EPT[M][N] Presidential Election Mini Mafia - Page 5
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Jealous
10111 Posts
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Jealous
10111 Posts
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Jealous
10111 Posts
On June 29 2016 05:34 Artanis[Xp] wrote: It doesn't really matter whether you think they're lame or not, they're correct. Damdred and I can't both be mafia so either my reasoning is 100% sincere, or he's Town anyway. Since I'm being sincere, you can be certain that I'm not trying to mess you about or fuck with you. There's certain things you know about a player after playing with them for long enough that they can't change, or are just innate to them. I'm not saying he can't play a great scumgame; I'm saying he can't play this scumgame with this team. I believe that to be entirely impossible. Furthermore, given I've pushed people that I haven't played with (and also used non-meta reasons), clearly it's not my entire play. It's a major part because all that matters is whether players are capable of playing the game they're currently playing as mafia. If the answer is no, you know their alignment. 1. I agree with this. I do believe your reasoning is sincere in the sense that you truly believe it. I also don't trust your reasoning because I can't trust someone who blindly pockets people (Chezinu). 2. I understand where you're coming from, but “overconfidence precedes carelessness.” You are so confident in your subjective experience and understanding of the people behind the aliases on this site that you are willing to overlook concrete evidence. On June 29 2016 05:35 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I'm sorry you can't get your mislynch based on logic. You've got some good logic going on and I'm sure it's frustrating to lose out on a mislynch this way. Not something you don't deserve with the way you're playing but mafia is a cruel game and sometimes people are town for reasons that suck, but make them clear town nonetheless. I like how you use "your mislynch" to further incriminate me in the eyes of the reader. I am only pursuing this because 1. I've "got some good logic going" and 2. I, like you, and truly sincere in my analysis. This is the clearest scum to me right now so I'm pushing it with tangible evidence at a time when everyone else seems to be dozing besides Superbia and TT. I'm doing this for the good of town. As I mentioned earlier, if I do all of this and Damdred were by chance to flip green, wouldn't that look terrible for me if all I had to do was vote for him and cite my D1 reads? I might not be an experienced player and therefore not a strong player, but I'm not retarded and even I can see cause-and-effect on an a->b level. Speaking of which, if you were scum and Damdred does get lynched and he is green, that would look great for you, wouldn't it? You made such an impassioned case with pretty formatting and an appeal to the in-circle of TL Mafia. If you were scum and I got lynched and flipped town, that might be a slight hindrance to you but nothing you wouldn't be able to work your way out of considering so many others are also on this wagon and because you have pocket buttbuddies in Chezinu and possibly Damdred (from his posts, at least). This is an interesting hypothetical, something I'd want to explore if Damdred does indeed flip green, which I doubt. For now, I'm sticking to my guns. It's won one game, it may win another. | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
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Jealous
10111 Posts
On June 29 2016 05:54 Tumblewood wrote: Fuck this I can't vote for Damdred this game Explain? | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
On June 29 2016 04:56 Shapelog wrote: (Correct)Day 2 Vote Count Jealous(4): Artanis[Xp], Superbia, Damdred. Tumblewood Damdred(3): Tictock, Skynx, Jealous Tictock (1): Not voting (1), Chezinu Currently, Jealous, Is set to be lynched! Day 2 ends Wednesday, Jun 29 9:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00) in . TL countdown synchronizes with your device local time and not with the TL server time. It might be inaccurate. Just noticed that GlowingBear isn't listed here. | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
On June 29 2016 05:57 Tumblewood wrote: I don't think anyone can be the scum but jealous TBH (tt maybe maybe) But I'm not wholly convinced jealous is scum Explain? I'd like to see a case built against me that doesn't involve "feels" or an acronym like TMI with a lack of substance. This isn't directly towards only you, Tumblewood, but are the veterans really that lazy around here? Almost no one besides Tictock is posting quotes and examining filters publicly. So far, many, people are just stating their reads with a definite lack of substance from within the thread. | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
On June 29 2016 05:58 GlowingBear wrote: Because I didn't cast my vote on Damdred yet You're not listed in the non-voting list, is what I meant. | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
On June 29 2016 06:04 Tumblewood wrote: Tone The way Damdred reacted to suspicion I don't think could ever come from scum. Imagine he is: He has to solo through the game and get 4 mislynches. He has four votes on him, all looks lost. You push him hard and he keeps pushing for his preferred lynch and defends himself hard. It felt incredibly genuine to me. He has 3 votes and I have 4. You unvoted me and revoted me, btw. On June 29 2016 06:04 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Honestly it just feels that you're scum to me because of the... opportunisticness you're displaying? You're lining up my potential mislynch now for if Damdred flips green, which is something I'd expect from scum. You're not taking the super easy things mostly such as people talking to others as if they're confirmed town (TT used it on Damdred) because you know they're cheap shots. I only worded it that way because I feel like everyone else is pretty townie and the way you're going about makes me feel pretty confident that you're mafia. There was also just some actual sympathy for you, not gloating about it. I sincerely believe you're scum and I am sincerely sorry that you're likely to get lynched because people get townread for stupid reasons. Mafia doesn't necessarily reward those who play the best. I've experienced it plenty myself where people end up with stupid townreads that are correct because they just would never do it as scum; dumbtells were common in that regard. As for the Chez read, I'm sure you're aware it's obviously a joke. Your frustration regarding it also further fuels my scumread on me, as I believe it's a mislynch that you need as mafia. Rest assured that I won't keep that joke going should it get to LYLO, but I doubt I'll be alive that long. I've had Damdred as my scumlean since D1. In a situation where it's me vs. Damdred both getting votes for lynch in the wake of Superbia's play, I'll always choose Damdred. Examining that in a vacuum, that can't be AI because as scum I am doing it to get as a myslynch, as you said, and as town I am doing it because that is the strongest scum case presented so far and the one I can stand behind as town. I'm playing to win in either scenario. Also, as I said before, it would be foolish for me to put in all that effort if I was scum to mislynch 1 player when I have so many more to take care of. I'm fully aware that if he flips green it will look bad for me; rationally, as scum, I would use this as an opportunity to quietly wagon on him and if I am approached about it I would cite my D1 reads. Instead, I'm trying to lead the charge. If you combine all of these things into one, I can't see how you can say I'm playing with an opportunistic mindset. Thanks for your sentiments. I'm frustrated because it's bad for town, and I am town. People withholding reads and analysis is always scummy to me. Chezinu contributing so little for so long, your refusal to read this fact, and Damdred constantly trying to butter you two up just all seem like things that townies who are trying to win wouldn't do. As you said, all three of you can't be scum, but all three of you could have mannerisms that are not beneficial to town. I do want to note that I never said that either you or Chez were scum, just that your "house of brown" stuff annoys me. | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
On June 29 2016 06:20 Jean Valjean wrote: Hey guys, I'm partially unavailable today, and probably tomorrow too. I am sorry for that, I should have more time to contribute on thursday. I will try to make sense of what is going on in a little while, also I'm not particularly bothered about what we kill today. I was quite honestly looking forward to your input/analysis of the current situation to be honest ): Will you be able to catch up before EoD? | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
On June 29 2016 06:30 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Jealous, I like you and because you've been so upfront and mannered about things I'll read your filter and Chez's filter and give an actual read on him as well sometime before tomorrow. Hey, thanks  It'd be no fun for me if I were to be lynched without a single person making a case against me that I can truly understand. I appreciate it. | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
On June 29 2016 06:18 Tumblewood wrote: I don't even know where to start casing jealous. there are a ton of things that should be huuuge mafia tells but from what I know about jealous's meta those tells probably don't even apply. Could you elaborate? | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
On June 29 2016 06:19 Damdred wrote: Meta is a thing jealous you just kind of live with through the opening portions of the game and later in the game is ignored usually. There are super strong meta reads in this game, mostly between myself and art. Partially towards gb before the claim. Besides that meta has been used pretty sparingly besides super as well. As for what's your play mafia wouldn't try that hard would come to the for front. Do I think your lock scum. Nit really I have some paranoia about someone else as well but meh. Why not make this case now? I may appear tunneled on you but that's because the only case I've been able to put my finger on with any degree of certainty. If you present a strong argument, I would like to think I am objective enough to reconsider. | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
On June 29 2016 06:42 Damdred wrote: I've put several decent arguments into the thread why I am not scum. Sure they do have wifom about them which makes them a somewhat weaker because I'm self aware of my meta. Like don't get me wrong I like both you and sk regardless if I get lynched both of you have the makings of good players that just need to improve some peripheral things. That's besides the point though. Honestly btw we can't wait till lylo or mylo to look into Jean or else he automatically wins if he is scum in lylo which is what I'm paranoid about. His post just sent shivers up my spine. Which stinks I can't be on the combo but maybe the way moosey gave himself up to Jean is indicative. I meant the case on who else you have scum leans on! | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + On June 27 2016 02:26 Jealous wrote: I was already typing this out as I was working through the thread, so I will use this as an answer: Having read the past few pages that were largely Jean Vanjean pushing Artanis, playing petty games and platforming for presidency, I have to say that he has left a foul taste in my mouth. While I respect his use of language and mild tone, I have to say that he is trying too hard to push the notion that he is "smart" and that therefore the best choice for mayor. Scum can be smart too, and I think a smart scum would follow along the same lines that Jean is doing: 1. Lay relatively low at first and not draw much suspicion in either direction while the thread is in a tumultuous Day 1 state, Artanis fighting QT, lots of speculation going in every direction, etc. 2. a. Push a target that is already under pressure/suspicion from others using vague meta reads (paraphrasing what Artanis said, "If I had a dollar for every time someone scumread me for playing worse than they expect me to,"). b. Play word/mind games (and perhaps a little bit of fear tactics) to force that target to say things that Jean wants said from another mouth, giving him added external validity. "This is not incorrect, as mafia can never lynch me. My greatest strength in mafia is that I can beat people into submission with arguments and words." - Jean c. Essentially bullying him into voting for him as president. 3. Build a stronger platform for a presidential candidacy than any that has been posted so far, using big words and nice formatting to please the eye and make the reader complacently agree with the validity of his statements, in what could be considered a "last push" because of the timing (12 hours before EoD as opposed to any time prior). I find the fact that he has garnered a fair share of support and relatively little suspicion to be very alarming. Is everyone going for the textbook "he is active and pushing someone, so can't be scum?" I believe that can backfire terribly in a game such as this where that modus operandi would be an effective strategy for Mafia to get into a position of power and make the game much harder for Town to win. There have been four people whose names have been tossed around/who have been voted for/have pushed for presidency, from what I've read so far (I still have to go back to the early pages). In most recent pages, GlowingBear has been making some weak pushes for it, going by the logic of "Why SHOULDN'T I be President?" as opposed to "Here is why I SHOULD be President," which I don't like either. In short, I think that between those people (Superbia, Jean, GB, and one other person I am forgetting at the moment) there must be a scum. It is THE play of the game in this format, and for scum to sit back and allow Town to freely elect Town for both positions would be simply poor play. I find that to be less likely than scum being one of the power candidates right now. | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
On June 29 2016 07:57 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Alternatively, this could be the worst game ever where we lose from 9v1, starting with lynching one of our strongest players that was unshootable and lynched mafia D1. In theory, the more time that is spent in indecision, the more insurmountable his 2 vote advantage will be. I'm not fully convinced that he is scum, but if there is ever a time to do this, it would have to be all of us as one. I will see how it plays out over the next 20 hours and think about it. In the meantime... On June 27 2016 06:18 Jealous wrote: Very nice. I'm glad MoosyDoosy shenanigans failed him in this game. Glad I came around to vote for Jean. + Show Spoiler [Extreme paranoia] + I will have to examine MoosyDoosy vs. Jean for fear of this being a legendary bus. | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
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Jealous
10111 Posts
On June 29 2016 22:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote: ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/KlkEtLA.gif) Deadline's today right? That's kind of unfortunate since I've got improv until close to deadline. I'm still waiting for your analysis ): This would also help to quiet Jean saying you don't contribute? ^^ | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
As TT said, the main reason this wagon even gained traction was because of some flight of fancy, more of a sentimental "let's jump to conclusions because we want this to be the greatest game evar" than any real analysis of Jean's play. As TT said, Superbia could be equally guilty of the same legendary bus technique. Basing Jean's lynch on this and inactivity is too great a risk because we lose 2 potentially townie votes and we lose a townie who can't be NK. | ||
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Jealous
10111 Posts
GlowingBear, will you ever use your pardon? If so, in what scenarios and why? If you were in an endgame scenario where you had to choose between Jean and your bodyguard to lynch, who would you lynch? Jean: Under what circumstances would you push a GlowingBear lynch? | ||
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