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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
He gets excited and uses like a lot! He's not doing that. Must be scum. Damdred: I noticed that and have been tryin to change it. Holyflare: you admitted to saying like a lot when you're town and you're not doing it! Scum claim! While I can see the coincidence being suspicious hf's response is entirely disingenuous. There is no way that he thinks this makes Damdred slam dunk scum. He is not retarded. | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 19 2018 15:52 Mocsta wrote: (1) Im not sure what is "aoe" If you are referring to appeal to emotion by damdred, its in my vote post... whilst brushing off damerion, he keeps trying to casually bring back to the fore mocsta/DF, without substantiating why its relevant or trying to develop it further... to me, the purpose of that is to get others to grab the idea and flesh it out on his behalf... hence appeal to emotion / puppet master play. (2) As for HF I understand to an extent what you are saying; and agree there are points that HF needs to clarify. Best lynch of the day though?? I am still not seeing it. (3) How about we change topic. What are your thoughts on darthfoley and mderg? Since you like wagon timings... what do you think about rels? Ah. Yes that's not what I consider appeal to emotion. If he's town he knows that has not scum and wants to talk about scumreads. That's not weird to me. Your concern seems to be a lack of evidence but what would you do if you were being voted and only had slight scumreads? Invent evidence? Well let me put it this way mocsta. I'm never voting Damdred over hf. He's not scum. I'm as certain as I can be without seeing a pm. So find me someone else. If you have no one but damdred better than hf hes my vote. Period. I don't like rels either but I'm not as sure on him. Darth foley's recent posting makes me feel a little better about him so he's mostly null to me. Mderg is forgettable, so could be scum. | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
I think I've made it abundantly clear that I think twatty is town. Damerion is probably also town for his push. I recognize enough of the meta read to believe it to be genuine. Though I don't really know damerion so that gets him a slight townread at this juncture...it's hard to read someone in a tunnel. There's not much to say about rels really. I don't like him coming in and aggreeing on a Damdred push, and his comment that I should have been prodding Ian was annoying because it disregards we weren't both in-thread. But I really haven't seen enough from him to make a read. Null to slight scumread. In rels' case you're right. It would be almost entirely related to the wagon and it's not a lunch I'm willing to push on so little reasoning - or certainty. Holyflare is scummy independent of who he ends up voting for. | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 19 2018 16:08 Mocsta wrote: Lets put HF and the others aside, since they are covered to some degree. you are hard on damdred and you think its completely OK for him to pursue a lead without evidence. Tell me, does this fit within your knowledge of how damdred plays? Everything about him to me reads as measured and carefully considered.. proofing before posting possibly more than twice. Everything is INTENTIONAL... If you have this player that is known to focus on his town-reads first... why then, +1 thread sentiment with no additional reasoning or attempt to probe into me or DF further? Is this really town play to you for a regarded player (to borrow your HF line) The short answer is yes. This is play I expect to see from a town Damdred. He's more of an analyst and kicks in stronger after the first lynch. He usually starts with tonal impressions that aren't strong and poe's down to nulls and slight scumreads d1. Doesn't mean he never pushes a scumread, questions a null read, or even pushes a lynch quote enthusiastically if he thinks he's on to something. It just means that generally his way one reads are pretty weak so his method usually is tofigure out who he doesn't want to lynch on d1. I also work similarly when I don't have a strong scumread d1 so it's easy to understand where has coming from. I'm generally more aggressive and active than him about it. His activity has been spotty for quite some time. Holyflare by contrast is an agitator as town unless he's changed very much, and Ieven if I don't agree wih his reasoning it's usually Smart. That's what I don't see here. You say Damdred and holyflare should be evaluated equally because they're both 'good', but they're both good in different ways and to different degrees | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 19 2018 16:20 Mocsta wrote: i be heading off now, but im disappointed we can't see eye to eye about damdred. I will have a think about how I can communicate what I am seeing more clearly.. remember, Im not viewing damdred in isolation of a meta-case. - which you appear to be fixated with. I do understand. I just all but know you're wrong without blaming you for your opinion ^^; | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
I don't want to lynch Damdred. I don't think I can be talked out of this read but you can try. I do want to lynch holyflare. Tell me why I'm wrong or vote with me. I'd vote most players in the game over Damdred and am willing to consolidate on one of them if we can't get the holyflare lynch, but don't you all want a d1 scum holyflare lynch to display on your trophy walls? You have to admit that it's sexy  Others I don't want to lynch: Twatty KSC Mocsta Damerion Kmatt I might vote some of these over Damdred, especially Kmatt given that one is especially weak, but I wouldn't be happy :/ | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 19 2018 15:47 Mocsta wrote: Whether anyone else agrees or not.. I think the timezone of this game is really impacting certain hours (especially near deadline).. Where im getting at, is the first 12hours of the game was sleep time for lots of people which naturally makes sense with ppl coming in, throwing a post and then disappearing.. HF (and others) are not doing this exclusively to you.. so I shamelessly am writing off a lot of that stuff as a tell/motive. To me its only more relevant if HF was still doing this to you (i.e. prior to deadline). i.e a pattern has formed of ignoring your prodding. perhaps valid.. i agree on the behaviour vs. motive part. i *REALLY* like this from you. I think its very townie to be offended someone you are trying to discern "treats' you that way. Whether your read is right or wrong, I do think you are taking it a little too personal, as there are plenty of reasons this could have happened that are not even mafia/town related.. but just, in-real life related. I felt I understood why HF pointed that out, and it was reinforced by Kelsier assumptino on how you may have read me.. I think Kelsier single handedly destroys your argument. Oh, btw I'm referring to hf being unconstructive while in a conversation with me like the one I just had with you, in real-time. This has nothing to do with time slots or deadlines. He's in the same timezone as me. Respectfully disagree on the last point as well though I understand that I read people differently and it might be a weak point of mine. I'm not looking at it in isolation though. | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 19 2018 17:04 Holyflare wrote: I didn't care about the meta read. I didn't even give it any weight at all. Damdred's responses are what clinched it. It's such a fucking random thing to coincidentally notice within the last one game that he's played with Damerion when Damerion has never mentioned it at all. It looks like Damdred gets caught on the back foot from a guy he puts a lot of weight on his reads on and then flails. "oh lol I know about that and I'm changing it despite nobody ever mentioning it ever and me playing for 5 years but somehow I realised it within 1 game with playing with you despite you not uttering a word of it" That's so unbelievably farfetched I can't understand how anyone can brush it off. It doesn't make sense as a scum response, holyflare. Panic response doesn't explain it and unpanicked response explains it even less. I get its weirdly coincidental but it's just obviously not believable. | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 19 2018 17:09 Holyflare wrote: And just because I'm not posting much or am sitting along and antagonising doesn't make me mafia. It's disingenuous to say I'm one of the best players on the site (I'd argue I'm only good at playing mafia) so I'm mafia for being underwhelming and not responding. That's a bad read. Lol what? I expect you to want to figure out my alignment and work with me. I don't require you to be superman. Nor do I believe for an instant that you don't consider yourself a good town player. When did that happen? | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
I was looking for the last time damerion played with Damdred, but now I'm not sure about damerion lol >< In the November game he did seem to focus on Damdred but didn't seem to have a meta read like this one developed. Damdred was scum that game. I guess my question for both Damdred and damerion is has this meta read minus the like been employed before and if so id like to see the game. | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 19 2018 17:39 Holyflare wrote: I also absolutely do not share the opinion that df has done enough either. This guy gets regularly shot n1. I just tunneled him before incorrectly and dont trust my eh feel about him. -squints at- Maaaybe I could believe your gameplay has changed. It hadn't in my last scum game but that was awhile ago. I can kinda see your Damdred thing now...I just find it weird that Ian would even know he said like as town and not as scum. Someone used smiley percentages to read me and I had no clue if that was right or not. Who counts how many times they say like? So I find it a weird thing for scum to panic about. And if he didn't panic that response doesn't make sense. | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 19 2018 02:41 Damdred wrote: I really do not care about "pressure" if the only reason you are voting me is to pressure me then it is futile. I work when I want to work and otherwise I roll around the thread until something interesting happens. And as for being lynched? Well I could probably care more but we will see what happens at eod. If I am lynched the people who refuse to really take a stand or characterize others for being scummy for doing so (mderg for instance) should be looked at pretty closely, I do not like his postings at this point even if he is defending me. In any case i'll have some form of team for post game cred before long anyway, you children and my babies just have fun rolling around until I do. -shrugs- tonally it reads Damdred to me. And the rest of his play is fine. I found the bouncy response weird but this fits better. No, I don't and never have a better read and I don't make up reasons. Fully aware that makes me less persuasive. | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 18 2018 22:33 Damdred wrote: Thats an interesting meta read on me I guess? And the praise given I enjoy bathing in it. But I disagree with the read, firstly I do recognize my word usage of the word like has at times.... been extreme. And I am surprised that nobody has really caught it a bit to that point. But once I realized what I was doing a few games ago with getting excited I decided it was time to eliminate it just because as you put it sounding like "a valley girl" is not appealing to me lol. As for the rest well there just isn't much to go on at this point no? so whats wrong with building a town circle built on what I have seen, people who agree with my view of the game is a good place to start with. Or at least people I do not want to fight with (HF baby don't leave me). really interesting you came out against me though, not sure what it makes you. I am a hard target so I give you credit damer for coming at me, but also seems like a way to change conversation away from DF and moc who I guess you have at null? So hm I guess i'm leaning town on damer seems a bit suicidal way to bring attention to himself in that way especially with the game kinda stale? Also tonally this feels calm, even bemused, not panicked. I could sum it up as lol, kay? i guess I could see you believing that as town. | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 19 2018 18:14 Holyflare wrote: Also to further add to that if Damdred did do that and realised as town I don't think he makes his town game more unnatural and removes it. He should add it to his mafia play. My point is that I find it believable he realized it outside of alignment. Personally, I am trying to be more comprehensive this game and to stop playing the court jester. (Of course I also intended to post less, but...yeah...like asking a fish to walk on land.) Nor would you even be right. He knows that he's more emotional as town and has actively tried to decrease his emotional outbursts (failed, but that's like with me and posting less), so there is no evidence whatsoever that he would try to change his scum game rather than his town game. Quite the opposite. Also entirely moot, in my opinion. I really just don't see the panic that you do, and without panic the most logical explanation is that it's just true. Since I have no other reason to think he's scum this game, I don't want to lynch him. Simple as that. Could I be wrong? Sure. I just don't think so. Though this at least, assuming your town, gives me reason to think you believe what you're pushing, so it serves a purpose in that sense. I'm still sulking about you being a dismissive ass at the beginning of the game then :/ I miss the good old days when rolling town with a holyflare was actually fun and we could work together, you know, before we started always rolling opposite alignments. (And I know this is retarded superstition but I'd be lying if I didn't admit part of me doesn't trust you on principle. Especially after making me speak Russian and playing on my isolation, you bastard.) @mderg I don't really protest beyond thinking that Rels would be easier to read Day 2 anyway and he's a strong town asset. If it's between Damdred and Rels, not really a contest. Where are you at anyway? | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
BTDT though...I think you hit scum there. That's some weak-ass shit. I vaguely remember BTDT making a much larger impression for me in the past. And part of me wants to leave df be for the moment just for bringing that up. Then the devil's advocate whispers in my ear, "But, Tina, if BTDT is town, that's probably one of the easiest things for a scum darth foley to do. Also easy for him to do if they're both scum, you know." And I :/ at my devil's advocate. But seeing as we can only lynch one, my preference would be BTDT for that blah. Pfft, I guess I'll stop pushing for a holyflare lynch. I'm not wholly (haha) convinced, but I'm willing to give benefit of the doubt at present. Mostly because I can see him believing his push pffffft. I'm gonna kick myself if he's scum though for letting that pass. Almost makes me want to dig my heels in and be stubborn for the sake of being stubborn lol >< | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
my current scum is somewhere in scummy btdt df rels null prp kmatt ??? holyflare - pending damerion - pending...i do need to talk to him and damdred...or spend an inordinate amount of hours going through games which i may do but bleh...it's weird to have a strong meta case without evidence of parts of that read before hrum | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
i think i'd rather lynch into btdt or df...rels is scummier than prp and kmatt, and normally i'd say lynch him over them, but i think he posts d2 (or we definitely lynch him anyway) and i'm not sure about the other two | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 19 2018 19:08 Holyflare wrote: The posts you link to damdred being calm and town he's absolutely capable (and has) as mafia. I agree his posts are calm and collected, and like I said, don't really do anything other than try and manipulate people's impression of his standing. It's just that one specific post in response to Damerion that is the panicked one and makes him mafia. Are we talking about a different post than the one I already quoted which is literally his response to Damerion's meta case? Because that's the one that I don't see panic in. And I'm sorry but, having been scum, and having been in the self-same position you're narrating, my response was not panic. It was genuine derision. I still don't know if he was right (random player who I've forgotten I'm sorry it was years ago ;o;), though certainly he thought he was...but struggle seeing why it would make anyone panic. Your narrative as I understand it depends upon Damdred panicking and being calm in the same post...which while not impossible is not very probable at all. | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 19 2018 19:39 Holyflare wrote: We'll just agree to disagree on Damdred and then I'll be right. lol That's more or less the conclusion that I already came to. You're slow. | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 19 2018 19:49 KelsierSC wrote: Though I disagree with HF on his damdred read, I do want to see more from damdred this day. Reading through HF's explanation. I could understand that if you were reading a guy as scummy from before. (due to his df/mcosta read) then with that biased you could see his response as panicked. I thought about the perspective of if I was scum HF/Rels. I think my initial interpretation was wrong.I don't think scum HF and Rels jump on this case and call it good. Especially Rels , if damdred flips town he looks super shady. I think if Damdred is town then you just soft defend him , in the way I have done tbh, and then look for some random lynch later on, if damdred is lynched then a town goes down and you look good. I think Mderg did that and maybe df but i'm not 100%. with btdt I liked something he did early, mentioning the bad read on hf and he read rsoultin as town so I gave him a few plus points. I didn't like his Mcosta is weird with a massive quote post , i'd need to see more though. At this point i'd lynch between mderg, maybe df then prplhz,kmatt and btdt need to put more into the thread. To be fair, I think scumRels would be way more likely to do that if there was an alternative lynch going, which there wasn't. It still felt like a half-assed drive-by shooting but I can't say that it makes him scum. Not feeling a mderg lynch. It's not sparkly but I get a little swimming against the current and a little waffley not sure not sure from his filter that just feels towny to me. Not my strongest read, of course, but I'd rather not lynch him. Meeeh btdt's filter is just so weak for me. Hold on. I already forgot specifics. | ||
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