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Newbie Student Mafia VII - Page 10

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 06:22 GMT
#2299
Tubesock stopped arguing with me. I was having fun

It's probably for the best, though. It doesn't give town any information, and just gets in the way of real scumhunting.

I'd really like to lynch Bourneq today. I could be willing to lynch Tubesock instead, but I just see no reason to do so.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 06:28 GMT
#2302
On April 17 2015 15:23 Tubesock wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 17 2015 15:07 Trfel wrote:
On April 17 2015 14:54 Tubesock wrote:
On April 17 2015 14:39 Trfel wrote:
On April 17 2015 14:15 Tubesock wrote:
Why are you guys towning Trfel?

For his massive synapsis posts? He MUST DO THAT! Don't town him because he makes big posts.

None of you have asked anything about my case except for the 2 guys in it. Why?
Yes. I'm scum because I did something that looks towny.

Tubesock, this simply isn't how to scumhunt. To scumhunt, you want to look for mafia motivation. However, this doesn't mean look for "why would they do this as mafia", it means to look for the reasons that mafia would do this that town wouldn't have. Me making my four analysis posts is something I would definitely do as town, and would probably do as scum. In and of itself, it's not alignment indicative. Read what I said, that's what is alignment indicative.

Nothing that you have posted suggests that I am scum. You've only showed that you disagree with several of the reasons that I have been townread. The one real potentially scummy thing in my filter, my hammer on TheBloodyDwarf over prplhz, isn't a reason you are scumreading me.

Apparently I killed Half the Sky because she was the biggest threat to me. So what? She was the biggest threat to most everyone. Just because Trfel would have killed Half the Sky here doesn't mean that any other mafia team would not. And it doesn't mean that I am scum.

Even as scum, you need to keep these things in mind. You can do crazy things and hope to get townread anyway, and often it will work, but normally your support dries up. Eventually you need some actual reasons behind your pushes.


What's alignment indicative is things of what you do. You agree that your extra effort is something that you would do as either alignment. I'm trying to get town to see that they shouldn't town you for it. I also think you had to overcompensate for Onegu's scumminess.

I don't think it is nearly as easy as "oh this post is alignment indicative." Or this one, it's too easy to fake. It's more about intentions of what they are doing. I don't want town to just pass you as town. I think that's a very dangerous mistake.
Onegu wasn't scummy? And I'm not getting townread for effort, I'm getting townread for tone, read progression/explanation, and the fact that my mafia game is a disgrace to the site. Both of my non-town games, rsoultin caught me in a handful of posts.

So you've gone from "here's why Trfel is scum" to "don't townread Trfel for these reasons". Why? You're attacking me with defense, not offense. You have no actual attack.


You haven't even read my case then. I saw the game Rso caught you. You picked a bad game to try to change your meta. That wasn't because you are not capable of looking towny as mafia.

How am I only defensing you. I've been repeating myself about how you haven't scumhunted in the first parts of Day 3. You only even noticed me because I came after you.
Yeah, I thought that I could still look towny as scum. I couldn't even pull it off as third party in Aperture 4. Holyflare straight up humiliated me Night 1. Rsoultin identified that I was third party and forced it out of me at the very start of Night 1. I can't prove it, as these conversations occurred over PM, but I'm sure rsoultin can vouch for it.

You haven't been defending me, no. You misread what I said. What I mean is that, instead of sharing reasons why I am scum, you're sharing reasons why things that I could be considered town for are null (in your opinion). You're not sticking any scum on me, you're just trying to remove my townie points.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 06:33 GMT
#2303
Your posts have become less frequent. Running to the scum QT for advice?
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 06:38 GMT
#2306
On April 17 2015 15:35 Tubesock wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 17 2015 15:28 Trfel wrote:
On April 17 2015 15:23 Tubesock wrote:
On April 17 2015 15:07 Trfel wrote:
On April 17 2015 14:54 Tubesock wrote:
On April 17 2015 14:39 Trfel wrote:
On April 17 2015 14:15 Tubesock wrote:
Why are you guys towning Trfel?

For his massive synapsis posts? He MUST DO THAT! Don't town him because he makes big posts.

None of you have asked anything about my case except for the 2 guys in it. Why?
Yes. I'm scum because I did something that looks towny.

Tubesock, this simply isn't how to scumhunt. To scumhunt, you want to look for mafia motivation. However, this doesn't mean look for "why would they do this as mafia", it means to look for the reasons that mafia would do this that town wouldn't have. Me making my four analysis posts is something I would definitely do as town, and would probably do as scum. In and of itself, it's not alignment indicative. Read what I said, that's what is alignment indicative.

Nothing that you have posted suggests that I am scum. You've only showed that you disagree with several of the reasons that I have been townread. The one real potentially scummy thing in my filter, my hammer on TheBloodyDwarf over prplhz, isn't a reason you are scumreading me.

Apparently I killed Half the Sky because she was the biggest threat to me. So what? She was the biggest threat to most everyone. Just because Trfel would have killed Half the Sky here doesn't mean that any other mafia team would not. And it doesn't mean that I am scum.

Even as scum, you need to keep these things in mind. You can do crazy things and hope to get townread anyway, and often it will work, but normally your support dries up. Eventually you need some actual reasons behind your pushes.


What's alignment indicative is things of what you do. You agree that your extra effort is something that you would do as either alignment. I'm trying to get town to see that they shouldn't town you for it. I also think you had to overcompensate for Onegu's scumminess.

I don't think it is nearly as easy as "oh this post is alignment indicative." Or this one, it's too easy to fake. It's more about intentions of what they are doing. I don't want town to just pass you as town. I think that's a very dangerous mistake.
Onegu wasn't scummy? And I'm not getting townread for effort, I'm getting townread for tone, read progression/explanation, and the fact that my mafia game is a disgrace to the site. Both of my non-town games, rsoultin caught me in a handful of posts.

So you've gone from "here's why Trfel is scum" to "don't townread Trfel for these reasons". Why? You're attacking me with defense, not offense. You have no actual attack.


You haven't even read my case then. I saw the game Rso caught you. You picked a bad game to try to change your meta. That wasn't because you are not capable of looking towny as mafia.

How am I only defensing you. I've been repeating myself about how you haven't scumhunted in the first parts of Day 3. You only even noticed me because I came after you.
Yeah, I thought that I could still look towny as scum. I couldn't even pull it off as third party in Aperture 4. Holyflare straight up humiliated me Night 1. Rsoultin identified that I was third party and forced it out of me at the very start of Night 1. I can't prove it, as these conversations occurred over PM, but I'm sure rsoultin can vouch for it.

You haven't been defending me, no. You misread what I said. What I mean is that, instead of sharing reasons why I am scum, you're sharing reasons why things that I could be considered town for are null (in your opinion). You're not sticking any scum on me, you're just trying to remove my townie points.


I meant it the way you did. I'm telling town not to just townread you for your effort. So, yeah that removes defense and I'm saying you are scummy for your D3 actions. I don't see how me saying you came in and IMMEDIATELY knew things that I think should have taken some time to at least think about. I'm accusing you of not reading the game because you don't have to. You also go straight for the no lynch/lynch and claim business which I think is not scumhunting.

That's scummy behavior not town.
So now you accuse me of not reading the game. You have no good reason for this at all. Spending time thinking about the night kill before End of Night isn't a good reason. Wanting to no lynch at MYLO when I'm busy isn't a good reason.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 06:39 GMT
#2308
On April 17 2015 15:36 Tubesock wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 17 2015 15:33 Trfel wrote:
Your posts have become less frequent. Running to the scum QT for advice?


Didn't know I should be spamming F5. I'm losing interest in you since everyone seemed to have left.
But I'm having fun!

I guess I probably shouldn't play with my food.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 06:40 GMT
#2309
On April 17 2015 15:39 Breshke wrote:
Im here tube but you seem more itnrested in arguing with trefel than expanding on your bourne read with me
Oh, sorry, if you actually want to have useful discussion with Tubesock, go ahead. I'll get out of your way.

Let me know when you're done so I can start arguing again.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 06:49 GMT
#2313
On April 17 2015 15:45 Tubesock wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 17 2015 15:38 Trfel wrote:
On April 17 2015 15:35 Tubesock wrote:
On April 17 2015 15:28 Trfel wrote:
On April 17 2015 15:23 Tubesock wrote:
On April 17 2015 15:07 Trfel wrote:
On April 17 2015 14:54 Tubesock wrote:
On April 17 2015 14:39 Trfel wrote:
On April 17 2015 14:15 Tubesock wrote:
Why are you guys towning Trfel?

For his massive synapsis posts? He MUST DO THAT! Don't town him because he makes big posts.

None of you have asked anything about my case except for the 2 guys in it. Why?
Yes. I'm scum because I did something that looks towny.

Tubesock, this simply isn't how to scumhunt. To scumhunt, you want to look for mafia motivation. However, this doesn't mean look for "why would they do this as mafia", it means to look for the reasons that mafia would do this that town wouldn't have. Me making my four analysis posts is something I would definitely do as town, and would probably do as scum. In and of itself, it's not alignment indicative. Read what I said, that's what is alignment indicative.

Nothing that you have posted suggests that I am scum. You've only showed that you disagree with several of the reasons that I have been townread. The one real potentially scummy thing in my filter, my hammer on TheBloodyDwarf over prplhz, isn't a reason you are scumreading me.

Apparently I killed Half the Sky because she was the biggest threat to me. So what? She was the biggest threat to most everyone. Just because Trfel would have killed Half the Sky here doesn't mean that any other mafia team would not. And it doesn't mean that I am scum.

Even as scum, you need to keep these things in mind. You can do crazy things and hope to get townread anyway, and often it will work, but normally your support dries up. Eventually you need some actual reasons behind your pushes.


What's alignment indicative is things of what you do. You agree that your extra effort is something that you would do as either alignment. I'm trying to get town to see that they shouldn't town you for it. I also think you had to overcompensate for Onegu's scumminess.

I don't think it is nearly as easy as "oh this post is alignment indicative." Or this one, it's too easy to fake. It's more about intentions of what they are doing. I don't want town to just pass you as town. I think that's a very dangerous mistake.
Onegu wasn't scummy? And I'm not getting townread for effort, I'm getting townread for tone, read progression/explanation, and the fact that my mafia game is a disgrace to the site. Both of my non-town games, rsoultin caught me in a handful of posts.

So you've gone from "here's why Trfel is scum" to "don't townread Trfel for these reasons". Why? You're attacking me with defense, not offense. You have no actual attack.


You haven't even read my case then. I saw the game Rso caught you. You picked a bad game to try to change your meta. That wasn't because you are not capable of looking towny as mafia.

How am I only defensing you. I've been repeating myself about how you haven't scumhunted in the first parts of Day 3. You only even noticed me because I came after you.
Yeah, I thought that I could still look towny as scum. I couldn't even pull it off as third party in Aperture 4. Holyflare straight up humiliated me Night 1. Rsoultin identified that I was third party and forced it out of me at the very start of Night 1. I can't prove it, as these conversations occurred over PM, but I'm sure rsoultin can vouch for it.

You haven't been defending me, no. You misread what I said. What I mean is that, instead of sharing reasons why I am scum, you're sharing reasons why things that I could be considered town for are null (in your opinion). You're not sticking any scum on me, you're just trying to remove my townie points.


I meant it the way you did. I'm telling town not to just townread you for your effort. So, yeah that removes defense and I'm saying you are scummy for your D3 actions. I don't see how me saying you came in and IMMEDIATELY knew things that I think should have taken some time to at least think about. I'm accusing you of not reading the game because you don't have to. You also go straight for the no lynch/lynch and claim business which I think is not scumhunting.

That's scummy behavior not town.
So now you accuse me of not reading the game. You have no good reason for this at all. Spending time thinking about the night kill before End of Night isn't a good reason. Wanting to no lynch at MYLO when I'm busy isn't a good reason.


I've said the same thing over and over.

This really boils down to I don't think you considered that Breshke could be fakeclaiming. I don't think you have been trying to read what I'm saying about non you subjects. I guess it makes sense, why would you I'm scumreading you. Then why would you read anything else I say about anything else really.
I don't need to consider that Breshke could be fake claiming.

We cannot possibly lynch a non counterclaimed blue. I basically don't care how scummy they look, they can't be lynched.

So why would I consider the possibility of Breshke being counterclaimed before it happens?

I paid minimal attention to your case on Breshke for the above reason. You've also said that rsoultin is town and prplhz is town. What else have you said that isn't about me?
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 07:02 GMT
#2317
It's 3 AM. I'm sleepy.

Good night.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 17:12 GMT
#2345
I'm here, if there is anything people want to talk about.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 18:11 GMT
#2356
On April 18 2015 03:08 Bourneq wrote:
Whatever I say I am not getting out of this lynch. See you next newbie game.
It's already open for signups here.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 22:10 GMT
#2398
You're kidding me. I was sure Bourneq was a free lynch. I wasn't caring about anything else.

Why would scum not push Bourneq there?!?!!?!? Not even at all? Scum pushed basically everyone else, everyone but Bourneq.

I'm so sorry, I just thought that there was no way Bourneq would be town when he was completely ignored like that. And I thought that that fact alone outweighed any analysis I could possibly do. Loss is on me, I stopped playing when I thought the lynch was guaranteed to work.

Tubesock was obvious enough, and rsoultin and jarjarbinks were definitely on the table. There were good reasons to townread prplhz, and I could have made myself unlynchable once the next day started. We would have actually been in a good spot if I had just townread Bourneq.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 22:12 GMT
#2399
On April 18 2015 06:38 rsoultin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 18 2015 06:35 The Shining wrote:
On April 18 2015 06:29 rsoultin wrote:
pls pls pls don't scumread me in future games for being wrong though lol >< i do that all the time i'm not marv/hf lol ><

hey plot! <3

i'm glad you and bourneq plan on playing again in the next newbie!



Bah I had that as part of your town meta so idk. Now it's nai for you =P

Yeah I'm happy you guys are playing again. Next newbie seems to be filling up fast.


o.0 what's part of my town meta?

lol generally any meta argument for me is bad lol >< it's why i go GRRRR at people trying

tone you can catch me on lol

and forgetting to post legacies that too >> nice one bresh...had to really dig through my games to find examples where i didn't do it as town lol ><
What? You never make legacies (or only make bad ones) in games I play with you....

Ugh, I guess there goes my strategy of not reading you and hoping you get night killed first.

Anyway, I figured Tubesock was the godfather.

Anyway, I'm sorry for replacing in. I had the time to catch up on the thread, I didn't have the time to truly play the game at a high level after catching up.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 22:19 GMT
#2400
I guess I probably spoke up about Bourneq too early. Scum just kept him as reserve in case, and didn't bother pushing him throught the day (it wasn't really necessary). And I got excited and jumped too soon.

Ugh. I guess you learn as you go.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 22:34 GMT
#2406
I'm so sorry, I threw this game all by myself.............

If I just didn't block town from playing the game normally, we would have been okay. I thought we were set, and I could afford to sidetrack the entire thread by arguing with mafia. I was so, so wrong.

Tubesock, just a warning, if you're going to try and lynch me, you really need to do a better job. And next time I won't let you interfere with the entire thread, I'll actually use my head once in a while.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 22:40 GMT
#2408
On April 18 2015 07:37 The Shining wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 18 2015 07:29 rsoultin wrote:
o.0 you actually thought i'm only wrong as town? lol that would make it hard to get anyone mislynched -amused-


No lol just that you being wrong and the way you defend those wrong reads after was town. Thought scum rso would be more guilty and therefore less coherently defensive of her reads.

Lesson learned. Read rso thru current game only. And if alive D3, auto lynch.
Nah. It was easy to see that something was wrong with rsoultin. You didn't even need to read her filter.

The disconnect is differentiating between her play being "off" and this being alignment indicative. That would be hard to figure out.

Honestly, were it not for the Bourneq thing, there's a pretty chance I would have gone with rsoultin being scum. Jarjarbinks was most likely to stop me.

I just feel so awful. I made a terrible assumption, and not only did I use it to sabotage my own play, but I sabotaged the entire town. You can't win mafia single-handedly, but you certainly can lose it that way.

Apologies to Bourneq, your play wasn't bad at all, my reason for scumreading you was simply moronic.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 22:52 GMT
#2416
On April 18 2015 07:50 Half the Sky wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 18 2015 07:47 Damdred wrote:
Just want to say new. People use your coaches more IDK how the others were but one of my qts had 3 posts.

It made me sad but meh, good job Scum I had job and tube as Scum though


My coaching QT was about ~170 posts when I got NKed. It didn't help me because I'm one of the worst town players in TL. xD

Seriously newbies. the coaches are there to help you. Ask questions and link posts and actively read the thread. We had a good set of coaches too.

If you are pressed for time, find ways to manage your priorities in thread. Focus on the scummiest players or a smaller group of players.
Wait, what, YOU had a coaching QT? What?!?!!!?

I really should have asked for one, then......
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 22:56 GMT
#2422
On April 18 2015 07:52 Half the Sky wrote:
Trfel, Tube honestly bled scum D3. I was losing the plot in scum qt, I'm glad you caught on to it and Breshke to an extent it was a damn shame the rest couldn't.

Also town had terrible RNG, nerfed setup (no DT, christ we needed a DT this game) and Holyflare subbing in at night instead of start D2. Bad luck there. Ras-pew-tin would have been DOA there.
I never bothered pushing Tubesock.

I argued with him for the sake of arguing with him. Not to implicate him as scum. I did it because I knew I could actually prove he was scum at any time, and because I thought we had the lynch sealed up in Bourneq. What a terrible decision.

The blame isn't on town for not seeing that Tubesock is scum. The blame is on me for making Tubesock a nightmare to read, and the thread impossible to follow. And for not bothering to explain why Tubesock was scum.
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 22:56 GMT
#2424
On April 18 2015 07:53 Half the Sky wrote:
Trfel, any veteran can request a coach. You have to just ask. Newbies get first priority obviously. If you RNG scum you are obviously given the scum coach.

Artanis was my coach. Much <3 to the protoss.
Protoss! XD
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 22:57 GMT
#2428
On April 18 2015 07:56 Holyflare wrote:
don't replace till end of cycles next time plz ty <3
If I had to wait until the end of Day 2 to get a start on the game, I would never have had a chance to get caught up......
Trfel
Profile Joined August 2011
7015 Posts
April 17 2015 23:01 GMT
#2432
On April 18 2015 08:00 prplhz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 18 2015 07:55 Half the Sky wrote:
prplhz, I'm also sorry for going batshit insane on you.

didn't even notice that so lol np

people were really nice this game. like no flaming or "YOU'RE THE WORST PERSON AND/OR PLAYER ON THIS INTERNET" or anything.
I kind of flamed Tubesock pretty badly....

Tubesock, I'm sorry. I won't do it ever again. Promise.
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