Newbie Student Mafia IX

On May 03 2015 10:25 disformation wrote:


Okay, here we go:


At first I was greatly confused why asking questions == mafia in this post. But I guess I kinda asked what behaviour people are looking for, which could also benefit mafia I guess. Still kinda confused about this. Maybe he could explain that to me?


Part of the HTS discussion. At first a lack of attention was suspected, but it kinda cleared up into a nullish thing.


This raised some red flags for me. Sure he may want to read more stuff from other people to get more reads on them. Or to look who might follow this up... still really suspicious to me.

So yeah, overall I have a slight scum leaning towards him.

On May 03 2015 10:57 Fecalfeast wrote:

you have the pinkish hue of scumlean.

Call me an ass but I think your 'loopiness' may be caused by rolling mafia too many times in a short period, rather than a flight

On May 03 2015 11:03 Fecalfeast wrote:
nah, I kinda wish I was after [situation from active game] but I am not, sadly.

On May 03 2015 11:07 y0su wrote:
i'm trying to find a decent stream... my internet seems to be unhappy and my eyes are getting tired

On May 03 2015 11:11 y0su wrote:
there's been a LOT for me to absorb... I like FF's color scheme idea and there's a few posts that have moved people but not significantly

On May 03 2015 11:52 -Celestial- wrote:


Personally I think the filter miss of Superbia WAS a simple mistake, an oversight. But scott's response to it was either terrible town play or a gleeful scum play jumping on HtS not being around in an attempt to take a leading role in a lynch for some early town credit.

I know the whole associative reads between Superbia and scott isn't the best way to do it; but given how mafia team members would inherently trust what each other posts I don't think its too far of a stretch.

Everything on ritoky is circumstantial. But its my best third read at the moment to round the team off.

On May 03 2015 11:49 -Celestial- wrote:


His two posts are these:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/483492-newbie-student-mafia-ix?page=7#131
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/483492-newbie-student-mafia-ix?page=7#134

A broken BB code post trying to embed a town claim in spoilers and him asking "Scott are you the dude that always posts in obs qts?" doesn't really amount to anything substantial to me I'm afraid. X-D

On May 03 2015 12:21 Fecalfeast wrote:

Is this a read robik would approve of? I think I see what you're saying

On May 03 2015 12:31 scott31337 wrote:


You are right - I did not check it until afterwards. I did not re-read the pre-game excuses until afterwards. That was my fault. I got better backing when I roll scum anyway - I wouldn't have made such a dumb mistake.

We have plenty of time - we will have convincing arguments for you

On May 03 2015 19:55 disformation wrote:
Good morning everyone.
Some stuff I am wondering:

Stutters695 :
You were around for a bit, but my list on you is empty and your filter is really short. Give us something more to work with? How bad do you think scott looks now? Any idea of who you would lynch as of now? Scum reads?

ritoky :
Your two pushes so far were towards me were easy pushes on me and y0su, both of which are newbies. Coincidence or looking for easy misslynches?
You also seem to be defensive about superbia. Scum mate of yours?

sicklucker :
For not wanting to play d1, you seem to be around a bit. Changed your mind a bit, or is it more in the vain of your d1 reads being bad anyway? Not sure what your spamy stuff is supposed to be though. Kinda confused tbh. If that was what you were aiming for: congrats.

On May 03 2015 19:58 Superbia wrote:
Rest of your reads are pretty fluffy.

On May 04 2015 01:46 Superbia wrote:
Ritoky you want to share your scum reads so far or do you just wanna chill and see for a little?

On May 04 2015 01:55 Superbia wrote:


The scott read was okay at best. I don't see how it is very alignment indicative. Did scott really blindly trust me? I don't know. It's not entirely clear to me what scott did that lead to the decision to vote HtS, it was pretty quiet after I thought I caught the slip. To me it felt like there was a bit of confusion from scott's part on what was actually happening. I would like to hear some more from scott on his thought process, but I don't find his vote on HtS particularly alignment indicative.

On May 03 2015 08:40 prplhz wrote:

this is rubbing me the WRONG WAY

On May 04 2015 02:01 y0su wrote:

been busy (working on my lists when I get to sit at the computer) quite curious about how you put someone on your team (even t2) with just a few posts?

On May 03 2015 08:40 prplhz wrote:

this is rubbing me the WRONG WAY

On May 03 2015 08:41 prplhz wrote:
like he's trying to make up some excuse for being useless and then he tries to solve the game and that like 30 posts into the game

On May 04 2015 02:00 Superbia wrote:
I'm not interested in lynching scott today for now. Want to hear his thought process during the whole HtS debacle though. Wagon on SL would be nice.

On May 04 2015 02:09 Superbia wrote:
Like I don't want to elaborate on the way I read SL at the moment, but let's just say that he hasn't been town at all.

On May 04 2015 02:14 Stutters695 wrote:


Debatable. Prpl posts a shit load as town. Not to mention that's literally his only insight so far. It's early but I don't consider anything he's said as definitive.

On May 04 2015 02:15 Superbia wrote:
Who's up for voting on SL? :D

On May 04 2015 02:23 Superbia wrote:


-Shrug-. You're not doing anything with your vote anyway. May as well park it on someone. Might get some info from pressure.

On May 04 2015 04:17 y0su wrote:
ff, what do you think of ritoky's initial "loopyness" followed by a pretty quick change of direction into questioning?

On May 04 2015 08:39 The Shining wrote:


Lmao explain? I like to think its fairly easy to tell when I'm town. But I won't meta myself for you. Super asked for my game links, go see if you want to lynch me reading other town games. I've been told I look scummy as town before, nothing new to me. I could say the same for your opening posts and 0 to 100 change from one style to the other.

But I lynch scum, not people whose posting style and phrasing annoys me. Just so I understand, this post is you hinting at probably wanting to lynch me all game while being not particularly fond of HtS? Not townie enough!

Why not come out and take a stance? This looks like 2 weak reads left to sit there in the hopes someone else will actively push them. HtS draws no conclusions but you don't say anything definitive here, either. Lynch me for phrasing and HtS...isn't townie enough. Funny you pick on my phrasing instead of saying what she isn't, instead of what you think she is.

On May 04 2015 09:30 sicklucker wrote:
To Ritoky

To you I give the whole me
For I believe that you're my destiny
To you I offer every best of my heart
For I believe that you will value it

I want to share my whole life with you
For me to show that my love is true
I want to hold you in my arms
And sing you songs and lullabies

Loving you is what I want to do
Although I know that it can make me blue
Cause tears in my eyes has nothing to do
If I'm with a man that is Ritoky

On May 05 2015 00:46 disformation wrote:


Huh? Which part do you mean with setting up for scott flipping town? =/

On May 05 2015 00:33 disformation wrote:


Well, this strikes me as a bit odd as I kinda read this as "At this point I don't care if he is mafia or not". So I kinda get where y0su gets his feeling from. But I don't think that is anywhere close enough to dismiss the case or call -c- scum. Plus I agree on him more likely being scum. But this might me nice to keep on hand for the night phase.

On May 05 2015 01:13 Half the Sky wrote:


Okay, this is a fair point. But I see this statement from both alignments.

Second question for ritoky then, as a veteran surely by now, you've seen others make the same statements from townies commenting on players who might be playing suboptimally or whose town meta is close to scum meta (think batsnacks, kushm4sta, Blazinghand, sicklucker, LightningStrike, etc).

Why is it (or do you think it is) unreasonable to imagine Celestial could be making such an observation as town? The mafia rationale makes sense, but why wouldn't the town rationale for this same statement?

On May 05 2015 01:33 -Celestial- wrote:
Stutters CLAIMS that he doesn't really do day 1. Given that we have a couple of high potential lynch targets already I'm okay with not lynching him day 1 for that but I'm expecting huge things for day 2 as a result.

On May 04 2015 19:40 Tictock wrote:
I'm having a hard time deciding who I want to vote for as well.

Scott is still the most appealing case, even though I have some doubts.

I'm tempted to make a case against prp but there just isn't enough to go on. I just don't like his dismissive post regarding how he "spams town" normally and says he isn't around. If he is legit too busy to play a town would likely replace, this seems more like a scum excuse to skate by day 1.

Unfortunately that's all I have as prp, as well as several other ppl, just aren't active enough to make real reads on.

On May 05 2015 04:34 The Shining wrote:


I do. I thought I scummed him somewhere for it, I might not have posted it, though. He claimed to have read my past games but I'm not sure I believe him, unless it was "these posts look about the same size and posted the same, good enough." He claimed my filter here looked those town filters. If that were the case, he'd know I opened this game exactly like my last town game. Name 3 random ppl who have alrdy posted, call them scumteam, gg. He'd also know literally any time I've been scummed, I defend myself tooth and nail. So scumming me for being bitter and sardonic when he's the reason I'm bitter(scumming me over an HtS slip that was clearly in her filter) instead of looking at it objectively just looks like trying to push me.

It felt more to me like he asked for those games, skimmed 1 or 2, claimed to read them for town cred(what scum would read games to figure out meta? they know alignments) and then let it go.

On May 05 2015 04:39 The Shining wrote:
So if he doesn't know these things I've mentioned, how would he know I'm more relaxed and jokey as town? You either did read or didn't read. And if you only skimmed and have partial information i.e. reading only my entrances instead of skimming through different phases, how could you be confident enough to scum me for it?

On May 05 2015 04:40 The Shining wrote:
Effort read?

On May 05 2015 04:45 The Shining wrote:
Then maybe I'm in a tunnel. It doesn't matter. Super isn't getting lynched today and unless you or he pushes me, neither am I. This is the 2nd time in as many days I've been forced to defend/talk about Superbia and his scumread on me. Then you wonder why I'm "inconsistent" and giving effort reads to some, not others.

On May 05 2015 04:48 The Shining wrote:


Ohhhh, like my read on HtS VS my read on Super. Like the fact that Super had no proof he even read any of my past games, other than claiming I'm usually relaxed. Whereas HtS has been in games with me, and in her other posts not regarding me, uses quotes to illustrate her thought process.

Is that what you meant when you said I was inconsistent?

On May 05 2015 04:51 Half the Sky wrote:




I am really curious to see what Tictock has to say on Superbia particularly on the exchange between him and Celestial if he has any input or even between that and Shining. Both disinformation and myself are also headscratching on him at the moment, and one of my issues with Superbia is that particular exchange. I realise he's partying hard (happy birthday btw!) but look forward to a response when he returns.

On May 05 2015 05:37 Half the Sky wrote:


1 Already rationalised the opposite reads. If you agree to disagree, fine.
2 I've made points against my two top scumreads (additional against Scott/original against Superbia), neither of which are or have been in the thread as of late to further engage. But there are three scummers in this setup, so why not just keep digging and seeing what else turns up?
3 Diplomatic tone (reading what you just posted) was from one post. Go back to how I cased Superbia and tell me that's diplomatic. In fact I would think #1 (your point on reading them opposite) contradicts the fact that I'm diplomatic. The post you quoted, I'm looking for followthrough from Tictock in case you couldn't tell.
4 The "don't feel obviously town" is about as bad as it gets as you could apply that to half the players in this game right now. That's a PoE argument best saved for late game.

Plus you were more interested in Stutters when you threw your vote on me. There are some flaws in your logic. Particularly #3.

Try again.

On May 05 2015 04:51 Half the Sky wrote:




I am really curious to see what Tictock has to say on Superbia particularly on the exchange between him and Celestial if he has any input or even between that and Shining. Both disinformation and myself are also headscratching on him at the moment, and one of my issues with Superbia is that particular exchange. I realise he's partying hard (happy birthday btw!) but look forward to a response when he returns.

On May 05 2015 05:49 Half the Sky wrote:
Okay, so you have a problem with how I phrased it. Active voice versus passive voice is your argument for scumreading me.

I'll be completely honest here - I have never heard anyone in TL scumread someone for phrasing in active versus passive voice. That's a new one.

Regardless though, it's still not obvious to you that Tictock should be responding to that? It's still not obvious I'm looking for followthrough?

On May 05 2015 07:51 -Celestial- wrote:
At this point barring a blue claim from scott to be considered I don't think I'm moving my vote. I already put up a freaking big post pointing out all of his mistakes and scum tells and he totally failed to engage in any attempt to defend himself at all or even to set up an alternate choice for lynching. That's as good as a scumclaim to me at this point.

On May 05 2015 07:53 Half the Sky wrote:


When did he post? The last hour when I was in the other game as co-host? Definitely not before that unless I missed that.

I literally get back here and Superbia is going all out on the lynch. prplhz looks even worse as he's just posting from the backseat.

On May 05 2015 06:48 Tictock wrote:


My issue here was that the vote on scott felt too easy. It wouldn't add pressure as scott had already seemed to accept he is probably going to be the D1 lynch and would only put me into the "lynch scott" bandwagon. So while that was my obvious vote at the time I did not see that vote giving town any new info. I was pretty tempted, and probably should have just gone with it, to vote for prp to try and pressure him into posting.

Probably not the best way to play it out, but that is what was going through my head.

In regards to my reads on Shining and Super, I've been having a hard time reading them or at least feeling like i have good reads on them. I'll reread them and catch up on their most recent posts here now.

As for the current state of things, I can't get behind a HtS lynch. The reads against her are purely meta-based and I've already stated I wont trust those.

scott... man you made yourself look pretty bad early on and at this point there is no denying your going to get lynched. Still I look at your most recent posts and I feel like you are posting genuinely. Why did you give up defending yoourself?

On May 05 2015 07:56 Fecalfeast wrote:

WTF is this post?

Did I say that was alignment indicative?

This is what I mean, combative.

On May 05 2015 08:02 -Celestial- wrote:
Also yes, whatever alignment scott is he votes HtS here so IDK what he was doing.

On May 05 2015 08:09 sicklucker wrote:


yes??

On May 05 2015 22:13 Half the Sky wrote:


Looks like I missed Superbia's second post when I said he was unsure on how he felt. So much was flying around at EoD, I had missed it.





The second post reads as sarcastic to me given his first sentence. So I think he's calling you scum for your ninja vote.

However, I checked your filter, and you listed at least three times as to why you didn't like Scott prior to the vote, so him calling it a ninja vote is just him looking at the timestamps and throwing it out there. You voted in thread about 90m prior and in voting thread approx 75m prior.

Although he calls it a ninja vote at 5m prior. He goes back to read the stuff on me and clearly he was looking at other things too when he called your ninja vote (and linked it) yet he didn't catch when you voted and still called it ninja. You haven't changed your reads on Scott from what I can tell. It's definitely selective reading and mafia can cherry pick the posts to fit their arguments. That's the (scum) impression I get from him.

Also he's saying you're not engaging in conversation. That statement doesn't really do anything productive as you have already stated your reasons for voting Scott. (Nor am I seeing his reasons for contesting that.)

Superbia gets back in thread and we have these series of quotes from him.







It's the same problem I have with Superbia voting me, he's not really reading the thread (the timestamps clearly indicate that), or reading selectively. IIRC he afks the thread saying I need to do more, and he basically comes back to that. His push on me is at best OMGUS.

On May 06 2015 02:13 Half the Sky wrote:


I'm assuming here you are talking about my response/rebuttal of why you think I'm scum. There's nothing OMGUS about refuting any argument, and I even said before your logic may be flawed. That's a simple defence - at no point I've even solidly scumread you to begin with, let alone in retaliation.

As for prplhz I was scumreading him well before he voted me, and his subsequent posts/EoD behaviour have only been worse. Even his last point on Stutters is pretty laughable - he's pretty much commenting from the backseat without questioning Superbia - checking his filter he doesn't even have a read on Superbia.

The pot/kettle argument is a moot point here.

On May 06 2015 02:25 Stutters695 wrote:
I'm kinda souring on Rit. Is he always this all over the place?

That question to HtS about prp is really wtf.

On May 06 2015 02:43 Half the Sky wrote:
I also mentioned it before and I'll mention it again - the argument that "having the same reads as yourself" makes someone town (or not having them makes a person mafia) is really faulty at best, especially early (and we're still early as it's only N1) in the game as D1 reads on aggregate aren't great.

On May 06 2015 02:51 -Celestial- wrote:


I already mentioned why in my post above. Simply put: I know from personal experience she can make a good job of hiding as scum. A few pages ago Superbia asked for my thoughts on HtS and my conclusion was the following:



Obviously there's been more since then. I WANT to townread her but honestly this game I'm not sure she's ever going to get better than a null from my own inherently suspicious bias. Sure, some of our reads are similar but I don't actually consider that to be outright alignment indicative in and of itself. I'm not perfect (as the egg on my face from pushing the scott lynch so hard can attest to) which means its entirely possible she's simply picked up on reads I've gotten wrong and is going along with it to fit in. Or she might genuinely believe it. Or she might think that I might think that and....

I'm drifting into WIFOM territory here. >_>

On May 06 2015 03:37 Stutters695 wrote:


Until he comes back, what can she do about it?

"Hey prpl, why don't you have any opinions?"

"Prpl, I'm still waiting"

"Prpl plz respond"

It shits up the thread for no real benefit.

Until he shows back up and actually has an opinion, we lynch him. There's nothing to discuss, this is how scum prpl do.

It totally makes sense, but I can see where you're coming from there.

On May 06 2015 03:59 Superbia wrote:
Ritoky what do you think of HtS at this point in time?

On May 06 2015 04:07 Superbia wrote:
What did celestial do to become confirmed town?

On May 06 2015 02:51 -Celestial- wrote:


I already mentioned why in my post above. Simply put: I know from personal experience she can make a good job of hiding as scum. A few pages ago Superbia asked for my thoughts on HtS and my conclusion was the following:



Obviously there's been more since then. I WANT to townread her but honestly this game I'm not sure she's ever going to get better than a null from my own inherently suspicious bias. Sure, some of our reads are similar but I don't actually consider that to be outright alignment indicative in and of itself. I'm not perfect (as the egg on my face from pushing the scott lynch so hard can attest to) which means its entirely possible she's simply picked up on reads I've gotten wrong and is going along with it to fit in. Or she might genuinely believe it. Or she might think that I might think that and....

I'm drifting into WIFOM territory here. >_>

On May 06 2015 04:10 prplhz wrote:
dunno i think ticktock looks horrible for throwing away his vote like that.

On May 06 2015 04:25 Stutters695 wrote:


That was already clear. Prpl doesn't need his hand held. If he steps up town can reevaluate but if not he's scum and he needs to die. Simple as that really.

Getting to your questions Super, I'm at work so it fluctuates depending how busy I am.

On May 06 2015 04:28 prplhz wrote:

I could buy that.

On May 06 2015 06:41 Half the Sky wrote:
Psstttt, ritoky....

On May 06 2015 06:59 Half the Sky wrote:


Alright, fair.

I also interpret "confirmed" town as a flipped town or a DT check or some mechanic that actually literally confirms that person, which is why I asked.

On May 07 2015 02:20 Stutters695 wrote:


We've had a really good lynch since n1 and you're directing attention away from him on the basis of a RB claim. That's hella scummy.

On May 07 2015 02:30 Stutters695 wrote:


Obviously.

My points are all throughout my filter and they haven't changed because he still is doing nothing. If you want me to rehash everything into a 5p essay I can, but it should be completely unnecessary. The dude is scum.

On May 07 2015 02:40 Stutters695 wrote:

Go read any game I play lol. If you get 3 pages out of me d1 it's a miracle. Honestly, it's not the best in newbies, but it's very established for my meta. There is a reason HtS was on my side about it d1.

Anyway that's like the 7th time I've explained it. Eyes forward now, I'm done with that.

Why don't we lynch prpl?

On May 04 2015 02:14 Stutters695 wrote:


Debatable. Prpl posts a shit load as town. Not to mention that's literally his only insight so far. It's early but I don't consider anything he's said as definitive.

On May 04 2015 03:56 Stutters695 wrote:


Spam yourself town. LOL. Is that what you're calling that? You established yourself as pretty town d1 there, then went completely mia as town imploded. Then came back spamming bullshit. If that's your strategy as town you need to step your game up real bad.

So far this game you've less and I was even trying not to tunnel you after that trainwreck of a game. Yet somehow, you just have a very lynchable face yet again.

How about you read C's filter and give me a reason not to lynch you instead of just saying "that stands out"

On May 05 2015 01:14 Stutters695 wrote:
Prpl still missing I see.

On May 05 2015 04:30 Stutters695 wrote:
Sorry guys, busy day. I would still do Scott. Playing in 2 games is rough.

On May 07 2015 02:42 Superbia wrote:
We don't lynch prp because prp subscribed to my thought patterns d1, which buys him a no-lynch today.

How in the seven hells do you want to lynch prp when people like the shining have not done anything after pressure was removed.

On May 07 2015 02:39 Half the Sky wrote:


I think I understand you. You're saying that is it possible that 2 scum voted me....but disinformation voted Scott. Wagon was 3 votes on me, you sup and prp.

I'm trying to avoid associations. It is possible that scum can form counterwagon to remove attention from themselves, though Superbia did that when the wagon on Scott was high. He wasn't invested in the Scott lynch at all. So this is a point in favour of him.

D2 I didn't just have a problem with one quote, I have problems with multiple things. If he can explain that, then it's one thing.

prplhz on the other hand looked really bad. I don't recall him being invested in that lynch, but he was trying to push me from the backseat (unlike you and Superbia).

I'm not scumreading disinformation (yet). I picked his brain a little and he's looking okay for now.



For what I recall, there are three people that scummed him relatively solidly. That's hardly a majority.

Celestial did D1 but it was associative, and now he's not sure. Stutters and myself had problems with him, and I still do. The newbies - I have no idea where they stand. Shining - no clue if his reads have changed. You I thought townread him.

On May 07 2015 02:56 Stutters695 wrote:


Since n1 not d1, what the fuck are you on about revisionist history. I gave him d1 to do anything. He didn't. He still hasn't, that's scum prpl in a nutshell. HtS made additional points. If you won't do it from my posts, read hers and lynch him.

On May 07 2015 02:50 ritoky wrote:


i think if 2 mafia didn't vote on the lead wagon, which is unlikely because the majority of mafia statistically votes on the lead wagon day 1. then it is likely disform + prp/superb. i doubt they would consolidate on the 3 man counterwagon, the association is too strong. however, statistically speaking there is likely 1 outside of the main wagon and 2 inside of it, from a numbers perspective.

and your read right there on disform is exactly what i am talking about. people keep giving him cheap town reads.

On May 07 2015 03:00 ritoky wrote:
prp is a role or mafia, take that 1 to the bank. had that read since like his 3rd or 4th post. waiting on his claim.

On May 07 2015 06:47 The Shining wrote:


Would love to see you come back when not on mobile and actually explain this. Because I'm in your filter right now and this isn't what I'm seeing.

Do tell.

On May 07 2015 07:14 The Shining wrote:
Disregard my last post. I thought you posted and left. Lets talk, if you still have time.

I agree with the off wagon mafia point. Thing is, and I hate to use this, but I've seen ppl defend TTs vote, as well as TT defending it, too. Newbie, pressured, etc.

Prp doesn't have that excuse.

Mmmm welp yosus my next filter. I didn't like what Super pointed out about him seeming to make excuses for me. It's a stretch but scum yosu would know my alignment and would be weary of being blamed for pushing my ml the hardest without interacting with me or finding solid to scum me on. He doesn't have that on me so he makes an excuse.

On May 07 2015 07:18 The Shining wrote:

The way I read it, you're scumming her for her tone shift(tone reasoning), then criticizing the Superbia because of tone.

So when is it acceptable and when isn't it? You got at me for inconsistencies in my reads(towning A for doing xyz but not B, who also did xyz). What I see here is you scumming for xyz, then criticizing the Superbia train for xyz.

On May 07 2015 07:25 The Shining wrote:


This was always going to happen, since D1 fell on my weekend. But this is misinformation now.

I'm here. I'm not behind in the thread. I've referenced recent interactions. I'm interacting. I'm not just summarizing, I've pulled examples from your filter. And yes, I was pinged out by everyone. Last night, yesterday afternoon, etc. So anything I do after that is doing it after being pinged out, regardless of whether I was going to or not. How is that alignment indicative?

On May 07 2015 07:28 prplhz wrote:
hey guys i'm reading up now anything i should pay attention to?

On May 07 2015 07:39 The Shining wrote:


So it's acceptable when you do it to make a read more serious than it is for info purposes but it's not acceptable when someone is using it, amongst other things, to make a case?

On May 07 2015 07:38 y0su wrote:
I don't really follow what my reads on you, tt, prp and super have to do with the overall question, I assume you're talking about d1 + Show Spoiler +
I don't see any reason that scum wouldn't want to disassociate from a ML. In terms of where they'd go, I think it would be easier to jump on another wagon than start their own.

On May 08 2015 02:32 y0su wrote:
This was (and still is) @ritoky

On May 08 2015 08:25 Half the Sky wrote:


Tictock is an isolated vote, obviously we know he's most likely not scum here. But in other games, stats aside how are you so sure that isolated votes AREN'T mafia?

I mean I hated the way you used it in Titanic, everyone knows VCA can be manipulated for an anti-town agenda and you were SK. Just saying. I'm talking in general btw, not necessarily this game, this game I'm sure you're town.

On May 08 2015 08:31 The Shining wrote:


What is this even

On May 07 2015 03:00 ritoky wrote:
prp is a role or mafia, take that 1 to the bank. had that read since like his 3rd or 4th post. waiting on his claim.

On May 07 2015 06:42 ritoky wrote:
unless prp comes in and claims a role and doesn't get cc'd. then i have to reconsider. i mean..i am probably lynching him unless he claims/

On May 10 2015 04:54 Tictock wrote:
"Bullied prp into claim" reads alot differnt than saying " I read him as role or scum D1, and put the pressure on him D2"
However, claiming this read after the fact proves little as you never stated those reads untill late D2.

Tone and phrasing make a world of differnce. I also like the VT throwaway notion, I'm not sold that it is a solid plan given that VT is still needed to win, but maybe in that situation it has some merit.

Anyways, i still see you as town or at least my most towny scum, i just hate that you throw this " too towny to prove town" attitude at us.

What do you think about my read on SL?

On May 10 2015 04:54 Tictock wrote:
What do you think about my read on SL?

On May 10 2015 10:37 -Celestial- wrote:


Prove it; everything I said there was logical and direct. All YOU'VE got going for you is you repeatedly stating things without proving or explaining why and then stating you're confirmed town. Scummy as hell. If you're not scum then you're playing a horrible town game.

Nice ad hominem by the way, go much further with the insults and I'm just going to report you. I'm not here to get into a personal pissing match with someone.

On May 10 2015 10:44 -Celestial- wrote:
Also amused that ritoky is insulting me for calling him out considering how hard he was reading prpl near the start. X-D

On May 11 2015 00:34 Half the Sky wrote:


Have you seen ritoky's PoE list? It's Shining and myself as the last mafia.



Not sure what he means by tictock being "statistically likely" but more important, what do you think about his PoE list different from yours?

You've PoEed Tictock and y0su, yet you suspect ritoky who provides those reasons for towning two of your PoEs. Thoughts on that?

On May 11 2015 01:44 Half the Sky wrote:
Those of you scumreading y0su, I'm curious to hear your thoughts on this latest exchange.

Newb town? Or newb scum?

I need to check into ritoky - note to self...

On May 11 2015 03:06 Half the Sky wrote:


I actually find this post pretty hilarious. Earlier you said I was scum for not following through on people. y0su is my top scumread (whether you agree with it or not is a separate issue) and I'm attempting to flesh out information to ensure he's not a newbie town playing suboptimally.

I'm pointing out flaws in his logic and you are calling it bullying? He already had a direction on me and I explained the flaws in it.

I also love how you use a tonal argument to infer scum on me. Remember how you said it was a problem using it against Superbia? *yawn*

Double standards aren't doing you any favours right now.

On May 11 2015 03:08 Half the Sky wrote:
Superbia, y0su and tictock are obv newbies but the other two -

+ Show Spoiler [ritoky] +

+ Show Spoiler [sicklucker] +

I need to also meta ritoky and follow through on him to be absolutely sure he's scum as I've yet to play a game with him when he's town. I have to afk again, but I'll post final judgement before EoD.

On May 11 2015 03:12 Superbia wrote:
Ritoky what are your thoughts? Will be you be mad if we lynch you?

On May 11 2015 03:14 Half the Sky wrote:


I didn't have a problem with the fact you gave an opinion. I have a problem with how you stated it based on your standards for scumreading people earlier in the game. Those standards of yours are changing through out the game.

Why? That is what I am challenging.

On May 11 2015 03:18 -Celestial- wrote:


If you think that's townplay and you actually are town you're a horrible judge of townplay. Then again we already know that since you were reading prpl so hard as town despite him doing jack all.

On May 11 2015 03:23 Half the Sky wrote:


Yawn.

Standards being the lack of followthrough and the tonal read, this is about the third time or even more than that tone has come up.

Also your responses show you aren't critically looking at why he changed direction. Nor did you appear to even analyse my walls of text (other than saying it was walls of text).

On May 11 2015 03:26 -Celestial- wrote:


And your response was to unnecessarily call for him to claim it when he was already under heavy pressure anyway; simply so you could claim some credit for yourself despite doing nothing. Bollocks, total bollocks. I don't need teaching by an incompetent player like yourself.

On May 11 2015 03:30 -Celestial- wrote:


She was explaining the term WIFOM. Which was highly relevant. The fact that you're misrepresenting this makes it even more likely that you're scum.

On May 11 2015 03:15 ritoky wrote:


if lynching me makes the game more solveable, then i don't mind.

my problem is really HtS. i am not sold on her as town like everyone else, and if we lynch me, then you die; i don't feel like the people remaining will sufficiently stand up to her and she will just get her way. that is a terrifying scenario for me. so if i can get her as a 95% town read then sure, we can PoE lynch me.

On May 11 2015 03:35 Half the Sky wrote:


I'm seeing similar jumps/misrepresentations in logic as he's making when he was serial killer in Titanic.

Whoop-de-doo ritoky - the princess bride reference was all in reference to WIFOM which directly influenced y0su's read on me.

My purpose was to flesh out newb town or newb scum from that.

I've resolved the WIFOM argument but I've not resolved the parroting argument - he's sheeping tictock on the sicklucker read.

There was absolute purpose in that, and again shows you're not thinking critically or taking it out of context. Yawn.

On May 11 2015 03:40 -Celestial- wrote:
As for being pissed, it'll get dealt with when you stop insulting me and get lynched and never bother me again.

On May 11 2015 03:40 -Celestial- wrote:
1. "As mafia" means dick all. Your town play here is horrible. Fact. You've done dick all to help us this game, instead spending most of it setting yourself up to claim credit on stuff people were already doing and yelling "I'm town" at every opportunity. None of what you've done is pro-town, in fact you've actively tried to confuse and misrepresent.

On May 11 2015 03:43 -Celestial- wrote:


You are literally the only person in this entire game saying everything you are doing is "obvious town". You are also the only person in this entire game who has consistently read you, ritoky, as town. And you've been incredibly vocal about that.

Either you're a HORRIBLE town player with an ego that makes you think you're amazing or you're scum.

On May 11 2015 02:54 Superbia wrote:
Scratch ritoky off the lynch list folks.

On May 11 2015 03:44 -Celestial- wrote:


You have. Get out.




Not confirming you, idiot. Get out.

On May 11 2015 03:44 -Celestial- wrote:


Before I cased you. And with no evidence.

Sure, bro. Get out.

On May 11 2015 03:47 Superbia wrote:
It's y0su. Final answer.

On May 11 2015 03:47 -Celestial- wrote:


To be honest that crap is throughout his entire filter. I couldn't believe the amount he'd gotten away with after actually looking through it.

Either he's totally incompetent or he's scum.

On May 11 2015 04:15 Half the Sky wrote:


To elaborate on this - you (ritoky) said that "a newbie couldn't think of this situation" to be fair presuming he's scum, he's on a scumteam with two vets and a coach, as town he has one, we know jack all what's being said to him and he's playing out a list of hypotheticals. Which can be done as either alignment.

On May 11 2015 04:17 Half the Sky wrote:
Which is why, ritoky, I'm not at all sold on y0su being town. I'm most concerned about his read progression.

Compare that to tictock and (flipped medic) disinformation.

He's also asking a load of questions and not seeing much conclusions and you even called him comformy yourself. You should examine whether this is happening again as he's voting sicklucker.

On May 11 2015 04:28 Superbia wrote:


Yeah, idk. My mind keeps going back to shining but his filter seems okay-ish.

On May 11 2015 05:24 -Celestial- wrote:


Go screw yourself.

On May 11 2015 05:26 plotspot wrote:
huh? What does it mean "y0su has fled"? Can you just give up like this?

On May 11 2015 05:28 -Celestial- wrote:


I take things personally when you start insulting me. So yeah.