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Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 00:02 GMT
#924
Vivax I don't understand why you're voting Hope1ess over deconduo. From your filter you've mentioned you mentioned something about how you don't think he's bussing? And you've sort of implied you think Hopeless might be town. Furthermore you've also prodded Deconduo on a few things which you didn't like, which you didn't do for Hopeless.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 00:06 GMT
#927
On August 13 2015 09:03 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2015 09:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Vivax I don't understand why you're voting Hope1ess over deconduo. From your filter you've mentioned you mentioned something about how you don't think he's bussing? And you've sort of implied you think Hopeless might be town. Furthermore you've also prodded Deconduo on a few things which you didn't like, which you didn't do for Hopeless.


The things in my filter weren't reason enough for me to go after one of them, confident that he is scum. I'm just being pragmatic and removing the less informative of the two first, since I'm forced to choose one.

So despite finding things you dislike in Deconduo's filter and not really doing so for Hopeless, you still prefer a Hopeless lynch because Deconduo is more likely to reveal his alignment later?

The way you phrase it, it kinda sounds like you do think Decon is slightly more likely to flip scum than hopeless.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 00:09 GMT
#929
On August 13 2015 09:08 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2015 09:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On August 13 2015 09:03 Vivax wrote:
On August 13 2015 09:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Vivax I don't understand why you're voting Hope1ess over deconduo. From your filter you've mentioned you mentioned something about how you don't think he's bussing? And you've sort of implied you think Hopeless might be town. Furthermore you've also prodded Deconduo on a few things which you didn't like, which you didn't do for Hopeless.


The things in my filter weren't reason enough for me to go after one of them, confident that he is scum. I'm just being pragmatic and removing the less informative of the two first, since I'm forced to choose one.

So despite finding things you dislike in Deconduo's filter and not really doing so for Hopeless, you still prefer a Hopeless lynch because Deconduo is more likely to reveal his alignment later?

The way you phrase it, it kinda sounds like you do think Decon is slightly more likely to flip scum than hopeless.


I won't change my decision. If you wanted to entrap me in something you are free to show off the catch.

I'm not trying to entrap you into anything. I'm asking you if you think Deconduo is more likely to flip scum than Hopeless.

If the answer is no, then I presume the explanations Deconduo gave for his posts were satisfactory?
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 00:13 GMT
#933
On August 13 2015 09:12 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2015 09:09 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On August 13 2015 09:08 Vivax wrote:
On August 13 2015 09:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On August 13 2015 09:03 Vivax wrote:
On August 13 2015 09:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Vivax I don't understand why you're voting Hope1ess over deconduo. From your filter you've mentioned you mentioned something about how you don't think he's bussing? And you've sort of implied you think Hopeless might be town. Furthermore you've also prodded Deconduo on a few things which you didn't like, which you didn't do for Hopeless.


The things in my filter weren't reason enough for me to go after one of them, confident that he is scum. I'm just being pragmatic and removing the less informative of the two first, since I'm forced to choose one.

So despite finding things you dislike in Deconduo's filter and not really doing so for Hopeless, you still prefer a Hopeless lynch because Deconduo is more likely to reveal his alignment later?

The way you phrase it, it kinda sounds like you do think Decon is slightly more likely to flip scum than hopeless.


I won't change my decision. If you wanted to entrap me in something you are free to show off the catch.

I'm not trying to entrap you into anything. I'm asking you if you think Deconduo is more likely to flip scum than Hopeless.

If the answer is no, then I presume the explanations Deconduo gave for his posts were satisfactory?


I didn't even take into consideration precisely what both of them did. I'm using shallow reasoning to choose between shallow options. Means whatever posts you are alluding to, I don't even care about them cause both of them feel like premature lynches.

I don't understand why you wouldn't use all the information you have available to try and choose the person most likely to be scum. It sounds like you're just being lazy.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 00:20 GMT
#939
On August 13 2015 09:17 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2015 09:13 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On August 13 2015 09:12 Vivax wrote:
On August 13 2015 09:09 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On August 13 2015 09:08 Vivax wrote:
On August 13 2015 09:06 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On August 13 2015 09:03 Vivax wrote:
On August 13 2015 09:02 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Vivax I don't understand why you're voting Hope1ess over deconduo. From your filter you've mentioned you mentioned something about how you don't think he's bussing? And you've sort of implied you think Hopeless might be town. Furthermore you've also prodded Deconduo on a few things which you didn't like, which you didn't do for Hopeless.


The things in my filter weren't reason enough for me to go after one of them, confident that he is scum. I'm just being pragmatic and removing the less informative of the two first, since I'm forced to choose one.

So despite finding things you dislike in Deconduo's filter and not really doing so for Hopeless, you still prefer a Hopeless lynch because Deconduo is more likely to reveal his alignment later?

The way you phrase it, it kinda sounds like you do think Decon is slightly more likely to flip scum than hopeless.


I won't change my decision. If you wanted to entrap me in something you are free to show off the catch.

I'm not trying to entrap you into anything. I'm asking you if you think Deconduo is more likely to flip scum than Hopeless.

If the answer is no, then I presume the explanations Deconduo gave for his posts were satisfactory?


I didn't even take into consideration precisely what both of them did. I'm using shallow reasoning to choose between shallow options. Means whatever posts you are alluding to, I don't even care about them cause both of them feel like premature lynches.

I don't understand why you wouldn't use all the information you have available to try and choose the person most likely to be scum. It sounds like you're just being lazy.


I am, cause these are not my favourite lynches. Spent all day on my lynch and I'm not getting it, so I don't have to explain to you why I pick one over the other with you suggesting I should have deeper reasons for my choice when I really didn't.

That's the entrapment: You ask of me if deconduo's posts are fine for me now as if it meant something for my choice when I have never even taken his posts into consideration. I've read through both of them and decided for myself that I would prefer another lynch, but I can't get it so I'll find a reason that affects the future game (how active I expect them to be). If I had a reason for one of them being mafia then I would use that and not this practical decision.

Look, it's pretty simple. Town wants to lynch mafia. Even if you didn't get your preferred lynch, you should still try to get the lynch that is most likely to get scum. I don't understand why you're trying to resist doing that in favour of some arbitrary decision based on information when there already is information to work with.

Anyway, I'm off to bed.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 07:43 GMT
#1024
Well, that's annoying.
I agree with Rayn.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 08:03 GMT
#1026
I'm just going to sheep you in shame now.
+ Show Spoiler +
Unless you still want to lynch Ruxx
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 08:26 GMT
#1032
I was gone in the last 2 hours, but actually you're right and I should've gone with my townreads. I just was so sure I found something because it felt like the overarching thread sentiment was right. Should've re-evaled when prplhz and hopeless joined though. bleh.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 08:26 GMT
#1033
On August 13 2015 17:23 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Final answer Hopeless / prplhz / Chezinu.

Now stop being stupid. I am looking at you Artanis, rsoultin and Damdred.

You no longer thing RuXx is mafia?
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 09:04 GMT
#1036
On August 13 2015 17:36 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I was kinda thinking of calling Trfel mafia but what he says and how he approaches the EoD lines up with his thought process earlier in the game.

prplhz suddenly crawls up from his cave when votes start going towards Hopeless. There is zero mention in his filter about Palmar which i find out to be impossible unless he is mafia (Palmar is really good at reading him, and they ALWAYS "fight" when prplhz is town, or if they are both mafia). He isn't saying anything smart and is only focused on saing dumb things to me, by dumb i mean things that are not relevant to anything really.

Hopeless just posts stuff that has zero thoughts behind it. Regardless of his activity in games that IS his scumplay, and NOT his townplay. As town he is at least trying to help, regardless of how people read his posts and regardless of if he gets lynched for it or not. He has literally zero intention to find mafia here, as i said he is just posting stuff.

There was not really any reason to scumread deconduo until he posts more. prplhz has been around long enough to know this. I talked about it with rsoultin. The game is hella different than it used to be and we just witnessed the same thing with iGrok last game. The fact that deconduo never comes back to the thread should not be a reason to lynch him, he is just begging for a vig-shot. But it does not make him a good lynch, because you can't really tell his alignment from his posting. The votes and how they ended up on deconduo SHOULD have told you there is something really wrong with this lynch.... meh...

Palmar i need you to step up here and do it quick. When i die i don't want this game to go on to autopilot mode which nearly lost the game in Down Under just because you lost your credibility by your "not caring" attitude early on. Please do start caring and please do it FAST.

Artanis halp me.

I'm good with a hopeless Storm Vote. Hopeless if you are town now is the time to churn out any reads you can since you're probably dead tomorrow. As for Prplhz, I don't think the biggest problem I have with him is being on Deconduo (especially since I did the same), but rather how he fought my argument despite being null on him, didn't push anything else then finally ended up on Deconduo anyway. Feels like he was just arguing for the sake of arguing.
On August 13 2015 17:39 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2015 17:26 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On August 13 2015 17:23 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Final answer Hopeless / prplhz / Chezinu.

Now stop being stupid. I am looking at you Artanis, rsoultin and Damdred.

You no longer thing RuXx is mafia?

I don't know and i don't care right now.
I am just going to ignore him because noone except Vivax will lynch him anyways no matter what i think and it's not productive. So i just completely ignore him and if he is mafia i am blaming you.

Ok, I'm happy to take the blame and confirm I'm terrible at this game if RuXx turns out to be mafia.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 09:27 GMT
#1039
[image loading]
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 09:33 GMT
#1041
It wasn't even intentional for Vivax to be the one that seemingly is diseased but it is most appropriate.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 09:36 GMT
#1042
(<3)
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 11:39 GMT
#1064
On August 13 2015 20:30 Vivax wrote:
I'm not letting Artanis off the hook after what he did yesterday when he tried to move me to Decon using my own posts as a tool.

You're so cute.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 11:40 GMT
#1065
On August 13 2015 20:33 prplhz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2015 20:21 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Like can you explain this prplhz:

Here is what i see when i read your filter:
First you say you need something to sheep (which is basically what you say all D1 long). Okay fine. Then you argue against lynching Hopeless because there is no case which is literally incorrect because i actually made a case on him. Instead of addressing the case directly you get into an argument with me over something that is totally irrelevant to finding mafia. Then you call out VE (i guess you are suspicious of him then, because why would you do that otherwise?). That's also fine. Then you go into an argument with Artanis about deconduo, and during the argument - when i read it now - it seems like you are defending deconduo (by attacking Artanis' argument). That's also fine.

What is NOT FINE is that your vote ends up on Deconduo given that you have:
- said you just don't wanna lurker lynch (hopeless) but apparently lurkerlynching deconduo is okay for you ?!?!?
- never ever commented on my ACTUAL CASE on Hopeless, and the fact that there was no case on deconduo
- VE, who you are suspicious of, is basically the first person to push deconduo, and you just don't care about this at all?
- You defend "deconduo" against Artanis. Hell Artanis even tells you VE is the first one to push deconduo, you still don't care.
- After all this you just park your vote on deconduo....

Like how in your opinion does ANY of this make ANY sense at all?

i never had a great problem with lynching deconduo. to me he played like every other player who used to play but then didn't play for a long while but now they're back to play again, like every other player like that plays. i thought it was what i expected of him so i gave him a very slight town read.

this very slight town read had absolutely nothing to do with my arguments with artanis.

artanis made a case on decon based on a spreadsheet that i was very impressed with. the spreadsheet, not the argument. in my opinion the case was super flawed and didn't tell us anything. so i engaged with artanis on it because the thread was dead, i had no leads, nothing was happening, some guy made an argument i disagreed with, lets see what happens?

after the case i decided to revoke my slight town read on decon. back to null with him. why? because he hadn't done anything. it's like he showed up, did what was expected, left again. back to null. rso looked town though and so did artanis and his spreadsheet so i decided that i'd just sheep them.

i can sort of see why artanis made his argument (that i still disagree with), i liked his spreadsheet, rso looked townie enough compared to other people, i decided that these were the people i was gonna sheep.

i don't know why it's relevant VE voted decon? i also already knew this when i started talking to artanis (i pointed it out in an earlier post http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=24726076).

So you were very impressed by the spreadsheet, but you didn't actually take anything away from it and disagreed with the case. In retrospect, it was indeed wrong. What DID you learn from it though?
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 11:42 GMT
#1066
On August 13 2015 20:38 Vivax wrote:
I think prpl is town and I fully agree with the spreadsheet thingy. I didn't mention this yesterday but I found that case to be even too tinfoil for my taste. It was well designed and presented but there wasn't that much behind the marketing. In fact it just felt like marketing.

I'm trying to rearrange reads and a hopeless flip would help immensely, he is indeed very passive compared to his townie standard. I can say that more confidently now that enough time has passed.

I think after him I'd look more closely into Artanis and VE.

What happened to your Damdred and Ruxxar reads?
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 11:50 GMT
#1070
On August 13 2015 20:46 Vivax wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2015 20:42 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On August 13 2015 20:38 Vivax wrote:
I think prpl is town and I fully agree with the spreadsheet thingy. I didn't mention this yesterday but I found that case to be even too tinfoil for my taste. It was well designed and presented but there wasn't that much behind the marketing. In fact it just felt like marketing.

I'm trying to rearrange reads and a hopeless flip would help immensely, he is indeed very passive compared to his townie standard. I can say that more confidently now that enough time has passed.

I think after him I'd look more closely into Artanis and VE.

What happened to your Damdred and Ruxxar reads?


Damdy wasn't a read, it was a Palmar sheep. Ruxxar is on ice while I evaluate what happened yesterday, he wasn't on the decon wagon.

So now that you know that your assumption about decon not being voted as a basis for the scumread has been proven wrong, where has the mafia been yesterday?

I presume some hopped onto the Deconduo wagon. If it's Hopeless, mafia is likely within the pool Rayn has outlined. I still need to take a more detailed look at the vote count though.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 12:53 GMT
#1078
On August 13 2015 21:19 prplhz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 13 2015 20:40 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On August 13 2015 20:33 prplhz wrote:
On August 13 2015 20:21 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Like can you explain this prplhz:

Here is what i see when i read your filter:
First you say you need something to sheep (which is basically what you say all D1 long). Okay fine. Then you argue against lynching Hopeless because there is no case which is literally incorrect because i actually made a case on him. Instead of addressing the case directly you get into an argument with me over something that is totally irrelevant to finding mafia. Then you call out VE (i guess you are suspicious of him then, because why would you do that otherwise?). That's also fine. Then you go into an argument with Artanis about deconduo, and during the argument - when i read it now - it seems like you are defending deconduo (by attacking Artanis' argument). That's also fine.

What is NOT FINE is that your vote ends up on Deconduo given that you have:
- said you just don't wanna lurker lynch (hopeless) but apparently lurkerlynching deconduo is okay for you ?!?!?
- never ever commented on my ACTUAL CASE on Hopeless, and the fact that there was no case on deconduo
- VE, who you are suspicious of, is basically the first person to push deconduo, and you just don't care about this at all?
- You defend "deconduo" against Artanis. Hell Artanis even tells you VE is the first one to push deconduo, you still don't care.
- After all this you just park your vote on deconduo....

Like how in your opinion does ANY of this make ANY sense at all?

i never had a great problem with lynching deconduo. to me he played like every other player who used to play but then didn't play for a long while but now they're back to play again, like every other player like that plays. i thought it was what i expected of him so i gave him a very slight town read.

this very slight town read had absolutely nothing to do with my arguments with artanis.

artanis made a case on decon based on a spreadsheet that i was very impressed with. the spreadsheet, not the argument. in my opinion the case was super flawed and didn't tell us anything. so i engaged with artanis on it because the thread was dead, i had no leads, nothing was happening, some guy made an argument i disagreed with, lets see what happens?

after the case i decided to revoke my slight town read on decon. back to null with him. why? because he hadn't done anything. it's like he showed up, did what was expected, left again. back to null. rso looked town though and so did artanis and his spreadsheet so i decided that i'd just sheep them.

i can sort of see why artanis made his argument (that i still disagree with), i liked his spreadsheet, rso looked townie enough compared to other people, i decided that these were the people i was gonna sheep.

i don't know why it's relevant VE voted decon? i also already knew this when i started talking to artanis (i pointed it out in an earlier post http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=24726076).

So you were very impressed by the spreadsheet, but you didn't actually take anything away from it and disagreed with the case. In retrospect, it was indeed wrong. What DID you learn from it though?

i'm really not trying to be cheeky here and i tried rewording my response a couple of time but every time it just boils down to this: i learned that you made a spreadsheet that seemed to be correct.

Fuck you, now I want to call you town.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 13:36 GMT
#1086
Rayn why did you stop thinking Damdred was scum (presuming you did since you haven't named him in recent times)?
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
August 13 2015 17:38 GMT
#1171
On August 14 2015 02:06 Vivax wrote:
I'm moving Artanis to town pile disregarding the questioning I didn't like yesterday, and taking rayn's word for him being town.

[image loading]
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