one person in office was a mistake. It makes plenty of sense for the Mafia to put up more than 1 candidate, and when the game starts I may even get the chance to show you why. They dont have to influence the vote for any one candidate, they just need to start a bandwagon to get townies to believe it's the right choice. Even if they put up 3 people, in a game of 128 and possibly 6 to 7 candidates it will still take time and a lot of convincing to get caught. [quote] Townies, on the other hand, don't have to worry about these things. 3) You don't seem to realize that your reasoning cuts both ways: Sure, if you're right, and the Mafia will put up a higher percentage of candidates than the town, the odds favor voting for you, but if you're wrong, and the town will put up a higher percentage of candidates than the Mafia, the odds favor voting for someone other than you. 4) In any case, none of that is what I was saying in my above post. I said this: on that 1/7 chance that you are Mafia, you've locked yourself into being the Mafia candidate. That makes it slightly more likely, that between you and another candidate, you are the Mafioso. For argument's sake, take two people A and B. Assume the Mafia has at most one candidate. A has declared his candidacy beforehand. If neither is Mafia, that is that. If A is Mafia (1/7 chance), A is the Mafia candidate. If B is Mafia and A is not (~6/49 chance), B is the Mafia candidate. If both are Mafia (~1/49), A is the Mafia candidate, because he's already locked himself in. So everything else being equal, it is more likely that A is the Mafia's candidate. You are A. You will probably not be Mafia (like any other given person), but everything else being equal, you are slightly more likely to be a Mafia candidate than someone else who is running.[/QUOTE] 3 - complete bullshit. There are no odds when it comes to voting for Mayor, especially if the last game is any proof. 4 - also complete crap. | ||
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Even without a Mayor, the Town has Elders and Vigis. Sure we may lose a Mayor, but it surely isn't game over or even close. Really, the ideal setup to winning for the Townies is to have a competent leader that can convince even the most die hard Townies to vote the right way, and be smart about catching Mafia. We don't need to know who the detectives are until a certain point - that's called roleclaiming which is a really good strategy when done right. All the DTs, if smart wouldnt all investigate the Mayor - some would surely hit the Pardoner or even a random townie acting stupid. I've admined and played this game enough to know that when it comes to voting for Mayor trying to pick out who is innocent is a major waste of time unless someone messes up. Just going with "kill multiple birds with one stone" strats forces the Mafia's hand and gets the ball rolling for the townies to survive. | ||
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On March 14 2008 16:06 qrs wrote: The point is: they have said they are running. They have no reason to change that, unless they answer to someone else. ok look to make this even simpler: I'm running for Mayor also. See? Now even if any of us are Mafia we'll still run for Mayor and you can't figure anything out. Your logic isn't adding up. | ||
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On March 14 2008 16:10 qrs wrote: Good, you agree with me. fusionsdf was the one who was saying that there were odds, based on certain assumptions of his. I pointed out that under different assumptions, the odds would point in the other direction. Honestly, I don't think that there's a really strong basis for either set of assumptions. ok good. Actually, it's not. Think about it. I said 4 was crap because this is what it boils down to: The Townies are electing a Mayor and Pardoner based on popularity, intelligence, and whether they think he/she isn't Mafia. The Mafia are electing a Mafia Mayor, or a dumb Townie who is just as good as a Mafia Mayor. Surely, you can see there are no odds to think about here. The number of Mafia do not matter. | ||
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um...no it isn't. lol @ 1st lynch request. | ||
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Pardoner can get away with Pardoning Mafia if they are slick, and sometimes Vigis act dumb and go off revenge killing (cuz someone voted for them to get lynched) This game will be interesting. | ||
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I've played and admined Mafia games before, know how powerful both Mayor and Pardoner roles can be in the right hands, and I'm pretty smart too. | ||
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Also added to that, whoever gets Mayor knows who the bodyguards are. Clearly, they should PM all the Bodyguards and set them all up to know each other's ID. This way the Town has a starting force of innocents off the bat. Also, even if a Mafia Mayor does this, the Bodyguards should all double check with each other in PM land, and assume that if the Mayor is not proven innocent by a DT soon, he is possibly lying about one of his BGs being legit - I've done this strat in the past as a Godfather Mafia Mayor. With the above strategy, we can easily have a group of innocent Townies assembled off the bat, even with a Mafia Mayor he'd have to put some of the Townies into power doing this. It's a good strat to start the Townies off on a good foot. | ||
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On March 18 2008 16:29 Ghar wrote: More ideas since the thread just got quiet Though at the moment I'm still contemplating whether it's beneficial to start weeding numbers quickly, or wait until a relatively sure kill before attacking. Thoughts and suggestions guys? I like to start the game off with weeding out strats that are easy to follow - this controls discussion and gives everyone focal points. One of the biggest reasons the Townies always lose is because they start posting nonsense, arguing about retarded shit, revenge voting, and seem to listen to the most nonsense posts for voting someone to get lynched. With weeding strats: 1.) We keep the focus on a few people 2.) allows the Detectives to split up their work. If they see the town gunning for some people, they can investigate OTHER people. This is a major help. 3.) Mafia members can no longer sit back and watch the town kill themselves - they have to get in on discussions. This way, they are in the spotlight just like we need them to be. | ||
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What I meant by splitting work is that once the town has 2 or 3 targets for lynching the people caught in voting patterns (or "unvoting") patterns should be examined asap instead of the suspects because the Town will, and should continue to hone in on them. | ||
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On March 18 2008 16:52 ahrara_ wrote: Ghar, your plan is seriously flawed. I don't think you've thought this through, which is why I'm going to encourage people not to vote for you. If there was a contest over best election poster however, you'd win by a landslide. There are four detectives. They can use their role finding abilities twice in the game, and once a day. However, noone knows who the detectives are. A mafia mayor could have a fellow mobster, even two, pretend to be detectives and report that you're the mayor. You could have the detectives detect the detectives, but that'd cause the same problem, and the real detectives would be using their abilities in vain. So it's not that easy, but at least it's better than what FS did. edit: For chrissake, if you're going to run for mayor, do more than a half-assed job. Can't be worse than fakesteve doesn't cut it. I'm sure you didn't read his entire post, because the strategy makes a lot of sense EVEN when the Mayor is Mafia because it forces the Mayor to do some work that benefits the Town. | ||
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On March 18 2008 17:02 aZnvaLiaNce wrote: See, all this business behind what strategy is best for the future mayor is all based on the honor code and who's being honest. Seriously, I think it's best to put the strategy behind us until the first day/night cycle is done just to see how the important roles act/react to events happening, in particular the mayor. Oh lord... Look, just throwing everyone in the pit,waiting for the Mafia to kill 9 ppl and then seeing "what happens" is not always a good strategy. If we do the plan Ghar suggested, along with myself then we have a starting point which is CRUCIAL for the town. If ALL the Townies know the Strategy beforehand, and ALL the Mafia knows it then we've eliminated a lot of random elements and are now in a position where everyone knows the next moves that the Townies need to win, and the Mafia need to stop us from doing so. With that in mind and clues from the Day/Night posts, we can now trap Mafia members because we know clearly how any logical Innocent person would act. What you just posted pretty much asks us to commit suicide (see last game). | ||
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On March 18 2008 17:04 ahrara_ wrote: I don't understand. If the mayor is mafia, and he convinces the real detectives to find out people's roles for him, then it's pretty much game over. If he's not mafia, he can't absolutely trust the detectives, because the mafia could be faking 4 detectives and reporting mob members as having the roles. BTW Ghar, I didn't mean you were half-assing it. I mean, well, it's clear the liquidians I'm talking about. Except that the Mayor is investigated FIRST so the real DTs are going to know if he's dirty or clean ASAP. There is a plan for the Mayor to figure out if the DTs are lying or not, and I won't post that here until later. The Mafia also isn't crazy enough to fake FOUR people. That would be ridiculously stupid. | ||
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On March 18 2008 17:22 aZnvaLiaNce wrote: 2.) Towny mayor: This is hard. Early on, you can't really trust who's who and the mayor doesn't know who the fake detectives are. Later on, however, if 4 of those 6 report in again when asked, then it becomes somewhat easier to discern people. If more than 4, then ask for a third time. Those who do report in are fakes then. However, you do this at the expense of losing all your detective reports for the game, so do this at your own risk. In scenario 2, The Mayor immediately role claims for all 6. Essentially, he says 6 people reported and only 4 can be DTS, and puts ALL the names into public. Now the Town has 2 sure fire Mafia, the Medics can easily see who they should think about saving, and the Mafia is fucked because if they don't kill any of the real DTs at night they live to investigate another night. If they DO kill any of the DTs, then that just tightens the noose on the other 2 Mafia posing DTs. | ||
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On March 18 2008 17:31 ahrara_ wrote: Ok ACE, I think Ghar's already posted your plan. So as I understand it, it's up for a real detective to report the mayor as mafia in case he is mafia. To verify this, we lynch said detective (as he's going to get killed anyway if he's real) to see if he's telling the truth. If he wasn't, that's one mafia down. If he was, then we lynch the mayor next. From there on, the mayor does his best to verify the other roles. I buy it so far, but I'll think about it before I vote. For now anyway, my vote is leading towards Ghar, because it's becoming more apparent to me how much rests on the mayor's shoulders, and Ghar's the only one who's given us a solid strategy. I also don't think he's mafia because of how fast his candidacy came up. I agree with bumatlarge. If I were mob, I wouldn't go run for mayor on a whim the moment the game starts. don't lynch the DT - if he's legit let the Mafia have to kill him and waste killing power. Or, let another DT verify him. In this case if a Mafia member poses DT we have a sure fire place to nab them off of now. | ||
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All right, they're on our left, they're on our right, they're in front of us, they're behind us... they can't get away this time" -- Lieutenant General Lewis B."Chesty" Puller (when surrounded by 8 enemy divisions) - United States Marine Corps | ||
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On March 18 2008 18:32 xDark.Carnivalx wrote: the problem with that is it was rather inefficient to send pms like that to everyone, and it wasn't a personal request; the time it took to send out the same pm to everyone seems to be the main reason people are even considering to vote for him, and that is a rather silly way to vote for the mayor. it would have been much simpler had he just announced his running for mayor in the thread, which points to him not being the best person for mayor. it's not only about who might be mafia, it's about who is best for the job. Great points here. Also I'm not going to vote for Araav because he made a script. And his points for running for Mayor were not good enough in my eyes. Just as an aide to future voters and other games when it comes to Mayor voting, here is my strategy: You have no idea who is guilty or innocent Day 1. Even with the clues, it's all speculation unless we find a 100% concrete link. With this rule in mind whether or not someone is Mafia or Innocent can't be the crux of your decision. Base it off of who seems intelligent,logical and active enough to help the Town survive. Anyone with a plan is better than someone without one even if their plan sucks - that way we have somewhere to start off debating which as I've stated numerous times is critical. Voting for someone based on logic is our best defense. Even with a Mafia Mayor, we all know how to discern when someone is acting irrationally aka against the best interest of the Town. With this in mind we can easily trap a Mafia Mayor, and even force them to do work that benefits the Town asap like The Bodyguard linking strat I posted earlier. Even better is that this kind of plan works with the Pardoner also As of now I'm voting for Ghar to be Mayor, and if that fails I hope he becomes Pardoner. | ||
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HOW does Araav knowing programming languages benefit us? Seriously ask yourself that. I know C/C++, Java, and Assembly but that really won't help me find Mafia members now will it? | ||
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You guys are starting to use a lot of faulty logic! I'm going to get to all of it later with a large post, but for now Araav I can't believe you would say that Ghar doesn't have a convincing plan when NO ONE else even has a plan. And you want to be Mayor? Sorry, but that post actually gave me very good reason not to vote for you. "Lynch me to find out" does not mean he doesn't care about the Town - you are reaching really far into nothing with that statement. Ghar is the only person so far that has a solid plan and I've used plans similar to it in other games - it works. Empryean has no business being Mayor or Pardoner. That move shows incredibly bad strategic thinking for a Townie and would be of no use to us. Otherwise he is possibly a Mafia in disguise trying to force the town's hand - either way he doesn't belong in either role. As for you people asking about the DT plan: If more than 4 people PM Ghar about being DT thats GREAT for the Town. Because now we'd have a suspect list and people caught false role claiming meaning we certainly have some Mafia cornered. Also remember if we DO lose some DT roles somehow - we have Jacks. These players can be backup DTs if need be, so don't think we'd be dead asap because we lost 1 or 2 detectives somehow. I've said it before the Town needs focus, and Ghar's plan is a good place to start for this theme to work. Also, I am running for Mayor. I said it before but don't think I made it obvious. | ||
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On March 18 2008 23:12 araav wrote: you so-called strategy is simply too superficial and could easily move to a Mayor lose for the town. At this stage of the game, it is best to vote for people who seem towny - i.e. DO not seem suspicious AT ALL: no clue-interpretations about them, no stupid moves (like Empy did) What the hell? You can NOT be serious with this post? This post is further showing me NOT to vote for you as Mayor. Come on, how can anyone not see this post says exactly why you shouldn't be in a Mayor or Pardoner role? You're accusing the guy off of 1 Day of clues when NO ONE can clear his or her name right now, and NO ONE can be convicted at all because there isn't enough evidence and no DT can do anything. You're jumping too far to conclusions way too fast with little evidence, that is BAD. | ||
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On March 18 2008 23:45 Hittegods wrote: Wouldn't that mean outing the four real DTs though? For the price of one mafia member they could possibly get a list of all DTs? Unless the mayor plans on doing all the investigation himself, which could work I guess. Also, even if Empyrean did a bad move and outed himself, wouldn't an incompetent DT be better for the town, than a dead one? this is from a past post I made about outting the real DTs: In scenario 2, The Mayor immediately role claims for all 6. Essentially, he says 6 people reported and only 4 can be DTS, and puts ALL the names into public. Now the Town has 2 sure fire Mafia, the Medics can easily see who they should think about saving, and the Mafia is fucked because if they don't kill any of the real DTs at night they live to investigate another night. If they DO kill any of the DTs, then that just tightens the noose on the other 2 Mafia posing DTs. It's part of a role claiming strategy. Take all that info, and now add the medics. With 4 DTs or possibly more, the Town has 2 major advantages: 1.) Some people are clearly lying 2.) The medics have a list of people that need protecting There is also another part to this strategy I'm going to post soon | ||
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On March 19 2008 00:09 Amber[LighT] wrote: Uhhhh no? You can't say that people who are faking the Detective spot are necessarily mafia. They can be townies as well. Don't forget it's the Mafia vs. The Townies & The Townies vs. The Townies. Why would ANY Townie that isn't a moron claim the DT role? Anyone faking DT has to be Mafia, because any Townie doing that after reading all these posts explaining the plan would realize they are hurting the Town by doing so. also, this is not in any way Townies vs Townies. At all. More so it's the uninformed majority vs the informed minority, and one of the ways to get around that trend is to share info with those that we 100% know is innocent. | ||
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This is a strategy I've used in the past to win games, and it works very well if even a slight majority of the main players involved use it. The base of this plan lends itself to the fact that no innocent Townie knows for sure who else is innocent or what roles they are. Also is the fact that the main disadvantage the Town has is lack of information, whereas our main advantage is numbers. Combining these two things is the Bodyguard Plan. At the start of the game, the only non-Mafia/elected roles that any other player can possibly know for sure is a Bodyguard. The Mayor receives this info once elected into office. This plan is best with an innocent Mayor, but it also forces a Mafia Mayor to help the town in the event he/she is ever elected. When the Mayor is elected, their first plan of action should be to PM all the Bodyguards each other's identities. This pus information into the hands of the Townies that is critical. Assume there are 7 bodyguards. The Mayor PMs all of them the identity of the other 6. All of them then PM each other to 1: confirm they got a PM stating they are the bodyguard from the Mayor 2: make sure they ALL have the same list of Bodyguards In the case of an Innocent Mayor doing this, we have 7 townies all on the same side off the jump and this will be a major help to the Town if they all know the roles of 6 other innocents asap. In the case of a Mafia Mayor he could actually try and add a Mafia member to the list of Bodyguards or ignore a real Bodyguard - and this is where the true failsafe in the plan comes in. Failsafe: Remember, all Bodyguards SHOULD get that PM. If any of the Bodyguards don't get it then they should know something is clearly fishy and should investigate hastily. The Mayor would be investigated from Day 1, so the Town will know for sure if he/she is innocent or not which will allow the Bodyguards to know they can or can't trust the Mayor. If the Mayor turns out dirty, the Bodyguards will clearly speak up asap. If the Mayor is legit, then that Bodyguard list is 100% legit and ensures we have a solid base to start from. In summary the idea of this plan is self checking: 1.) The Bodyguards know they have to get a PM 2.) The Mayor knows they have to PM the Bodyguards the Bodyguard list 3.) The Bodyguards PM each other to check their lists 4.) The Mayor also knows that they will be investigated asap by a DT If the Mayor tends to be Mafia and releases a corrupted list, then the BGs will speak up and name the people on the list. The DTs paying attention to this, investigate the names. In the case of an innocent Mayor this 100% guarantees us safety, in the case of a Mafia Mayor it takes us at worst 2 days to clean up the mess. This is my plan of action to start the game off. In the event the list is released publicly, the best part of this plan is that the spotlight is taken off of the Detectives and put on the Bodyguards. This allows the Detectives to stay quiet, and for the Medics to have a list of people they need to watch. Remember what I stated earlier - the Town's main disadvantage is that we lack information and this plan serves to rectify that while maximizing our main advantage - numbers. Once the base has been formed (Mayors + Bodyguards) we can start generating a list of suspects together, and figuring out roles down the road. To succeed the Town needs a strong start, and this plan is one of such. | ||
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But why would they PM that info to the Mayor? That would cause confusion that the Town doesn't need. | ||
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On March 19 2008 00:28 qrs wrote: Well, keeping track of the profiles, etc. does benefit us, but more to the point, he bothered to do it. If he was Mafia, that would be a questionable move: who knows how long it would take for us to get the information together otherwise? Therefore I think that araav's using his programming skills to help the town is an indication that he is a towny. Honestly look, if I was Mafia I'd also be going out of my way to do stuff to prove it benefits the Town. The point of the matter is you guys are basing your votes off something that has NOTHING to do with his skills at playing the game, it's just that he bothered to do it. He hasn't even posted a plan of action, all he has done is code something and you guys are ready to vote for him. Sorry, I've played this game way too many times and while it doesn't paint araav as Innocent or Mafia, it surely makes me question his ability to lead the town when their are better candidates out there. | ||
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I read it, and thats the exact situation I'm trying to avoid this time around. | ||
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LastRomantic - aZnvaLiaNce(1) SoMuchBetter - SoMuchBetter(1) randombum - Dr.Dragoon,Alethios,G.s)Naruto,Sadir,fanatacist,Bockit,BWdero,Ninja4ever(8) fusionsdf - Plexa,Zbir,Kau(3) Plexa - ssj100,Seifu(2) SonuvBob - LTT,Joxxor,wurm,Heros)Pink(4) Ghar - falcynn,Ace,ahrara,Pangolin,GranDim,Mandalor,Amber[Light],rpf(8) araav - meta,SonuvBob,RowdierBob,Klive5ive,xDark.Carnivalx,Naib,Neax,Energies,qrs(9) Empyrean - Caller,Eti307,Showtime,MTF,BloodyCobbler,NatsuTerran,RtS)NightMare(7) Ace- Ghar,Spoinka(2) | ||
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On March 19 2008 01:06 qrs wrote: Now, that sounds like a good plan. Let me go you one better (unless this is what you meant): after the bodyguards are confirmed, let the mayor release one of their names publically. If it's a lie, the other bodyguards can call it. Now we have a guaranteed towny and all the detectives, etc. can PM their roles to him. In turn, he can forward them to the other bodyguards, so that even if the Mafia kills him, there will still be townies who know the important roles and can co-ordinate. I'll consider switching my vote to you, but it doesn't matter that much. We can follow your plan whether or not you are the mayor. Now you're seeing it the way I hoped everyone would. And yes, whether or not I am Mayor I would hope this plan or something even better is followed! | ||
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Even worse, BWdero why are you suspecting him just because others are? We barely have any clues, and he hasn't done anything through his posts that can target him as Mafia. Please people, lets not get into the practice of bandwagon suspicion so early. | ||
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With almost everyone else we have no idea what they are going to do. And when we have no idea what they can do or plan to do, they are less accountable and there is more room for "accidents" and "oops" moments. At least with Ghar we've got a guy thats willing to explain his actions upfront, his plan, and even has ideas of what to do in case it does not work. FAR better than what anyone else is offering right now. | ||
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Also, even though clues may point to a certain person as a Townie there are 2 things that should inspire your votes when lynching time arrives: 1.) Clues and discussions about them 2.) What people post and who they vote for, but more importantly what they DONT post Number 2 is going to help you a lot more than #1 in the long run. I've already got a list of everyone who's posted in this thread, who they voted for, and comments about everyone's thinking patterns. Once I start to see people act fishy, or incredibly stupid I'll check it against my info and see whats up and vote accordingly. | ||
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I posted the quote just so you guys know exactly where his quote comes from, not because I think he is Mafia at all. 8 people in his way, and 8 enemy divisions is a very far reach right now. | ||
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But I won't debate that right now - that only leads to confusion among the Town and takes away from what we need to do right now - vote for a Mayor. Either way, you really have no solid arguments as to why Ghar shouldn't be Mayor. | ||
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I'm serious, I want to hear it so that we can all analyze the plan in the open and work out any questions or flaws that can be exploited. | ||
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1.) Remember what I said, all Bodyguards now know each other's ID + The Mayor. Once the Mayor is investigated, if no one speaks up obviously he has to be legit. I doubt any DT that investigates the Mayor and finds him guilty would stay quiet in fear of their death - that would be selfish and harm the Town. 2.) Even so, let's assume that NO detectives investigate the Mayor. Either way with 7 people and The Mayor, thats a lot of communication going on to find Mafia. At some point, and I'm hoping for this, the Bodyguards will have to question the Mayors decisions. Even better, they do this publicly. The Mayor has to defend certain actions, and if he is acting suspicious with no good reason something is up. In 1, whether or not the Mayor is innocent is going to be found out very fast. In 2, the Mayor in the case of being Mafia even if not found out has the added task of killing innocents while appearing to do good by 7 other people who also know each other, and that they are all 100% innocent (refer back to the plan to find out how). So how can a Mafia Mayor who follows the Bodyguard Plan still harm the Town? Possibly by trying to trick the Bodyguards into doing something horrible, but with 7 ppl that's going to be hard because that isn't enough for mob mentality to take over - and I doubt all of them would be that gullible. The plan works even if the Mayor doesn't mess with the list - we get a verified Mayor and his allies by the time day 2 starts. How is that not good enough? | ||
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On March 19 2008 02:59 Lysithea wrote: Reposting this part from my own post since I really want peoples thoughts on this. Ok here's my take - it would be a pretty good idea from a Mafia standpoint. 1.) Empryean did very well last game 2.) For some reason, people think the probability of him being Mafia again has changed when it really hasn't 3.) He claims a role that is important and can't be verified right now 4.) Most importantly, it adds confusion to the game 4 is the prime reason that if I were Mafia, it would be a great tool. People trust Empryean, and if another DT comes and investigates him well they'd be hard pressed to prove it - and now the Mafia knows another DT role with nothing else weighing in on their decisions aka an easy kill. Thats an element of confusion that takes away from the main focus, and the easiest way for the Mafia to win is to confuse the Townies. I'm not saying Empryean is Mafia, but that was a very risky move. There was no point in revealing his alleged role so early in the game. Maybe he's afraid that he'd be killed early and is innocent after all - and if that's the case for someone so smart he should have provided a better angle of campaigning. | ||
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Sorry if I wasn't more clear, and sorry for the insult Getting rid of double lynches is not going to matter to the Mafia UNLESS we obviously have Townies that are clearly on the right path - that point is moot. Double lynching is essentially only good for when we have a situation where it's an EITHER/OR case. Example: Only 1 Medic is left alive, and 2 people claim the role. With only Medic no one has a reliable chance of living at night anyway, and one of these people is lying and the town somehow can't decide. Call for the Double lynch because it destroys the Mafia killing power. The Detectives being scared to reveal their roles would hurt the town. And I'm betting that we've got some smart, rational detectives on our side. Surely, to save the Town they'd give themselves up. But not only that, role claiming at the right time will screw the Mafia over. This is something I wanted to reveal later, but I'll partially post it now: While the Mafia knows each other and have the advantage of secrecy, they also lack information - namely roles. With this in mind, whenever a role that is crucial is publicly revealed they usually want to kill them - sometimes. Where does that sometimes pop up? When they damn well know that Medics will protect that target at all costs. Which means that they'd have to send a lot of killing power to get rid of that person. Which also means they cant kill as many people that very night which is good for the town. That 1 detective could actually save a couple of lives. hold on - it gets better. I mentioned earlier on the forum something along the lines of Mafia have it easy when their are only a couple of really good targets to kill. When you add in like 5 or 6 good targets, they have an issue. If the Town knows that 5 or 6 of their best could possibly be killed, the Medics know that. And the Mafia knows that the Medics know that. So they are somewhat stuck in a rut as they definitely can't kill ALL of them, and they don't know which ones are getting protected. Wait. There's on more good part to this. We have Jacks. Any DT that is playing this game can realize that even if they died, we have Jacks that could replace them if need be. I doubt anyone is playing THAT selfish and is worried that somehow role claiming at the right time to help the town with critical information is a bad choice. | ||
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On March 19 2008 03:24 randombum wrote: Ace the bodyguard plan is not faulty, but merely that even if implemented its not that great. True that is 7 people who are working together, but 10(mayorx4) will not be able to change much with 130 people voting. It is FAR more important for information to be shared with everybody. (not who are bodyguards but other information.) The mafia or pardoner's position should be the mouthpieces of the town. Detectives (don't have to reveal their detective status) can send information to mayor. The mayor repeats it to the town. Thereby giving the town the ability hear all the information from everyone, but keeping those people anonymous. So the more involved people do not have to share their opinions publicly. This keeps our active people alive, but they ideas are still shared. I agree with some of this randombum. The Bodyguard plan is not the full plan I would use, it's just a start that gets information around and gets the town into a good setting. Whether or not the BG roles need to be revealed is a different issue and I think it's worth telling at a certain time. In most Mafia games, the town does something called Role Claiming which is a great thing to do. It brings out conflicts because surely Mafia members need to claim SOMETHING. However, the Mayor + BodyGuards DO have the power to change the voting. Remember, if everyone knows that the plan is being followed and nothing comes out about a guilty mayor, then they must be innocent. And if the innocent Mayor has a committee of innocents, that drops the suspect list down to 122, gets information flowing, and eliminates red herrings in clue posts. Surely, that is a much better plan than what we have now? wait, what DO we have now? | ||
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However, what we can do is just let the Mayor speak for "the committee" once he's known to be innocent. At that point, the BGs don't have to be revealed yet. | ||
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Once the Mayor is confirmed innocent, he/she is the mouthpiece of the committe (Mayor + BGs). After that, by day 2 we have a new course of action: check clues, look for suspects. Investigate the Pardoner. Any innocents can PM the Mayor their role, who will share this with the committee. randombum: I'll talk more about role claiming at a later date. | ||
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On March 19 2008 03:57 Falcynn wrote: To be honest the pardoner seems like a useless position for a towny until maybe really really late in the game. The only good thing that comes from granting someone Pardoner status is the bodyguard protection, so we don't really need a pardoner who works well with the mayor. We just need to put a towny that we want to keep protected. Pardoner is actually very powerful if the Town is somehow mob voting and the Pardoner figures out in time if something is fishy. The Pardoner should pretty much be treated as a second Mayor, since that person should also be pretty good at leading the Town and figuring things out. And yes, the last point that it should be someone we want to protect should be taken into account. | ||
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LastRomantic - aznvaliance (1) Empyrean - LastRomantic, Meta,Eti307,Showtime,MTF,BloodyC0bbler,RST Nightmare,NatsuTerran,Solosteer,Jim Tudor,nemy,decafchicken (13) Ace - CDRdude,Joxxor,Ghar,spoinka,Hittegods,Hollander,Naib,useless,GeneralStan,Shadowdrgn, Lysithea,Falcynn,zeks,Mynock,Caller (15) randombum - Drdragoon,Alethios,G.S)Naruto,Sadir,fanatacist,Bockit,GranDim,Ninja4ever, so no fek,shallow[bay] (10) fusionsdf - plexa,ZBIR (2) plexa - ssj100,Seifu (2) Sonuvbob - LTT.wurm,Heros)Pink (2) Ghar - Ace,ahrara,Pangolin,Mandalor,Amber[Light],rpf,Ziel (7) araav - SonuvBob,RowdierBob,Klive5ive,xdark,Neax,Energies,qsr (7) | ||
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On March 19 2008 05:13 Falcynn wrote: Only the mayor knows who the body guards are, even the bodyguards themselves don't know. So if a bodyguard doesn't get a message...he'll just assume that he's not a bodyguard. Hmmm? Not quite. Remember that Chuiu PMs everyone their Bodyguard Roles after elections. If a Bodyguard doesn't get a message something is fishy because he knows the Mayor has to know who he/she is, and that if the Mayor is following the plan they HAVE to PM them. This is the self-checking part of the plan. Also guys, I don't think we need to reveal a bodyguard. Whoever wins mayor will undoubtedly be checked up on by a Detective or a Jack, and if found Mafia will be turned out ASAP. If things are quiet, we can be sure as heck that they must be innocent. The Mayor will be the mouthpiece of "the committee" (Bodyguards + Mayor) 1. Even if I were mafia, a mafia mayor would still be good for the town. Think about it. Mayors have to act in town interest. If he doesn't, there is mass suspicion against him, and he can be lynched. It's in the town's best interest to always enact double-lynches. If, for some reason, the mayor declines, he's pretty much voted dead the next day. It's NOT in The Town's best interest to always enact double lynches - they are only useful is some critical information is going to be revealed or the case where out of the candidates someone is SURELY Mafia and we have exhausted other attempts at figuring it out. 2. Yes, I am forcing the town's hand. I'm fine with having someone confirm me as a detective, or for having people give me questions to confirm. If I am not mayor or pardoner, I'll be a likely target for the mafia the first night. They're smart enough to put multiple hits on people to ensure bodyguard protection is wasted. If mafia don't target me first night, I'll be able to reveal some more clues until they're forced to kill me or otherwise be revealed. I'm not fine with anyone confirming anything based on you - because what you're asking is a system where you are the only person accountable for anything. In other words, you are asking for blind trust and using your abilities in last game (which have 0 bearing on your status this game) as a crutch to get elected - and I'm not for it. A detective mayor/pardoner is the best bet for the town. Why? At the end of the game, it's likely that at least one bodyguard will still be alive. When the playing field has diminished so greatly, I'll be able to ask "What is [player]'s role" which leads to an immediate mafia death. That's why you should vote for me. Surely you don't think we are this stupid??? 1.) You role claim at a point no one can justify 2.) You are pretty much asking for blind trust 3.) You have no plan Seriously, if people keep saying you are so good at this game I can't help but ignore how BAD this move is for the town. It's a very selfish move akin to "I don't want to die" and your campaign for Mayor/Pardoner isn't even strong at all. I seriously hope people do not vote for you, because you definitely are not acting like a leader or in the best interest of the town. You did not need any protection at all, and in fact the more I think about your little stunt is actually taking votes away from more qualified candidates like randombum and Ghar. You are acting VERY selfish and I just can't stop repeating it. You have offered no plan and you are pretty much saying "I'm a Detective, Mayor + Detective = win, vote for me". People I URGE you to reconsider your votes for Empyrean, because he is NOT displaying good qualities we need as a Mayor or Pardoner. | ||
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On March 19 2008 07:58 qrs wrote: The problem with that in a nutshell is that you are forcing all the detectives to use one of their two "is-he-Mafia" questions. (If one does not, how do we know that all of them will not?) Surely it's better to save those questions for when we can use them better, and out a single bodyguard (who can be protected or fake-protected). I would rather have the DTs use their abilities to verify the Mayor and easing the conscience of the Bodyguards and allowing the Town to start off on a good foot. I also hope people are looking at ahrara's last post. Do not jump to conclusion's people - there is no strong evidence pointing to anyone at all right now. | ||
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On March 19 2008 07:58 Empyrean wrote: 1. Yes. I am acting very selfishly. It still benefits the town to guarantee that I'm a protected position. 2. I support your plan. I probably should have made that more clear. Think about it from a mafia standpoint: If I truly were mafia roleclaiming to be detective, once the election is over and under your plan, the detectives reveal their clues (not publically, of course), it'll be obvious that I wasn't a detective. So why would the mafia risk such a scenario? Quick edit. Ok I'll think about it from a Mafia standpoint: 1.) If you are Mafia and you don't win Mayor you could always get away with false claiming for a while if the Mayor isn't good enough to break that trend early 2.)If you are Mafia, you are hoping you do win the election and that by the time you really are investigated things are out of whack. Essentially by the point part 2 comes up, if you were Mayor the Town loses a Mayor, you hope the BGs are in disarray, and any Detective or Jack that says you are Guilty will be labeled as scum or a traitor and won't be killed at night to keep the suspicions on them. Honestly, the more you post about reasons to be Mayor the more I keep thinking about past games I've played and how people have tried stuff like this to pull one over the eyes of the town. Even if you were caught fast, the damage to the town would be sickening. You'd take up a valuable night spot, and a lot of active, smart players would be dead on the first night. And as of now, you are not acting intelligent enough to be Mayor or Pardoner. I don't care what anyone says about last game, this game is showing that your selfish nature and by any means necessary attitude is not good for the Town.period. | ||
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On March 19 2008 08:21 LucasWoJ wrote: Same for you Ace, but I voted for Empyrean because of his detective role. None of us can prove that he is the Detective. Basically, it's all going off of his wording and that we should trust him. That is a MAJOR problem for the Town. | ||
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You do realize this don't you? | ||
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On March 19 2008 08:30 Empyrean wrote: My problem with your candidacy is that the same thing could apply. You could be mafia as well, and all we have is your word. I'm basically going to be adopting a similar plan, so why not vote for the candidate who actually has a role? (Of course, you may as well.) Also, I don't agree with the bodyguard plan qrs posted wholly - if the mayor were mafia, he could have a mafia member "reveal" that he was a bodyguard, and then the mafia would know the player's jobs/plan/etc., as well as waste a significant amount of paramedic protection. That's why I think that we should investigate any person who claims bodyguard first. But seriously. If I'm elected, just get other detectives to check my role. The mafia will certainly fake some detectives, but I have ways around that which I can't reveal at the moment because it would compromise the method. Obviously ANY of us could be Mafia, stating that isn't going to help figure out anything. The problem I have with you being Mayor is you never offered any kind of plan until today when Ghar and myself posted stuff and starting getting votes - and you were here last night so you saw the original plan Ghar posted and my comments. Even if you somehow missed it - you never revealed that you had a plan until we questioned your candidacy. Voting for a candidate based on a supposed role has NO BENEFIT for the Town. Surely, someone as smart as yourself would have realized that and instead run on the basis of well - being smart, knowing what to do, experience. a plan, something. You did something extremely selfish, and I hate to say it but if you are elected Mayor or even Pardoner we are in a bad spot at the start of the game. Selfish people are horrible for the town - Detectives that won't come forward with critical evidence because they fear death, Medics that refuse to actually protect people that are pretty much a sure fire kill for Mafia, Vets that don't post or contribute at all and instead only vote which means they draw no attention to themselves. Also you are CLEARLY not READING. If you looked at both my plan and qrs's plan you'd realize that the Mayor CANT DO THAT without getting into bad situation. If they false claim the Mayor is a goner, and out of the possible claimers the Town has a sure fire list of suspects which contains a Mafiaso and the detectives are easily going to investigate them. I seriously cant believe you are acting in the best interest of the town when you wont even read other posts that suggest plans of action carefully. | ||
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On March 19 2008 08:41 HeRoS)Pink wrote: Well even if empyrean is telling a lie he's more clean than Ace (for me), Ace was defending Ghar's point of view (another candidate) + Ghar have clues against him, and the mafia has probably sent 2 candidates for the mayor's position and that could be the reason why Ghar was ready to give up his votes to Ace Why would he do that if he really wants to be the mayor? Cuz they both think alike? I dont think so, they had almost the same plan which is another coincidence. So Don't start voting for Ace because he's accusing Empyrean of being too much unsafe for the town. -Pink I'm defending him because I think he's posting very logical examples of ways to help the Town, and while I can't 100% verify him being innocent, I know when I see something that helps the Town. And Empyrean isn't helping the Town, in fact he is adding a lot of confusion to this election which is something we do not need as a Town. | ||
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On March 19 2008 08:44 HotZhot wrote: P.S2: Ace you seem to want the mayor position alot, I wonder why... Because I know I'm good enough to help the Town win in that position. | ||
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On March 19 2008 08:48 HotZhot wrote: He is the new Tracil IMO, are you Tracil Ace? would fit if he got mafia rol, lol hahaha look at my profile - been here since 2002. I'm NOT the new Tracil | ||
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On March 19 2008 08:57 Kau wrote: Ace: About your Bodyguard plan, what stops a mafia mayor from pming each actual bodyguard with a list that is something like: mafia 1 mafia 2 mafia 3 bodyguard # Each actual bodyguard would get a pm back from each of the fake mafia-bodyguards and they wouldn't know. Then once the mayor gets checked by a detective, couldn't there be fake mafia-detectives that state that the mayor is innocent? They can't because all the other Bodyguards that didn't get a PM would know something is wrong. In the event that they do that, it just helps the town because we can just apply all clues and DT/Jack power to that list of suspects and catch the Mafia asap. No fake detective is going to spring forward and state the Mayor is innocent because they run the risk at having a real detective also step forward and once again we are back to place where we have confirmed a situation with at least 1 suspect as Mafia (because someone is lying) and a sure fire Mafia lynching. | ||
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On March 19 2008 09:04 Empyrean wrote: Especially since once the real bodyguards complain that they didn't get a PM, other mafia can as well. And if the Mayor is innocent he'd (which would be confirmed by the DTs silence) then those stupid Mafia that tried to geek the Town would be caught when the Mayor never mentions them on his list. If any Mafia member false claims they'd be caught red handed fast because this plan does not use 1 person as the word of trust - it uses several with a self checking scheme. Continue to try and find more holes in it, this is interesting and fun. | ||
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On March 19 2008 09:04 qrs wrote: Edit: @ Ace: He's saying that every bodyguard would get a PM. Their PM would list Mafia members as bodyguards. Each bodyguard's PM would list (the same) fake bodyguards as their colleagues. None of the bodyguards would know the difference. They'd still be caught. Ok let's look at like this: Scenario 1: There are 7 bodyguards total. 2 Mafia members "fake" PM the BG's with a Mafia Mayor who also sends out the PM. We will know how many BGs are there when the elections are over. The Mafia can't leave 2 of the real Bodyguards off the list because the 2 that didn't get a PM would speak up. They can't just add an extra 2 to the PM because any BG getting a PM from the Mayor with 9 names obviously means the Mayor is clearly not thinking straight and is fishy. Scenario 2: There are 7 bodyguards total. 2 Mafia members "fake" PM the BG's with an Innocent Mayor who also sends out the PM. The PMs from the Mayor don't match those 2 "fake" PMs. Even better, the names of those 2 fakers never even appear in the Mayor's original PM and they just outted themselves as Mafia for a pathetic chance at confusion. How can the Mafia possibly get away with faking any of it without drawing attention to their members? | ||
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On March 19 2008 09:11 qrs wrote: You guys aren't understanding Kau's point. The real bodyguards would ALL get PMs from the mafioso mayor. The PMs would be lies, but they would all get them. Remember the other part of the plan - the Detectives. If a Mafia Mayor sent those PMs he'd be revealed by the next day. So the BGs would know something is not right once he's found out. The thing is, any tampering with this plan means that a Mafia member has to come out of hiding to do it. And once things don't add up, we have a list of suspects to investigate and a good place to start off. I'm SURE Mafia members will try and tamper with it, and if I'm Mayor I'll be waiting for them. | ||
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On March 19 2008 09:32 Kau wrote: Ace, I don't see how scenario 1 would happen at all. Unless I don't understand how the game works (which is a definite possibility), this is how I see it using your numbers. What everyone knows: There are 7 bodyguards. Only the mayor knows which 7 people are bodyguards. Now, we assume that the mayor is also mafia, so he can coordinate with other mafia members. Since he knows who each bodyguard is, he will send each of the 7 bodyguards a pm. Each pm will have 7 people in it: 6 mafia and 1 bodyguard. Each bodyguard gets pm'ed back by the mafia members (6 different pm's for each bodyguard) and so they believe there are 7 bodyguards. No bodyguards are left out. Each list sent contains 7 people. Each bodyguard recieves 6 confirmation pm's. If this Does happen the Mafia has then implicated 7 of their own Mafia members because: 1.) The DTs investigated the Mayor and find out he is MAFIA 2.) Once this is revealed, all the BGs speak out about the PMs they received and not only are the names tallied, the common names in PMs that are fishy get investigated first For that hole to work, it assumes that we have a Mafia Mayor and that no Detective investigates them. That would never happen. | ||
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Bodyguards are checked by each other and Mayor with the PMs Mayor is checked by Detectives Detectives stay silent if the Mayor is legit, and speak up if he is Mafia If ANY Detective speaks up against the Mayor and we can't decide whether or not who to believe, we go to the ultimatum approach - just lynch the DT first and if he is telling the truth the Mayor is Mafia. Boom - Mafia Mayor gone by the second day. If you see any flaws in the self-checking scheme, also point that out so we can discuss. | ||
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On March 19 2008 10:10 Kau wrote: Guys, the reason I brought up this hole was because I didn't know that the mayor could be proven mafia or innocent. Since Ace cleared it up, sending fake pms as a mafia mayor will just get them killed. no problem, I am hoping people find holes so we can clear up any confusion about the plan and also find solutions where they are needed. | ||
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On March 19 2008 10:16 qrs wrote: Much as I hate to admit it, I believe my plan is flawed. As per Kau's post, a Mafia can identify himself as a bodyguard, and all the bodyguards will believe he is telling the truth. The Bodyguard plan is not failsafe after all. Unless someone comes up with something new, we will have to waste some detective power as Ghar has been saying. Read my self checking scheme. Sure we waste some Detective Power, but we get a much needed confirmation of the Mayor's status. An added benefit is that once the Detectives know the Mayor is innocent, he can then PM him and reveal himself. | ||
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On March 19 2008 10:30 Kau wrote: Hmm... Actually, what happens in the case the mayor is mafia, and a mafia-detective points him out along with real detective. Would we have to lynch both to be sure? Yes, but another alternative is to apply clues to both of them and find out which fits best and go from there. If we make a mistake and lynch one of them innocently, then the other is sure to be Mafia. When that testimony is resolved we will also know the status of the Mayor. | ||
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On March 19 2008 11:26 BlindAlbino wrote: Well hopefully we can get a good mayor/pardoner this time around. Tracil was completely useless last game, and the whole lynching FS thing was a joke. If we are gonna elect someone, has to be someone that people actually like so we dont get another bandwagon lynch. I vote Ace for Mayor. http://teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?currentpage=6&topic_id=68177 | ||
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Seriously people that are voting for Empyrean what exactly are you basing this vote off of? The fact that he played well last round even though he was Mafia? The wrong thinking that since he was Mafia last round that he surely can't be Mafia this round? Those 2 points are clearly not going to help choose a Good Mayor. But that isn't my problem with his candidacy - this is: He role claimed Detective. This one action brings out a major problem. At this point we can't verify that Empyrean is legit as a DT. We pretty much have to go on blind trust, and I'm begging those of you who have played this game before to recall what happens when we act on blind faith. Nothing good will come out of it. Why would someone claim a key role like that early, saying that they fear they would be killed at night? If he really was acting in the best interest of the town, he would realize that as a key target the Medics would protect him and how that simple action puts a spin on the Mafia killing power. But he went the selfish route. Even more so, Empyrean never had a plan until myself and Ghar put plans up. He never even read the original plans and even got qsr's plan analyzed WRONG. How can this guy be a good candidate even though he didn't read many of the posts that are the main focus of discussion right now? But besides all of that, the final nail in the coffin is the fact that everyone says Empyrean is a good player. As any good mafia player will tell you, role claiming is a great strategy - only when done at the right time. The very beginning of the game when nothing can be proved, Empyrean an acclaimed good player role claims. He even admits that it can't be proved but we should just trust him. Think this out guys. A GOOD player that has not acted on logic, has not posted a plan till later in voting, and is running on a platform of "trust me based on my actions last game" which have no bearing on his status this game. HOW is this going to help us survive? He has not done anything so far that shows me or many others he is capable of acting in the best interest of the town and has even admitted it. Empyrean is smart - and he certainly isn't running on a platform that shows that. It's a trust platform, and right now the best thing we can do is vote based on plans of action and leadership NOT trust - because that can't be proven until later. Stop voting for him. I may have a slight lead right now, but by tomorrow who knows how the voting will stack up. I may even never get the Mayor position. I'm not comfortable with a guy who's acting selfishly and irrationally on Day 1 in any position of power. Even if he is Pardoner I'd be worried. Once I again I'm begging you guys to reconsider. | ||
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On March 19 2008 12:07 JeeJee wrote: as for the other candidates..meh. i was keeping an updated excel sheet of ALL the people, who they vote for, who supports them, who they support, who accuses them, who they accuse, because it gets oh-so-easy to keep track of people (i was reading thread @ work and felt like doing that) then i get home and flip vanilla, so i suddenly get far too lazy to do that =/ maybe someone else can take over, i'll send you what i have right now (it goes up to page 35ish i think?) oh and it has the list of all the people, their sigs, and potential themes used for clues, ordered by likelihood, since I think that getting a list of clues that could apply to a certain person, then running through the day post to see if any in fact DO match, is a far better way than vice versa (running through the post to see the people they might match to) someone with a lot of time (randombum?) wanna do this?  I've also got 2 notepads with info of stuff myself | ||
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I got your PM, I'll respond later when I'm back from going out. | ||
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If I HAVE to lynch someone though, I already have an idea of how to go about it. | ||
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On March 19 2008 12:57 ahrara_ wrote: I see clues as largely a means of supporting a suspicion, not the beginning of one. Like I said, if you've been following the thread, there have been people who've done some weird things that warrant suspicions. Nothing for sure, but plenty of starting points not based on clues. This is something that needs constant repeating. | ||
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On March 19 2008 13:00 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote: You seriously do remind me of Tracil last game. You just don't say "scum" as every second word. I'm being careful about throwing that word around, I don't want to start any false bandwagons by accident. I haven't even accused anyone yet lol | ||
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And yes it possibly can end up getting one of my voters killed, but I highly doubt it. And if it does look like I'm going to win for sure, I'll post the strat on purpose as insurance that it works. | ||
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I've got a much better idea this time around. | ||
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On March 19 2008 13:09 qrs wrote: QFT. You have said some things that made sense, Ace, but you have also sounded fairly patronizing in many of your posts. At the end of the day, you haven't actually contributed that much more than anyone else. (I was taken by the bodyguard idea when you posted it, but Kau pointed out the flaw in it [as a standalone method].) I can't help if I sound patronizing I guess? We've already addressed the flaw, it was cleared up. If you've still got questions let me know asap, I'm about to leave here soon. | ||
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Last Romantic - 2 aZnvaLiaNce d.arkive SonuvBob - 5 MoRe_mInErAls LTT wurm bumatlarge Chezinu Empyrean - 21 Last Romantic Meta Eti307 Showtime! MTF BloodyC0bbler RtS)Night[Mare NatsuTerran SoleSteeler Jimtudor nemY decafchicken imDerek KH1031 LoStYouRSkiLLS ShaLLoW[baY] LucasWoJ HeRoS)Pink butidigress GranDim crazie-penguin Ace - 31 CDRdude xDark.Carnivalx JoxxOr ghar spoinka Hittegods Hollander Naib useLess GeneralStan ShadowDrgn Falcynn zeks Mynock Caller Artanis[Xp] Fishball MasterOfChaos Lenwe ahrara_ Queasy NeaX goldenkrnboi French_Toast Pangolin Alethios Yogurt Empyrean New104 clazziquai Alventenie randombum - 14 Dr.Dragoon G.s)NarutO Sadir fanatacist Bockit BWdero Ninja4ever. So no fek Lysithea GrayArea jeejee Meta iNfuNdiBuLuM Ace fusionsdf - 4 Plexa ZBiR Kau ~OpZ~ Plexa - 2 ssj100 Siefu ghar - 4 Amber[LighT] rpf Ziel TranceStorm araav - 5 SonuvBob RowdierBob Klive5ive qrs AcrossFiveJulys Abstain - 4 Wysp HotZhot MidnightGladius randombum | ||
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On March 19 2008 15:37 GeneralStan wrote: Damn I wish we could get randombum to Pardoner all it takes is 4 votes to switch | ||
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On March 19 2008 15:45 Alethios wrote: Could you enlighten us on this? Your method of selection. One of them will be using the clues that we have so far, thats all I can say for now. | ||
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On March 19 2008 22:21 Klive5ive wrote: We need to call Empyrean out. I'll start by saying I think it is very likely he is a detective. Everyone should be assumed innocent until CLUES or obvious circumstances cast serious doubt over them. The mistake made last time was to assume the people who posted frequently were Mafia, purely because they said things that were silly/didn't make sense. Just because people are stupid or play the game badly doesn't mean they are Mafia. In light of this the best way to go about it in my opinion is to NOT ALLOW HIM TO USE HIS PARDONING POWERS. By that I mean we simply state that he is not allowed to pardon anyone. IF he does, then he will be assumed Mafia and we simply lynch him next round. If enough people agree that this is a good idea we can get the benefits of a possible pardoner-detective without the disadvantages of a mafia-pardoner saving mafia. This makes no sense, and I'll explain why. 1.) Saying that Empyrean is likely detective is pointless - no one's roles can be proved 2.) No one should be assumed innocent, or guilty - the only assumption anyone knows at all right now is that they can trust no one if they are a Townie 3.) I agree, just because people play badly or dumb doesn't make them Mafia - but it surely doesn't make them worthy for candidacy of Mayor or Pardoner 4.) No one is accusing anyone of being Mafia right now 5.) Not allow him to use his Pardoning powers? If he gets the role, we cant exactly force him not toby threat of lynching. Anyone who has played this game enough knows that a threat like that can be smashed into pieces if a much bigger disaster hits the Town because people "forget". | ||
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Another thing, I'm sure the Mafia has read up on the Bodyguard plan and have seen something in it that makes it a little difficult to "break". I'm still asking that if anyone can find any scenarios that would mess the plan up to please post them.After the game I'll explain in depth the real reasoning behind the plan (can't do that now). | ||
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Ace-30 randombum-23 Empyrean-17 | ||
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Also, this is not a lynch Empyrean moment - nemy stop posting nonsense. Confusion like that only hurts the town. The focus of the town is: 1.) Get a Mayor and Pardoner 2.) Mayor uses first lynch 3.) Investigate myself,empyrean and randombum 4.) Enact the Bodyguard Plan Hopefully I still get Mayor, randombum is catching up *Makes dirty campaign adds slandering randombum's name* | ||
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On March 20 2008 04:55 BlindAlbino wrote: ace that seems very flawed. How will you know the other detectives besides empyrean is telling the truth? they would have to reveal themselves for this to happen. If you mean about the plan, the Detectives confirm my innocence by staying silent. If any of the Detectives speak up and say I'm Mafia, then one of us has to be lying. We lynch the DT, if he is Mafia it was just a plan to try and get the town to lynch me first. If he is innocent, I'm obviously Mafia and the Town would lynch me when his death reveals his innocence. | ||
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On March 20 2008 05:08 RtS)Night[Mare wrote: i really think that empyrean isnt mafia. Sadly, if he ends non-pardoner or mayor, meds are taking a big risk at protecting him, due to suicide bomber. ;(. Empyrean played a GG last game, i think he should get pardonership because mayorship is probably taken by ace by now. Another bad point is that saboteur would probably block empyrean's role . yea, which is why I said that early role claim, whether or not Empyrean is Innocent just put us in a really shitty spot :/ | ||
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On March 20 2008 05:27 BlindAlbino wrote: yea but what makes you think they will call you out as mafia if they know that will happen? what if the detective knows you are mafia but just stays silent for his own greed? that is what im getting at. That would literally be like, the dumbest thing ever for a detective to do. Way too selfish. All it takes is ONE detective to call me out. If one of them calls me out then all the others can stay silent and watch the proceedings. I also hope that when people find out I really am Innocent as Mayor, they PM me their roles and any other relevant info. I've already started making lists of info. | ||
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On March 20 2008 06:33 Hittegods wrote: While this is mafia, it's also TL mafia, so don't expect people to act 100% rational or serious. yea I'm starting to realize that, that could be a problem but I'll try and find a way around that also | ||
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On March 20 2008 07:15 Hittegods wrote: Again, this is TL mafia, so make sure everyone gets exactly how it works  for sure, I'll repost the entire body guard plan AND the First lynch plan AND part of our "mob hunting plan" too. | ||
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If anyone remember that speed game that got messed with the Starcraft themes, I was the one who proposed the "we lynch anyone that doesn't talk". 1.) Mafia members that don't talk and try to lay low will have to step forward into the spotlight or chanced getting lynched 2.) Townies that really aren't doing anything to contribute to the game aren't going to help us at all anyway. What I did was I looked at the people that signed up and then compared them to the people that voted. Whatever names didn't show on both lists I took out and picked 1 which was Incontrol. Then I started at page 16 of the thread (where the game really starts) and F-searched every page and did not see that he posted in the thread at all. Thats how I came to my decision. | ||
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On March 20 2008 13:28 HeRoS)Pink wrote: Yeah like I was pretty sure it would happen, Ace isnt helping the town with that lynch You really really have been all against me from Day 1 havent you? | ||
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On March 20 2008 13:34 qrs wrote: I don't think you can take credit for the idea: Tracil was pushing it from the beginning of the first game. But I agree that it's a good way to lynch when there is very little to go on. I wasnt in the first game. And thats a plan that I think every Veteran of Mafia has used at some point. | ||
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On March 20 2008 13:33 Kau wrote: Ace, couldn't you have clicked the All pages link and then just F-search one huge page? Would've saved some time :p yea | ||
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So for tomorrow I can't Double Lynch, and I don't have extra voting power. | ||
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On March 20 2008 13:42 Showtime! wrote: The guy didn't even look to see who was active. Dumbest move ever. did you even READ my post? | ||
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Think about what that implies. | ||
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On March 20 2008 13:45 Showtime! wrote: Not only that he didn't even look to see who !@#$%! voted beforehand. He killed someone who wasn't even still in the game = uncool especially with all the damage he could have done. I'm quoting this post also for future reference. | ||
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I'm not going to lynch anyone that voted because that would eliminate a somewhat active player. | ||
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If you keep doing that I'm just going to assume your Mafia and hope you get lynched very soon. Also, Townies as I stated before I've already been role blocked by the Saboteur. No extra votes, no double lynch. I have a voting power total of 6, with 5 extras. | ||
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On March 20 2008 14:15 Showtime! wrote: How many votes were there again? 111? Odds are almost the entire mob is playing. Didn't the organizer already say that he made a waiting list, so if people didn't vote or abstrain they would be in the game instead? In other words the other people got cut. Chances are it would have been better to go with a few other people's hunches or discussed it with the group first. how about this for better logic: Odds are anyone with a good role is playing the game and voting, especially being that majority of them got vanilla townies. So odds are I hit Mafia trying to lay low or a vanilla townie who just gave up on playing. I took a chance and just happened to hit a blue. Really thats just tough luck but if Inc didn't post at all nevertheless vote or abstain how does that help us? | ||
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The Bodyguard Plan (fully revised) This is a strategy I've used in the past to win games, and it works very well if even a slight majority of the main players involved use it. The base of this plan lends itself to the fact that no innocent Townie knows for sure who else is innocent or what roles they are. Also is the fact that the main disadvantage the Town has is lack of information, whereas our main advantage is numbers. Combining these two things is the Bodyguard Plan. At the start of the game, the only non-Mafia/elected roles that any other player can possibly know for sure is a Bodyguard. The Mayor receives this info once elected into office. This plan is best with an innocent Mayor, but it also forces a Mafia Mayor to help the town in the event he/she is ever elected. When the Mayor is elected, their first plan of action should be to PM all the Bodyguards each other's identities. This pus information into the hands of the Townies that is critical. Assume there are 7 bodyguards. The Mayor PMs all of them the identity of the other 6. All of them then PM each other to 1: confirm they got a PM stating they are the bodyguard from the Mayor 2: make sure they ALL have the same list of Bodyguards In the case of an Innocent Mayor doing this, we have 7 townies all on the same side off the jump and this will be a major help to the Town if they all know the roles of 6 other innocents asap. In the case of a Mafia Mayor he could actually try and add a Mafia member to the list of Bodyguards or ignore a real Bodyguard - and this is where the true failsafe in the plan comes in. Failsafe: Remember, all Bodyguards SHOULD get that PM. If any of the Bodyguards don't get it then they should know something is clearly fishy and should investigate hastily. The Mayor would be investigated from Day 1, so the Town will know for sure if he/she is innocent or not which will allow the Bodyguards to know they can or can't trust the Mayor. If the Mayor turns out dirty, the Bodyguards will clearly speak up asap. If the Mayor is legit, then that Bodyguard list is 100% legit and ensures we have a solid base to start from because the Detectives stay silent. In summary the idea of this plan is self checking: Bodyguards are checked by each other and Mayor with the PMs Mayor is checked by Detectives Detectives stay silent if the Mayor is legit, and speak up if he is Mafia If ANY Detective speaks up against the Mayor and we can't decide whether or not who to believe, we go to the ultimatum approach - just lynch the DT first and if he is telling the truth the Mayor is Mafia. Boom - Mafia Mayor gone by the second day. If the Mayor tends to be Mafia and releases a corrupted list, then the BGs will speak up and name the people on the list. The DTs paying attention to this, investigate the names. The Mafia will have added just thrown some of their members into a trap and will get figured out eventually. In the case of an innocent Mayor this 100% guarantees us safety, in the case of a Mafia Mayor it takes us at worst 2 days to clean up the mess. This is my plan of action to start the game off. In the event the list is released publicly, the best part of this plan is that the spotlight is taken off of the Detectives and put on the Bodyguards. This allows the Detectives to stay quiet, and for the Medics to have a list of people they need to watch. Remember what I stated earlier - the Town's main disadvantage is that we lack information and this plan serves to rectify that while maximizing our main advantage - numbers. Once the base has been formed (Mayors + Bodyguards) we can start generating a list of suspects together, and figuring out roles down the road. To succeed the Town needs a strong start, and this plan is one of such. Once you are assured of my innocence through the Detective's silence, then you should PM me your roles so we can get started. | ||
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On March 20 2008 14:21 Showtime! wrote: The only players playing are those who voted or abstrained from voting. Read the damn rules, God. Chuiu did not remove anyone from the game yet so I thought ALL players were fair game. I read the rules but since Chuiu left them all there is it wrong for me to think that surely any of them can still be playing? You really are irritating. And like I said I'm not lynching anyone based off of 1 night of clues. The reason I didn't even bother to look at any of the people posting is because if I ended up lynching an Innocent who just happened to be stupid, the backlash would have been worse than it is now. The ONLY reason people are upset is because Inc turned out to be blue instead of green. I say we just move on with the plan and stop trying to be disgruntled. It's only adding confusion and a bad start. This is the last time I'm addressing this. | ||
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The plan has already been put into motion, and already a few surprising things have come up. | ||
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Shallow I cant reveal that info right now, just know a lot of PMs have come in | ||
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It's just really interesting because I have a lot of faith in the town's ability. Some of the townies (if they really are) are really very clever individuals. | ||
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On March 20 2008 15:04 ahrara_ wrote: Well, I still don't think you're worth trusting even with strats and suspicions. Alven: I sure as hell hope detectives aren't revealing their roles to him. If the Detectives investigate me, then reveal their roles to me and see I'm innocent then why wouldn't they PM me? | ||
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Either he acts in the best interest of the Town and is fucked if he doesn't, and/or we double guess his every move and see how he votes and who he doesn't vote for. But, it's usually a good idea to kill a Mafia Mayor asap once they've been found out. | ||
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The town can play mind games too | ||
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All bodyguards have been contacted and all their info exchanged. Not all DTs have confirmed anything with me yet, I think some of them are still waiting or sleeping. I still have to verify them all at some point anyway, that'll take time but I've already got a plan for that. | ||
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No extra voting power or double lynches for me today. So I only have a vote count of 1, not 6 for today. | ||
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No one is a prime suspect right now, until I start getting more info and the first night's lynches happen there isn't anyone even close to the chopping block. | ||
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Right now, I think that should be our main focus. No matter who dies tonight, if we already have a list of suspects, coupled with the information I am receiving we'll save a lot of time and hopefully lives with tomorrow's lynch. | ||
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actually it's a sound strategy. Shit stirrers are no benefit to the town, and if we make it clear we'd lynch them they would shape up. If they continue to behave that way we have no choice but to think they are Mafia and get rid of them. | ||
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On March 21 2008 02:00 Falcynn wrote: Also if anyone wants to check out the clue interpretations/suspicions that have already been posted, I got them right here Edit: fixed broken links Sonuvbob's list of people he thinks are mafia+his reasoning http://teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=67925¤tpage=57#1132 Shallow[bay]'s list of all the people that the code names can relate to http://teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=67925¤tpage=31#602 Reason people think Ghar could be mafia. http://teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=67925¤tpage=20#391 IMO some pretty good interpretations by xDark.Carnivalx http://teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=67925¤tpage=23#456 More interpretations of what the code names could mean by Meta. http://teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=67925¤tpage=20#392 Clues from ShadowDrgn, these deal more with the dialog/action of the day post rather than the code names. http://teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=67925¤tpage=48#958 Sureshot posting some of his thoughts in a blog http://teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=68254 thanks a ton | ||
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1.) Once all the Townies start PMing me, if any roles clash there's an issue 2.) There's room for 76 townies, and even then with inactives if too many Mafia tried to claim vanilla, that strengthens the validity of the blues that PM me giving us an easier time 3.) Everyone doesn't need to be investigated 4.) With a killing power of 9, after 2 days lets say around 24 people died (vigis and lynchings). By then, it would be really clear who some of the Mafia are. Really, I'd only be worried if we hit Day 3 with 0 dead mafia and almost all our blues gone. | ||
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It'll help me a lot | ||
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On March 21 2008 03:23 qrs wrote: You're joking, right? In case you aren't: how could it possibly help you? Ok for a second I'm going to put myself in the shoes of a Mafia member talking strategy with all his cohorts. I see the bodyguard plan and realize that false claiming BG or DT early in the game will 100% lead to me being investigated soon no matter what. So I instead wait until no one accuses the Mayor who I know is innocent, and then start sending in role PMs. 3 things happen here that can benefit Mafia: 1.) Not enough people sent in the same role PM (blue) so I look legit enough 2.) I claim a vanilla townie (green) and no one else is sending in PMs anyway so why waste an investigation on me 3. ) There are a lot of greens anyway so chances are I'm not found out So I devised a counter-strategy that also falls in line with the BG plan: If I ask everyone to PM me (and they should once they realize I'm legit) then the Mafia plan is crushed, because they 1.) can't risk sending in a blue PM this is a major advantage to the town. If they send in a false blue PM and I ask them to do something and stuff doesn't add up they are caught. If they don't send in a false blue PM that just makes the real blues look legit (all add up) and I'm 100% sure they are real and can use them to the best abilities. 2.) send in vanilla PMs seriously, if I end up with a list of 90 something vanillas and few blues I essentially just cut off all 34 or so blue roles out the suspect list. Either way, the act of forcing everyone to PM me makes the Mafia have to think about the path they'll take their chances with, and I have methods for dealing with both paths. | ||
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On March 21 2008 03:37 LucasWoJ wrote: It would still help with the slightest screw-up from the mafia. Say four detectives send a PM to Ace revealing their roles. One mafioso decides to become a detective for the sake of the PM. Bam, we've got a smaller suspect list. It's easier to look into the Day posts and find clues for 5 people than 130. And that is one of our prime strategies right now. Remember I already said we don't need to investigate 100+ people. If someone screws up in a group of 7, all we need to do is apply the clues to that group and confirm things with an investigation if need be. | ||
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On March 21 2008 03:42 qrs wrote: IOW, let's just save some time and agree that no PM = claim to be a towny. this idea makes no sense. No PM also means Mafia members just never have to worry about contacting me, and then they also know that not every townie has PM'd me so it's easier for them to just lay low and not get caught lying. If everyone has to PM me, eventually I'll catch some role clashes and some lies. | ||
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On March 21 2008 03:49 fusionsdf wrote: what guessing would they have to do lol? empyrean being alive is a much bigger burden for us than for them no it isn't. Mynock's logic makes sense. Whether or not Empyrean is a DT or not the only people that would really benefit from his death right now are Mafia if he isn't one. They have the option of leaving his suspicion to us, or racking their brains trying to figure out if he really was a DT. If he really was, well then if they let him live he goes around unscathed doing his thing. Either way Empyrean isn't getting lynched by the town just yet. | ||
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If everyone sent me a PM saying their townie - GREAT. Now when all the blues PM me I know they all match up and are 100% confirmed. So now I knock 34 names off the suspect list, incorporate them into the network and all suspects are also on the "vanilla townie" list. A PM that tells me "hi I'm townie" holds a lot of weight. | ||
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Also, I already have ideas on ho to confirm people. I don't need all 100+ players, and yes even the silent ones are going to get fished out. I'm guessing Mafia have some silent members, some that only vote, and surely some posting in this thread actively to try and mess things up. | ||
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On March 21 2008 04:42 Lysithea wrote: Exactly what I want to avoid, losing because of a lucky move by mafia would suck. Ace says he can prevent that however. Can't really figure out how, guess I'll know by the time we have Ace confirmed and pms start flowing. I just want the secure group to be as secure it can get, with no holes in the path securing it first of all, even the people who I think are legit won't know any other persons roles. The only people that would have that list are myself and the Bodyguards. | ||
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On March 21 2008 04:41 nemY wrote: Well I don't want to die, so just thought I'd clarify that for everyone to see that I am in fact a townie. You do realize declaring you are a townie is a very selfish move right? Either you're trying to confuse mafia, or your mafia hoping we don't lynch you and serving as a distraction. It's stunts like this that I would rather have gotten a PM. | ||
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On March 21 2008 05:14 HeRoS)Pink wrote: I did like to know how many mafioso voted for Ace but thats probably to much to ask cant do that, check the rules @ziel: It's been how many days now? Come on, people have got to be playing by now or the town would be as good as dead from the get go. | ||
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how so? sacrificing themselves to save the town from a corrupt Mayor? I don't see the problem. | ||
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On March 21 2008 05:25 OneBlueAugust wrote: This may have been clarified earlier, but activity is judged not just by forum posts, right? I've been relatively active in PMs, as I feel that's the only wise way to express my thoughts at the moment, but I haven't posted here yet at all. voting counts as activity too. But soon, people that just don't do anything BUT vote will obviously be suspected. | ||
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Once tomorrow comes and the voting starts, a lot of the Townies will have their minds made up and know where to go from there. | ||
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Of course I'll always try and explain all my votes as best as I can. | ||
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On March 22 2008 06:40 Showtime! wrote: No, but Empyrean is a sexy beast. They kill him off and then we're down one sexy beast. you mean...we don't have anymore? | ||
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Hold on for a while. And by now all of you should realize I'm innocent. | ||
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Sadly, neither Yogurt or CTStalker ever pm'd me so I couldn't even get them protected even by chance | ||
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On March 22 2008 13:43 Caller wrote: It seems to me that yogurt the mad jack put a bomb on CTStalker. yea I think so too | ||
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Why in gods name did anyone suspect Stalker. Didn't we all say until Day 2 has clues posted that NO ONE is suspect? This shit actually makes me kinda pissed :/ | ||
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EVERYONE PM me their roles. I think it's pretty obvious to everyone that I'm innocent now. We lost 2 blues tonight, and sadly one of them was a Jack. Neither of those 2 players ever PM'd me and if this trend keeps on going myself and the others that are 100% innocent will be playing with incomplete info. | ||
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On March 22 2008 14:01 ShadowDrgn wrote: Yogurt did the right thing. He could only plant one bomb a night but could remove them at any time so the best strategy was to plant a bomb on the most suspicious person, which was CTStalker. Yogurt being randomly killed and CTStalker being a Jack were both really bad luck, just like your lynching of incontrol. Good strategy, bad luck. ... If I was a mad hatter, and I was in a town of 70 I wouldnt put a bomb on anyone at all until I had 100% proof or AT LEAST discussed it with the people that had more info than myself that I knew had to be 100% innocent. What if mafia had hit one of my bodyguards AND Stalker was also a bodyguard? see how quickly things could get shitty if everyone plays selfish? | ||
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Really, if all the medics would have PM'd me b4 acting (we had AGES) I think for sure Mynock would have lived. | ||
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Some good news - I think we've got about 3, possibly 4 Mafia in the crosshairs right now. That doesn't mean they'll be lynched today (as of now), but we're going to be gathering a lot of info soon. Also, not all of the detectives have PM'd me. I'm still waiting on more. Everyone should be sending me their roles right now, it's obvious I'm innocent | ||
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Went to sleep at 11am Eastern Time | ||
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<---eating chicken right now | ||
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I know that could just be a Mafia ploy to lay low, but it explains why I won't use my vote to lynch him right now. But keep investigating, you guys are helping me a lot with your PMs and public discussion a lot more than you know. Once again, since it's obvious I'm innocent right now PM me your role and any other relevant information if asap even if you're a vanilla townie because it helps! | ||
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I'll be leaving sometime soon, but a Mafia member is getting lynched today for sure unless someone messes up. | ||
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Even vanilla townies, it's helping a lot. | ||
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On March 23 2008 12:21 Falcynn wrote: Wait...I'm confused, does this mean that you want us to retract our votes from Ghar? I'm asking because that second part makes it sound like we're voting correctly, but you're telling us to withdraw... I'm asking everyone retract votes because when the suspect is confirmed, I want everyone to vote the exact same. And I don't want Ghar to be even near the chopping block and get lynched because people "forgot to sign on in time to change their vote". | ||
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On March 23 2008 04:59 Falcynn wrote: Just throwing this out there to Ace since he probably has his own plans, but maybe you can have one of the detectives ask Chuiu if the whole using Mynocks dismembered head as a flail is a clue that corresponds to Ghar. You don't have a limit to those kinds of questions I believe, so it wouldn't be much of a waste. will do | ||
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On March 23 2008 13:00 Kau wrote: So Ace, by what time will you be able to tell us who we should vote for? (approximately) hopefully when I get back home all my stuff will be finished (going partying again tonight). | ||
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Yes, this is part of my plan | ||
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In fact, I want to see what happens on Night 2. I think the Mafia are in a jam if we're lucky ^_^ | ||
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On March 23 2008 18:52 Scorch wrote: i will not retract my vote for Ghar yet. i'm 80% convinced of his guilt, and even if he's inactive, it's still a mafia kill. my vote will remain until Ace rationally convinces me of a better target and explains to me his reasoning. post or PM me your strategic plan and i may comply. i trust and support you, but not blindly. I'll explain it fully once I get this new information. As to the other post, if everyone tried to retract their votes but a few didn't and got an innocent lynched even better - I just ask a DT to ask Chuiu how many Mafia voted in that lynch and well that's a pretty good trade. | ||
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I've answered this question like 5 times throughout the thread already. I still don't have all Detectives though, I'm trying to work with the ones I have though. | ||
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Remaining Vigilantes please PM me before Night time arrives. | ||
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We've been over this about 50 times about why that would be ridiculously bad. Honestly, asking something like that I'm not sure if you're Mafia just getting desperate or what because you know that you guys messed up and that we are on to you. I've purposely not been posting in public too much information because I didn't have to. But certain people are not responding to my messages even though I gave them ample time, so in about 2 hours I'll be very close to releasing the first suspect list which I'm sure contains Mafia. Basically, any of the people who don't respond within that time limit will be publicly thrown up for execution. | ||
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If they are innocent, then they are screwing themselves over because it's been WAY too long for them not to either do they say they were going to do or respond to PMs. | ||
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On March 24 2008 05:07 HeRoS)Pink wrote: rolf, this mayor is a joke, theres like 6-7 hours left for the vote and still nothign from him, poeple will not check 1 hour before the final countdown to see who to vote, (some poeple will probably be away since its Easter's holiday like, I'm seriously close to asking the town to lynch you. This has got to be at least the 4th time you've stated something obviously so stupid whether you are Innocent or not the town would be better off without you. And here's why I'm calling you out: Anyone with any sense realizes I'm trying to save an innocent life that obviously hasn't PM'd me back. And we all know there's not a lot of time before the vote closes. So I'm thinking your Mafia because you're always on my nuts and you know that the voting is going to close soon. You also know I'm not going to get that PM I need. And you also know that the info you sent me is the only reason I'd think about not asking for you to be killed (you'd be wrong on that account). I'm willing to drop my current lead and just ask everyone to vote for you and French_Toast because of the shit you guys have been doing. As an aside for the town, here's the PM convo between myself and French_Toast: ----------------------------------------- Original Message: now you really gotta stfu on the thread because you're becoming really annoying. And by the way your innocence has not been proven yet, detectives wont speak up and you haven't voted with your "disabled" vote count. And you protecting ghar like that makes me really suspicious, voting for inactive people without relevant clues = bad idea. To: French_Toast Subject: Re: my role Date: 3/24/08 04:58 stop bitching. If my innocence hasn't been proven yet in your eyes so be it, but don't come at me talking a bunch of shit. If you feel that way, post it publicly and stop acting like a fucking moron. His PM makes no damn sense, because when have I voted? I haven't. He either is not reading the thread or Mafia trying to cause confusion. As of now, I ask the townies to match clues up on Heros)Pink and French_Toast. Do as you guys please with your votes until I get this information, because honestly if either of these 2 die and turn up innocent it's not going to hurt us. We've been through this a thousand times and you fucktards still keep spewing shit which makes me think you'd have to be Mafia despite the big fucking signs that say STOP CAUSING CONFUSION EVEN WHEN WE ALL ALREADY KNOW WHATS GOING ON. | ||
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On March 24 2008 05:33 RtS)Night[Mare wrote: are we lynching heros)pink or french_toast over the ghar clue? NO WAY? what the hell? | ||
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I'm trying to confirm one of my DTs. So I asked the person to check out another person who's role I obviously already know. All my other DTs passed this test, so the last DT has to do this also. That person hasn't responded so I'm very close to lynching them because I think they can't figure out what it is (obviously because they aren't a DT). | ||
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Everything will be clear soon. | ||
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On March 24 2008 05:49 Falcynn wrote: Wait...so now all of the DT's have no more role checks? I mean it's nice to have everyone confirmed, and I guess this is probably the best way to do it, but using up their role checks this quickly seems like it may cost us later. However if they/you use their other skills correctly I guess it shouldn't be a problem. Just voicing my concerns. I'm going to ignore this post only because I would end up revealing how the inner workings of the DT's checked out. | ||
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On March 24 2008 05:52 JeeJee wrote: well it's not like it takes any longer than a few minutes ... it would be pretty stupid to be waiting on a reply from someone who's sleeping from say 2;00KST to 10;00KST Thats the thing, they can't still be sleeping. I sent them something so long ago I think they are laying low. | ||
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Basically even if we messed this up, I'd know who the liar was and ask a Vigi to kill that person tonight. I don't 100% believe Ghar is innocent or guilty, but I'm not going to lynch him when finding out this info right now would save us a lot of trouble. | ||
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On March 24 2008 06:02 ahrara_ wrote: Are you investigating Ghar at least? I read your post from before, but I think Ghar's clue is a much more "sure fire" case. I think for the sake of your credibility, you should encourage Ghar's lynching. Yea I will, but since I can't do a double lynch it would make no sense to reveal info that gets 2 ppl in crossfires just yet, because I'd have to reveal something else also. | ||
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Everyone vote for Mandalor to be lynched. | ||
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So I asked Mandalor a question, and he would have confirmed something for me if he did respond, but it's been forever and I'm waiting for a response. If he's innocent, that would just be really rotten luck because he said he'd get back to me asap but hasn't so I think he is laying low just because. If we lynch him and he turns out innocent, I'll just lynch the people that lied to me about him. | ||
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On March 24 2008 06:33 ahrara_ wrote: I'm voting for Mandalor, but if it doesn't work out I'm not going to follow you on blind faith anymore. I hope you get a vigilante on Ghar. Ok put yourself in my shoes. You have a situation where 2 ppl are caught and 1 of them is lying. One of those people responds with something that shows they are somewhat legit, and the other never responds. And one of these 2 have to be guilty, and it's been a long time and the other person never said they'd be gone for so long. What would you do? | ||
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On March 24 2008 06:33 ZBiR wrote: And how many is that? I don't think this information would benefit mafia at all, so you can tell. 2 | ||
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Nice guess though EVERYONE VOTE FOR MANDALOR HE IS CONFIRMED MAFIA | ||
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VOTE FOR MANDALOR | ||
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iirc, Ghar is one of the top suspects? Can you guys start posting lists of your top 5 suspects each and some reasons why? Heros)Pink and Frenchie are obviously at the top of my list for being way too annoying. | ||
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On March 24 2008 08:45 Naib wrote: I don't suspect Pink or French, I'd say they're just stirring cr*p immaturely. At this point thats a good enough reason to get rid of them both. | ||
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I guess they don't want me influencing their powers, and will act like true Vigi's and kill off whoever they want to. Let's pray they don't hit innocents. | ||
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And it keeps igging me that they are so adamantly against me even at this point in time. They cause confusion and in every Mafia game I've played, some Mafia are sitting around just to confuse people and so far those 2 sure are acting like it. They are smart enough to know that confusing the Town is the quickest way to kill us all. They also know that this town has been in general, pretty orderly. And they still do it? it just irks me and doesn't seem right. | ||
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He was a servant to The God, but turned good after slaying so many dragons. I think the Goddesses name was Minerva, I've got to check again. | ||
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On March 24 2008 10:46 Chezinu wrote: What if the other two detectives were mafia and Mandalor was the only true one? That would be so funny! it sure would, except Mandalor sent me a PM where we were taunting each other, and how he got caught. | ||
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some of you haven't confirmed - ok. Please, please dont kill anyone tonight unless you discuss it with me first. I'd hate for another Mad Hatter moment. | ||
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I communicate with them 5 times as much as with the blues. If you guys could see the PMs I get you'd probably explode. | ||
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Out of the 58 people that voted to lynch Mandalor, 10 are Mafia List: Mandalor - 58 Ace Showtime! ShaLLoW[baY] qrs clazziquai ahrara_ Falcynn ZBiR unsoundlogic BWdero GeneralStan Scorch nemY MidnightGladius decafchicken L Empyrean Eti307 suresh0t randombum Lysithea French_Toast New104 Kau Artanis[Xp] Ninja4ever. Naib JeeJee Hittegods SoleSteeler Romance_us Plexa LucasWoJ Caller Fishball RtS)Night[Mare Jimtudor GranDim Lenwe Alethios NatsuTerran 0cz3c Last Romantic zeks Pangolin SpiritoftheTuna Unforgiven_ve Energies BloodyC0bbler iNfuNdiBuLuM SoMuchBetter Camlito bumatlarge fanatacist ieatkids5 ~OpZ~ SonuvBob Siefu butidigress | ||
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Yea, we've had a Medic crisis. But not only that, we have a Vet crisis also. So at least 2 Mafia are lying about their roles. Mandalor claimed to know the role of the person I asked him to check, and well good luck to them. That person is going to be protected anyway, and they can try and suicide bomber him if they please (good luck). So they know that we know they have a lying medic, and they also know we know they have a lying Vet. So tonight's Medic assignments will be setup very carefully. There are some sure fire townies that are targets, and there are some that will be highly protected. There are also some that I think they don't want to hit because it would surely make some of them look guilty. And tonight, Vigis are on the loose. This will be a big night for both sides. Right now, we are waiting for news on the people that voted for Ghar before making any crazy decisions. | ||
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So we have a list of 58 people, 10 are MAfia and we know some of the sure fire innocents on that list. After the information on Ghar comes in, we'll also look at the people who did not cast a vote. | ||
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Uma Thurman Beatrix Kiddo / Black Mamba / The Bride David Carradine Bill / Snake Charmer Lucy Liu O-Ren Ishii / Cottonmouth Michael Madsen Budd / Sidewinder Eddie could refer to Edward Bunker. He was a former criminal/troublesome child that became an author and also had a small part in Reservoir Dogs. Michael Madsen as Mr. Blonde Chris Penn as "Nice Guy" Eddie Cabot Steve Buscemi as Mr. Pink Edward Bunker as Mr. Blue Hope this helps | ||
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Ghar - 7 useLess aZnvaLiaNce ShadowDrgn Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm Evilmonkey. Out of these 7 people, 1 of them is Mafia. Also, the fact that only 1 Mafia voted to lynch Ghar does not look too good for him. The only plausible explanation is that they all switched to voting for Mandalor and left 1 of their guys on this list so we couldnt have 6 innocents off the bat. | ||
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On March 25 2008 00:43 ZBiR wrote: But you see, it is already obvious that the town is at Ace's will, so when he commanded us to vote Mandalor, he could be sure to bite the bullet. This means mafia should, and probably did, jump in at any time. Right, which is what we hoped. Thats why I asked everyone to retract votes for Ghar, we basically wanted a "Master list" with a sure fire # of Mafia on it confirmed. That way when people start dying, we have something to cross check everything against. Now we have that list. They know we have the list. And now they have to pick targets carefully. I'm betting they go after some of the people on the Abstained list. | ||
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I got some interesting information about centering around Mandalor's death. Check this out: ### Mandalor Germany. March 24 2008 03:15. Posts 1164 PM Profile Blog Quote I abstain as well. ### ### Ace United States. March 24 2008 06:21. Posts 1938 PM Profile Quote well then how about this. Everyone vote for Mandalor to be lynched. ### I revealed this at 6:21 on March 24th. Smurfingchobo already voted for Mandalor on the 23rd. If he's mafia, then the mafia's game plan might be to vote against each other. ### smurfingchobo March 23 2008 20:45. Posts 527 PM Profile Quote I change my vote from abstain to Mandalor. ### I thought that was an interesting vote (a day before) because no one had mentioned him as a suspect, and I couldn't find any clues leading to him. To sum up, basically smurfingchobo voted on Mandalor way before I even brought him up. This is odd because even when we knew Mandalor was Mafia, we couldn't even find a single clue that implicated him. What do you guys think about this? Someone did some nice work | ||
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I have a notepad file of initial impressions of everyone in the game, here is the entry for araav: araav - ran for mayor on ridiculous pretenses | ||
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On March 25 2008 01:37 ZBiR wrote: Uhm... no. He voted (probably abstained) before you pointed Mandalor, then after you accused Mandalor, he changed his post from before. That's how I see it. Sorry I should have expounded this point. I sent Mandalor the PM to tell me the info way b4 I accused him publicly. smurf voted for Mandalor a little bit before that time. We're just interested in how he voted for the guy when there were no clues pointing to him, even when we knew he was Mafia and couldn't find a thing. | ||
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being able to write a script doesn't help you win Mafia games. It was ridiculous, and it just irks me people even thought about seriously going a long with it. It's like a bandwagon of Mafia members looking for the simplest idea to gather votes, when he's found out Mayor position gets smashed. | ||
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I'm interested to hear about this araav stuff though. | ||
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On March 25 2008 01:48 qrs wrote: In these games, clues can help find mafiosi and having a master list of profiles and relevant info seems like it should be very helpful in matching the clues with people. Put it this way: maybe I'm overrating it, but if I was Mafia, I would prefer not to have a master list like that out there. If araav hadn't done it? Maybe someone else would have. Maybe not. Thats the thing, several people have already done it. It would have been done so how does that skill help to catch Mafia? | ||
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On March 25 2008 02:10 Ghar wrote: Medic role claimers, from a mafia perspective, so long as they avoid the names they've been sent to protect, they strengthen the notion that they are legit medics. almost. If they have to kill a certain target I ask them to protect things get tricky. They don't know how many other medics are protecting that target, or if they are the only one. They also cant chance a suicide bomber since they can't find the prime target. ^_^ | ||
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On March 25 2008 02:14 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote: Hey cool, what was your initial impression of me? btw, sick job on the lynching Shallow[Bay] - very off the wall, but is posting clues which helps. He may be a hidden weapon against Mafia if he would stop being so crazy. | ||
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This is the plan for the next Day(he person who came up with this idea will remain anonymous, i just improved on it a bit). We know that from the Ghar List, 1 out of 7 of these people are Mafia: Ghar List - 7 useLess aZnvaLiaNce ShadowDrgn Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm Evilmonkey What I'm asking for is for these 7 people to split their votes. The top 3 will vote for randombum tomorrow, and the bottom 4 will vote for myself. This way neither of us stands a very good chance to get lynched tomorrow and we can see who's what. Once the list is split, we'll count check them both again. So it should look like this: randombum - 3 useLess aZnvaLiaNce ShadowDrgn Ace -4 Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm Evilmonkey If you do not follow this idea, we'll have no choice but to think you're Mafia and autovote to lynch you. I'll be PMing all of you later with this info. I'm also posting this WAY early so no one has the excuse that they did not see it. In addition to that plan, we'll also be splitting the Mandalor Vote. The top 29(excluding me) will vote on Suspect#1 and the bottom 29 will vote on Suspect#2. These suspects will be revealed after tonight. Just like above, anyone who doesn't follow the plan we have no choice but to cast suspicion on them. Double count the #s because my counting may be off. Here's the list: Suspect#1 -29 Showtime! ShaLLoW[baY] qrs clazziquai ahrara_ Falcynn ZBiR unsoundlogic BWdero GeneralStan Scorch nemY MidnightGladius decafchicken L Empyrean Eti307 suresh0t randombum Lysithea French_Toast New104 Kau Artanis[Xp] Ninja4ever. Naib JeeJee Hittegods SoleSteeler Suspect#2 -29 Romance_us Plexa LucasWoJ Caller Fishball RtS)Night[Mare Jimtudor GranDim Lenwe Alethios NatsuTerran 0cz3c Last Romantic zeks Pangolin SpiritoftheTuna Unforgiven_ve Energies BloodyC0bbler iNfuNdiBuLuM SoMuchBetter Camlito bumatlarge fanatacist ieatkids5 ~OpZ~ SonuvBob Siefu butidigress People on the abstain list or that didn't vote can do what they want. This, along with the way medic protections have been setup tonight will give the mafia a difficult time with targets if they haven't already sent in their hitlist. No matter who dies tonight, this plan will be carried out. Any questions, comments or concerns let them be known. Once again, if you go against this plan we have no choice but to cast suspicions on you. | ||
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If anyone hopped on a bandwagon to lynch me when it's so obvious I'm innocent, one of the DTs will count check the list, and if I'm dead speak up and reveal the mafia count. Then we'd cross check all lists and pick them out. So yea, they can do it if they please. | ||
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On March 25 2008 04:08 Dr.Dragoon wrote: Sucks if those guys miss the post. next vote wont be for a long time. So I'm going to PM everyone. If anybody says they didnt get the PM, didnt read it, or didnt check the thread that would be a far stretch. Not checking blatantly obvious important info for that long? I dont think so. | ||
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On March 25 2008 04:10 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote: This part just made me think that you'd forgotten that the Pardoner role actually has some use :p I don't honestly think 4 votes will be enough to lynch you either. thats why I asked for randombum to be voted on. I dont know if he's 100% innocent now but that doesn't matter, 3 or 4 votes wont be enough to lynch either of us. I'll also still have my 6 votes tomorrow. Unless they role block me again, oh well | ||
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On March 25 2008 05:45 aZnvaLiaNce wrote: *Back to being serious* OK, basically what Ace is doing is herding the mafia into different, smaller pens (wow, for a moment there I almost typed penis). By doing that, we, as the town, can better deduce who is mafia from a smaller pool of choices via detective ability. Great thinking. I say we dub it "The Pig Pen Plan" | ||
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On March 25 2008 06:07 qrs wrote: Comment/concern: Sounds like a plan, but it should not come at the expense of lynching a mafioso tomorrow. Right now, as far as I'm concerned, Ghar is the prime suspect, at least until a detective tells us that the severed head did not point to him. If Ghar is suspect #1 or suspect #2, or if there is a stronger case pointing to them than to Ghar, I'll go along with the vote. The reason why is because investigating Ghar whether he is innocent or not right now only gets us 1 possible Mafia, whereas this method gets us 11. | ||
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On March 25 2008 06:28 Kau wrote: Do you have enough suspects to just split the big group into 4 groups of 14 or 15 people? Because the 1 out of 7 in the other "pen" is already a pretty good ratio to work with. possibly | ||
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Update This is the plan for the next Day(he person who came up with this idea will remain anonymous, i just improved on it a bit). We know that from the Ghar List, 1 out of 7 of these people are Mafia: Ghar List - 7 useLess aZnvaLiaNce ShadowDrgn Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm Evilmonkey What I'm asking for is for these 7 people to split their votes. The top 3 will vote for randombum tomorrow, and the bottom 4 will vote for myself. This way neither of us stands a very good chance to get lynched tomorrow and we can see who's what. Once the list is split, we'll count check them both again. So it should look like this: randombum - 3 useLess aZnvaLiaNce ShadowDrgn Ace -4 Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm Evilmonkey If you do not follow this idea, we'll have no choice but to think you're Mafia and autovote to lynch you. I'll be PMing all of you later with this info. I'm also posting this WAY early so no one has the excuse that they did not see it. In addition to that plan, we'll also be splitting the Mandalor Vote. The top 29(excluding me) will vote on Suspect#1 and the bottom 29 will vote on Suspect#2. These suspects will be revealed after tonight. Just like above, anyone who doesn't follow the plan we have no choice but to cast suspicion on them. Double count the #s because my counting may be off. Here's the list: Suspect#1 -29 Showtime! ShaLLoW[baY] qrs clazziquai ahrara_ Falcynn ZBiR unsoundlogic BWdero GeneralStan Scorch nemY MidnightGladius decafchicken L Empyrean Eti307 suresh0t randombum Lysithea French_Toast New104 Kau Artanis[Xp] Ninja4ever. Naib JeeJee Hittegods SoleSteeler Suspect#2 -29 Romance_us Plexa LucasWoJ Caller Fishball RtS)Night[Mare Jimtudor GranDim Lenwe Alethios NatsuTerran 0cz3c Last Romantic zeks Pangolin SpiritoftheTuna Unforgiven_ve Energies BloodyC0bbler iNfuNdiBuLuM SoMuchBetter Camlito bumatlarge fanatacist ieatkids5 ~OpZ~ SonuvBob Siefu butidigress People on the abstain list or that didn't vote can do what they want. This, along with the way medic protections have been setup tonight will give the mafia a difficult time with targets if they haven't already sent in their hitlist. No matter who dies tonight, this plan will be carried out. Any questions, comments or concerns let them be known. Once again, if you go against this plan we have no choice but to cast suspicions on you. | ||
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After tonight though, I think it's going to get very dirty. | ||
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Thursday night I'll be gone for a bit. Friday night I might be gone all night and morning, not sure yet. Saturday I'll be gone for sure for a long time sarting around 7 or 8 pm. I'll be throwing a party that doesn't end until 5 or 6am the next morning. | ||
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Also on clues - the Kill Bill theme. Uma Thurman - Beatrix Kiddo / Black Mamba / The Bride David Carradine - Bill / Snake Charmer Lucy Liu - O-Ren Ishii / Cottonmouth Michael Madsen - Budd / Sidewinder Eddie could refer to Edward Bunker. He was a former criminal/troublesome child that became an author and also had a small part in Reservoir Dogs. Reservoir Dogs roles: Michael Madsen as Mr. Blonde Chris Penn as "Nice Guy" Eddie Cabot Steve Buscemi as Mr. Pink Edward Bunker as Mr. Blue Instead of checking for the code names, maybe check people's profiles for anything that pops up in relations to the actors/actresses that played those roles. | ||
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On March 25 2008 12:43 aZnvaLiaNce wrote: Getting ass three days in a row? You are indulging yourself, sir. Hahaha.. Have fun, though. A mayor deserves a good drink or two when he's on fire (not literally) hey someone's gotta lay the pipe on the town prostitutes | ||
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good luck man | ||
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I think Mafia are only keeping you alive just to see your posts | ||
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On March 25 2008 14:28 qrs wrote: Do you have any reason besides him not PMing his role? You can't have gotten PMs from all the green townies. I agree that abstaining instead of voting Mandalor (if wurm did that after you posted to vote for Mandalor) is slightly suspicious, but I don't see almost-certainty. On another subject: a comment about the latest detective plan. Instead of spending a detection on the 7 people who voted for Ghar (since only 1/7 are mafia--less than the overall percentage, and only 1 mafioso total), have you considered going after the larger pool of people instead? Put it differently: you mentioned two groups: a group of 58 with 10 mafiosi (1/5.8) and a group of 7 containing 1 mafioso (1/7). You neglected the final group: a group of 58 with 9 mafiosi (1/6.4). Why not get to work on this group? We divide them in half (more or less) every turn, so the sooner we start on the large groups, the better. we've thought about it. The reason we are going into the group with 7, or at least heavily thinking about it is because that would also confirm 6 people as innocent for sure. It's not always about catching Mafia at some points | ||
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On March 25 2008 17:31 wurm wrote: So... hard... to... choose. Seriously though, just because i didn't pm a role to Ace isn't exactly concrete evidence. either way you're almost guaranteed to be Suspect #1 tomorrow. And I think you are being either incredibly stupid or suspicious. I'm going to explain why right now. This is so far, what I know about the Mafia kill list for night 1 looking like: 1.)Mynock 2.)goldenkrnboi 3.)NeaX 4.)Yogurt 5.)OneBlueAugust 6.)X 7.)Y 8.) 9.) 8 and 9 are unexplained, and possible that Mafia sent in more than 1 hit against one of those names. Out of X and Y, one of those names said they got a PM from you claiming to be a Paramedic. So that person survived one hit against them and lived, and got a PM from you saying you're a paramedic that protected them. Interesting. Because that same person also got another PM from another Paramedic claiming they also protected him. Strange. On the first night, the Mafia sent out a kill list with the same person listed TWICE instead of exercising full power? Doubt it. That kill list would look like this: 1.)Mynock 2.)goldenkrnboi 3.)NeaX 4.)Yogurt 5.)OneBlueAugust 6.)X 7.)Y 8.)Y 9.) So I posted that we've got a Medic problem, and PM'd you to ask you your role after you've been dodging the question for days and you still won't answer me. I think you're scum because at this point I doubt any townie would avoid something that would obviously clear up so much confusion. If you really are a medic, then the suspicion stays on you and Mafia probably wont kill you tonight. If you aren't a medic and a vigilante doesn't kill you tonight, then you are certainly on the chopping block tomorrow. And by that point I wouldn't really care what your role was because your excuse is bullshit. Good riddance ^_^ | ||
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wurm = Suspect #1 | ||
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Would it help if I told you one of the Vigi's might kill you tonight? | ||
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no problem on this end | ||
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On March 25 2008 17:49 Pangolin wrote: Well once mobsters like Mandalor and (allegedly) you stop making mistakes and outing yourselves to Ace it will be up to townies to dig up the clues for the detectives to investigate. Using the fact that Ace has a working plan is hardly a reason to disobey his orders. Especially since nothing is stopping you from digging up clues or accusing people based on strange actions just as you would in any other mafia game. Ace only has these foolproof ways to find mafia at the moment so he might as well take them. Eventually I assume he will need good clue interpretations. even when we knew Mandalor was guilty we tried to look at how the clues pointed him out. Either way wurm is blatantly acting too shady and his logic doesn't add up. Using the excuse that you dont like the way I'm playing the game doesn't mean anything. The townies were free to do as they please this whole time and I didn't even start making my plans public till recently. So I think you're bullshitting. If you really were a medic, too bad. You're getting lynched tomorrow or killed tonight by Mafia. | ||
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If you're innocent, oh well. There's nothing we can do now you've had a lot of time to prove your innocence. | ||
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On March 25 2008 17:49 wurm wrote: Then you just lost a medic. a medic who went 1/1 on the first night. Seems like I am good at analyzing who the mafia will hit, huh? Before that vigilante will lynch me, i'm pretty sure i can make it 2/2 since i already sent in my save to Chuiu. but who knows? if you sent in your save to Chuiu, how about you PM it to me then? If things match up maybe we'll reconsider what we're about to do. | ||
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On March 25 2008 18:13 Scorch wrote: i don't like this. i can't see any clues pointing towards wurm. i'm blackmailed to vote against wurm anyway because i'm in the first half of voters against mandalor. this sucks. if it makes you feel better we'll label wurm as suspect #2. | ||
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This has nothing to do with clues, and all to do with BEHAVIOR. The excuse that people don't like the way I'm playing the game is bull, all wurm had to do was answer a simple question. If he really is a medic what was the point of avoiding giving information that helped the town for so long? It just does not add up. If he's a medic, he's a selfish one at that. Look at the last game and how Alventenie died because a medic didn't protect him. Read the scenario that happened - if case 2 happened where the player was attacked twice wouldn't it make even MORE sense for wurm to contact me and let me know that he protected a high priority target and hey - maybe I should ask him and the other medic to protect them again just in case? This isn't about clues, it's about behavior and right now things are way off. | ||
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On March 26 2008 01:50 qrs wrote: ^Your point being? Ace was saying that wurm (the supposed medic) should have said something if 2 people protected the target. edit: d'oh, you're right. Yeah, Ace should know if 2 people protected Falcynn (or whomever). what? | ||
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On March 26 2008 01:55 qrs wrote: Read Ace's post, then read my post, then read my edit. ;-) There was a hole in what Ace was saying (that wurm should have said something in case 2). I was responding to that, but, yeah, I missed the obvious point that Ace should know what happened anyway. I don't know why he's being tricky about it. Of course I'm being tricky about it, can't let the Mafia know the intention of all my posts | ||
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On March 26 2008 01:57 qrs wrote: @ Ace: Whoever the medic(s) protected knows how many people protected him. He should tell you. but how did you know Falcynn was the person? | ||
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On March 26 2008 01:59 qrs wrote: Because he blurted it out earlier in the thread. I'll dig it up if you want. ok go ahead. Thats all I wanted to know. | ||
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On March 26 2008 02:00 LucasWoJ wrote: Oh, I see. Yeah, the very fact that wurm (if he's a medic) received a PM confirming that he saved someone during the night is reason enough to send Ace a PM and tell him. He should have also sent him a PM before the the new Day post informing Ace of his actions during the night (If someone is saved during the night, then it becomes more plausible that it was your doing since you sent in your actions to both Chuiu and Ace.) right. Even if he doesn't want to listen to my suggestions, if I know who he protected and the person gets hit, whether he lives or dies we can see who the lying medic is by just reconstructing the Mafia hit list. But of course, most people think this is "boring" and just want to add more confusion and anarchy to the town. | ||
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On March 26 2008 02:05 butidigress wrote: Hm, I guess you're right Ace. What happens if he turns up blue? That means he did protect his target as he said, which means something still doesn't add up. I guess we'll see as we go along. the point is even if he does turn up blue, he is making no sense. Just look at his defense when I accused him. Honestly does that sound like anyone who even cares? | ||
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On March 26 2008 05:39 Scorch wrote: Ace himself said that he doesn't care about clues, but behaviour exclusively almost. Behavior and logic holds 1000000 times more importance than clues. No offense intended, but Chuiu's clues are so hard or pointless there is no point in even going for clues first as a reasonable strategy - every townie even remotely connected would get lynched. Also, clues are coming from a third party source and I 'd rather catch Mafia based on their own mishaps and not what the narrator is giving up. Lastly, the game is not even easy at all. Mafia have a distinct advantage because they dont have to collaborate as much as we do, which means inactive players kill us badly. The kill system in this game requires 1 kill list with 9 names. Thats incredibly way too easy. In the games I've admined all Mafia had to PM their targets to me, and they all had to match up so that they could have successful kills. This way inactive Mafia members are just as much as a burden to them. We've got a few inactive townies, but I guess having about only ~20 or less players missing isn't a big deal right? /sarcasm | ||
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This is the plan for the next Day(he person who came up with this idea will remain anonymous, i just improved on it a bit). We know that from the Ghar List, 1 out of 7 of these people are Mafia: Ghar List - 7 useLess aZnvaLiaNce ShadowDrgn Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm Evilmonkey What I'm asking for is for these 7 people to split their votes. The top 3 will vote for randombum tomorrow, and the bottom 4 will vote for myself. This way neither of us stands a very good chance to get lynched tomorrow and we can see who's what. Once the list is split, we'll count check them both again. So it should look like this: randombum - 3 useLess aZnvaLiaNce ShadowDrgn Ace -4 Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm Evilmonkey If you do not follow this idea, we'll have no choice but to think you're Mafia and autovote to lynch you. I'll be PMing all of you later with this info. I'm also posting this WAY early so no one has the excuse that they did not see it. In addition to that plan, we'll also be splitting the Mandalor Vote. The top 29(excluding me) will vote on Suspect#1 and the bottom 29 will vote on Suspect#2. These suspects will be revealed after tonight. Just like above, anyone who doesn't follow the plan we have no choice but to cast suspicion on them. Double count the #s because my counting may be off. Here's the list: Suspect#1 -29 Showtime! ShaLLoW[baY] qrs clazziquai ahrara_ Falcynn ZBiR unsoundlogic BWdero GeneralStan Scorch nemY MidnightGladius decafchicken L Empyrean Eti307 suresh0t randombum Lysithea French_Toast New104 Kau Artanis[Xp] Ninja4ever. Naib JeeJee Hittegods SoleSteeler Suspect#2 -29 Romance_us Plexa LucasWoJ Caller Fishball RtS)Night[Mare Jimtudor GranDim Lenwe Alethios NatsuTerran 0cz3c Last Romantic zeks Pangolin SpiritoftheTuna Unforgiven_ve Energies BloodyC0bbler iNfuNdiBuLuM SoMuchBetter Camlito bumatlarge fanatacist ieatkids5 ~OpZ~ SonuvBob Siefu butidigress People on the abstain list or that didn't vote can do what they want. This, along with the way medic protections have been setup tonight will give the mafia a difficult time with targets if they haven't already sent in their hitlist. No matter who dies tonight, this plan will be carried out. Any questions, comments or concerns let them be known. Once again, if you go against this plan we have no choice but to cast suspicions on you. | ||
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On March 26 2008 07:46 JeeJee wrote: annnnnnnd finally, for the person who suggested we only investigate one half of the groups (since the other could be deduced from the total) -- dont. this is good assuming everyone votes, and the people who didn't previously vote also dont' vote. if this could be guaranteed, there would be a better course of action anyway (virtual splits), but since it's not a guarantee at all, both sides must still be investigated. the good thing about doing this, is that it doesn't matter whether you want to follow along with the plan or not, because you're still following along with it. we know what the total mafia #s have to add up to, and if the people who were told to vote for someone choose to abstain, or in fact choose to vote for someone else entirely, they will affect the total, and in fact, reveal their alignment. obv there's a loophole to this (at least it looks like it - thankfully, there's a somewhat obvious prevention mechanism as well) I didn't want to point this part out though, because any townies that do this may accidentally affect totals if say...a Mafia member tried to jump the gun and leave, and then other townies didn't vote also. If enough of them leave the group, we may have a problem. But yes, there is a prevention mechanism for that too. I've already started taking notes on a certain select few peoples behaviors. | ||
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On March 26 2008 07:56 Wysp wrote: Ace, make sure all these people are PM'd in the vote spliting, the group of 7 should be easy enough to organize but its going to take a miracle for a well organized split of the 29. Its definately worth a try, though. indeed. the good thing about the group of 29 though is that most of those players are active. If 20 out of 29 move the other 9 are in a jam. While technically innocents can move if they please, Mafia cant because they'd affect the total. We jut dont want innocents to move because it would cause too much moving and confusion. Anyone thats innocent doesn't even HAVE a reason to move because they wont get caught. | ||
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On March 26 2008 07:57 Wysp wrote: Also, if this splitting causes the wrong person to be lynched, he can just be pardoned (not sure if this has been mentioned, I haven't time right now but to skim.) after tonight's killings + the info we already know, I'm almost certain tomorrow is going to be nuts. | ||
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btw, what ever happened to Klive5ive? | ||
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Heros)Pink - saying not to put Ghar in position because clues point to him even though they really dont, is vying for Empyrean against me and Ghar. THis dude is very odd, as even when logic stares him in the face he refuses to look. | ||
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Empryean claims DT on Mayor voting Day, so early when it isn't even needed much. He is clearly leading to some confusion among the Townies, and is already starting to point fingers (at ahrara). He "concedes" to me after he realizes it's almost a sure bet I will be elected Mayor, and instead Happily settles for Pardoner. He also isn't "defending" himself with any reason when suspicious posts of his are pointed out. | ||
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On March 26 2008 15:10 ~OpZ~ wrote: sit lose then loose not lose, no Ninja edit 4 u! | ||
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On March 26 2008 15:53 Alethios wrote: A chink in your armor there Ace? Thats the best you can come up with? I make no sense? I don't mean to suggest that you are part of the multi-international corporation, simply that you could be. However, I DO mean to suggest that your plan for tomorrow's voting is stupid, because it is. If there were higher numbers of mafia in each list... I might condone it. As it stands however, if you took a random sample... your data would probably lie within 1 std deviation of what you've got. Not enough to act upon. Give up, try another tack. explain your math, because right now it's not adding up. | ||
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On March 26 2008 16:18 Alethios wrote: Put simply... 1/7 Guilty in the first lot (this is your better sample) is still only 14.3% mafia. Compare this to the total murderers in the game, over the total players. 22/130 = 16.9% mafia Then you have your 10/58 Guilty in the second lot.... Which is slightly more at 10/58 = 17.2% but still not far from the mean. Furthermore, much more effort is required to separate out these mafia than in the first lot. Seriously... I don't buy your "math isn't adding up" for a second. I realise that (assuming you ARE town) you have to maintain the trust of the town, but persisting with this stupid scheme isn't helping in the slightest. You're still wrong, Out of those 7 people you think I don't know that some of them are 100% innocent? At this point if you don't realize I'm innocent I cant but help in thinking you're either purposely trying to mislead the town or just plain old haven't been reading the thread. | ||
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[QUOTE]On March 26 2008 16:52 Ghar wrote: Chuiu, can detectives check abstain lists? [/QUOTE] we cant | ||
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On March 26 2008 17:34 Alethios wrote: I've suggested right from the beginning that if Ace gives us another Mandalor, we should go for it. What i've been arguing against is the enforced voting, where we vote for X or Y or else. The entire point of the enforced voting to those who can see it is not only to find a Mafia but to find out which townies are 100% innocent. This way after tomorrows votes I possibly won't ever even have to do enforced voting. I'll have enough information on 11 possible mafia targets in no time just by the very fact that I'll know who's innocent + the innocents I know now. On March 26 2008 16:18 Alethios wrote: The list of 7 people I think is wrong, but go ahead if you wish. It'll still take a number of turns (and detectives) in any case, resources that might be put to better use. I'll warn you now though, your seemingly sturdy plans will fall down as soon as people start missing votes, or dissenting. It will take 1 turn, and thats only if one of them dont die. The list will be split 4/3. 1 Mafia among them. I already know some of those guy's roles. Once I find out which side the Mafia is on it's going to be at worst 1/4 or 25% chance of finding him without applying prior knowledge. The other half of that list is automatically innocent. How are you figuring it will take us more than 1 turn? 1 detective - 1 turn. Thats it. If people miss votes when they've had WAY more than enough time so be it. It's the burden on the Mafia. If they leave the group and no other townies does then we have our suspect. If he leaves and only 1 or 2 townies do also, BAM we still have our suspect. Where is the failure part of this plan? If all 7 of them vote differently even though some of those people already PM'd me saying they would vote the same to prove their innocence? You're arguments isn't adding up because any innocent townie that would do what's best for the town would see how this works out. Where is the fabled Ace of old? Is this the best you can come up with? Not even an attempt to counter my logic? For shame. . Counter what logic? Anyone playing this game that read the plan knows I'm innocent right now. It's impossible for me to be Mafia. Just because you cooked up some fabled scenario for some reason to confuse the town doesn't mean the rest of us are going to buy it. That post was the silliest set of logic leaps I've seen and it clearly shows you are up to something. | ||
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Keep talking whatever nonsense keeps you happy. We'll ask you to go forward with the plan tomorrow, and whether or not your with us we'll do what we can. | ||
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There is no DT flaw as there are no Godfather roles. Which means the DT answers to someone's role always is 100% correct. Where's the flaw? There is no way that all 4 DTs are inactive with me knowing Mandalor was Mafia + getting a vote count. That takes care of your DT flaw. What do you mean work? The 58 person split is not only to find Mafia, but to find out who's innocent. I don't know how many times we have to tell you this but you keep beating it into your head that there's some magical flaw. I'm not Cross Referencing anything. But above all else, I have at least 3 times as much information as YOU do. So obviously I know exactly why this plan works in ways you could never even fathom. Don't tell me you really think I accused wurm by accident? The Mafia isn't the only one playing mind games this time around. | ||
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If a DT asks someone's role, regular mafia are revealed as MAFIA otherwise there would be no point in only being able to ask twice. Mafia is a ROLE. Doesn't matter if it's special or not. Right, so after tomorrows vote you get: 4/20 Mafia in one list (With 10 people changing or abstaining) 5/29 Mafia in the other list. What new information do you get from that? NONE. I get a lot more than you think. If I already know that in that first half of 29 that 10 are innocent, and then it comes out that 6 of those are Mafia to YOU it looks like 6/29 but to me it looks like 6/19. And of those 19, there may be circumstances I know about that implicates some of them and frees others where it can drop down to even 6/15 and lower. I've told you this before, I know much more information than you do so I have no need to Cross Reference lists first. I can do that AFTER but there's no point in doing that with 58 people when I could save 4 times the work by splitting the list in half and comparing it with the info I already know. I don't see why you think you can bring in talk about wurm and how YOU are the one playing mind games this time! Expecting me to go "oh yes, you are very clever aren't you" Not relevant, sorry. I said that in the hopes that you'd realize everything I've done so far is more than what it seems. Sometimes the simplest explanation isn't best. | ||
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On March 26 2008 19:48 araav wrote: Would be nice to divide the big group to three. And not use Ghar's group for now. just save it for later references. That just might happen. I was thinking about it last night and its very possible that may be a better course of action. As long as those 7 are there, Mafia can't kill any of them without tightening the noose on that suspects neck. | ||
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But in other news, a lot of good has come out of this. And yes, ShadowDrgn was a vigi kill. We're still going along with the plan. If wurm would have told me earlier things would have been avoided for sure, so Night 3 we are probably going to have a huge problem now that LucasWoj is dead. Current Plan of Action Voting pattern 1 - randombum. useLess aZnvaLiaNce voting pattern 2 - Ace Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm Evilmonkey The people on the randombum and Ace lists will vote accordingly so we can figure out which of these guys is Mafia while vindicating innocents. And yes I split it 2/4 on purpose. Suspect #1 = wurm Showtime! ShaLLoW[baY] qrs clazziquai ahrara_ Falcynn ZBiR unsoundlogic BWdero GeneralStan Scorch nemY MidnightGladius decafchicken L Empyrean Eti307 suresh0t randombum Lysithea French_Toast New104 Kau Artanis[Xp] Ninja4ever. Naib JeeJee Hittegods SoleSteeler Suspect #2 = ghar (for now) Romance_us Plexa LucasWoJ Caller Fishball RtS)Night[Mare Jimtudor GranDim Lenwe Alethios NatsuTerran 0cz3c Last Romantic zeks Pangolin SpiritoftheTuna Unforgiven_ve Energies BloodyC0bbler iNfuNdiBuLuM SoMuchBetter Camlito bumatlarge fanatacist ieatkids5 ~OpZ~ SonuvBob Siefu butidigress People on the suspect #1 and #2 lists vote in that way so we can figure out who the 10 Mafia people are. People that abstained in the Day 2 votes should either abstain again or vote for anyone else but the 4 names listed. Basically just dont hop on any of those lists for now. Anyone going against the plan right now just has to be labeled suspicious. I expected a medic to die, but I didn't expect THAT DT to die. | ||
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On March 27 2008 14:01 RtS)Night[Mare wrote: Ace, we now have only 3 DT checks for votes, i hope you take that in mind I know | ||
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On March 27 2008 14:06 Pangolin wrote: So are we going to double lynch or not? highly possible, but not guaranteed yet. | ||
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But the whole wurm thing really fucked us up. | ||
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we might just use 2 DTs to count check the lists of 29 (which are shorter than they really are cuz of deaths) and keep the other 6 alive. Using 1 DT to role check a highly suspected person. | ||
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On March 27 2008 14:28 clazziquai wrote: How many DT role checks do we have left? And I'll vote for wurm well...dinmsab had 1 left b4 he died Unfortunately we may have to use one on wurm As you can tell we really didnt want to do that. | ||
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We'll also reconstruct the Mafia kill list. I expected a Medic to die because almost all of them were paired up, and 1 or maybe 2 had 1 target assigned so I was thinking the Mafia would figure out a way to hit at least 1 of them. Also it seemed a lot of info was passed around Day 1 before I even got a lot of the medics info. The problem with wurm is that we didn't even suspect he was the fake medic until we started checking who told us what and it didn't add up. So we had to change everything because the real suspect couldn't be caught if we couldnt even get our supposedly real medics in order. See the dilemnna? Now we had 2 suspected medics being faked. Wurm fucked us over because the original protection plan had to change, and I had to send a new order out to one of the medics. That medic I'm sure is innocent, but since he isn't proven 100% innocent and I sent him info twice (2 different names) I'm sure you guys can see where the problem is if he's the Mafia medic - I gave out way too much info. Wurm is still acting suspect, and at this point I'm sure he is no longer any use to the town. The other medics should pm me who they protected last night and if they got hit. Anyone that got hit should let me know asap. We have to solve this medic problem asap because like I said today shit would hit the fan. The Mafia caught a DT and one of my BGs but it could have been a lot more damaging. This voting plan has to proceed so we can get rid of these 11 Mafia by Day 5 at the latest and drop their killing power ridiculously. I'm close to declaring a double lynch today just so they can't do anything on Day 4 when the noose is much tighter. | ||
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Thats the whole reason we needed you to report in just so we can strengthen any holes to see who got protected. DUH. The Mafia would have to be pretty stupid not to kill you knowing you're a medic. They have a kill list of 9, and have failed twice to fully exercise it. throwing you on there is a sure fire kill for them, keeping you alive for the town to lynch is wa waste for them because if you're found innocent then they are day behind on medic kills and surely it would be harder to kill you by Night 3. I'd never even let them know if I knew you were truly innocent or not, let them take the chances and be stupid - IF you're innocent. | ||
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1.) dinsmab 2.) JeeJee 3.) FrenchToast 4.) Fish_Ball 5.) Lucas)Woj 6.) target 6 7.) Showtime 8.) 9.) No idea if there was a target 8 or 9 as of now. Plans French_Toast was arguing that I made the game too easy at one point, Townies go back to that point in the thread and check out all the people siding with him. Scan the thread for that copperhead quote or instances relating to it - "there no fun in that but I can't really argue, we gotta get this here done quick" Vote according the plan. The list will be updated later, along with a list of people that didn't vote, a list of people that never PM'd me their roles. Medic protections that need to be public LucasWoj to protected Showtime last night. Showtime took a hit. wurm allegedly protected Plexa last night. Plexa who has been somewhat active still hasn't sent me a role PM. Right now a few things will happen: 1.) We are possibly going to role check wurm. If he's innocent we've just wasted one due to his stupidity anyway. 2.) The lists will be split and vote checked 3.) we'll figure out if that bum clue points to randombum or bumatlarge 4.) we will end this medic problem by today 5.) I may declare a double lynch just so I can't be role blocked on day 4, and to get more info on suspects. Find out if there was a target 8 and 9 | ||
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Either way, wurm has shown he doesnt want to cooperate and basically gave us the FU messing things up. | ||
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If he's innocent we just get closer to finding out who the fake Mafia medic is. @Mandalor: he asked if he could do it | ||
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No Vigilante put a hit on Showtime, therefore Showtime is Innocent | ||
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On March 28 2008 01:46 araav wrote: Do not waste a lynch, it's currently all we have agains mafia's night kills, wtf?... There is no "wasting a lynch". Read all of wurms posts and tell me if you honestly think he is any benefit to the town. Go ahead, I'll wait. | ||
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On March 28 2008 01:56 Scorch wrote: i'd rather kill a mafia than an individualist. as i read your posts, you aren't 100% convinced of wurm's guilt, right? i'm under the impression that you want to make an example of wurm, not to stand up against this... regime. how about we concentrate on clues and information that every townie has, not only your elite circle of "confirmed" innocents, to find actual mafias? of course wurm could be a mafioso, but i'm far from believing that considering the lack of clues in day posts. if we kill wurm, it brings us one step closer to solving the medic problem either way | ||
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Townies what should we do: A.) Use a Detective role check on wurm or B.) Lynch wurm anyway Vote on it | ||
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Lucas was a medic, confirmed through death. Why would he lie? | ||
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a.) check if that clue about severed head points to Ghar b.) role check wurm c.) lynch wurm anyway I think that covers everything right? | ||
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I'm declaring a Double Lynch. I'll update the town with more info on the Ghar clue soon. since everyoen gets 2 votes: Use your first vote to follow the original voting plan. Do whatever you wish with the second vote. | ||
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On March 28 2008 06:37 aZnvaLiaNce wrote: To Ace: You should have the ones who are voting for you/randombum use their 2nd vote on someone else besides the two of you. That way, when you DT check the votes, there are no overlapping vote conflicts. good point. I figured most would do it anyway since neither myself or randombum are major suspects. randombum still hasnt ever been rolechecked though. | ||
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Allegedly bumatlarge claimed to be mafia, so he is suspect #2 from now on Waiting on more info. No idea how araav got the info, but whoever told it to him PM me. If no one does we'll just have to assume he somehow found out and he's mafia. | ||
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On March 28 2008 12:06 bumatlarge wrote: Remind me again where I claimed to be mafia? I did not realize putting yourself in Mafia shoes constituted someone as a mafia. I got a PM stating so | ||
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No one could have found the room even by accident. So why use codenames? Only people we are sure are 100% innocent have the info. | ||
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On March 28 2008 12:22 wurm wrote: it would be funny if the game got scrapped just because a mafioso successfully infiltrated the town ranks, posing as a blue. i'm about to go to class, guess i'll just catch up on the drama later. cant. Even the blues that have access dont know everyone's roles. The only people that have that info are myself and the Bodyguards. ho ho ho. | ||
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There were at most 6 people in there...hardly enough to do much. @RTS: tomorrow I'm going to fix the voting up. No one should be using any votes on Ghar, myself, randombum, or wurm if they didnt vote in the original scenarios. Whatever happens with the random voting, oh well. | ||
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Right now I'm convinced that most of the people posting actively are innocent and a lot of mafia are not talking purposely. I've got a lot of information to go through, and I'll post some results soon along with how people should be voting. | ||
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I was more curious than anything. I've also just realized I might know how dinmsab got killed. | ||
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Waiting on info from the Ghar scenario. | ||
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Bumatlarge is suspect #2, and wurm is suspect #1. | ||
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he role checked someone, and sent the PM to myself AND randombum. He told us both he was a Detective, and that if he died that day one of us was surely mafia. With the recent evidence linking a bum to the murders either the mafia got really lucky or randombum snitched. I'll let you guys figure it out. | ||
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I'm just posting a lot more info because people are complaining the game is boring. After today's plan we'll stop playing so "careful" and just let the chaos ensure. | ||
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Even though there is a Double Lynch in effect, still only vote according to the strategy unless otherwise stated. Firstly, suspect #1 = wurm The only people that should be voting for wurm no matter what are these players: Showtime! ShaLLoW[baY] qrs clazziquai ahrara_ Falcynn ZBiR unsoundlogic BWdero GeneralStan Scorch nemY MidnightGladius decafchicken L Empyrean Eti307 suresh0t randombum Lysithea New104 Kau Artanis[Xp] Ninja4ever Naib Hittegods SoleSteeler NO ONE ELSE VOTE FOR WURM! Likewise, suspect #2 = Ghar The only people voting for Ghar no matter what should be these people: Romance_us Plexa Caller Fishball RtS)Night[Mare Jimtudor GranDim Lenwe Alethios NatsuTerran 0cz3c Last Romantic zeks Pangolin SpiritoftheTuna Unforgiven_ve Energies BloodyC0bbler iNfuNdiBuLuM SoMuchBetter Camlito bumatlarge fanatacist ieatkids5 ~OpZ~ SonuvBob Siefu butidigress NO ONE ELSE VOTE FOR Ghar! Now that you guys know that, this is the rest of the plan. These players should vote like this: randombum - 2 useLess aZnvaLiaNce Ace -4 Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm Evilmonkey Thats it. However, we know only 1 of those 6 are Mafia. Any innocent townie that wants to prove their innocence can vote on either myself or randombum BUT watch the vote count to make sure you don't accidentally lynch one of us. If you don't even want to risk it vote on ANYONE else except those 4 names, or just abstain. Please do this asap because we dont have much time. | ||
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Current Vote Count: Suspect #1 = Wurm MidnightGladius ShaLLoW[baY] ahrara_ randombum clazziquai Falcynn suresh0t Showtime! Kau Scorch Ace(x6) Artanis[Xp] GeneralStan Lysithea SoleSteeler Naib zeks TranceStorm Amber[LighT] bumatlarge Puosu Kau fusionsdf crazie-penguin Alethios ZBiR Siefu Ninja4ever BWdero Empyrean Hittegods unsoundlogic suspect #2 = Ghar QRS Pangolin RtS)Night[Mare Camlito SonuvBob Last Romantic Alethios Lenwe Caller Naib iNfuNdiBuLuM zeks GeneralStan wurm bumatlarge HotZhot fusionsdf crazie-penguin Scorch ieatkids5 Showtime! fanatacist Eti307 Romance_us JoxxOr butidigress randombum aZnvaLiaNce SonuvBob Ace Chezinu Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm fusionsdf Showtime! CDRdude wurm Kau iNfuNdiBuLuM Lenwe qrs ahrara_ bumatlarge MTF 0cz3c SpiritoftheTuna GranDim Pangolin Plexa ~OpZ~ BloodyC0bbler fanatacist Jimtudor NatsuTerran Eti307 Empyrean JoxxOr LostYourSkills MTF Zeks aZnvaLiaNce Ninja4ever NatsuTerran Chezinu fusionsdf MoRe_mInErAls HeRoS)Pink Alethios MoRe_mInErAls HeRoS)Pink useless BloodyC0bbler STR BlindAlbino Energies BlindAlbino Queasy ShaLLoW[baY] Plexa ~OpZ~ Siefu BlindAlbino ZBiR KH1031 smurfingchobo Klive5ive smurfingchobo smurfingchobo Klive5ive Abstain GrayArea L Dr.Dragoon Ghar wurm Ziel xDark.Carnivalx Klive5ive Meta KH1031 0cz3c Falcynn Amber[LighT] HotZhot Puosu Hollander Ninja4ever LTT BWdero KF91 Jimtudor Romance_us Hittegods Artanis[Xp] Bockit unsoundlogic caller showtime | ||
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I cant regulate it all as I have to be going, but PLEASE don't let this get messed up. | ||
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2.) The DT that was supposed to check the Ghar clue never did, and I wasnt around to make sure he could get pardoned. 3.) It was much more than wurm not cooperating, and I've explained this 1000 times. 4.) I'll probably just lay back and let you guys do as you please, I already know how to win the game but due to constant bitching I think I'll be silent and do things on my own. Have fun. | ||
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Got home at about 11am, exhausted. Slept, and had to do a ton of things. I've got class tomorrow so who knows when I'll be very active. | ||
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New104 died because of an incident with mandalor, but they couldn't kill him before. The lag between nights and the fact that some people never were cooperating fucked up a lot of protections for Night 3. dinmsab had verified Emp, who had verified me. New104 was never verified but we beleived he was a DT because of a few things. Showtime and Emp were acting suspicious all the time to draw attention away from other targets, and make the Mafia want to keep them alive. They failed to kill both of them before. They did pretty damn well and as you can see it doesn't matter if too many blues die as long as they do what's needed at the right times. | ||
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When I say tried to keep them alive, I should really have said "barely put effort into killing them" since afaik Showtime! was only hit once before, and I don't think Emp ever got hit. | ||
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Empyrean was roleblocked yesterday. I'm roleblocked today. From: New104 Subject: Re: Detective Ability Date: 4/2/08 03:13 1. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: How many mafia voted for Ace on Day 3? old message: MTF SpiritoftheTuna d.arkive Pangolin(2) Plexa ~OpZ~ NatsuTerran Eti307 Empyrean JoxxOr Romance_us BloodyC0bbler are all confirmed innocent | ||
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Ace - 7 Chezinu Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm fusionsdf ~OpZ~(2) Evilmonkey. | ||
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Ace - 7 Chezinu Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm fusionsdf ~OpZ~(2) Evilmonkey. I also got another set of info confirming that these people are all innocent: MTF SpiritoftheTuna d.arkive Pangolin(2) Plexa ~OpZ~ NatsuTerran Eti307 Empyrean JoxxOr Romance_us BloodyC0bbler Which shortens our list down to this: Ace - 7(6) Chezinu Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm fusionsdf ~OpZ~(2) <--innocent Evilmonkey. | ||
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I'm so busy atm that I cant put all the data and PMs together that I have. The next step, along with these 6 is to check out the people who have voted and not posted a lot. Chuiu hasn't kicked out any inactives as far as I know so the town is much farther away from where we need to be. | ||
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One of the other Mafia could have potentially hopped on the bandwagon of my vote to "save" useless, but I doubt it. It's just something I'm pointing out. So for now we have to assume aznvaliance and useless are both innocent. | ||
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On April 07 2008 05:17 RtS)Night[Mare wrote: i think next game should be invite only by people who were active agreed | ||
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On April 07 2008 19:56 qrs wrote: OK, I admit that showtime was an idiot and the chatroom story made very little sense anyway. The only reason I half-believed it was that Ace had been backing showtime up. I don't know what Ace is thinking, though, so since he hasn't brought it up since showtime died... I'd change my vote, but the final vote count is in. I backed up Showtime to make it LOOK as if he was important. I knew he was just a townie, and he did a good job of drawing attention away from better targets. | ||
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On April 08 2008 02:04 Scorch wrote: The problem with this being that there is only a single detective left. its not really a problem at all. The reason I was avoiding specific role checks was just because of this and why I wanted to get vote checks asap. In case so many Dts died enough info from lists would be available to the public to carry on without them. So far it seems to be working well. For the next vote, I'd propose splitting the lists again. | ||
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aZnvaLiaNce MTF BloodyC0bbler Meta rpf L bumatlarge smurfingchobo MidnightGladius Lenwe unsoundlogic Hittegods GranDim 1 of these people are Mafia | ||
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On April 08 2008 13:52 Last Romantic wrote: What about the ones on that list that are supposedly confirmed innocents? MTF rpf bumatlarge smurfingchobo MidnightGladius unsoundlogic This would be my final list, but I'm mainly looking at bumatlarge because of that other clue from day 3 was it? The "bum" clue. | ||
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On April 08 2008 16:29 Scorch wrote: This doesn't match up really. If MTF was confirmed innocent earlier, why is he on the top suspect list? Bumatlarge is probably innocent: the "bum" clue (codename: Sidewinder) was most likely linked to Queasy. See Plexa's post on page 184. All of this leaves us with very uncertain information and a less than average percentage of mafia in this subset (1/11 if you consider MTF and BloodyC0bbler innocent), which isn't helping us much. I suggest we take our investigations in another direction. I forgot to take MTF off my list thats all We're going to settle this whole fusion/useless/evilmonkey thing tomorrow. But that other list with clues pointing at bumatlarge/randombum gives us a good shot to nail a definite mafia right now. | ||
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He voted but never posted, I have a list of those people but I lost it SOMEWHERE. | ||
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THANK god I mad sure not every BG was in that channnel | ||
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On April 10 2008 16:22 nemY wrote: Mafia seem to be gunning for Ace... and our vig hits are rofl if we didn't have inactives this wouldnt even be an issue | ||
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All the blues weren't in there though | ||
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I also thought that it was fishy when I got the list how they were "confirmed". Thanks for pointing that out because if thats the case and the person lied we REALLY got screwed. | ||
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And once again ALL THE BLUES WERE NOT THERE. This should be obvious by now. Either way I think I know who's getting lynched tomorrow, and if this happens we got screwed hard. Either way... Chuiu what are you doing about inactives?. | ||
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Subject: Re: mafia Date: 3/31/08 15:01 yea i meant bumatlarge ----------------------------------------- Original Message: you mean you vote checked everyone that voted for bumatlarge? This is the list I see: bumatlarge - 11 MTF d.arkive Pangolin(2) Plexa fanatacist Eti307(2) Empyrean JoxxOr(2) Romance_us(2) BloodyC0bbler(2) Scorch(2) Where's Scorch and Spirit from? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: yea you never told me what to do so i just vote checked random bum ----------------------------------------- Original Message: oh you used DT powers? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: MTF SpiritoftheTuna d.arkive Pangolin(2) Plexa ~OpZ~ fanatacist NatsuTerran Eti307 Empyrean JoxxOr Romance_us BloodyC0bbler are all confirmed innocent ----------------------------------------- Original Message: if so you'll probably want to check some counts, but dont PM anyone else except caller or lenwe while I'm away. They'll definitely know what to do at the moment since I'm not here. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: yea im sure i could get away with using detective (if not its worth a try ) ----------------------------------------- Original Message: hmmm no idea yet. Night hasnt come yet, so we'll see when I get back. you have what left? vigi,medic and vet right? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: You still havent pm'd me what to do and time is running out. unless you want me to go vigi on someones ass? | ||
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we need a second victim | ||
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At this point it's too much of a coincidence that everyone that was in that channel got axed AND he had a confirmed innocent list that didn't match up. The only thing bugging me is the inactives because if we lynch this guy and he turns out Mafia I will be seriously upset it could have been solved by Day 2. | ||
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On April 10 2008 21:04 qrs wrote: What the hell, Ace! Maybe it's your fault, maybe not, but you've done nothing but screw over the town this game. Don't check out the Ghar clue, make us lynch wurm, take the lynch off the suicide bomber so we lynch a townie instead, apparently leak information (deliberately or not) that leads to Mafia figuring out half the roles! I'm through taking direction. Plexa's list seems to be the best thing we've got now. hasn't it occured to your dumbass yet that I've tried to PREVENT you guys from lynching innocents countless times? The whole reason I kept ignoring the Ghar stuff was because I was sure he was innocent. Likewise I ignored people saying Caller was mafia. It should be really obvious to anyone right now why I ignore certain things most of you post. The information did not leak. The only thing anyone could have access to was the channel. People could reveal their roles to each other if they pleased, but no one really did. And no one except myself and the Bggs had the role list so the mafia didn't get much info anyway. Stop bitching. I'm getting tired of your shit, so I'm putting my votes to lynch you and possibly the other guy when I finish reading this thread. I'm declaring a double lynch | ||
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On April 10 2008 21:18 HeRoS)Pink wrote: and wtf? from the list of 4 suspects having chezinu as a potential townie more than the others, you had to sent a vigi on him? or you never said to kill him? I dont control them, I just make suggestions. I said we shouldn't kill chezinu because no one checked fusion yet, and I thought Chezinu was innocent because he told me beforehand he would jump on that list to prove his innocence. | ||
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On April 10 2008 23:19 Plexa wrote: I'd also like to propose that smurfingchobo is mafia, consider that and tell me what you think Also consider Siefu as Joe Also, investigate SoMuchBetter and LoStYouRSkiLLS I've pegged Seifu as Mafia because of voting but not posting ever. Which is a strange behavior for a townie. | ||
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The fact that he "messed up" the confirmed innocent list also is an issue. That was my first suspicion but the only thing holding me back is no one else claimed Jack of All Trades. If the town wants that name released just let me know. Warning, if this guy turns out Mafia we are in more trouble with inactives then I thought. | ||
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Everyone that was in communication knew I thought Ghar was innocent. I only listed him as suspect #2 so people could THINK I thought he was mafia. Just because I don't tell YOU anything it doesn't mean I don't know whats going on. I let the town do as they please after the wurm incident because of people like you, constant bitching. Even when townies act stupid and we give good reason to lynch them there's always an asshat like you complaining. I had nothing to do with Trancestorm dying, I had nothing to do with the Vigis killing Chezinu, and I had no way of knowing we'd have a fake jack because if people are inactive I can't do shit about it. And since dead people can't post, I'm forever voting qrs to be lycnhed in the hopes that he dies and shuts the fuck up. | ||
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On April 11 2008 11:38 HeRoS)Pink wrote: We should not waste a lynch on fusionsdf atm Reason: theres no clue towards him, and both useless and azn seems to be regular townie I would pay more attention the Alventine,Imderek, and evilmonkey(my pick) agreed. One of those 3 are a better shot than Fusion atm. | ||
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Mafia Kill List for Night 4 1.)Hittegods 2.)xDark.Carnivalx 3.)Lenwe (protected once) - Medic #1 4.)Lenwe 5.)Caller 6.)Meta All of these were legit - now here's something interesting. 7.) Plexa (protected) Medic2 8.)Plexa (protected) Medic3 9.) Plexa (protected again) Medic4 (not confirmed yet) 10.) Jack (I told him to put vet status on) took 1 hit 11.) Jack (protected) Medic 5 or 10 +11 is true. Either way something is wrong. This is all based on the Night Kills + info I got from medics and the Jack. As you can see, something does NOT add up. How could Plexa be protected 3 times and the Jack get hit as a vet and saved? Plexa how many hits were you informed about taking last night? | ||
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On April 11 2008 14:17 aZnvaLiaNce wrote: I've already pleaded my innocence pages and pages ago (around 187?). If you're not going to listen and not see how I'm trying to actually TRY to nail red, not my problem. As for now, since I'm having fingers pointed in my direction, and I know myself to be green, it's very suspicious in my own mind that Plexa is red. Plexa is almost guaranteed innocence with how many times he was targetted in the past few days. For him to be guilty 3 medics would have to be lying. | ||
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On April 11 2008 14:19 fusionsdf wrote: could you explain this a little bit more? I see five medic actions, which looks correct and 11 mafia actions (when they should only have 8) Is that the problem? What does it indicate? The first 6 all make sense with what we know - 1 kill for each and a 2nd listing for Lenwe since he took a hit. The last 5 are odd. The Mafia have/had a killing power of 9. The PMs I got add up to 11 actions. One of the 3 medics I told to protect Plexa is lying, and/or the Jack and th medic I told to protect him is lying. I don't know if he really assumed Vet status and got hit, or both since I don't know how Chuiu decides. If the Jack turned Vet and got hit, does 1 protection count or is the vet extra life counted first? If the extra life is counted first does that mean the medic is still informed and the target(Jack) also? | ||
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2.) The jack didn't have access to the list 3.) we already know there is a lying Medic in the bunch | ||
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Showtime! - 11 CDRdude wurm(2) <- dead Kau(2) < - dead iNfuNdiBuLuM(2) Lenwe(2) <- dead qrs(2) ahrara_(2) RtS)Night[Mare(2) nemY(2) ulszz araav(2) | ||
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Only ONE of these people are Mafia: Ace - 7 Chezinu < - dead Alventenie imDerek TranceStorm < - dead fusionsdf ~OpZ~(2) Evilmonkey. | ||
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I'm agreeing with Plexa on EvilMonkey and Seifu. Especially Seifu since he ONLY votes and never posts. edited, had a mistake in this post earlier. | ||
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On April 11 2008 14:47 fusionsdf wrote: Ace, what are the odds araav is mafia? very slim | ||
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MTF HotZhot all have you voted on right now | ||
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Plexa should be changing soon. | ||
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We'll continue discussing other things at the same time, but don't get your votes sidetracked. | ||
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so no fek - voted Day 1 but nothing else fen - never voted or PM'd Dr.Dragoon - voted everyday but never PM'd me his role ieatkids5 - voted everyday except Day 1 Wizard - never voted but sent me a role PM Puosu - voted Days 3 and 4 ulszz - voted Day 3 for Showtime! + no role PM Alethios - voted everyday infinity21 - never voted + no role PM ZBiR - voted everyday except Day 4 SiZ.FaNtAsY - voted Day 2 + no role PM Vharox - never voted or role PM Unforgiven_ve - voted everyday except day 3 fgsvsd - done nothing at all KF91 - everything except vote Day 1 | ||
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so no fek - voted Day 1 but nothing else fen - never voted or PM'd Dr.Dragoon - voted everyday but never PM'd me his role ieatkids5 - voted everyday except Day 1 Wizard - never voted but sent me a role PM Puosu - voted Days 3 and 4 ulszz - voted Day 3 for Showtime! + no role PM Alethios - voted everyday infinity21 - never voted + no role PM ZBiR - voted everyday except Day 4 SiZ.FaNtAsY - voted Day 2 + no role PM Vharox - never voted or role PM Unforgiven_ve - voted everyday except day 3 fgsvsd - done nothing at all KF91 - everything except vote Day 1 str - never voted smurfingchobo - missed Day 1 and Day 2 Kuja900 - missed Day 2, 4 and no role PM GranDim - voted everyday Artanis[Xp] - voted everyday except Day 4 LoStYouRSkiLLS - only voted Day 1 and nothing else Lysithea - did everything fanatacist - did everything SoleSteeler - did everything KorvspaD - only sent me a role PM, never voted GeneralStan - voted everyday except day 4 Ziel - didnt vote days 2 and 4, no role PM Supah - only abstained on Day 3, no role PM jtan - did nothing BWdero - done everything AcrossFiveJulys - after Day 1 never voted again butidigress - did everything Jimtudor - did everything spoinka - never voted after day 1 unsoundlogic - didnt vote Day 1 decafchicken - did everything DamageControL - never did anything omfghi2u2 - never did anything RowdierBob - only voted Day 1, nothing else AmorVincitOmnia - never did anything wysp - abstained every day and didn't vote day 4 BuGzlToOnl - voted on days 2 and 4 (nemy both times) + no role PM GrayArea - voted Day 1 and abstained every day after, no role PM crazie-penguin - voted Day 1 and abstained every day after DTDominion - never did anything zeks - voted everyday except Day 4 useLess - did everything except vote Day 3 (when he REALLY should have) and didn't send role PM G.s)NarutO - voted Day 1 and Day 4, no role PM Evilmonkey - voted everyday except day 1 Klive5ive - did everything KH1031 - did everything rpf - did everything Analysis of this list First: 2 birds with one stone The first issue is useless. When EvilMonkey is lynched if he turns out to be green then useless is the #1 suspect. He didn't vote when we asked him to and was active every other time. The only thing saving him is that the list had 1 mafia member again. That would mean that Opz would have to be Mafia by default as he's the only new name in the list still alive. But then that implicates both of them since 1 Mafia would have just replaced another. If EM turns out green, both of them are Mafia. I'm going to double check my info one more time to make sure this holds up. Second: in-actives/low laying scum People that are inactive on that list fall under the category of doing nothing or voting early/rarely and then leaving. Some people abstained all days but that shows activity so they are only listed here if I don't have a role PM from them.These people are: so no fek fen wizard ulszz infinity21 SiZ.FaNtAsY vharox fgsvsd str kuja900 lostyourskills korspaD Ziel Supah jtan AcrossFiveJulys damagecontrol omfghi2u2 Rowdierbob AmorVincitOmnia BuGzlToOnl GrayArea DTdominion Almost everyone on this list is pretty much useless to the town. They are either inactive or lying low Mafioso. By now these players would surely have done something and I'm asking the town to focus on this list and cross reference them with any other lists and clue analysis we have. They are all good for lynching since none of them contribute so it doesn't matter if they are innocent or not. Once again, these players are either inactive or Mafia. | ||
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Mafia Kill List for Night 4 1.)Hittegods 2.)xDark.Carnivalx 3.)Lenwe (protected once) - Medic #1 4.)Lenwe 5.)Caller 6.)Meta All of these were legit - now here's something interesting. 7.) Plexa (protected) Medic2 8.)Plexa (protected) Medic3 9.) Jack (I told him to put vet status on) took 1 hit 10.) Jack (protected) Medic 5 9+10 has to count as 1 action for this to be true. This is the final kill list for Mafia last night. | ||
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EvilMonkey - nonsense posts | ||
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On April 12 2008 19:29 Plexa wrote: While we're killing time... What's everyones opinion on Lostyourskills? I think someone said something about an Australian being Mafia, which would put spotlight on LostYourSkills. Also a couple of names that always pop up in my PMs: Ninja4ever MidnightGladius L Eti307 those 4 are on that Mandalor list. | ||
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check posts that caused innocents to be lynched. Looking through the thread and seeing who advocated to lynch Ghar and Trancestorm will help us a lot. Likewise, looking to see who wanted to prevent EvilMonkey and Mandalor lynchings would be a good idea also. | ||
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On April 13 2008 00:36 fusionsdf wrote: From: New104 Subject: Re: Detective Ability Date: 4/2/08 03:13 1. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: How many mafia voted for Ace on Day 3? old message: MTF SpiritoftheTuna d.arkive Pangolin(2) Plexa ~OpZ~ NatsuTerran Eti307 Empyrean JoxxOr Romance_us BloodyC0bbler are all confirmed innocent ------------- uh-oh you got it mixed up. That isn't the list of people to have voted on me day 3 from New104. That list of people is from the Jack that turned out false, he said he made a mistake and asked for randombum but gave me the results of bumatlarge's list. | ||
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why? | ||
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On April 13 2008 08:32 Kuja900 wrote: ace you are in trouble only 2/6 bodyguards left I'm only in trouble if both of them die | ||
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On April 14 2008 03:25 fusionsdf wrote: In case anyone cares, my suspect list is General Stan RtS)Night[Mare ieatkids5 ShaLLoW[baY] Romance_us suresh0t MidnightGladius Last Romantic LostYourSKills MTF unforgiven_ve SpiritoftheTuna interesting list because none of these people are on my 100% innocent list | ||
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Also I suggest setting up someone like Eti307 or EvilMonkey. due to their inactivity yet their voting as well. | ||
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Just removing people that have been somewhat posting/helpful + people that have some kind of possibility of being innocent: clazziquai ZBiR unsoundlogic BWdero GeneralStan nemY Eti307 suresh0t randombum Artanis[Xp] Ninja4ever Naib SoleSteeler Romance_us RtS)Night[Mare Jimtudor Alethios NatsuTerran 0cz3c zeks Pangolin SpiritoftheTuna Unforgiven_ve SoMuchBetter ieatkids5 SonuvBob This list has 26 names. The people that have their names removed are still suspects, but I just wanted to shorten the list to more concrete amount. From now on, focus on these people mainly. | ||
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Can he possibly pinpoint targets from a distance? Also notice in every encounter The Wolf's targets end up on the ground. Sureshot's profile pic is somewhat ominous in this regard. | ||
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Maybe he keeps losing balance because his shoes are messed up? Soles are the bottom part of the shoe. | ||
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smurfs are short. | ||
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On April 14 2008 16:54 Plexa wrote: Mr Pink is likely to be Kuja900 Is it the narcissism thing that makes you think so? | ||
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Eddie as Lostyourskills is a pretty good catch. nm edited, I already read the explanation for Jimtudor. | ||
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MTF is going all out before he possibly gets taken out which is a good thing. | ||
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Keke the night must be filled with tons of murder | ||
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On April 15 2008 14:29 Plexa wrote: Ace ^^^^^^^MBC better beat SKT | ||
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On April 15 2008 14:46 Camlito wrote: your 5th ace? damn im 11th, and i went for SKT .sux for j00! | ||
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afaik no vigi's put a hit out on you. | ||
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On April 16 2008 13:53 nemY wrote: Clear me of suspicion yet? I'm confused... how did the Jack go Vig and hit a medic? Shouldn't Ace have stopped this?!? MidnightGladius seemed "Gharish" in that there were multiple obvious clues relating to him... hindsight 20/20. because the jack was the one who fucked up and had overwhelming clues pointing to him. We tried to solve it the best way possible (especially knowing he'd probably be dead). Well my top two suspects are Heros)Pink and L. | ||
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because The Rock smells what's cookin! | ||
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Ok L has been confirmed Mafia. I'll explain to you guys the plan we used and why we used it. Sadly, decafchicken messed up the list making us think he was guilty. KH1031 said he protected decaf the night before, so either both of them were mafia or , KH1031 was innocent. So we told decaf to go vigi and kill KH1031. If KH1031 didn't die, we knew decaf was Mafia. So as a failsafe I added another plan. In the event they are BOTH innocent, put one of our suspicious medics on Decaf. We thought decaf would be a possible target if innocent, so if worse comes to worse then decaf would survive the night. However as I told Plexa, the only bad thing that could happen is the WORST CASE SCENARIO of both innocents dying. It happened. And the fake medic didn't protect Decaf. Who's the fake medic? L. Also Heros, I only accused you to see who would jump on the bandwagon and try to help get you lynched. I'll check the voting thread soon to see whats up. Original Message: Protection for Night 5: L - decafchicken Having L protect decafchicken is another plan to leverage us. If decaf is innocent he'd survive the night hopefully. If L is the Mafia he can't protect decaf, but can't risk killing him for fear of not knowing how many medics were assigned to decaf which may screw up the kill list Mafia use. That way we can always catch L in a lie later on that day if h's indeed the mole medic. | ||
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It all comes down to the fact that Decaf was not protected AT ALL last night. We only put ONE medic on him - you. There were no bumbling mistakes. I took a gamble that you already knew his ID, which you all surely did. Good try L. Too bad you got caught in the end. | ||
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On April 17 2008 04:55 L wrote: You realize that 5 hits didn't land last night, one of which was protected by me. Where did the rest go? Edit: 2 vig hits (one on your orders on KH, which decaf pmed me about) + 3 normal kills. Either mafia hit 5 veterans, or they probably put extra hits on decaf to assure that he couldn't vote check in the future. And to add to that, if the Jack's ID was already known by the channel incident, why does it tie to me. Mafia already knew, and with the missing hits, (being over FIFTY PERCENT of their total hits), its incredibly easy to assume that they just tossed an extra hit or two on him to assure his death. decaf said he didnt get a PM about getting hit | ||
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On April 17 2008 05:25 L wrote: people don't get pms about getting hit unless they survive. Ask chuiu. Also, to reply to amber: I don't know. I know i stopped one hit. The fact that there was more than one hit is assured, which still leaves 3 in the air. One medic protection wouldn't ever be guaranteed protection, and from mafia's hitting history, they seem to stack hits, or hit a LOT of veterans, none of which have died. Honestly, it doesn't even matter now. Ace just got me killed by mafia hit tomorrow night unless he's trying to set me up to get protected. When Lenwe died he got twice. The first time he got saved and got a PM about, the second time he died. So how is now different from then? If decaf was hit once, you would have saved him. If decaf was hit twice or more, he would have still got a PM saying he was saved and then died anyway. Neither of those happened. | ||
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On April 17 2008 05:44 Amber[LighT] wrote: You shouldn't know that information.... EDIT: I'm not saying it's necessarily wrong to know this info, but still the mayor can't technically talk to the dead. I didn't know that until Chuiu just posted it. Even ignoring that info L is STILL confirmed Mafia. | ||
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And if you truly are a medic, then how about you publicly post who you protected what night and how it turned out. | ||
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Ignoring that info look at the clues that point to L. | ||
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Medic A protects Bob. Bob dies that night. If bob disappears and Medic A said " I protected Bob" then this is the scaenario: Medic A is lying and Bob wasn't protected. Medic A isn't lying and Bob was hit at least Twice. How do you know for sure? By asking Bob. If Bob can't tell you anything, which he should be able to since he SURVIVED the first hit then how does the town resolve the situation? Ask DTs to check the Medics? That's a disadvantage for the town because this scenario would happen almost every night, making the DTs practically Medic baby sitters. Ask the medic? yea, sure. Especially if the medic can lie. Reconstruct the Mafia Kill list? It's your best bet, but if the Mafia have a constant kill list all you know is that the MAX # of kills could add up to a certain # and know nothing about whether or not that # was used. | ||
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You on the other hand have clues + a precarious situation linking to you: you are the only medic who has never saved someone from death. Individually, every medic that's currently alive has saved someone. | ||
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Everyone else protected their targets last night, you're the only one who did not. | ||
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The only possible way you could be blue is if everyone else is lying. | ||
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X survived and said he got 2 PMs stating he was hit (I didn't know about B at the time who turned out to be wurm). So Medics A and B are both cleared. No one else claimed to have protected X except these 2. Unless a medic is inactive Medic A would be mafia. I highly doubt it. Medic C was KH1031, who we thought was possibly innocent but because of the decaf situation we had to take a chance. That's 3 out of 7 medics already confirmed. LucasWoj is Medic D. 4 out of 7 confirmed. Medic E's targets all survived and reported to me about it - Lenwe's Medic. 5 out of 7 Medic F also protected someone who survived a hit - Y . 6 out of 7 confirmed. Medic G saved someone last night. 7 out of 7 confirmed. So where do YOU fit in? | ||
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If they post what good will that do? | ||
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L let's say we find a better candidate to lynch today and let you off the hook. I'll publicly say that tonight we are only putting YOU on a target, a target like...Plexa. If Plexa dies or you don't die we'd know your Mafia for sure and then lynch you tomorrow. Deal? | ||
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@qrs: there's so much I have to take care of behind the scenes you've got no idea why things keep going wrong. I've literally had over 100 PMs about all kinds of stuff this game and it's not easy trying to decipher the liars from the innocent. Either way everything I've done so far has brought the town closer to victory. What exactly have you done besides criticize from day 1? If enough people change their votes to crazie-penguin then let's lynch him, but before that can we find even stronger clues to him, or at least another suspect if we are going to leave L alive? | ||
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Mandalor Queasy d.arkive blindalbino EvilMonkey L crazie-penguin Dr.Dragoon 8/20 If we catch the others on the Mandalor List, assuming L is Mafia we'd have another 9. Giving us 17/20 Mafia. | ||
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Dr.Dragoon who seemed to be very active last game is really quiet this time. DamageControl is a stretch but I like that analysis. | ||
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Ninja4ever, L, and ulszz (who was first claimed to be Joe) are all top 3 suspects at the moment. | ||
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On April 22 2008 07:32 SoleSteeler wrote: My dear God I've read most of these posts, but it's the last day for many of my friends' exams and I, so I am too drunk to respond. Tomorrow, hopefully, I will. Now I will at least say, please, please ,please, vote for others who are more concrete. I hope that in a couple days with more Mr. pink clues you'll see i'm no mafioso. It'll be clear trust me. hey don't worry, you're only 3rd in the lynch list | ||
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On April 22 2008 14:09 Plexa wrote: Obviously the best move for the mafia would be a hitlist like this; 1) Plexa 2) Plexa 3) Plexa 4) Plexa 5) Plexa 6) MTF 7) MTF Then if/when I die who will we nominate as deputy mayor? Shallowbay? | ||
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With 4 medics and all our vets alive that's a really good position to be in. | ||
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On April 27 2008 20:02 qrs wrote: Can't comment on the generally annoying part--sorry, I guess--but what is "resistant to Town" supposed to mean? I've voted, commented if I thought some clue interpretation was convincing/unconvincing. What else is a good townie supposed to do? Actually you've been against almost everything I've done from Day 1. Whether you are mafia or not it IS alarming. | ||
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With only 1 critical vote no matter what tomorrow, I say we go for the Mandalor list and pick from there. By now we have a great amount of info on who is innocent on that list, and I'm sure we can easily hit a mafia target at will by now. | ||
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What was the evidence against ieatkids5 again? I think he was another sound suspect. | ||
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I'm going to vote on LYS as today's top suspect. Assuming it's too late since I haven't recieved a pm about being role blocked I am declaring a double lynch for today. Second top suspect is possibly sureshot, but I think we have better odds with a few others. | ||
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On April 29 2008 17:30 Plexa wrote: you make it sound easy~~ clazziquai ZBiR suresh0t Lysithea Ninja4ever SoleSteeler Jimtudor zeks SoMuchBetter ieatkids5 may i suggest SMB, ieatkids or clazziquai I agree with ieatkids as the top suspect out of those for now. Him and LYS are my choices for today. | ||
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On May 10 2008 23:27 jtan wrote: The most suspicious thing about me is probably that I join the game now, which I obviously wouldn't do if I was mafia actually that makes you look more like mafia. Posting once your name satrts to be posted consistently and with stronger ties is very mafia like. | ||
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Grandim you were great man, spectacular help all this time man Double Lynch today! | ||
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Whats the reason for abandoning Ninja4ever? Sureshot can wait. | ||
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Double lynch won't be withdrawn for sure though. | ||
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On May 20 2008 13:49 suresh0t wrote: ok shallow i am fucked, just like every fucking mafia has tried to get me lynched or ninja4ever lynched. I guarentee that if you killed either of us we would be green. i'm sorry i defended myself for the uptenth time from qrs who has voted for me every time. how are you so sure Ninjaever is innocent? @MM: I had you protected on previous nights, I wasn't really giving medics orders last night. I dont know what happened. | ||
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On May 20 2008 21:44 RtS)Night[Mare wrote: infundibulum HAS to be california mountain snake: looking at today's clues, noticehow he uses a swinging (spinning?) metal object to slice hollander's head off. Now look at infundibulum's picture. It's a guy whose hat has an blades spinning around. It sounds to me that he could very probably take his hat off and let the blade slice hollander's head. (plus, it fits they are sharp). ooo I like this post ^_^ | ||
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On May 24 2008 02:20 randombum wrote: Also killing ace but not killing me would not prove me mafia. It would have if you did not mention it, but now that you have mafia might let me live just so the town wastes a lynch on me. Ace would die because he has all the information and can lead the town far better than I can. If the game gets close Mafia can't afford to be that stupid. They surely WOULD kill you if you are innocent. ie I'm dead and now the only thing stopping them from surely getting an extra kill in (day lynch) is an innocent pardoner who might see a bandwagon forming and pardon the person. Mafia would kill you without a second thought. They wouldn't take the chance. | ||
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I'm declaring a DOUBLE LYNCH. Townies, listen to me. You all know I'm 100% innocent and that I know what I'm doing. I've taken a back seat in the past few days because some of my associates had to do their job and get things done. However, follow my lead because what is about to happen will save all of our asses. First of all, my last bodyguard will surely die tonight. It is no surprise that Mafia have been having 100% good hit rates TOO many times. This said, this is THE most important vote of the game. First of all this is my LAST double lynch. Second of all, I was hit last night but survived. That means the already want me dead asap. LTT and SpiritofTheTuna MUST be lynched today. BOTH of them. I'm damn near 100% sure both of these guys will turn RED. Secondly, if randombum pardons either one of them he is 100% mafia. After today's lynches I will reveal one of my associates findings and put out the entire MAFIA LIST. Townies -everyone must vote! | ||
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Townies also take note, 6 out of 7 of the Vets are still alive and none of them except ONE have EVER told me they've been hit - he ended up dying. | ||
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Happy Birthday btw! | ||
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However, we do know what happened the second time. | ||
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Good job on supporting the vote yesterday Townies., and even you Mafia that jumped on the vote train. I've only got a limited amount of time so I'm about to reveal the first half of a crucial set of information. During the latter half of the game, the entire list of roles that I had written down got transmitted and posted on the site. It was hidden in some old threads from last year. It was virtually impossible for those posts to be found. Well, remember we all thought it was odd that 4 blues died in one night and that barely any vets got hit? (small correction from the other night, 2 other vets both got hit once each). To find that list, you would have had to search through someone's post history or get really,really lucky. We doubt anyone had that much luck because the blues that got hit were all a mix of something: quiet, random, vocal, even some suspected publicly. That said, this leads me to believe that Bockit is Mafia - he has the power as an admin to search through anyone's post history. He would undoubtedly be able to see edits to previous posts. Even better, Bockit claimed to a Vet. The game is coming down to the wire and before long the entire list of roles will be revealed. That way we corner mafia because they can't kill all the vets, but if they keep killing townies they will out themselves eventually. When Bockit turns red, the other 7 living Vets will be auto-blued and know who each other are via the publicized list. With a kill power of 4, which will be down to it's minimum at 3 very soon Mafia will have a hard time killing all the vets AND townies. None of them will be able to role claim vet because the list will be public and they can't argue against it. | ||
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randombum can't pardon anyone at this point because it would make no sense. All deaths at this point no matter who it is is good for the town. If he pardons anyone it won't look good on his part. With 7( 2 at 2 life) vets, technically we have 40 + 15 + 4 or 59 hits of life left as a town. With a KP of 4 that means it would take almost 15 nights, or at best for the mafia 12 if we killed only townies every day to win the game. Have faith guys, even with so many blues dead we had a bunch of crucial info + awesome townies that took the charge. Remember, lynch according to the Mandalor list first. Look at Plexa's old posts and get those names first. But before everything, Bockit is the next to be lynched. | ||
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On May 27 2008 08:38 L wrote: Mandalor found the list by searching through threads that has his name it in. There was no abuse of TL.net powers, or edit reading. either way you're dead, just let my post sit there for now | ||
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just why would you reveal that info right now? | ||
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Also I've never claimed that you cheated, in fact searching post histories I thought was valid? | ||
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Well interesting thing is if Mandalor searched threads for his name ROOOOOOOOOOOFL. Go ahead, do a search for "Mandalor". True dedication. | ||
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Before we lynch Bockit townies, lynch randombum. This has been a long time in the works and a lot of people have contributed over time, so here is the overall analysis. Clues. I can't remember who it was that brought it up SO long ago, but someone said that a "bum like" clue appeared in a Day post. It pointed to both bumatlarge and randombum but we all dropped it. Well bumatlarge turned out to be INNOCENT. Added to that, look at these clue interpretations that ALL point to randombum. + Show Spoiler + Copperhead and Mr. Black were the first to act as they broke into the home of JeeJee. But as they broke the glass of one of his windows JeeJee woke up and grabbed his trusty baseball bat and headed down the stairs to meet them. He crept down slowly and peered around the corner to see Copperhead standing in wait for Mr. Black as he climbed in through the window. JeeJee didn't waste anytime waiting and charged at Copperhead with the bat but Mr. Black caught it with his hand and yanked it from JeeJee. JeeJee grabbed it and tried getting it back from him only to find it was stuck to his hand now. (this is a random event) Mr. Black wouldn't let him pass though, standing in front of the door, so JeeJee decided to put his new weapon to good use, he thrusted down hard toward Mr. Black's face but Mr. Black defended with the baseball bat and the knife drove through it. Mr. Black disarmed JeeJee, twisting the bat to the side and bashed him over the head with it. As JeeJee lay stunned on the ground (again an unexpected, random event) Mr. Black pulled the knife out and drove it through JeeJee's chest ending his life. he panicked and turned around to get out as fast as he could but found three mafia in his way. Eddie, Enigma, and Mr. Black were all ready to get a piece of KH1031 but found someone else doing their dirty work (interesting choice of words?) for them. "We love what you've done here, but you're just as much a risk to us so you've got to go as well" said Mr. Black. Enigma had an ugly look on his face as he tackled decafchicken to the ground and Mr. Black followed up as they both started viciously beating him. Mr. Black approached the last target for the night, GrayArea. He found him taking out the trash before going to bed that night and ambushed him as he headed back. Throwing some foul smelling bones from the trash at GrayArea he got his attention. (why wash e hanging around the trash for?) GrayArea saw what was left of the dinner he caught on the ground and no sooner did he notice Mr. Black than was he already being attacked by him. Mr. Black drove a knife through GrayArea's arm and it sent him flinching back. He grabbed his arm and ran back towards the house to try to get help or call the cops. But Mr. Black sprinted after him and stabbed again in his back. GrayArea convulsed from the attack and fell to the ground. GrayArea had no escape at this point and Mr. Black finished him off by stabbing him through the heart from the back to finish him. Mr. Black wasn't out to find someone to kill he was just looking for a bar still open (oh i wonder why? perhaps he's a homeless drunk?) when he came across MoRe_mInErAls. Seeing no one around he thought to himself what an easy kill this would be so he took the opportunity and began to sneak up on MoRe_mInErAls. MoRe_mInErAls was standing outside an unmarked building as if guarding it when he noticed an eerie aroma wafting about. (this guy likes trash remember?) Right when he was about to investigate Mr. Black was behind him and choking him with a piece of rope. MoRe_mInErAls struggled and gasped for air, he tried hitting Mr. Black but only succeeding in knocking them both to the ground. He struggled another moment until finally MoRe_mInErAls died from suffocation. Look at this piece again when he came across MoRe_mInErAls. Seeing no one around he thought to himself what an easy kill this would be so he took the opportunity and began to sneak up on MoRe_mInErAls. MoRe_mInErAls was standing outside an unmarked building as if guarding it when he noticed an eerie aroma wafting about. More_Minerals was my bodyguard. But as Pardoner, randombum was ALSO being guarded by MM. Notice Mr.Black came up behind him and strangled him. Obviously catching MM off-guard from the one place MM wouldn't suspect - inside the very building he was guarding. Night drew on Liquidia and the town was filled with confidence. Day after day they were pinning down those with criminal intent. But that didn't mean the mafia weren't through. Their first victim this night was Energies. The mafia thought he posed a threat to them so he was number one on their list. Mr. Black crept into his room when he was sleeping trying his best not to wake Energies but an overwhelming stench wafted in with him and crinkled his nose. (stop eating garbage ffs) Energies sat up abruptly and looked around the room spotting Mr. Black. He reached for the gun at his bedside and fired off two rounds at Mr. Black but he had retreated into the hallway and began planning a new course of action. Energies chased after Mr. Black as fast he could into the hallway but didn't expect him to be right in front of him, (random!!) he hesitated and Mr. Black was able to disarm him. Mr. Black kicked him back and grabbed the weapon off the floor, before Energies could get up he had two bullet holes in his chest. (what a thief!!) Notes about Mr.Black - He never brings a weapon to the scene - Always steals people's weapons - Smells and hangs out by trash - Is random - caught More_Minerals, a bodyguard off-guard while he was guarding an unmarked building Behavior and Alliances Probably the second most damning thing against randombum is his behavior this game. If you would please remember back in March when this game started what were the 2 major reasons people supported randombum? 1.) He was good at figuring out clues from the first game 2.) He was highly active via the mass PM before the game started He promised to be very active. However, randombum has been pretty much gone the entire game. He hasn't even led us to any mafia members and he is supposed to be active. However, there is one more disturbing piece of information: The Empyrean debacle. Everyone look at the beginning of this game starting around page 18, and then look at the Day 1(Mayor) votes. Remember who has been confirmed Mafia so far. We know Emp turned out innocent but look at the voting patterns and the reasons listed and make the connections. REMEMBER when we all said trusting Emp was bad and that we'd like to have RB as Pardoner right? Keep that in mind. And now look at how some suspected mafia and confirmed mafia voted: BWdero I vote for randombum Reasoning: I like that he pm'd me. (I do realise it was a mass pm, but still) And, as CDRdude pointed out, all his votes were spot on last game. Combine that with mayor voting power, and we have a mafiakiller on our hands. qrs I have to admit that the thought crossed my mind to run myself, but after seeing the explosion of posts on the first day--forget it. If the pace stays even close to this, I'll never be able to keep up. For that reason, I vote for randombum. He says that he'll have the time to spend on this game, and he proved it by sending out over 100 PMs. ______ PS-Obviously, had I run, my campaign would not have been about me (who knows me?) but about my platform. So I may as well say what it would have been: these are the things I think are important for a mayor: The Mayor by QRS -Don't use double lynches unless we have a solid idea about who to use them on. In the last Mafia game, the town followed Tracil's rule of using double lynches every day (until they lynched the mayor) and they were both wasted. There is a limited supply, so we should use them wisely. -Delegate. This game is so huge it will be very hard for one person to keep track of everything. Assign several people to keep track of people's profile quotes and any other evidence on them. Better, ask everyone to keep track of, say, the two people above them on the list of participants. That makes things more manageable. (OK, it wasn't a huge platform. ) Ninja4ever I vote for randombum ! ========== Start thinking about the plan to get Randombum elected Pardoner about now Shallow[bay] i vote for randombum PM's are an excellent method of votegetting crazie=penguin I withdraw my vote from Empyrean and give it to randombum as I've been swayed by recent posts in this blog and the Day 1 Thread and Ace seems to already have enough votes. L I vote for randombum on the basis that his candidacy was pre-game and the fact that he isn't Emp. LTT I change my vote to randombum as Bob needs a miracle and based on the current information I think it would be wise to avoid electing Emp. unforgiven_ve i vote for randombum i think he's trusthwhorty enough cause he was campaining PRE-game wtf guys? empyrean voted for Ace...and Ace voted for randonbum someone running for mayor should/whould ABSTAIN or vote for someone whit no chance...this is just stupid/fishy i dont like what im seeing Ocz3c I honestly don't know who to think is mafia and who isn't, especially this early in the game. Under these conditions, I should abstain... But I guess the only person who actually asked for a vote from me was Randombum (and through a PM), and that was before the actual game began. Ace has just wayyy too many votes, and that adds a lot of suspicions... I vote for Randombum. BlindAlbino Changing my vote from Ace to Randombum, seems Ace/empyrean are in this together from recent posts clazziqui I change my vote from Ace to now randombum for mayor Why? I really do think Ace will be a good mayor. However, his plan is going into effect regardless of his position in the election. But his presentation of the plan was a powerful move that mafia could have used to secure the election and snipe the mayor position. randombum being the least likely person to be mafia due to his pre-game campaign would get the best of both worlds. Queasy I changed my vote to Ace on the pure notion that I just didn't want Empyrean in office. Since it looks like Empyrean is safely out of the running, I wish to change my vote from Ace to Randombum. Look at the voting patterns especially toward the end and who voted for Randombum and the reasons (even though it was clear that Emp lost the race). It's important because I only got the Mayor vote by TWO votes. Mafia possibly were hoping enough people switched at the last minute to get randombum into office as Mayor. Mandalor list Keep in mind everything you have just read. Now look at the reduced Mandalor list: shallow zbir ocz3c romance_us lysithea randombum jimtudor bwdero we are sure that 4 of these guys are Mafia. | ||
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Notice on the last page he knew about the publicly posted Mandalor list before I even revealed it. NONE of us that knew of it ever told him about it. How did qrs know about it? Also qrs when Plexa accused LTT why did you stick up for him, knowing that we all knew Plexa was doing well with clues? On May 24 2008 01:52 qrs wrote: LTT is on bumatlarge's list of innocents, which has proven correct so far. I doubt that he's Mafia. So qrs with that said just answer these TWO questions: How did you find out about the list and WHY did you defend LTT? | ||
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The IRC channel was on a random server with a random channel name - no one would find it unless they were specifically looking for it or we somehow posted the info. If the info was posted chances are the password would have been posted too, so your point doesn't really make sense. | ||
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On May 27 2008 22:09 araav wrote: randombum was my suspect long time ago, when my simple call for him to prove his innosense wasn't accepted: see here in my posting list - http://teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?currentpage=2&topic_id=69736currentpage=2&topic_id=69736 but still, i suggest for now not to lynch randombum and bockit (unless a stronger evidence is found) and concentrate on the reduced mandalor list provided by Ace. araav a lot of people have suspected others but we have to wait till we have more proof to lynch people. Randombum is 100% mafia, trust me on this. Right now lynching randombum is our best move so he can not pardon anyone. Out of all the suspects he has by far the most evidence stacked AGAINST him. qrs how could you have found it. In fact you found it pretty quick, what did you search? And you've been against me EVEN when we were doing the right things. I don't think it matters if I mess up because every single time I have I've given reasons for why we have done things. Unlike you, majority of the town has listened to my plan because it's better than sitting there and complaining about how many Blues died or some random thing like you always do. Look at how the game is going - the town still has a major advantage over the mafia. and read my last post about Mr.Black - those bum clues point to randombum not Queasy/Sidewinder. | ||
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1.) vote randombum to be lynched the next day 2.) vote to lynch bockit the day after 3.) look at the mandalor and showtime! lists as your guide, a long with posts by notable townies | ||
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sup! | ||
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On June 17 2008 14:36 crazie-penguin wrote: wow cant believe mafia are still in this. Doesn't matter who wins, the mafia was the better team even with all the gay imbalances against us. What imbalances? I'm interested in hearing it thru PM. | ||
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I'm interested in knowing what they felt were the imbalanced things that messed them up after game is over | ||
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On June 17 2008 18:44 Alethios wrote: Now i'm going to have to disagree with you here. I realise that a game can be very imbalanced towards Town or Mafia... but my point is that no individual thing is per se imbalanced. Furthermore, i'll show that this game is not in and of itself imbalanced. But more on that once the game ends. On that note... lets put aside the Meta-Mafia discussion until later eh? understood. I find it funny that they claim Mafia is the "better team" when they made several huge mistakes themselves even with a couple of big breaks. Also the game has to use clues of some sort, or else almost everything is a "shot in the dark" so to speak. Also there were a lot of MVP candidates early in the game b4 Plexa and co arrived Caller, Lenwe, Emp, Hittegods, dinm/decaf all did some crucial things + other players. | ||
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3 months of game time murdered this game. | ||
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The only thing he arguably did wrong was write it in green but any decent townie would know it's not proof of their innocence. The hardest part was like what others said - clues. I think the townies should have just stayed with the inactives and kept the game going (no offense to the new guys brought in) to avoid all this :/ | ||
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whats going on with the game? | ||
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So I'm interested in hearing from the Mafia what things they thought were unfair and what the hell happened with the irc incident | ||
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Quick breakdown from my P.O.V. The beginning was myself and Ghar talking a lot of strategy. This was why I was defending Ghar so much early in the game. Caller and Lenwe were a major help with figuring things out. Once we realized we could trust Empyrean him and the other detectives were great. Showtime! was cool, I purposely didn't even say much to stop him from being bad because everyone on the inside knew Showtime! would live, and we all were sure he was innocent. HE wasn't too bad at clue breakdowns either. Plexa came to me after I was silent for a few days. Then Camlito came around. When we all died and Hotzhot became a prime suspect I thought about that mirror stuff and called it on hotzhot. If you look at the "z" as the axis and think of a 2-sided mirror you realize what hotzhot looks like I left out a ton but I'll eventually remember more. | ||
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On August 05 2008 10:18 Alethios wrote: Oh that was nasty Mandalor... Yeah... so I was the guy who delivered the dying wishes of Ace and the boys As some have said, myself, Scorch, Wysp and Nemy formed a detective team of sorts... I tried to keep my head down... attacking Ace at times... trying to give the impression I was just a spamming nobody... but you killed me off just before I could implement my master plan. (Was this just blind luck or did you suspect how much information would die with me?) Oh well... GG! a couple of people played that role nicely - appearing as an enemy to me in public but really being cooperative with the town. qrs was a jackass though. He was never really helpful to me when I was alive, and pretty much only became useful once everyone else was dead and almost all of the work was done. If you would have read the last posts by myself and Plexa you would see some interesting connections | ||
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This isn't about what happened months ago - this was an ongoing thing which most of us were watching while wondering what the hell you were doing. Literally, Plexa and Co had to convince me you were just a horrible townie and not mafia because there were MANY times I was close to advocating your lynch. You were pretty much Mafia #21 and their MVP. | ||
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thats the part I dont get. Even if the channel was unpassworded how did you knew it existed? and even though Plexa gets a lot of credit, Camlito was the genius behind a lot of stuff. Really there were a lot of people that did much. very good game though. Even though I don't think Mafia would have won if you killed plexa early (Camlito was still alive) it is what it is. good game. | ||
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that chat log is AWESOME! hahahahahahahaha that makes waiting forever for the end of this game to end fucking worth it! <---creamed his pants about this thought: when it was found out the chat channel was infiltrated showtime! (Rk) goes: see, I told you guys to use fake nicks! ironically EVERYONE else who was blue didn't and the only vanilla townies did. hahaha | ||
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I'm guessing you did it on Empyrean's name since he was the only "known" blue at that point. but good shit, this has made me laugh so hard. | ||
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And of course I couldn't exactly go "hey whats empyrean's role" so that was moot. Mandalor tipped me off though in a reply PM that he knew what New104 was, like I figured he would putting 2 and 2 together, and I just scratched the role check plan. I think it was Caller that was like lets go ahead with the mass vote checking plan. When the IRC incident happened I was like thank god not all my bodyguards were ever in that channel so I just figured we could live a bit long. Also that IRC thing DID kill decaf. I had a plan with Plexa about how to figure it out and it turned out Kh101 was ALSO a legit blue. We were hoping that the worst case scenario didn't happen and it did. As for randombum being elected Mayor, I do remember saying hey townies lets not fuck me over. If RB got Mayor the game would have been chaotic. I could see him saying fuck your BG plan and shitting on everyone asap. As fo is it worth it for Mafia to take mayor and sacrifice themselves: at the beginning I said no. Just checking the vote list would incriminate a lot of people. But now I have mixed feelings. There were a lot of things I did as Mayor that probably seemed questionable - but I have no choice. As Mayor you pretty much have to be the "leader" and the person "in charge". Have to take a lot of shit from retarded townies, have to try an sift through bullshit PMs (I think LTT sent me something), and also try and keep people focused and on the right track. After this game I think if a Mafioso gets Mayor the town is in some shit. The fact that I was protected and pretty much confirmed innocent let a lot of people speak through me and keep themselves alive for a long time. | ||
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I can already see someone ready to kill Showtime! as soon as lynch time starts. | ||
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Originally randombum should have been vote checked asap after me. However when the Mandalor thing happened we immediately ditched it and went for vote checking. I was sure a lot of mafia would vote for mandalor to "fit in", and randombum wasn't a priority. The thinking was if he's in the Pardoner seat he can't pardon any surefire mafia for any reason or he'd incriminate himself. Empyrean wanted him as the top suspect but we never got around to it. Then I remember the bumatlarge/randombum debate. Somehow, some way we all lost track of it after bumatlarge turned green. Then came crunch time. When it was clear myself and Plexa were going to die pretty soon, we had to pool all of our knowledge together to make a clear case against everyone we had pinned. randombum who was always "there" as a suspect became top priority after a couple of things. 1.) Camlito or Plexa, one of them urged me he was surely mafia. They had clues linking to him. 2.) I noticed randombum, the same guy who promised to be so active was literally gone for most of the game. But it wasn't until I went back to earlier posts did it REALLY hit the fan - The Mayor vote. We started looking at known mafia and the mayor vote. I noticed that at the end, a few mafia voted to almost put randombum over even though by that point Empyrean was surely not going to be Pardoner. In one of the last posts before I died I outlined it, and we even noticed how some of their reasoning for putting RB up was just bullshit. Then I looked at the night where I think it was More_Minerals, one of my BGs died. It was staring us in the face of how the attacker came from the building MM was GUARDING. After all that, what really sealed the deal was this PM which explained how the hell dinmsab got killed: From: dinmsab Subject: mafia Date: 3/20/08 13:53 I'll go straight to the point... Empyrean is a detective, as a detective myself I have confirmed this using my powers. Its up to you guys to sway the public opinion to go against lynching him, if all fails... pardon him. I know some random guy running up to you and claiming to be a detective might be a bit weird and suspicious.. but I give u my word, I am a detective. The reason I pm'd both of you is because if anyone of 2 of you are mafia, and i die tomorrow.. the other will know. He sent me this along with sending it to randombum. Mafia didn't kill him right away which was a good move but when he died it definitely was a what the fuck moment. I had an explanation about this as a horrible move in my notes: A problem with dimsab is that he investigated EMP b4 even investigating me. If EMP was truly a DT and I was Mafia, that would be a really dumb move if he's Towny. He did this pretty much right after I was elected which means there was no time for any other DT to "be silent". That means dimsab is Mafia false claiming, or is really playing risky and didn't read the plan. 2 things: If Emp dies and is anything but DT, dimsab is surely Mafia. However, if dimsab dies and isn't Dt that doesn't implicate EMP, it could be a Mafia ploy hoping we kill EMP also just because a Mafia "vouched" for him. I definitely didn't suspect RB of being mafia so early in the game, but I never came back to this part of my notes at all later. Notes This is the very, very beginning of the game first impressions notes I had jotted down. Stop at top of 31 Suspects: ahrara_ - doesn't read or plainly is Mafia because he is calling a pretty logical plan bad (p.20). However, he caught on to Empyrean's bad logic to get the Mayoral election. His plan is to lynch the real DT anyway to see if he's legit...possibly bad, but can be good. He isn't 100% as dumb as he sounds though. aZnvaLiaNce - asking to put strategy behind us the first night, clearly stupid or crazy. says he supports me after the plan is posted. araav - ran for mayor on ridiculous pretenses SonofaBob - voted for araav on even more ridiculous pretenses CDRDude - shaky posts on page 21, calling araav's platform "good" when it was clearly crap Plexa - says never to trust an australian with 10 posts (Ghar) p.21 EvilMonkey - nonsense posts xDark.Carnivalx - seems logical for now but voted for Araav, bandwagoner? Naib - claims Araav's posts make the most sense when they clearly dont, accusing Ghar already Empryean claims DT on Mayor voting Day, so early when it isn't even needed much. He is clearly leading to some confusion among the Townies, and is already starting to point fingers (at ahrara). He "concedes" to me after he realizes it's almost a sure bet I will be elected Mayor, and instead Happily settles for Pardoner. He also isn't "defending" himself with any reason when suspicious posts of his are pointed out. Bockit - complete nonsense Somuchbetter - seems like a smart guy, understood the plan Ghar/myself suggested and is willing to embrace it. Amber[Light] - thought he was smart, but posted something completely off the wall that no sane person would have - I think he may be scum Lenwe - voted for randombum, but posted a pretty good reason for why. Is playing cautious. qrs - thinking way too much about the wrong things,however is willing to follow the BodyGuard Plan and has seen how it works out. He questions almost everything I do, which is good but it seems to come from posts other people make. Hopefully it's just enthusiam and not a sheepish mentality over proving my status. Heros)Pink - saying not to put Ghar in position because clues point to him even though they really dont, is vying for Empyrean against me and Ghar. THis dude is very odd, as even when logic stares him in the face he refuses to look. RtS)Night[Mare - think Empryean wouldn't be Mafia again is a bad idea to start off with. advocated voting on only 4 players and "closing the vote" even when only 35 votes were cast. Blindly supporting Empyrean even when it's obvious Emp is acting weird. L - seems to be thinking smart. Sharp guy, seems to be supporting me. BWdero - puts Ghar on his suspect list just because others have also, bandwagoner? Klive5ive - is very opposed to myself and Ghar for Mayor. Klive is also supporting voting for Empryean. He is trying to post logical, but his logic is clearly backwards. Mafia? Is VERY opposed to myself and Ghar. He even sounds shady when posting as he wants to kill Townies somewhat fast. He also supported araav. Extremely blind support of Empyrean, assumes he is innocent off the bat. Falcynn - Seems to be working towards the greater goal of the Town. Seems logical. Shallow[Bay] - very off the wall, but is posting clues which helps. He may be a hidden weapon against Mafia if he would stop being so crazy. Mynock - seems very logical in his posts, levelheaded for sure Yogurt - what the fuck? supporting Empyrean based on nonsense. Changed his vote to me AFTER empyrean "conceded" his election to me. His first vote for Empyrean was in the midst of nowhere. Falcynn - as of now I think he may be Townie, as he is generally helpful with everything he does. votes with logic and questions stupidity. Hittegods - seems genuinely interested in how the plan works. spoinka - voted for me asap but doesn't post often Naib - also voted for me even though he seems to be second guessing himself GeneralStan - seems genuinely good, smart enough to see Empyrean's shit Lysithea - decent JeeJee - heavily against Empyrean and all he stands for Last Romantic - likes the bodyguard plan but voted for Empyrean and would vote for araav Ziel - supports Bodyguard plan and Ghar, realizes we must carry the plan out zeks -quiet towny, not really bad so far. advocates Mayor and Paronder work together caller - admits to being a flip flop, wants Pardoner Hollander - vigilant in getting clues bumatlarge -called out empyrean to prove his innocent Wysp - seems like a solid, reasonable guy. Has been against Empyrean from the get go. LucasWoj - seems to be a misguided townie, not sure of what to do at all. May have good intentions but he claims medic, and claimed to protect Shallow[bay] the first night. | ||
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This is just some stuff I'm sure townies would like to see that I just looked at. rom: randombum Subject: Re: dimsaab Date: 3/21/08 12:24 Yea that's pretty much how I feel. We'll see if any dts come forward and say you are mafia. Even if dimsaab is mafia false claiming then if nobody says anything about you, it will be safer to assume you are townie. I'll just wait to see what happens. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Yea I got his PM, and yes I made a note of it that he could be trying to trick us. I'm not 100% sure of your innocence yet but I'm gonna share the note I had made: A problem with dimsab is that he investigated EMP b4 even investigating me. If EMP was truly a DT and I was Mafia, that would be a really dumb move if he's Towny. He did this pretty much right after I was elected which means there was no time for any other DT to "be silent". That means dimsab is Mafia false claiming, or is really playing risky and didn't read the plan. 2 things: If Emp dies and is anything but DT, dimsab is surely Mafia. However, if dimsab dies and isn't Dt that doesn't implicate EMP, it could be a Mafia ploy hoping we kill EMP also just because a Mafia "vouched" for him. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Hey, did you get a PM from dimsaab about a certain few powers of some people? What do you think of it. Could he be a mafia trying to trick me? Did you get his PM? Could he be tricking both of us? Your thoughts? This is from Showtime after CTStalker died: From: Showtime! Subject: fuck Date: 3/22/08 23:51 ok so not ctstalker. new list of Australians: RodierBob Fen Ghar Gotta love showtime haha From: BWdero Subject: my mafia role Date: 3/23/08 01:23 Alright, day 2 has come and no detective has spoken up. This combined with your excellent posts has convinced me 100% that you are not a mafia. So I hereby send you my role: I am but a simple townie. Go get those mafia basterds. From: ShaLLoW[baY] Subject: Re: Mafia Date: 3/23/08 11:00 Alright, but in my opinion Ghar's case is pretty solid. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I won't tell you yet because once I figure something else out I need everyone to act in unison. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Alright, I've placed my vote for Ghar because that MSPaint is very, very incriminating; unless there's someone you'd rather I vote for instead? I'd prefer you told me who to change to via PM though. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: understood, but right now some more pressing information has come up. Pretty much a Mafia member is getting lynched today for sure. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I really think there's a solid case against Caller, as lots of objects in his signature reference clues dropped in the game (lead, mud, etc.) Just so you know From: 0cz3c Subject: Re: Recommendation Date: 3/24/08 05:24 Oh, I see. Sorry for the attack then. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I know, but if I post the list of suspects *right now* something bad might happen. I'm hoping to hope this one person responds to me asap so I dont have to put an innocent potentially into the cross fire by revealing their role. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I'd recommend you post who is mafia VERY soon (even if the list is one person). You have 8 hours as of now before Chuiu officially would declare NIGHT, and in that time, certainly 123 people will NOT be on. A large part that has voted for Ghar might be away celebrating Easter, and might never abstain (never get the chance to). Expecting PMs on Easter is a bad idea -- ALOT of people are away. The rest of us awaiting your post can't be on forever to vote the way you suggest. From: Mandalor Subject: Re: info Date: 3/24/08 06:48 Well at least I know what new104's role is now lol ----------------------------------------- Original Message: lol nice try ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Omg I just came back from the easter fires. New104 is a bodyguard. fuck I hope you can have the votes withdrawn from me lol ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I need that info asap. From: 0cz3c Subject: DT Check Date: 3/25/08 00:30 I think you should ask a DT to ask Chuiu how many mafia voted for Ghar. It's a smaller number, so it can be narrowed down quicker and more substantially. Furthermore, would a DT be able to check Abstain? Because once all three are checked, it establishes how many mafia are inactive/laying low. If 1. They are inactive -- That's awesome for us, since we can concentrate on killing the active, sure, obvious ones. 2. They are laying low -- You can force them to come out into the open. For example -- they might be laying low because a previous clue was linked to them. Those that haven't responded to last night's accusations can be examples. It's easier to kill the number of mafia that are actually posting in the thread when we know how many are posting in the thread. From: Showtime! Subject: I'm trying to push Plexa around Date: 3/25/08 22:41 to see if my suspicions are correct. I still believe shadowdrgn or MG should bite the bullet tonight along with Heros and Ghar. Like I said before I would at least go with shadow, Ghar and Heros. You need to take some control back over the townies and by using force. From: ShaLLoW[baY] Subject: mafia Date: 3/28/08 10:22 I know Pink is a Paramedic, I'm just posting to divert mafia attention because he made it pretty obvious with his post. From: Showtime! Subject: wtf is aarav Date: 3/28/08 11:38 doing in the channeL? I thought you told me you suspected him. From: araav Subject: Re: info Date: 3/29/08 00:54 Ace, you are right, sure. not a big deal. But why would we make the town think I am mafia? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: just ignore Showtime. No idea why he is making this such a big deal. I didn't even pay it any mind when I realized whoever got in there couldn't have known enough info about the roles because nothing in there was revealed. They basically only know everyone in there was innocent which doesn't do much. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Ace, then please explain me what will we get out of this farce? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: yea I saw it, I kicked the person out. I know you're a confirmed innocent but we'll just act like you're a mafia for now. Showtime is making it a much bigger deal than it needs to be, whoever came in that channel only saw 3 or 4 names max I think, and another name that was codenamed. Either way something fishy happened but I wasn't around to find out. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Ace, you sure? Have you seen it with your eyes? Then we - the town - are in trouble! ----------------------------------------- Original Message: You said you didn't know about the channel at all? Someone came in with the name araav... From: araav Subject: Re: info Date: 3/29/08 01:17 ok, your choise. let's see what happens. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: so the Mafia wouldnt hit you at night if we think you're a suspect. I mean some of us KNOW you're innocent, but they dont know that. From: LTT Subject: Re: A thought Date: 3/29/08 01:34 Alright. I feel a little better about it now. I guess I was just freaking out that all of our detectives/bodyguards were going to die tonight and that we wouldn't get any information from the two vote split plan because all the votes are currently muddled. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Araav was already a suspect anyway, but I didnt want to use a role check at all. I got into the room way after everything happened and was catching up with everyone. I thought it wasn't araav at all to be dumb enough to use his real name, but we had to be sure so we wasted a check. The thing is the IRC channel is impossible to guess so something went wrong, and I think I have an idea how. The good thing is, it wasn't all blues in that channel, nor all the DTs or Bodyguards. Some of them dont even jump in the IRC channel. It was impossible for whoever it was to know what was what, and afaik no one revealed any critical info. But yes, it's made the game more exciting. I think after today/tonight's results we'll stop being so "careful" and just have more fun. There is no point in playing if everyone isnt having fun no matter who wins or loses. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Well, it sounds like it is time to weigh in. I stopped caring about this thread as soon as it was clear what was happening. Ace, your plan was great but it made the game rediculously boring for those of us who weren't in the loop. I made the comment to Bob that it felt like you were turning the game into a Single player game. Ace vs Mafia. Extremely effective, but not much fun for the rest of us. There was no incentive to play at all because even if we managed to win, it wouldn't be due to anything us peons did. This araav thing seems to have changed things though. From these last few pages, it sounds like you used a rolecheck to clear him. I think using role checks at this point is a very bad idea. Even if araav was cleared, what guarantee do you have that it was really him who got into your chatroom? I believe you said this was an IRC channel. I hang out in the teamliquid channel all the time. Changing your name is a simple as typing /nick (newnickname). If araav was the culprit, why would he use his real name? Is there some other information that you got that convinced you it was araav? If you aren't certain, I think we have to assume that mafia got into your channel somehow. You said they only learned the names of 6 blues. If ANY of those blues are detectives, your original plan is in trouble. Without the ability to check the votes it is going to be much harder to find the 10 mafia in the two group split. If detectives are at risk, I'd advise you to use them to get as many numbers as you can right now. Those numbers will help us much more down the road than an individual role check will. And why the double lynch? Getting two mafia would be great, but the "vote for whoever you want" on the second vote seems like it ruins the two group split plan. I really think you should direct our votes a little better and very quickly. Barring a kidney stone flare up, there is less than 11 hours left until voting ends. From: Plexa Subject: Re: Innocent List Date: 4/11/08 15:26 vigils get two shots right? 1) Queasy 2) Chez ----------------------------------------- Original Message: yea, which means Energies is almost out of kills. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Chezinu was hit by energies I know fusionsdf is innocent (or rather 99% sure) and he gave me a choice between chezinu and fusion im sorry about that.... originally we were planning to hit SMB but we decided to follow the plan ----------------------------------------- Original Message: well if EvilMonkey turns out Mafia, all the others have to be innocent. I thought Chezinu was innocent also but the Vigis hit him. I dont even know which Vigi hit bumatlarge but more importantly I just got this PM: To: imDerek Subject: Re: about night 4 Date: 4/11/08 15:16 didnt know ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I'm not sure if you counted me in when you made the extremely important post, but I also protected Plexa in night 4. did you know this or not? 4 people protecting Plexa? I didn't tell imDerek to do anything but I don't think he's guilty yet. After this lynching, if EM comes up Mafia well imderek is innocent. If he's green we've got a situation. Either way Grandim and Hollander are both 100% legit at this point. L, HerosPink, imderek, and KH are suspects with the former 2 being my main picks for liars right now. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: ok, just making sure there isn't anything lying around you think fusionsdf is innocent btw? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: which ones? Almost everything is in the thread at some points. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: One more thing, if its possible could you give me some dt lists? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: nope none of them knew others were protecting you. L, Heros and Grandim all protected you. The latter told me you took a hit, L didn't he just told me "good call" in a PM. Hollander covered Lenwe. KH101 covered Decafchicken. And I told decaf to assume vet status last night and he said he did. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: one more thing about the meds; who were protecting me? and did they know about the others? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: This is the original info on medics Medics(8/7): LucasWoJ(#) - claimed to protect Shallowbay 1st night Grandim - claimed to have protected Falcynn 1st night, and Falcynn survived 1 hit against him HeRoS)Pink - claimed to protect x.dark (who wasnt targetted he says) wurm(#) - Falcynn says wurm sent him a PM claiming to have protected him imDerek - claims to have protected Alventenie first night, who survived 1 hit Hollander - claimed to have protected Emp who did not get hit L - claimed medic role, protected Emp night 1 KH1031 - claimed to have protected Emp night 1 Hollander and Grandim are almost surely innocent. imderek possibly. L, Heros and KH are suspect but I have to go back and check past PMs - I think KH is legit. Of course Lucas and wurm are both dead. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: how does our medic list shape up? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: oh btw let me explain the full situation: The chat room had in total at any one time: Showtime! 4 BGS 3 DTS 1 Jack (supposed) The problem was with the Jack. He might have messed up some info, might not but I was still suspicious up until Day 2 - someone would have had to come forward by then but no one did. Then something strange happened. He kept telling me he was using his DT powers "all the time" and Chuiu was forgetting. This was my first alert. The second was the list, I didn't think ALL those guys were innocent. HE was "confusing" himself by saying he meant to check the "randombumlist" but checked the "bumatlarge" list. Either way this doesn't make sense with the adding and deleting some names. The FINAL nail in the coffin? 3 BGS died in one night - only the ones in the channel. The info had to be leaked because the channel was on a different server from the TL.net channel purposely AND you had to guess the name. So in confidence for now, I'm giving you the name - DECAFCHICKEN. See if you can find any clues to him. So far I've seen his name pop up once. Good luck in your analysis. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Thats fine with me ----------------------------------------- Original Message: later tonight, as you can see I'll be having to go through a lot of info to change things around now. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Hey Ace, I hope you can still trust that i am a townie after that incident of arkive being mafia. Anyway, possible you could send me over a list of innocents? Would mean i could better focus my searching ^^ From: Plexa Subject: Re: Medics Date: 4/11/08 17:40 kk better spend them wisely then! ----------------------------------------- Original Message: also Energies(Ordell) kills look like this. 1.)Queasy 2.)Chezinu BC(Max) 1.) Shadowdragon butIdigress(louis?) 1.) bumatlarge So we should have 4 total vigi kills left. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: ok awesome - we'll let naruto sit tight tonight then ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Im with it. I'll give the order to BloodyCobbler tomorrow night. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I propose this, we vigil KH If he is medic, then we know decaf is blue If he is red, then we celebrate and know decaf is red Medic is less important than jack so its better to do it this way imo ----------------------------------------- Original Message: well it's a gamble but... If a vigi kills decaf who has so much evidence pointing towards him right now turns him Mafia, then KH101 is Mafia because he lied and we just caught 2 for the price of 1 and our medic problem should be over. If decaf turns blue well we dont know shit about KH101 yet anyway. If anyone else turns out Mafia from the meds that should make both of them legit. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: kk ill keep that in mind ----------------------------------------- Original Message: and Heros too. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: So right now our medic suspects are L and KH right? From: decafchicken Subject: Re: holy shit Date: 4/12/08 07:22 yea i know people are skeptical of azn, but he's def innocent. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: so those 2 are innocent? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: OH FUCK i just realized what happened with the voting. I MEANT to check bumatlarge, and asked for randombum(confirmed via screenshot of my PM to chuiu) instead (must've mixed up the two bum names T_T), which is why i sent you the list of 11 people or w/e that voted for bumatlarge, when i should have sent you this list of innocents: aZnvaLiaNce SonuvBob(2) who voted for randombum sorry for the massive fuck up T_T ----------------------------------------- Original Message: screen shot it ----------------------------------------- Original Message: so i just read the mafia thread...and it looks like i fucked up or something? here's the PM from when i did a vote check: 0. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: i'd like to use my detective ability and know how many mafia voted for randombum oh so i guess i did mean random bum and not bumatlarge, my bad. then i just copied the first list i saw in the vote thread. and it definitely was somebody else, because i got hit too (i will screenshot my inbox if you want T_T) From: Plexa Subject: Re: correction Date: 4/12/08 19:03 kk awesome ----------------------------------------- Original Message: that list of 6 innocents is one of my first priorities atm ----------------------------------------- Original Message: try to get some protection of fusionsdf - atleast if i day you still have him around. He's really great at analysing stuff and im worried that mafia will try to hit him and me ----------------------------------------- Original Message: nothing is set up yet, I've been thinking of an alternate plan just in case Decaf is innocent and KH is innocent too. I'll get to that later. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: T_T how are the protections looking for tonight? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: almost I'm about to update you on some PMs I received. Everytime I want to clear Heros)Pink as being 100% legit he does something to make me doubt him. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Re: the medic situation If KH turns blue, then we know L is mafia If KH turns red, then we know Decaf is red ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I kept calling him KH101, its KH1031 From: Plexa Subject: Re: First - Decaf situation Date: 4/12/08 19:24 Thats quite a good plan actually :O ----------------------------------------- Original Message: he hasn't used anything today. However, I'm thinking about how to use him to our advantage. I'm thinking of making him be a Vigi and carry a hit out on a high priority target. Having him hit KH1031 may be a good idea. If they are both Mafia, KH1031 can't die and decaf is found out to be mafia by default. Decaf can't be mafia and KH1031 be innocent because that would mean a vigi acted w/o telling any of us he put a hit on decaf. Highly unlikely. If both are innocent, well we only lose a medic without giving any info to anyone else not in the situation which is better than what we had before. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Thats believable - whats his role today? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Here is a series of PMs between myself and Decaf where he tries to explain his slip up: From: decafchicken Subject: Re: holy shit Date: 4/12/08 07:22 yea i know people are skeptical of azn, but he's def innocent. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: so those 2 are innocent? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: OH FUCK i just realized what happened with the voting. I MEANT to check bumatlarge, and asked for randombum(confirmed via screenshot of my PM to chuiu) instead (must've mixed up the two bum names T_T), which is why i sent you the list of 11 people or w/e that voted for bumatlarge, when i should have sent you this list of innocents: aZnvaLiaNce SonuvBob(2) who voted for randombum sorry for the massive fuck up T_T ----------------------------------------- Original Message: screen shot it ----------------------------------------- Original Message: so i just read the mafia thread...and it looks like i fucked up or something? here's the PM from when i did a vote check: 0. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: i'd like to use my detective ability and know how many mafia voted for randombum oh so i guess i did mean random bum and not bumatlarge, my bad. then i just copied the first list i saw in the vote thread. and it definitely was somebody else, because i got hit too (i will screenshot my inbox if you want T_T) --------------End of PMs Besides the compelling evidence of before if you notice Decaf has never sent me the PM as proof. I don't think I need to remind him of that because if he was really innocent I'm sure that would have been his first priority. Even though he could have really messed up by switching the names there's still the fact of the evidence from before. Right now him + KH1031 are high priority. From: Plexa Subject: Re: Second - The Pink situation Date: 4/12/08 20:05 pretty sure he did ----------------------------------------- Original Message: ok so then Naruto killed bumatlarge then. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: incorrect he has acted - he has one kill left ----------------------------------------- Original Message: but Naruto never acted so he shouldn't have an ID from the day posts. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: i can tell you who naruto is, but ill have to search my pms best to keep everything on a need to know basis i suppose ----------------------------------------- Original Message: well Naruto can't be Louis since he never acted which is making me wonder whats up with Pink's info. we know ahrara isn't ordell but of course pink may think so. No clue how he got KH1031 out to be max. I'm willing to let him think he's right just in case he is mafia - that would make tonight's kill list kind of a give away if Naruto died. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Interesting set of clues. Obviously, i know all the vigils and seeing KH's name come up initially is rather odd.. oh well... I doubt pink is mafia, but i don't know why they would hit Ordell anyway? He doesn't have any shots left haha but i suppose its a confidence blow for the town if we lose a vigil ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Heros)Pink has been off and on my radar countless times mostly for being brash and complaining I don't tell him anything. However this situation played out today. First thing I got is this PM from ahrara about Pink: From: ahrara_ Subject: heros)pink Date: 4/12/08 02:59 transcript of dialogue w/ heros)pink: I'm not really the vigi, but if I die tonight, you'll know Pink is mafia. it's cool cause i've been inactive the last couple days anyawy. --- ya, i am ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I really need this information to see if my other clues are good or not anyway at this time in the game you can tell me the truth, ask ace im a townie. Are you Ordell(vigi) (tell me the truth, anyway you doesnt have killed power anyway so it would be pointless to kill you (if i was mafia) ----End of PM Obviously I know who all the vigis are and their IDs. After reading this I thought ok, maybe it's just 2 innocents lying to each other because they dont trust one another which isn't a big deal. Then this series of PMs between myself and Pink occured: From: HeRoS)Pink Subject: Re: mafia Date: 4/12/08 05:03 first you have to tell me who is the false jack + who do you think is Louis, maybe its the same , I have been really carefull with the one saying he was Louis to me, never said anything about my role, just said i was pure townie. He said he was all the time talking with plexa.(can't prove that) The one I think is Louis is one of the few player accused in the beginning and that some poeple still think he's mafia ----------------------------------------- Original Message: really? well someone is lying about something because I have a good idea who Louis is. Who told you that they are Louis? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Ordell is araav because The main clue about Ordell is the running thing (jogged, etc) and araav_ is the only one related to that. but COULD LTT BE Max? my guess is that LTT is Either Max or Mr.Orange so mafia or townie so thats why I didnt post anything about him earlier since there could have been a bangwagon thing on him and could have been a vigi. we can't affort losing a vigi You probably know only 2 vigi? or theres one you know but never made him attack. I know who louis is and he said he never sent you his role, thats probably the reason of that dumb move on Chiezinu. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: neither are 100% innocent but we can't tell if they are guilty till tonight when a vigi goes active. why do you think araav is ordell? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: oups sorry for the other pm, Once again im asking for your help, I have figured out by myself that araav was Ordell, I also know who Louis is but not max yet, I need to know who are the player you are 100% sure about If you cannot provide me that list Tell me if LTT or L have been found innocent From: HeRoS)Pink Subject: Re: mafia again Date: 4/12/08 05:06 believe me I wont release any info. I need to know as many innocent as possible to get a smaller list of poeple to look at, and possibly relate caractere to a single player which would help us. I wonder why you arent cooperating with me, I'm on your 100% confirmed townie list, I know it. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I cant release the name yet, if he turns out innocent thru some other actions we are about to take then we dont want to accidentally let that info out. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: Please tell me who the false jack is atm, I could possibly relate a clue towards him, but from what you have said in the channel , you will either sent on him a vigi or he's either Siefu or Evilmonkey. From: HeRoS)Pink Subject: mafia Date: 4/12/08 05:14 can you at least confirm this Ordell : araav_ Max : KH1031 Louis : G.S)Naruto I've got no idea how he knows about Naruto except maybe someone told him. No idea how he came to KH1031. We see how he got araav. Of course both of us know this info is completely wrong. But Pink is begging for info on the Vigi identities. I don't think he's paying attention to whats been happening lately and exactly why I won't give him any info. Let me know what you make of these PMs From: Plexa Subject: Re: Hey Date: 4/14/08 11:56 thats interesting, i had forgotten about that.. nice to know he's up on a list ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I've always got qrs down because even when he knew I was innocent he'd still say "your still probably mafia" as if hoping to see if people would agree with him. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: T_T that would suck tremendously the other list that took my interest was CDRDude ulszz nemY araav infundibulum ahara_ nightmare qrs and none of those people except for infundibulum i've ever considered being mafia before =/ ----------------------------------------- Original Message: indeed. The worst case scenario is decaf, L, and KH1031 all being legit and dying. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: sureshots? i think.. im hoping midnight is mafia, i hope L is a medic well if gladius dies tonight then we know that L is more likely mafia ----------------------------------------- Original Message: for some reason I swear I saw a list like that and thought of L or Midnight Gladius being mafia. Which voting list was that off of again? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: herers ----------------------------------------- Heres an interesting fact; One out of; SmurfingChobo MTF unsoundlogic mightnightgladius L is mafia using this list and eliminating unlikely suspects we get left with midnight, MTF and L Original Message: I do also. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: KH is still a suspect though, and im pretty sure its between him and L.. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: decaf is still suspect remember. I told him to kill KH1031 tonight. I also had another idea about that. If we told one of our legit medics to protect KH1031, and decaf tried to kill him would that save KH1031? Then the medic would told us he got hit giving us the right info all in one night. What ya think? ----------------------------------------- Original Message: SonuvBob is innocent if Decaf's list is correct From: MTF Subject: Hey. Date: 4/16/08 16:18 First time PMing you and all, but I wanted to bring to your attention some things me and Plexa were discussing via PM. ----------------------------------------- Plexa: So we hit worst possible scenario last night ... What about L as mafia, he is on the "medic" list as well as on the L/chobo etc list ----------------------------------------- MTF: I think L might be Enigma. 1. According to the PM you sent me with the night assignments, L was asked to protect decafchicken on Night 5. 2. created L as a "force of justice" "why we're here to rid the world of good, because we're the only ones who can". 3. L Lawliet (エル・ローライト, Eru Rōraito?), commonly referred to by his alias "L" (エル, Eru?), is a fictional character in the manga and anime series Death Note. He is considered the world's greatest detective, noticed Enigma writing a note, perhaps with the intention to replace Empyreans findings with false ones to throw the town off. 4. Obata believes that the design evokes "a feeling of mystery" and that the reader cannot determine L's true thoughts. 5. Obata asked Ohba if L could be "unattractive." ----------------------------------------- Plexa: Me and Camlito reached the exact same conclusion about 20 minutes ago ----------------------------------------- MTF: So, what's the plan of action likely to look like? ----------------------------------------- Plexa: He's got to be mafia... theres just so much evidence against him... Either that or he is in the wrong place at the wrong time consistently ----------------------------------------- MTF: The fact that he protected decaf the night before and has such evidence pointed at him is enough to target him on, I think. Has he protected/did he know the role of anyone other than Emp and decaf? ----------------------------------------- Plexa: i dont know.. he's protected me before though ----------------------------------------- MTF: Well, you're obviously a target with or without Mafia knowing that for sure through a mole. XD I think it'd be a good idea to lynch King Mountain Snake and vigi-kill (if we have any of those left) L. Provided we're right and they both turn up red, Mafia kill power goes down to 6 and your mole is gone. ----------------------------------------- Plexa: Today is a difficult day because of the fact Ace is roleblocked =/ We have one vigil left - the others have used up their shots. I suppose its best to lynch penguin and vigil L because if L turns up blue then atleast it saves face From: Plexa Subject: Re: mistake Date: 4/16/08 19:48 Me, MTF and Camlito all arrived at the same conclusion at approximately the same time (~20mins in it i think) L is enigma, connection is from L the deathnote character ----------------------------------------- Original Message: the last PM I had it reversed. L is NOT confirmed, Pink is. Waiting on a PM. From: Camlito Subject: hi Date: 5/17/08 19:55 Me and plexa discussed it, and i said id have his balls if damagecontrol was mafia, becuase i was so sure of sureshot. Sureshot is my no.1 now just to let you know :D. From: Plexa Subject: So... Date: 6/3/08 12:39 What did i say!! I told you he was the saboteur Most logical place to hide him From: Plexa Subject: Re: lulz Date: 6/14/08 10:22 oh god he's hilarious ----------------------------------------- Original Message: hahaha ah yea I think that'll make him get lynched now. Pissing people off isnt a great way to do survive. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: lololol "Unlike many Americans, I actually have a work ethic and hold a desire for good grades." ----------------------------------------- Original Message: ah yea. He's making classic mafia mistakes now: accusing ppl who accuse him of being mafia typing all kinds of excuses why he was inactive says his name was thrown around b4 BUT he's never been so close to being lynched all kinds of dumb logic in all his posts he said other people are better mafia targets but cant name them lol oh man this is kinda sad ----------------------------------------- Original Message: roflllll epic mafia defense ----------------------------------------- Original Message: LMAO omg. Oz is really, really, really bad under pressure From: Alethios Subject: i seem to have died Date: 6/15/08 11:47 Shit. From: Plexa Subject: Re: gah Date: 7/8/08 15:42 nope pretty much everyone i've talked to that knows the mafia picked itu p ----------------------------------------- Original Message: I thought I was the only one to catch that hahahaha ----------------------------------------- Original Message: i know T_T its so goddam mafia rigged its rediculous seriously KF comes from nowhere, first post in this game, and votes for nemy ----------------------------------------- Original Message: lmao look at the list of people who voted for nemy. Good lord the town cant possibly fuck THIS up. ----------------------------------------- Original Message: one fucking vote -.- chuiu should of left it open for another 12~ hours There were also lots of Pms from MTF, Cam, ~Opz~, all the medics, my bodyguards, jeez a lot of people. Like I said there were many more contributors besides the main ones and it was a great town effort. This game was FUN | ||
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@Kau: no I didn't Vigi you. A few times the Vigis acted on their own. We vigi'd KH1031 though :/ | ||
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