Newbie Student Mafia XXIV

On October 31 2016 09:24 NeverUnlucky wrote:
Sure. c: One more /in.

This is what is going to happen this game:

1. I will roll town.
2. Game starts; unoriginal players'll say "First confirmed town!"
3. One town will have a weird or even scummy entry.
4. Calix will tunnel said player. NeverUnlucky will have a good read on Calix based on the tunnel.
5. Said town will claim that the intent behind his entry was to stir up conversation.
6. Everyone will mock him and some will town-read him.
7. Active players’ll shitpost, lurkers’ll lurk.
8. One player will case another player who’ll become the main wagon, but the case is weak, thus :
9. People will initiate a CFD at EoD, and a town will die.

On October 31 2016 20:49 cakepie wrote:

Coaches are good for much more than just mechanics!

On October 31 2016 21:33 Shapelog wrote:

Actually, all he has done, is back himself in a corner with you if he is scum.

See number 4 states that he will have a good read on you, in the case that you tunnel. If no such read was to come, or a crappy one, then he would look less credible. Perhaps, you could argue that 6 could set up a possible scum read for him (if people keep scum reading him) but that is weak.

He also is forced in this to read the "One town with a weird entry" as town, due to wording. Which is bad for scum, as it knocks off a ML for day 1 at least.

In fact, the only way this benefits scum is if the person to make the weird entry is scum buddies, which is a high risk, low reward (a weak reason to TR at most) move IMO

The rest of it is unpredictable and useless, since it revolves on other players doing it.

Sorry, regaining my mafia mindset.

EDIT: He also would have to point out the case is weak too due to #8 and make reads accordly.

On November 03 2016 03:08 Calix wrote:


So if you ARE mainly communicating in gifs then why claim a role first thing before doing that? Seems illogical for town to do.

On November 03 2016 03:20 Calix wrote:


Sheep vote noted.

How is claiming that posting gifs after claiming a role tryhard?

On November 03 2016 03:21 Calix wrote:
And as a side note, how is being tryhard a scum tell?

On November 03 2016 03:33 Calix wrote:


You are voting right after I received a vote. There is no discrediting here, only using evidence to draw a conclusion.

Why would I not question your push? I don't consider 'tryhard' to be a scum-tell and wanted to know what your logic was for thinking so.

I am not scum-reading ExO. That's not 'going after an easy target', it's asking for a response to a simple question.

No it didn't. I asked why they weren't doing it. That cannot be interpreted as a subtle nudge to keep doing it in any world.

It's not pro-scum. It's anti-town.

On November 03 2016 03:40 Calix wrote:


Correction. I am not voting for ExO and you should be suspicious of me if I was given that you (correctly) think I am not scum-reading him.

On November 03 2016 03:38 Calix wrote:


Incorrect. Pro-scum behaviour is something that ONLY scum are capable of doing. Town never act in pro-scum ways (short of game-throwing which isn't 'playing' the game anyway) because they are town and their actions are, in their own way, working towards their wincon of finding and eliminating scum.

Anti-town behaviour is only detrimental to town and is done by both alignments. (e.g., shit-posting)

On November 03 2016 04:01 mahrgell wrote:
@Foreman
Now that you noticed your misread. Are you still going after Calix, or have you shifted your focus on NU?
Would the argument you made for Calix also apply to NU? Or where do you see the difference there?

On November 03 2016 04:14 Calix wrote:


Knock knock, Calix is here, asking you to read my NU case like a good dear.

Is my NU case also disingenuous? If so, how?

On November 03 2016 04:20 Calix wrote:


Why do I need to 'acquit myself' for you to take my NU case seriously?

You either agree with it or you don't. My 'credibility' has nothing to do with wherever you think I make valid points on NU.

Poor reaction from you.

On November 03 2016 04:22 mahrgell wrote:


Why not? Following multiple leads is not bad for town.
And even if we flip Calix in the end, no matter what color it is, having his talking points discussed would be beneficial to town. So I can't understand that refusal to comment on it. Especially as I would be very interested in your opinion.

Don't worry, we won't forget about Calix. And if you feel it got forgotten, ust bring it up later again, if someone wants to balem you for it, just forward it to me.

On November 03 2016 04:24 Calix wrote:


Ah, it's the MS classic of "you're totally scum so I'm ignoring everything you say" shtick.

How anyone has such a strong read that they are willing to dismiss everything that I say post-scum-read with less than 200 posts in the entire thread is beyond me.

So do explain, how have you concluded that I'm so scummy this early on?

On November 03 2016 04:31 mahrgell wrote:


Well... So you refuse to answer me, because I share points with Calix on this issue? So I'm now scum by association for you?
Doing that after posting large paragraphs about "what kind of behaviour is protown"?

On November 03 2016 05:01 Calix wrote:


How is he sheeping? He said he agreed with my case with some additional comments.

I was initially paranoid that he was trying to pocket me. That was my fear until he made the "lol I don't want to think like Calix" comment. That seems too weird to be a buddying attempt to me.

Why would mahrgell be scum if I am town exactly?

On November 03 2016 05:05 Skynx wrote:

Here is what happened;

Calix sr Exo (gif stuff)
Exo sr Calix (doesn't like his push)
Everyone sr Everyone (because all pushes are very surjective and doesn't mean anything and everyone is aware of that so might aswell sr the others)

What you are asking right now makes sense in that regard as me suggesting you guys pushing NAI stuff on eachother means I should also sr you guys but its just not right and this is all really nothing productive in the end.

On November 03 2016 05:14 Calix wrote:


Last paragraph is the first thing that Foreman's posted that I really like.

On November 03 2016 05:27 Calix wrote:


Nothing. It's a summary of Skynx's behaviour which anyone can do. Nothing to note there.

I used the intensifier 'really' to make it clear that I liked the concluding paragraph in particular.

On November 03 2016 03:29 Foreman wrote:
1) You are going after an easy target for not doing what they said they'd do (after they got some friction about it when they announced it, iirc?)

On November 03 2016 03:30 Foreman wrote:


Because you're looking for an excuse to accuse somebody of being scum where no scum motive is present.

On November 03 2016 05:44 Calix wrote:


It wasn't a case though. I never said there was scum motivation. I have stated this on multiple occasions so people need to actually read my posts. I'm not repeating myself again.

All I did was ask "yo why did you change your posting style from X pre-game posting style that you said you were doing?". I think this is a perfectly reasonable question since he...changed his posting style AFTER receiving his role so thus it had a chance of yielding AI information.

He didn't waffle over it and I didn't say it was scummy. I said it was illogical which isn't the same thing as scum-motivated. It means that I don't get why he did it. (I still don't but the actual reasoning is completely irrelevant so I don't want ExO to answer now)

You also have to take into account that I considered his behaviour anti-town. I don't see the problem with questioning a player in that category within the first few posts. It's the best time to clear up such matters, no?

I hope that clears up everything.

On November 03 2016 05:49 Calix wrote:


In his filter...which you could have looked at irregardless of your read on me.

Alternatively, it's in my filter. You can skip over Page 1 of my filter because it's pre-game stuff.

On November 03 2016 05:56 Calix wrote:


Are you referring to ExO or NU? I am assuming the former here.

Your post is confusing and I don't understand how you reached...whatever it is that you concluded.

On November 03 2016 05:58 Calix wrote:


Then I'm even more confused. Clarification would be welcomed.

On November 03 2016 03:25 NeverUnlucky wrote:

I said that.

On November 03 2016 06:05 Calix wrote:


My 'illogical' comment was referring to ExO though, not NU.

But NU said "I agree with Calix that ExO's defensiveness is scummy" and when I said "I didn't say that, where did you get that idea from?" he then changes and says "well I said that"

Which makes no sense. How do you even get that mixed up?

On November 03 2016 06:18 NeverUnlucky wrote:

That is anti-town, dude. As bad and as incorrect as her post on me is, you cannot have this attitude towards her, especially 2 hours into the game.

I'm reading this as buddying.

On November 03 2016 06:29 Calix wrote:


How much experience do you have with mafia?

On November 03 2016 06:30 NeverUnlucky wrote:

I dislike in this order Skynx, ExO, Foreman, Calix, you.

And I appreciated darthfoley's one post.

That's about how my read look like.

On November 03 2016 06:31 NeverUnlucky wrote:

Mhh?

That's 100% Calix you're describing here. I rarely if ever read people based on logic.

What made you think that?

On November 03 2016 06:37 Tictock wrote:


What prompted this?

On November 03 2016 06:37 Tictock wrote:


What prompted this?

On November 03 2016 06:42 NeverUnlucky wrote:

Mahrgell is willing to take step back from his pushes while Calix is seemingly trying to get me stuck in the past and not backing off, instead worsening her already god awful push.

On November 03 2016 06:49 mahrgell wrote:


How many you need? You obviously ignored all my posts about yourself.

But let's summarize and update:
Looking at your entire post history, I try to figure out how you managed to come to the conclusion you have. If you have no information about the game, you should have seen the same as me. And yet somehow you managed to take another turn at pretty much every point in the game. So far all your actions have been about the opposite of what I would expect from someone who saw the same as I did, with the same information I have. (none).

1) you see the Calix vs Exo_ interaction and for weird reasons tunnel down on Calix. Was she(it seems like Calix is a she?) pushing Exo? I don't think so. If she was, I agree it was pointless, but well... Day1. You were sure she was pushing Exo. Okay... Happy tunneling.
2) so you chase after people for having the antitown-proscum conversation, just to push that conversation further. If it was in your interest to remove this discussion from the thread to steer the game in a more town friendly direction, you should probably not try to last word in that conversation.
3) Next Calix asks you about NU. Instead of answering, you refuse to answer at all, because you consider Calix scum. I believe enough people pointed out at this point that this is pretty anti-town. Considering you being worried about the town atmosphere before, this is rather ironic.
4) I ask you about NU too. You dismiss it as parroting. Besides the fact that I consider it not parroting, but admit, that my critique on NU was very similar to Calix (earlier, not her latest) posts, let's for a moment assume it was parroting. At this point you claimed to scumlean Calix, but didn't say anything about me. If I were a townie, and see someone else parrot a person I consider scum... I for sure as hell would do my best to get this person to stop sheeping a scummie. Either you turn on me right away, or you try to get me away from her. Instead you just dismissed me. If I was sheeping Calix and you considered her scum, you willingly gave her an additional vote.
5) Your general contribution to this thread has never been in the interest of improving the atmosphere. In none of the mentioned points have you ever tried for a constructive conversation. And your latest responses to NU weren't better either. Not sure if it was in this thread or in the other one, but when you asked about the TL meta someone (NU?) answered: "Be wrong and a dick about it" This is exactly what I see you doing here.


I guess you earned it
##Vote Foreman

On November 03 2016 06:51 Tictock wrote:


Yea I did that before posting, I'm a bit confused why you went from being uber-tunneled on Calix to suddenly considering her as town.

I'll be honest, I was thinking you were lock scum up till this post but it gave me pause because I consider thinking about people from both alignments is a good town trait. However your posts seem more like you are just shifting focus away from Calix to another target but your read really hasn't changed.

Right now I'd stick with my initial read that you are scum and attribute this shift to being told in your QT that you are tunneling too much.

On November 03 2016 06:58 Calix wrote:


With regards to #3, how do you explain this post?

On November 03 2016 07:05 Tictock wrote:
Calix and Marghal (or w/e) are my top town atm. Mostly everything they have done has been to push the game forward and have been looking at multiple people from multiple angles.

On November 03 2016 07:10 Tictock wrote:


He jumped on you for being try-hard and didn't have an opinion on anyone else.

Took him a full page of filter before he even talked about anyone else, and even then it was only a segway based on his read on you.

On November 03 2016 21:42 mahrgell wrote:
. Scum has usually 2 options:
a) make up stuff
b) reinforce shitty assumptions by townies
Meanwhile a townie sees what I see. So if I feel myself completely unable to follow the line of thought of a player, this is a scumlean for me. In the end, I have to judge if the different judgements made by other players are due to different character or due to hidden agenda.

On November 03 2016 21:43 NeverUnlucky wrote:
##Unvote
##Vote Calix

Town doesn't ignore other members of the town.

On November 04 2016 00:14 Skynx wrote:

I'm here, still reading all the shitty posts unfortunately and that takes time.

Also, congratz for exposing yourself for going after a low-hanging fruit.

On November 04 2016 02:28 darthfoley wrote:


Sure

I think Foreman is most town to me.

On November 04 2016 02:48 darthfoley wrote:
I'd also appreciate Foreman's reads when he gets a chance

On November 04 2016 03:05 darthfoley wrote:
Best scum team 2k16 NU Calix

On November 04 2016 04:01 darthfoley wrote:
Why'd you change your vote off of mahrgell to Skynx?

On November 04 2016 04:13 Skynx wrote:

Stand by the facts.

I was just an emo at this point to most people including you. Just before i posted some actual reads. I was the definition of low hanging fruit.

Thats not a defence, thats an accusation for you going for someone whos just raging about the game rather than post your thoughts on actual playing people some of which you were definitely scumreading at this point.

On November 04 2016 05:41 Calix wrote:
Foreman, can you give your thoughts on Skynx' wall-posts?

As for ExO, I missed #600. I'm not sure I agree. He says "I think ExO is scum but if he isn't then he's only a VT and is useless so he can die"

He thinks you're scum, ergo you're lying about being VT. All he does is rule out the possibility of you being TPR. I don't see inconsistency here.

On November 04 2016 05:44 ExO_ wrote:


Or I'm lying about being VT to get scum to not mess with me on day 1. However look at the way he posts. He knows I'm only VT.

You need to learn to read between the lines. Mafia are never going to come into the thread and announce they are mafia

On November 04 2016 06:03 ExO_ wrote:


What is this supposed to accomplish? He's not allowed to start posting things b/c he at one point in the game considered himself low hanging fruit?

On November 04 2016 06:09 ExO_ wrote:


He cannot be lying about calling himself low-hanging fruit. Thats an opinion thing and not alignment indicative in any way. Getting stuck up on this is dumb as hell.

Also read the thread. You're skipping posts like crazy

On November 04 2016 06:12 Calix wrote:


I feel like this is going around in circles. It's clear that you think that's a scummy reaction from ExO and I disagree. I think we should move on since this thread is blowing up.

Thoughts on Foreman? I'm still thinking this could be TvT and thus I find him sitting in the background to be conspicuous.

On November 04 2016 06:22 ExO_ wrote:


because I explained the part you were confused about to calix, and you come in and ask the same fucking question. If you can't be arsed to read my posts how the fuck can you reasonably question them

On November 04 2016 06:31 Calix wrote:


Well in my opinion, you weren't posting a lot. Fine by itself.

But you were just talking about stuff which wasn't related to the main discussion at hand until recently. That stood out to me especially because I think it's two townies fighting.

Thus someone ignoring it looks weird and like they don't want to take a side in it since either of them being lynched helps scum.

So yes, my logic is pretty good, I'd say.

On November 04 2016 06:32 NeverUnlucky wrote:
v
TT (=) / Rels (+)
Calix (=) / Skynx (+)
DF (-) / Foreman (=) / ExO (-=)
mahrgell (=)
w

On November 04 2016 06:37 ExO_ wrote:


If you're going to acuse Calix of tunneling, you better be able to back it up.

Calix you Town reading NU? because if you're scum reading him I think he might be a decent lynch today

On November 04 2016 07:12 mahrgell wrote:
Foreman: I see where you are coming from, again. Honestly, if you are right, I would consider it rather sad, but I guess the "be a dick" meta is really the current thing. But here I still lack any attempt by Foremen to progress the game. Okay, let him be blunt, let him be the noBS type. But what did he contribute?
At this point I actually question myself, as I seem to be the only one not liking Foremen. But I simply can't get it. All reasons for him to be town sound like yours "He doesnt give a fuck about others". Yeah, but maybe it would be a useful trait to actually give a fuck about others.

On November 04 2016 07:45 Calix wrote:


"not familiar with"

If they were discussing a meta reference then I would believe this. However they weren't. Everything that was discussed with ExO/ TT was sourced from the game thread. Why would the dynamics be unfamiliar to you?

Regardless of your response, what DID you make of ExO/ TT?

On November 04 2016 07:47 ExO_ wrote:


He and NU both jumped on my Calix shit at the start of the game

On November 04 2016 08:05 Calix wrote:


A poor argument. A fresh set of eyes is extremely helpful when it comes to sorting players. You, as a player new to the site, would be ignorant of ExO/ TT's 'meta tells' and thus would pick up on minor details that players more experienced with them would otherwise dismiss as NAI. Perhaps it's just me but sometimes not knowing meta is a good thing because then you can offer a different perspective on a player that isn't tainted by meta.

But anyway, I shall let you have fun with your dying phone. I'll await your thoughts on TT later.

On November 03 2016 23:21 Tictock wrote:
Rels what happened to you? Your play the past few games is like your heart just isn't in it anymore.

On November 04 2016 00:56 Tictock wrote:
In other news I see Skynx decided to start playing the game and I'm not hating it so far.

On November 04 2016 01:30 Tictock wrote:
Exo and Skynx are my top picks for lynch right now.

On November 04 2016 05:04 Tictock wrote:
Actually didn't someone mention that Skynx said he tries to open scummy to see who goes after him?

If that's true then I have to throw out my line of thought about his early game. Clearly scum!Skynx would try to replicate that type of play from his towngames.

On November 04 2016 05:49 Tictock wrote:


Interesting... I wonder if there was a reason that I included that little spoiler in that post...

Nah couldn't be. I don't think about what I post.

On November 04 2016 08:42 ExO_ wrote:
NU is actively borrowing his reads for rels in an attempt to push me, with Marhgwell being 3rd on a wagon.

Marhgwell is scum, and probably NU

On November 04 2016 08:51 ExO_ wrote:


What do you think of Mahgrell voting me without giving his reasoning just now? What about NU literally taking the words out of rels mouth as a reason to push me, even though rels didn't see it as a reason to scum read me.

foreman read the damn thread. And do something to help town. What did this post accomplish here? What did you disagreeing with me (in a bad way) accomplish?

N O T H I N G

On November 04 2016 08:55 ExO_ wrote:


for what reason? Why do you think I'm scum?

On November 04 2016 08:59 ExO_ wrote:


how exactly am I lying about you? or attempting to intimidate you? Aren't you supposed to be mr.coldnotaffectedbyonlinepersonalities guy

On November 04 2016 14:28 Tictock wrote:



Mostly the fact that "Not hating it" doesn't translate to "He's town"

---

I was referring to the fact that I had initially townread Skynx due to his early play.

On November 05 2016 07:40 NeverUnlucky wrote:
They both write "lol" in caps (Oddly I find this scummy).

On November 05 2016 11:46 darthfoley wrote:


Thanks for your summary. Really in depth