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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
Rels, shlog, LS, DF. In no peticular order. With all those I feel like they are on the right track. When they ask a question I can somehow see why a townie would like to ask that question what the potential answers could bring to the game. I ca understannd where their judgement comes from. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
Emp: I agree with TT on him. I simply can't understand his thought progress. He went from NU scum->NU town->NU scum in a way I simply can't follow. #577 he suddenly called NU town... Only 10 posts later he again doubted NU. To me it always felt like he was testing the waters how others feel about NU, and as soon as others were questioning NU, he struck again. The point is not that I can not see the validity of his arguments against NU, but the progress puzzles me and rings bells. Also his defense when he was mildly pressured consisted mostly out of looking for shittier players than himself. One thing has to be said though: I'm certain of one thing: NU vs emp is NOT MvM. I can't see any scum do this fishing for followers approach in MvM. So imho if one flips red, this clears the other one in my mind. Brings me to NU: He tries his best to make me (and seemingly everyone else) not understand him. Now this imho fits what I had in mind from him... so if we ignore this... I'm still missing something from him. The old NU loved to lock onto something, chase it. This NU completely lacks this. He is all over the place. He lacks targeted offense. I don't agree with Koshi on NU being the typical "type everything that comes into your mind" player. To me he was more like the "I have a thought and now I make everything fit my view" player. But even from that, this does not fit to what he is showing here. Basically the only excuse I have in my mind is that he wanted to have a new meta, after being called out for the unpleasentness of his previous one, and that I should give him time to to establish that. Conclusion: Somehow they are both my topscum, but I'm 95% sure not both are scum. And I'm not sure how to proceed. So honest question: Actually, under the assumption that there MUST be a townie between those 2, is it still correct to just lynch one? like IRL i would actually let both survive, as there must be 2 scum among the remaining players and chase for those. And then reevaluate this duel later. But IRL the numbers are very different from forum mafia with way less mislynches allowed. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
Guess he gets his own post. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
Uhm, originally I wanted to post a large post on how Koshi dropped from my town reads and why at this point im back at completely neut on him. But I think this does not really concern the day, so maybe we should focus on the lynches for the remaining hours. I would still like to discuss this during the night though... | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
Both have this unpleasant kind of "I clearly can't be scum, and this is proven" posts. Has this ever worked? Well... looking at Koshis recent scum wins (and late survival in D2), I guess it did. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
If you have 2 players, both highly suspicious, but certainly not both can be scum at the same time. Lynch one or not? As I said, in IRL mafia with 3 scum alive, I wouldn't lynch either but wait and see. How about online with the more town favored numbers? | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
On November 30 2016 18:49 Koshi wrote: Well. Everybody makes posts that they can't be scum. Basically the point of the game. Uhm, okay. I disagree. And I sincerely try my best not to ever do it. And ignore any posts doing that. I think it is completely pointless to explain why one can't be scum. Basically scum can make up anything and this is 100% WIFOM then. I certainly prefer to explain why the own play makes sense as town though. And let others pass judgement if this makes sense as town. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
On November 30 2016 18:53 Holyflare wrote: Who cares if a towny dies, you get a lot of information out of it. It's pretty irrelevant who dies day 1. Potentially even bad if mafia die imo. Makes the game complacent and stale. Well, IRL "lynching for information" is usually highly frowned But okay, I guess I trust Koshi and you on this one... And at least you seem uninvested in this. Which brings me to: What is actually your opinion on the NU vs emp story? You are attacking Koshi now (not sure you are still on me), which makes me feel you don't think as bad about NU. Meanwhile I decide who to vote between the two... | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
@HF and how about emp? You feel like he is natural? --- At this point, between Emp ad HF, after reading their filters again, I feel like the posts and the meta speak against NU, but my mind somehow feels he may not be guilty, while on Emp it is the other way around. His posts are less bad than my mind makes them want to be but I just don't feel good about him. Let's go with "facts" here ##vote NeverUnlucky | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
Would love to know where everyone stands. Tictock: --> emp : You had a full scumread on emp, half scum on NU. You think they both can be scum? Will you stay on Emp? Onegu: -->Koshi: I actually liked your last post, and as mentioned I have serious doubts about Koshi at this point. But I don't think he is a realistic D1 target so I would love to discuss him at night. If nobody joins your Koshi lead, will you come back to voting for "lesser evils" (or lesser goods, if we talk scumwise) or will you stay principled on Koshi, effectively abstaining from the vote? Rels: --> HF: Quite a while since you posted. Still convinced on HF? He posted quite some stuff since then. If this train dies down (seems like it) what is your updated opinion on NU vs Emp. DF: --> HF: You mentioned you consider HF,SL or Emp as viable lynches. HF and SL posted. So you are now on Emp if it would come down to Emp vs NU? HF: -->none: You went after me, had trust issues with Koshi, don't care about NU being lynched, are more than fine lynching Onegu... Well.. still no vote. If you could dayshoot someone now, it would be Onegu? If not, who else? CM8: -->none: Can you stop playing clueless noob? Like I don't care if you are clueless or not. But you must have an opinion. Your strongest wording so far was some mistrust on NU (why? because others made good arguments on him?) and some weak stuff on Onegu. We are lynching someone soon. Can you become more concrete and post with a bit more confidence? If you were a dayvig, who would you shoot now? | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
Cool. I already mentioned, that I see no point in filling the thread during the last half of the day with this discussion. Also I have you on Null, not on scum. I don't think a lynch on you is gonna happen, and I'm not sure I would even want that, and I'm pretty sure you know about the first part too. So cluttering the thread with it now is certainly not leading in a direction that is helping town. Which makes your interest in it only reinforcing my doubts. And honestly... I don't see any point in disucssing it with you anyway. So far all your answers have been "IM LOCK TOWN; YOU RETARD" and you obviously think this is how the convo is supposed to go. Nothing to argue then. I prefer to talk to others in this case. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
can you post it again with proper tags? | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
On November 30 2016 22:15 Koshi wrote: Skyrocketing up my scumlist. I am null? I have the most content of all. Please. Explain. Why. I. Am. Scum. Or. Null. No. And explained my reasons enough, Learn to fucking read. Throw your vote at me, call me topscum, blegh. I really dont give a shit. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
Just reread it. I see where you are coming from. I dismissed it earlier, as a hiccup as he was posting as he read it, but you are right, this Skynx!=HF should only concern his doubts about my expectations about you, not about my changed playstyle. But the rest of his filter simply looks so townish. Is Rels the kind of player to make such a "hm... I think this is something"->"hmmm is it?" -> "nah, this sounds totally stupid" progression as scum? It simply felt genuine. Also about my eraly meta, I guess I discarded it also, because I fully acknowledge that I somehow changed... The last game albeit somehow successful was not fully enjoyable a lot of due to how I approached the game. My mental approach is still the same, but I really tried to change my posting habits to make the game more fun and sustainable for myself. So if he at this point felt my meta was off... He was right. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
On November 30 2016 22:28 Holyflare wrote: I would like to hear koshi reasons. I made a big wall on koshi so how is it not relevant if you think he's null? Leave no stone unturned. Meh... okay... gimme an hour. | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
Pretty sure he can fake those targeted posts, but well, he didn't in the past games early stage. Not sure he could fake the motivation though. At this point I was very sure he could not. With my more recent concerns I could only explain this by him having some kind of trophy-hunting mindset, where he wants to show everything. Honestly something I would trust him to do form all I read from him, but still this initial feeling is holding me back the most on Koshi. Something though, that annoyed me early already, was his utter refusal to talk about anything but his own shit. Anyone doubting him was wasting time or him simply refusing to give any reasons for his reads, because we don't need to know. (Sorry cant find the post right now... several ppl quoted it too) LS was locktown because trust me boys, CM8 flipped between all alignments while not even posting. I simply never consider it a waste of time to have people talk about my own alignment, as it at least tells me somethig about them, where I have half the information. He can't tell me he has some super secret knowledge he doesn't want to share early day1. Sure, if a blue does that D3, or someone found the ultimate spew and wants to expand the case before revealing it.. go ahead. Early D1? Na. This story then continues. Koshi cant be scum. At the same time his reads are getting less and less impressive. Goes after HF, and calls him out for being offensive towards me. I would usually town read ppl for that. But Koshi? As full of himself as he is? Given his own post style? This looks more like taking cheap jabs, while scoring town points at the same time. And of course, no conversation with Koshi not telling the world that he cant be scum and it is completely impossible for him to play like this as scum. Regarding NU: NU scum, ah no, NU town, ah no, NU lockscum with basically no new information again. (but now emp also chimed in... makes me rethink my judgement about emp... not sure who was looking for assistance here) I actually liked his latest judgement about NU Just cant follow any thought progression here. This all was available before. At this point this feels more like he had a large number of arguments prepped on NU and whipped them out when the stars were good. This all still led me to him being neut though. His post on NU was good, just the progression and timing was shit. His start could be explained in weird ways to be scummish, but simple solutions are often easier and correct. But him calling out people for tone and friendliness, while being a dick all around, the complete refusal to accept any doubt on himself... Given his past games, this was basically how he played as scum there. Postulating he cant be scum (because double lynch in D2) and then trying to lead town. I have not read any townkoshi games. So it is entirely possible he plays the same as town. Just his wild claims, that this must be his town play is utterly bullshit. What basically is tipping me at this point though is his sudden obsession with my doubts on him. I think I was in his townlist for most of the game, and now, with the day entering his final stage, he is suddenly obsessed with me doubting him? Did my doubt of his glorious personality suddenly make me topscum? Was he suddenly looking for a case on someone he called town all day? I already said I would be willing to discuss it at night so I really cant dodge that conversation. But do we really need it now? There is nothing more urgent few hours before deadline that discussing doubts on players who are not getting lynched anyway? I would very much prefer to keep the discussion on likely lynch targets while tracking the other players state of mind. But instead he suddenly wants this to turn into Koshi vs me. But I guess my doubt on him indeed made me scum now. Shit happens. TLDR: - townish opening, I liked his initiative and focus - saying "I'm lock town, can't be scum" is utterly bullshit, when he played the same way the last couple of games. - actively refusing to answer questions on how his reads come together is at least not helping town - calling for others to play nice, lecture them about how to create a helpful town atmosphere while trying the "I'm king, follow me, don't question me" approach to the game is ... again bullshit. - his case on NU was good, the thought progression and timing though was shit and feels unnatural. - insisting on this Mahrgell vs Koshi is disruptive and again shit timing... and the tone is certainly not what he just demanded from HF towards me. - I honestly have no clue where his vote on me is coming from except "MWAHAHA; YOU DONT CALL ME TOWN" | ||
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
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mahrgell
Germany3941 Posts
On November 30 2016 23:19 Koshi wrote: True. I did change my read on Rels a bit after reading that Onegu post. Or at least it sparked my interest in Rels. Ok top 4 atm NU Mahrgell Rels TT Cool, from Top3 town to Top2 scum because I doubted you. :D | ||
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