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Trfel
7015 Posts
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Trfel
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/in If someone wants my spot, they are more than welcome to it. If I don't play, I would like to /obs or /replace, if the latter is necessary. And either way, I promise not to be a jerk. New non-obnoxious playstyle. | ||
Trfel
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Otherwise, like I said, it's fine if I don't play. | ||
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On December 26 2015 10:09 Artanis[Xp] wrote: But we need to lynch MoosyDoosy first Prob gonna be my first mislynch as town (nonhydra) if I roll town ![]() ![]() And there's no way you get lynched before I do XD | ||
Trfel
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I want my chances of rolling mafia to be as low as possible... | ||
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Not sure what time that ends up being for Europeans, though. | ||
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![]() It's the first time in about nine months where I have a town winrate greater than 50%. I'd like to keep it that way. For those of you who don't know, this is approximately my skill at mafia: | ||
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On December 27 2015 08:09 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Hi, Artanis, you're mafia!Damdred Damdred are you feeling happy? ##vote Artanis[Xp] | ||
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On December 27 2015 08:19 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Okay, then it appears that you are mafia, because you are suspected for something that you actually did post and are not complaining.By, N e s s, yes. I have no idea about you because I can see you fear reading me either way. That was easy ![]() | ||
Trfel
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![]() It appears that Artanis is town, if he's being pushed for what he has posted, he's town. Even idiot-proof isn't idiot-proof enough for me T.T | ||
Trfel
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Yes, I have a few reads. Nothing interesting, though ![]() | ||
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![]() Weak town reads on Artanis[Xp], Damdred, maybe GlowingBear. But it seems I missed a ton of posts somehow, so bleh, I'll figure it out later. Going to go take a sauna now. | ||
Trfel
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I think that the meta comparison between ExO_'s play in Guardians of the Galaxy is somewhat useful as well (assuming I am remembering it correctly); there, he didn't seem annoyed, he seemed a bit more reserved and like he was trying to make the best with the situation instead of arguing and getting frustrated. I'll check tonight when I get better internet. ##vote ExO_ | ||
Trfel
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![]() I think I'll keep my mouth shut until I find something actually worth talking about. | ||
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I don't care if he knows that I will read him based on post count, we both know that he can't keep a high post count as mafia this game ![]() Call me silly, but I think it's an easy read. | ||
Trfel
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On December 27 2015 14:54 ritoky wrote: Didn't really read it yet, raynpelikoneet's townread of me felt a bit "easy", like I don't think he generally reads me with that confidence, and I don't think that my play has been notably good so far (or towny, outside potential meta that few, if any, know).what do you think of me and rayn and our disagreement on reading you? On December 27 2015 09:47 ritoky wrote: This statement, however, is exactly the opposite of my "meta". This is not a reason to townread me, since my scum playstyle wasn't working and I need a new playstyle, but your statement here is factually incorrect.trfel is mafia cuz he sounded whimpy. having played with trfel as mafia recently, i think his biggest tell is that he sounds meek and whimpy as mafia. I mean, it's possible that you see my scum play as weak and wimpy, fine. Compared to my town play, though, it's extremely aggressive. I feel like you should know this, seeing as I kept mentioning that I was scared about hurting people's feelings in the scum QT? But there's no incentive for you to lie intentionally, so bleh. I'm going to reread the thread now, so yeah. | ||
Trfel
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On December 27 2015 15:07 ritoky wrote: Seeing as I managed to defend my mafia partner by leading a mislynch on Day 1, and even pushed an un-cc'd blue trying to force the mislynch through?i remember you not committing to a side like at all day 1 in that game and then backing down from a blue claim fight and getting pretty wishy-washy when people got salty. maybe you're right and i am wrong and the game we were mafia together in was just a bit of an anomaly. might got look at another one of your scum games to see if i get the feels. I'd really like you to explain how you could see my play in this way, and more importantly, how you can see my town play as more committal. | ||
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On December 27 2015 15:22 ritoky wrote: Thanks for answering my question. That makes sense to me for now, though I'll re-evaluate upon finishing the thread.Shit like this: From battle of drams where you're assertive and telling people how it is. Not weak in tone, but rather straightforward and terse. oh wow...i went back to read newbie student fullmetal and i am just wrong. you were super fucking aggro in this game. maybe i just have a fucked up perception cuz of the qt. well i guess that read is trash now. I'm too lazy to check, why did you townread Artanis early in the game? If you already answered, I'll find it eventually, sorry. | ||
Trfel
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Meh, I guess I'll go for it. rsoultin? (runs for cover) | ||
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Like, why are you scumreading ObiWanShinobi? | ||
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![]() Both questions to rsoultin, if it wasn't clear. | ||
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On December 27 2015 17:11 Trfel wrote: Wait, no, my question is why does rsoultin have a town lean on Holyflare.Oh, and Holyflare, too. I'm too disorganized ![]() Both questions to rsoultin, if it wasn't clear. Wow, this is horrid. What's happened to me ![]() 我不会说英文。。。 可是也不会说中文。。。 | ||
Trfel
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![]() For later, but, that game where Holyflare questioned Alakaslam... Were you thinking of Guardians of the Galaxy mafia? Because that's the game I thought of, and I checked it, and it didn't feel similar to this at all. Though Holyflare is clearly using a different style this game (which I don't think is very alignment indicative, if anything slightly town indicative), so I don't feel comfortable with the meta. Anyway, I'm not really sure about Holyflare ![]() @ExO_, historically rsoultin has been good at tone reading Onegu. At least, I'm pretty sure that she thinks so ![]() | ||
Trfel
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Town - raynpelikoneet, Damdred, ritoky, Artanis[Xp] Town Lean - sicklucker, ExO_, Koshi, GlowingBear, N e s s, Alakaslam Suspicious-ish - rsoultin I didn't check these that carefully, I'm tired. Really looking forward to the 24 hour pause in the game, of course it can't be enforced to not read the thread during this time, but is doing so bad form? As much as I'd love time to catch up with / analyze the game, if doing so is abuse, I won't do so. The main reason I'm suspicious of rsoultin is that she's seemed present, but not really involved. Though, this is quite subjective, and I'll look again tomorrow. Like, maybe there are other causes, or maybe I'm perceiving it incorrectly, but it seems like rsoultin is choosing when to interact and what to talk about, instead of a genuine desire to figure out alignments? There's also a fair amount of meta which I think is good but could be stupid because I'm really bad at meta. I don't see much reason to lynch nooniansoong, Tictock, or Vivax right now, to be honest. Anyway, good night. | ||
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As of 30 pages ago, my reads were far too similar to sicklucker's for my liking, it seems like something is very wrong. | ||
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On December 28 2015 15:36 ObiWanShinobi wrote: Any particular reason why or is the fact that they're similar the thing that's bugging you in and of itself? On December 27 2015 23:55 Damdred wrote: Basically what Damdred said. It's a lousy reason to scumread sicklucker, since last time I played with him, he was scum and I read him as scum, but it's still really, really weird. It does make me feel that my reads are horrible, though SL I think your town...so I should lynch you right? ![]() Anyway, I don't think I'll be able to finish the thread before going to bed, yeesh. I'll take a much closer look at the main wagons if I can't finish, including ritoky's post above. | ||
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What did you think about the Artanis/raynpelikoneet argument about GlowingBear a page or two ago? Can you encourage me to keep reading and make it through? | ||
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On December 28 2015 01:06 Holyflare wrote: Rsoultin (or anyone else), thoughts on this post?is it too late to /out this game? I only wanted to play in a mini with not shit people and came back to a full normal I realize I'm behind, perhaps this was discussed already, but this post seems rather off to me. | ||
Trfel
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On December 28 2015 05:38 raynpelikoneet wrote: So tempting Well if anyone else wants to claim mason then please go a head in your next post. It's the correct play. ![]() Side note, Holyflare is really confusing me, but I'd feel really really really bad if I mislynched him, and the "simple" answer is that he's town. On further thinking I don't think that the post I quoted a bit ago is important. | ||
Trfel
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On December 28 2015 17:14 rsoultin wrote: I forgot about one of his three pregame posts.what seems off about it? sounds like standard ego/frustration which doesn't seem weird to me coming from hf or half the other players in this game lol >< I was thinking he signed up as the first player in the game, and then tried to get the game started earlier, and then was making this post saying that he didn't want to put up with a game and only wanted to play with good people. But the post I forgot about showed that he wasn't actually that excited for this game, which makes his post make enough sense that I'll discount it. I'm lazy, who should I vote for and why? | ||
Trfel
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"I'm going to try hard to work on read accuracy" -> "No reads for a while" -> Townread on Tictock -> Lots of posting with no effort to solve the game There's really no desire to solve the game, despite him saying early on that he'd try hard to get accurate reads. The suspicions from his first post weren't followed up on at all, either. The number of posts that he made about the game without saying anything at all (his posts show that he knows he isn't doing anything) is remarkable. Furthermore, the vote on Palmar, without caring to push it, and saying that he's willing to lynch about a dozen people for a policy lynch, seems very mafia-motivated. He's leaving his options open for later and not committing to anything. | ||
Trfel
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@Vivax, why do you say this? | ||
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On December 28 2015 18:27 Tictock wrote: I checked his filter from last game. It seemed remarkably different from this one. However, last game I checked MoosyDoosy's previous game and felt it was remarkably different from it, and he was town anyway, so I'm just bad. Meta aside....Given how Kush played last game as town I'm not surprised by a lot of what you are calling him out for here. His vote on Palmar is... meek? though, you have a point there. Last game I remember Kush throwing his vote out early and without giving a shit. It's mostly that nooniansoong doesn't seem to care about solving the game, but there are strange contrasts in his posting. Not having time to make reads but having time to talk a bunch about useless stuff. Seeming to care enough to tell people how to play, but at the same time spending several posts arguing about his "I have no reasons to think anything about this person at all". And that he seems to know more about the game than he lets on ("ObiWanShinobi looks scummy for similar reasons as Tictock"), but still doesn't actually care about the lynch at all. | ||
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![]() Any summary of what's happened since I went to sleep? | ||
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On December 27 2015 09:17 GlowingBear wrote: This post made me feel that GlowingBear does actually care about the game and is emotionally invested. It didn't feel robotic at all to me.THANK GOD someone gets what I'm saying. I'd feel that mafia's first instinct would be to complain about people being stupid/paying him no attention, but instead GlowingBear seems actually happy that his arguments are being pursued. | ||
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On December 29 2015 04:24 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Oh, wow, I was about to case Artanis but I guess he's actually town If this is the reason people actually TR me I swear I'm going to shoot someone ![]() Artanis, what's in the rest of the chart? Like, not the specifics, but how do you go about taking notes for the game? On December 29 2015 07:29 ritoky wrote: Because he doesn't want to lynch Tictock, but he's not trying to do anything at all to vote for someone else or even explain why he's voting for Alakaslam (at least, I don't remember seeing anything).he basically told me to go fuck myself and i thought it was town; why is he mafia? Rsoultin, did you see the quote I brought up about GlowingBear (this page, or last page)? I don't feel that GlowingBear's tone is robotic in this game, and I believe that's the only reason you are scumreading him. Please explain? | ||
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On December 29 2015 07:35 ritoky wrote: Nooniansoong has been here and has been posting a lot, the other three have not. Nooniansoong has been clear about not liking the Tictock lynch, but hasn't even been pushing his lynch at all (while just being useless), while I don't recall the other three saying anything about Tictock.why him over moosy, boxerfred, and onegu who are doing pretty much the same thing? Plus, nooniansoong's play has ~3 mindset contradictions that I feel are best explained by him being mafia. | ||
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On December 29 2015 05:46 Vivax wrote: But he's still voting for Alakaslam this whole time, without talking about him, without ever trying to move the lynch.Im going to like the kush - TS exchange, kush might actually find points that point to TS being mafia This is not an attempt to solve the game. This is not actually caring about the game, or trying to find the best lynch. | ||
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On December 29 2015 07:49 Holyflare wrote: I get the impression that Tictock actually is reading the thread, primarily because last night as I was catching up, he supposedly read 15-20 pages at the same time as I did. Like, he'd comment on posts every so often, and was basically on my pace the entire time. That seems difficult to fake.Trfel I see you voting off wagon and not really attempting to do anything with TT, why is that? I don't think you've really gone into a TT thought process much at all other than mentioning he's not a very good lynch? Not that I remember anyway. I don't think that Tictock would actually put that much effort to read the thread and then not care to actually try to move the lynch as scum. I also don't think there is much reason to scumread him, notably I didn't like the criticisms of his first post (there were some reasons I wanted to townread Koshi then, and I liked that Tictock wasn't sharing a widely accepted read, but instead a more unique one). The arguments against Tictock seem to be arguing that he's bad instead of that he's scum? Though I have not caught up yet and I have been reading quickly without having a chance to double check things. | ||
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On December 29 2015 08:14 Koshi wrote: Huh? If it's both town, why does the vote switch provide any information whatsoever?yeah if tt is town there is good information here. On December 29 2015 07:16 Holyflare wrote: I guess this is worth discussing again.I don't think that's alignment indicative at all since people can get frustrated from not being listened to just by virtue of not beng listened to but yeah I don't think he's robotic like TT/rsoul are making out, TT also seems to have not seen GB's interaction with me. I agree that both town and mafia can be frustrated just by not being listened to, however, my point is that I don't feel that GlowingBear was frustrated in this post. He seemed genuinely happy that someone was was thinking the same thing and pushing his arguments, which isn't something I'd expect from scum there (and does make sense from town). | ||
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On December 29 2015 13:01 Holyflare wrote: If I tell you that he's town, will you believe me?On the one hand I disagree with pretty much everything he says and have no idea how he reached any of his conclusions. On the other hand he was doing stuff just now whilst everyone afks and stuff like that. Bit of a quandary. You probably shouldn't ![]() You said earlier that you gave Tictock an out but he didn't take it, what was the out that you gave him? | ||
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On December 29 2015 15:42 Vivax wrote: I'd vote for Artanis too Id vote Artanis and Damdred for town leaders in this game ![]() But seriously, I am fairly confident that Holyflare is town, and I still think that GlowingBear is likely town and nooniansoong is likely scum. Thoughts? | ||
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If anything, I bet this would have been discussed in the mafia QT. I know I would have tried to discuss how to deal with the masons right when I saw the claim. | ||
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On December 29 2015 17:41 ritoky wrote: It's true, but MoosyDoosy is probably capable of replicating it as mafia, since not caring really isn't hard to fake.has anyone played with moosy more than once? and can they confirm the whole gives a shit = mafia; fucks off/does dumb shit = town read that he self-proclaims? I'd actually still go with it, I imagine that MoosyDoosy would have a fun time doing random stuff as mafia in a game like this, but I do note that MoosyDoosy didn't complain about rolling town at all, which I've come to expect from him. I'm still embarrassed about my errant read on MoosyDoosy last game, especially since I figured out the problem with the read and then forgot what it was. So I'm kind of ignoring him this game ![]() I'm tired and babbling, but to this point MoosyDoosy's self-meta is true. | ||
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But anyway, good night. And I'm not so sure that Vivax is mafia, I was kind of thinking he was town, but I didn't check what he did at End of Day. | ||
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On December 29 2015 18:11 ExO_ wrote: You want to cc them with me? I would Without looking at it too closely, Damdred's flip seems suspect to me. I don't really like your flip either. I need to go re-read what happened before I took a nap (that turned into like 4 hours of sleep lol) and see exactly how this went down. And where the fuck is coag? For being basically confirmed masons, coag is being complete trash, and I'm not too happy with rsoultin either. I really hope a pair of masons CC them. But its irrationally stupid for both of them to be scum and claiming mason early, which mean coag just isn't giving a damn :/ ![]() | ||
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![]() I am also confident that Palmar is mafia. I don't expect to catch up until the end of the 24 hour break, though. | ||
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On December 30 2015 08:24 Holyflare wrote: Oh yeah, apparently some people were saying association things.Hey it's that red check that now proves I'm town! Get rekt mafia. Stupid me for doubting my Holyflare read that was really smart ![]() | ||
Trfel
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On December 30 2015 10:46 GlowingBear wrote: Trfel #1580I've just won a game of Hearthstone, and it was fucking weird. I was against a Hunter. I'm Paladin. He had Explosive Trap and I used Truesilver Champion. I had 2 health. I attacked him, activated the secret, then I've reached 0 health. Then my hero attacked him and gained +2 health and I won the game. WAT Add me on Hearthstone? I still feel like sicklucker is likely town, but I don't think I'll have time for serious analysis for a while. Palmar's filter size is a bit concerning, but his filter is extremely boring and doesn't feel at all like town!Palmar. Plus, his reaction to the Artanis night kill wasn't convincing. Anyway, Tictock's play should be worthy of an award nomination ^^ | ||
Trfel
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Tictock is 100% mafia and gets lynched here no matter what. Even if Damdred rescinds his gunsmith claim, five people counterclaim Onegu's cop claim, and Onegu posts baby seals, Tictock is STILL mafia and STILL gets lynched. | ||
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On December 31 2015 06:05 ritoky wrote: 10 AM Eastern, I believe.what time exactly does the game get paused for 24 hrs? EoD or? Palmar is funny ![]() | ||
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On December 31 2015 06:15 ritoky wrote: Kushm4sta/nooniansoong, whichever name you prefer. After that I'm blank, but I figure that a 100% lynch and two very likely mafia to look more closely at later is good enough for now.thanx. btw who are your top 2 mafia that aren't named palmar or tt? | ||
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I guess I'm not going to try and figure it out. | ||
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There comes a point where you simply can't tolerate stupidity any more. | ||
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I'm really not sure about Onegu. It seems that claiming to get Tictock lynched would be a really stupid one for one for mafia to take, but Onegu is the kind of player who just might do it anyway. I feel that he's a bit more likely town, but need to look again. I never ever thought that someone would fake a red check for a significant amount of time. And I thought that people would always claim their role if they were about to get lynched. I feel so stupid. | ||
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Town Damdred + Show Spoiler + Tone read and meta read. Either way, his alignment will be resolved soon enough. If he is town (which I'm pretty sure he is), he'll force mafia to shoot him. If not, he's mafia. ExO_ + Show Spoiler + Seems very emotional and invested in the game, and has a lot of strange theories. I should probably look through his filter more carefully at some point, but now isn't the time. Koshi + Show Spoiler + Feels like town due to effort. Again, if he's town mafia will be forced to shoot him. ritoky + Show Spoiler + Eh, I'm bored of writing about townreads. I don't really know why he's town, but he is. I think. Kinda. Anyway. Coagulation Town Lean Holyflare + Show Spoiler + His filter is too long for me to read through completely, but I feel that Holyflare is town. The main reason for this is that his posting tone/direction has changed over the course of the game, and it felt like it changed at a time that was town-motivated, not at a time that was mafia-motivated. For now, anyway. Onegu + Show Spoiler + His tone feels a bit relaxed and free, which seems more like his town play than his mafia play. But I really don't think that mafia would claim a red check just because they feel like it, that gains a ton of extra attention and is a ton of risk (the best result being killing someone who was already lynchbait). Furthermore, his afk since claiming the red check makes me feel that this play wouldn't be from mafia!Onegu doing it purely for the fun factor, as Onegu loves playing scum and I'd feel like he'd want to be posting while he was "confirmed" town due to his claim. sicklucker + Show Spoiler + I like how he started out the game with a scumread on Holyflare. This doesn't feel like something that mafia would be inclined to do. Sicklucker seems to genuinely care about the game, one example being how adamant he was about not lynching Vivax until later. MoosyDoosy + Show Spoiler + If he were mafia, he would play more seriously, and he wouldn't have risked not voting. At least, I think, anyway. GlowingBear + Show Spoiler + GlowingBear's posting has felt genuine, and there's a drive to solve the game. Both raynpelikoneet and rsoultin had him at fairly confident townreads when they died. If I have more time, I'll look more closely at his filter. In general, GlowingBear's constant suspicions of Holyflare seemed towny (not necessarily due to the reasoning itself, but the way that he pursued it). The Shining + Show Spoiler + I'm not so sure about this read. The Shining's posting feels more free this game, like his town play, and his posts seem to be trying to solve the game. However, his reaction to the Day 2 flip was underwhelming, he didn't seem to respond at all to his reads being wrong. Furthermore, his play dropped off significantly, but that's not necessarily mafia-indicative. Overall I still feel like he's town, but I'm not very confident. Vivax + Show Spoiler + I'm tired. Vivax is here primarily for filter length, as Vivax is generally rather inactive as mafia. Alakaslam + Show Spoiler + Still tired. Tone read. Mafia Lean ObiWanShinobi + Show Spoiler + He's just.... not doing anything at all. He's not making any useful thoughts, he's not being commanding, he's just following the lead that everyone else is providing. He's just doing whatever, not trying to solve the game. One example of this is ObiWanShinobi's read on boxerfred. He initially said that people scumreading boxerfred for doing nothing is bad, because boxerfred did nothing and got mislynched for it as town. However, when boxerfred continued to be useless, Holyflare said that he wanted to lynch boxerfred on Day 3, and ObiWanShinobi said that he agreed without mentioning boxerfred in between. Palmar + Show Spoiler + Palmar's play this game is very serious. This is strange, because in general, Palmar plays seriously as mafia and does random things and generally doesn't care that much when he is town. For example, see Mini Mafia Down Under 2, where Palmar has a conversation with at least one other Palmar, perhaps two. Instead of playing the game. He was town. And Gaiden 2, where Palmar started out with a very confident scumread of justanothertownie, and keeps pushing this read to ridiculous extremes. After dropping this read, Palmar's activity also drops off. Compare this to Palmar's mafia play. See Completely Normal Generic Mini Mafia, for example, where Palmar starts with a few jokes, and then plays the game in a "normal" fashion. Which Palmar basically never does as town. To clarify, it's not necessarily the effort that Palmar puts in, but the way he goes about it. And the way he plays the game here is from a more serious mindset, much more like Palmar's mafia play than his town play. Anyway, meta aside... Palmar starts the game by townreading ExO_ and Koshi, and being suspicious of kushm4sta/nooniansoong. He eventually says that nooniansoong is a fine lynch, and then decides to sheep raynpelikoneet on Tictock without really caring about his previous read on nooniansoong. On December 29 2015 19:35 Palmar wrote: Just noticed this. If Palmar is willing to direct power roles, is he really suggesting that the cop should claim a green check to save him from being lynched?!?! That's a really bad idea. While at the same time saying that he's trustworthy enough to get a gun?Don't worry, apparently I'm mafia and I have no credit in the thread. Btw, because I'm already scummy. I'm going to direct blues for a bit. Gunsmiths: it's super duper important you give your guns to non-retards. Give them to people who know how to use vigilante roles. Here's a guide for those who want to become good vigilantes: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/232671-how-to-play-vigilante-and-how-to-play-cop Also, because I'm tired of everyone's shit, I wouldn't mind getting cop checked at all. I normally say it's a waste but I might not have the energy to argue myself out of a lynch this game (and the deadline is literally at 23:00 new year's eve my time... so I will be drunk and playing with fireworks instead of playing mafia). Palmar simply hasn't done that much. By far the biggest thing he did was the Artanis scumread. I'm not positive on Palmar's alignment, but he is very suspicious. Mafia nooniansoong + Show Spoiler + Or kushm4sta, whichever you prefer. I'm just going to go through and mention everything that I think is important, I'll summarize at the end. + Show Spoiler + On December 27 2015 10:57 nooniansoong wrote: Hi everybody. I'm a kush smurf. This game I am going to try hard to work on read accuracy. I just did a quick read through. Exo gave me mafia feels in his few posts, but that doesn't mean much. I liked hf's first post. Then ness said he needed to write a lot in defense. Ness, I urge you to write as little as possible while still honestly addressing hf's concerns. On December 28 2015 00:51 nooniansoong wrote: Where did his earlier reads go, or were they really not worth mentioning? And why did he mention them, then? Note that he gave advice to both N e s s and ExO_, his only suspicions at this point in the thread.Hi again guys. It's kush, checking in. I have been reading/skimming/skipping rayns posts, but I haven't had the time to close read anything. Some people are talking too much. Right now I have zero reads. I realize I am a null read at best, and if you want to lynch me I won't stand in your way. I am also signed up for the newbie game so I won't be mafialess for long. Don't get me wrong, I do want to play in this game. I simply don't have the time to keep up with 20 people's spam. Expect reads from me d2 at the latest. Thank you for your time, Kush At this point, the vote count was 5 votes for Vivax and 3 votes for Tictock. Nooniansoong's read on Tictock: On December 28 2015 06:04 nooniansoong wrote: TT was very try hard as mafia last game. I suppose his play could be scum feeling mafia fatigue. I think he is more likely low effort town. On December 28 2015 06:14 nooniansoong wrote: I based my read on two pieces of information. 1 He played try hard scum last game. I was in that game with him and I remember it very well. 2 I read his filter this game and it looks much lower effort than his mafia game. I don't think it's tmi. On December 28 2015 06:31 nooniansoong wrote: There is no leap. His activity points to two options: burnt out scum or town. Which of those he is, I do not know. However, I do not think his lack of activity and the emptiness of his posts is a scumtell, due to his last scumgame. That is what most people are basing the scumread on. Is he burnt out scum or town? If his behavior doesn't point to one being more likely than the other, than it is more likely he is town, simply because town is the more abundant role. On December 28 2015 06:59 nooniansoong wrote: Nooniansoong doesn't seem to care about Tictock's alignment at all, the most common thing that he says is that Tictock could be scum or town, but he isn't sure which.@rayn the game was nutcracker. @hf it's not a leap precisely because i dont have a view on all the other players in the game. Objectively town is more abundant. that is a fact before reads. On December 28 2015 06:19 nooniansoong wrote: And after this he says he has no scum reads. Nooniansoong proceeds to question sicklucker a bit, and then says that ObiWanShinobi looks bad for similar reasons to why Tictock looks bad (which he doesn't think makes Tictock look bad). Which again says nothing and shows no interest in the game.I am going to put my vote down on palmar. It's a quasi-placeholder vote. Palmar is missing d1 and according to his meta he is a d1 player. I think he's going to be unreadable regardless of his alignment so he's a good policy lynch. And all of this time, he hasn't said a single thing about the leading wagon, Vivax, despite making many posts that don't say anything. On December 28 2015 12:39 nooniansoong wrote: Here he says that his vote on Palmar is a policy lynch, and implies that he wants to policy lynch.I don't have a scumread to push. I engage people when it is convenient. My vote for palmar is a vote for a policy lynch. It can be interchanged with about a dozen other players. I think he is a good policy lynch but it's not super important to me. On December 28 2015 12:40 nooniansoong wrote: And here, he's saying that he wants to come back so that he can answer questions, not to come back so that he can solve the game and lynch mafia. Despite saying that he's willing to be lynched, he seems much more apologetic than interested in finding mafia.Apologizes for not consolidating this post but goodnight all. I will try to get to any questions at lunch tomorrow in approximately 13 hours. By the time that nooniansoong returns, Palmar has made several more posts. He says that ExO_ is town for a tinfoil hat theory about the mason claims, and says that he might want to lynch nooniansoong. There's also a post that can be sort of interpreted to be a townread on Koshi. Nooniansoong responds as follows: On December 28 2015 21:24 nooniansoong wrote: So you think he read a lot and is saying he didn't read anything because it makes him look townier? Really? Not reading the thread is very believable to me. On December 28 2015 23:32 nooniansoong wrote: I don't know what you are looking for here but okay... I didn't think you had done anything that warrented a scumread. You read a filter and called someone town from what you read. You approached the game in the same way I would if I were in your position of having 60 unread pages. So Exo's sudden scumread of you seemed inappropriate, and I wanted to get a better idea of what logic he was basing it on. I suppose I can understand Exo thinking you might be scum playing dumb in order to excuse yourself from having to look townie. On December 29 2015 00:46 nooniansoong wrote: He's not saying that Palmar is town, it seems that his read switched because he wanted to lynch an inactive player and Palmar was posting. He also says that Vivax is just as scummy as all of the other inactives:My vote on palmar is definitely bad now that he has showed up, but I don't know who to change it to yet. Alaka for now. On December 29 2015 00:08 nooniansoong wrote: But decides to vote for Alakaslam instead of Vivax, no explanation given.Well there is SL's argument that he is easier to read as the game progresses. Then there is someone else's argument that low activity is not scum indicative for vivax, since he has been known to play like that as town. Which makes him only as scummy as all the other inactives. Nooniansoong then questions Holyflare and The Shining, and ends up saying that Vivax and Holyflare are both town. At this point, nooniansoong is opposed to the Tictock wagon, which is by far the biggest, and his vote is still on a policy lynch. He doesn't seem to care at all. He returns after the lynch, saying that he really wanted to see Tictock flip. This doesn't make sense at all, this feels very mafia motivated to let town flail wildly while just not caring. From this point, nooniansoong's play changes a bit, and he seems to play with a direction of trying to solve the game. On December 30 2015 04:07 nooniansoong wrote: He ends up with this scum list, which doesn't appear to be extremely thorough, and then has a town lean on boxerfred and defends Palmar from Artanis. He doesn't explain his scum reads at all (he's commented a little bit on The Shining and ExO_ in the past, though).off the cuff scumlist 7. damdred 9. Exo_ 17. Trfel 18. ObiWanShinobi 19. The Shining who the fuck knows 8. Waylanner (replaced by ObviousOne) 13. Mooseeeeeeeeydooseeeeeey 24. Alakaslam On December 30 2015 21:16 nooniansoong wrote: This is strange because nooniansoong wasn't conflicted when he had a town lean on boxerfred earlier. It's especially strange because this post was made after boxerfred did more of the exact same thing that nooniansoong thought was towny.Bf...I'm conflicted. His logic is so weird. Too weird to be scum maybe? Nooniansoong again says that he has no reads. A bit later: On December 31 2015 08:23 Holyflare wrote: Bf/TT/Slam/Palmar (ness/oo/kushmaybenot/someone else) On December 31 2015 08:30 nooniansoong wrote: But Nooniansoong is null to town on boxerfred, doesn't know about Alakaslam, not providing a read on but defending Palmar, and hasn't mentioned the rest. If this is indeed a good list in his opinion, that means that nooniansoong has changed his reads dramatically, without mentioning them at all. And while having no reads.No clue why he liked Holyflare's list at all.pretty good list Nooniansoong seems to be suspicious of ExO_, and says he's townreading ritoky, Palmar, and sicklucker. And that's all of his filter. In conclusion, nooniansoong isn't trying to solve the game. He's commenting on things and not investigating, and he didn't care at all about the Day 1 lynch. He's almost certainly mafia. Some of my town leans are weak, I'll revisit them. I'm pretty sure that at least 2/3 scumreads are correct, hopefully all three. | ||
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This game reminds me a bit of Alakaslam's play in Guardians of the Galaxy, where he played more "seriously" as town. The combination of making actual, "normal" reads and still using chupazi. I'm used to mafia!Alakaslam relying purely on chupazi as a survival mechanism, here he's aggressively pushing things. Out for the rest of the night phase. I will probably not be online for the deadline of Day 3, since I'll be in the airport ish at that time, not exactly sure how things will work out. | ||
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On January 03 2016 08:11 ritoky wrote: Why did you not consider Palmar, ObiWanShinobi, and nooniansoong?because i read you town, and i figured if 1 of you and onegu is mafia or both are mafia, then i am getting roleblocked and i know it. if both of you are town they are gonna let my bullet through so i started working on other people to shoot. and between myself and hf i arrived at moosy and slam. i sent about 9 pms to the mods....i really wish i had shot slam now. | ||
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He's not doing anything, he's just existing. Seriously, he's not invested in the game at all, just going with the flow. It's the same thing as ObiWanShinobi and Palmar. If people are pushing town all the time (Vivax, Tictock, Rels, Tictock again), why does mafia need to do anything? Mafia will sit back and go with it, let town argue about it. That's what nooniansoong, ObiWanShinobi, and Palmar have been doing this entire time. I definitely see Damdred's point about NocturneMage, however I felt that N e s s's play seemed like town, and I'm not yet comfortable reading NocturneMage from these posts. The contrast is also a bit weaker because this is a much, much larger game than the last one NocturneMage replaced into. I'll take another look at Alakaslam, but my impressions from his filter weren't aligned with most of the things that ritoky was saying. On January 03 2016 00:21 ObiWanShinobi wrote: So then the question becomes, did ObiWanShinobi have actual scumreads at the time he said that he would be willing to lynch boxerfred.I didn't know I needed reasons to kill someone useless - I can concede that someone is probably town and useless but that doesn't make being useless a good thing. If he did, then this is very suspicious. If not, then I'm less sure. I'll try and check that tonight as well. | ||
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If my reads are horrible and stupid, or don't make people scum, please tell me. And if it's just that they don't make people scum, if you could explain why, that would be great? | ||
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I mean, yeah, he could be mafia, but I feel like town is a much simpler explanation. And the simple explanation is generally always correct. I'll take another look if you'd like, you seem fairly convinced about it. But later, I need to head out now. | ||
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On January 03 2016 12:28 ObiWanShinobi wrote: Actually I'm going to go out and respond to it because why not. I was voting Tt pretty much the entire time so it's untrue. Even if it wasn't, bf still would have been a fantastic lynch for being useless. That is nothing like what I said at all. Nice reading comprehension. Sorry TS, busy. | ||
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I remember ObiWanShinobi not having many serious reads. On Day 2, he was scumreading Tictock (as was basically everyone else), and voting for Tictock. Then, when Holyflare said that he wanted to lynch boxerfred on Day 3, ObiWanShinobi said that he agreed with this. ObiWanShinobi's last stance on boxerfred was a town lean, described in two separate posts. I was wondering what caused this change. He explained this change to be caused because he felt like he had to lynch someone who was being useless, even if he didn't necessarily think that they were scum. Or something like that, I can't look it up at this moment. This part isn't important, he's not scum for this statement IMO, but rather the context. The motivation to lynch boxerfred may be there, but wasn't that high. If ObiWanShinobi had an actual scumread that he wanted to lynch, I would expect him to not want to lynch boxerfred to lynch his actual scumread instead. Day 3, so Tictock would already be lynched, and he wouldn't count. And the magnitude of this scumread would need to be judged versus the reason and explanation to scumread boxerfred, and see how they compare. And I'd need to double check the wording, perhaps ObiWanShinobi's agreement with Holyflare was more of consent than thinking it was the best option, as I read it initially. Anyway. The Shining, I don't need to actually be present for you to tell me if my reads have any merit or not. My reads are summarized in my interpretation of the people who are commenting and existing without contributing or trying to solve the game. The details are more accurately explained in my list post about 24 hours ago. Unfortunately, because no one seems to care about my reads, I'm feeling like I'm probably just really wrong ![]() | ||
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On January 03 2016 17:28 sicklucker wrote: Um, NocturneMage replaced in for N e s s.so i came back expecting some good discussion but it was mostly people trying to figure out ness whos going to be mod killed... used your time better boys | ||
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Who do you currently want to lynch and why? And why don't you want to lynch nooniansoong/kushm4sta, Palmar, or ObiWanShinobi? | ||
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On December 28 2015 00:20 ObiWanShinobi wrote: Fwiw BF posting nothing is reminiscent of some game where he was town and people lynched him for doing it. They were quite upset after he flipped so I'm not sure we can really read into him being bad all that much. On December 30 2015 10:02 ObiWanShinobi wrote: I don't like this at all.Why do people think Shining is town again? Someone remind me because he's a likely day 3 lynch candidate imho. | ||
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![]() Holyflare's comment about Alakaslam's tone towards N e s s was fairly accurate as well, and Alakaslam has seemed disinterested in the thread. He's generally been pushing something, but he's focused on very specific parts of the thread, always separated from the main topics and not involving himself much in the lynches. I can still see him being town, though, without too much effort... Bleh. Can someone please comment on the three ObiWanShinobi quotes I provided above? This is one example of the overall impression I got from ObiWanShinobi's filter, that he's been following other people instead of pushing his own reads and ideas. Anyway, good night. | ||
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On January 03 2016 19:11 sicklucker wrote: He pushed N e s s for a while, and then ExO_. Lately, not much, but that's sort of understandable ish.what has slam pushed... | ||
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On January 04 2016 00:19 sicklucker wrote: Why do you think that this is not Alakaslam's town play? What do Alakaslam's town and scum playstyles look like to you?this is onegus town meta/play sadly. its not really slam/nocts etcs play And can someone please respond to a single one of the questions I've spent the last 48 hours trying to get answered? Please? | ||
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On January 04 2016 06:55 Damdred wrote: I was about to make a post explaining this, but thanks Damdred for doing it for me.You are trying to take null things kush and turn them into town type motives. Most of the thread had reactions that were not dissimilar to what palmar posted. At best this is a null as scum are looking just as much as town where to put votes and more than likely palmar vote was already on Rels. Secondly of course palmar doesn't want to be shot this is totally null. 1) Town palmar doesn't want to get shot because he's town and can help to try to win the game. 2) Scum palmar doesn't want to be shot because he's scum,and wants to,win. And thinks he can talk his way out of getting lynched with a large effort. It's totally null, and I'm really concerned now that you are trying to tr palmar for such weak things. Nooniansoong isn't trying to solve the game, he's just commenting and defending some people (mostly Palmar) instead of being interested in his scumreads. His latest defense of Palmar is a great example of this. | ||
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On January 04 2016 06:57 Damdred wrote: I thought that he was town, now I'm not sure.The way you are treating slam is very strange trfel. Can you explain your progress trfel. I thought that he was town for activity and investment in the game. However, after his first series or two of posts, his activity dropped off a lot, and he hasn't felt interested in the game at all lately. His tone still seems towny as a whole, however Holyflare's point that Alakaslam was heavily scumreading N e s s but still giving him advice as if he were town looks quite strange, given the heavy tone contrast. I really don't know what to think of Alakaslam, I'm simply not used to him playing the game as mafia. But I'm not really used to him playing the game as town, either... | ||
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On January 04 2016 07:00 nooniansoong wrote: Nooniansoong, can you please explain why you are scumreading me?"isn't trying to solve the game" is exactly the type of generic wording scum loves to use when describing their fake scumreads. | ||
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On January 04 2016 07:07 nooniansoong wrote: So you don't think that mafia loves to quote a post from someone and say why it's scummy?See the post of mine you just quoted. | ||
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On January 04 2016 07:11 nooniansoong wrote: You dodged the question that I asked.i explained why it's scummy in the post. Your scumreads lack depth on thought. In this post, I described why your play is focused on commenting instead of solving the game. You did not respond. I've also pointed out several mindset/mentality contradictions in your play, which you also failed to respond to. Care to respond to any or all? | ||
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I will read your filter again from this perspective, and also assuming that your "solving the game" looks different from what I would expect, but I'm having a lot of trouble understanding this playstyle. I'll probably have to check some more meta ![]() | ||
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On January 04 2016 07:31 Damdred wrote: Why?Though kush is coming off towny in this exchange tbh | ||
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On December 27 2015 10:57 nooniansoong wrote: Hi everybody. I'm a kush smurf. This game I am going to try hard to work on read accuracy. I just did a quick read through. Exo gave me mafia feels in his few posts, but that doesn't mean much. I liked hf's first post. Then ness said he needed to write a lot in defense. Ness, I urge you to write as little as possible while still honestly addressing hf's concerns. On December 28 2015 06:04 nooniansoong wrote: Nooniansoong, I'm not sure how these posts fit with your process-of-elimination mindset described here. How can you get mafia feels from ExO_'s first few posts? And why do you feel that Tictock is more likely town than mafia, while you say that when you can't find a reason to townread people, you assume that they are mafia?TT was very try hard as mafia last game. I suppose his play could be scum feeling mafia fatigue. I think he is more likely low effort town. Am I misunderstanding something? | ||
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What exactly made you think that Onegu and Damdred are not good lynches today, I'm having trouble understanding what you're getting at. | ||
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I'd think that they'd barely prefer rolechecking Tictock to rolechecking themselves. You don't think that Onegu can be mafia for the WIFOM play? | ||
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In this game, he presents several scumreads and clearly cares about the Day 1 lynch. He has a progression of several scumreads and is willing to consolidate his vote such that it actually matters. Furthermore, despite being busy, he reads filters and makes reads of all of the main wagons. And in this game, he didn't care at all about the Day 1 lynch. I'm waiting for nooniansoong's explanation, but I'm having a TON of difficulty seeing his play coming from town this game. His explanation of process-of-elimination solving the game doesn't seem to be anything like how he played last game. Nooniansoong, please answer as soon as you can, I am trying to keep an open mind, but I need your answer to continue. If you are not going to answer, if you could at least tell me that you won't answer, that would be great so I can do my best to check my read on you without it. Otherwise, I'll have to go through tonight anyway. I think I want to lynch nooniansoong or Palmar most, I'll work on it tonight. | ||
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On January 04 2016 08:07 Damdred wrote: Oh, I didn't realize that he played in that game. I'll take a look.But you are cherry picking to a degree trfel. You wave dark tournament around but then ignore his most recent game of,nutcracjer where he didn't Carr about the d1 lynch but turned it on d2. I'm not sure it makes him town or scum though You expect town to not care about lynches? You expect town to not care about finding mafia? | ||
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On January 04 2016 08:07 Palmar wrote: I'm having trouble understanding your reads. I don't feel like you're actually pushing anything (except for the Artanis push, which was really awful for other reasons). It feels more like you're playing to survive rather than to solve the game.Trfel, I seem to recall most of the reason for your scumread being that I'm playing more seriously than in some two other games. You should probably ignore that. I play all sorts of town games. In general, doing bits (tunneling super hard, split personalities, elaborate schemes, fabulous speeches etc) takes time, of which I haven't had much (it's the holidays) this game. Sure, I'll check again tonight though. | ||
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However, look at nooniansoong's filter in this game. He's clearly putting in effort, or at least he thinks he is. On Day 1, he still didn't actually care about the lynch, and even now it's difficult to get him to explain his scum reads, despite his decent activity. That's the contrast. It's not that he just doesn't care at all, it's that he cares about the game but not about the lynch. | ||
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![]() I can't remember stuff well, but off the top of my head.... Do you really think that it is a mechanically correct play for the cop to claim a green check to defend you? If not, why did you ask the cop to check you Night 1? I'm having a hard time understanding how you could scumread Onegu and Damdred so heavily right after the Tictock flip, and take this long to come around, when basically everyone else wasn't sure about reads on them shortly after the flip. Can you explain your Alakaslam read? | ||
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On January 04 2016 08:18 Damdred wrote: It's extremely mafia motivated.Does that make someone scum though trfel? There are a lot of reasons why I am scumreading nooniansoong, I'm simplifying it. I'm trying the scumread form of : I think that [player] is scum for these reasons. Here is an example of each. Nooniansoong's apathy towards the Day 1 lynch is one example, the big-picture reason being that he doesn't care about solving the game, which is very mafia motivated. | ||
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It's really hard to tell about NocturneMage for a variety of reasons. He's still busy trying to read through the game, and it's a fairly large game. It's also right after a major holiday, and he's playing in another game at the same time. If you remember from the last game that NocturneMage replaced into, Dark Tournament I think? but, he wasn't very active for ~24 hours and then started doing more stuff while catching up with the thread. Basically, I don't feel confident with lynching him now at all, it feels like basically an activity policy lynch, and I feel that he will be far easier to read next day. And I feel that there are several lynches with a very good chance of hitting mafia. | ||
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From nooniansoong's last game, as town: On December 15 2015 21:48 kushm4sta wrote: I see no reason not to vote gb. Dunno when flip is but I will try to do some stuff at lunch On December 15 2015 21:48 kushm4sta wrote: (among other posts scumreading GlowingBear)I see no reason not to vote gb. Dunno when flip is but I will try to do some stuff at lunch On December 16 2015 07:33 kushm4sta wrote: Still very different from the current game. Specifically in that he had scumreads and the reason he wasn't around for the Day 1 lynch was due to availability instead of desire.sorry guys i had a lunch meeting. I won't be able to catch up on reading tonight. Pretty dumb to lynch me due to a lurker meta though. Whether I am a lurker or not has nothign to do with alignment and everything to do with how busy I am. Dark tournament I was also lynched d1 for low activity and I was also town. So keep that in mind. | ||
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On January 04 2016 13:08 ritoky wrote: What?so you have no read on him, but expect to get one when his only really known mafia meta is to be passive and inactive?????? do you know he is town and gonna post or are you in a qt or something? This really isn't a complicated idea. Like, not at all. More time means it's easier to read someone, regardless of what they are doing. However, in NocturneMage's case, more time is especially indicative because he's just replacing into the game. Like, seriously, I shouldn't have to explain this. Do you want an elementary school explanation? | ||
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On January 04 2016 13:52 Trfel wrote: Sorry, this post was not called for.What? This really isn't a complicated idea. Like, not at all. More time means it's easier to read someone, regardless of what they are doing. However, in NocturneMage's case, more time is especially indicative because he's just replacing into the game. Like, seriously, I shouldn't have to explain this. Do you want an elementary school explanation? There are several potential reasons why NocturneMage's play could be like this as town, as I stated a few posts ago. If NocturneMage's play continues to be the same as time passes, then these explanations are no longer valid, and he is likely mafia. If his play changes significantly, then he could very well be town. I need to pack my stuff, then I'll try to look at mafia stuff, but I need to wake up at like 4 tomorrow. So I'm hoping to not stay up that late. | ||
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On January 04 2016 15:22 Damdred wrote: I mean, your first sentence is simply wrong.I'm not understanding exactly, the last game he replaced into he got to work almost straight away didn't need to be poked or prodded and jumped on things. Here he's been in the game what will be 72 hours in a little over 12 hours. The only bursts of activity is when he is getting called out for little to no activity. And then once the pressure swings away from him he is back to being gone without giving any real thoughts. I'm not sure why more time would make him easier to read hell. In his last game he got to a 20 page filter by d4? Something insane like that.... It would be nice if you bothered to know what you're talking about before you try and contradict me. | ||
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People don't always play to the best of their abilities, even when they are town. I feel that it's possible that NocturneMage is town and not playing to the best of his abilities. For one example of this, look at when he replaced into Dark Tournament Mini Mafia; for over 24 hours after he replaced in, his only posts had zero purpose and scumhunting. Afterwards, he was able to catch up with the thread and become more productive. I feel that the following things could be limiting NocturneMage's play as town: 1. Being in a second game, the reason he didn't sign up for this game in the first place 2. Replacing into a very large game, has to read a ton to catch up / get a handle on things 3. The holiday makes things busier Like, I'd sort of get it, except there are people to lynch who are actually scummy. But I guess I'll try and go through N e s s's filter after I finish with nooniansoong, Palmar, and ObiWanShinobi. | ||
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Damdred, sorry. Ritoky, depends on what he does. And I, like several other people, had strong townreads on N e s s. I finished looking through his filter again and I really don't see what's scummy about it. While he isn't being especially original, he does seem interested in pushing his reads, and he's extremely willing to stick his head out. | ||
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![]() I guess I'll sheep Artanis. | ||
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I think I mostly trust Damdred, but I'm not really sure I trust ritoky; it's a random tinfoil hat theory that I haven't had time to check yet. It's way too darn early ![]() | ||
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Do I need to stick around or can I worry about this game later? | ||
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On January 05 2016 07:29 GlowingBear wrote: I mean, no, I'm not. But there's not much I can do. I need to stop defending people from players who are better than me, because it doesn't seem to accomplish anything, regardless of my read accuracy (which this game is pretty awful).Dude you've been reading me as town almost the entire game and now you're okay I'm gettinf lynched???? I would prefer to lynch ObiWanShinobi to Palmar at this point, since ObiWanShinobi has been doing nothing but following the sentiment and Palmar has made a bunch of posts which I haven't read. But I don't see that happening. I guess I'll move my vote anyway. I guess nooniansoong is likely town, just because I can't effectively explain why I think that he is mafia any more. | ||
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And he's also mafia, so there's that. Post game credit, you know? | ||
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On January 05 2016 07:43 ExO_ wrote: If I need to, I'll consider changing my vote.trfel why vote OWS now? it's clear he's not going to be the one lynched today whats the point. If you don't think its GB lynch palmar. Otherwise, I want postgame credit. | ||
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GlowingBear, please be town ![]() ObiWanShinobi is still mafia, though ![]() | ||
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On January 05 2016 07:50 Damdred wrote: Look, Damdred, I was out of my place and I apologized.For the record trfel is now voting with his 100% scum read in kush. You're a better player than me, I messed up both in read accuracy and manners. I'm sorry. There's nothing more that I can do than say sorry. I mean, if you want me to modkill myself, sure, I can do that. Otherwise, I'm simply trying to move on as best as I can. | ||
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