On May 02 2016 09:18 gumshoe wrote: sl and dyh trd you pretty hard, thats not indicative of you bieng scum but it doesnt help me tr you ethier.
Regardless, my play has been lack luster and I may deserve todays lynch, but shape is def town here.
Again, this is wrong, again SL tried to get me killed, this has been said already once before, and associative reads are best done when the scum are ignoring their teammates or the interactions are meaningless, that's not at all what you are even saying here though.
when he voted you, he had the majority of votes (3-4) and you were one of the last to place said vote, he may very well have been distancing.
Obv I cant read the pages I missed and defend myself at the same time. But id imagine hts is scum for that vote. Shes not that silly
This is a pretty godamm half hearted offense hts -_- nothing like how dyh pushed koshi shape and to a lesser extent me. It is sl though / : but meh.
He attacked you cause you voted him(thats it) you voted him cause it looked like he was already dead / : on top of that he switched onto koshi pretty fast (only 12 minutes, he never even explained why he switched to koshi last second)
in fact he seemed to switch onto koshi (for no reason) my guess is he saw that he was making you into the secondary wagon.
a minute after this was posted, he switched votes with no comment on why / : he was still accusing you, but he was voting koshi, someone who was never getting lynched and who he wasnt currently accusing -_- yeah... looks a tinsy bit shadey.
I'll be honest, after that gb debacle, I don't paticularly want to get into a huge shouting match again, even if I'm right this time. Winning just isn't worth the repeat effort, at least not this game / : hts has played brilliantly, I have trd her for ever because she genuinely looks super duper omega town to me. I am forced to say otherwise now because Koshi and shape simply aren't scum based off their interactions and despite how terrible I've played I know what I am.
All the evidence is out there, nothing I say should really motivate you as everything that comes from me did not exist before this cycle. Given my day 2 I am easily capable of concocting circumstances to scum read someone who is town, so my self defense shouldn't really be a factor here / :
There are a few points of note though.
Day 1: would I really so blatantly defended/ waffled on sl just as momentoum starts to build off him? I went from scum reading him to town reading him in a rapid span, seems like the kinda shit scum would want to avoid. Comparatively hts's interactions were a lot safer.
Night 1: why shoot damdred? As I said myself earlier, I felt he was a likely blue heal, plus he was tring me and dyh reasonably hard, sl was highly likely to die eventually so they didn't kill him for that guy. Damdred was constantly coming back to hts as scum, if scum was going to win this game with an hts dyh sl combo, it would be via hts's strong play. To that end, Damdred was a pretty huge threat, you also can't say the chance of heal is a non factor, as doc actually did heal Damdred, he just got rbd. With hts as trump card, the risky shot makes sense.
Day2 I come out with a huge case on a townie, and dyh chooses to fight me on my double town scum reads? Something's wrong there, again, also my reluctance to lynch dyh there was pretty blatant, as always you can't avoid the traps you don't know are coming.
Night 2 lightning-another guy who was tring me pretty hard / :
Day 3 : I am incapable of putting that much effort into lynching someone I know is town, I have never and will probably never push a case that hard as scum. Meanwhile hts was going back and forth on me and gb as the scummer, which is pretty optimal for at some point getting us both lynched.
Night 3 null- just doc
Day 4 wasn't here XD sorry
Night 4 null, just vet, though tumble was tring me pretty hard as well / :
Also would I really go after hts here as scum? Koshi particularly begging to kill shape _- I'm not going for the easiest lynch, I'm going for the one I think has the highest chance of red regardless of if I deserve or even can do so
In general my actions don't really make sense as scum, I barrel forward into landlines and push with conviction I can't possibly have if I'm scum.
Hts is smart and active, but she always like that apparently. Koshi remember cell mafia? Remember my push on prplz? For better or worse, (likely worse XD ) this is who I am when I think I'm right. I know your frustrated with towns shitty play and hts is actually trying, but is that anger worth losing?
On May 03 2016 02:25 Koshi wrote: lol I was kidding voting you tbh. Even though those are some really bad reasons to call yourself town for.
##unvote ##vote HTS
Top scum likelyness: 38% HTS 38% Shape 24% gumshoe
In my eyes. But I might be wrong.
kek, yeah the reasons arent that compelling in general XD ive honestly been pretty bad this game.
The point about the damdred nk has merit though, if we assume hts is scum, we can further assume that the team built thier plan around her as she probs had the best chance of winning.
we also know that scum took a risk in shooting damdred and actually managed to kill him based purely off luck (rb) therefore they must have had a good reason for it. Doesnt really match with me bieng scum, as he was tring me pretty hard.
Damdred was a pretty large and consistent threat throughout day 1 to hts, he was also kind of cooling on her (but still had her in his bottom 5) at the time of his shot so it was a pretty great time to kill him.
makes sense to me / :
damdred was also scum reading shape, but as you know I tr him for dif reasons (mainly dyh interactions and his day 1 vote)
Shape is the person I'm most suspicious of, doesn't seem to be doing much and his posts are overly self-conscious, especially for someone that hasn't been seriously pressured yet.
Actually, I want to revise what I said about Shape. It isn't so much that he is self-conscious. It is more that he is just talking about himself a lot, even after the beginning posts.
Shape talking about himself a bunch while not being productive is indicative of a scum mindset. It implies that he is worried about how the thread is perceiving him, which is more likely to come from scum.
Shape - We'll be getting into this more today, but my original reasons for voting him are still good and he is likely scum.
does this honestly seem like scum on scum koshi? I really cant see it / :
On May 03 2016 08:17 Koshi wrote: OK guys while brushing my teeth I have decided that we will lynch Shape.
He is very likely mafia based on his play.
Gumshoe I expect you to sheep me.
I think HTS played a good enough game to get the win. I think I can see her be town.
I literally do not understand why you people dont want to lynch shape. He has done nothing and it seems that it is working.
This is my final vote. Gumshoe I expect you to sheep me.
like I said, dyh's push on him does not come off as scum on scum. We have actual correlations now here at the end of the game, we can reason through lynches and kills.
relying on our gut and what we find inherently scummy hasn't helped ether of us catch scum. You were sure fedie was the lynch right up until he claimed and so was I about gb right up till he died.
given the situation, I think it's best to focus on the key events, sure they can be written off as wifom but I dont think the other way is much better.
Fact1, damdred was killed while townreading shape and me(also dyh) and while posing a threat to hts. He was killed despite the likelyhood of a heal (which did happen) implying thier was a gain to the shot. If shape is scum, they took a risk shot for no reason.
fact2- sl did not start attacking hts till she voted him(when he was already a leading wagon), if we assume thier scum together, she must have already started bussing him at that point, making his half hearted vote back onto her likely just distancing. He then switched off her for no given reason onto you koshi, presumably because he saw that his vote was making her into a potential shenany wagon.
fact3- dyh went after shape hard, why attack your active scum mate while giving sl, his inactive scum mate a pass? Comparatively he omega green read hts / :
fac4t- why would shape jump onto a wagon that he knew was going to flip green? makes no sense.
I dont claim to know what is inherently scummy in peoples play, I may pretend to for the games sake but whats to separate true derp from scum derp? Very little in truth, but I simply cannot reconcile a shape scum team with the above points, they have little to do with what I think is right or wrong, they simply stand in opposition to what may seem like a clear lynch to you.
I also dont think shape would let you into final 4 koshi / : your unkillable and eager to murder him.
I will not be sheeping you on this koshi / : im sorry. Really dont think shape is scum here
also hts usually plays well as ethier side, if we let her pass because of that, does that mean she always deserves the win as scum? Why bother playing if shes in the game XD
On May 03 2016 02:03 gumshoe wrote: Day 1: would I really so blatantly defended/ waffled on sl just as momentoum starts to build off him? I went from scum reading him to town reading him in a rapid span, seems like the kinda shit scum would want to avoid. Comparatively hts's interactions were a lot safer.
Night 1: why shoot damdred? As I said myself earlier, I felt he was a likely blue heal, plus he was tring me and dyh reasonably hard, sl was highly likely to die eventually so they didn't kill him for that guy. Damdred was constantly coming back to hts as scum, if scum was going to win this game with an hts dyh sl combo, it would be via hts's strong play. To that end, Damdred was a pretty huge threat, you also can't say the chance of heal is a non factor, as doc actually did heal Damdred, he just got rbd. With hts as trump card, the risky shot makes sense.
This first part is pretty WIFOM altogether, given Damdred's list, your reasoning cannot possibly exclude Shape, but we'll recap here.
On April 23 2016 06:22 Damdred wrote: I had to run to the store so my post won't be posted maybe mafia won't kill me and I'll be able to post it when I'm home.
But ATM I have
Damdred LS Gumshoe Ticktock As my really pretty sure they are town
GB Dyh Koshi
As my probably town right now
Hts
Right now is a gut feel town.
I feel like tumble is really likely mafia with what I said.
Which leaves me in a world where SL, shape and james have two mafia in it from my perspective. Technically GB could drop here but idk I'm in his pocket a bit ATM with the hard town read earlier.
If I had to make a guess its James, SL and tumble. But i was still working through things
Several problems with the points you are making - LS (and even I admitted) mentioned the tactical wagon to shoot was myself, and scum could not have known that SL was or wasn't getting shot N1. Second, to suggest that Shape couldn't possibly be mafia from your own reasoning is poor at best, but I'll continue.
On May 03 2016 02:03 gumshoe wrote: Day2 I come out with a huge case on a townie, and dyh chooses to fight me on my double town scum reads? Something's wrong there, again, also my reluctance to lynch dyh there was pretty blatant, as always you can't avoid the traps you don't know are coming.
This is not what I'd consider "fighting" nor did he do anything meaningful or push you in an alignment indicative manner with what you are claiming:
On April 25 2016 05:00 gumshoe wrote: I'll consent to lynching fedie or gb, otherwise it's better to just kill me (the scummiest townie) cause I don't see a red flip coming from anyone else.
You just listed two people I think are town. Aggression is not exclusively a townie trait and it doesn't make Koshi town.
Night 2 lightning-another guy who was tring me pretty hard / :
This can't possibly be used in anyone's defence, even as he got out of the tunnel on myself. He was universally townread and was actively trying to organise town. It's pretty clear that most of the rest of town was disorganised and scum in general have taken advantage of that all game long.
On May 03 2016 02:03 gumshoe wrote: Day 3 : I am incapable of putting that much effort into lynching someone I know is town, I have never and will probably never push a case that hard as scum. Meanwhile hts was going back and forth on me and gb as the scummer, which is pretty optimal for at some point getting us both lynched.
[...]
Also would I really go after hts here as scum? Koshi particularly begging to kill shape _- I'm not going for the easiest lynch, I'm going for the one I think has the highest chance of red regardless of if I deserve or even can do so
The self-meta and WIFOM aside, the bolded is also really bad and takes what I actually did out of context. I was hard scumreading GB before both you engaged with each other, and threw my case at him to see how he reacted, and at the time concluded both of you were town on town after engaging you both. I drew doubt to your timestamps and rightfully so, and you backed off, so how you are categorising this now is really shady. (GB's confusing read on Tictock threw me off, but as far as you two interacting I was getting reads on you both.)
Koshi being willing to kill me at points this cycle also negates you "not" going for the easiest lynch, but regardless that doesn't make you town the way you are claiming.
Obviously you're re-framing your arguments to make me look bad, and your hitting me immediately for the second vote right off the gate to lock in a likely mislynch is very suspicious.
But I'll continue with your next post and go through the motions with Shape to be fully sure. [/QUOTE]
i made a neutral mistake hts (time stamps) that in truth said nothing about my alignment, and twisted that into me trying to "bury a townie"
as for damdred's list including shape, I agree, shape may have killed damdred / : but I most certainly wouldn't have in that spot and I doubt dyh would ethier. There was a high chance of a heal, yet scum shot anyways. Meaning damdred was a threat / :
shape is town though as I said, cause of how dyh pressed him (doesnt at all gel with our existing record of how he treats his scum partners)
and he wouldnt have jumped onto ff last sec.
You on the other hand, are only ever attack by scum when there seemingly dead already (3 votes on sl) or trd by them.
I'd like to see you look a bit more into some of the lower volume posters though and take a stance either way, I realise it's Day 1 but there has been some content at least from DYH and sicklucker.
some people say you can still hear her muscles strain from all that lifting so long ago.
On May 03 2016 18:38 Koshi wrote: I am not doing anything. I heard it was your last game so you can have a win. Unless it is gumshoe but then you got the mental victory. or w.e it is called.
While I can appreciate the sentiment, I'm not voting for someone I think is town at Lylo, end of story.
On May 03 2016 18:38 Koshi wrote: I am not doing anything. I heard it was your last game so you can have a win. Unless it is gumshoe but then you got the mental victory. or w.e it is called.
While I can appreciate the sentiment, I'm not voting for someone I think is town at Lylo, end of story.
So in all the posts HTS made you can't find anything more townie than the wifom around Shape and his scummates?
Dude, townies fucking suck at this game. Someone bieng terrible and scummy is not a reliable way of catching scum unless it's paticularly uncharacteristic of them to be so. I've literally been in this exact position like 5 times and it's just as likely to be the competent player as it is to be the derp one.
Nk analysis plus vote analysis plus scum relations are the best way to find scum. And even if holes can be pocked at them, those holes aren't as likely as the obvious conclusions. All my instincts and logic say that the evidence points to shape bieng a pathetic townie, just like I am, just like fedie and gb were.
Hts is a strong active player who probably rolled with scum mates she could buss (ie lower than her in skill) so of course I expect her filter to look great. Just like blazings in vanilla / :
On May 03 2016 18:38 Koshi wrote: I am not doing anything. I heard it was your last game so you can have a win. Unless it is gumshoe but then you got the mental victory. or w.e it is called.
While I can appreciate the sentiment, I'm not voting for someone I think is town at Lylo, end of story.
So in all the posts HTS made you can't find anything more townie than the wifom around Shape and his scummates?
Dude, townies fucking suck at this game. Someone bieng terrible and scummy is not a reliable way of catching scum unless it's paticularly uncharacteristic of them to be so. I've literally been in this exact position like 5 times and it's just as likely to be the competent player as it is to be the derp one.
Nk analysis plus vote analysis plus scum relations are the best way to find scum. And even if holes can be pocked at them, those holes aren't as likely as the obvious conclusions. All my instincts and logic say that the evidence points to shape bieng a pathetic townie, just like I am, just like fedie and gb were.
Hts is a strong active player who probably rolled with scum mates she could buss (ie lower than her in skill) so of course I expect her filter to look great. Just like blazings in vanilla / :
lol
She doesn't look great at all...
Dude she has like 5 million wots, effort like that in some players iusually means instant tr XD.
That said no I'm not doing this cause of course I'm just going to find bullshit to justify my view. That's just how my brain works.
I have the highest rate of accuracy when I focus on key events in relation to players.
I can't explain why dyh would push shape and not sl
I can't explain why sl magically switched his vote off of hts
I can't explain why shape voted on ff last second
I don't understand why shape would let you into final 4
And I can't explain why scum shot Damdred unless he was a threat to their long term goals. Note this point could also fit shape
I have seen townies do things you cannot imagine Koshi. Focusing on key points is the most reliable way to catch scum that I have. I won't stray from that this game.
On April 22 2016 01:10 Shapelog wrote: DYH: Nothing I am seeing is making think he is town or scum. The sheeping thing caught my eye, but makes sense if HTS is his top town read. Would like to see more out of him. Also his opinion on LS, since LS is the main one pushing Sky, his top town read. SaltShaker Kinda debating putting him in the scum lean cat. (I did) I would expect him to do more after saying most people are going to wait to post (his 3rd post.) Also this post really doesn't give much if you look at it:
Dont want to lynch Ls hes so cute and trying hard Ticktock is looking really strong I do want to lynch koshi but hes probably town. Not sure I can do another koshi game Gum probably town from what I know about him FF was not even in the top 3 people for wasting posts early so im not sure why hes being attacked. Hts seems over defensive but maybe thats just the koshi factor wish I could read shapelogs posts but luckily he does not have one I want to lynch gb a lil for this posts
A lot of his town reads aren't really explained (TT) and just feels rushed in a way. He is kinda avoids a read on 3 people (talks about FF, but doesn't actually really gives a read, more so on the threads interaction on FF) (HTS statement was pretty none positional) (and I have really no clue what he means on mine lol)
He also doesn't seem to go after anyone other than GB. And focuses on GB on his next post.
Which is pretty impressive. After he gave that list post he did nothing to push either sl or figure out DYH their alignment though.
But turned it miraculously around and he voted mafia sl on D1. Impressive once more. But looking at his post he kinda was looking to get off him. Why?
On April 22 2016 07:10 Shapelog wrote: Hmmm. I do not understand why FF was open to a HTS vote.
On April 21 2016 07:10 Fecalfeast wrote:
On April 21 2016 07:06 Damdred wrote:
On April 21 2016 07:04 Fecalfeast wrote: LS you're using so many posts just trying to discredit what people say about you rather than trying to find scum.
And this is different than every other game how?
Anyway I'm going to hedge on hts now until tommorow.
It is bothering me sl is getting so little attention especially with his lack of try hard as s um lately.
You're right, it's been a while I guess.
I'll never pass up a chance to lynch SL, especially if he's being lazy
On April 22 2016 01:47 Fecalfeast wrote: I would like to vote and lynch sicklucker if he doesn't come back. HTS you're giving me weird tone feels right now it feels like you're talking down to everyone but maybe that's just me having only been awake 10 minutes
He hasn't come back. So logic says that SL should be his lynched for today.
On April 22 2016 06:04 Fecalfeast wrote: Pssssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
##vote sicklucker
frig off damdred
On April 22 2016 06:42 Fecalfeast wrote: I would vote HTS
Even though he did have sus. towards HTS. i do not understand why he thinks another vote without giving reasoning behind it. FF basically said "no show = vote" yet he is still looking at other lynches. It feels a bit opportunistic, and is really concerning if Sl gets lynched and flips scum. I feel like the first few posts was just him talking to talk, but now his person is getting lynched (other than LS, which by the time he posted the sky comment, was still before he went with damdred.)
↑ please watch how FF was voting fecalfeast. The same person Shape thought was mafia. But for some reason right after voting sl, Shape goes attack the person who wants to vote sl with him.
On April 22 2016 07:16 Shapelog wrote: Saltshaker, you finally decided to show up. Just 30 mins roughly from deadline. Yay....
Prob. my 4/5 post or w/e
↑ Tinfoil (mafia talking to each other) BUT There is also no actual attempt from Shape to read sl. Just this. Strange when Shape was scumreading sl?
And D2 he again ended on mafia!! Impressive once more.
And D3 he did nothing because there was 0 pressure. Pushed the GB a bit but didn't put his hearth really into it. Also pushed another town lynch in TT already. Just doing what is needed. Blending in and making the right cases on the right people.
For D4 he didn't even vote. Which is not normal for Shape. I do believe he has really problems connecting to the internet but I also think that as town he would find a way to show his commitment to solving the game and wouldn't get catched by internet failure. Probably voted his scumread when he entered the thread. etc etc.
The guy is just playing reactionary D3 and D4 and is getting rewarded for it by dumbass shit townreads that people give him. I never understood why people townread him. Both HTS and gumshoe and this TW. And GB.
Only TT was skeptical and said he was probably town because the mafia spewed him town. Which was exactly my read on Shape but some dumbasses lynched TT and some other dumbasses didn't vote. But w.e that happened.
D5 more nothing. Just get him lynched. Last 3 cycles it is mafia riding to victory because town is fucking retarded to the maximum.
Gumshoe. Read this fucking case carefully. And tell me why the fuck you want to lynch somebody who wrote 5 billion words over Shape. Who has no real reason to be town except GAME FUCKING RELATED EVENTS.
While HTS was pushed by SL While HTS made a shitton of questionable post. (which at that amount could come from town trying to solve over mafia trying to hide) While HTS is really trying to solve the game. day after day.
point 1: zero effort- hyperbole.
point 2: seems like your muddling this up, but yeah, just seems like derp to me. If dude knew if ff was going to flip green he would not have voted ff at the last sec. the end.
point 3: shape is not a pushy player and he wasnt leading town sentiment, he was probs just lazy/realistic. Like I blatantly defended sl that day, so my criteria for scummy regarding this lynch is "who was afraid to look bad" and shape def doesnt fall into that category.
point 4: you vaguely brush over how he lands on mafia and treat this as a scum point... gonna need more than that.
point 5: if hts is the final scummer, we can assume he was having a hard time pushing as no one was actually scum XD which may very well explain his hesitance, for proof though I was also busy, I was frustrated with the situation as well making the game hard to play at all.
point 6: I didnt vote due to a combination of gb disappointment and work, that shows there is a precedent for a townie showcasing this behaviors ether way therefore it is null.
point 7: of course a player will look reactionary when they dont really know who scum is (ie scum is one of thier hard town reads)
point 8: read it carefully.
point 9: we've already explained hts's behavior, 1: it's her last game she wants to win 2: her scum team is beneath her skill level so she can buss if need be 3: Shes generally skilled and active as ethier side. Shape may very well just be a shit townie, we def have lots of those always.
point 10: Hts was only pushed by sl once she started pushing him(around when he looked like the lynch) she eventually voted off him, and he voted off her FOR LITERALLY NO GIVEN REASON ON TO YOU.
11: Post day 2, hts does not have to play scummy, she just has to not die.
On May 03 2016 20:33 Koshi wrote: I will never again vote HTS this game gumshoe. So you better shape the fuck up and read the guy.
Pun intended.
thats fine, we can let the lynch dead lock, ill get shot and you can vote whoever you want.
I also am unwilling to sheep you due to how you got fucking mad at fedie for being town XD I dont want hts to be scum koshi, I am simply voting the person the evidence suggests is mafia.
You on the other hand have this notion of deserving or not deserving the win, I think for the sake of your own sanity you desperately want shape to be scum XD and more than anything in the world, you dont wanna be the guy who lets a scum shape win in this position.
Your not impartial and your ignoring key points. I am sorry koshi but you are not sheep worthy.
On May 03 2016 20:49 Koshi wrote: gumshoe your reasoning for defending Shape are the worst I ever read in forever. So either you get lynched for being this fucking dense or Shape is.
I am maybe tunneled on Shape, but if Shape is not mafia you are.
then lynch me, I am not lynching shape
and yes I am making reasons up to counter you because I simply dont think hes scum and everything else is second to that.
thats because I have key points your saying dont matter, but they do matter to me koshi, as they always yield my best reads.
On May 03 2016 20:54 Koshi wrote: Well if he was frustrated it was because he couldn't access the interwebz. But you didn't mean that and Shape was not frustrated with the game because he fucking isn't playing the game.
The guy is literally not playing the game while he normally is a hardcore player. I already said that this is the guy that is floating so many fucking scenarios in his head that you want to fucking buy a gun and shoot him in the head so he would shut the fuck up clustering the thread with a fucking million posts about who could be mafia for reasons you think can't get more ridiculous till you read his next post.
I just played a game where he would afk for long stretches of time and didnt really have any strong cases. Therefore you can forgive me for not buying into your meta read / :
EPT
