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On June 27 2018 22:44 Regfan wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2018 22:37 Conversion wrote:
I’m not “dictating” how you play, I’m calling bullshit on you partly scumreading me because I’m trying to “debunk” your towncred. I had bad feelings about you even though what you were doing is town-aligned, hence the question to the thread. I moved on from it pretty quickly once it got no steam and I resolved myself you being most likely town and moving on to figuring out who I want to lynch D1.
If you don’t want me talking to your points, don’t ask me to softly clarify in your posts. Simple as that. Right, that's why you addressed none of my actual concerns and instead just insulted the way I play the game. Screw off. -G
Go ask more people on how to scumread people after making a 5 paragraph essay, then. See ya
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Vivax voted me so I decided to read him.
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On June 27 2018 22:44 ShoCkeyy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2018 22:33 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:29 ShoCkeyy wrote:On June 27 2018 22:21 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:17 ShoCkeyy wrote:On June 27 2018 22:08 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:04 ShoCkeyy wrote:Vivax, why can't it not be something they do? If he claims he can't die, there's only two reasons, he's a role, or he's mafia. There's a 50/50 chance, and if he doesn't die tonight, does that increase the likely hood he is mafia? So let me put it in easier terms, math. If there is three mafia shots, three town will die at night + the mislynch leaving us in a really bad spot for tomorrow. If there is two mafia shots, we're still in a bad spot for this next lynch and the following lynch after will really be the game breaker. If there is one mafia shot, we have three cycles to play. If he's already claiming something, then I rather take it as mafia who has a solid chance of surviving all three cycles if he's "unlynchable". On June 27 2018 21:47 Calix wrote:
Another bad post, eh? ^^
Since when did you very conveniently and opportunistically decide to scum-read me, may I ask? And for what reason?
That paragraph about AFKs being more likely town and rambling about the game starting date is filler.
Your town-read on Vivax is based on a very flimsy pre-flip association which will crumple like a house of cards. Do you have any substantial reason to town-read this guy? My town read is because Vivax town read you early into the game, and you've only been trying to get him lynched, which is even odder to me since it's both you and Tictock pushing for Vivax without any dialogue happening between you too. Huh? Mafia can't shoot multiple people in a night. I don't see how trying to lynch someone who TOWN-READS me is scummy since that means I'm trying to vote off someone who isn't going to vote for me...at a time when I'm being discussed as a lynch candidate. In no world does that make me mafia. TT is American iirc, I'm from the UK. We're not usually on at the same time ^^ How do you know they can't shoot multiple times? it doesn't say it in the rules, it just says this: Option A - 1 blue role , 9 vanilla town, 3 vanilla mafia Option B - 2 blue role , 8 vanilla town, 1 mafia roleblocker, 2 vanilla mafia Either two vanilla, or three vanilla, and from the Role PM, it seems like all three can shoot. You probably didn't check because it will be handed to you through mafia QT... along where you and Tictock maybe conversing even though you're on "different" time zones. Because it's 13P and mafia always gets 1 KPN in 13Ps otherwise it'd be unbalanced? You can look at every recent 13P game to verify this. Your 'evidence' for scum-reading TT and I is very weak. With that in mind, your unnatural level of confidence in TT/ Calix scum-team comes across as very forced and try-hard as if you're overcompensating for knowing that I'm town. Of course you would say it's "try-hard" when you're getting scrumread along side with your buddy. You're scum reading me, and I'm scum reading you, isn't that the point? Isn't that what you did all day yesterday? Lol... But I'm not wrong. I'm saying your level of confidence in your scum-read doesn't square up with the evidence provided. Which shows that you're making things up. I still don't know why you scum-read me individually and saying "because you're on a team with TT" shows very superficial thinking. Are you saying you're scum-reading me for scum-reading you first? I don't know how to interpret your last sentences otherwise. The evidence is there if others want to look, like Vivax. He actually took a look and saw what I saw. You can interpret the last sentence however you want.
You cannot be serious.
Instead of trying to explain yourself to others so that they can understand where you're coming from, you deliberately leave things vague and up to interpretation.
Even though, from your POV, I'm either misreading you (as town) or I'm intentionally misrepresenting your posts (as mafia).
I don't see how a townie makes this post ever.
So I'm just going with ShoCkeyy/ Vivax/ ??? for my current scum reads.
I'd like some thoughts on ShoCkeyy/ Calix from the rest of the thread please.
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I probably want to lynch between Vivax and Shock today and I'm kind of inclined to just go Shock over Vivax because I don't see how talking about mechanics the way he is ever makes sense as what he thinks is important or valuable to talk about here as some of his first exploring into the game.
-G
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On June 27 2018 22:49 Calix wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2018 22:44 ShoCkeyy wrote:On June 27 2018 22:33 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:29 ShoCkeyy wrote:On June 27 2018 22:21 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:17 ShoCkeyy wrote:On June 27 2018 22:08 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:04 ShoCkeyy wrote:Vivax, why can't it not be something they do? If he claims he can't die, there's only two reasons, he's a role, or he's mafia. There's a 50/50 chance, and if he doesn't die tonight, does that increase the likely hood he is mafia? So let me put it in easier terms, math. If there is three mafia shots, three town will die at night + the mislynch leaving us in a really bad spot for tomorrow. If there is two mafia shots, we're still in a bad spot for this next lynch and the following lynch after will really be the game breaker. If there is one mafia shot, we have three cycles to play. If he's already claiming something, then I rather take it as mafia who has a solid chance of surviving all three cycles if he's "unlynchable". On June 27 2018 21:47 Calix wrote:
Another bad post, eh? ^^
Since when did you very conveniently and opportunistically decide to scum-read me, may I ask? And for what reason?
That paragraph about AFKs being more likely town and rambling about the game starting date is filler.
Your town-read on Vivax is based on a very flimsy pre-flip association which will crumple like a house of cards. Do you have any substantial reason to town-read this guy? My town read is because Vivax town read you early into the game, and you've only been trying to get him lynched, which is even odder to me since it's both you and Tictock pushing for Vivax without any dialogue happening between you too. Huh? Mafia can't shoot multiple people in a night. I don't see how trying to lynch someone who TOWN-READS me is scummy since that means I'm trying to vote off someone who isn't going to vote for me...at a time when I'm being discussed as a lynch candidate. In no world does that make me mafia. TT is American iirc, I'm from the UK. We're not usually on at the same time ^^ How do you know they can't shoot multiple times? it doesn't say it in the rules, it just says this: Option A - 1 blue role , 9 vanilla town, 3 vanilla mafia Option B - 2 blue role , 8 vanilla town, 1 mafia roleblocker, 2 vanilla mafia Either two vanilla, or three vanilla, and from the Role PM, it seems like all three can shoot. You probably didn't check because it will be handed to you through mafia QT... along where you and Tictock maybe conversing even though you're on "different" time zones. Because it's 13P and mafia always gets 1 KPN in 13Ps otherwise it'd be unbalanced? You can look at every recent 13P game to verify this. Your 'evidence' for scum-reading TT and I is very weak. With that in mind, your unnatural level of confidence in TT/ Calix scum-team comes across as very forced and try-hard as if you're overcompensating for knowing that I'm town. Of course you would say it's "try-hard" when you're getting scrumread along side with your buddy. You're scum reading me, and I'm scum reading you, isn't that the point? Isn't that what you did all day yesterday? Lol... But I'm not wrong. I'm saying your level of confidence in your scum-read doesn't square up with the evidence provided. Which shows that you're making things up. I still don't know why you scum-read me individually and saying "because you're on a team with TT" shows very superficial thinking. Are you saying you're scum-reading me for scum-reading you first? I don't know how to interpret your last sentences otherwise. The evidence is there if others want to look, like Vivax. He actually took a look and saw what I saw. You can interpret the last sentence however you want. You cannot be serious. Instead of trying to explain yourself to others so that they can understand where you're coming from, you deliberately leave things vague and up to interpretation. Even though, from your POV, I'm either misreading you (as town) or I'm intentionally misrepresenting your posts (as mafia). I don't see how a townie makes this post ever. So I'm just going with ShoCkeyy/ Vivax/ ??? for my current scum reads. I'd like some thoughts on ShoCkeyy/ Calix from the rest of the thread please.
Regfan has Shock and Vivax as unaligned and he's never wrong about unaligns, fyi.
-G
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On June 27 2018 22:53 Regfan wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2018 22:49 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:44 ShoCkeyy wrote:On June 27 2018 22:33 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:29 ShoCkeyy wrote:On June 27 2018 22:21 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:17 ShoCkeyy wrote:On June 27 2018 22:08 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:04 ShoCkeyy wrote:Vivax, why can't it not be something they do? If he claims he can't die, there's only two reasons, he's a role, or he's mafia. There's a 50/50 chance, and if he doesn't die tonight, does that increase the likely hood he is mafia? So let me put it in easier terms, math. If there is three mafia shots, three town will die at night + the mislynch leaving us in a really bad spot for tomorrow. If there is two mafia shots, we're still in a bad spot for this next lynch and the following lynch after will really be the game breaker. If there is one mafia shot, we have three cycles to play. If he's already claiming something, then I rather take it as mafia who has a solid chance of surviving all three cycles if he's "unlynchable". On June 27 2018 21:47 Calix wrote:
Another bad post, eh? ^^
Since when did you very conveniently and opportunistically decide to scum-read me, may I ask? And for what reason?
That paragraph about AFKs being more likely town and rambling about the game starting date is filler.
Your town-read on Vivax is based on a very flimsy pre-flip association which will crumple like a house of cards. Do you have any substantial reason to town-read this guy? My town read is because Vivax town read you early into the game, and you've only been trying to get him lynched, which is even odder to me since it's both you and Tictock pushing for Vivax without any dialogue happening between you too. Huh? Mafia can't shoot multiple people in a night. I don't see how trying to lynch someone who TOWN-READS me is scummy since that means I'm trying to vote off someone who isn't going to vote for me...at a time when I'm being discussed as a lynch candidate. In no world does that make me mafia. TT is American iirc, I'm from the UK. We're not usually on at the same time ^^ How do you know they can't shoot multiple times? it doesn't say it in the rules, it just says this: Option A - 1 blue role , 9 vanilla town, 3 vanilla mafia Option B - 2 blue role , 8 vanilla town, 1 mafia roleblocker, 2 vanilla mafia Either two vanilla, or three vanilla, and from the Role PM, it seems like all three can shoot. You probably didn't check because it will be handed to you through mafia QT... along where you and Tictock maybe conversing even though you're on "different" time zones. Because it's 13P and mafia always gets 1 KPN in 13Ps otherwise it'd be unbalanced? You can look at every recent 13P game to verify this. Your 'evidence' for scum-reading TT and I is very weak. With that in mind, your unnatural level of confidence in TT/ Calix scum-team comes across as very forced and try-hard as if you're overcompensating for knowing that I'm town. Of course you would say it's "try-hard" when you're getting scrumread along side with your buddy. You're scum reading me, and I'm scum reading you, isn't that the point? Isn't that what you did all day yesterday? Lol... But I'm not wrong. I'm saying your level of confidence in your scum-read doesn't square up with the evidence provided. Which shows that you're making things up. I still don't know why you scum-read me individually and saying "because you're on a team with TT" shows very superficial thinking. Are you saying you're scum-reading me for scum-reading you first? I don't know how to interpret your last sentences otherwise. The evidence is there if others want to look, like Vivax. He actually took a look and saw what I saw. You can interpret the last sentence however you want. You cannot be serious. Instead of trying to explain yourself to others so that they can understand where you're coming from, you deliberately leave things vague and up to interpretation. Even though, from your POV, I'm either misreading you (as town) or I'm intentionally misrepresenting your posts (as mafia). I don't see how a townie makes this post ever. So I'm just going with ShoCkeyy/ Vivax/ ??? for my current scum reads. I'd like some thoughts on ShoCkeyy/ Calix from the rest of the thread please. Regfan has Shock and Vivax as unaligned and he's never wrong about unaligns, fyi. -G
I don't worry TOO much about teams until we actually get a scum flip because it's mostly speculation until that happens.
Those two are just the scummiest IMO ^^
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On June 27 2018 22:49 Calix wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2018 22:44 ShoCkeyy wrote:On June 27 2018 22:33 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:29 ShoCkeyy wrote:On June 27 2018 22:21 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:17 ShoCkeyy wrote:On June 27 2018 22:08 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:04 ShoCkeyy wrote:Vivax, why can't it not be something they do? If he claims he can't die, there's only two reasons, he's a role, or he's mafia. There's a 50/50 chance, and if he doesn't die tonight, does that increase the likely hood he is mafia? So let me put it in easier terms, math. If there is three mafia shots, three town will die at night + the mislynch leaving us in a really bad spot for tomorrow. If there is two mafia shots, we're still in a bad spot for this next lynch and the following lynch after will really be the game breaker. If there is one mafia shot, we have three cycles to play. If he's already claiming something, then I rather take it as mafia who has a solid chance of surviving all three cycles if he's "unlynchable". On June 27 2018 21:47 Calix wrote:
Another bad post, eh? ^^
Since when did you very conveniently and opportunistically decide to scum-read me, may I ask? And for what reason?
That paragraph about AFKs being more likely town and rambling about the game starting date is filler.
Your town-read on Vivax is based on a very flimsy pre-flip association which will crumple like a house of cards. Do you have any substantial reason to town-read this guy? My town read is because Vivax town read you early into the game, and you've only been trying to get him lynched, which is even odder to me since it's both you and Tictock pushing for Vivax without any dialogue happening between you too. Huh? Mafia can't shoot multiple people in a night. I don't see how trying to lynch someone who TOWN-READS me is scummy since that means I'm trying to vote off someone who isn't going to vote for me...at a time when I'm being discussed as a lynch candidate. In no world does that make me mafia. TT is American iirc, I'm from the UK. We're not usually on at the same time ^^ How do you know they can't shoot multiple times? it doesn't say it in the rules, it just says this: Option A - 1 blue role , 9 vanilla town, 3 vanilla mafia Option B - 2 blue role , 8 vanilla town, 1 mafia roleblocker, 2 vanilla mafia Either two vanilla, or three vanilla, and from the Role PM, it seems like all three can shoot. You probably didn't check because it will be handed to you through mafia QT... along where you and Tictock maybe conversing even though you're on "different" time zones. Because it's 13P and mafia always gets 1 KPN in 13Ps otherwise it'd be unbalanced? You can look at every recent 13P game to verify this. Your 'evidence' for scum-reading TT and I is very weak. With that in mind, your unnatural level of confidence in TT/ Calix scum-team comes across as very forced and try-hard as if you're overcompensating for knowing that I'm town. Of course you would say it's "try-hard" when you're getting scrumread along side with your buddy. You're scum reading me, and I'm scum reading you, isn't that the point? Isn't that what you did all day yesterday? Lol... But I'm not wrong. I'm saying your level of confidence in your scum-read doesn't square up with the evidence provided. Which shows that you're making things up. I still don't know why you scum-read me individually and saying "because you're on a team with TT" shows very superficial thinking. Are you saying you're scum-reading me for scum-reading you first? I don't know how to interpret your last sentences otherwise. The evidence is there if others want to look, like Vivax. He actually took a look and saw what I saw. You can interpret the last sentence however you want. You cannot be serious. Instead of trying to explain yourself to others so that they can understand where you're coming from, you deliberately leave things vague and up to interpretation. Even though, from your POV, I'm either misreading you (as town) or I'm intentionally misrepresenting your posts (as mafia). I don't see how a townie makes this post ever. So I'm just going with ShoCkeyy/ Vivax/ ??? for my current scum reads. I'd like some thoughts on ShoCkeyy/ Calix from the rest of the thread please.
I recall having the same frustrations with Shock making posts that never seemed town, and he ended up being town, in a game I played with him. I’ll metacheck that when I’m at a computer
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Calling everybody mafia but ending on me is pretty hilarious. Didnt read thread but I assume he is nkt making waves.
His suspicion with HF is possibly interesting. Feels the dirtiest in his filter. Maybe I should read HF. Didnt see him much so far.
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Since you haven't played with me before, I'm town, others that have, already see that I'm town... Even Conversion called me out on my bait for mafia members. I think I gave enough reasoning why I currently scum read you and Tictock, and there is also enough evidence on the thread against you, like what, there's already been two cases against you such as:
On June 27 2018 08:15 Mocsta wrote:##Vote: Calix+ Show Spoiler [quotes] +On June 26 2018 08:06 Calix wrote:
Sup, long time no see. Fancy randomly bandwagoning some AFK person for the lulz? On June 26 2018 08:14 Tictock wrote:
On second thought, lets vote Regfan, purely for having an obscene prepared post, that I will prob never read. On June 26 2018 08:15 Calix wrote:
It was clearly written before he received his role because if he was an investigative role, he (or she, since this is Gemma?) would know that Cops on this site don't get N0 checks.
Thus it's not AI.
I would like to know more about the two players in the hydra though. How many games have they played, where are they from, stuff like that. On June 26 2018 10:05 raynpelikoneet wrote:Calix literally didn't take a stance on anything since the conclusion says "not alignment indicative". Which is by the way the opposite you claimed a conclusion towards your post should be in the first place. Secondly, the conclusion sucks even more since the first paragraph of her post includes an indirect assumption that your hydra is town, which again contradicts clearly to the conclusion she has made. There is no reason to believe, in case your post is pre-written, that you do not believe you have a cop check on N0 as a cop so a smart person, instead of making that post would instead of writing a nice looking nice sounding nonsense post ask "why don't you wanna claim your check right now?" If you think people who are being nice are more likely to be town and people who are not nice are not, then you have a very terrible view of what this game is about. Also if what you said here: Show nested quote +...did it in a way that contributed to discussion in a healthy way [...] which feels like a town thing ..if you actually believe this, then you should probably call yourself mafia for the very first post you made this game. On June 26 2018 10:49 Tictock wrote:
I'm not sure I saw anything in Calix's post that made the assumption that Gemma-Reg is town, but I overall agree with rayn here.
Calix's switch in stance from "lets rando vote someone for lol's" to "thats not AI, don't vote" seemed sudden to me. Especially when my suggestion to pile votes on Reg had nothing to do with alignment. I feel slightly hypocritical here though, kus I switched my own stance of "I don't wanna vote pointlessly" to off the cuff voting someone just kus they did something I think is stupid.
Actually maybe I do see what you mean here Rayn, there is no way Calix should be able to make any assumption about when Reg prepared that post. PM's went out an hour before the game started so there was plenty of time to decide to do something like that after getting a role, and there should be no real way to tell when someone makes that call.
Anyways, I'll optimistically call Rayn and Mocsta town here. On June 26 2018 10:54 raynpelikoneet wrote:
If the underlined part is really what Calix believes, there is no reason to assume a mafia fakecliming to be a cop would not believe they don't have a N0 check (since that's how it clearly works where Gemma usually plays, and there are indications of that for anyone whop has ever played anywhere else since it's almost always how it works).
So instead of writing the post off as non-alignment indicative any smart person -- again, believing what Calix clearly implies here -- would try to possibly catch a mafia in a lie by asking "so why don't you wanna claim your check now?"
Calix has struck me as a player who digs into stuff and small discrepancies even when they possibly don't matter (especially in the game where i was mafia with bugs and oats), and this "ignorance" towards a possibly revealing discussion seems very un-Calix-like. I have highlighted key parts of the quotes in red, as I do believe this is a genuine scum slip/town tell & may have gone over most peoples heads. (1) Calix requests random vote bandwagon (2) Regfan posts a fake post (3) TT requests to vote Regfan (implied to Calix) (4) Calix provides "analysis of Regfan post" by commenting on validity of cop claim (5) Other posters comment on "Regfan post" by simply stating "copypasta" What I find critical about this sequence of events is that: - Calix cop claim assessment doesn't consider a world where Regfan is mafia and fake-posting, instead - Calix auto-assumes a world where Regfan is cop or VT This is important because Calix is changing gears from "random vote" to "analysis before vote" to provide this contribution that is in essence providing town-lean evidence to upgrade from scummy to NULL. This only satisfies mafia agenda. You provide authentic contribution (i.e. town read), make a potential ally in Regfan, and possibly start a wagon on those that scum read Regfan. I think the townier way to go about the fake-post was what others did. Comment that its a copy/paste and move on. In a world where you only have your PM that is green or blue; how do you read into that fake-post any further.... well, you cant. So why does Calix then go out on a limb so early?
Why jump to the conclusion that a fake-post is from town land only?
Why change gears in the first place?I absolutely understand why town and scum would not want to random vote; but I cannot comprehend why any town would want to feign a care-free attitude to then ditch it immediately.
On June 27 2018 21:21 raynpelikoneet wrote:I simply don't have much to add rn. Also when someone acts like complete ass towards me for no reason at all i am gonna grab my tools and go home. I have better things to do than lose my mental health over some idiot. Calix is painfully obviously mafia. Vote on Vivax means absolutely nothing since it's probably the best thing to do regardless of Vivax' affiliation. She isn't even trying to do anything after Cake case, simply just nothing, except for looking into lurkers (which also was btw scummy as per her opinion). If i have ever seen a staged conversation it is the one between Calix and Vivax. Oh my dear god i laughed at it yesterday.  Vivax has simply zero train of thought in anything he has said this game. It is that simple. I am growing more and more suspicions regarding the hydra. Probably our third mafia right there. Some bullet points: - The thing i talked about earlier where Regfan's and Gemma's thoughts never even try to meld. It was like they are playing a completely different game by themselves and not even trying to figure out which one is wrong when they have a differing opinion on something. Magically, now, when i point this out, it changes! Except that this doesn't make any sense either since Gemma tried to feed some "you don't probably just know how playing as hydra works" bullshit that doesn't even make any sense. But anyways, if she believes in that, there is no reason to change the way they act. So basically it is just done because someone figured out it is not natural what they were doing, and it is because the only reasons you would want to do that is to either stay on both side of the fences or if "one person fucks up, the other one cleans after". - Then there is the thing where Gemma calls Calix town because Calix was nice, and me mafia because i was not nice, early on in the game. When Calix answers my case later on (i should also note that Calix never really touches the actual case even, just some random shit about wording and stuff), what's Gemma's opinion... Calix is supertown because Calix is not nice!!!! Yeahhhh, it's quite amusing when supposedly same standards work in the opposite way regading who is the person in question. - Same with Regfan's read on Calix. The post where Mocsta did go into argument with him earlier today. Regfan doesn't want to lynch Calix because some bs about some three people not being mafia together and some percentage stuff. What is that even, you lynch people who are scummy. If you don't want to lynch someone then you don't think they are scummy. Regfan never even says if he thinks Calix is scummy or not, just some crap that has nothing to do with Calix' affiliation and the conclusion is "not a good lynch". Way to present a "read" without actually saying anything about the person. - Then there is this TT read. 12 hours ago Gemma literally posted this; "We both felt good about TT at the same time.". Suddenly Gemma heavily dislikes TT, for no apparent reason. Basically the only thing TT has done since 12 hrs ago is agreed with the hydra's read that Calix is not necessarily a good lynch. That is literally the only thing that has changed regarding tictocks reads after Gemma called him town. Conclusion; Holyflare watch out, you see what they are doing? - I am not sure i believe regfan doesn't have a read on me since basically every game we have been together in he (as town) always claims "rayn is super easy to read when he is town" (which also simply by association means i am easy to read when i am mafia). If that is correct or not, it's irrelevant, it's relevant he believes so regardless how much of time has passed from our last game together. So yeah, those are my scumreads. I pretend Conversion doesn't exist in the game but he is most likely not mafia anyways.
I mean, you trying to say I give no evidence of why you're mafia is just trying to shit on me for no reason and paint me as mafia, when it's clear where your allegiance stands.
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Ended up reading TT and think we should vote Vivax over Calix. I'll still follow rayn but Vivax looks worse from what I read.
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Going to enjoy more sun. I will put it in my brain to check when watching soccer.
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On June 27 2018 23:02 ShoCkeyy wrote:Since you haven't played with me before, I'm town, others that have, already see that I'm town... Even Conversion called me out on my bait for mafia members. I think I gave enough reasoning why I currently scum read you and Tictock, and there is also enough evidence on the thread against you, like what, there's already been two cases against you such as: Show nested quote +On June 27 2018 08:15 Mocsta wrote:##Vote: Calix+ Show Spoiler [quotes] +On June 26 2018 08:06 Calix wrote:
Sup, long time no see. Fancy randomly bandwagoning some AFK person for the lulz? On June 26 2018 08:14 Tictock wrote:
On second thought, lets vote Regfan, purely for having an obscene prepared post, that I will prob never read. On June 26 2018 08:15 Calix wrote:
It was clearly written before he received his role because if he was an investigative role, he (or she, since this is Gemma?) would know that Cops on this site don't get N0 checks.
Thus it's not AI.
I would like to know more about the two players in the hydra though. How many games have they played, where are they from, stuff like that. On June 26 2018 10:05 raynpelikoneet wrote:Calix literally didn't take a stance on anything since the conclusion says "not alignment indicative". Which is by the way the opposite you claimed a conclusion towards your post should be in the first place. Secondly, the conclusion sucks even more since the first paragraph of her post includes an indirect assumption that your hydra is town, which again contradicts clearly to the conclusion she has made. There is no reason to believe, in case your post is pre-written, that you do not believe you have a cop check on N0 as a cop so a smart person, instead of making that post would instead of writing a nice looking nice sounding nonsense post ask "why don't you wanna claim your check right now?" If you think people who are being nice are more likely to be town and people who are not nice are not, then you have a very terrible view of what this game is about. Also if what you said here: Show nested quote +...did it in a way that contributed to discussion in a healthy way [...] which feels like a town thing ..if you actually believe this, then you should probably call yourself mafia for the very first post you made this game. On June 26 2018 10:49 Tictock wrote:
I'm not sure I saw anything in Calix's post that made the assumption that Gemma-Reg is town, but I overall agree with rayn here.
Calix's switch in stance from "lets rando vote someone for lol's" to "thats not AI, don't vote" seemed sudden to me. Especially when my suggestion to pile votes on Reg had nothing to do with alignment. I feel slightly hypocritical here though, kus I switched my own stance of "I don't wanna vote pointlessly" to off the cuff voting someone just kus they did something I think is stupid.
Actually maybe I do see what you mean here Rayn, there is no way Calix should be able to make any assumption about when Reg prepared that post. PM's went out an hour before the game started so there was plenty of time to decide to do something like that after getting a role, and there should be no real way to tell when someone makes that call.
Anyways, I'll optimistically call Rayn and Mocsta town here. On June 26 2018 10:54 raynpelikoneet wrote:
If the underlined part is really what Calix believes, there is no reason to assume a mafia fakecliming to be a cop would not believe they don't have a N0 check (since that's how it clearly works where Gemma usually plays, and there are indications of that for anyone whop has ever played anywhere else since it's almost always how it works).
So instead of writing the post off as non-alignment indicative any smart person -- again, believing what Calix clearly implies here -- would try to possibly catch a mafia in a lie by asking "so why don't you wanna claim your check now?"
Calix has struck me as a player who digs into stuff and small discrepancies even when they possibly don't matter (especially in the game where i was mafia with bugs and oats), and this "ignorance" towards a possibly revealing discussion seems very un-Calix-like. I have highlighted key parts of the quotes in red, as I do believe this is a genuine scum slip/town tell & may have gone over most peoples heads. (1) Calix requests random vote bandwagon (2) Regfan posts a fake post (3) TT requests to vote Regfan (implied to Calix) (4) Calix provides "analysis of Regfan post" by commenting on validity of cop claim (5) Other posters comment on "Regfan post" by simply stating "copypasta" What I find critical about this sequence of events is that: - Calix cop claim assessment doesn't consider a world where Regfan is mafia and fake-posting, instead - Calix auto-assumes a world where Regfan is cop or VT This is important because Calix is changing gears from "random vote" to "analysis before vote" to provide this contribution that is in essence providing town-lean evidence to upgrade from scummy to NULL. This only satisfies mafia agenda. You provide authentic contribution (i.e. town read), make a potential ally in Regfan, and possibly start a wagon on those that scum read Regfan. I think the townier way to go about the fake-post was what others did. Comment that its a copy/paste and move on. In a world where you only have your PM that is green or blue; how do you read into that fake-post any further.... well, you cant. So why does Calix then go out on a limb so early?
Why jump to the conclusion that a fake-post is from town land only?
Why change gears in the first place?I absolutely understand why town and scum would not want to random vote; but I cannot comprehend why any town would want to feign a care-free attitude to then ditch it immediately. Show nested quote +On June 27 2018 21:21 raynpelikoneet wrote:I simply don't have much to add rn. Also when someone acts like complete ass towards me for no reason at all i am gonna grab my tools and go home. I have better things to do than lose my mental health over some idiot. Calix is painfully obviously mafia. Vote on Vivax means absolutely nothing since it's probably the best thing to do regardless of Vivax' affiliation. She isn't even trying to do anything after Cake case, simply just nothing, except for looking into lurkers (which also was btw scummy as per her opinion). If i have ever seen a staged conversation it is the one between Calix and Vivax. Oh my dear god i laughed at it yesterday. Vivax has simply zero train of thought in anything he has said this game. It is that simple. I am growing more and more suspicions regarding the hydra. Probably our third mafia right there. Some bullet points: - The thing i talked about earlier where Regfan's and Gemma's thoughts never even try to meld. It was like they are playing a completely different game by themselves and not even trying to figure out which one is wrong when they have a differing opinion on something. Magically, now, when i point this out, it changes! Except that this doesn't make any sense either since Gemma tried to feed some "you don't probably just know how playing as hydra works" bullshit that doesn't even make any sense. But anyways, if she believes in that, there is no reason to change the way they act. So basically it is just done because someone figured out it is not natural what they were doing, and it is because the only reasons you would want to do that is to either stay on both side of the fences or if "one person fucks up, the other one cleans after". - Then there is the thing where Gemma calls Calix town because Calix was nice, and me mafia because i was not nice, early on in the game. When Calix answers my case later on (i should also note that Calix never really touches the actual case even, just some random shit about wording and stuff), what's Gemma's opinion... Calix is supertown because Calix is not nice!!!! Yeahhhh, it's quite amusing when supposedly same standards work in the opposite way regading who is the person in question. - Same with Regfan's read on Calix. The post where Mocsta did go into argument with him earlier today. Regfan doesn't want to lynch Calix because some bs about some three people not being mafia together and some percentage stuff. What is that even, you lynch people who are scummy. If you don't want to lynch someone then you don't think they are scummy. Regfan never even says if he thinks Calix is scummy or not, just some crap that has nothing to do with Calix' affiliation and the conclusion is "not a good lynch". Way to present a "read" without actually saying anything about the person. - Then there is this TT read. 12 hours ago Gemma literally posted this; "We both felt good about TT at the same time.". Suddenly Gemma heavily dislikes TT, for no apparent reason. Basically the only thing TT has done since 12 hrs ago is agreed with the hydra's read that Calix is not necessarily a good lynch. That is literally the only thing that has changed regarding tictocks reads after Gemma called him town. Conclusion; Holyflare watch out, you see what they are doing? - I am not sure i believe regfan doesn't have a read on me since basically every game we have been together in he (as town) always claims "rayn is super easy to read when he is town" (which also simply by association means i am easy to read when i am mafia). If that is correct or not, it's irrelevant, it's relevant he believes so regardless how much of time has passed from our last game together. So yeah, those are my scumreads. I pretend Conversion doesn't exist in the game but he is most likely not mafia anyways. I mean, you trying to say I give no evidence of why you're mafia is just trying to shit on me for no reason and paint me as mafia, when it's clear where your allegiance stands.
Another meta defense? I'm getting sick of this. Why can't anyone just defend their posts that they're making IN THIS GAME instead of expecting me to slog through games from 2012 or whatever?
What's the point of casing people when everyone responds to what I say with "but what about this really old meta though?" and "how dare you scum-read people you've never played with before, you're obviously mafia"?
I too could throw a bunch of old games at you if I really wanted to "prove" I'm town but that's boring and doesn't actually prove anything anyway.
But I give up. I'll just stick with Vivax so I don't have to deal with some bullshit meta defense instead of anything sourced from this particular game.
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On June 27 2018 23:11 Koshi wrote:
Going to enjoy more sun. I will put it in my brain to check when watching soccer.
Go Mexico go go
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Allright, I have some catching up to do, but first off I did as promised and read over Cake's Calix case from the top of pg 23.
I think the most interesting part to me was Calix's early vote on HF, which I hadn't noticed before. So hopefully Calix has given her reasoning there, or if not if she could plz.
The rest of your case, Cake, I didn't find too compelling. I had already discussed her case on you and her post about Reg's open, so those were old news. I read this in traffic on my way to work so I wasn't able to check every post you mentioned, but I noticed a few of the ones you quoted you seemed to be putting some words in her mouth. For example you posted one where she is questioning HF's focus on me, and conclude that she is calling him mafia there. To me that post read as just a general questioning, not one that pre-supposed HF to be mafia.
Having slept on it, I felt ok about Mocsta's reactions to my post on him. He seemed more happy to have a more confident read on me than defensive for being attacked. I may move him back to a town lean, but will see how I feel when I start catching back up.
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On June 27 2018 02:35 Calix wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2018 02:30 CopCake wrote:On June 27 2018 02:28 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 02:19 CopCake wrote:
Calix, who are your mafia reads and who are your toen reads and why?
I need two on each category. I don't have anything insightful with mafia reads. My current thinking is "the active people seem townie so there's probably more mafia in the inactive section" but I also don't know how to sort between boxerfred/ Koshi/ SlenderMan/ Vivax/ ShoCkeyy. I guess Koshi and Vivax and ShoCkeyy because they've posted and their posts are pretty underwhelming and accomplish even less shit than I have? And Vivax might be trying to pocket/ white-knight me since I'm looking like a likely mislynch right now. I realise I'm still voting for you so lemme change that: ##Vote: Vivax. I think Mocsta is town because he seems to be posting off-the-cuff and doesn't seem to have preformed conclusions and is flexible with his reads. His style is different from his last game too. Conversion's town because he seems to be having fun while still contributing when he wants. Tictock's probably town. I haven't actually opened his filter though. I'm just being cocky and assuming he'll fuck up really bad at some point if he's scum so I'm not worried about him. But werent you calling me scum for focusing on inactives? o_O No, I was calling you mafia for that within the context of when you posted about the inactives while a bunch of other shit was going down. Meanwhile I'm talking about inactives because few of the active people look like good D1 lynch candidates. Okay yeah, I could #yolo vote Regfan or HF but that would be dumb since they'll actually play and respond to accusations and the like. Also I'm going to ask you why you think HF is townish now. You were scum-reading him, then you said you felt better about him but you never really explained why or what posts made you conclude that.
@rayn, if you don't like Regfan's reasoning then try this.
I don't think mafia almost ever makes this post when they're in the position that Calix was in there. There are two main things for me here to notice about the context of this post.
1. If he's mafia then he had been spending a bunch of effort in trying to pocket us, earlier when we were pushing similar reads to him.
2. At the time of this post he was being widely scumread and basically no one was defending him.
Now look at his attitude here. He's saying that he could yolovote us (who he knows are town, and who he was actively trying to pocket earlier) / isn't sold on us being town. If he's mafia, that is going to feel like a super super sketchy as fuck thing to put into thread, he has to have a super super high amount of confidence in order to go there, but there's no way he has that kind of confidence because he has to think he's always dying at that point as scum.
It's also just a completely natural way to express yourself. "Sure I could vote them I guess but I don't really want to because they're actually playing" is not the way mafia treat us there, not without overdoing it.
Furthermore, he's actively shooting himself in the foot if he's mafia, because he's risking estranging us, and it runs completely against what he was trying to do, to buddy us and get us to townread him. You can't fake that kind of a turnaround without it coming across really clunky and that isn't clunky at all.
And the last little bit about HF is just, I don't think it ever even occurs to him to bring HF into the conversation there if he's mafia.
I wouldn't be defending him like this if Regfan didn't townread him as strongly as he does but I believe in Regfan, I townread Calix as well and even if we don't hit scum today I'd really like to not see a townread get lynched.
-G
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On June 27 2018 22:41 Calix wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2018 22:37 CopCake wrote:
I am sorry Calix, my answer might come of the one of an ass but your answer about me initially asking you then must habw been boring or not satisfying because I dont remember.
It didnt make me thing “Oh well this read is good maybe Calix is town” but it didnt happen.
The only universe I can think of you being town is if Rayn is mafia.
Talking with you is a waste of time then. You don't assess what I'm saying, only how what I say makes you feel. P.S: That "if it's not X player it must be Y" association is terrible and you should never make those sorts of reads ever.
Well that is your problen them.
I got regfan’s “his voye on HF is clear” and so when you explained but other than that I cant see you being town.
I filtered you yesterday (not all posts) but I find you to be scummy, most of it is for my “case” that came out of no where and you dont caring for my meta unless it was “very recent”
Yeah I use a lot of “feels” on this, with a little of night actions since actions dont clear at all a player.
So, at this moment, and I am asking calming and trying to understand you.
Let’s imagine you are town and mafia is framing you but they dont know you have a gun and you decide to use it.
Who would you shot?
Give me something to understand your playstyle and how you scumread people.
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On June 27 2018 23:10 Koshi wrote:
Ended up reading TT and think we should vote Vivax over Calix. I'll still follow rayn but Vivax looks worse from what I read.
hard yikes
-G
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On June 27 2018 23:13 Calix wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2018 23:02 ShoCkeyy wrote:Since you haven't played with me before, I'm town, others that have, already see that I'm town... Even Conversion called me out on my bait for mafia members. I think I gave enough reasoning why I currently scum read you and Tictock, and there is also enough evidence on the thread against you, like what, there's already been two cases against you such as: On June 27 2018 08:15 Mocsta wrote:##Vote: Calix+ Show Spoiler [quotes] +On June 26 2018 08:06 Calix wrote:
Sup, long time no see. Fancy randomly bandwagoning some AFK person for the lulz? On June 26 2018 08:14 Tictock wrote:
On second thought, lets vote Regfan, purely for having an obscene prepared post, that I will prob never read. On June 26 2018 08:15 Calix wrote:
It was clearly written before he received his role because if he was an investigative role, he (or she, since this is Gemma?) would know that Cops on this site don't get N0 checks.
Thus it's not AI.
I would like to know more about the two players in the hydra though. How many games have they played, where are they from, stuff like that. On June 26 2018 10:05 raynpelikoneet wrote:Calix literally didn't take a stance on anything since the conclusion says "not alignment indicative". Which is by the way the opposite you claimed a conclusion towards your post should be in the first place. Secondly, the conclusion sucks even more since the first paragraph of her post includes an indirect assumption that your hydra is town, which again contradicts clearly to the conclusion she has made. There is no reason to believe, in case your post is pre-written, that you do not believe you have a cop check on N0 as a cop so a smart person, instead of making that post would instead of writing a nice looking nice sounding nonsense post ask "why don't you wanna claim your check right now?" If you think people who are being nice are more likely to be town and people who are not nice are not, then you have a very terrible view of what this game is about. Also if what you said here: Show nested quote +...did it in a way that contributed to discussion in a healthy way [...] which feels like a town thing ..if you actually believe this, then you should probably call yourself mafia for the very first post you made this game. On June 26 2018 10:49 Tictock wrote:
I'm not sure I saw anything in Calix's post that made the assumption that Gemma-Reg is town, but I overall agree with rayn here.
Calix's switch in stance from "lets rando vote someone for lol's" to "thats not AI, don't vote" seemed sudden to me. Especially when my suggestion to pile votes on Reg had nothing to do with alignment. I feel slightly hypocritical here though, kus I switched my own stance of "I don't wanna vote pointlessly" to off the cuff voting someone just kus they did something I think is stupid.
Actually maybe I do see what you mean here Rayn, there is no way Calix should be able to make any assumption about when Reg prepared that post. PM's went out an hour before the game started so there was plenty of time to decide to do something like that after getting a role, and there should be no real way to tell when someone makes that call.
Anyways, I'll optimistically call Rayn and Mocsta town here. On June 26 2018 10:54 raynpelikoneet wrote:
If the underlined part is really what Calix believes, there is no reason to assume a mafia fakecliming to be a cop would not believe they don't have a N0 check (since that's how it clearly works where Gemma usually plays, and there are indications of that for anyone whop has ever played anywhere else since it's almost always how it works).
So instead of writing the post off as non-alignment indicative any smart person -- again, believing what Calix clearly implies here -- would try to possibly catch a mafia in a lie by asking "so why don't you wanna claim your check now?"
Calix has struck me as a player who digs into stuff and small discrepancies even when they possibly don't matter (especially in the game where i was mafia with bugs and oats), and this "ignorance" towards a possibly revealing discussion seems very un-Calix-like. I have highlighted key parts of the quotes in red, as I do believe this is a genuine scum slip/town tell & may have gone over most peoples heads. (1) Calix requests random vote bandwagon (2) Regfan posts a fake post (3) TT requests to vote Regfan (implied to Calix) (4) Calix provides "analysis of Regfan post" by commenting on validity of cop claim (5) Other posters comment on "Regfan post" by simply stating "copypasta" What I find critical about this sequence of events is that: - Calix cop claim assessment doesn't consider a world where Regfan is mafia and fake-posting, instead - Calix auto-assumes a world where Regfan is cop or VT This is important because Calix is changing gears from "random vote" to "analysis before vote" to provide this contribution that is in essence providing town-lean evidence to upgrade from scummy to NULL. This only satisfies mafia agenda. You provide authentic contribution (i.e. town read), make a potential ally in Regfan, and possibly start a wagon on those that scum read Regfan. I think the townier way to go about the fake-post was what others did. Comment that its a copy/paste and move on. In a world where you only have your PM that is green or blue; how do you read into that fake-post any further.... well, you cant. So why does Calix then go out on a limb so early?
Why jump to the conclusion that a fake-post is from town land only?
Why change gears in the first place?I absolutely understand why town and scum would not want to random vote; but I cannot comprehend why any town would want to feign a care-free attitude to then ditch it immediately. On June 27 2018 21:21 raynpelikoneet wrote:I simply don't have much to add rn. Also when someone acts like complete ass towards me for no reason at all i am gonna grab my tools and go home. I have better things to do than lose my mental health over some idiot. Calix is painfully obviously mafia. Vote on Vivax means absolutely nothing since it's probably the best thing to do regardless of Vivax' affiliation. She isn't even trying to do anything after Cake case, simply just nothing, except for looking into lurkers (which also was btw scummy as per her opinion). If i have ever seen a staged conversation it is the one between Calix and Vivax. Oh my dear god i laughed at it yesterday. Vivax has simply zero train of thought in anything he has said this game. It is that simple. I am growing more and more suspicions regarding the hydra. Probably our third mafia right there. Some bullet points: - The thing i talked about earlier where Regfan's and Gemma's thoughts never even try to meld. It was like they are playing a completely different game by themselves and not even trying to figure out which one is wrong when they have a differing opinion on something. Magically, now, when i point this out, it changes! Except that this doesn't make any sense either since Gemma tried to feed some "you don't probably just know how playing as hydra works" bullshit that doesn't even make any sense. But anyways, if she believes in that, there is no reason to change the way they act. So basically it is just done because someone figured out it is not natural what they were doing, and it is because the only reasons you would want to do that is to either stay on both side of the fences or if "one person fucks up, the other one cleans after". - Then there is the thing where Gemma calls Calix town because Calix was nice, and me mafia because i was not nice, early on in the game. When Calix answers my case later on (i should also note that Calix never really touches the actual case even, just some random shit about wording and stuff), what's Gemma's opinion... Calix is supertown because Calix is not nice!!!! Yeahhhh, it's quite amusing when supposedly same standards work in the opposite way regading who is the person in question. - Same with Regfan's read on Calix. The post where Mocsta did go into argument with him earlier today. Regfan doesn't want to lynch Calix because some bs about some three people not being mafia together and some percentage stuff. What is that even, you lynch people who are scummy. If you don't want to lynch someone then you don't think they are scummy. Regfan never even says if he thinks Calix is scummy or not, just some crap that has nothing to do with Calix' affiliation and the conclusion is "not a good lynch". Way to present a "read" without actually saying anything about the person. - Then there is this TT read. 12 hours ago Gemma literally posted this; "We both felt good about TT at the same time.". Suddenly Gemma heavily dislikes TT, for no apparent reason. Basically the only thing TT has done since 12 hrs ago is agreed with the hydra's read that Calix is not necessarily a good lynch. That is literally the only thing that has changed regarding tictocks reads after Gemma called him town. Conclusion; Holyflare watch out, you see what they are doing? - I am not sure i believe regfan doesn't have a read on me since basically every game we have been together in he (as town) always claims "rayn is super easy to read when he is town" (which also simply by association means i am easy to read when i am mafia). If that is correct or not, it's irrelevant, it's relevant he believes so regardless how much of time has passed from our last game together. So yeah, those are my scumreads. I pretend Conversion doesn't exist in the game but he is most likely not mafia anyways. I mean, you trying to say I give no evidence of why you're mafia is just trying to shit on me for no reason and paint me as mafia, when it's clear where your allegiance stands. Another meta defense? I'm getting sick of this. Why can't anyone just defend their posts that they're making IN THIS GAME instead of expecting me to slog through games from 2012 or whatever? What's the point of casing people when everyone responds to what I say with "but what about this really old meta though?" and "how dare you scum-read people you've never played with before, you're obviously mafia"? I too could throw a bunch of old games at you if I really wanted to "prove" I'm town but that's boring and doesn't actually prove anything anyway. But I give up. I'll just stick with Vivax so I don't have to deal with some bullshit meta defense instead of anything sourced from this particular game.
This doesn't help you, if anything mafia would likely never go back to older games because they simply don't care. While meta can change in different games yes, and it's hard to classify just based on that, it does help when you've played games with others.
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On June 27 2018 23:24 CopCake wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2018 22:41 Calix wrote:On June 27 2018 22:37 CopCake wrote:
I am sorry Calix, my answer might come of the one of an ass but your answer about me initially asking you then must habw been boring or not satisfying because I dont remember.
It didnt make me thing “Oh well this read is good maybe Calix is town” but it didnt happen.
The only universe I can think of you being town is if Rayn is mafia.
Talking with you is a waste of time then. You don't assess what I'm saying, only how what I say makes you feel. P.S: That "if it's not X player it must be Y" association is terrible and you should never make those sorts of reads ever. Well that is your problen them. I got regfan’s “his voye on HF is clear” and so when you explained but other than that I cant see you being town. I filtered you yesterday (not all posts) but I find you to be scummy, most of it is for my “case” that came out of no where and you dont caring for my meta unless it was “very recent” Yeah I use a lot of “feels” on this, with a little of night actions since actions dont clear at all a player. So, at this moment, and I am asking calming and trying to understand you. Let’s imagine you are town and mafia is framing you but they dont know you have a gun and you decide to use it. Who would you shot? Give me something to understand your playstyle and how you scumread people.
Well duh. People change as they get older so why would I put THAT much stock into meta from...whenever you used to play? I know I'm quite different from when I first started playing and that wasn't that long ago. I used to be extremely aggressive and very rarely reconsidered my reads.
I don't see how this question will help you understand me that well but sure. I'd shoot one of the AFKs since they're not giving town any information to begin with and it saves us from wasting a lynch on those people. Because threatening to lynch someone who posts is better than trying to pressure someone who will not post since new information is revealed and reads can develop.
Then if the person being pressured makes it clear they are town within those 48 hours then you can switch votes to an inactive player without losing too much if that inactive person is town.
If, during that time, you think that townies are the only people being pressured all day then you can look at the people who have been skirting by, not sticking their necks out, pretending to do more than they have, etc, and push them to the surface instead of defaulting to an inactive player. Because mafia are usually the people who are 'there' but not doing too much to solve the game or who have really unmemorable filters or whatnot.
I'd say what I've just written here is how I do things in most games. You shouldn't take it as AI or anything.
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This is where I really need Mocsta to turn up and save the day.
-G
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EPT
